I have installed hundreds of EV chargers over the years and am Tesla and Powerpoint certified. I have used manual transfer switches to get the same results by using an extra A/C unit or stove circuit, because people don't usually run their stove or range at night when they are charging.. I am really glad to find out about an automatic unit .
Dustin, I've been doing 200A service upgrades and electric vehicle 60A circuits w/ level 2 chargers all year long. It's really all I ever want to do as far as work goes.
Thanks for covering this Dustin - I've seen load managers for EV charge points themselves (sharing charging loads together) but not generically like this, with monitoring the whole electrical panel. Also, nice work explaining the residential load calculations, without getting deep in the weeds with the code references - many people just need the "big picture" overview like you gave!
Mr Rob, I watch many of your Revit videos. Very helpful! With regards to this video. The company I work for( Electrical Consultants) we are currently reviewing many sites for the installation on 20-40 chargers each. You typically have to install a meter at the point of connection(utility) to measure the spare capacity and the add a dynamic load managment system. This can control up to 100 chargers.
People overthink charging their EVs. I was limited by the wiring to a seperates garage from the house. All I could use was 20a but I had two phases. A Nema 6-20 plug, 12-2 wiring and a new 20a dual breaker along with a 16a 240v level 2 charger and now I'm charging at 3.5kw. That is enough to charge my hungry Audi E-Tron overnight. That all cost me $300.
I wish someone would make for North America an EV charger (EVSE) with an integrated load manager, like they do in the UK. That way it can throttle the charging current enough to stay within the service’s rating without having to completely stop charging. If say the total demand is say 10A too high it could temporarily drop the charging rate by 10A.
In some places the building code requires provisions for EV charging during new construction. Installation of the breaker and wire or conduit so wire can be pulled later. It's so much cheaper taking care of this before the concrete is poured. Once the concrete is poured it cost 15 times more to get the electricity from where it is to where its wanted.
Load managers are a god idea i am only supriced that you talk about this as someting new. I live in Sweden and here load manager started to be a thing in the late 1980 is. Someting else that might shock you is that in Sweden you can not get a singel phase service to a house, you can only get 3 phase.
UK, and learned from maintaining my old Porsche and my electric scooter. Ordinary plug socket outside, and car charged overnight. Let your battery run low, keep it under 80% for most of the time, and then trickle charge to full capacity, which allows the battery to rebalance itself. No installations, just a simple charger cable kept in the boot (trunk). I don't do high mileage, so it's all sensible for me, including 7 hours of sleep at night. Saying all that, my wife has a diesel, so IF an emergency happens 100 miles away, I can always pinch hers, but after a year, that hasn't actually happened, lol.
Another consideration is that an EV doesn't always have to be charged at the highest level. I regularly charge mine at 6A. It's obviously really slow and not the most efficient, but I'm effectively off grid and have plenty of solar to utilise, so it's not a problem. 6A is like a trickle charge, so way less stress on the battery.
I'm only at 4:22 but are you going to mention changing your old lights to LEDs, thereby decreasing their power drawer by ~ 90%? And getting rid of any old fashioned vacuum cleaners and replacing them with battery powered vacuum(s), decreasing their power draw by about 90%?
Great point, but unfortunately, NEC code for residential load calculations have no provisions for taking that into account, as far as I'm aware. It is 3VA/sqft for lighting and receptacles, no "buts". The vast majority of new EV owners who "had" to get a service upgrade probably don't actually use anywhere near the capacity of their service. Hence the load manager featured in this video can be installed, and will rarely, if ever trip. Even with the existing, "undersized" service.
with a newer heat pump system such as the Bosch bova system. The heat pump as well as the heat strips will run at the same time. So when calculating loads for system like that uses 2 stages of heat will need calculated together. The heat pump will run with the help of the heat strips, so the one or the other is not true. both need to be calculated together.
Dustin, I cant tell if the magnification on my 86" tv is off, but you said that is a 200 amp service. Them there service entrance wires sure don't look 200 ampish. 🤔 3/0?
A bit off topic but can you make a guide to getting shocked? Today as I type this or 3 hours ago I accidentally touched the common side of a outlet and shocked my arm. IDK what the exit side of the current was but damn it hurt my left arm. I think its somthing we should better know about. One thing I know now is that getting electronicuted or shocked is way more silent then you think is. Like no noise at all. You dont hear the zzzz noise like in movies or games.
Love this video. I’m installing 30kw of batteries for a whole home backup. Is there a way to do dc to dc charging if that is faster? If it’s not any faster than I won’t explore any further.
Not an electrician, but based on what I know, not sure about faster but more efficient for sure. As DC to AC has losses and then back again you have more losses.
There are very few DC-DC residential chargers available (I think actually none in USA but 2-3 announced and coming) and they will be more efficient but not quicker.
Hello. I have a Siemens charger. It was installed with the ferrites that were provided that made it tricky to install with 6/3 to support the 48amp service for it. It’s been working since September and now my car stops charging minutes after plugging in. No error lights on the charger.
I have a 2025 Chevy blazer EV. Charges fine everywhere else. Siemens says the charger is online and showing no issues. I don’t get why the charge keeps stopping.
Did those CT have shorting bars? Otherwise, the outputs need to be under load before you clamp. Another possibility to consider: that a smart company might jump on. My Clipper Creek (now Enphase), had a 'Sharing' control option that allowed 2 units to run on the same branch by backing down their output when the other was in use. There is no reason that your sense CT's could not generate that 'Other in use' signal and charge at half power. (AFAIK they can't do smart proportioning based upon actual measured draw)
Cool. Now we can charge 8 hours for 1 hour worth of work to install ev chargers. Remember electricians … we get paid by our knowledge and expertise. Not by the hour 👍🏼
@@Kamalatowing video schmideo I charge by the job and I charge $650 minimum for a simple ev charger install. It takes me about 45 minutes and that includes materials. The price just goes up from there depending on how far away from the main panel the charger has to be installed.
In part of that video you had the Siemens multi-circuit monitoring system, but it was gone by the end of the video... What was up with that? Are you doing a video on their monitoring system?
Technically yes, nobody does it. #6 THHN would fly by code, but nobody wants to pipe the entire run. I always see #6 Romex and still passes inspection somehow 🤷♂️
$800 before you even consider the charger.This is one of the reasons "anti ev" folks can have a legit reason to gripe.Lets face it, for someone who is looking to perhaps buy a used EV and take advantage of the rebates and is already on somewhat of a budget,it's a non starter.A little planning and smaller expense of a charger,and you too can fuel up at home.Only have a 100 amp service?then your dryer and or your range has no business being on whilst you charge.Have a garage?then you'll charge overnight,Have a gourmet meal planned you have to prepare where all 4 burners and your oven will be on?then you can't charge your car.I know I oversimplify, but we also shouldn't over complicate. If however, you are charging your electric Porsche,by all means consider this product.But then again you if you have a Porsche,then a service upgrade really isn't a problem now,Right?right.
@@joeshmoe8952 I agree with you. You’re not saving nor helping anything by using an ev. They still burn fossil fuels to make the electricity that charges the ev lol. So route basically robbing Paul to pay Peter.
I have installed hundreds of EV chargers over the years and am Tesla and Powerpoint certified. I have used manual transfer switches to get the same results by using an extra A/C unit or stove circuit, because people don't usually run their stove or range at night when they are charging.. I am really glad to find out about an automatic unit .
Dustin, I've been doing 200A service upgrades and electric vehicle 60A circuits w/ level 2 chargers all year long. It's really all I ever want to do as far as work goes.
Not electrician but that sounds a lot better than some other jobs like rewiring a whole house or something.
I learn a bunch from your videos Ron, thank you for what you do!
Ron is the dude from NJ, Dustin is the cat in TX, both are fukn dope!@@GregsWorkshopOregon
Thanks for covering this Dustin - I've seen load managers for EV charge points themselves (sharing charging loads together) but not generically like this, with monitoring the whole electrical panel. Also, nice work explaining the residential load calculations, without getting deep in the weeds with the code references - many people just need the "big picture" overview like you gave!
Mr Rob, I watch many of your Revit videos. Very helpful!
With regards to this video. The company I work for( Electrical Consultants) we are currently reviewing many sites for the installation on 20-40 chargers each.
You typically have to install a meter at the point of connection(utility) to measure the spare capacity and the add a dynamic load managment system. This can control up to 100 chargers.
People overthink charging their EVs. I was limited by the wiring to a seperates garage from the house. All I could use was 20a but I had two phases. A Nema 6-20 plug, 12-2 wiring and a new 20a dual breaker along with a 16a 240v level 2 charger and now I'm charging at 3.5kw. That is enough to charge my hungry Audi E-Tron overnight. That all cost me $300.
This is a great video...especially the first 7 minutes!
I wish someone would make for North America an EV charger (EVSE) with an integrated load manager, like they do in the UK. That way it can throttle the charging current enough to stay within the service’s rating without having to completely stop charging. If say the total demand is say 10A too high it could temporarily drop the charging rate by 10A.
Great info., Dustin. Thank you.
In some places the building code requires provisions for EV charging during new construction. Installation of the breaker and wire or conduit so wire can be pulled later. It's so much cheaper taking care of this before the concrete is poured. Once the concrete is poured it cost 15 times more to get the electricity from where it is to where its wanted.
Load managers are a god idea i am only supriced that you talk about this as someting new. I live in Sweden and here load manager started to be a thing in the late 1980 is. Someting else that might shock you is that in Sweden you can not get a singel phase service to a house, you can only get 3 phase.
Informative
UK, and learned from maintaining my old Porsche and my electric scooter.
Ordinary plug socket outside, and car charged overnight.
Let your battery run low, keep it under 80% for most of the time, and then trickle charge to full capacity, which allows the battery to rebalance itself.
No installations, just a simple charger cable kept in the boot (trunk).
I don't do high mileage, so it's all sensible for me, including 7 hours of sleep at night.
Saying all that, my wife has a diesel, so IF an emergency happens 100 miles away, I can always pinch hers, but after a year, that hasn't actually happened, lol.
Another consideration is that an EV doesn't always have to be charged at the highest level. I regularly charge mine at 6A. It's obviously really slow and not the most efficient, but I'm effectively off grid and have plenty of solar to utilise, so it's not a problem. 6A is like a trickle charge, so way less stress on the battery.
I'm only at 4:22 but are you going to mention changing your old lights to LEDs, thereby decreasing their power drawer by ~ 90%? And getting rid of any old fashioned vacuum cleaners and replacing them with battery powered vacuum(s), decreasing their power draw by about 90%?
Great point, but unfortunately, NEC code for residential load calculations have no provisions for taking that into account, as far as I'm aware. It is 3VA/sqft for lighting and receptacles, no "buts".
The vast majority of new EV owners who "had" to get a service upgrade probably don't actually use anywhere near the capacity of their service. Hence the load manager featured in this video can be installed, and will rarely, if ever trip. Even with the existing, "undersized" service.
I have a square d qo main panel. Is there a square d version load manager i can see online?
Looked it up and the Siemens Load Manager connects with any brand load center 👍
How much would you charge to install this setup?
Does using a SPAN or other smart panels already solve this?
Very good information - thank you. One slight comment...this would be a better learning experience without the infernal music in the background.
with a newer heat pump system such as the Bosch bova system. The heat pump as well as the heat strips will run at the same time. So when calculating loads for system like that uses 2 stages of heat will need calculated together. The heat pump will run with the help of the heat strips, so the one or the other is not true. both need to be calculated together.
Dustin, I cant tell if the magnification on my 86" tv is off, but you said that is a 200 amp service. Them there service entrance wires sure don't look 200 ampish. 🤔 3/0?
A bit off topic but can you make a guide to getting shocked? Today as I type this or 3 hours ago I accidentally touched the common side of a outlet and shocked my arm. IDK what the exit side of the current was but damn it hurt my left arm. I think its somthing we should better know about. One thing I know now is that getting electronicuted or shocked is way more silent then you think is. Like no noise at all. You dont hear the zzzz noise like in movies or games.
Love this video. I’m installing 30kw of batteries for a whole home backup. Is there a way to do dc to dc charging if that is faster? If it’s not any faster than I won’t explore any further.
I don't think there's an easy way to do it.
Not an electrician, but based on what I know, not sure about faster but more efficient for sure. As DC to AC has losses and then back again you have more losses.
There are very few DC-DC residential chargers available (I think actually none in USA but 2-3 announced and coming) and they will be more efficient but not quicker.
Hello. I have a Siemens charger. It was installed with the ferrites that were provided that made it tricky to install with 6/3 to support the 48amp service for it. It’s been working since September and now my car stops charging minutes after plugging in. No error lights on the charger.
I have a 2025 Chevy blazer EV. Charges fine everywhere else. Siemens says the charger is online and showing no issues. I don’t get why the charge keeps stopping.
Did those CT have shorting bars? Otherwise, the outputs need to be under load before you clamp.
Another possibility to consider: that a smart company might jump on. My Clipper Creek (now Enphase), had a 'Sharing' control option that allowed 2 units to run on the same branch by backing down their output when the other was in use. There is no reason that your sense CT's could not generate that 'Other in use' signal and charge at half power. (AFAIK they can't do smart proportioning based upon actual measured draw)
Cool. Now we can charge 8 hours for 1 hour worth of work to install ev chargers. Remember electricians … we get paid by our knowledge and expertise. Not by the hour 👍🏼
I just watched a legal advice video, so as a lawyer I must advise against doing that. Three hundred dollars an hour for my service, you're welcome.
@@Kamalatowing video schmideo I charge by the job and I charge $650 minimum for a simple ev charger install. It takes me about 45 minutes and that includes materials. The price just goes up from there depending on how far away from the main panel the charger has to be installed.
It looks a lot like those fire-starter transfer panels from Reliance Controls.
So I check outlet n it say 128 i turn on light goes down to 121 then in breaker started to show 240
In part of that video you had the Siemens multi-circuit monitoring system, but it was gone by the end of the video... What was up with that? Are you doing a video on their monitoring system?
Can’t you just install a small subpanel for your ev charger instead of replacing the main service???
What would be 100x smarter, is to have a charger that uses those ct's and could just lower the charge current.
Wouldn’t you want to use 4 AWG for 60 amps?
Technically yes, nobody does it. #6 THHN would fly by code, but nobody wants to pipe the entire run. I always see #6 Romex and still passes inspection somehow 🤷♂️
#6 THWN is rated for 65 amps
@ that’s right. I was thinking NM cable for some reason.
Is there something unusual? THHN
The EV chargers that I have seen lately only require 50 amps max.
The electric system at my parents house is from the 50’s 😂
psp load shedding devices are a pain to work on
if anyone has ever worked on them lol
Why?
$800 before you even consider the charger.This is one of the reasons "anti ev" folks can have a legit reason to gripe.Lets face it, for someone who is looking to perhaps buy a used EV and take advantage of the rebates and is already on somewhat of a budget,it's a non starter.A little planning and smaller expense of a charger,and you too can fuel up at home.Only have a 100 amp service?then your dryer and or your range has no business being on whilst you charge.Have a garage?then you'll charge overnight,Have a gourmet meal planned you have to prepare where all 4 burners and your oven will be on?then you can't charge your car.I know I oversimplify, but we also shouldn't over complicate.
If however, you are charging your electric Porsche,by all means consider this product.But then again you if you have a Porsche,then a service upgrade really isn't a problem now,Right?right.
First thing I would do is get rid of that Chinese contactor. Wow Siemens... really?
Charge it on the neighbors house!
DO NOT buy one.....problem solved!
I would just avoid buying an EV period!
Grow up
@@eazy-ecuster6878😂
@@joeshmoe8952 I agree with you. You’re not saving nor helping anything by using an ev. They still burn fossil fuels to make the electricity that charges the ev lol. So route basically robbing Paul to pay Peter.
And the oil CEOs thank you for your money.
Get a plug-in hybrid! They can run full electric, full gas, or as they were designed: a hybrid of the two
Sell the ev!!!!! The battery will fail catestrophically and burn down your house!!!
😂
Dendrites in those batteries is unavoidable.