Just completely remanufactured a pair of opti’s, biggest issue is poor maintenance, and marina thieves. I have owned mercs for 48 years, and no issues, enjoy your vids!!
I have a 1998 200 OptiMax that I got new on my 1997 BassCat and it has run with very few issues in the 26 years I have owned it. I am a stickler on maintaining it and I think that is the key. It runs as good as the day I bought it.
Such great tips, Keith. It's great that you shares disclaimers and cautions about particular brand names, and at the same time, you are still letting the audience know if they still want to purchase, they can, but be careful. Yes, I'm realizing just like a car, motorcycle, machines, etc... take that boat out for a test run. I like that saying the person said to you. If something new comes out, he'll allow a few years to go by in order to see how things go. Lol. That can apply to many things in life. Great video as always, Keith!
I got one of the second batch on your list, thankfully my 03 Yamaha F225 hasn't had the dreaded corrosion issues reported by so many other mechanics and owners.. but then again I've never had any corrosion issues with any of my marine engines and I think my Father and Brother in Law are to thank for making me develop the habit of flushing my engines after every use.. and a dash of Joy dish soap in the mix might have helped as well?!?
I have a 2004 Yamaha 150 4 stroke. Sorry it made the list. It has been an awesome motor and I use it several times a week during the summer months running it hard fishing tournaments. Only problem I have had was the harmonic balancer started to make noise, and I replaced it with a newer version with an updated oil tower 10 years ago. No corrosion issues and I bought it new.
The f150 Yamaha's didn't have the same corrosion issues as the bigger 6 cylinder 4 strokes. F150 has one Achilles heel and it was the balancer. You can delete it altogether or replace it with a newer version.
@@russianbotstein1422 Yes that was an issue and need to pull the power head to replace. Not a bad job if there is not much corrosion but the Marina will charge a few bucks to get it done
@@OutboardDad You do not have to pull the power head to replace the harmonic balancer. I did mine in 3 hours max. just because it was first time for me. I could do it in 2 hours or less next time. Very easy to replace.
I'd like to hear your opinion on the legendary OMC JonnyRude Crossflow. I just rebuilt a 1980 Evinrude 140cv. I had a 1995 Evinrude 90cv that ate a ring (or two) lol and I finally had to break down and pull the powerhead. The 79'-98' v4 crossflows were all the same. 100ci. I found a donor motor on FB and got the whole motor for $400. Tore the powerhead down, measured the cylinders (surprisingly in spec) and rebuilt it. I used the 1995 electronics and ignition. 1980 bypass covers for the recirculation system and the 1980 carbs because they had the large bore 1 5/16 with 67c jets. I had to do that because of the bubbleback exhaust. It's basically a 1995 115cv because as you know the horsepower rating changed in the late 80's. Only time will tell how fuel mileage differs. Kind of wish I would have used the flatback exhaust and 90cv carbs. Better fuel consumption. It's a center console fishing boat. I doubt I'll ever get the benefit of the extra 15 horsepower because it's up top at like 5800rpm.
@@martinschulz9381 Interesting, I wonder how diligent they were with maintaining them. I have a couple guys that work on coast guard and another sea tow. He said sea tow does all maintenance and have not had issues with the Optimax. Of course it was only a few as they put 1000 hrs a year so it was a few years back. I am still a fan of 2 stroke carb motors, what are you running on your boat?
@@OutboardDad We have a Suzuki 70. We previously had a Mercury carb two stroke. I love the Suzuki, but I sometimes miss the two stoke sound and smell. Nothing like the puff of smoke and smell in the mornings when starting. My wife doesn't look back one bit though. lol
@@martinschulz9381 LOL! I couldn’t agree more but also love the smooth quiet power of the 4 strokes. Thanks for sharing I will do a follow up video and mention your comments
the 1st 18 months of production was a nightmare for OMC and it's FICHT motors, but they wanted ALL those 60 degree powerheads shipped back to the factory for updated ones. all the things you listed had been largely corrected after this. too bad though as it really damaged their reputation. The FORCE motors under Mercury were excellent motors as by 1996 they had merc mids, gearcases, trim and ignitions. only ran until 1999, but the last of the bunch were smooth, quite and easy to work on. I believe Merc did piston and bearing updates as well on most. the 3 cyl merc made 25hp (sold as a Force) is rare, but at only 92lbs, was an absolute rocket! One brand i would say stay away from is any Suzuki DT 2 strokes... not because they weren't excellent motors, because they were, but because parts are not available, people are clueless as to how the simple and reliable oil injection works, and how the sensors work on the digital ignitions. any one of those ignition parts will cost an arm and a leg, and like Yamaha had teething issues throughout. I love the DTV6 motors.... rebuilding a 1986 super six with the dual plug heads as I write this, but not for the weekend mechanic thats for sure!
I had an early 1980's Force 85hp strapped to a Bayliner boat. I can vouch for it being junk. Later years might be ok, but not early years. Nothing but problems and it idled like a Harley, ok for a motorcycle, not so much for a pleasure boat.
Thanks for this list. I can picture all these motors over the years. I have an 04 90 Yamaha 4 stroke. It’s a freshwater motor but I’d love to know exactly where the corrosion occurs so I can check. It’s a fantastic running machine otherwise.
@@motorv8N So you can pull the lower unit and scope the mid section and see if it’s corroded. There are theories that the only time they failed was when they were over propped and had hotter exhaust that actually started melting the aluminum or bringing it too a high temp causing more corrosion.
I agree. Great video, as always! One suggestion... Could you increase the microphone gain or speak closer to it? I can hear you alright, but only if I play your videos at full volume.
A Force o/b left me stranded in the middle of a raging river in Upstate NY. Fortunately a guy with a 30ft Searay was able to tow me. Same boat threw a starter solenoid in a remote Ontario Lake. Sold it soon after.
@ yes you were right I spelled wrong, 2008yamaha 90, free reving from 5000-6500 any thoughts, lower end sat in water 2 years, used 2 summers and now I have this? I did service the lower and rechecked and oil looks great, and a new prop , about to do water pump, is there anything I should look for? Thanks again
I think any motors earlier than the 1970s should be avoided at all costs. I have a 1963 Montgomery ward 6 HP that has the Chrysler parts and I cannot find parts for it anywhere. I bought the motor on a boat 6 years ago and the previous owner said that he had replaced the impeller back in 2016. Today in 2024, the impeller still works, and i pulled the lower unit to look at it, and the impeller still looks ok, but the rubber wings are weak. It still pumps water but has to be at high idle minimum. Low idle, no water moves at all. It also backfires at time's even when the carb is properly adjusted. Compression is at 65 psi so im thinking that the motor doesnt have much time left anyway. No marine shop in my area is interested in working on it, so probably will run it till it dies. Also had a 1955 johnson that ran great till the lower unit seized up. A seal went bad and water got up into the lower unit with the oil. Also couldn't find parts anywhere, but the impeller was still in great shape. Motor had a lot of backfiring but its a result of one of the cylinders having 50 psi and the other had 75 psi. If i buy a used motor, probably wont go any older than early 90s. I really like the older Mercurys. Although its really nice to see some outboards last 50+ years. Especially if the maintenance is done. I bought a Hangkai 6 HP outboard on ebay. Cheap motor, but im curious to see how long it lasts.
As an Certified Optimax Technician, the Optimax was the best engineered unit Mercury ever built. Problem, people who want a thoroughbred , but don't want to pay to maintain the unit. I have several motors well over 1000 hours and still working well. I find most of your information is directed to DYI, mechanics. Take them to your dealer for best service and longevity.
I had a BF200 same as BF225 from 2002. Great motor. Honda claim some wire harness recall so that’s covered, however, mine actually had a problem with small box that contained solenoids for kill switch (fuel pump, fuel injection, ignition cutoff). Bad solder joints during manufacturing caused smoking in the box. Was a $57 part back in the day and might have been the initial run. Maybe harness issue was overrated. Later claims of water backing up through the exhaust causing corrosion. Otherwise Honda motors are great motors cuz Coast Guard uses them and usually required to buy American products, but must of had a waiver because American outboards couldn’t make contract requirements. The downside to Honda are the Carb models. My BF25 had 3 carbs and they then to get hairline cracks in the jet tubes. Lots of maintenance to repair. Also, cuz they use multiple carbs each carb puts out lower HP and has very small idle jets. They tend to clog very easily with ethanol gas and humidity if not run constantly
@@bobmcglothlin1562 That’s a trick question. As long as the motor has been properly maintained and all checks out following the guide most motors are fine. If I was looking for two stroke older motors I like yamaha because of their oil injection system.
1998 force 120hp vs. 1998 mercury 125hp ill take the force all day long. 2 carbs vs. 4 sometimes simpler is better. most of the parts are interchangeable. the read valves are better in the force as well.
@@OutboardDad i ran the foce for 3 years after i went through it. never had a problem. i just cleaned the carbs replaces what was worn out, and replaced one reed valve pack. the merc, i did the same except replace the reed valves. they looked good. i could never get it to run great, hard starting and would stall at times. the oil injection was pain, better off just mixing. over all more work to get all 4 carbs in sink, and working on it was pain full. to get to one part, you have to remove 3 or more parts. things like that. ill sacrifice 5hp for reliability and ease of maintenance.
@@pjimmbojimmbo1990 Yes I have heard the same story, although I know some people who have run them for 20 years. Did the manufacturer do anything after the second fail for you?
@@OutboardDad The Score was noticed during a Trade-in Inspection, and the engine was still under the original 4 yr OMC Warranty so I didn't have to deal with any of it, it became the Dealers Problem
@@OutboardDad Well, I figured if the Powerhead had to be replaced Once in only 3 yrs, and it was soon going to out of Warranty, I would be paying for the next Powerhead. I figured it wasn't a case of it "Might" Fail, but rather just a case of When... So I Traded it in on a different set of Problems, but it was new, and 4 yrs of Warranty. I switched an 18 1/2 ft Runabout, with a Volvo Penta 5.7 liter. It's Engine had to be replaced at about 100 Hrs, due to the Remote Oil Filter Lines/Hoses being Reversed, and no Oil was filtered for those 100hr, because the Filter has a Check Valve in it. Engine had to come out again several yrs later for the Transom to be Repaired and Reinforced. And the Trailer was rebuilt by the Manufacturer, and I replaced the Spring Axle with a Torsion Axle(that really makes for a Tow)
@ Oh man you’ve had a rough go with some boats. I wonder how the oil lines got crossed? Still though it’s understandable why you moved on from Evinrude. Are you still boating?
@OutboardDad I am in Tulsa, Oklahoma. It will be next May before I can spend money on it but I am definitely interested. I just went threw a nasty divorce so my money situation right now is not good. But next May I will have access to my savings . I have a 2000 Tracker Tournament V18 with a early 70s 115 Johnson motor that I'd love to swap out for a good loop charged 140.
@@DanVanDorn I actually have a 150 for sale. It’s a 60 degree 1995 with new water pump, trim seals, lower unit oil and plugs. Email me and I can send you pics keith@outboarddad.com
I have a 1999 Evinrude 115hp FICHT. 25 year old motor and "it runs like a raped ape" as a friend of mine said. NEVER had a lick of problems with it. Not ONE. My 115hp is a 4 cylinder, sips fuel, and is light and powerful as hell. The FICHT motors that had problems were almost EXCLUSIVELY 6 cylinder!!! Very BAD info to throw them all into one basket and condemn!!!
Another one to avoid. McCullough outboards. 75 HP models ran fast when they ran. Three cylinder engines that blew head gaskets frequently. If it lasted long enough, it'd likely throw a rod through the block. Very high compression motors, ran 100:1 oil mixture (yep, that's right). They'd outrun a 90 Johnson which was a heavier engine but again, they frequently self destructed.
Obviously older stuff can be a problem no matter what brand it is. As far as reliability goes in the modern age the Tohatsu is #1. the biggest manufacturer on the planet and made with Japanese parts. These aren't a hodgepodge of parts from all over the world like Mercury and Evinrude were.
80s 90s small hp Evinrude Johnson’s are great. I also have a few old mercs 51 KG7 I run. Mercs from the late 60s 70s wires always break down 😂. Chrysler are junk few force are ok but Chrysler is just junk
@@OutboardDad Sorry Mate I was just joking. However it was a joke me and my old fishing buddy used to make about his Chrysler. "it's that shit box dodge again" was another joke. Dads friend became so angry that he ditched his troublesome chrysler at sea & slowly motored back on his small spare outboard.
Evinrude is out of business period. The Etec motors that were BRP's spin offs of the fict were almost as bad. You will notice that all the EPA compliant 2 stroke engines , whether it be Optimax , Etec or HPDI were all lacking in sufficient lubrication because of having to meet EPA standards and thus commonly would not even make five hundred hours of use.
@@OutboardDad Never owned one, knew of a couple people who did. One swore by it, the other swore at it. I came from an OMC Family, and became a Heretic, when I bought an Inline 6 Merc.
@@OutboardDad I really liked mine, though the Floats in Carbs would get Cockeyed and stick every so often. It had to replace a Swtichbox, once, but the Stealership had given me a box of slightly used ones, as they changed both when one would fail, somethong about Bias. Whatever, I just changed One and was back in Business. It was an 1984, the first year the Power Time was between the Transom Brackets, and the Motor Housing filled with water... Earlier I had an Evinrude 140(Crank Rated)on the Boat, the Merc 115 was Prop Rated. The Merc was quicker out of the Hole, had higher Top Speed and burned less Gas doing so.
@@pjimmbojimmbo1990 I was always amazed at the way Mercury designed the reeds on the crankshaft. The race guys love those as well as the 2.5. So many modifications can be done and get real power out of these. My brother in laws dad had a 115 tower of power on a 1978 StarCraft 21 foot aluminum boat that ran great and had plenty of power.
Never ever buy a 4 stroke outboard of any size. Will not last even a decade. No oil injection 2 stroke motors. If you do find one, convert it to oil in gas before you ever run it. It is nice to get a reed valve 2 stroke but the older ones still run great.
Top motors to avoid ? Anything made in the last 20 years ... its all a endless garbage money pit .... for what they cost , its a joke ... Four strokes ? Meh , heavy and slow and way too much tech to just spin a propeller and when they go boom , just junk it ....All my old JohnnyRudes from the 70s run like a top still but you have to maintain them . yeh , they suck fuel like mad , but they will get you home ... means more to me when your out on the water ... easy to rebuild too , plenty of parts second hand to choose from
Boat/motor owner for 45 years. I feel the newer motors have been more reliable for me. My current motor has 700+ hours and never anything more than standard oil changes and a new water pump impeller now and then.
@@AdventuresOutdoors I'd have over 5000 hours on a Tohatsu mfs40 and over 1000 hours on an mfs50. Neither has missed a beat, both start with ease any time. I'd never have a 2 stroke again.
I have twin 2006 Yam 250s on my Jupiter that have 1600 hours with no issues. They were scoped for the issue you and others claim effects all of these. NOT TRUE. My neighbor has a 2005 Yam 225 with over 3k hours, same no issues. Yes we're on salt water. Stop spreading this lie please.
@@myopinioncountsmost2419 Glad this was not an issue for you and your friend. Actually I added that many techs believe that the people with the corrosion issue were over propped to get a few more MPH and ran too hot exhaust that caused the issue. The best is to have them scoped just like you say to be sure all is ok.
![I.N "HALLUCINATION" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/n5B5q1Hwt_U/mqdefault.jpg)
Just completely remanufactured a pair of opti’s, biggest issue is poor maintenance, and marina thieves. I have owned mercs for 48 years, and no issues, enjoy your vids!!
@@mercman2.5 Thank you!
I have a 1998 200 OptiMax that I got new on my 1997 BassCat and it has run with very few issues in the 26 years I have owned it. I am a stickler on maintaining it and I think that is the key. It runs as good as the day I bought it.
@@bill-qv3er You’re speaking my language!
Ran a 83 Evinrude 175 cross flow for 39 years. Very reliable. Was still running great when I sold it. Always did maintenance on it every spring
@@danramzinski2957 Awesome! Thanks for the input!
Such great tips, Keith. It's great that you shares disclaimers and cautions about particular brand names, and at the same time, you are still letting the audience know if they still want to purchase, they can, but be careful.
Yes, I'm realizing just like a car, motorcycle, machines, etc... take that boat out for a test run. I like that saying the person said to you. If something new comes out, he'll allow a few years to go by in order to see how things go. Lol. That can apply to many things in life. Great video as always, Keith!
@@sherinewade Thank you!
I got one of the second batch on your list, thankfully my 03 Yamaha F225 hasn't had the dreaded corrosion issues reported by so many other mechanics and owners.. but then again I've never had any corrosion issues with any of my marine engines and I think my Father and Brother in Law are to thank for making me develop the habit of flushing my engines after every use.. and a dash of Joy dish soap in the mix might have helped as well?!?
@@lermancurry9651 Agreed! Thanks for sharing
I have a 2004 Yamaha 150 4 stroke. Sorry it made the list. It has been an awesome motor and I use it several times a week during the summer months running it hard fishing tournaments. Only problem I have had was the harmonic balancer started to make noise, and I replaced it with a newer version with an updated oil tower 10 years ago. No corrosion issues and I bought it new.
@@CAN43715 Awesone! Thanks for the comment
The f150 Yamaha's didn't have the same corrosion issues as the bigger 6 cylinder 4 strokes. F150 has one Achilles heel and it was the balancer. You can delete it altogether or replace it with a newer version.
@@russianbotstein1422 Harmonic Balancer was only a problem on earlier models. The Yamaha F150 is arguably the most reliable motor you can buy.
@@russianbotstein1422 Yes that was an issue and need to pull the power head to replace. Not a bad job if there is not much corrosion but the Marina will charge a few bucks to get it done
@@OutboardDad You do not have to pull the power head to replace the harmonic balancer. I did mine in 3 hours max. just because it was first time for me. I could do it in 2 hours or less next time. Very easy to replace.
I'd like to hear your opinion on the legendary OMC JonnyRude Crossflow. I just rebuilt a 1980 Evinrude 140cv. I had a 1995 Evinrude 90cv that ate a ring (or two) lol and I finally had to break down and pull the powerhead. The 79'-98' v4 crossflows were all the same. 100ci. I found a donor motor on FB and got the whole motor for $400. Tore the powerhead down, measured the cylinders (surprisingly in spec) and rebuilt it. I used the 1995 electronics and ignition. 1980 bypass covers for the recirculation system and the 1980 carbs because they had the large bore 1 5/16 with 67c jets. I had to do that because of the bubbleback exhaust. It's basically a 1995 115cv because as you know the horsepower rating changed in the late 80's. Only time will tell how fuel mileage differs. Kind of wish I would have used the flatback exhaust and 90cv carbs. Better fuel consumption. It's a center console fishing boat. I doubt I'll ever get the benefit of the extra 15 horsepower because it's up top at like 5800rpm.
@@MexicoPescadoro Yes I love those motors! My first was a 79 Johnson 85 hp ran for 22 yrs
My Marine mechanic serviced the Opti Max outboards for he coastguard in the area and he did not recommend them. He loved regular Merc's though.
@@martinschulz9381 Interesting, I wonder how diligent they were with maintaining them. I have a couple guys that work on coast guard and another sea tow. He said sea tow does all maintenance and have not had issues with the Optimax. Of course it was only a few as they put 1000 hrs a year so it was a few years back. I am still a fan of 2 stroke carb motors, what are you running on your boat?
@@OutboardDad We have a Suzuki 70. We previously had a Mercury carb two stroke. I love the Suzuki, but I sometimes miss the two stoke sound and smell. Nothing like the puff of smoke and smell in the mornings when starting. My wife doesn't look back one bit though. lol
@@martinschulz9381 LOL! I couldn’t agree more but also love the smooth quiet power of the 4 strokes. Thanks for sharing I will do a follow up video and mention your comments
the 1st 18 months of production was a nightmare for OMC and it's FICHT motors, but they wanted ALL those 60 degree powerheads shipped back to the factory for updated ones. all the things you listed had been largely corrected after this. too bad though as it really damaged their reputation. The FORCE motors under Mercury were excellent motors as by 1996 they had merc mids, gearcases, trim and ignitions. only ran until 1999, but the last of the bunch were smooth, quite and easy to work on. I believe Merc did piston and bearing updates as well on most. the 3 cyl merc made 25hp (sold as a Force) is rare, but at only 92lbs, was an absolute rocket! One brand i would say stay away from is any Suzuki DT 2 strokes... not because they weren't excellent motors, because they were, but because parts are not available, people are clueless as to how the simple and reliable oil injection works, and how the sensors work on the digital ignitions. any one of those ignition parts will cost an arm and a leg, and like Yamaha had teething issues throughout. I love the DTV6 motors.... rebuilding a 1986 super six with the dual plug heads as I write this, but not for the weekend mechanic thats for sure!
@@ct1762 Thank you! Great insight here, I will have to do a follow up video with your comment
I had an early 1980's Force 85hp strapped to a Bayliner boat. I can vouch for it being junk. Later years might be ok, but not early years. Nothing but problems and it idled like a Harley, ok for a motorcycle, not so much for a pleasure boat.
@@CAN43715 Thanks Dude
Had a 2004 Mariner 115 Optimax and couldn't fault it . Loved to be run hard and excellent fuel economy .
Thanks for this list. I can picture all these motors over the years.
I have an 04 90 Yamaha 4 stroke. It’s a freshwater motor but I’d love to know exactly where the corrosion occurs so I can check. It’s a fantastic running machine otherwise.
@@motorv8N So you can pull the lower unit and scope the mid section and see if it’s corroded. There are theories that the only time they failed was when they were over propped and had hotter exhaust that actually started melting the aluminum or bringing it too a high temp causing more corrosion.
My 97 Mercury 175 EFI ran perfect yesterday at the lake (fishing). Glad my outboard didn't make 'The List' ! Thanks for the info.
@@wayne558 your very welcome!
@@wayne558 Nice!
Could I get some information on a 2015 tohatsu bft250a 250 horse, four stroke corrosion problems in the block
@@johnlaird9157 sure send me an email keith@outboarddad.com
I agree.
Great video, as always!
One suggestion...
Could you increase the microphone gain or speak closer to it?
I can hear you alright, but only if I play your videos at full volume.
@@josemariatrueba4568 Yes I am working on that, going to GoPro
the first generation VRO from OMC took out allot of connecting rod bearings
@@volunteermaupi4809 Indeed, and OMC did not have a fix, just kept sending out faulty pumps
A Force o/b left me stranded in the middle of a raging river in Upstate NY. Fortunately a guy with a 30ft Searay was able to tow me. Same boat threw a starter solenoid in a remote Ontario Lake. Sold it soon after.
@@bobcaygeon975 Wow, Nothing like having no power on the moving water!
What is the Yamaha mix section
@@jeffberner3102 Sorry if I confused you, did I mean mid section?
@ yes you were right I spelled wrong, 2008yamaha 90, free reving from 5000-6500 any thoughts, lower end sat in water 2 years, used 2 summers and now I have this? I did service the lower and rechecked and oil looks great, and a new prop , about to do water pump, is there anything I should look for? Thanks again
@ Best to talk, email me your number and a good time with your time zone keith@outboarddad.com
I think any motors earlier than the 1970s should be avoided at all costs.
I have a 1963 Montgomery ward 6 HP that has the Chrysler parts and I cannot find parts for it anywhere. I bought the motor on a boat 6 years ago and the previous owner said that he had replaced the impeller back in 2016. Today in 2024, the impeller still works, and i pulled the lower unit to look at it, and the impeller still looks ok, but the rubber wings are weak. It still pumps water but has to be at high idle minimum. Low idle, no water moves at all. It also backfires at time's even when the carb is properly adjusted. Compression is at 65 psi so im thinking that the motor doesnt have much time left anyway. No marine shop in my area is interested in working on it, so probably will run it till it dies.
Also had a 1955 johnson that ran great till the lower unit seized up. A seal went bad and water got up into the lower unit with the oil. Also couldn't find parts anywhere, but the impeller was still in great shape. Motor had a lot of backfiring but its a result of one of the cylinders having 50 psi and the other had 75 psi.
If i buy a used motor, probably wont go any older than early 90s. I really like the older Mercurys.
Although its really nice to see some outboards last 50+ years. Especially if the maintenance is done.
I bought a Hangkai 6 HP outboard on ebay. Cheap motor, but im curious to see how long it lasts.
As an Certified Optimax Technician, the Optimax was the best engineered unit Mercury ever built. Problem, people who want a thoroughbred , but don't want to pay to maintain the unit. I have several motors well over 1000 hours and still working well. I find most of your information is directed to DYI, mechanics. Take them to your dealer for best service and longevity.
@@rceme74 Thanks for the input!
thanks for this. Now considering repower with brand new BF250 Honda, any feedback on this outboard? thanks again.
@@khalidalbagdadymd4081 Hey man, I know 2 guys that have those and love them!
I had a BF200 same as BF225 from 2002. Great motor. Honda claim some wire harness recall so that’s covered, however, mine actually had a problem with small box that contained solenoids for kill switch (fuel pump, fuel injection, ignition cutoff). Bad solder joints during manufacturing caused smoking in the box. Was a $57 part back in the day and might have been the initial run. Maybe harness issue was overrated. Later claims of water backing up through the exhaust causing corrosion. Otherwise Honda motors are great motors cuz Coast Guard uses them and usually required to buy American products, but must of had a waiver because American outboards couldn’t make contract requirements.
The downside to Honda are the Carb models. My BF25 had 3 carbs and they then to get hairline cracks in the jet tubes. Lots of maintenance to repair. Also, cuz they use multiple carbs each carb puts out lower HP and has very small idle jets. They tend to clog very easily with ethanol gas and humidity if not run constantly
@@hugoglenn9741 Hey man, great info for the Honda owners here!
How do I go about getting one of your books Sir?
@@bobmcglothlin1562 Email me at keith@outboarddad.com
Didn't Force buy the Chrysler Outboard Division decades ago?
@@johngranato2673 From what I understand they had a portion and Mercury had the majority and sold some under the force name
@@OutboardDad I remember that the engine looked the same as the Chrysler except for paint and logos
Hi Keith, how do I go about getting one of those books you offered, Thanks!
@@Ray-hj5cc Thanks just email me keith@outboarddad.com
Where can I get a copy of that book please?
I just subscribed 😊
@@tiemanmalcolm Just email me keith@outboarddad.com and I will send it to you in a pdf. Thanks for subscribing!
What brand of motor do you recommend?
@@bobmcglothlin1562 That’s a trick question. As long as the motor has been properly maintained and all checks out following the guide most motors are fine. If I was looking for two stroke older motors I like yamaha because of their oil injection system.
1998 force 120hp vs. 1998 mercury 125hp ill take the force all day long. 2 carbs vs. 4 sometimes simpler is better. most of the parts are interchangeable. the read valves are better in the force as well.
@@abhvgas I see your thinking, did you feel you got good power out of the force? How many years did you run it?
@@OutboardDad i ran the foce for 3 years after i went through it. never had a problem. i just cleaned the carbs replaces what was worn out, and replaced one reed valve pack. the merc, i did the same except replace the reed valves. they looked good. i could never get it to run great, hard starting and would stall at times. the oil injection was pain, better off just mixing. over all more work to get all 4 carbs in sink, and working on it was pain full. to get to one part, you have to remove 3 or more parts. things like that. ill sacrifice 5hp for reliability and ease of maintenance.
@@abhvgas Understood, appreciate your comments. I usually will sacrifce a little performance for more realiability
Volvo Penta bought Seven Marine in 2017 and put them out of business in 2020.
@@mcplutt Good to know
At least he didn’t say Mercury tower of power or johnrude Xflow v4
@@AbbyNormalGarage Love those motors!
The Tower of Power! Yes....
Tower of power forever
Tohatsu ?
@@williamestep4103 Good point, only worked in a few and all ran well. Will have to do a follow up video
Obviously never owned FiCHT .. some of the most reliable motors I’ve ever owned.. Take it over an Opti-Bomb any day
@@rogerjackson333 LOl! Thanks for the feedback!
My 1994 mercury 200 offshore is still screaming also but inhales gas
@@Lazybones52 Yes the suck it down!
FICHT, should be renamed FUCHT. I owned one 1998 - 2001. Powerhead was replaced in 2001, and 40 hrs later, it had a Scored Cylinder.
@@pjimmbojimmbo1990 Yes I have heard the same story, although I know some people who have run them for 20 years. Did the manufacturer do anything after the second fail for you?
@@OutboardDad
The Score was noticed during a Trade-in Inspection, and the engine was still under the original 4 yr OMC Warranty so I didn't have to deal with any of it, it became the Dealers Problem
@ Interesting, such a shame as they had good power when they ran. Also oil pump failure that they did not fix in time. What are you running now?
@@OutboardDad
Well, I figured if the Powerhead had to be replaced Once in only 3 yrs, and it was soon going to out of Warranty, I would be paying for the next Powerhead. I figured it wasn't a case of it "Might" Fail, but rather just a case of When... So I Traded it in on a different set of Problems, but it was new, and 4 yrs of Warranty. I switched an 18 1/2 ft Runabout, with a Volvo Penta 5.7 liter. It's Engine had to be replaced at about 100 Hrs, due to the Remote Oil Filter Lines/Hoses being Reversed, and no Oil was filtered for those 100hr, because the Filter has a Check Valve in it. Engine had to come out again several yrs later for the Transom to be Repaired and Reinforced. And the Trailer was rebuilt by the Manufacturer, and I replaced the Spring Axle with a Torsion Axle(that really makes for a Tow)
@ Oh man you’ve had a rough go with some boats. I wonder how the oil lines got crossed? Still though it’s understandable why you moved on from Evinrude. Are you still boating?
The 6cly Optimax is the one to avoid. The 3cly are about as bulletproof as you're gonna get.
What about the middle 90s 90°V block 4 cylinder OMC motors??? I would love to find a Loop charged 140 with the big v6 gearcase.
@@DanVanDorn I have one, where are you located?
@OutboardDad I am in Tulsa, Oklahoma. It will be next May before I can spend money on it but I am definitely interested. I just went threw a nasty divorce so my money situation right now is not good. But next May I will have access to my savings .
I have a 2000 Tracker Tournament V18 with a early 70s 115 Johnson motor that I'd love to swap out for a good loop charged 140.
@@DanVanDorn OK, send me an email and I will send you my used outboard buying guide. Keith@outboarddad.con
@@OutboardDad Tell me about the Loop Charged OMC 140 that you have.
@@DanVanDorn I actually have a 150 for sale. It’s a 60 degree 1995 with new water pump, trim seals, lower unit oil and plugs. Email me and I can send you pics keith@outboarddad.com
I have a 1999 Evinrude 115hp FICHT. 25 year old motor and "it runs like a raped ape" as a friend of mine said. NEVER had a lick of problems with it. Not ONE. My 115hp is a 4 cylinder, sips fuel, and is light and powerful as hell. The FICHT motors that had problems were almost EXCLUSIVELY 6 cylinder!!! Very BAD info to throw them all into one basket and condemn!!!
@@frankschannel2642 Agreed! Thanks for the feedback!
Another one to avoid. McCullough outboards. 75 HP models ran fast when they ran. Three cylinder engines that blew head gaskets frequently. If it lasted long enough, it'd likely throw a rod through the block. Very high compression motors, ran 100:1 oil mixture (yep, that's right). They'd outrun a 90 Johnson which was a heavier engine but again, they frequently self destructed.
@@barryf5479 Interesting
@@OutboardDadkcal
Oooooooooo
Obviously older stuff can be a problem no matter what brand it is. As far as reliability goes in the modern age the Tohatsu is #1. the biggest manufacturer on the planet and made with Japanese parts. These aren't a hodgepodge of parts from all over the world like Mercury and Evinrude were.
@@jp.9664 Great input thank you
Great engines. Guess who owns Tohatsu? Nissan company. In facr i owned a 40 hp nissan once.@OutboardDad
@ Yup! I’ve had good success with their cars and trucks.
80s 90s small hp Evinrude Johnson’s are great. I also have a few old mercs 51 KG7 I run. Mercs from the late 60s 70s wires always break down 😂. Chrysler are junk few force are ok but Chrysler is just junk
@@Rlip Thanks for the comments!
I once had the most unreliable POS outboard, it made the most reliable letterbox.
@@JoeC88 Lol! What make and model?
@@OutboardDad Sorry Mate I was just joking. However it was a joke me and my old fishing buddy used to make about his Chrysler. "it's that shit box dodge again" was another joke.
Dads friend became so angry that he ditched his troublesome chrysler at sea & slowly motored back on his small spare outboard.
@ LOL! I love it!
Never buy Force or Evinrude anything. Ever 💯
@@randymiller5008 Thanks for the comment
Evinrude is out of business period. The Etec motors that were BRP's spin offs of the fict were almost as bad. You will notice that all the EPA compliant 2 stroke engines , whether it be Optimax , Etec or HPDI were all lacking in sufficient lubrication because of having to meet EPA standards and thus commonly would not even make five hundred hours of use.
@@scottsilver5409 Interesting, thanks for the feedback!
Avoid anything two-stroke direct injection. Avoid any four stroke larger engine from 2004-2010.
@@MudflyWatersman Thank you
Very useful
@@eppsteacher Thanks buddy
7 Marine only went out of business because Volvo killed it.
@@charlesdriggers199 Agreed
Force was an Acronym for:
Fubared
Old
Recycled
Chrysler
Engine
@@pjimmbojimmbo1990 LOL! Did you own one for any length of time?
@@OutboardDad
Never owned one, knew of a couple people who did. One swore by it, the other swore at it. I came from an OMC Family, and became a Heretic, when I bought an Inline 6 Merc.
@ Love the tower of power, reliable and simple
@@OutboardDad
I really liked mine, though the Floats in Carbs would get Cockeyed and stick every so often. It had to replace a Swtichbox, once, but the Stealership had given me a box of slightly used ones, as they changed both when one would fail, somethong about Bias. Whatever, I just changed One and was back in Business. It was an 1984, the first year the Power Time was between the Transom Brackets, and the Motor Housing filled with water...
Earlier I had an Evinrude 140(Crank Rated)on the Boat, the Merc 115 was Prop Rated. The Merc was quicker out of the Hole, had higher Top Speed and burned less Gas doing so.
@@pjimmbojimmbo1990 I was always amazed at the way Mercury designed the reeds on the crankshaft. The race guys love those as well as the 2.5. So many modifications can be done and get real power out of these. My brother in laws dad had a 115 tower of power on a 1978 StarCraft 21 foot aluminum boat that ran great and had plenty of power.
TOWER OF POWER 😊
@@brianarthur6945 Amazed at how many are still out there!
Never ever buy a 4 stroke outboard of any size. Will not last even a decade. No oil injection 2 stroke motors. If you do find one, convert it to oil in gas before you ever run it. It is nice to get a reed valve 2 stroke but the older ones still run great.
@@geraldkoth654 Thanks for the comment!
Top motors to avoid ? Anything made in the last 20 years ... its all a endless garbage money pit .... for what they cost , its a joke ... Four strokes ? Meh , heavy and slow and way too much tech to just spin a propeller and when they go boom , just junk it ....All my old JohnnyRudes from the 70s run like a top still but you have to maintain them . yeh , they suck fuel like mad , but they will get you home ... means more to me when your out on the water ... easy to rebuild too , plenty of parts second hand to choose from
@@jeffreybodine2897 Thank you Jeff! Love your input
Boat/motor owner for 45 years. I feel the newer motors have been more reliable for me. My current motor has 700+ hours and never anything more than standard oil changes and a new water pump impeller now and then.
Oh… and fuel economy… I get better fuel economy with my 150hp than I did with a 20hp from the late 70s and with no oil to breathe.
@@AdventuresOutdoors Thank you
@@AdventuresOutdoors I'd have over 5000 hours on a Tohatsu mfs40 and over 1000 hours on an mfs50. Neither has missed a beat, both start with ease any time. I'd never have a 2 stroke again.
He forgot to mention the Yamaha 250hp and up hpdi worse motor ever
@@livangil Thank you, your right, will have to do a follow up video
My 2004 250 HPDI is at 1500 hours and counting
Dead wrong about Chrysler/Force. Simple is great. They can struggle finding coils for some years. But if you want used cheap, simple is better
@@dheujsnrhfydhehehshshhdggsd Thanks for your input!
Force stand for F------G old Rebuilt Chrysler Engine
Yamaha sumps are nla.
I have twin 2006 Yam 250s on my Jupiter that have 1600 hours with no issues. They were scoped for the issue you and others claim effects all of these. NOT TRUE. My neighbor has a 2005 Yam 225 with over 3k hours, same no issues. Yes we're on salt water. Stop spreading this lie please.
@@myopinioncountsmost2419 Glad this was not an issue for you and your friend. Actually I added that many techs believe that the people with the corrosion issue were over propped to get a few more MPH and ran too hot exhaust that caused the issue. The best is to have them scoped just like you say to be sure all is ok.
My ficht is powerful and economical! 2001
@@Lazybones52 It’s amazing when you hear people say they are all garbage
It’s not the motors fault it malfunctions it’s the owners who never maintain them.
@@robertmoody2221 So true!
@robertmoody2221 @outboarddad
thanks for your comment this is helpful. Have a great day.