Nakamichi BX-100 Idler Wheel Problem
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- Опубликовано: 29 авг 2024
- Unit had problem of fast-forward and rewind being very sluggish. Idler wheel rubber surface was found to be glazed over. I used 150 grit sandpaper to remove the glaze. Unit now worked much better. The most difficult part was removing the small clear plastic washer holding the idler wheel in place. Care must be taken not to lose this. In theory, another washer could probably made out of clear plastic blister packaging.
Some people don't like the Sankyo mechanism in Nakamichi tape decks but they are "easy" to repair, compared to others.
Thank you for taking the time to make the video and all the commenters for the extra tips. I used the sanding method and totally fixed the FFD/RWD issue on my Technics CX-650R. You all are what is great about the internet. Thank you all!
Thanks sir, for your kind words for my commenters and myself! I am happy that you got it fixed and didn't give up. Good job!
Many thanks Old School! I'd watched another video which involved even removing the base plate, but thankfully there was no need to do that at all -- your guide has been exactly what I needed and it all worked perfectly.
Cool! Good job! Glad my video helped a little!
A very special Thank you for posting the video,clearly explaining the root cause and remedy, easy enough that anyone could understand. Fixed my Nakamichi BX1 , works like a charm. I managed to remove the plate and did the job, just too scared to remove the mechanism.Great, thanks once again.
Congratulations for doing a good job! You saved another vintage unit of audio gear. Thanks for your kind words and for watching.
Hi - Nice video! Just a quick note - if you want to clean the idler to get more life while your part is on order, all you have to do is pop off the cassette door, take out the 2 screws holding on the black plate, and clean the idler! You don't even need to take the cover off!
Just did that on mine and it's back to strong winding each way!
Thanks! And thanks for the info! That's good to know!
I just repaired my Nakamichi CR-7A thanks to your video and to the comment of one of the persons that watched the video.
To make it easier than this video, I just removed the black metal plate that sits behind the cassette, there are two small screws on the top of this plate that sits right in front of this Idle wheel. I cleaned the tire with liquid sander and I clean all the parts or spindles where this tire makes contact with Isopropyl alcohol, it took me about 15 minutes.
Now it rewinds, fast-forward and plays like brand new!
Good job! Thanks for your comments and tips!
Thanks. I have this same model, and this helped me. I ended cuting a 1 inch square of 220 grit sand paper and wraping that around the wheel, and sanding it lightly in place. Only had to remove the front plate, and not take apart the whole thing.
Thanks for telling about the method you used. Good job!
Hey There 'Old School' - Just wanted to Thank you so much for posting this video. I have exactly the same model of Nakamichi & it had exactly the same fault! Your video helped a lot to fix it & has saved it from being skipped! 👍🏽
Thank you so much, sir, for your kind words! You did a good deed, by fixing your unit. Best wishes.
And I have the same deck that I purchased in college. Twice it was sent in for repairs for this to the tune of about $200 each time. It's been sitting in the closet for years - now I can fix it myself for cheap!
Praise the internet and praise people like you for sharing the knowledge. I THINK this is going to be exactly what I need to get a Sansui D-550M going properly again. If the sandpaper doesn't work, then maybe I'll use an o-ring instead. Fingers crossed!
Good luck and thanks for mentioning o-rings!
@@OldSchoolElectronics Just to follow up, i was able to use your idea of sandpaper without removing the idler assembly. In fact, without a tape inserted my machine was able to spin the idler wheel reasonably well, so I could use fast forward to spin the wheel while I lightly touched it with sandpaper. I few minutes later, I was done. Thanks again.
Glad that worked out for you...Looks like you did a great job!
Mine had developed the same fault. The good news is you don't need to take it apart to fix this. Removing the black plate is easy enough with just the two screws and then you can get to the little wheel and roughen it with one of those sticks designed for filing your nails. Very light pressure, patience -the idea is not to file it down. Using Fast Forward will allow you to get the machine to do most of the work too. However, I think the real problem is the rubber has aged and hardened over the last 40 years and this will only be a temporary fix. A replacement tire is needed. I ordered one along with a capstan belt as I am sure the existing one will also have lost its performance over time. Lubrication of the various bearings is probably a good idea too.
Thanks for your input! True, the rubber has just aged; nothing can be done about that. So far the deck, which is used often, has held up fine. I didn't know they still sold replacement idlers.
I used this filing method and it worked brilliantly. Highly recommended.
I just wanted to add to this video. I found that you can access the idler wheel by just taking off the black plate through the door. Also I removed the rubber wheel without removing the cam. I then turned the rubber wheel inside out so that the previous unworn inside part was now on the outside. A perfect easy fix.
Thanks for the extra information!
Your welcome. I didn’t say in my comment that your video is great. It’s probably saved hundreds of Naks from ending up in the junk heap. Thank You!
Thanks, again! People have criticized me for this video, though! Sometimes I have also used an o-ring for the rubber wheel/tire. Good idea with turning the wheel/tire around.
Gotta love those super simple Nakamichi mechanism's. When I fixed my Philips F6121 there was also a washer for the idler gear which had it's teeth fall of and also the auto-stop gear had it's teeth fall of. I probably wasted about 1 hour or more to find that damn washer, I think that I've lost and found it about 7 times lol. Never thought of putting it on a piece of tape!. Keep up the good works. Cheers :)
Bravo! Thanks for sharing. I have the same mechanism in an onkyo that I hope to repair and this gives me hope. Godspeed with you other adventures!
Thank you sir and good luck! I repaired this a few years ago and according to the owner the unit still works fine. All the best!
Without this small trick and a small piece of sand paper, thi Naka was good for the garbage : what a shame ! I mean : there is not a single line about this possible issue on the BX-2 Service Manual. Couldn't they think such a problem could show up after some years ? Dam ! I mean, I'm happy to have save it - and thank you so much for your help - but in the other hands, I feel that so absurd ... Most of people have think it is dead and how many units have been wasted ?
Good job! I am happy you got it fixed. Saved from going to the trash! I think when they made these machines they did not think these Nakamichis would still be used 40 years later. Thanks for watching and your comments!
you have a point!
Tess , the ones who wasted it and threw it away were the no-brainers .. . . . Just place a piece of tape round the rewinding spools , both left and right .. Or you can place the neck of a balloon round the idler wheel . Fits like a glove .
the surplus you take away with a pair of scissors
There's also a video where someone places balloonrubber round the winding spools.
Look for Kenwood KX-400 in the browser , the one with 5.14 minutes
In the good old days we just apply some amount of lacquer thinner in a cotton swab and then rub it at that idler tire rubber surface. No more hassle of removing it which is difficult and time consuming.
Thanks for the tip!
If you lose the idler wheel washer, like I did.. You can use a tiny piece of the speaker wire sheath, just clip a piece off the end and use it as the washer. I've been playing tapes for months without any problems.
Cool! Thanks for that idea! Those little washers tend to disappear and hide.
@@OldSchoolElectronics at first I thought I was in trouble. Then I read some forum where they used a leather punch to create a washer from a milk jug. I was elated when the lil piece of wire sheath fit so well.
Good job and good idea!
@@mzebari That site was tapeheads... hahaha. I saw that thread too :-)
Many thanks for this video. I need to do the same thing with my deck and now I know how to proceed. This is RUclips as it's best. Take care and stay safe!
Thanks and good luck with your deck! You stay safe too!
It looks like MR1 has same idler design for reels. NAK had a gear upgrade option, but it was noisier and offered no general benefit vs idler tire. Try using Rubber Renew it's also very good restoration
Thanks for the info about the deck and the Rubber Renew!
Cats like this guy are my hero's
Great video!! I have a BX300 with the same issue.. Now I know how to fix it!! Thank you!
Thanks and good luck!
I got my replacement washer from a garden hose tap adapter (the little rubber sealing ring is perfect).... cheap from the local shop and still working 10+ years later.
Hey! That's a trick to know! Thanks!
Watch out for the black plate, at the bottom it fits into slots in the shiny pins at either side. I can see on the video 9:10 that the plate is not in the slots. This mounts the plate too far forward miss aligns the tape and makes the deck sound a bit off.
Thanks for that. I probably corrected everything afterwards or in between video shooting, since I do give every unit a final test before I pass it on. It's been awhile, but the deck is still going strong although it is used every week by the young woman that has it now.
Ha!..Dam washers and shag carpet!..lol..that sound like me when i was young...tearing apart stuff on the floor and loosing parts in the carpet! Nice tape trick,good idea to keep from dropping the washer when putting it back on..nice fix too!
Thanks Lonny! LOL! Shag carpet used to be "hot" back in the day....just like bell bottoms, hot pants, avocado-colored fridges and so on.
haha!.. i think we still had some shag, but i was born in 70 so i didnt have bell bottoms or maybe i was too young to wear them, but i do remember mom dressing me in those 80's horizontal stripped shirts with the little button up collar! lol..man i hated those, i wanted to wear dirt bike t-shirts! haha!
Nakamichi used to supply a replacement kit, I used a rubber O-ring to replace the idler tire.
Thanks for the tip! O-ring seems like a good idea.
thanks for this great video, my deck had a different problem, but the same cause. it could FF and REW, but play worked for 2-3 seconds, then the deck stopped. having watched this video, i started removing the transport, but then decided to just remove the back plate, and I carefully sanded the idler wheel in place with a tiny strip of 180grit sandpaper.
Thanks for watching and glad you got it fixed! I hate to see this great vintage hifi gear ending up in a landfill. Yes, it is not necessary to remove the mechanism (I just prefer it since I can inspect things better); I think I mentioned this in the video or comments--not sure though. You used to be able to sand turntable idler wheels with sandpaper too. Anyway, good job!
I have the same problem with my mr1.. I'm a bit confused
You really have chosen the hard way lol. You can remove the plate and replace or refurb the idler without removing the mech.
LOL. I don't know how many commenter already wrote that. I think I had a certain reason for doing that; hopefully you don't think I am inept even though I have repaired thousands of electronics units since I have been in electronics; on and off the job.
@@OldSchoolElectronics All good, your way was certainly working it just was a little complicated. Still, its good to see different ways of doing things :) I'm currently working out if I can refurb the idlers on a Sharp RT5100 without taking everything out...
Must say that changing that rubber thing works best, dont try to save some money, it might work sanding the rubber, but a new part is cheaper.
Now my deck runs again, but is making clickering noises when the tape is over.
Same issue with a 300 I just got for 4 bucks.
Fixed it and sold got a small fortune
Cool, you got a good deal!
Gracias por el aporte, me sirvió para reparar mi Nakamichi BX-150. Thanks man.
Thanks for watching!
Most times if the rubber cannot be sourced, an o ring is the best subtitute
It works just as well
I solved plenty problems like that already
Thanks for the info!
A dab of grease will hold the washer in place...That drive system looks exactly like my Yamaha K-1000...the capstan motor is brushless and has a big flywheel that spins around a set of coils, which will have zero resistance, and the reel motor has the tire like yours that moves back and forth between the two reels..and I had to do the same thing with the tire...sand it LIGHTLY and as evenly as i could which fixed it.
Thanks for all the infos and tips!
some tech's use 3000 grit sand paper on the tire with a dremel. I prefer to spray carb cleaner on a cuetip and apply it on the tire. Restores tire softness and removes glaze.
Good ideas! Never tried carb cleaner. Thanks!
@@OldSchoolElectronics carb cleaner on cue tip, then on tire. just enough to evaporate in a couple seconds will do the trick.
I will try that next time! Thanks again for that tip!
Couldn't you do this without taking the whole mechanism off and just remove that metal plate to get to the rubber wheel?
I think I might have mentioned that in the video. It was just easier for me personally to do it this way.
...I may have snapped the idler wheel off while trying to fix this. I feel like an idiot. How can I fix this? I would appreciate any help.
I don't get that: why did you open up the machine and pull out the entire drive mechanism, when all you had to do, to access the idler wheel, was remove the plate from the front without any of that ???
I had another reason for pulling it out; I don't remember what it was though, since it was years ago? Why would you be so concerned about that?
The most important thing - how to take off the snap ring is not there - omitted. Otherwise the removal of the whole mechanism due to the replacement of the rubber band is completely unnecessary, it can be done from the front without removing it from the hi-fi tower
Well then, you can make a video showing how to do this.
@@OldSchoolElectronics No video required. With the door open, the operator cover can be unscrewed with two screws and pulled out comfortably. The pulley is exposed and can be removed after removing the fuse. The rubber band is replaced and put back. That is all. Otherwise, thank you for your video :)
Ok, cool! Thanks for the infos!
What if my VCR is feeding itself too much tape and gets clogged?
Hi, thanks for the video. Does Idler also work in play or just rewind and fast forward? Thank’s.
Hi and thanks for commenting. The idler is just for fast forward and rewind. It is called the idler because it is mostly idle, that is, it just does nothing until it is used for FFW (fast forward) and REW (rewind).
I got a nak bx300 with a broken "swing arm" that holds the roller in place. I bought a used bx-1 for parts and got her going! It's an absolute pain though.
Good job! I didn't expect to work on mine; unexpected problem. I assume the higher you go up in model number, the more difficult they are to fix.
This helped me fix my deck thank you
Great! Good job! You got it fixed! Glad the video helped a little.
The hard part of working on these decks is that the part are soo small!
My device, a Nakamichi BX-1 was in very good condition, but had sat unused for several years at least. It has the same transport as the one in this video. The device would power on, but the only button that did anything was the play button, and it would just spin the capstan motor and flywheel for a few seconds and then stop. Nothing at all would happen with a cassette in the machine.
If you are having similar symptoms to the ones I described above (little to no movement from Play, Rev, FF), go to this video and find my comment there: ruclips.net/video/ExNSDYwKeXA/видео.html
Once I had basic functions working, I came to this video to solve this exact issue. I would put a cassette in the machine and the functions were unable to move the cassette.
I suggest doing the following like another commenter suggested, it worked very well. Just remove the black plate as he does in the video, close the cassette door, press FF, and very lightly touch a small file to the rubber of the Idler wheel. After some time, and it will take some patience, try a cassette, and if it doesn't work try more filing. Due to the very low amounts of pressure you can use, a sharper file works better. Let the spinning of the FF do the work over a minute or a few. If your wheel is destroyed or cracked filing it probably won't work, but if it is just too smooth like mine was this might work well.
Hope this helps!
Great explanation Old School, very useful video. Thanks.
Thanks for your comments and tips! The deck I did is still holding up good. The woman that owns it uses it every week and it has been a while since I made this video.
Will it also help to very slightly sand paper the brass motor capstan with like 320 grit sand paper, which comes in contact with the idler wheel? WIll this further enhances better contact or just don't do it as it might distort the dimension of that brass capstan?
sir, i would be hesitant with sanding the capstan. might be another story if it had some kind of wear pattern. i just clean them with alcohol (use a clean rag if the cotton swab doesn't work), making sure not to get the alcohol in the capstan bearing. then maybe put one drop of sewing/machine oil on the bearing; just one drop. then clean any excess oil off. maybe i would use something not too abrasive like scotchbrite if there was something on there i could not otherwise get off--so far, i have always gotten everything off. in the end, it is a judgement call...if the unit plays fine, i would just clean the capstan up. stands to reason though, that a slightly sanded capstan would grip slightly better. a heavily sanded capstan would seem to wear the tape faster, this would probably show itself by deposits building up faster. in the end, i would focus on the other stuff to get the deck up to par again: pressure roller, clean heads, new belts, good rubber pulleys, clean tape guides, demagnetization, and so on.
Thanks man!
Thanks for watching!
I'm wanting to replace the power cord on my Nak CR4, do you think it's as easy as soldering two connections?
I no longer have this unit, but it should not be too difficult; so long as you can get the strain relief of the power cord out.
ok thanks.
I would not have messed about cleaning it up, you can buy new tyres on eBay.
At that time I couldn't find any and the problem remains solved to this day.
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this is the same problem with Sansui deck D-350M almost the same mechanism
Thanks for this good information!
Спасибо
Can u make a video on how to do this on the 9090?
I can do that in the near future.
@@OldSchoolElectronics ty sooo much