Can Mewtwo beat Pokemon Crystal on Minimum Battles? 500 Subscriber Thank you!
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- Опубликовано: 12 сен 2024
- Minimum Battles is the ultimate challenge. But is it even possible to beat the entire game on Minimum Battles?
On my main channel @RBYPokemonChallenges , I have already completed this challenge with all 151 Pokemon on Gen 1, but Gen 2 presents a massively different challenge - sleep and Wrap were nerfed, there's no Gen 1 miss (1/256 glitch), and all the trainers have better AI. But Minimum Battles might just be possible with some effort and ingenuity.
For the scientist in the team rocket hideout at the 26 mark, you either have to talk to him again or examine the computer after you beat him to have the grunts stop coming after you.
Yeah, it's the computer that turns off the traps
Got it! I will use that to cut off 1 battle
Computer
You can also use the other path to avoid the hallway with koffing and geodude
I mean, I just caught them, which I consider not battles. Same reason I was catching Electrodes and Red Gyarados, to bypass exp
25:53 You need to use the PC next to the scientist to disable the statues.
That makes sense. I was trying to talk to him to disable the traps, not the PC
Gen 2 is my everything. I love RBY challenges, but I needed to see more for gen 2. I'm here for it!
Heck yeah, Ge 2 action incoming
25:30 You fight that scientist in the Team Rocket hideout and then interact with his computer to turn off the alarms
Makes sense.
If Rival 3 or Morty are giving you trouble, you can fight the Kimono girls and get Surf and/or fight the trainers in the Lighthouse (assuming you have a Teleport Abra, at least) prior to fighting them.
True, I think there are lots of options from that point for more EXP
You mentioned you were stuck at the League and didn't know how to get back. The old man with the Abra next to the Pokemon Center counter. Talk to him and he'll teleport you home. He disappears after you beat the League.
Nice, I'll use it next time. Or just plan my route better and get Tame I might need in advance 😂
The Dark type is weak to Fighting and Bug. Unfortunately, good moves of either type are hard to come by. Dynamic Punch from Chuck is probably most reasonable with your playstyle - it has high base power and always confuses, but only has 50% accuracy, often requiring resets if you rely on it, but every other Fighting move is only learned by a few pokémon, or is too weak to use in the case of Rock Smash. Against Houndoom, of course, Surf or Earthquake would also be effective. As for Bug moves, Houndoom and Murkrow aren’t even weak to them, and only Fury Cutter is widely available, which takes multiple turns to ramp up to a reasonable power, letting Umbreon use Sand Attack to reset it.
For sure. I think Dynamic Punch was the best play in this case. Obviously in runs with water moves we won't struggle there as much.
Yes I was thinking earthquake. The weird thing is that Mewtwo can not learn it in gen 2. Only from Gen 3 onwards. Same with Venasuar
I know it's probably super early to discuss this but can we add Curse and Hidden Power to the broken TMs list? Curse usually cheeses physical tanks to setup Return sweeps (see Red's Snorlax) and with Gamehook Hidden Power can be a base 70 power any type coverage move.
I specifically avoided both for exactly this reason. I love to watch runs by Squidgy, for example, but I know every runs involves him learning Return and spamming it for the rest of the game
Yeah I was tempted to just list the usual Red Four Point Five (Return, Curse, Rest, Protect/Earthquake) but there is the argument that movepools especially for the new mons were gimped thinking you'll use the TMs to fill in coverage gaps.
Maybe having a category of "generic / staple" TMs that aren't the -10 from Broken TMs but like minus 3 or 5 for overused coverage moves (Elemental punches, Mud Slap, Earthquake)
Yeah, I am in the process of deciding this as I go along. My first question is honestly if any Pokemon will have a moveset good enough to beat the game without TMs at all. It's fairly simple in Gen 1 due to the brokenness of Sleep and BBG, but Gen 2 give a a much tougher challeng because of nerfs to those strategies and the overall greater coverage of opponents. Plus that level spike at Red is pretty insane honestly.
Not sure if it helps in this specific instance, but you can fight the 2 trainers in the underground before Whitney. They obviously aren't required before Whitney, but they are required to beat the game, and an extra level pre-Whitney could help out a ton for some pokemon.
Yeah, I had a comment on a previous video that said they were not required so I skipped them at first, confirmed that they were required in the Team Rocket section, so I will likely add them to the route from here on
Jrose fights the scientist to use the computer to stop the grunts from appearing
*This*
For sure. It was cut out of his video, and I didn't see that on the guide page when I was reading it..
The levels kept up surprisingly well, but Mewtwo's stats are insane. I feel like most mons won't be able to pass the postgame on min battles. Though, as a thought in line with how you question the standard practices of running gen 1, I will ask why Johto is the region that people feel the postgame is mandatory when running? Especially with how so many people seem to complain about how much of a joke the bulk of the Kanto side of the game is.
The grinding for red is super annoying
So I think the fact that Mewtwo could do it on 0 DVs/0 IVs is actually quite a good I doctor that other Pokemon COULD succeed, owing to the fact that 1) Mewtwo doesn't get a ton of levels due to it's slow growth rate and 2) it doesn't get a status like sleep or confusion. While statuses were nerfed in Gen 2, Sleep remains pretty strong as long as we have reasonable damage ranges on key opponents
To answer your question about the postgame, it is because unlike most other postgames, credits roll after it. This gives the impression to a lot of people that the E4 was just a fakeout ending.
Add to that the fact GSC was gonna be the end of the series and the battle with Red feels all the more climactic, and thus fitting for the end of the run.
The idea of "postgames" was also alien to a lot of gamers at that time. It wasn't seen as a postgame, but rather the end of the game.
Hope this proves helpful.
Yeah i cant really see anything non-legendary really beating red on minimum battles, but the Kanto part is fun to watch IMO better than ending it at Lance. I like what Gym Leader Matt does he does timed runs and stops the time after defeating Blue...which is cool because he's significantly tougher than Lance but not stupid hard like Red, so more things have a chance i think
For HM/Field Move Pokemon: You could catch a Sentret on Route 29 to get a Surf + Cut user in 1 pokemon, instead of Paras/Psyduck. The gift Togepi can learn Flash. The gift Spearow can learn Fly, the gift Shuckle can learn Strength (as well as Dig and Rock Smash, if desired), and the Shiny Gyarados can learn Whirlpool and Waterfall (and catching it is less experience than knocking it out, of course). An Abra from the game corner can use Teleport.
For sure. The main issue is that we can't actually get the Flash HM in a minimum battles run, but until I learn the route well enough to simply go through the dark sections, we can simply "assume" a traded Pokemon, and since we catch Electrodes as well in the Rocket Hideout to avoid EXP, this seems a fair compromise to me
Can't you get an Abra near the day care center?
@@adventureoflinkmk2 might count as an optional battle depending on how you're defining a battle
@Kanbei11 well, we are typically allowed to catch pokemon for field move use
But, perhaps the money need for 500 coins/time could be invested in other areas for the run too
@adventureoflinkmk2 The Abra saves time in several places. Lets you teleport back from the bottle girl back to town, and in Kanto lets you only go through Rock Tunnel once.
Also leaves the option open to run the lighthouse before Morty if the EXP is needed; otherwise can't backtrack without hitting an extra trainer. And other hopping around may be required on runs where doing Chuck early isn't practical. In many of my runs, I found it advantageous to run the hideout before attempting any of the gym leaders, for experience and such.
Since Teo doesn't use vitamins, the only thing to worry about money for at this point in the game is the elemental punches, which you should still be able to afford 1-2 of regardless. You can't afford the TMs from the game corner until later.
Idk. Abra just seems like a no brainer to me, for just 2k.
I pressed this video so early that the sound hadnt come through yet. I was so confused
Don't feel bad I clicked as soon as it came too... I was like wtf
Also confused: did you get hit with supersonic or confuse Ray or a psychic move
@@adventureoflinkmk2 I got hit with swagger :(
@@leftysheppey ope
Forgot that hits confusion too..
Sorry, I just set it to release. Forgot that sound doesn't process for a while
One way you could legitimately get flash without training and while maintaining the integrity of the challenge is to get a smeargle, battle trainer Mark on route 36 after spending all your money, sketch flash from his Abra, and then lose.
That is a possibility.... Now to get a Smeargle
Dude
I am so baked
I was suntanning
11/10 video
LOL
I would love to see a line graph with number of battles on the X axis, and level of pokemon on the Y axis. Then you could see the level difference in each battle, and how much a Pokémon needs to level up before passing certain walls
Something for me to go back and gather. What we can say for certain is that all of the Rockets are fairly weak and underlevelled, and most of the Kanto Gym leaders are as well
Yeah this would be super interesting to see
You honestly deserve more subs for sure !! Keep up
I appreciate that!
Had been looking forward to a full run on this channel!
This is basically just a test, but it shows where we're going
Seeing you use so many physical attacks like iron tail against blaine was painful 😂
Yeah definitely bad strategy there, as mentioned I am still learning gen 2
Watch some of scotts gsc runs. You need to have a plan for reds snorlax at the end of the game and special attackers struggle there. Most Pokémon have to default to the curse/rest/return/sleep talk move set. Get familiar with those since they’re the best answer against red in these games.
The point is that I am trying to avoid that specific set. It's the same with Scott runs in RBY, where he almost always ends with Rest/ Mimic on his moveset - good strategy for speed optimization, to be sure, but not terribly interesting when the run is just ending with a generic TM strategy.
And just to be clear, this isn't hate on my guy Scott or Squidgy, two guys I resp CT and watch a lot, but I do want to make sure that I'm not JUST rehashing their strategies if at all possible. Correct strategy was definitely Dynamic Punch over Headbutt, it 2HK0s th Snorlax.
@@GSCPokemonChallenges yeah I can understand wanting to keep your content more original by not just copying them. They tend to go for consistency strategies for repeatable runs and you try to push the boundaries of what is possible with good luck. I’m just not sure how many Pokémon can manage what mewtwo did. Gsc are tough games for single Pokémon runs and especially so for minimum battles. Very few Pokémon don’t run into a hard wall at at least one gym leader/Karen.
Came here just to talk about the Rocket hideout part but looks like a million other people already did. Good video.
And as for hidden power, didnt you mention for your gen 2 min battles series that youll be banning boring/broken TMs that everything can learn anyways? Hope youre sticking to that because otherwise hidden power will defeat the purpose of it since you could just shore up every pokemon's main weakness. Curse is lame too (other than Slowpoke line that gets it by level up) and Im honestly kinda hoping you ban return too its just so OP
I am seriously considering the broken TMs thing in Gen 2. I would definitely agree that Hidden Power manipulation is banned, because adding a 70 power coverage move of any type you want is just terrible. Curse is at least only available late in Kanto, but I don't think I want to go overboard there too (as usual, I never ban if it's a level up moves though). Return could be a tricky one... It is basically the best Normal-type TM in the game, so for normal.types banning it completely could wreck their chances.... but on the other hand it is centralizing as hell....
@@GSCPokemonChallenges yeah true thats a good point about return, maybe you're right.
Curse is a tough one though, would just hate to see all the battles turn into a curse/rest festival lol. If a pokemon cant win without curse/rest I'd rather just see it eliminated than keep advancing thru.
Cheers man!
I know I have been commenting a lot on your stuff recently, but I thought of a gen 2 equivalent to what you do with super minimum battles. I call it "minimum experience". If you lose to the rival, and then immediately trade in an HM pokemon (I think all it technically needs to know is surf to skip battles, but I traded over 2 that know everything together) and it is holding an exp share, then you can skip the Kimono girls and your pokemon throughout the run will only gain half the experience it normally would (or less due to rounding). I am trying that run with Lugia right now and Whitney was insane because I was only level 13 with no other battles I could do (including those 2 basement battles that are required later for the team rocket radio section). I think without TMs and possibly manipulating DVs for hidden power, it may not be possible for Lugia, but now that I just got my 4th badge the map opens up a ton which gives me a lot better options.
Sounds absolutely brutal 😂 I was testing Lugia before and that Rollout on Whitney was no joke.. And that was normal play but with 0 DVs
@GSCPokemonChallenges Yeah I had to spam mud slap to get her to -6 and get a lot of misses for me to win.
@GSCPokemonChallenges Wanted to update you in the minimum exp run. I made it to Red, but he isn't even remotely possible to beat. After using all the rare candies (I had to use 6 in Jhoto to beat Jasmine without surf, and the other 4 in Kanto before Red) I only reached level 50. I had hidden power ground which was basically necessary for the magnamites before getting earthquake in victory road. Anyway, a fun run even though I couldn't finish Red.
Yeah, I highliy doubt many Pokemon will beat Red on minimum battles/ minimum EXP. The level jump is just WAY too big
That's cool, finally the complete runs are starting.^^
It's been a while since I played Gen 2 but I think before the league you can talk to a guy who has an abra to teleport you home or something like that. Because you couldn't fly back to Johto.
But maybe I'm confusing it with the remakes or something like that
I will double check it, but that makes sense. Proves what a new I am at GSC
I think Mewtwo would have had an easier time in Kanto if you had given it Psychic from the TM. Any plans of possibly revisiting Mewtwo in the future? TM is in the same spot as it is in RYB
Absolutely. I will be redoing this run on the future. It was a first attempt and just really to validate whether or not Minimum Battles through Red is possible/reasonable. Even with mistakes and lack of good TMs, we found that in many cases, it's possible to progress, but I do think fewer Pokemon complete Kanto on Minimum Battles.
Is there a full video not edited for this run? I'd like to see the full process for the first official GSC run.
I will put it together and upload it. As mentioned, my PC hard drive got full around the Karen fight, and I deleted enough other footage to continue, but I need to clear space to render the two halves together. Also, lots of mistakes and silent sections of me searching up information, since it was my first time doing minimum battles in many sections. Overall it was approx 4 hours of real-time, with likely half of that due to routing mistakes, research, etc.
I am curious why you keep iron tail for so long, it never seems like the right move on the set, unless I missed something in testing.
No good reason. I didn't pre-plan the route, just finding it as I went along. The move was mostly useless, so I wouldn't learn it again when I "optimize" this in the future
The Quick Claw is found in the National Park by talking to an NPC.
Yep, I used it in the CurseLax Run a lot!
I’m doing a crystal run currently- so excited to see this!!
Leaving a comment because I believe in your content.
Thank you!!! What run are you doing? I'd love to hear how it goes!
Can you use gamehook to modify the spinners’ behavior? Either to make them face a fixed direction, or make them intentional talk-to battles? I foresee this saving a lot of time on unnecessary resets and allow your point system to work. Either that, or using a 1X speed toggle while crossing your fingers?
It seems sometimes they stop periodically. There's k way I know of to manipulate them with Gamehook, so I just need to learn to route around them
Just got my first suggested video for this channel! Didn’t even know you’d started it up. Great work, Teo! I wanna see how your various Karps destroy or get destroyed in gen 2 :) Take care!
Awesome! Thank you!
If you are talking really minimum EXP route you should do the lake of rage stuff as soon as possible, because you can trade in the red scale for an exp-share at mr. pokemon (i know, a lot of backtracking) slapping this on any other pokemon would half the exp your main gets after each battle
Also talking to the PC in the rocket section removes 2 battles and not only one (the scientist and the standing rocket cancel out but the statue gives you 2 trainerbattles you can otherwise skip
For sure. This was something I didn't know. I tried talking to the Scientist to see if he would stop battles, but the PC is key.
Could a challenge that aims at "true" minimal exp (rather than minimal battles) be possible ? Like, you'd have 5 extra mons in your team with exp shares to drain the exp away, so the main mon would gain only 1/6th of exp at all time.
I guess you'd probably need a mewtwo with some illegal moves to make any form of strategy viable. Either that or a super gimmicky mon, like shuckle with toxik stall strats, or a ditto to copy most of the ennemy's stats.
I think you're on the right track. It would have to be a Mon that could beat the E4 with a strategy that works even massively under-levelled
Love this second channel🥳
Yay! Thank you!
I think instead of teaching shadow ball over thunder punch, keep all the elemental punches. With Will, you can use the elemental punches against his team, and use thunder punch for Karen’s Houndoom and Lance’s Dragonite.
I think Dynamic Punch would have helped o Karens Houndoom and definitely should have just kept the elemental punches outside of that
I would actually say buy more than 1 set of all the Elemental Punches. If money is short come back before the league since only then it really matters.
btw when doing mininum battles like... at the start how do you even know what the minimumbattles is? like do you just kinda go in blind and just try to skip everything you can or is thee like some charts or whatever to reference? i kinda want to experiment doing a solo minimum battles thing in DP
So I rewatched Jrose's Gold Version Minimum Battles as a primer, but as he mentions many trainers have different locations in Crystal So from there it is a lot of trial and error at first. I save before any section where I am unsure, try every possible route I can think of, and then reset to take the route with the fewest battles. That's why this first attempt took around 4 hours real-time, but well over half of that was just testing and checking routes
Even on a non minimum battle playthrough, I battle the scientist then go to the Switch to turn everything off.
Didn't know that. In my defense, when I watched Jrose's minimum battles Gold as a pre-game, he cut that part out entirely and never mentioned the switch
You probably needed to rebuy thunder punch for Red.
Yeah, I thought about that. Er and Red I could have prepared better
Hey I was wanting to start my own channel and wanted to know what you use to record your videos. I know everyone uses an emulator and I already have that just wanted to know the best way to record. Thanks!
I use OBS, which there are tons of tutorials for, but basically just open the emulator, then make a Window Capture source in OBS and you're pretty much good to go. Everything from there is just backgrounds, overlays, etc, but not too hard to just start recording gameplay and voice
@@GSCPokemonChallenges thanks man appreciate the advice!
i wish i knew about this before i just found this channel
Welcome to GSC!
If you're allowing trades then the Kimono girls can be skipped.
Just trade over a Pokemon that already knows Surf.
Edit: Not sure if you want to do that though since minimum battles RBY typically does route 24/25 and SS Anne rival even though you can skip them via the same method.
If trades are allowed might as well trade it and teach it TMs, use vitamins, and give it a leftovers...
he does it on rby pc where he calls it super min battles
@@salamipitza Oh now I remember - that's where I got the idea from. Lol I just tried to advise the guy to do the thing he told me about!
So I wasn't really aiming for sequence breaks here. The issue is simply that I don't know the route through the dark sections well enough to stumble through them... yet
Im ready for gen 3 next
I plan to add a Gen 3 and Gen 4 channel if I can get to the point of doing RUclips full time. It's still a little ways s off, but hopefully someday!
Spoilers for the Faulkner minimum battles videos! But really, 1 down 250 to go for the full run journey!
Seriously. I wanted to put something out to at least make the point that we certainly won't reach the end with nothing beating Red. It's not going to be easy, but the best Pokemon will separate themselves and reach the mountaintop
@@GSCPokemonChallenges I am mostly curious if any will fall over in the Kanto region pre-Blue/Red. I can see road blocks in most other areas showing up.
I mean, the reputation of the Kanto trainers other than Blue and Red are as mere cannon fodder to gear up for the real trainers 😂
Weird issue with gamehook, thunderpunch has power/accuracy of N/A
I just fixed this in Yellow, but Crystal uses a separate file. It's a naming mismatch between PokeAPI and GameHook
@@GSCPokemonChallenges AHH, ok. Sorry for pointing out all the random errors. Great run all the same man :)
54:21 magnemites steel typing didnt show up properly on your display. I cant code, so i dont know why. Looks more like a visual error than anything else
Yeah, I know the source of the error. I didn't have the PNG for the Steel and Dark types in the correct folder
Lol Whitney's Clefairy was the real boss this time
Yeah,sometimes that Clefairy is OP. Random, but definitely lucky
Anyway nice run
Oh wow I didnt even know this channel exists
Spliff, you might say that it is so perfectly balanced that it would destroy RUclips islf it were ever known lol
Dynamicpunch the snorlax at end
I did change to that strategy, but I didn't save after I learned it. I ended up getting through without it, but Dynamic Punch is a 2HKO there
crazy that you know gen 1 inside out but used shadow ball on umbreon XD
Yeah, that was a fail
Lmao, he’s not minimum battles, while being the key to minimum battles 😂
You can talk to the man with the Abra inside the League building to be teleported back to Newbark Town. I think this is only available until you have beaten the E4 the first time.
Got it, that makes sense
Yes
You probably did not need to teach mewtwo Shadow ball at Will in the elite four. This is since will pokemon are all weak to the elemently punches. Save thunder punch for Karen.
For sure. I will mess with it more in future runs
You probably could have killed the gyrados for the XP if you wanted with x4 thunderpunch
Yeah, this was specifically to reduce XP that I caught it instead
Is there a pokemon game mewtwo CAN'T beat with minimum battles I wonder. Black/White maybe, with ghetsis' hydreigon.
I actually did a run with Mewtwo in Black/White, and that fight wasn't easy, but I got through it with the Focus Blast tm, which I was able to get after I got the Surf hm. Unfortunately, I couldn't access it before Clay's gym, which made the Excadrill tough, but doable. I haven't done the second round of the Elite Four yet, but they should be doable, especially as I haven't used any rare candies yet. The part that sucks the most is that you don't get access to Psychic until the post-game, my best Psychic move for most of the game was Confusion, which was weaker than Shadow Ball, even with the STAB bonus, so that became my best move once I got it.
The first fight with N was also annoying but doable, as I had to get his Purrloin to use Struggle through disabling Scratch, as I had no no psychic type attacking moves.
Depending on how you define minimum battles, he can't do Gen 3. Poochyena in the very first non rival trainer battle makes Mewtwo use up PP first so it can struggle through the battle. So by this channels rules Mewtwo can do it as long as it doesn't knock anything out while draining PP. By Jrose rules, Mewtwo fails.
Pretty much after that the rest of the entire game is easy though.
Yeah, I talked to Razador about exactly this situation.
I just checked, and Emerald is impossible because the first Youngster has a Poochyena, and R/S are impossible, because while you can lose to the Poochyena attacking Birch, and the first Youngster has a Zigzagoon, the Aqua or Magma grunt in the Petalburg Woods has a Poochyena. I guess it comes down to whether or not Struggle strats on wild Pokemon are viewed as legit or not.@@peacocca190
if you want go away from the league, you have to speak to the old man with abra standing near the nurse Joey. He teleport away, i don't remember where :D ( i think your house)
Got it. I went in with a less than ideal setup, would have liked to have extra TMs from Goldenrod and perhaps from the Game Corner
What about buying abra for fast teleport?
Yeah, didn't do it here because I didn't know the route well enough to even know when to teleport, but in theory we could save a lot of time
5 hundred 69!!!
Perfect
4:51 I checked and in the japanese version he's actually called shota
For sure, more commenting that "Abe" would be pronounced as "Ah-bae" in Japanese. I actually work with a lady named Abe here in Japan 😂
How’s he level up to 55 against Surge and Blue? Something fishy here. 😂
Also curious why you’d use physical attacks when Mewtwo’s special is so much higher. And what real point did iron tail even serve? 😂
Iron Tail was useless. I thought it could be useful if I could get defense boosts and hit some strong opps. The elemental punches were the way to go
You can just run from the gyarados if you want btw
I thought you couldn't, you'd still need to fight it?
it's just like sudowoodu
My understanding is if you run, the game doesn't progress. That may have been an error. Either way, I caught it so no EXP gain
also you said KAY like 100 times in the final battle it is really infuriating me.... sorry to once again bring it up but it would be amazing if you stopped that
Jesus your mic audio improved drastically
Yeah, I needed the upgrade desperately