*Benjamin Lafayette Sisko is the best Captain.* Wolf 359. Sisko had EVERY obstacle to navigate including a war. Without Sisko the Alpha Quad is changed forever. The only Captain that can be respected by Dukat, Kira, Odo, and Garak "Time Captain" Janeway is 2nd. She caused multiple PD violations, and was lucky having 7 of 9, She violated time to bring Voyager home. "Year of Hell" was her best work as Captain, but time again saved her. Voyager was undamaged for 7 years. Picard is 3rd for one reason - Data My ranking is different; but loved your reasoning, passion, and humor!
Raptor: Yeah Sisko and Janeway for me are like tied number 1. I think Sisko is made a lot better thanks to folks like Dukat, Garek, Kira, Weyon. If i was taking the captains on their own, i think Janeway comes out just ahead. But i love both. And thank you for your comment ^^
@@OneTrekMind "Average" would be the last word to describe James Tiberius Kirk (and I mean the REAL one) and there are tens of millions who would agree with me.
Raptor: I was very torn between Sisko and Janeway. Tbh i would probably put them as joint number 1. I stand by Picard and Kirk not being as good as either however
How. On earth can you have Picard above OG Kirk? Picard show never dated so high after persuading in to leave the nexus for Veridian III instead of Earth to save his brother Robert and nephew Rene and warn himself about Doran instead of a bad tactical decision that results in Kirk 's death and Robert and Rene still dying. OH Kirk will always best Picard.
Raptor: Im not sure you can use a single movie as evidence Picard is lower than OG Kirk. As for Kirk himself, I think the newer captains have all been better.
Does Abrams/Kurtzman Trek even count as Star Trek though? It would make the video much shorter admittedly, but I just can't see their stuff as part of the same franchise.
I believe it's Michael's built in bias which allows him to see Archer as "racist" and speak poorly of the captain. One of the main story arcs for the series, was about humans and Vulcans trusting each other. Archer even explained in great detail the damage that Vulcan's caused in his life. From them holding back his fathers work, to them telling all of humanity they are not ready to go into deep space, and pretty much told them "they were not welcomed at the cool-kids table". Look at how many times the Vulcans try to torpedo all deep space programs and declare that the Enterprise is/was a wasted experiment. Racism is based off of hate. Archer didn't hate the Vulcans. He was tired of them always talking down to humans. What he wanted to do was prove them wrong, to show humanity is ready, and that there was a need for a shared alliance. For two generations, the Vulcans has shat on everything that has to deal with humans in space during Archers timeline. It's not racisms, It's only human to have animosity towards someone, or a group, who has spent a lot of resources for your space program to fail and to hold your progression back. I feel a lot of lore is being ignored on purpose, just to push this "He's racist" narrative. Another aspect that is being ignored of Archer is he didn't have the Federation Playbook like what every other Captain/non-captain has had the luxury of having. You got a Captain, who is the first of his kind, with the first of it's kind crew, in the first of it's kind vessel. He didn't have the vast knowledge the future Starfleet officers will have. He was told "Just go out there randomly, and don't start any conflicts". So yes, his emotions did get the better of him, he did make some iffy calls during parts of the story. But the guy was doing the best he can, with no playbook or blueprint to follow. While also trying his best to make sure this "space program" survives on its own and not become an extension of the military. Out of the Captains, he had to face an invasion of Earth and a full scale sneak attack on Earth, in his 2nd year of duty? Maybe it was the first year, but to have that fall on your plate, that Earth is now in your hands, and you need to come up with a response to what happened. In a ship that has been getting it's ass kicked every time they ran into someone. You simply didn't like Archer.
Raptor: I dont agree. Archer blaimed the Vulcans for what happened with his dad, and then directed that attitude towards every vulcan he encountered. He was clearly bigoted towards them for most of season 1, and i would argue that it was hatred. While I appreciate that he moved on from that, which was something me and Michael discussed in our Enteprise broad look, it doesnt mean his attitude didnt start as borderline racist. As for ignoring lore, we really werent. Again, we discussed a lot of this in our enterprise broad look. This video was not meant to go into huge amounts of depth. Also I didnt ignore the lack of a rulebook. Infact i literally spoke about it. I appreciate your post however. It was nice to see someone take the time to discuss and explain themselves and their view on what we said. So thank you for your comment. Would Archer be your number 1 captain then?
Michael: I am curious as to what my built in bias is...but I still argue that excuses aside he was racist and overcame that over the course of his show. I don't hate Captain Archer but there were many reasons I placed him lower on my list.
I never get the point of having two opinions when the options are mirror images of one another. A lot of RUclips channels seems plagued with this. I get it, the reason you guys are buddies is because you think alike. But the videos are twice as long as they need to be when you guys just parrot one another.
Kirk, Picard, Sisko, Janeway, and Archer are the only real Captains. None of those other 'captains' from the garbage known as new 'Trek' should be anywhere near a list like this.
Michael: I'm far more open to new Trek with some pretty strong criticisms of them as well. Most of them do not land for me, but I think they all provide points that are worthwhile, some more than others, same for their captains.
I just had this video recommended to me on my main page. Love the discussion you guys had, and while my list differs slightly, it's cool to see how closely it aligns. My list from best to worst is: Janeway Picard Pike Sisko Freeman Saru Archer OG Kirk Burnham Kelvin Kirk Lorca As a character, I prefer Archer to Saru, but I think Saru is a better captain. It was really tough between Pike and Sisko, but ultimately some of the decisions. Sisko made bumped him down one E.G. poisoning an inhabited planet, and the 'it's a faaaake!' fiasco. That alongside Pike's sacrifice in accepting the beep chair as his fate, put him in third place. Janeway is definitely the best. In your discussion, you said it would be interesting to see how Janeway behaved towards the rules once she got back home. I know this video was uploaded several months ago, so season 2 of Prodigy was not out yet, but have you seen it now? What are your thoughts on Admiral Janeway. We did of course see her in season 1, but not to the same extent.
Raptor: Thank you for your kind words. We have not yet started on Prodigy, and uncertain if we will cover it since its primarily a kids show. But we might do, its something under discussion ^^
@@OneTrekMind Trust me, it's way more than just a kid's show. Family show would be more appropriate. It's the best Trek from the modern era IMO, especially season 2. Since Janeway is both of your favourite captains, I would highly recommend it.
Raptor: It seems there is a lot of OG Kirk support in the comments ^^. I can appreciate him having quite a strong fanbase, espeically among older audiences. I do think Kirk is just a little too out-dated, at least as far as the show goes. Film OG Kirk is a bit different
Michael: Totally fair to have a different number one, and there's a lot I do like about Kirk. I personally think there's plenty of evidence from the show that shows him being rather sexist, the final line of the series being a big one, but as I said I did like a lot about him and respect him being your number one.
Raptor: Well unfortunatly i agree that in that situation there was no right way to solve that situation. Either kill tuvix, or kill tuvok and neelix. Personally i agree with her choice
I was hopeful for this list and I was pretty sure that we all knew what order the top 3 were gonna go but then you pandered to all the feminists out there. Sure Janeway is good, but number one? Come on guys, you need to do better. You also spelled Captain Sisko’s name wrong, lol. Anyway, I’m sure most fans can agree if the number one choice is not Sisko or Picard, maybe OG Kirk for some old timers, you’re pushing an agenda.
Raptor: This makes me laugh considering I dispise Discovery for the agenda pushing...you labelling me a feminist is just funny. And yeah i mispelled Sisko. Well spotted.
@@OneTrekMind in my opinion, her decision not to blow up the array using a timer is monumental lapse in judgement, that knocks her down and she had ample time to think about it. Another decision was to kill a bunch of species 8472 and then lecturing and killing Captain Ransom for kind of doing the same thing. Another was not to gaurd the Ferengi in that episode with them. Her snarky attitude toward her staff at times rubbed me the wrong way sometimes. Killing Tuvix. multiple prime directive violations. There is quite a few more reasons why I wouldn't put her as number one but these are just a few.
@@sethaldrich6902 Raptor: I think every captain has made questionable choices. Sisko comitted war crimes multiple times. Archer did some pretty unethical stuff. And yeah janeway did some questionable stuff too. For me out of the big three legacy captains, Janeway is the one that i would prefer to know irl. Picard is too stiff and stale, and Sisko too intense
@@OneTrekMind in my mind, stranding yourself and crew in the delta quadrant when you didn't have to is a bit different than doing whatever you have to do to circumvent annihalation. And as far as Archer, I don't think he was ever really in the conversation as a number one captian of all time, in addition to him not being able to study other captians decisions like alot of the other captians were able to do because they lived later on in the timeline b/c he was the first to do it.
Need to take Lorca off the list, that is not lorca, its his counterpoint, from the mirror verse. This would be like ranking capt Kirk based on mirror verse Kirk
The problem with Burnham is that she was explicitly written as a "Strong Black Female" & they tried too hard to make her the best, most compassionate, most skilled, etc. etc. but she was never very likeable which the writers didn't count on. As part of a proper ensemble crew it wouldn't have been so bad but she was by far the main focus of Discovery and it actively put me off watching the show (along with the horrible Klingon scenes). I think Hollywood writers need to re-learn how to write interesting & deep characters instead of sticking to "inspiring" tropes. Star Wars had a similar problem with Rey who was more a collection of skills & qualities than a real person.
I prefer the nickname of "Mikey Spock". They screwed up HARD in new Star wars, the better route would have been to keep most of the first movie as it is, have Rey get captured at the end and then focus the entirety of the second movie on Finn. That way they could have built his character up, pulled one of those stupid plot twists that they seem to love so much, AND contrast the walking tool shed of skills and qualities that is Rey with Finn, whom would have to learn new skills in order to take up the leading role. You could even have Rey Palpatine get seduced by the Dark Side and then have Finn needing to go up against both Kylo Ren AND her in order to snap her out of it, they set her up to be such a perfect Mary Sue that that fight would probably have felt more epic than Luke vs. Vader. I mean they teased that Finn was able to handle a lightsaber, and then they just completely killed that story arch entirely. Anything would be better than what we got...
Michael: I have some varied thoughts on the character of Burnham and the show as a whole. I don't fall entirely in the camp of "She's just an SJW Mary Sue" and I don't entirely fall in the camp of "She's the greatest Trek captain their is". With the upcoming final season for Discovery, we're likely going to discuss it more in depth pretty soon.
Michael: I agree that Michael Burnham is good at perhaps too many things, but she has qualities that I find worthwhile, much more so than Lorca, Kelvin Kirk, and just by smidge more than Archer. Sisko is really great though I do agree, I just happen to like Janeway a bit more.
Jeez so many chuds in the comments. Wanted to say you guys are great and your choices are nuanced and balanced. I agree with most of it. Even though Freeman is played up for laughs and the sorritos is kinda the worst ship in the federation, but it's still trek so she should be on the list anyway. My list, worst to best would be: Lorca Kelvin Kirk Freeman Burnham Kirk Saru Pike Archer Sisko Picard Janeway We don't get to see much of Captain Riker but I imagine he'd be somewhere around OG Kirk. Keep up the good work!
Raptor: Yeah its been interesting lol. I am genuinely surprised at the amount of pro-shatner kirk folks. As for freeman...there is a funny story there. I did intially have her on my list. But michael suddenly realised during recording he had forgotten her so we decieded to add her at the end as a honorable mention to prevent having to re-record an hour of talking ^^
Michael: Thank you very much! And thank you for providing a list in return. I do feel bad for forgetting Captain Freeman on my list and do like her as a captain, but we'll definitely need to do an updated list in the future.
@@daviddiggens8841 I don't remember seeing Sisko as a Star Fleet captain. I remember seeing him as the overseer of a space station. Personally, I prefer the captains on Star Trek that, you know, actually go on TREK's. DS9 was a spin-off, no matter how good. Voyager was not.
@@Luciphellwell he started as commander but very quickly became a captain in rank. I guess it's easy to miss. There are quite a few proper ranks ignored. I've never seen a commodore, nor rear admiral in star fleet for example but he definitely was a captain early on
The tales of a commodore commanding a small fleet could actually be a pretty incredible tale but I suppose since everyone goes from captain to admiral we will never get it
@@curiousuranus810 The boldness i defo agree with. He handles Klingons very well. The french thing? i dunno...hes so british lol. He does make a good speech though. Thank you for your comment ^^ and sharing in the discussion
this is some revisionist history here, voyager was not a good show, and poor enterprise suffered because of it a Janeway was boring , the show was boring and a slog to get through, and if we're just going on in universe how good a captain you are she lost her ship and all hands her first trip out, horrible captain
I agree with you both about Kelvin Kirk. Such a disservice to the original Kirk.
*Benjamin Lafayette Sisko is the best Captain.* Wolf 359. Sisko had EVERY obstacle to navigate including a war. Without Sisko the Alpha Quad is changed forever. The only Captain that can be respected by Dukat, Kira, Odo, and Garak
"Time Captain" Janeway is 2nd. She caused multiple PD violations, and was lucky having 7 of 9, She violated time to bring Voyager home. "Year of Hell" was her best work as Captain, but time again saved her. Voyager was undamaged for 7 years.
Picard is 3rd for one reason - Data
My ranking is different; but loved your reasoning, passion, and humor!
Facts
Raptor: Yeah Sisko and Janeway for me are like tied number 1. I think Sisko is made a lot better thanks to folks like Dukat, Garek, Kira, Weyon. If i was taking the captains on their own, i think Janeway comes out just ahead. But i love both.
And thank you for your comment ^^
Michael: Completely respect that and I truly love Captain Sisko
Janeway had blindspots that interfered with her judgment at times, like the running gag of refusing to promote Harry Kim.
Raptor: I agree that Kim deserved to be promoted during the shows run.
Michael: Poor Kim, he really did deserve a promotion
I respect your choices.
I pick O.G Captain Kirk, Sisko & Archer and Picard (My top four Captains).
Raptor: Thank you! At the end of the day everyone has very varied opinions on this topic, and we cant all be 'kirk or picard' types ^^
I love the captain kirk and captain Picard 💙 😍
Sisko should be number 1
Raptor: I was pretty torn. I think Sisko is a better captain than janeway, but i prefer Janeways personality
@@OneTrekMindAre you kidding, no disrespect to Janeway character, Sisko was a Capt and Spiritual God lol... Sisko saved the universal twice over
@@OneTrekMindAnd Sisko can sing and cook 😆
Raptor: The cooking is defo a point in his favour i agree ^^
Michael: I love Sisko I really do, but I'd be lying if I said I liked him more than Janeway.
How dare you put Kirk (OG) so low
Raptor: I just think he is a very average captain
@@OneTrekMind "Average" would be the last word to describe James Tiberius Kirk (and I mean the REAL one) and there are tens of millions who would agree with me.
@@vincentsaia6545And i think hes average. But we can agree to disagree ^^
@@OneTrekMind I know what you said.
@@vincentsaia6545 Dude. Everyone is entitled to an opinion. You think hes good. I think hes average. Dunno what the issue is?
But is it Kirk, or is it Picard?
No! Team Sisko, to your stations!
Raptor: I was very torn between Sisko and Janeway. Tbh i would probably put them as joint number 1. I stand by Picard and Kirk not being as good as either however
Archer is better than Picard any day. Overrated Picard. Veridian will always tag Picard for the not so smart tactician he turned out to be.
How. On earth can you have Picard above OG Kirk? Picard show never dated so high after persuading in to leave the nexus for Veridian III instead of Earth to save his brother Robert and nephew Rene and warn himself about Doran instead of a bad tactical decision that results in Kirk 's death and Robert and Rene still dying. OH Kirk will always best Picard.
Raptor: Im not sure you can use a single movie as evidence Picard is lower than OG Kirk. As for Kirk himself, I think the newer captains have all been better.
Does Abrams/Kurtzman Trek even count as Star Trek though? It would make the video much shorter admittedly, but I just can't see their stuff as part of the same franchise.
Raptor: Well they are certainly different sorts of captains thats for sure
Michael: I'm still firmly of the belief that even though a lot of newer Trek hasn't been my cup of tea, it's still Star Trek
I wish you would have included Kirk from the movies
Raptor: Yeah Ive been thinking about this, and I do agree that the TOS movie Kirk is very different to the series Kirk.
@@OneTrekMind ❤️
Captain archer😊
Kirk and Archer tie for first...
Raptor: I think archer gets unfairly treated by a lot of fans
If you are going to make fun of Kia Winn, do us older folks a favor and just call her Nurse Ratched.
Raptor: Having gone and youtubed that..yeah...i agree ^^
Michael: Umbridge was my childhood Nurse Ratched/Kai Winn, I can't help it.
@OneTrekMind yup, when I first saw her pop up on DS9 I nearly soiled myself.
@OneTrekMind perfectly fair.
Your opinions on archer were very different from each other. That’s interesting.
Raptor: We do try to have different opinions heh
I believe it's Michael's built in bias which allows him to see Archer as "racist" and speak poorly of the captain.
One of the main story arcs for the series, was about humans and Vulcans trusting each other. Archer even explained in great detail the damage that Vulcan's caused in his life. From them holding back his fathers work, to them telling all of humanity they are not ready to go into deep space, and pretty much told them "they were not welcomed at the cool-kids table". Look at how many times the Vulcans try to torpedo all deep space programs and declare that the Enterprise is/was a wasted experiment.
Racism is based off of hate. Archer didn't hate the Vulcans. He was tired of them always talking down to humans. What he wanted to do was prove them wrong, to show humanity is ready, and that there was a need for a shared alliance. For two generations, the Vulcans has shat on everything that has to deal with humans in space during Archers timeline. It's not racisms, It's only human to have animosity towards someone, or a group, who has spent a lot of resources for your space program to fail and to hold your progression back. I feel a lot of lore is being ignored on purpose, just to push this "He's racist" narrative.
Another aspect that is being ignored of Archer is he didn't have the Federation Playbook like what every other Captain/non-captain has had the luxury of having. You got a Captain, who is the first of his kind, with the first of it's kind crew, in the first of it's kind vessel. He didn't have the vast knowledge the future Starfleet officers will have. He was told "Just go out there randomly, and don't start any conflicts". So yes, his emotions did get the better of him, he did make some iffy calls during parts of the story. But the guy was doing the best he can, with no playbook or blueprint to follow. While also trying his best to make sure this "space program" survives on its own and not become an extension of the military. Out of the Captains, he had to face an invasion of Earth and a full scale sneak attack on Earth, in his 2nd year of duty? Maybe it was the first year, but to have that fall on your plate, that Earth is now in your hands, and you need to come up with a response to what happened. In a ship that has been getting it's ass kicked every time they ran into someone. You simply didn't like Archer.
Raptor: I dont agree. Archer blaimed the Vulcans for what happened with his dad, and then directed that attitude towards every vulcan he encountered. He was clearly bigoted towards them for most of season 1, and i would argue that it was hatred. While I appreciate that he moved on from that, which was something me and Michael discussed in our Enteprise broad look, it doesnt mean his attitude didnt start as borderline racist.
As for ignoring lore, we really werent. Again, we discussed a lot of this in our enterprise broad look. This video was not meant to go into huge amounts of depth.
Also I didnt ignore the lack of a rulebook. Infact i literally spoke about it.
I appreciate your post however. It was nice to see someone take the time to discuss and explain themselves and their view on what we said. So thank you for your comment. Would Archer be your number 1 captain then?
Michael: I am curious as to what my built in bias is...but I still argue that excuses aside he was racist and overcame that over the course of his show. I don't hate Captain Archer but there were many reasons I placed him lower on my list.
So thanks to Archer for making you two separate people :D
Raptor: Honestly i thought our lists would vary more
I never get the point of having two opinions when the options are mirror images of one another. A lot of RUclips channels seems plagued with this. I get it, the reason you guys are buddies is because you think alike. But the videos are twice as long as they need to be when you guys just parrot one another.
We dont go into it expecting that. Its just what ends up happening at the end of the day.
Michael: Nothing we can do about agreeing on something except lie and pretend to have the opposite opinion.
Sisko is the best!
Yike! Janeway MAY BE in the top 3 but #1? Nay nay
Shes #1 in prime directive violations
I'd rank her #2, I really like her as a captain but Sisko will always be #1.
Raptor: Yeah i was very torn between Sisko and Janeway for number 1.
@@kyrious643 lol... hilarious... But I think Kirk did the most violations 😆 🤣
Michael: All I can say is I like her style the best.
Kirk, Picard, Sisko, Janeway, and Archer are the only real Captains. None of those other 'captains' from the garbage known as new 'Trek' should be anywhere near a list like this.
Raptor: Nu Trek is not my favourite, and I have some strong opinions on it that me and Michael will be discussing in future videos.
Michael: I'm far more open to new Trek with some pretty strong criticisms of them as well. Most of them do not land for me, but I think they all provide points that are worthwhile, some more than others, same for their captains.
I agree with your ranking.
I just had this video recommended to me on my main page. Love the discussion you guys had, and while my list differs slightly, it's cool to see how closely it aligns. My list from best to worst is:
Janeway
Picard
Pike
Sisko
Freeman
Saru
Archer
OG Kirk
Burnham
Kelvin Kirk
Lorca
As a character, I prefer Archer to Saru, but I think Saru is a better captain. It was really tough between Pike and Sisko, but ultimately some of the decisions. Sisko made bumped him down one E.G. poisoning an inhabited planet, and the 'it's a faaaake!' fiasco. That alongside Pike's sacrifice in accepting the beep chair as his fate, put him in third place.
Janeway is definitely the best. In your discussion, you said it would be interesting to see how Janeway behaved towards the rules once she got back home. I know this video was uploaded several months ago, so season 2 of Prodigy was not out yet, but have you seen it now? What are your thoughts on Admiral Janeway. We did of course see her in season 1, but not to the same extent.
Raptor: Thank you for your kind words.
We have not yet started on Prodigy, and uncertain if we will cover it since its primarily a kids show. But we might do, its something under discussion ^^
@@OneTrekMind Trust me, it's way more than just a kid's show. Family show would be more appropriate. It's the best Trek from the modern era IMO, especially season 2. Since Janeway is both of your favourite captains, I would highly recommend it.
Raptor: then we might have to give it a watch
Michael: We'll definitely be giving Prodigy a look mostly for Janeway, and thank you for the comment and your own list!
@@OneTrekMind That's great! I look forward to listening to your takes on the show once you've seen it :D
Janeway is the worst. She ordered Tuvix to his death. Picard would've let him live. Tuvix was a great cook and was more relaxed.
I'm O.G Captain Kirk Fan, maybe I am bias but I'm a Constituton Class Starship Guy but O.G Kirkis far peferct but sexist...I don't know about that.
Raptor: It seems there is a lot of OG Kirk support in the comments ^^. I can appreciate him having quite a strong fanbase, espeically among older audiences. I do think Kirk is just a little too out-dated, at least as far as the show goes. Film OG Kirk is a bit different
Michael: Totally fair to have a different number one, and there's a lot I do like about Kirk. I personally think there's plenty of evidence from the show that shows him being rather sexist, the final line of the series being a big one, but as I said I did like a lot about him and respect him being your number one.
Tuvicks. Knocks her off number one
Raptor: Well unfortunatly i agree that in that situation there was no right way to solve that situation. Either kill tuvix, or kill tuvok and neelix. Personally i agree with her choice
Michael: I would have killed Tuvicks twice
I was hopeful for this list and I was pretty sure that we all knew what order the top 3 were gonna go but then you pandered to all the feminists out there. Sure Janeway is good, but number one? Come on guys, you need to do better. You also spelled Captain Sisko’s name wrong, lol. Anyway, I’m sure most fans can agree if the number one choice is not Sisko or Picard, maybe OG Kirk for some old timers, you’re pushing an agenda.
Raptor: This makes me laugh considering I dispise Discovery for the agenda pushing...you labelling me a feminist is just funny. And yeah i mispelled Sisko. Well spotted.
@@OneTrekMind in my opinion, her decision not to blow up the array using a timer is monumental lapse in judgement, that knocks her down and she had ample time to think about it. Another decision was to kill a bunch of species 8472 and then lecturing and killing Captain Ransom for kind of doing the same thing. Another was not to gaurd the Ferengi in that episode with them. Her snarky attitude toward her staff at times rubbed me the wrong way sometimes. Killing Tuvix. multiple prime directive violations. There is quite a few more reasons why I wouldn't put her as number one but these are just a few.
Kirk or Picard is the ultimate question as to the best Captain. None of the others are anywhere near the top two.
Good podcast, good chemistry between you two. I'm assuming your channel is new. Keep it up, put the work in. I think you've got a future here!
Raptor: Thank you!
Michael: Thank you very much, we're doing our best.
But if Janeway had just set a time bomb, they wouldn’t have been stuck out there.
Raptor: That is a good point
Agree, this is my number one gripe against her for supposedly being so smart she made some questionable decisions.
@@sethaldrich6902 Raptor: I think every captain has made questionable choices. Sisko comitted war crimes multiple times. Archer did some pretty unethical stuff. And yeah janeway did some questionable stuff too. For me out of the big three legacy captains, Janeway is the one that i would prefer to know irl. Picard is too stiff and stale, and Sisko too intense
@@OneTrekMind in my mind, stranding yourself and crew in the delta quadrant when you didn't have to is a bit different than doing whatever you have to do to circumvent annihalation. And as far as Archer, I don't think he was ever really in the conversation as a number one captian of all time, in addition to him not being able to study other captians decisions like alot of the other captians were able to do because they lived later on in the timeline b/c he was the first to do it.
Need to take Lorca off the list, that is not lorca, its his counterpoint, from the mirror verse. This would be like ranking capt Kirk based on mirror verse Kirk
Yeah I was thinking the same, if his mirror counterpart is that bad as a captain, the actual guy has to be one of the greats, right?
Raptor: I can see your point, but given that he was Captain for a whole season, we felt he should be on the list
Freeman! Yay!
The captain of the Enterprise, while it was a training ship, was left out. Captain SPOCK should get an honorable mention!
Raptor: We will be doing a video looking at the single episode / movie captains at some point.
I wanted to follow your channel, but this might have been the worst list I've ever seen.
Raptor: We are all allowed to have different views. Perhaps instead of just saying it was bad you could explain your reasons?
I like your list
I don't think captain Braham, captain orica, captain Georgia, are in different universe 😳 😊
Captain Braham I'm
In different universe 😊
Kevin captain kirk in different universe 😊
The problem with Burnham is that she was explicitly written as a "Strong Black Female" & they tried too hard to make her the best, most compassionate, most skilled, etc. etc. but she was never very likeable which the writers didn't count on. As part of a proper ensemble crew it wouldn't have been so bad but she was by far the main focus of Discovery and it actively put me off watching the show (along with the horrible Klingon scenes).
I think Hollywood writers need to re-learn how to write interesting & deep characters instead of sticking to "inspiring" tropes. Star Wars had a similar problem with Rey who was more a collection of skills & qualities than a real person.
I prefer the nickname of "Mikey Spock".
They screwed up HARD in new Star wars, the better route would have been to keep most of the first movie as it is, have Rey get captured at the end and then focus the entirety of the second movie on Finn. That way they could have built his character up, pulled one of those stupid plot twists that they seem to love so much, AND contrast the walking tool shed of skills and qualities that is Rey with Finn, whom would have to learn new skills in order to take up the leading role.
You could even have Rey Palpatine get seduced by the Dark Side and then have Finn needing to go up against both Kylo Ren AND her in order to snap her out of it, they set her up to be such a perfect Mary Sue that that fight would probably have felt more epic than Luke vs. Vader. I mean they teased that Finn was able to handle a lightsaber, and then they just completely killed that story arch entirely.
Anything would be better than what we got...
Raptor: That was basically what turned me off watching the show from the start
Michael: I have some varied thoughts on the character of Burnham and the show as a whole. I don't fall entirely in the camp of "She's just an SJW Mary Sue" and I don't entirely fall in the camp of "She's the greatest Trek captain their is". With the upcoming final season for Discovery, we're likely going to discuss it more in depth pretty soon.
Mary Sue and Space jesus rolled into one.
Wait wait wait... Where is Capt Nog???? Come on!!! 😆 🤣
Raptor: heh we might do a list in the future about one movie/one episode captains
Michael: I do love me some Captain Nog, so yes we'll have to do an expanded list to get everybody in there next time.
You people are not thinking straight. Captain Sisko is the best. There is no way that Michael Barnum isn’t in last place. She’s a Mary sue!
Raptor: Sisko is good, and I was very torn betwene him and Janeway personally.
Michael: I agree that Michael Burnham is good at perhaps too many things, but she has qualities that I find worthwhile, much more so than Lorca, Kelvin Kirk, and just by smidge more than Archer. Sisko is really great though I do agree, I just happen to like Janeway a bit more.
Jeez so many chuds in the comments. Wanted to say you guys are great and your choices are nuanced and balanced. I agree with most of it.
Even though Freeman is played up for laughs and the sorritos is kinda the worst ship in the federation, but it's still trek so she should be on the list anyway. My list, worst to best would be:
Lorca
Kelvin Kirk
Freeman
Burnham
Kirk
Saru
Pike
Archer
Sisko
Picard
Janeway
We don't get to see much of Captain Riker but I imagine he'd be somewhere around OG Kirk.
Keep up the good work!
Raptor: Yeah its been interesting lol. I am genuinely surprised at the amount of pro-shatner kirk folks.
As for freeman...there is a funny story there. I did intially have her on my list. But michael suddenly realised during recording he had forgotten her so we decieded to add her at the end as a honorable mention to prevent having to re-record an hour of talking ^^
Michael: Thank you very much! And thank you for providing a list in return. I do feel bad for forgetting Captain Freeman on my list and do like her as a captain, but we'll definitely need to do an updated list in the future.
Alternative universe don’t count
The accusation of racism in current year should be seen only as a badge of honor.
Michael: That's genuinely concerning to hear.
@@OneTrekMind thrn those in power shouldnt of overused the word.
Janeway? Are you kidding me? Sisco is light years ahead of Janeway!
No, he isn't.
@@LuciphellBLASPHEMY!!!
@@daviddiggens8841
I don't remember seeing Sisko as a Star Fleet captain. I remember seeing him as the overseer of a space station.
Personally, I prefer the captains on Star Trek that, you know, actually go on TREK's.
DS9 was a spin-off, no matter how good.
Voyager was not.
@@Luciphellwell he started as commander but very quickly became a captain in rank.
I guess it's easy to miss.
There are quite a few proper ranks ignored.
I've never seen a commodore, nor rear admiral in star fleet for example but he definitely was a captain early on
The tales of a commodore commanding a small fleet could actually be a pretty incredible tale but I suppose since everyone goes from captain to admiral we will never get it
Picard is the only starship captin and Janeway should be the official Treck toilet cleaner.
Raptor: What makes Picard number 1 for you?
@@OneTrekMind French gravitas (and boldness).
@@curiousuranus810 The boldness i defo agree with. He handles Klingons very well. The french thing? i dunno...hes so british lol.
He does make a good speech though.
Thank you for your comment ^^ and sharing in the discussion
this is some revisionist history here, voyager was not a good show, and poor enterprise suffered because of it a Janeway was boring , the show was boring and a slog to get through, and if we're just going on in universe how good a captain you are she lost her ship and all hands her first trip out, horrible captain
Raptor: Who would be your 1st place?
Michael: I very much disagree but that's what this is all about. Like Raptor, I'm curious about who your picks might be
Sisko .witha k
Raptor: Yeah i only realised just after we finished making the video. I'm not sure how i made such a silly error ^^