@@IVIaskerade after accruing several unholy experiments in the form of tested-to-destruction prints and bent receiver stampings that would fit said description, at a certain point I had to accept that this is just my life now
For the amount that SDI wants, you could do over a dozen projects and learn more than any course could teach you from a book. Even just simple stuff like learning how to file/stone things flat and parallel, that *feel* and really the "artist's eye" can't be taught out of a book. If you put all of that tuition/fees into *just* doing 1911s, and set a goal like be able to produce a 1911 than can do 2" or better at 50 yards, you'd be a fantastic and valuable smith by the end of it.
My uncle was a "Gunsmith", and I use the quote marks because he was a machinist by trade and always loved firearms and kind of slowly transitioned his way into it and was able to make a career out of it through the mid 80's until he died in 2003. He use to make a new mini canon every year for the 4th of July and fire it off all afternoon. Super fun as a kid.
Ivan, thank you for this video… As a young 24 year old Canadian kid, I can’t really properly express how much these types of videos are needed. That last 5 minutes at the end really resonated with me and has given me a goal to work towards. Im currently unemployed doing nothing with my life, living alone off of my dads insurance money from his fentanyl overdose and i needed to hear this brother. I know I’m going into a trade regardless and you talking about machining and explaining that even if i can’t become a gunsmith, i’d still be employed due to having a machining degree. This stuff gives me some hope and motivation to do better. Been following you for a few years now and you making this was an absolute treat. Godbless from Canada 🤙🏼🇨🇦
A vise is the most important tool in the shop! In my mind, machining/metal work is a puzzle of figuring out a way to hold the work and a way to cut/shape it to the drawing
I'm a mechanical engineer in the gun industry, I have rarely seen anyone with gunsmith skills at a factory setting that assembles guns. Mostly these days its assembly line work where you do one/few task only. This is more due to tolerancing correctly of designs and CAD/CAM where the parts are final dimension and not file to match like the older firearms assembly use to be. Now gun stores, even many so called "gunsmiths" at stores are not gunsmiths either. They might be able to take apart a gun and clean it but its rare that one can properly make and fit a part to fix an action. Mark Noval is a channel people need to watch if they would like to see some real gunsmithing work.
So, did you just go to college for just mechanical engineering or is there somewhere that has small arms engineering as a specific field of study? Did you actually even get a degree in mechanical engineering at all? Reason I ask that is because I have spent a large portion of my adult life working in machine shops and currently work in a large machine shop owned by a popular automotive manufacturer and MANY of our engineers are not formally trained as engineers. They started as machinists or tool and die makers and eventually moved into our design/engineering department from there. Don't get me wrong, we do have a lot of people who graduated with a B.S. in mechanical engineering also--but there are plenty who never went to college after they completed their machinist/tool and die apprenticeship. This has been true at every machine shop I've worked in and I've made a lot of mechanically complicated parts at different factories. I myself am a tool and die apprentice who is transitioning into CNC machining. I also have an interest in design so I took classes on Solidworks. I eventually would like to work in the firearms industry. Even though I'm just an apprentice, I have a ton of experience running machines on my own without supervision from a journeyman because I run the machines on the night shift so I'm pretty sure I could already get a good paying job in the gun industry if I applied somewhere. Most machinists never even complete an apprenticeship, they just take a few classes and make chips. I'm the first CNC apprentice at my shop in like 20 years.
@@armorers_wrench I have a BSME. I started in the oil industry after college but always had my own designs in my head for guns. I taught myself Solidworks. I had my first successful design after a bet with Mark Serbu. CZ produced it and it sold great in Europe and the US. I then did some patent drawings and design work which lead to me doing contract jobs for 10 different manufacturers. The military uses two of my designs. College does not teach Engineers how to do specific work, they teach how to approach problems to solve them with he tools you have learned. Typically engineers learn from the supervising engineers through mentorship. I had to mostly mentor myself since the oil industry does not directly apply to firearms. I'm now retired but still take on some contract jobs for the firearms industry.
It'd be neat if we had more smiffs into stamping or metal shaping. So many esoteric clips and dust covers that are extinct or only have crappy non-functional repros. Maybe there's not enough meat on that bone to keep the lights on, though. And flat springs! Old guns are like 20% flat springs by volume
I've had decent luck with flat springs by having the 2d shapes lasered out of spring steel then threaded, bent up, etc as needed, then heat treated. The one redeeming thing about flat springs is you've typically got plenty of room for error to make little tweaks. I've had luck printing some small stamped parts, like the shell latch on a CZ241, and that's holding up well.
@@IvanPrintsGuns I’ve thought about trying to get a laser and learning to make them. Just need to find space and time. Haven’t had good experiences with smiths making them in the past. I had a Frommer Stop missing an ejector spring. Went to a smith that several people had recommended, provided pictures of the part from an old manual, and then went over how the action worked and what the important dimensions/features were. His first attempt didn’t work in a way that made it clear he didn’t bother to test it. I brought it back for a second attempt. That one also didn’t work, but it was close enough that I could fix it with a jeweler’s file. The other time I brought in a hammerless SxS for an unrelated repair (different smith). When he handed it back, he said he had to make a new left sear spring. I had the gun apart previously, so I knew it was fine when I gave it to him. His replacement is so weak that it lets go under recoil, so now pulling the front/right trigger fires both barrels.
I recently built my first rifle(AR-15 in an a3 triad chassis) and tbh the most satisfying part was fixing the out of spec trigger they sent in the parts kit. 5 hours and 1 destroyed harbor freight flat file later, it feels like MY rifle where before it was just A rifle
Honestly I hope you do make more content like this. Love informative long form videos like this. Also it’s a tragedy that I just found this video thanks to the RUclips algorithm get Mat to shout you out more.
I've wanted to be a gun designer and smith since I was a young teenager. I decided that my best option was to become a good machinist, and work on my own designs and guns to learn the skills I needed past machining. In retrospect I think that was a very good choice. I got a job/apprenticeship at a small job and production shop where there's a good mix of manual, CNC, and some hand work. It's been a great way to learn a variety of metalworking skills and also understand how to design parts with good machining practices in mind. Worst comes to worst and I absolutely fail on my own gun designs and such, I'll still be an employable machinist.
I've always understood (and explained to others) the topic of gunsmithing as thus: * A "hobbyist" can build a gun from parts, but lacks the ability or desire to modify, adjust or fabricrate their own parts, and are often uneasy actually putting their own guns together (although they will if they don't have another choice). A hobbyist may have a generalized understanding of how a particular firearm works, but will lack the more in-depth knowledge about things like the physics, geometry, chemistry or math behind how it works. A hobbyist would likely be a lot of the traditionally popular folks in the Guntuber space, like Matt Carriker. * An "armorer" can build a gun from parts, and has the ability and desire to modify those parts as needed, and will be able to fabricate certain components, as needed, depending on the complexity of those components. An armorer will also have an in-depth knowledge of how a particular platform functions, and understand how to adjust the performance of that platform to fit their needs. An armorer would be someone like PrintShootRepeat or Ivan (no offense Ivan
What so many people fail to include in these descriptions is the gunsmith's ability not just to fabricate a gun or gun part but their ability to fabricate tooling/fixtures/specialty tools . IMO a true gunsmith is a machinist to some extent. They may not be a true journeyman machinist capable of writing CNC programs but they should at a MINIMUM know how to operate a lathe and a bridgeport style mill. I'd also say they should know how to operate a surface grinder. Comes in real handy when metal working... I wanted to be a gunsmith but there aren't very many apprenticeships these days for it so I got into a Tool and Die maker's apprenticeship and then from there transitioned into a CNC machinists apprenticeship. I know how to run manual machines(because I started in tool and die) and I know how to operate CNC and even do my own programs although I need to get more advanced in programming before I call myself a programmer. I can also use solidworks to design my own parts before I fabricate them which is very handy.
Real eternal fudd gonsmiff here. I fully agree with this video. I kinda want to share my story here, because it ties into the video. I spent my adolescent years watching Tales of the Gun and getting my dad to take me to the LGS to harass them about whatever guns I learned about that week and to get my hands on them or something similiar. We had a LGS on every corner it seemed, but we traveled a lot and I got to spend hours in countless stores all over the south. By the time I was a teenager, when I wasnt at school I was hanging out in a shop and helping with anything I could. An old grumpy gunsmith finally let me watch him work on stuff and I spent what seemed like forever doing just the most menial minor things like mounting scopes, refinishing wooden stocks, all sorts of fairly mundane stuff that seemed really cool at the time that this video covers. Being the young military gun lover I got the cool gig of handling every dicked up milsurp rifle. After a few years of this I was trusted by so many people that it was a sense of pride. The problem is, everything has changed so much in the last several years. You cant be a gunsmith by taking an online or college class anymore than you can be a welder, electrician or machinest. I moved on mostly since the owner died but still do the odd job here and there. This sort of video gave me some hope for a new wave to somehow emerge out of the shitty circumstances. It seems to me it was a lot easier to get going in a work capacity in the 90s, but a hell of a lot more accessible to be a hobbyist DIYer today.
It’s hilarious I used to work in a machine shop where I would do a bunch of custom one off on manual machines. A bunch of it ended up being automotive related, but a lot of it was also making weird gun parts even like spring and stuff. I did a lot of welding too(when needed for machining). I can absolutely handle a bunch of that stuff. I would never call myself a gunsmith because I really struggle like making wooden stocks and repairing wooden stocks and things like drilling and tapping the receiver on my 870 took me some thought process. But a guy I met did the gunsmithing classes at Sdi, crapply assembled a black powder rifle and now he’s out there in the industry, trying to be a gunsmith. (also he owns like eight Bear Creek arsenal rifles and not a single quality rifle.) he couldn’t run a mill or a or cut a dovetail make a spring.
On a serious note. SDI for guns is kinda like what UTI is for cars. You can learn all the textbook stuff, get some hands-on experience, and be better prepared to be an automotive technician than someone with no training. You still have to put in the work and earn the experience with experience.
Maybe, but SDI does NOT look worth it for the price. I’ve learned some of their stated course material from just being a hobbyist, buying my own rifle and upgrading it. It’s a difference of $20,000 of student loan debt vs. an eight hundred dollar rifle and about a thousand spent on various parts and decorations as I could afford to buy them.
I commend you for trying. Lots and lots of good info. I completely understand and dont take for granted i lucked out in my path. I k ow it wont and cant be that easy for many, hell, most. But the "figure it out" concept is lost on many. Most lack motivation and the vigor required to become what they say they want. If they can figure out how different guns work, they can figure out how to become a gunsmith. It takes a certain type of mentality to find a way to make it work.
I look at gunsmiths like I do mechanics. The breath of skill and knowledge between them is massive in scale. From a local shop mechanic to a certified CAT diesel technician and everything in between. They vary drasticly in experience and expertise, but they are all mechanics. The same is true for gunsmiths. As for SDI, a guy who worked for them for 7 years was on a live with Focus Tripp, and he summed it up perfectly. "SDI is a marketing company, not a gunsmithing school."
You can make a mold of 3d printed parts and use that mold to recast them into polymer they should be able to hold together a lot better or even use sand casting for metal parts
Tools for any sort of smithing or machining are the same as ones for gunsmiths. Think of: (this is a lot btw) #1- Money #2- Time #3- A will to loose/break tools somehow #4- A good aerated space #5- A will to learn and get 2 hours of sleep Past that, in terms of tools and such: High quality punch set (get 2 in case of breakage) Brass hammers, plastic hammers, & small regular hammers A good set of precision/electronic repair screwdrivers and bits a set of regular screwdrivers with security bits. A LOT of random different files of various sizes (Most important imo) A high quality dremel with a LOT of attachments (filing stones, drill bits, etc) Chamfer related add-ons for drill/press tapping driver tool tap & die set A drill press 12 ton press lathe drill bits electric sander 3d printer (good for making molds) (knowledge of solid works or blender may help) a decent vice A decent welder & welding mask A mask and safety goggles. A sharpie marker and a bunch of plastic bags for labeling parts for storage or for when you stop for the day. a bunch of oils, lube, and grease. vice grips, and a lot of different pliers Staining oils for wood, and bluing related kits for metal. mechanics gloves, and work gloves. A good EDC flashlight A magnifying glass A good multitool A good pocketknife A large magnet to put near the ground to find pins/screws you drop No-go gauges, go gauges, field gauges for various calibers. Snap caps. Hex keys Metric and imperial A cheap ratchet set. crescent wrenches Electrical tape, duct tape, flex tape. A good med kit (in case you cut yourself) thread lockers break cleaner & WD40
Become a Gunsmith or an Armourer is my dream job. Its really hard to get into and from what I’ve seen, teaching yourself and finding like minded people is the best way to get into this. The government doesn’t like people like us, at all.
Math I think is highly underrated as a skill, and it's one you really do need to practice at. I'm a software developer, I have a computer science bachelor's and a Math minor, and I recently relearned long division and pre-calculus. It wasn't hard but it's amazing how quickly you can forget things.
I could not agree more that the the best way to learn is by doing and it's not super expensive to start. I'm only a couple years in myself. I started doing videos, which pushed myself to learn even more news things, over the past 11 months and it's amazing how much I've managed to learn in less than a year. So yeah, just go do! And if you find you're not learning the new things you think you should be, or fast enough, find a way to push yourself, hold yourself accountable.
I think if you’re a gunsmith, you should be willing to tell customers, “I don’t know how to do this, here’s a refund.” My first experience with a gunsmith was a supposedly good shop that couldn’t figure out what I did to a Ruger MkII to make it not work, but they billed me for a bunch of VQ springs they stuffed inside it at an insane mark-up. I was annoyed, so I watched a video, learned how to take a MkII apart completely, took it apart, took another one apart, measured every part with calipers, figured out what was wrong, and fixed it. I never used that shop again, though.
I started with 80% AR's and have migrated into 3D printing them. And 1911's. From here I'm going to be going into CNC machining, anodizing, etc. Have a few Parker-Hale Mauser bolt-action castings that are going to get machined a& heat-treated, custom stocks, and converted over to use Savage barrels.
There are levels of gunsmiths. Assembling them, repairing them(mechanical or artistic), fabricating them, and fabricating parts for the repairs as needed(highest level) alongside designers which can be visionary gunsmiths that change the field(Hoffman and the like).
I'm no gun smith but getting a 3D printer and buying a parts kit is very satisfying and fun. Get good at making your own 3d printed guns before you decide if you want to get into legit gun smithing. It has definitely taught me that I enjoy tinkering and making my own guns but that I don't necessarily want to do this for other people.
i called a local gun store/gun smith for some reason and ended up shooting the shit he mentioned SDI and i was like yeah i could do it, i got a GI Bill i called them but their customer service was lazy and never got back to me. thank god they didnt
i can buy all the parts to a knife and put it together, i can sharpen blades, do basic repairs, but i dont call myself a blacksmith because i dont actually make knives, likewise with gunsmithing i think of a guy you can hand a gun to and he can re-blue the steel, fix a crack in the stock, check your headspacing for your weird caliber choice, and make both basic and complex repairs, identify things like potential cracks forming in stuff like trunions or locking surfaces etc, anyone with an IQ above 80 can put together an AR, anyone with a proper interest in ARs more than just going to the range once a year with their airsoft optic on their DDM4 can swap to a different weight buffer, though these are things that would fall under the category of gunsmithing, they wouldnt make you a gunsmith because its basically just adult legos
I’ve been spending the last few days dicking around with designing a polymer handguard for an Aug A3. I’d like to attach it to the barrel assembly so that it doesn’t interfere with the QD barrel system, but one issue I’m running into is finding a way to mount it without allowing direct heat transfer from the gas block into the handguard; I’ve been sliding over the bayonet lug and pinning in place at the swivel point of the vertical foregrip, but the bayonet lug heats up enough to melt and distort the connection after about 50 rounds. Is there something you’d recommend for insulating prints from heat over direct attachment points like this? My next idea was to have a machinist make a bushing that attaches to the bayonet lug threads, wrap it in some high heat insulating material, and have the 3D print sleeve over that bushing, but I’m not sure what would be the best material to do that with.
I have studied machinery, hours and hours in lathes, presses, mills, and took Glock, AR, armorer's courses and a gunsmith is basically a type of engineer that works on the products they build... I been doing this for years a decade, built 15 or so ARs , couple 1911's, and numerous Glocks and P80's etc.... i still call myself an apprentice in gunsmithing, which technically i am one, but not a word to be used lightly
The part at the end sounds a lot like the discourse around being a mechanical engineer vs an aeronautical engineer. With some effort a mechanical engineer can work their way into aeronautical engineering, but not really the other way round
So the lesson I heard here Ivan was buy cheap crappy shotguns and that is one with which I will happily oblige. Make the shotgun series, they are tremendously interesting subject that goes far too overlooked.
I just reprofiled a cheap "pa-15" lower from a2 style to a partial fence a1 using carbide burrs. I fucked a lot of it up and spent so many hours with a set of diamond hand files smoothing out the areas I mutilated. In the end it turned an ugly lower I was reticent to use into a lower I'm excited to use in a retro build, plus I learned quite a bit.
Something that can protect your eyes from springs/detents launched out of guns, fragments from broken tools, etc. Something rated for being around machine tools should be sufficient.
I do want to start 3D printing guns, but I guess what’s preventing me is that I just don’t know where to start. That and the lack of space since I live in an apartment.
Learn to use a file, make a chisel ridiculously sharp, make and properly heat treat flat springs. Then you can make mistakes until you learn. The big day will finally happen when some offers to pay you to make mistakes
I think that is the number one that people need to hear loud and clear. You do NOT need a license to build guns or repair guns. You need a license to sell them if manufacturing for sale is your business.
I am not a gunsmith, more of an armorer. I weld, do a little machining, and have custom made a decent amount of stuff. I am actually stating DSI soon for their drone program. Simple way to get into that hobby, get certified, and get paid to do so with the GI Bill. But I can tell you from speaking to their reps for a few month: they don’t like to be honest about telling you want the program cost.
anyone whos into gunsmithing doesn't need a school to do it they need to learn manufacturing or gun repair those are the two things someone in gunsmithing is going to be doing
Gunsmithing as an art is probably similarly taught, though through a much longer curriculum to welding. There is some people that are going to struggle, because it’s just a certain layer of art to it that makes it quality. Your welds may hold for testing, but look like crap.
10:00 that’s how I got into it. Went from automotive to aviation electronics and now guns. I simply started by looking for a job as an apprentice. Now all the sicarios want my work lol! I went to a local gunsmithing school and learned absolutely jack shit. I had a great teacher to work under and a horrible teacher from school.
I actually have a degree from SDI in Firearms Technology, I also have a Bachelors degree in Economics, and yet I am not an Economist... I will say that I have gotten to work on many guns because I have the degree from SDI... BUT.... I have learned most things about how to work on any gun from watching videos online. To be honest, if you want to be a gunsmith, just claim you have a degree from anywhere, because NO one will look it up... So a gunsmith degree from Harvard will get you business... But, I will say you just have to actually care about what you are doing, I care about old guns, and I take a doctors oath, Do no Harm...
One of the OutOfBattery streams was on the same topic, I found it pretty informative: "The Guncad Home Workshop with OA" (watch?v=RUTwIQtfxSc) One thing I will add: BreakFree CLP gives major rashes, I had to stop using it on guns I work on continuously (Stupid Advantage arms kit...) in favor of Balistol.
These comments may get lost in the algorithm but here’s my advice (from some random dude on the internet). Buy a book on communication like Dale Carnegie, how to win friends and influence people. It’s a more effective skill to talk with other people than to know gun smithing. Next good small gun repair shops in your area. Know what you’re looking for are old gun smiths/hobbies. Age 65 to 80, they are rare but they are out there. No one that does it for a living has the time to train you. You have to look at the guy kids moved away, that doesn’t need the money, that just enjoys the trade. Is your communication skills, It’s very easy once you got it down. If he makes an offer to take you under neath his wing you have to make that decision. You may say they these people don’t exist. Wrong I been ask 4 separate times from different people to be their apprentice. All because of charm and communication. If you made it these far, last piece of advice, just got out there and look around. When one door closes another opens. The worst thing is they say know, but if you like each other you just made a friend and that sometime more powerful than master a skill. Best of luck out there
I'm not a gunsmith, I'm a gonsmiff. A horrible amalgamation of bubba and weekendgunnit that should not be.
I miss gunnit
The personification of "There is a point where we needed to stop and we have clearly passed it but let's keep going and see what happens"
@@IVIaskerade after accruing several unholy experiments in the form of tested-to-destruction prints and bent receiver stampings that would fit said description, at a certain point I had to accept that this is just my life now
It exists still just a bit fractured compared to the OG@@logi7671
For the amount that SDI wants, you could do over a dozen projects and learn more than any course could teach you from a book. Even just simple stuff like learning how to file/stone things flat and parallel, that *feel* and really the "artist's eye" can't be taught out of a book. If you put all of that tuition/fees into *just* doing 1911s, and set a goal like be able to produce a 1911 than can do 2" or better at 50 yards, you'd be a fantastic and valuable smith by the end of it.
My uncle was a "Gunsmith", and I use the quote marks because he was a machinist by trade and always loved firearms and kind of slowly transitioned his way into it and was able to make a career out of it through the mid 80's until he died in 2003. He use to make a new mini canon every year for the 4th of July and fire it off all afternoon. Super fun as a kid.
My "intro to machine ops" professor showed us a cannon he had turned on a lathe. It's actually really easy to make.
Your uncle sounded fun man, im glad you got these memories brother 🤙🏼
I dremeled the paddle release block out of my older sp5k. I am gonsmif
gurmschmafthpt
I can fieldstrip my 15 and mounted my scope on pre-existing rail myself, gonsmiff.
Ivan, thank you for this video… As a young 24 year old Canadian kid, I can’t really properly express how much these types of videos are needed.
That last 5 minutes at the end really resonated with me and has given me a goal to work towards.
Im currently unemployed doing nothing with my life, living alone off of my dads insurance money from his fentanyl overdose and i needed to hear this brother.
I know I’m going into a trade regardless and you talking about machining and explaining that even if i can’t become a gunsmith, i’d still be employed due to having a machining degree.
This stuff gives me some hope and motivation to do better.
Been following you for a few years now and you making this was an absolute treat.
Godbless from Canada 🤙🏼🇨🇦
A vise is the most important tool in the shop! In my mind, machining/metal work is a puzzle of figuring out a way to hold the work and a way to cut/shape it to the drawing
I'm a mechanical engineer in the gun industry, I have rarely seen anyone with gunsmith skills at a factory setting that assembles guns. Mostly these days its assembly line work where you do one/few task only. This is more due to tolerancing correctly of designs and CAD/CAM where the parts are final dimension and not file to match like the older firearms assembly use to be. Now gun stores, even many so called "gunsmiths" at stores are not gunsmiths either. They might be able to take apart a gun and clean it but its rare that one can properly make and fit a part to fix an action. Mark Noval is a channel people need to watch if they would like to see some real gunsmithing work.
So, did you just go to college for just mechanical engineering or is there somewhere that has small arms engineering as a specific field of study? Did you actually even get a degree in mechanical engineering at all? Reason I ask that is because I have spent a large portion of my adult life working in machine shops and currently work in a large machine shop owned by a popular automotive manufacturer and MANY of our engineers are not formally trained as engineers. They started as machinists or tool and die makers and eventually moved into our design/engineering department from there. Don't get me wrong, we do have a lot of people who graduated with a B.S. in mechanical engineering also--but there are plenty who never went to college after they completed their machinist/tool and die apprenticeship. This has been true at every machine shop I've worked in and I've made a lot of mechanically complicated parts at different factories.
I myself am a tool and die apprentice who is transitioning into CNC machining. I also have an interest in design so I took classes on Solidworks. I eventually would like to work in the firearms industry. Even though I'm just an apprentice, I have a ton of experience running machines on my own without supervision from a journeyman because I run the machines on the night shift so I'm pretty sure I could already get a good paying job in the gun industry if I applied somewhere. Most machinists never even complete an apprenticeship, they just take a few classes and make chips. I'm the first CNC apprentice at my shop in like 20 years.
@@armorers_wrench I have a BSME. I started in the oil industry after college but always had my own designs in my head for guns. I taught myself Solidworks. I had my first successful design after a bet with Mark Serbu. CZ produced it and it sold great in Europe and the US. I then did some patent drawings and design work which lead to me doing contract jobs for 10 different manufacturers. The military uses two of my designs.
College does not teach Engineers how to do specific work, they teach how to approach problems to solve them with he tools you have learned. Typically engineers learn from the supervising engineers through mentorship. I had to mostly mentor myself since the oil industry does not directly apply to firearms.
I'm now retired but still take on some contract jobs for the firearms industry.
@@armorers_wrench Weird I replied and it seems it was deleted? Short version I do have a BSME from 1989.
I never learned more about gun smithing in any course than I learned from working in a machine shop.
It'd be neat if we had more smiffs into stamping or metal shaping. So many esoteric clips and dust covers that are extinct or only have crappy non-functional repros. Maybe there's not enough meat on that bone to keep the lights on, though. And flat springs! Old guns are like 20% flat springs by volume
I've had decent luck with flat springs by having the 2d shapes lasered out of spring steel then threaded, bent up, etc as needed, then heat treated. The one redeeming thing about flat springs is you've typically got plenty of room for error to make little tweaks. I've had luck printing some small stamped parts, like the shell latch on a CZ241, and that's holding up well.
@@IvanPrintsGuns I’ve thought about trying to get a laser and learning to make them. Just need to find space and time. Haven’t had good experiences with smiths making them in the past.
I had a Frommer Stop missing an ejector spring. Went to a smith that several people had recommended, provided pictures of the part from an old manual, and then went over how the action worked and what the important dimensions/features were. His first attempt didn’t work in a way that made it clear he didn’t bother to test it. I brought it back for a second attempt. That one also didn’t work, but it was close enough that I could fix it with a jeweler’s file.
The other time I brought in a hammerless SxS for an unrelated repair (different smith). When he handed it back, he said he had to make a new left sear spring. I had the gun apart previously, so I knew it was fine when I gave it to him. His replacement is so weak that it lets go under recoil, so now pulling the front/right trigger fires both barrels.
I recently built my first rifle(AR-15 in an a3 triad chassis) and tbh the most satisfying part was fixing the out of spec trigger they sent in the parts kit. 5 hours and 1 destroyed harbor freight flat file later, it feels like MY rifle where before it was just A rifle
Honestly I hope you do make more content like this. Love informative long form videos like this. Also it’s a tragedy that I just found this video thanks to the RUclips algorithm get Mat to shout you out more.
I love your long form commentary videos ivan! They scratch the tisim spot perfectly
i’ve seen so many videos sponsored by SDI glad someone like you is giving an honest run down
I've wanted to be a gun designer and smith since I was a young teenager. I decided that my best option was to become a good machinist, and work on my own designs and guns to learn the skills I needed past machining. In retrospect I think that was a very good choice. I got a job/apprenticeship at a small job and production shop where there's a good mix of manual, CNC, and some hand work. It's been a great way to learn a variety of metalworking skills and also understand how to design parts with good machining practices in mind.
Worst comes to worst and I absolutely fail on my own gun designs and such, I'll still be an employable machinist.
I'm on the exact same path now
I've always understood (and explained to others) the topic of gunsmithing as thus:
* A "hobbyist" can build a gun from parts, but lacks the ability or desire to modify, adjust or fabricrate their own parts, and are often uneasy actually putting their own guns together (although they will if they don't have another choice). A hobbyist may have a generalized understanding of how a particular firearm works, but will lack the more in-depth knowledge about things like the physics, geometry, chemistry or math behind how it works. A hobbyist would likely be a lot of the traditionally popular folks in the Guntuber space, like Matt Carriker.
* An "armorer" can build a gun from parts, and has the ability and desire to modify those parts as needed, and will be able to fabricate certain components, as needed, depending on the complexity of those components. An armorer will also have an in-depth knowledge of how a particular platform functions, and understand how to adjust the performance of that platform to fit their needs. An armorer would be someone like PrintShootRepeat or Ivan (no offense Ivan
IMO an armorer can build a gun from parts and a gunsmith can make new parts, an inventor is required to make a new design.
@bigmike- bullshi, the gunsmith nowadays is a just a person with a retail shop. The titles mean nothing
"Everybody knows at least one bubba."
[Insert any PoopMadness vid]
What so many people fail to include in these descriptions is the gunsmith's ability not just to fabricate a gun or gun part but their ability to fabricate tooling/fixtures/specialty tools . IMO a true gunsmith is a machinist to some extent. They may not be a true journeyman machinist capable of writing CNC programs but they should at a MINIMUM know how to operate a lathe and a bridgeport style mill. I'd also say they should know how to operate a surface grinder. Comes in real handy when metal working...
I wanted to be a gunsmith but there aren't very many apprenticeships these days for it so I got into a Tool and Die maker's apprenticeship and then from there transitioned into a CNC machinists apprenticeship. I know how to run manual machines(because I started in tool and die) and I know how to operate CNC and even do my own programs although I need to get more advanced in programming before I call myself a programmer. I can also use solidworks to design my own parts before I fabricate them which is very handy.
Not so sure Mark could make a (good) gun from scratch.
Real eternal fudd gonsmiff here. I fully agree with this video. I kinda want to share my story here, because it ties into the video. I spent my adolescent years watching Tales of the Gun and getting my dad to take me to the LGS to harass them about whatever guns I learned about that week and to get my hands on them or something similiar. We had a LGS on every corner it seemed, but we traveled a lot and I got to spend hours in countless stores all over the south.
By the time I was a teenager, when I wasnt at school I was hanging out in a shop and helping with anything I could. An old grumpy gunsmith finally let me watch him work on stuff and I spent what seemed like forever doing just the most menial minor things like mounting scopes, refinishing wooden stocks, all sorts of fairly mundane stuff that seemed really cool at the time that this video covers. Being the young military gun lover I got the cool gig of handling every dicked up milsurp rifle.
After a few years of this I was trusted by so many people that it was a sense of pride. The problem is, everything has changed so much in the last several years.
You cant be a gunsmith by taking an online or college class anymore than you can be a welder, electrician or machinest. I moved on mostly since the owner died but still do the odd job here and there.
This sort of video gave me some hope for a new wave to somehow emerge out of the shitty circumstances. It seems to me it was a lot easier to get going in a work capacity in the 90s, but a hell of a lot more accessible to be a hobbyist DIYer today.
It’s hilarious I used to work in a machine shop where I would do a bunch of custom one off on manual machines. A bunch of it ended up being automotive related, but a lot of it was also making weird gun parts even like spring and stuff. I did a lot of welding too(when needed for machining). I can absolutely handle a bunch of that stuff. I would never call myself a gunsmith because I really struggle like making wooden stocks and repairing wooden stocks and things like drilling and tapping the receiver on my 870 took me some thought process. But a guy I met did the gunsmithing classes at Sdi, crapply assembled a black powder rifle and now he’s out there in the industry, trying to be a gunsmith. (also he owns like eight Bear Creek arsenal rifles and not a single quality rifle.) he couldn’t run a mill or a or cut a dovetail make a spring.
On a serious note. SDI for guns is kinda like what UTI is for cars. You can learn all the textbook stuff, get some hands-on experience, and be better prepared to be an automotive technician than someone with no training. You still have to put in the work and earn the experience with experience.
Depends on the price I guess, but I think that's a fair assessment
Maybe, but SDI does NOT look worth it for the price. I’ve learned some of their stated course material from just being a hobbyist, buying my own rifle and upgrading it. It’s a difference of $20,000 of student loan debt vs. an eight hundred dollar rifle and about a thousand spent on various parts and decorations as I could afford to buy them.
I commend you for trying. Lots and lots of good info. I completely understand and dont take for granted i lucked out in my path. I k ow it wont and cant be that easy for many, hell, most. But the "figure it out" concept is lost on many. Most lack motivation and the vigor required to become what they say they want. If they can figure out how different guns work, they can figure out how to become a gunsmith. It takes a certain type of mentality to find a way to make it work.
@ForgottenWeapons should share this invaluable video for a question he gets so often.
What you have said about troubleshooting and fucking things up is how we learn! Well said freeman👍🏼
I have hundreds of hours grinding out corrosion with cratex bits in a die grinder. I could smell them as soon as you said the name.
All I needed was that little push to get me looking at banged up old shotguns again.
I look at gunsmiths like I do mechanics. The breath of skill and knowledge between them is massive in scale. From a local shop mechanic to a certified CAT diesel technician and everything in between. They vary drasticly in experience and expertise, but they are all mechanics. The same is true for gunsmiths.
As for SDI, a guy who worked for them for 7 years was on a live with Focus Tripp, and he summed it up perfectly. "SDI is a marketing company, not a gunsmithing school."
Learning by doing is very true. I’ve worked on dozens of my own guns. Still consider myself a bubba level amateur but I know more than when I started.
You can make a mold of 3d printed parts and use that mold to recast them into polymer they should be able to hold together a lot better or even use sand casting for metal parts
The things mentioned here as far as the mindset to this trade can apply to any other kind of trade. Mainly the drive to learn.
Love your vids please make more videos like this
Tools for any sort of smithing or machining are the same as ones for gunsmiths.
Think of: (this is a lot btw)
#1- Money
#2- Time
#3- A will to loose/break tools somehow
#4- A good aerated space
#5- A will to learn and get 2 hours of sleep
Past that, in terms of tools and such:
High quality punch set (get 2 in case of breakage)
Brass hammers, plastic hammers, & small regular hammers
A good set of precision/electronic repair screwdrivers and bits
a set of regular screwdrivers with security bits.
A LOT of random different files of various sizes (Most important imo)
A high quality dremel with a LOT of attachments (filing stones, drill bits, etc)
Chamfer related add-ons for drill/press
tapping driver tool
tap & die set
A drill press
12 ton press
lathe
drill bits
electric sander
3d printer (good for making molds) (knowledge of solid works or blender may help)
a decent vice
A decent welder & welding mask
A mask and safety goggles.
A sharpie marker and a bunch of plastic bags for labeling parts for storage or for when you stop for the day.
a bunch of oils, lube, and grease.
vice grips, and a lot of different pliers
Staining oils for wood, and bluing related kits for metal.
mechanics gloves, and work gloves.
A good EDC flashlight
A magnifying glass
A good multitool
A good pocketknife
A large magnet to put near the ground to find pins/screws you drop
No-go gauges, go gauges, field gauges for various calibers.
Snap caps.
Hex keys Metric and imperial
A cheap ratchet set.
crescent wrenches
Electrical tape, duct tape, flex tape.
A good med kit (in case you cut yourself)
thread lockers
break cleaner & WD40
Become a Gunsmith or an Armourer is my dream job.
Its really hard to get into and from what I’ve seen, teaching yourself and finding like minded people is the best way to get into this.
The government doesn’t like people like us, at all.
Ive got a literal workshop but no place to actually set up shop... frustration on a whole new level...
Art School, Film School, MBA… All good analogies.
Also, I originally got into 3D printing for the sole purpose of printing jigs, fixtures, and tools.
Love these talking videos
I found this video helpful. Thanks for the insights.
Latex gloves are your friend for metal splinters, microflex diamond grip is what I used as a machinist.
Math I think is highly underrated as a skill, and it's one you really do need to practice at. I'm a software developer, I have a computer science bachelor's and a Math minor, and I recently relearned long division and pre-calculus. It wasn't hard but it's amazing how quickly you can forget things.
Calculus and long division are not often that useful but being able to convert ratios and percentages is very useful and can be a bit unintuitive.
I could not agree more that the the best way to learn is by doing and it's not super expensive to start. I'm only a couple years in myself. I started doing videos, which pushed myself to learn even more news things, over the past 11 months and it's amazing how much I've managed to learn in less than a year. So yeah, just go do! And if you find you're not learning the new things you think you should be, or fast enough, find a way to push yourself, hold yourself accountable.
This is almost word for word for what I tell people who wanna get into it
I think if you’re a gunsmith, you should be willing to tell customers, “I don’t know how to do this, here’s a refund.”
My first experience with a gunsmith was a supposedly good shop that couldn’t figure out what I did to a Ruger MkII to make it not work, but they billed me for a bunch of VQ springs they stuffed inside it at an insane mark-up. I was annoyed, so I watched a video, learned how to take a MkII apart completely, took it apart, took another one apart, measured every part with calipers, figured out what was wrong, and fixed it.
I never used that shop again, though.
I started with 80% AR's and have migrated into 3D printing them. And 1911's. From here I'm going to be going into CNC machining, anodizing, etc. Have a few Parker-Hale Mauser bolt-action castings that are going to get machined a& heat-treated, custom stocks, and converted over to use Savage barrels.
gunsmith when firearmjohnson walks in
firearmjohnson when weaponbartholomew walks in
There are levels of gunsmiths. Assembling them, repairing them(mechanical or artistic), fabricating them, and fabricating parts for the repairs as needed(highest level) alongside designers which can be visionary gunsmiths that change the field(Hoffman and the like).
I'm no gun smith but getting a 3D printer and buying a parts kit is very satisfying and fun. Get good at making your own 3d printed guns before you decide if you want to get into legit gun smithing. It has definitely taught me that I enjoy tinkering and making my own guns but that I don't necessarily want to do this for other people.
I found the American Gunsmith publication very helpful in my pursuit of the hobby.
Interesting subject
Great video great resource
Amazing video
Thanks for the Blueing advice, I want to get a polished PP and I guess Ill follow up this instead.
i called a local gun store/gun smith for some reason and ended up shooting the shit
he mentioned SDI and i was like yeah i could do it, i got a GI Bill
i called them but their customer service was lazy and never got back to me.
thank god they didnt
i can buy all the parts to a knife and put it together, i can sharpen blades, do basic repairs, but i dont call myself a blacksmith because i dont actually make knives, likewise with gunsmithing i think of a guy you can hand a gun to and he can re-blue the steel, fix a crack in the stock, check your headspacing for your weird caliber choice, and make both basic and complex repairs, identify things like potential cracks forming in stuff like trunions or locking surfaces etc, anyone with an IQ above 80 can put together an AR, anyone with a proper interest in ARs more than just going to the range once a year with their airsoft optic on their DDM4 can swap to a different weight buffer, though these are things that would fall under the category of gunsmithing, they wouldnt make you a gunsmith because its basically just adult legos
Almost everything that you've said about gunsmithing counts for machining as well. 👍
I’ve been spending the last few days dicking around with designing a polymer handguard for an Aug A3. I’d like to attach it to the barrel assembly so that it doesn’t interfere with the QD barrel system, but one issue I’m running into is finding a way to mount it without allowing direct heat transfer from the gas block into the handguard; I’ve been sliding over the bayonet lug and pinning in place at the swivel point of the vertical foregrip, but the bayonet lug heats up enough to melt and distort the connection after about 50 rounds. Is there something you’d recommend for insulating prints from heat over direct attachment points like this? My next idea was to have a machinist make a bushing that attaches to the bayonet lug threads, wrap it in some high heat insulating material, and have the 3D print sleeve over that bushing, but I’m not sure what would be the best material to do that with.
As always he be out here spitting facts
I think if you repair guns, or build guns, or manufacture components, and do these well, you deserve to be called a gunsmith.
Pine Technical and Community college has a great in person gun smithing program
37:42 Ivan: "Matt is a lower caste than burger flippers" 😁
Sorry for bothering everyone, but the documents link on the barrel making video is dead.
Is there another active link?
so what youre saying is, that because i have a dremel tool, i too am a gunsmiff? I cant wait to start cutting glock slides!
I have studied machinery, hours and hours in lathes, presses, mills, and took Glock, AR, armorer's courses and a gunsmith is basically a type of engineer that works on the products they build... I been doing this for years a decade, built 15 or so ARs , couple 1911's, and numerous Glocks and P80's etc.... i still call myself an apprentice in gunsmithing, which technically i am one, but not a word to be used lightly
The part at the end sounds a lot like the discourse around being a mechanical engineer vs an aeronautical engineer. With some effort a mechanical engineer can work their way into aeronautical engineering, but not really the other way round
So the lesson I heard here Ivan was buy cheap crappy shotguns and that is one with which I will happily oblige.
Make the shotgun series, they are tremendously interesting subject that goes far too overlooked.
I didn't know you had your own channel!
So basically, its a trade with specializations. Like, you could be a master electrician, but only specialize in residential wiring
I just reprofiled a cheap "pa-15" lower from a2 style to a partial fence a1 using carbide burrs. I fucked a lot of it up and spent so many hours with a set of diamond hand files smoothing out the areas I mutilated. In the end it turned an ugly lower I was reticent to use into a lower I'm excited to use in a retro build, plus I learned quite a bit.
This is probably a stupid question but: I'm a CNC operator, would my prescription Z87 safety glasses be sufficient, or would I need something else?
Something that can protect your eyes from springs/detents launched out of guns, fragments from broken tools, etc. Something rated for being around machine tools should be sufficient.
Can I identify as a gunsmith?
I diagnose you as gumsmiph
Technically yes
you should identify as having a second joke
@@coolbugfacts1234seriously
According to SDI... If you can put together Legos.. Then yes
I had SDI once from a tinder date. It was like pissing gasoline for weeks.....
The friends we made were the bolts we gapped along the way. (I am fully a bubba)
I do want to start 3D printing guns, but I guess what’s preventing me is that I just don’t know where to start. That and the lack of space since I live in an apartment.
The CTRLPEW Getting Started Guide is where to start
@@IvanPrintsGuns thanks. Love the content here and on Fuddblasters btw.
I unsporterized a saiga 12, I em GumSmif.
No gunsmith I met has formal gunsmith training. It’s hard as it is and the rich make it harder by keeping the normals away from
Guns
Have a degree in ME and can confirm I can’t remember how to subtract much less do differential equations
Learn to use a file, make a chisel ridiculously sharp, make and properly heat treat flat springs. Then you can make mistakes until you learn. The big day will finally happen when some offers to pay you to make mistakes
I think that is the number one that people need to hear loud and clear. You do NOT need a license to build guns or repair guns. You need a license to sell them if manufacturing for sale is your business.
What can is that?
I am not a gunsmith, more of an armorer. I weld, do a little machining, and have custom made a decent amount of stuff. I am actually stating DSI soon for their drone program. Simple way to get into that hobby, get certified, and get paid to do so with the GI Bill. But I can tell you from speaking to their reps for a few month: they don’t like to be honest about telling you want the program cost.
Is that 1911 a 9mm or .38 super auto?
anyone whos into gunsmithing doesn't need a school to do it they need to learn manufacturing or gun repair those are the two things someone in gunsmithing is going to be doing
I want to solder an rmr mount onto a blackpowder revolver
weld not solder
Is there some useful literature about gunsmithing?
Greetings, Mr. Rat
Gunsmithing as an art is probably similarly taught, though through a much longer curriculum to welding. There is some people that are going to struggle, because it’s just a certain layer of art to it that makes it quality. Your welds may hold for testing, but look like crap.
10:00 that’s how I got into it. Went from automotive to aviation electronics and now guns. I simply started by looking for a job as an apprentice. Now all the sicarios want my work lol! I went to a local gunsmithing school and learned absolutely jack shit. I had a great teacher to work under and a horrible teacher from school.
I actually have a degree from SDI in Firearms Technology, I also have a Bachelors degree in Economics, and yet I am not an Economist... I will say that I have gotten to work on many guns because I have the degree from SDI... BUT.... I have learned most things about how to work on any gun from watching videos online.
To be honest, if you want to be a gunsmith, just claim you have a degree from anywhere, because NO one will look it up... So a gunsmith degree from Harvard will get you business...
But, I will say you just have to actually care about what you are doing, I care about old guns, and I take a doctors oath, Do no Harm...
One of the OutOfBattery streams was on the same topic, I found it pretty informative: "The Guncad Home Workshop with OA" (watch?v=RUTwIQtfxSc)
One thing I will add: BreakFree CLP gives major rashes, I had to stop using it on guns I work on continuously (Stupid Advantage arms kit...) in favor of Balistol.
Uh sir I believe the term is professional dremmel operator.
@24:00 Nitrile gloves
shoptalk is good content
So is the correct term here "Armorer":?
"Gat Molester"
An actual gunsmith is when you're a jack of all trades but in a very specialized niche...
i gots the same screwdriver set. i broked it
I went to where it’s at in Tempe and idk seems 🐟 🐟
I love you mister ratman
If Archimedes had 3d printers Syracuse would be a global superpower today.
Wait? Everytown has a gunsmith?
These comments may get lost in the algorithm but here’s my advice (from some random dude on the internet). Buy a book on communication like Dale Carnegie, how to win friends and influence people. It’s a more effective skill to talk with other people than to know gun smithing. Next good small gun repair shops in your area. Know what you’re looking for are old gun smiths/hobbies. Age 65 to 80, they are rare but they are out there. No one that does it for a living has the time to train you. You have to look at the guy kids moved away, that doesn’t need the money, that just enjoys the trade. Is your communication skills, It’s very easy once you got it down. If he makes an offer to take you under neath his wing you have to make that decision. You may say they these people don’t exist. Wrong I been ask 4 separate times from different people to be their apprentice. All because of charm and communication.
If you made it these far, last piece of advice, just got out there and look around. When one door closes another opens. The worst thing is they say know, but if you like each other you just made a friend and that sometime more powerful than master a skill. Best of luck out there
I AM A PROUD DREMELFU- I MEAN *DREMELSMITH*
yeah budy
Iv challenge: can you produce the M41A-PulseRifle with the weapon's option's flame-thrower and rocket launcher you can?
for me gunsmithing is things I can't do even with tools, for example removing a tikka t3 barrel which they way over torque.