Varnish Actually Works!?
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- Опубликовано: 5 фев 2025
- How can we protect our minis during gameplay? In this episode I test metal minis with different primers and varnishes. I ran three different durability tests of special relevance to gamers.
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"Why are you spending 3 hours eating Funyuns and playing with toys?"
"SCIENCE!"
3 hours of repetitive greasy hand action? A typical evening during lockdown
I don't get it...
Greasy hand action eh?
PENNY NO
Sounds like you've been hanging out with Miss Penny too much Mr. Guy. Her dirty mindedness is starting to rub off on you... good for her!
@@GoobertownHobbies Hence the greasy hand action.
Those conga line sisters moving around the board are hypnotic.
I never was drawn in by time lapses much before....after Goobertown I want more hobby time lapses.
I could watch it for hours
Only real science requires funions and tank tops.
"Brent? What are you doing in there?"
Brent, moving minis around a monopoly board on a timer: "Science."
That fish tank I hear in the background sounds a little undersized.
We all had that face when you were chucking the figures around ! My figures: out of box on to table. Turn one, back in box. Ah well.....at least the paint job will last longer.
“What’re you doing today, Brent?”
**”S C I E N C E”**
my theory is:
primer is only there for the painting stage, used to get better grip and even first layer
varnish is a sealant, a protective "shell" that gets a hard finish
yeah I thought so too. until now i've primed every model but they still had tear on edges even during the painting process which led to repainting everything that sticks out
Commercial paint companies make declarations and definitions of the uses and significance of primers/paints/clearcoats. They all recommend primer on plastic and metal certainly for adhesion but also very smooth apply forces over larger areas (think contrast paints) which makes it harder to form a proper film at a low enough thickness to preserve detail. There are very high adhesion products that will stick to smooth surfaces just fine. you can for example apply varnish directly as to resin, metal, almost anything.
You can even use matte varnish as a primer, It's the fact that matte has micro solids (i forget the real term) that improves the application of the next layer.
Primer is about minimizing the issues with the substrate such as colour bleed, adhesion, still soluble pigments, oil, and others. Brent as a habit washes his miniatures before priming them, which I think mitigates the main issue that say Citadel was concerned for when they originally mandated oil based undercoats. That's just an experienced hunch. The other main reason being that 'sprue gray' is not usually the appropriate colour under subsequent colours.
@@Vova-xv3zn Are you giving them a full 24 hours to cure after priming them? Rattlecan primer will appear dry after an hour or so, and airbrush primer will look dry very quickly, but both need to cure fully before painting over them.
@@brandongiles6875 yes. some of my minis were left for a week after priming
at this point i'm CONVINCED that these experiments are just an excuse for brent to satisfy his timelaps fetish
... maybe. :-)
Just want to say thanks for taking the time to do this. Looks like it was incredibly tedious but it's good you got some clear results.
This was your most epic video yet Brent! Your endurance is absolutely awe inspiring. I have much to learn.
Ok maybe not your most epic. We all know which video that belongs to😉
Would be interesting to see a wear and tear comparison of resin, metal, soft and hard plastic, and green stuff!
I really hope you all appreciate what this man puts himself thru for all of us. I saw pain in those eyes...
Curious about the layer of gloss + layer of matte vs 2 layers of matte. People have always said "Gloss for protection, matte for finish", but I'm curious if gloss actually does offer more protection..
Great video!
I very seldom take the time to like or comment on videos but the effort you put into your videos and the quality of the information and suggestions we can take away from them is just fantastic. Thanks for what you offer to the community.
I'm something of a scientist myself, so the opening of this episode had me in stitches.
Yeah as a biologist I was happy
Me too... we need to increase the number of publications to boost the nascent field of mini chemistry :)
To appease the physics gods I'm going to start by assuming that all minis are spherical and in a vacuum.
@@warbossworm oh definitely
I like a lot of miniature painting hobby channels but this video shows why Goobertown holds my heart.
Gotta say though: Missed opportunity to play cheesy conga line music as background in the beginning! :D
"Nasty gamer hands" isn't something I ever expected to hear on this show, but I'm 100% here for it. As silly as this looks, it's a very realistic and useful test. I'm varnishing ALL my minis from now on!
As the first publication in this new field, you are going to cited by EVERYONE. Clever Brent. Very Clever. :)
When you start conga-ing smoothly with one hand at 2:56 it was very satisfying
That cringe when you were shaking the Sisters... such a sacrifice in the name of science!
These experiments are some of your best videos! Also loved the one where you tested the various liquids for striping models. Entertaining, enlightening, and back by the scientific method 👍🏻
You should make these a series on your channel! You’re not only the Bob Ross of minis in Goobertown, you’re also it’s hobby Mythbuster!
These last 2 videos have exactly what I expect from Brent & all the residents of Goobertown
Really great demonstration of a basic concept, and a good case for using varnish. I always found it was a hard sell for me when I first started painting, so great for a newbie to see the benefit.
Side note: I appreciate that you could have stretched for that 10 minute mark, and yet didn't. Shows what you're all about.
Some people may argue that Brent is slowly going completely insane, I'd argue I am perfectly fine with what comes out of it.
;-)
This is the first GTH video I've seen in a while where Vallejo Model Color Purple wasn't mentioned.
Related aside: Brent, as a result of your recommendations in multiple videos, today I've bought a pot of Vallejo Purple. Looking forward to trying it on a mini!
Man, now I REALLY badly want to see the gloss vs. matte vs. gloss+matte varnish experiment. It's long been held that gloss is the only one that protects well, or that it protects much better than matte, and I think it's time we put that assertion to the test! Love the video Brent, your scientifically rigorous application of force and funions is a boom to us all.
Thanks you very much Brent for putting in the time to do these tests. I just got into mini painting, and have en trying to fined the best way to protect my art.
beautiful model system and thought-out treatment groups (including controls). introduction, material and methods, results, discussion. yep, our man is a scientist. Love seing when our craft pearmeates personal lifes aswell :)
Even in the evergrowing YT section of miniature painting, vids like these still are unique! It may seem trivial, but it's always good to check assumed "facts" with SCIENE! :D
I remember the time when I started a Chaos Demon army, back when most of them still were metal miniatures. I rattlecan varnished them, but only matte, this was what was sufficient until then. Most my previously painted models were plastic and those few metal minis were treated with more care and I had no issue. But when most of your army is metal... it took about 1-3 tournaments and I was pissed about all the spots with chipped paint. So I started to varnish glossy first, with an additional matte layer afterwards. No significant issue anymore. By now, I'm using airbrush varnishes instead of rattlecans, but couldn't find much difference. Would be interesting to see a stress test though!
This video was quite interesting to me. I never varnish my minis but now I am DEFINITELY gonna start doing it. I don't want to have to repaint minis that already took me entirely too long to paint!
I love these kind of stress tests, it's on one hand hilarious, but on the other very informative and educating!
Respect to you Brent, your patience is very appreciated! :)
Your facial expressions while shaking the minis around... I felt that. Love the video.
Hey Brent!
Thanks for running another one of these. I really enjoy the scientific approach to gaming applications.
When you do the mini test, one thing to consider is normal mini resin v 3d printed resin. I know both have different properties in regards to falling and breaking.
Thanks again!
Printer resin is gonna come first- I don't have anywhere near enough cast-resin minis! :-)
I love that you have the heart and mind of a scientist when you do these experiments. Well done!
Making the content we simply can't find anywhere else.
I always wondered what type of damage moving minis around did but never decided how to so this helped well!
I’m enjoying following along; thanks!
I had read someone who presented the idea that Matte + gloss varnish provided more protection than 2 coats of just one type.
Are you doing okay? ...mentally? You're doing fine right? this really was just an experiment?
;-)
Excellent! I approve of take 2, and it stands in wonderful contrast to the plastics. Metal miniatures, I love em personally, and there are things in metal you just can't get anymore. But this does show that while no metal mini is invulnerable to abuse, that varnishing them can go a long way to protecting them with more careful handling.
Your timelapse game is on point in this episode!
Your patience for experiments for things like this is amazing. 3 hours of moving sisters round
When he puts his hair down, you know he's serious.
Yup!
Do or die, the hair never lies.
I think it was a good experiment and you showed how the clear coats do have an advantage in keeping the figures paint intact. Thanks for doing and sharing this interesting experiment.
Admirable dedication to science, and some results which are both interesting and useful. Good work. :)
That's some amazing dedication man! Thank you for those amazing experiments. What I'm curious about is casted resin vs printed resin. Might also be an idea for your testing episodes :-)
I love to see your experimenting-videos so keep em coming please!
Dude, you are a real hero for wargamers! I just would die from the sound of rubbing them over the foam.
In house painting we have a concept of encapsulation. Essentially having the resin wet on all sides and drying at once 'shrink' it on the figure. Theoretically the best application for encapsulation is dipping, you can clear excess with compressed air or an empty air gun, it will be messy.
I'd be most interested in a test entirely with airbrush varnish and the variable being extenders/dryers. It would also be interesting if the first and second coats were strikingly different colours. Perhaps black under blue under pigmented varnish.
Also, you could do a longer range passive test for the effects of handling by preparing a set of painting handles or something else and then using them for a year. just a thought.
that conga line time lapse is the most epic thing i have seen on youtube all year!
I've really appreciated this video. Is the kind of experiment that really leads to useful day-by-day decisions for any hobbyist. Thanks Brent!
Thank you for doing this! I know (anecdotally) from experience that playing with partially painted minis for a while will lead to the paint wearing away. Some additional criteria that could be checked if you decide to do part two: Move some of the minis around before you prime/paint them (pre-grease). Use different colors/brands of paints, some paints just flat adhere better and those "thicker" paints would likely also be more resistant to being rubbed off.
That was cool and interesting! For the version with different varnishes you might want to apply a bit more physical stress upon the minis to prevent seiling effects in order to be able to better differentiate between the varnishes and varnish combinations, when testing their durability.
It would also be cool to get your hypothesis about the results at the beginning and why you think it might turn out that way :)
Thanks for the video :D
Yeah I'm still trying to process all this, but some more varnish tests are definitely in the works! :-)
@@GoobertownHobbies That sounds great :D
I also meant "bottom or seiling effects", but just forget the one half XD
this is a great followup to your previous goblin test that answered all of my lingering questions from that video. looking forward to your future experiments :)
Wow! That’s commitment to the hobby. Thanks for the experiments and for the information gathered. Good to know.
Brent, you are a true hero to the hobby! This is true dedication.
This is the true work of a scientist. The world needs to know this information. Can we get a similar test for card sleeves? Testing no sleeves, single sleeves, and double sleeves. Continue the Lord’s work.
that would be fun, I'm sure there's a variant of that which is actually needed....
This dude always makes me smile I can't explain it.
Goober town hobbies: the most relaxing hobby channel on RUclips.
Your channel is an absolute boon to the hobby, thank you so much Brent for the wonderful content you create.
Brent, you’re a madman. These videos are great. I’m definitely interested in a video about the different types of varnish, like you mentioned.
This is a very informative video. I love it. Thank you so much for taking the time to do this. Also, nice tank top.
Your vids are so helpful dude, Im pretty new to warhammer and theyve been a huge help. Keep up the awesome work!
As a mini painter with OCD, anxiety and a bit of an obsession with cleanliness, this version of Brent is my worst nightmare. Tonight I will see him in my dreams, coming for my painstakingly painted minis with his greasy fingers... 'Let's play a game...'
Very interesting Brent! Thank you for your dedication to the hobby cause ;-) I've got an idea for your next experiment. If you look on forums you can find lots of reports of primed/painted/varnished minis suddenly becoming sticky and tacky weeks or months after being painted. I must admit this is my biggest fear to find the minis I spent days and days painting in such condition. There are lots of theories about it but nobody seems to really understand what's going on and why. It think it would be an interesting topic to look at... Cheers from Belgium!
Paint Bravely needs a Brent soundboard because "this is gonna be greasy" and "my nasty gamer hands" are total gems.
Loving the dedication to your craft Goobs :) and a nice result confirming what seems to be common sense. Varnish your metal minis people!
Love the scientific methods you're applying in these videos, Brent. :)
Regarding resin minis, I know personally they're incredibly brittle, so maybe do a test where you mix in 10%, 20%, etc flexible resin into standard resin to see how each mini stands up up being dropped? That would be super useful information. 👍🏻🔬
Thanks for spending your time testing this :) very interesting. I think metal minis are way more fragile compared to plastic ones in general. I own a couple of metal minis but most of them are plastic/resin. Would have liked to see this rest with plastic and/or resin minis
Brent, this new style of video is awesome! I love that you are becoming the mini scientist.
Amazing, love these experiment videos :) I especially enjoyed the cat cam time lapse!
Canoness: Sisters! We march in a conga line for the emperor~!
Retributor: Canoness why is my paint chipping off after fifty laps?
Battle Sister: AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA [gets rubbed on a foam board 100 times]
That looks like you lost your mind but this is so funny and interesting to watch and I have to say thank you for this tests and I love the mindset behind this video experiment. Thanks a lot please never stop doing this stuff :-)
Much respect for the amount of time and patience you put into this!
Love how you manage to make it into a doubble blind test by having forgotten which mini was which by the time you evaluated the damage.
He is a man of focus, commitment, and sheer f$%&&/g will ! Kudos !
Oh wow Brent that's a really labor intensive methodology. Thanks for going through it for all of us
Well, now your preview pic in the Goobertown Discord makes a whole lot more sense. :D Super cool video, I admire your persistence and patience with these experiments!
hehehehehe
Loving these experiment videos! Keep them coming, I am learning quite a lot!
Best hobby video ever! Informative, fun, innovative and ridiculous! :D Love it!
Awesome results this time around, one experiment I definitely would like to see is the effects of direct sunlight, I don't keep my minis outside but I did used to keep them on a display stand that was in direct light and over time my (unvarnished but primed) minis lost a lot of their vibrancy. May be worth taking a look at, and will take way less physical, boring, stress!
That's actually a really good idea!
You make me proud of both hobbyists and scientists. Thank you!
RUclips must be slow today- I got the notification for this highly scientific video while already watching it!
Another great experiment Brent!
All Google services was down earlier today in Norway 🤣
Awesome. This is exactly the video I wanted to see after the last varnish test!
Wow Brent, amazing dedication and process! Thanks for the info!
3 hours of pushing minis around a monopoly board .. dear lord .. a man of focus, commitment and sheer will
With. A. Pencil!
Man I wish I saw these videos when they came out. XD Without getting into it, knowing this would have saved me tons of hassle when I was starting out.
Perfect blend of Nerd, Dork, and Geek sciences... love it
A thought on airbrushed vs hand brushed paint: when aerosolized, a lot of the moisture in the acrylic medium is being immediately eliminated by the time the paint hits the surface of the mini. This should result in significantly faster curing time for the paint. It might take several more days for brushed paint to become as hard as the sprayed on or air-brushed primer and paint.
As for varnish really working, well, it makes sense to me. In addition to gloss or satin varnish having a smooth surface, varnish really sticks to itself well and forms a tightly gripping cocoon around the object it is applied to. You can see this if you try to pick and peel off some freshly applied varnish that is starting to turn gummy but isn't ready to be handled yet: rather than just peeling off at the part you're touching, like paint, the varnish comes off in a "skin" from the entire surface.
Due to that, I always assumed that hardened varnish is more like cellophane shrink wrap. And consider how durable shrink wrap is to being rubbed against a surface.
For the algorithm! I’d love to see a comparison between different types/brands of varnish. Also, how many layers is the most efficient? Both would help determine the combination for optimal protection.
My "go-to" varnishing technique is a good coating of glossy varnish to really protect the paintjob, and then matte varnish over that to dull it down and make it look less like a creepy porcelain figurine
This was awesome. No big surprises, but this and the last one really did answer some questions that we mostly just assume the answers of. If there is some sort of scientific journal of geeky stuff out there then this one needs to go into publication.
Much more thorough analysis achieved through this test, GJ Brent!
Patience at this level is rarely even observed in top military sniper teams.
@Harvey Crewe the fact that they used sniper teams as the basis of this obvious hyperbole implies that they're the most patient people that Odieman could think of. I'm not sure the British army needs a new propaganda wing since we all seem to be on the same page vis a vis the patience of snipers.
Science is not all particle colliders and data crunching! Brought here by the Mighty Algorithm and definitely on the fringe of where science meets fantasy but so spot on. I dropped a like and wish you well in your future Science. As I dropped a like its likely the algorithm will make us 'meet' again. Until then, science on!
Fantastic, really excited to see the matte varnish tests
Something I would definitely be interested in if you're in testing mode - Acrylic vs lacquer vs enamel varnishes.
My own subjective impression is that lacquer is just the best with a narrow exception - Lacquer does yellow over time and greasy fingers make it worse. Due to this I have been in the process of repainting a bunch of OG lead base pewter battletech stuff recently.
That being said, I could be full of crap and maybe acrylics or enamels are just better.
Hearing you say how slow three hours went and then showing real time footage was too damn funny, thanks for torturing yourself for us Brent xD
Great to see that you have improved Monopoly from the standard ruleset!
And this version only takes 3 hours to finish a game.
a man of determination and pure f-ing will
I need a suit.