How Archie Sonic Became a Masterpiece
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- Опубликовано: 7 июн 2024
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PREVIOUS PARTS
Link to part 1: • What No One Tells You ...
Link to part 2: • How Archie Sonic Lost ...
Link to part 3: • What No One Tells You ...
Link to Knuckles Lore Lecture: • Knuckles 101 - The Sto...
Support me on Patreon: / lowart
Follow me on Twitter: / thelowestart
Contact me: lowart.contact@gmail.com
The Cowriter, IanWaffles: / kirbysonicteam
IanWaffles’ Reading Guide: docs.google.com/document/d/e/...
BACKGROUND MUSIC LIST
docs.google.com/document/d/e/...
TIME STAMPS
00:00:00 - A Hog Needs His Sleep (Sponsorship)
00:01:30 - Previously on Archie Sonic (ft. Karl Bollers)
00:03:07 - It's Still Crunch Time
00:11:13 - Home
00:16:23 - One Very Special Person
00:17:30 - The Slap
00:19:17 - The Suffering of Sally Acorn
00:25:03 - Balance
00:32:12 - A Tale for This Time
00:34:14 - Asterisk
00:39:22 - The Flynn Era is Here
00:40:01 - The "Sonic Savior," Everybody!
00:42:17 - Birthday Bash!
00:49:10 - No One Will be Forgotten
00:51:42 - The Darkest Storm
01:07:30 - A Tale for this Turtle
01:14:23 - When you assume, you make an asterisk out of you and me
01:17:02 - Doggyland
01:18:15 - What's Black, White, and Peak all over?
01:20:01 - Going Bananas
01:22:25 - A Stupid Idiot Moron Man
01:23:11 - Remember...
01:28:52 - I'm Proud of You, Son
01:34:38 - A Good Ol' Time
01:37:25 - Rougher Than the Rest of Them
01:40:27 - The Salvation of Sally Acorn
01:47:11 - Eggman Empire
01:53:18 - Limit
01:56:39 - Miracle
02:03:12 - After all, the world of Archie Sonic is the main character
02:04:43 - Our Two Heroes
02:06:37 - Why? 
Развлечения
![Rich Dunk (Ft. DaBaby) - BIG DAWG [Official Video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Pz2ewsSKAEM/mqdefault.jpg)
Sonic the Hedgehog needs his rest, and so do you. Visit Manta Sleep and use coupon code "lowart" for 10% off your order of a Manta Sleep mask: bit.ly/3pC37nD
As always, thanks for watching these stupidly long videos! This is easily the most fun I've ever had doing RUclips, so I'm incredibly thankful that you keep watching these. May the Walkers guide you, my friends.
Rupload
Have you checked out Archie Mega Man?
Can we expect one giant video containing every video in one package in the future?
@@UnderfellSansTheEdgySkeleton Yes, I am planning to release that sometime in November. There are a couple (albeit small) adjustments we want to make where we feel we could slightly improve past sections, so that will be a great place to do that.
@@scourgeanimations444 I haven't read Archie Mega Man yet! However, I'm planning to make a video on it when I do. (Probably after all of Pre-reboot Archie)
My favourite thing about Ian sending in fan letters was when (iirc) he asked Ken Penders about why the comic was going on constant tangents, and then Ken responded by dodging the question entirely.
just like questions about One More Day and the way the Spider-Man comics are going down these crappy tangents; Marvel dodges the questions.
"Let's not talk about tangents by going on one"
@@redstonewarrior0152 I can't help but wonder if another writer will rise like Ian did & redefine Spiderman for another generation
@@bricky7081the big issue there is Marvel doesnt want Peter to grow and if the company doesnt want their characters to become more then there is nothing a writer can do, Ian was only soo successful because SEGA seems to geniunly want to course correct Sonic and he has a lot of experience thanks to Archie but Marvel is still stick in the 60s with spiderman
@@carso1500 This is 💯 facts. Especially considering how Marvel editorial literally is their own worst enemy in a sense here. What's worse is the late comics back then had more work put into then compared to now. At least Stan & Dikto could keep them from ruining their boy.
You know I really loved the fact that pre genesis wave Archie made Sonic kind of feel like a real person. We saw him cry, we saw him a lot more depressed then we have ever seen game Sonic and if you count Light Mobius we saw him go from a young boy to a grown man with kids of his own yet he still sort of acts like the Sonic we know. We even got to see him have moments with Tails and Knuckles that actually have then act their age.
Come to think of it, the original timeline had the characters feel more human than I imagine. That’s probably why I have a soft spot for it for being different than the Sega Sonic universe. It made them more relatable.
@@cville991What's wrong with the current timeline
@@YassineTorchani-dc2cmThey didn’t say anything was wrong with it???? They just said they prefer the original one.
Yeah. Big reason I miss Archie Sonic. There is no other setting like it that goes to such places with the characters.
@@YassineTorchani-dc2cm SEGA put mandates later in the comics that heavily restrict how Sonic can be characterized. He's still written okay, but he's not allowed to lose battles, cry, or be morally complex. Ian Flynn still makes the most of him, but you're not going to have issues like this anymore where he outright goes ballistic on Eggman or gets sincerely rattled from a big loss. That's not to say Sonic should be hyperemotional or edgy or anything, but it is cool to see him more... human, for lack of a better word? And some of the tension in later arcs gets lost because we know he always wins now.
Fun story. I used to work conventions, had a booth doing my thing. I was walking around a local one here in Austin, and saw someone who was selling the (at the time) brand new IDW Sonic Comic to let people know it was a thing. They were also selling some select Archie comics signed. I asked, and they said they worked on the Archie ones before moving over to IDW when that happened. Thought that was pretty cool. Guy was only about 10 or so years older than me, so we just kind of talked about being old school fans of the comics back in the day and generally vibing. But I had to get back to my booth. Didn't catch his name, or if I did, I forgot (I'm bad with names). Then, I actually read the IDW comics, and recognized the name. It was FECKING IAN FLYNN! I should have gotten one of the comics signed.
You met and talked with Ian Flynn? Awesome, I'm sure we will see him in more conventions.
That’s awesome! Haven’t met or spoken with Flynn, but I HAVE met Tracy Yardley. Wonderful fellow. He came to a library in my area for story time to talk to kids about what it’s like making comics. Got him to sign my physical copy of 160 (and one day I’ll get Ian’s signature too)!
@@0zerios0 It was a promotional thing he was doing for the launch of the new IDW Sonic Comic, so I dunno. Maybe next major event thing he'll do rounds again. He was a pretty awesome dude to just talk to, really chill. Just wish I'd made the connections and actually bought something. Kicking myself for that to this day.
I mean, he already told you he worked at Archie and at the IDW reboot... Could have asked his name then and there... Who the fuck do you think it could be.... if not Ian Flynn but some artist that worked with him? Are you that air-headed lmao
@@prince_nocturnebut maybe he enjoyed his conversation with someone who didnt recognize him initially, who to him he was just another fan
“ sally acorn is only here to suffer “
Wow, just like peter parker!
And anemome, and emporio, and diavolo, and Luigi’s foot when you win Mario tennis on the GameCube as him
Agreed ❤
The Darkest Storm arc was actually tasked to Ian by the editors just to resolve as many plot points as he could so that his run could actually be his. According to him (on the 75th BumbleKast), he resolved about 33 individual plot lines.
(Reposting this comment ‘cause I find the behind the scenes stuff interesting.)
that is an amazing feat on his part, seems like such a hard task to accomplish in just one arc!
@@kaxcommentssomethingREAL Especially so since it was, like, the second story he wrote for the comics.
@@J.R.Unbound absolutely *insane* to think about honestly, no wonder he was hired for the games! this man can WRITE
@@J.R.Unbound actually it was his first. Ian said he actually wrote that before "Birthday Bash," but they put that one first instead as his debut issue for some reason.
@@beauwalker9820 Huh, neat! Thanks for letting me know!
"oh my gosh is that SLEUTH DOGGY DAWG!?" this gag never gets old haha
woof!
Every time he did the gag I wondered: “what will he think of his departure?”
Was not dissapointed
What's the music in the background?
@@cje499Theme of Metropolis Speedway” from Sonic DJ Style Party Album
Flynn is the kind of writer where you hear “sonic savior” and think it’s an over-exaggeration, but god it really isn’t. The moment he arrives, a Sonic story goes from bad or okay to freakin fantastic.
Agreed ❤❤❤
Ian Flynn & Yardley came along and turned Archie Sonic into something that's basically a comic book version of a Sonic the Hedgehog shonen anime I would have been all over as a kid & still adored as an adult. And I am proud to say Ian, Yardley & now so many others are still giving the franchise the delicious shonen treatment in the post-reboot era & IDW Comics
IDW Sonic is bloody fantastic, wish there was more of it lol.
You making the comparison of the Pre-Boot Flynn Era being a Shonen really hit me in the core! It just makes sense to give it that Genre as we've seen with the Classics, SA1 and 2, Battle, 06, the Advance Trilogy, Rush, like everything before now and ect.! It just really proves that Sonic isn't just for Kids and is more so PG-13.! You have my thanks for pointing out that sweet spot that makes Sonic what it is!
Ian isn't a bad writer in Frontiers, but the problem is his more serious and grounded writing really clashes with the extremely kiddy designs of modern Sonic, what with their overly large hands and other extreme proportions. They really needed to redesign the models for me to take them seriously. It would have meshed better if they used '06 models, or gave them better proportions.
@@tbnwontpop8857 I'd say the issue more has to do with him working restrictive written environment.
@@tbnwontpop8857for me the main issue was that it
1. just kinda came out of nowhere, and
2. that the game really didn’t spend enough time to explore this more mature Sonic.
What was there was pretty decent/good, I’d say. But it just isn’t enough. Especially after the 10+ years that we had to spend with Colours‘ Sonic
This is crazy, because Ian Flynn basically did this exact same thing with Sonic Frontiers, instead of rectonning any events, he manages to find a way to put it all together.
It's amazing, and inspiring!
Obviously there is alot that goes into a game, much more limitations but while it is the same idea... One does it a hell of a lot better. Frontiers connecting everything fet super unnatural while Ian truly pulled out all the stops in Archie to make the world feel alive
@@SxM04650 make me wonder how it would have been if Ian Flynn was given more freedom. Imagine how it could have went.
Not to mention the refrences where a LOT more in your face in Frontiers than it was in Archie.
Frontiers does hit a few road bumps trying to accomplish what he did with archie.
Yea, the fact that there was so many limitations in the games, Flynn couldn't hit the same stride as he did at the beginning of his Archie run. Not that he could replicate THAT!
He managed to use almost all of Penders' convoluted crap and turned them into something cohesive and amazing! I still can't get over how he managed that whole Sonic in space crap, as well as many of the comics' cosmic lore, the Nanite City, everyone's NOT favorite character, Tommy, that annoying Anomalous plot, and of course Tails the Chosen One and used them to bring in the other colored emeralds and make them seven!
It still blows my mind!
I love how when Ian comes in the editing goes full animated comic style for several scenes. It deserves it.
Love the anime-esq music for Sir Connery's sacrifice.
Agreed ❤❤❤
For those of us who started out loving the real Sally, the one from SatAM, the rest of you have no concept of the sheer agony that was 90% of Archie's portrayal of her up until the Flynn era. This, from the same comic that took Antoine, the worst character ever, and turned him into an easy favorite. Archie Sonic truly is insane.
the same comic that took Evil Sonic, a lame character that started that whole thing in issue 150 (look it up), and turned him into Scourge, an easy fan favorite that had his own arc in Sonic Universe.
Archie Sonic REALLY is insane!
Man did I want to see the Mecha Sally arch run its course, such a waste of potential.
12:28 "Was [tee-tee-eff-en] some weird attempt to half-swear."
Bruh that's just how Tigger says goodbye to everyone. "TTFN! Ta-ta for now!"
Agreed ❤❤❤
Congratulations, your Archie retrospective series now clocks in at exactly 9:01:50. For perspective, Peter Jackson's Lord of the Rings and Hobbit trilogies clock in at 9 hours 18 minutes and 7 hours 54 minutes, respectively, for their theatrical releases. Holy shit, you're 7 minutes away from finishing the theatrical version of Return of the King. I'm not fucking kidding! 😮 You absolute madman.
There's still so much more left too. I'm scared
@@Lowartdon’t worry. It can’t be crazier that Brazilian mega man comic. I read both and Brazilian Megaman comic is more ridiculous.
@@LowartAre you just going to do the individual spinoff videos or will there be one more video in this epic saga to cover the ending of the comic?
@creativeusername7951 we plan to have the final video be about Mecha sally onwards. So yeah, one final hurrah of a video. We expect it will be huge.
@@KirbySonicTeam Yesss!
Fun Fact: this video has actually encouraged me to read all of Archie all the way from issue 160.
And now, I've kept up with IDW.
oh wow thats awesome! What did you think of Archie and IDW from what youve read?
Nice
@@KirbySonicTeam They are some of the most fun I've had in the entire series of Sonic (coming from a guy who played almost every Sonic game in existence)
@@KirbySonicTeam Oh wait, i just realized who you are!
You made that awesome Archie Sonic Video, i loved every second of that!
@@Gear07 thanks for watching them! Means a lot :)
One thing I’ve always loved about A.D.A.M’s super form is it’s uncanny resemblance to Solaris
Not only is it a good reference to those who know Solaris, but on its own it looks sick
It’s a reference that isn’t called out on or one you have to know to get what’s happening, yet if you do, it makes it all the much better.
I really like this comment, namely because it got me thinking about a the fact that A.D.A.M has some uncannily striking parallels to Mephiles.
Both were "created," one by biological means and the other digitally. They both have moments where they resemble twisted reflections of preexisting characters (Mephiles and Shadow, A.D.A.M and Tommy/Julian Robotnik). They're both the puppetmasters of their respective plans, manipulating people and orchestrating everything so that each piece of the puzzle will further their schemes and grant them access to the chaos emeralds, only to THEN be stopped by heroes/a hero wielding the very same power.
I don't know if Ian Flynn has ever said anything about these similarities however, so I could just be going nowhere with this.
@@jocosejpeg considering the super form is a reference to Solaris, I would say that might’ve been Ian Flynn’s intention
Maybe he wanted to make a good version of Mephiles’ ideas because, at the time, he wasn’t a fan favourite yet, and the story of 06 was disliked by everyone.
@@mrrd2600 I think calling Mephiles a "fan favorite" is quite a stretch no matter what time period you're talking about. He might be more popular than, like, Void or the Babylon Guardian, but I think even middling characters like Fang or the Deadly Six are more popular than he is. And that's to say nothing of actual fan favorite antagonists like Shadow or Metal Sonic or even the memetic Tails Doll
@@metalsonic8888i thought mephiles was widely agreed upon as one of the coolest parts of 06. that shadow confrontation scene is iconic. hell i'd even argue infinite was pretty much just sega's attempt at bringing back mephiles but without referencing 06
@@haha_hollie I don't dispute that he's at least one of the best parts of '06, but '06 was widely considered the worst game in the franchise and even now only Boom really even competes for that spot. Maybe all the kids that grew up on '06 outnumber older fans now and I'm out of touch, but I thought he was considered a slightly above average one-off villain (mostly because of his role in Shadow's character development rather than his own merits) in an abysmal game. Not exactly a fan favorite. Again, compare to the likes of Shadow or Metal Sonic who are bona fide fan favorites. Or even Silver or Blaze or Big. He just isn't at that level
This video really does a great job capturing the insanity of Archie Sonic reaching its lowest point right before the quality soars into the heavens. Ian coming in and basically doing a "forget all that, let's move on" would have been fine enough and even deserved with how bad the comic was getting, but its the fact that he incorporates all of it and rewards you for persisting through even the worst stories by drastically improving these old concepts that makes his start on the book truly special. And, getting ahead of myself, that ability to incorporate everything from every era in a creative way even continues once the comic reboots and has to lose most of its worldbuilding up to that point, because Ian starts pulling from all eras of the games. Just great stuff.
Agreed
Flynn's run from issue 160 until the reboot is the best Sonic content of all time in my opinion. I remember being 9 years old and issue 165 being the very first issue of this comic that I read. I had no idea what was going on or who Scourge, Fiona and Julie-Su were but I could feel the rich history and passion in every aspect of the comic (plus great character drama from Knuckles and Locke in that issue) and it just made me want to read everything before and continue reading. I became an avid reader up until the cancellation, but my interest really dwindled after the reboot. Thanks for making this video and expressing all the little and big moments that I loved and even some I had forgotten. Looking forward to more videos
I started Archie Sonic as a kid at issue 13 but dropped it after two or three years. I was amazed at how good it had become when I picked up a late Flynn issue.
@@DrCorndog1 good for you
Reading the entire comic series just to be able to understand the entire Flynn era was a treat to behold, not even that entirely, but just to appreciate the development of nearly every single character throughout the years, the world itself feels like the main character. You'd be insane to read the whole series, especially getting through the terrible parts, but I cannot tell you how great it feels, and I'm happy this retrospective series understands that...
Managed to read the whole series over the course of an 8 month deployment.
Agreed
@@Cowboycomando54
Agreed
Damn, Penders' writing is so distinct that I could immediately tell in the video when it got to his work.
Agreed
I honestly can't tell if Lowart lost himself or found himself reviewing the sonic comics.
Either way these videos are bangers.
Yes. The answer is yes.
Both
archie sonic is a rollicoaster of emotions
As someone who's re-read this series several times (mainly so I can document it on the Sonic Wiki), I must say, although epic, it's also somewhat sad reading through the Flynn era, and realizing that we probably won't get anything like that ever again. It's so different than every other form of Sonic media, but in the best way possible.
Hey! One of our main admins here! Also, big agree.
Something I've always loved about Ian's writing style is that he leaves very few crumbs on the table. Any past plot points, good or bad, can be used to enrich the story. It makes everything feel so... REAL. An out of character moment can be used as an introspective look, rather than a lapse of writing effort. And while i will concede that it can get a bit heavy handed, as someone who has seen every part of this series, it feels so rewarding to know that the person writing it has too. Especially for a series as dense as this one.
Agreed.
12:25 Sadly, no, it's not a roundabout swear. He's spelling out "TTFN", which is the initialization for "Ta-Ta For Now", which is just a fancy "goodbye".
Cool
As someone who likes writing, Ian Flynn is one of my role models. Maybe not every plot he writes is dynamite, but his ability to engineer peak fiction from a mountain of slop is mind boggling
Agreed.
All this analysis of Sally made me make a weird realization; if Amy Rose is the Princess Peach of Sonic, then Sally Acorn is the Pauline. The main protagonist's original love interest who just kinda disappeared and was forgotten. And while Sally was never canon to the _games_ like Pauline was, I think she deserves to make a comeback just as much.
Atleast Nintendo Retool Pauline into a Mayor.
@@conradojavier7547morio Kishimoto has stated that he would love to work with Sally Alcorn and the other Freedom Fighters so there's hope.
With that analogy, Blaze is the Daisy- debuted in a handheld, much more tomboyish than the Peach and yet more remembered for her roles as "girl 2" in the crossover spinoffs.
I forget if Nintendo of Japan named Pauline, but it seems just like Sally, it could be a western name situation too.
Amy is not a love interest, Sonic is not that type of character outside of Archie
Unfortunately, Sega has gone out of their way to bury everything related to the Sonic SatAM show due to it being tied to this comic.
The "I've got your limit right here" scene feels very reminiscent of Vegeta's Final Flash against Perfect Cell, one last desperate attack with everything he has upon a fight that's leaving him beaten and broken, one that even terrifies the unstoppable force they're facing upon facing it, only for the end result to be a deeper feeling of hopelessness.
Agreed.
Sonic: "this is my girlfriend Sally. She is so smart and beautiful, I'm so proud of her"
Antoine: "This is my gorgeous girlfriend Bunnie. I love her so much. She is an angel"
Tails: "This is Fiona"
"I think she has rabies"
Cool
1:01:25😂
The Darkest Storm arc was actually tasked to Ian by the editors just to resolve as many plot points as he could so that his run could actually be his. According to him (on the 75th BumbleKast), he resolved about 33 individual plot lines.
Cool for you
I'm gonna join the choir and say that Ian Flynn's Pre-reboot run is the Golden Era of the Archie Comics (and even all the American Comics) for me. It's got the best blend of experimental rawness and grit to it, while still holding true to what an ideal Sonic story should feel like. The fact it got me devouring fan wikis as a kid trying to find out all the backstories of everyone around Sonic really speaks to how well Flynn wrote even way back then.
You don't mention it in this video, but my favorite arc is The Return Of Enerjak, for exactly the reasons you mention about Flynn's early stories.
It's already a good story on its own, but if you had read all the prior stories, know the convoluted Echidna lore, and Knuckles' relationship with his father, it becomes even better.
That arc alone made me feel like reading all of Ken Penders' bullshit in the Knuckles solo comic wasn't a waste of time.
What issues cover the Return of Enerjak arc? I wanna read it but I don’t know where to start
@skykyosuke7628 Those issues are 180 - 184
@@KirbySonicTeam thank you
@@KirbySonicTeamoh shit Ian
Yeah, next video is going to be very heavily focused on that arc. It's fantastic
Man That Scene with Antoine, Bunny, and his dad still gets me. The piano cover of marble hill made it even better.
Agreed.
Funny how Ken claims he would've left the comic ages ago if his son wasn't a fan of Sonic, but his character designs for his Lara-Su comic STILL have those Mobian muzzles and echidna dreadlocks.
And then the series had to drop a bunch of well loved characters because he wouldn't let them go 🙃 So much for being as unattached as he claims
@@softsounds8453the sheer amount of characters we lost because of the Genesis Wave retcon is actually impressive. Penders went to a whole new level of petty over Sonic the Hedgehog and I think that's hilarious in a sad kind of way
@@Subpar1O1 That and the Mecha Sally arch never got its conclusion, such a waste.
The more I understood the slap, the more I loved her even more. She’s probably the most relatable Sonic character to me. I’ve dealt with massive losses, it’s always a cycle of bad when I think I’ve won something I always wanted. I understand what’s it like to be lonely and isolated. I understand the weight of having to be a leader as the oldest child in a divorced family and the responsibility that comes with that as well as being a leader in a choir and for my school as a member of Student Government. There’s been plenty of times I’ve broke down and straight up lost it (Maybe not to the extent to slapping someone) due to reaching my mental and emotional limit. I understand her PTSD and her depression. How could I hate her when me and her are practically one and the same at our cores. I appreciate them for even letting a character like her exist, it’s not often when you have Sonic characters that tackle trauma, mental health, love, loss and responsibility on a personal and human level like Sally and I will forever applaud everyone who worked on Archie, SatAM and her creator for this.
Agreed
fun fact, the transformation sequence at 9:25 is a shot for shot recreation of Elpizo's transformation from Megaman Zero 2. The game had just come out and Jon Gray thought it would look cool in the comic, but he admitted he "may have copied it a bit too closely." Guess he wasn't kidding about it being a lawless era.
Agreed.
As someone who has read all of the archie sonic issues, side series and all, not once, but twice, I just want to say that I adore these videos.
This comic is a wild, at times absolutely incomprehensible ride that still somehow manages to keep you coming back for more and, eventually, despite the rough road, becomes something truly incredible, and something to be remembered.
And this retrospective series captures that energy perfectly. The editing, the music, the way the script was written and delivered. It hits in a way I can hardly describe, because before I was never able to quite put into words why I couldn't forget this series.
It's not just because it's absolutely batshit insane, but moreso because of how, despite it all, it still manages to have an identity, and this is something that's special to Sonic as a franchise.
Say what you will about the games, the shows, the comics or anything else, but you can never tell me with a straight face that it was boring or stagnant. When it fails, it fails spectaculalry, and rarely out of laziness. And the comics still mirror that perfectly. I just never realised that was what kept me coming back before this, and watching you talk about it has helped me with truly appreciating what captivated me so much.
I am never going to forget archie sonic, for all of it's faults, and the frustration it's caused me, and I just want to express how happy I am that other people feel similarly, because it truly is something special.
I know this isn't the end yet, but honestly, good job on making it through everything and sticking to it, despite how much of a wild wild ride it truly is. Keep up the good work, man!
There have been some boring or forgettable Sonic projetcs.
Agreed.
@@fightingmedialounge519
True but then again I don't mind them so much.
playing frontiers boss fight music during the mogul arc is pure genius.
Àgreed
Jon Gary's art is highly underrated. Even if it's not SEGASonic accurate, the amount of content he can cram into a single page is crazy.
After having read a lot of Disney comics recently, it'd clear his style is heavily influenced by European Donal Duck comics.
Can confirm he's a HUGE fan and I know he's done work with Disney bringing some of them over to the US
Agreed.
@@labtheque cool
You know if the Pre Genesis Wave Archie Continuity kept going I wonder how they would handle characters like Infinite, Sage or even the storyline of Sonic Frontiers. I would genuinely love to see Archie Eggman’s interactions with Sage and maybe even have him mention her older siblings like Adam and Mecha by name. Also do you think the Idw characters would still be created in this theoretical future?
Of course not, what even makes you think they would adapt sonic frontiers Archie rarely adapts stuff.
If it weren't for Pender's Ego, Frontier's Flashbacks would have been a Nod to Archie's Lorem
Sage would have been Renamed Seth if Penders never sued Archie.
@@conradojavier7547wouldn't you have to get Cain and Abel before Seth?
@@conradojavier7547 non of that is true
LOWART YOU HAVE MADE ME THE HAPPIEST PERSON ALIVE, I fucking love what the Archie Comics did with Silver, and seeing not only the poignant remark of his story beinf expressed visually in his issues, but seeing the _silhouette..._ it's made me so excited to keep watching this!
*SILVER VIDEO WHEN*
Agreed.
The most surprising thing to me in this video is learning the guy who made almost 10 hours of video covering archie sonic actually has a wife.
Agreed.
Every time you talk about Bunny and Ant I instantly think of Rouge and Gambit its their accents i swear
Agreed.
I'm so glad you keep heavily teasing scourge and how the suppression squad arc is PEAK, it's my favorite sonic thing ever and I look forward to you covering it.
Me too
I love your views on these characters and comics. There's just an utter passion behind your descriptions of the faults, flaws, triumphs and beauties of not just the art and the writing but the people who created these works themselves that's utterly unmatched by almost anyone else on this platform. I was a fan of archie comics as a kid and while I certainly didn't own many; in what copies I did have I wished to know more about them. Please take this small portion of cash I can offer as a thank you for giving me such a fun and frankly nostalgic series to watch.
Oh wow thank you so much! I'm happy you've enjoyed the videos, and I hope you'll enjoy the future ones as well! :)
@@Lowart you are welcomed
Same here and I agree with you
i never imagined that things would get SO MUCH BETTER for this comic.
i have seen quite a few people despise seeing Ian referencing certain things in Frontiers that may have been done to tie things together, sure, he does mistakes, we all make mistakes in our first step at partaking in something new... but i know for certain that things will eventually get better, now that we have him on board, a TRUE Sonic fan writing for this series is... something i never knew we would get, we have been needing consistency for this series in a long time, and i'm so glad that we are getting just that, i care about these characters, Knuckles, Sonic, Amy, Cream, *Tails.* he was done so dirty, and now he will FINALLY get his chance to shine in the future. ( ,' __ ' )
I agree.
This video made me realise Flynn did the exact same lore consolidation with Frontiers. Seeing Eggman reference the Black Arms of all things was surreal haha
Would love to see you cover Fleetways Sonic
Agreed 💯
Something I love about Amy in these comics is just how powerful she is. She’s able to take the iron king in a one on one - someone sonic just can’t do anything about without that fan.
Agreed.
1:36:54
Nah, now this is the craziest plot twist in my opinion. Do respect and happy for it all the way.
Agreed.
"Tee-Tee-Eff-Enn" is a reference to Tigger from Winnie the Pooh. He'd often say "Tee-Tee-Eff-Enn, Tah-tah for now!" when he left somewhere :)
Cool. Thank you 😊 for the information
When Sally slapped him , it was from wanting to destroy the center of pain.
Being afraid of Sonic dying was unimaginable , it was too new to handle.
And she knew he could smooth talk her , so she said crazy things beyond his ability.
Giving her a lie so she could tell herself "I don't care if he dies" , a desperate paradox.
Ok but still why infront of everybody
@@ezrat4248Her mental state at the time likely made her forget where she was at the moment.
@@ezrat4248 , think about it , if it was in private he could agree with whatever.
He would smooth things over after she cooled down from exhaustion.
If it's public he has to stand for others , politicians and royals know this.
@@self-absorbed5269 Then that's even shittier of her.
@@self-absorbed5269 That's actually the exact opposite if how a politician would handle this.
So in a nutshell "10/10 Don't read." lol
Agreed.
29:30 The rapid return to old status quo pre-Sonic's return isn't just a thing that happened due to some miscommunication. It was Ken Penders disliking everyone's contributions to the story other than his own.
"Ken liked to maintain a very specific status quo on Angel Island, and was livid when Karl shook things up. Ken referred to the arc as a “hissy fit” written to undermine his work. When Karl moved on to other projects and Ken regained control of Angel Island, the echidnas rapidly rebuilt their city, and Locke immediately began searching for the missing Brotherhood. He was determined to erase Karl’s story from relevance and return everything to the way it used to be." - Bobby Schroeder
Though this quote is about Angel Island in particular, I think you can see from your own time with the comic that this extends to the entire world of the comic, what with returning to fantasy kingdom shenanigans and evil dimension characters (which Penders introduced) immediately as Bollers let up.
Agreed.
56:38
“I smite theeeee!!”
*horse neigh sfx*
Agreed.
Also awesome
Playing Sonic and the Black Knight music when Sir Connery comes in is genius.
Agreed.
Shout out to your cool wife for being there to support you during these big comic-level trials!
Àgreed
1:11:52 nanite infection… that’s a very interesting specific choice of words… it’s almost like eggman tried an infinitely worse version of this in his next life!
Same with the infintely growing city!!
True
@@Schnort I agree 💯
"Tee Tee Eff Enn" or 'TTFN' literally just means 'Ta-Ta For Now'. Ta-ta just means goodbye. I don't think this was intended as a swear.
Thank you for the information
That was beautiful dude, so glad you dedicated a whole section to Return to Angel Island. Part 2 of that arc was the first comic I ever owned, a birthday gift from my parents. It's what got me into Archie Sonic and drawing comic books as a whole, which of course eventually led to my friends and I making Archie Sonic Online together, so it holds a special place in my heart ^^
Ever since BlackDogBrew did his Sonic the Comic retrospective videos over a decade and a half ago, I always thought it would be super helpful to new readers if someone could make a video like that for Archie Sonic too. So happy to see it's finally happened, and that it was put together so well by such a talented person who really understands what made this comic an absolutely insane and yet enjoyable thing, haha.
Thrilled to hear you will be covering some of the later stories with their own dedicated videos, absolutely can't wait to check them out. :)
Àgreed
As someone who read the comics as a kid, and who went through the same insane journey of reading the comic in its entirety up to the Flynn era just last year, these videos have been both incredibly validating of all the shit I sat through, and also very insightful on some stuff that I hadn't thought of before (for better or worse). Finally reaching the turning point really does feel like a massive weight lifted off of your shoulders - like the hours upon hours of trudging through bad writing, art of wildly fluctuating quality, and empty promises finally means something. It's an experience I agree is absolutely not worth the journey, but for those who have made that journey, it's one of the most validating, rewarding, and overall exciting feelings I've had the pleasure(?) of experiencing firsthand, and it's one that I think you capture amazingly in the video!
Agreed 💯👍
imo two of the greatest things Flynn ever did with pre-reboot Archie was 1: Give Evil Sonic a new and beautifully meta story arc that made him relatable and somehow more than just a two bit villain that he basically had been since the start of the comic
and most impressively, 2: Actually made me like Silver as a character by giving him a real story and character, and flaws that he has to address and resolve himself. I'm shocked he managed to do that because I went into seeing Silver be introduced at first and thinking "oh no it's this guy from the failed sonic 06 reboot" and within a few appearances I found myself actually excited to see his own story arc in Universe. Of course, let's not forget the OTHER exciting reason for that particular arc, which I'm certain Lowart will be gleefully touching upon in a future video...
It was a fantastic ride, and I'm happy to see that after the whole disastrous end of the comic Ian and his team basically jumped to another publisher and was able to just keep on going, making that good shit all over again. Archie Sonic will forever live on in my head as proof that you can just go completely balls to the walls insane with your story and people will love it. I can only hope we will one day get a story that is an equal amount of unhinged and excellent in the future.
the silver saga is so good man. i love the art so much and any enerjak arc under ian's pen is an instant classic
regardless of how much i love the idw series and some characterizations, im grateful the archie series was able to present us their interpretations of the characters, making them seem so genuine and fun to read with how raw their interactions felt when done well
Agreed.
Not sure if anyone else has said it, but "TTFN" is short for "Ta Ta for Now." Something that, iirc, AoStH robotnik said a lot.
Agreed.
Didn’t go into this video expecting Sally and Hank Pym to have something in common.
Àgreed
The only issue of Archie Sonic I owned as a kid was the one where Eggman zapped everyone and beat sonic to a pulp.
Agreed.❤❤❤❤
1:29:18 Having Drago getting punched in the corner is perfect.
Agreed ❤
@12:28 "Tee Tee Eff Enn" is the initials for "TaTa For Now." I only know this because of Tigger from Winnie the Pooh, of all things
"He assumed Sonic's fans were worthless, secondary fodder."
Looks like Sega is just now realizing that's not true as well...at least a little.
What ?
Agreed.
@@YassineTorchani-dc2cm don't worry you will understand when you read the comic
Fun fact: I had read comics, and even Sonic comics before (my first was the Adventure 2.5 arc when everyone rushes the Xorda weapon), but I had never bought a comic with my own money before. When a comic shop opened up in my town, the first thing I bought was an issue of Sonic the Hedgehog and it was issue 160! Still own it and even got it signed by Tracy Yardley! One of my most prized possessions and one day I’ll get signed by Ian too!
Not only did you actually manage to find some bright spots in the pre Flynn era I almost never hear from anyone but you actually made it to the part where it's peak fiction. And now your telling me your gonna deep dive on single characters and story arcs giving these books the reverence they deserved but never received because most others wrote off the book as nonsense while the people who knew it was great just never managed to speak up about it? Insane.
Also here's a thing about Yardly's art during this beginning section of his work, you can tell that he's taking a lot of inspiration by the Yuji Uekawa (Sonic's official 2d artist) especially during the Free Comic Book Day issue where Eggman controls Sonic before subtly tweaking it to be his own
Cool and I agree with you
I probably said this on a previous video but man these comics were the only ongoing comic I actually made an effort to read as a kid. Every time the library got a new Sonic Universe volume I'd snatch it up and read it over and over again in the next few weeks. It took me a long time to finally read all the issues in between 78-140(my library was very inconsistent and eventually got rid of all of them), but afterward I only appreciated the later eras even more. Thank you for making this series so much more accessible to newcomers, and have a way past cool day!
so happy to see another instalment in the archie sonic series, this made my month!!!! I grew up with archie sonic so its great to see such a comprehensive and dedicated review of the series!!!
I love the buildup to the title drop in the video. you finally snapping and saying you hated the comic and thinking Ian Flynn couldn't save it, then the music hits.
Oh boy! Time to watch a 2 hour video essay from a RUclipsr I have never seen before
I never thought I'd become so invested in a sword fight between a horse and elephant.
I watched the first version of the video before you removed it and I really liked it. Looking forward to the next one, I really want to hear your thoughts on Flynn's writing of Scourge, Monkey Khan, Fiona and Geoffrey.
Awesome! What did you like about it
wait, it was deleted?
@@Game_Hero yes, due to misinformation regarding the infamous Sally slap being Jon Gray's idea.
@@DipperPines1986 So it was the writer's idea?
I was in the middle of it before it got taken down when it just stopped on its own, and now just had to pick up where I was hours later. I was at the 1hr 15 mark. The slap was already discussed, but I know it came back towards the end. Did I miss anything interesting in the reedit that I didnt see?
Archie Sonic or the story of how a guy managed to fix over 150 issues of continuity.
Àgreed. Cool alternative title
Watching this, I'm kind of reminded a lot of another long lived licensed comic book series: IDW's first Transformers universe.
Similar story of dropped plot points, characters and lore (in this case, because of multiple changes in writers and directions taken) being used by new writers to build something great in its Phase 2 and 3 eras.
Those comics are one hell of a journey, by the way, I'd recommend to everyone, despite having some low points.
Cool. Can't wait to read them
Ah, it's back. What a trip down memory lane. Maaaan I miss Archie Sonic a lot.
Àgreed
Every time I watch a lowart video I just hope and wait to see SLEUTH DOGGY DOG.
Love this dog. Man.
Dog man.
May he retire in peace
After watching this whole series Im glad that the dip in quality right before Ian Flynn wasn't just me. Also, the whole time once you got to the Ian Flynn era I was thinking "When's he gonna talk about Scourge?" And then I find out at the end you're giving my dude his own video?! Beautiful!
It’s amazing to me that the Sonic fanbase has so many amazing talents that keep the brand going and has saved the brand many a time. Christian Whitehead and Simon Tomley, Tee Lopes, Tyson Hesse, and of course… the man of the hour in this video… Ian Flynn. This man saved Archie Sonic after some ROUGH issues almost tanked the series, Ian Flynn made the reboot era work in Archie Sonic, then he saves any tension Forces has by properly addressing it in the IDW comic line, which is supposedly canon to the games canon, and Flynn saved Sonic’s characterization in Sonic Frontiers after YEARS of Pontaff and Graff mischaracterizing EVERYONE in the games. Ian Flynn is a true champion of the Sonic franchise and I’m grateful for him. When I became a Sonic fan, it was during the PS2 era and I loved looking at the comic covers in Sonic Mega Collection Plus. I remember at first really liking Archie Sonic… then the writing took a nosedive and I wanted to drop the series and just get my Sonic content solely from the games… then Ian Flynn came in and addressed pretty much everything there was to address and I was excited. What amazes me is that Flynn took all of the baggage other writers left in the comic and actually DID something with it, finally making everything important. Idk who else could have done that besides a true blue Sonic fan. Thank you Ian Flynn for saving this comic series for my sake… and of course for Lowart’s sake since he’s still reading these books.
Agreed ❤❤❤❤
Haven't even started the video yet, but I would like to thank you for using one of the Rawest cover arts they ever did as the thumbnail, and I'm still glad I still own a good condition copy of that issue in particular.
HOLY SHIT, you start with the arc I got into the comics with. Okay, I'm sitting through this whole thing.
Ian Flynn literally helped salvage by the comic series (more than once) and the storytelling and characterization of the cast with Sonic Frontiers.
Ian Flynn is not a diehard Sonic or blindly devoted fan. He understands the ins and outs of Sonic and co. And seems to have an encyclopedic knowledge of both the comics and games.
Sega, Archie Comics (formerly), and IDW should feel more than lucky to have someone like Ian Flynn writing for him. When someone is sincerely passionate about something and is positive about it, he or she inspires or directly makes wonderful works. I probably won't be a huge fan of Sonic if it wasn't for Ian.
Àgreed
I started reading Archie Sonic after Part 3 of this retrospective, and this video came out as I was 5 issues away from finishing the series. I was grinning ear to ear when you finally said you were out of good faith, and this comic was unsalvageable.
These just keep getting better and better.
i got my first issue of archie sonic in 2006, it was issue 167 part 2 of the 25 years later arc. super odd place to be dropped into the world. also sonic x 12 was out. we found it in the magazine section at the grocery store, i was an enormous sonic fan already and this is how i found out sonic had a comic. i think it is insane timing wise how i pretty much got onboard with the series as it was entering its best era.. i read some of the older issues in the sonic archive novels (which only had 6 volumes at the time), and as a kid i could not even hardly comprehend that the archives were the same story as what i would read monthly. starting at 167, yes there were characters and references i didnt get… but i filled in the gaps as much i could and those characters honestly and quickly became way cooler than me to the game characters. one of my favorite memories was the hype for issue 200. me and my sister were tasked with painting the garage at our house, and i said id do it all by myself if i could just read issue 200 first. LOL i used to write fan letters and mailed art to them, and they replied to me with personalized messages!
Great to hear
Archie's sonic run was so good for all the lows it had some HUGE HIGHS
Agreed.
that walrus bit was simply sublime
Thank you. That was one of my favourite gags in the video, so I'm happy to see it being appreciated haha
You have officially convinced me to read the comics. Congratulations my dude.
I havent even read the story and Im so upset that Sir Connery died
This video is the first time I've felt emotional about a comic I've never read with the emotion you've put over certain moments like when Nicole made her comeback to save the day, or when Tails reunited with his family...
This retrospective made some rather stressful days at work much more bearable. So many memories reading these as a kid. Thank you for doing these. Definitely looking forward to the individual character retrospectives you mention, especially Scourge.
I love these videos.. I definitely miss pre-genesis-wave Archie sometimes and this reminds me why. Years of chaos and seeing what sticks being recontextualised into a rich world that matters.. it made me feel like my investment was always rewarded. It's why the genesis-wave stung so much, and why the comic's ultimate fate felt so frustrating and bittersweet.
As a DC Comics fan I am very used to reboots and relaunches, they usually suck but its par for the course, you get used to it. But it really sucks here because of the reasons behind it. No changing of creative team, no editorial meddling, none of the usual logic behind the reboots. It was due to legal drama, something no one could have prepared for. Flynn and his team weathered the storm pretty well, but it was still a no-win scenario.
You can read the "Archie Sonic Online" fan continuation. This work is trully pretty good and have the "spirit" of Ian Flynn's era.
@@TheSlimshady00058 Yeah the say they resolved the Mecha Sally plotline was top notch !
@@saidi7975 yeah. Dr. Z and Gentleman X has a gourgeos written skills
I had a chance to buy every issue and variant for $500 just before the comic ended its run. My mom didnt let that happen, and so i never went back and read the hundreds of issues that came before my time with the comic. I was never going to go back, i was satisfied with just knowing some surface level wacky things.
Im so sad i dont have that mega bundle of every issue, but im not letting that regret stop me anymore. You’ve convinced me to read the entire thing, including the pre Flynn content. I want to experience it all. Thank you for these incredibly entertaining retrospectives, i can't wait to read the comics for myself and see your future discussions of this insane comic series.
Can't believe this is part 4, what a long way we've come
When do you think part 5 might come out?
I started this comic through the archives volumes, and the first actual issue i read was one of the first Universe issues post-reboot, but the second was a 'sonic super digest' that included the issue where the FF and chaotix destroy the egg breaker. I had zero context for that scene. I had no idea why Eggman was so pissed, why there was cannon fire throughout the issue, or what the deal with Hope and Snively was. I vividly remember being VERY confused on who the hell saffron was, especially since i at least vaguely knew the other comic-exclusives through the archives and sonic selects.
And yet...the fight against the Egg Breaker felt IMPORTANT. It felt like the resolution to something really meaningful that had a huge impact on not just the characters and world, but the comic itself. And it WAS, but I didn't know that going in. So to me, all the talk of how they've chosen to keep playing Eggman's game, and just the general energy of triumph and confidence throughout that entire issue was so powerful despite not even reading the issues that lead up to that scene until...i wanna say like 4 years later, geez. It made me want to find out more about this comic.
I'll always remember the second Egg Breaker fight for that. Not because of the resolution of the story at the time. Not because of what had led up to it. But because of the way that it managed to pull me in, and made me CARE about something I didn't even know had happened.
Dude, that second to last track going over the Flynn era? DUDE, the nostalgia came rushing back like a train. How do you make me feel that again? I remember viewing the covers of the comics in Sonic Mega Collection, and god that was an amazing time for me. I loved this video man, can’t wait to see more of your work!
I began reading the sonic comic RIGHT at the sally acorn marrying Antoine arc. That comic art of sonic crying with the invitation really sent me back to my childhood. I'm so glad to hear that my love of the comic around this time wasn't just nostalgia but genuinely because it slapped. Mammoth mogul is my favorite Archie comic villain because of the material you've covered in the video. Your previous videos all had me going "NO DUDE I PROMISE HE GETS COOL" and it's immensely gratifying to see you finally reach that point.
You turned into the Archie sonic comic youtuber I didn't know I wanted.
I got no idea how you made these comics actually badass to look and talk about (something lacking in comic overviews) but you breath LIFE Into these pages.
Fans save the Sonic franchise, how often do you hear that? But truly, Sega’s acceptance of fans to guide the series continues to pay off, even in today’s era.