Not only are LG still updating the CX range, they're still updating the B7/C7 range too. My B7 got a new software update the other week, nothing immediately noticeable changed but nice to know the support is still there.
Those are security patches. Now LG is even giving OS Upgrades for Alpha 7 & 9 2022 and 2023 Models‚ and all models from 2024 for up to 5 yrs. So the new shiny TV from LG will not gonna die on the OS that came with‚ this way it will fell a little refreshed every year.
How is the S90C in SDR? I saw it next to the X90L and it looked nice until a bright image and popped and the X90L went to 600+ nits while the S90C dropped to 200-300.
@@techsamurai11 It's good in SDR. Admittedly I'm in a dark room so I can't speak for how it looks in a living room but it gets plenty bright enough for me. With the Peak Brightness set to high it peaks at 500nits in a 25% window & 200nits Fullscreen. Bear in mind that it's rare that more than a quarter of the screen will be filled with bright highlights and if it was you wouldn't want 500nits blinding you across the Fullscreen anyway. So with the Peak Brightness setting enabled the majority of the image will have identical brightness to HDR just without those super-bright peak highlights. Setting SDR to crazy levels is silly anyway as your eyes will mostly just adjust anyway and you'll encounter far more banding artefacts. In my opinion the far better contrast & shadows of Oled is far more important, after all you can always close the curtains to light control, but you can't fix blooming. And remember it wasn't that long ago we were watching Plasmas that were sub-100nits and LCD's struggled to hit 300 and no one had an issue then, so any high-end TV will have no problem with SDR brightness. And for the best image quality we should be disabling peak brightness adjustments and setting the TV to 100nits for reference quality, it's what I do for 1080p Blu-Rays anyway.
@@techsamurai11yeah I have the same issue with OLEDs, I need that sustained brightness, but some people don't, so it depends on what kind of person you are A Sony E generation display is extremely old by today's standards so the difference would be even bigger against a modern LCD
@@techsamurai11I have the s90c 77” so the slighter brighter panel variant. Granted my apartment does not get direct sunlight but LOWERING brightness never crossed my mind in the past as it does now. Used to have a 55”Vizio 4K P series c1 locally dimmed tv from 2015. Brightness detail in a dark scene was my issue, something locally dimmed high end tvs struggled with until recently. I knew my next tv was going to OLED. Something people can’t explain to you well is how upsizing from 55” to 77” affects your brightness tolerances. I do not turn on my lights in the living room anymore after dusk because this panel simply throws so much more light everywhere due to its sheer size. The ABL is a non issue and frankly helps my eyes from squinting even more. I can’t speak for very bright rooms but anyone who wants the best viewing experience anyway should avoid placing a nice tv in direct sunlight or very bright room. .
2000 nits highlights on a 10/20% window as he said. It maxes out at around 800 nits full brightness, still quite bright sure. But I guess it depends on your environment. If you are in a dark room it'll most likely hurt your eyes but if you're in a well lit room (like me) this level of brightness isn't much of a deal.
Because you are sitting in a dark room looking at a screen... Believe it or not during overcast day the whole environment is in like 8.000 - 10.000 nit in brightness. It goes heck a lot brighter with sunny day. But that's just it. In sunny and overcast everything is dynamically radiating light. Meaning you are not focused only on say 9000 nit bright object but there's 5000 nit 10 000 nit bright 2 000 nit bright and eyes aren't just overwhelmed by a single bright spot. And really in order to get the full out of HDR10 we need displays that can do 10 000 nit brightness.
@@sermerlin1 I'm sure the difference really just comes down to Oliver wants all of the perks of HDR without sitting in a dark room. My original comment was tongue in cheek, it's not something I'd be mad at Oliver about of course.
You really don't need higher nits if your in a dark room. I have a Hisense R6 the nits aren't in the 1,000, however if you gets good blinds and covers for your windows you can get pure dark and perfect picture quality. If I ever do upgrade I am probably getting a Mini-LED TV like the Hisense U7K as I see no reason for OLED
the 2000 is only for hdr peak brightness holy moly cant believe people are still this clueless about this stuff, hdr has been out for like 10 years now.
Also, John, that VRR judder bug you're talking about is something RTings picked up in their review as well. They go into it a bit in their YT video on the G4
The brightness fluctuations? Ik surprised people didn't know this, it's common on oleds how it's implemented. Also why you didn't see gsync support on laptop oleds and such.
I still can't believe replaced the CX. The fact that only it and the c1are capable of doing bfi at 120 hz alone is reason enough for holfing onto it and not upgrading
I’m have an LG OLED CS, it looks breathtaking, though like John I play in darkened room so the decreased brightness is not noticeable but those true black and Dolby vision is glorious
I've been waiting a long time for the right moment to upgrade, and I just got an LG C3 (on liquidation sale; they are phasing this model out) and I absolutely love it. HDMI 2.1 on all inputs, 120 Hz VRR, DolbyVision, and very very bright highlights(more than bright enough for me). I feel like it hits a sweetspot and thus right now is a great time to upgrade.
I bought a S95B QD-OLED about 18 months ago and I honestly cannot recommend QD-OLED enough. The colour and brightness is honestly unreal. You don’t get Dolby Vision but I can honestly live without it and the dimming can be aggressive but it’s easy to safely override.
QD OLED is basically CRT color quality. It blows WOLED out of the water for warm colors like yellows and reds. I still prefer AMOLED and microLED. No quantum dot gimmicks and similar stuff.
His old one was a 2020 model, it's not that short a period for an enthusiast considering there have been tangible developments on the OLED front since then.
I don't know, I have an AW2725DF (QD-OLED) and a Hisense U8K (Mini LED). For HDR, I'd say the Hisense delivers a considerably better experience in most real world scenarios thanks to the much higher brightness. In real content, the benefit of the pixel level dimming is rarely visible (even scenes with extremely small bright highlights like a starry night sky look amazing on the Mini LED), while the drawbacks of OLED are quite often visible (every scene with a high APL doesn't look like HDR at all, basically). Many games, shows and movies have a lot more bright scenes than dark ones. I just finished Senua's Saga switching between the TV and the monitor, and I preferred the TV for basically any scene in the game, even the dark cave with the very small lights looked absolutely phenomenal, thanks to the local dimming (ruclips.net/video/05zNatvdUVo/видео.html if you don't know what I'm talking about). Alan Wake 2 is a very similar story, even given it's very dark presentation. Local dimming works well enough to produce nearly the same deep blacks while still having much brighter highlights. The Hisense can do roughly 1700-1800 nits vs a maximum of 1000 nits on the Alienware for very small highlights. In an actual scene from the game, you're much more likely to end up with 400-500 nits in highlights. Don't get me wrong though, they're both absolutely amazing displays and the pixel response times and colors on the OLED are just mind blowing for fast paced games. Still, I often end up being disappointed by the HDR on the Alienware given it's low brightness output after being used to nearly 2000 nits brightness (I use both in daylight and at night, btw).
I still hanging on to my beloved 2016 LG 55C6P OLED with passive 3D, very very minor burn in right bottom corner gas/ brake gauges from hundreds of hours running Asetto Corsa on it. This thing in great condition may clocking up to 3-4K usd on abay
@@BigBoss7777777 it's rare model, supply/ demand thing. Well thought after by 3d enthusiasts. 3d content looks very good on it, it has very nice, slight curvature too. Plenty of brightness for my eyes, I kept at mid 60 in settings for movies and games, not sure why this obsession to sky high nits
@@BigBoss7777777 it's rare model, curved passive 3d, well thought after by enthusiasts. Watched Gravity, Judge Dredd, played Trine 2, Ico. HDR and 3d content looks great on it, I don't really understand all this brightness/ nits fuss, barely kept mine at 60%
I prefer 30fps content in LCD instead of OLED. With my Sony A95K, 30fps content hurts my eyes from the stuttering. I use my X900F for my PS3 & 4 content as a result. They truly are different panel types for different use cases.
You make zero sense. There are plenty of LCD TV's nowadays that have a fast enough pixel response time which causes judder during slow 24fps/30fps content. The problem is NOT exclusive to OLED displays.
Game motion plus on Samsung displays helps with games. With movies and tv shows you’re stuck with motion smoothing which many people don’t like. But as others have said, any decent lcd will have largely the same problem
Same here, just wish I could have gotten the 75 inch. The 65 inch was on sale and with Amazon 0% 5-month payment plan made it so easy to afford when the 75 inch was full price and no payment plan, so there were no other choice but to get the 65 inch.
for sure consider modding it into an s95c through the service manual. its an insanely simple tweak to unlock more brightness at no extra risk. its using an s95c panel already good choice btw
What matters is if you can say the same 5 years from now. If a tv can’t hold quality for at LEAST 5 years, it’s not worth having at all. Honestly a tv should last at least 10 years
Team John here, the G4 is very easily bright enough if you have any interest in accuracy, it does 320 nits fullscreen in SDR and 220 nits in HDR. You just flip on HGiG like John said and it displays basically everything exactly at its intended brightness except for the 1% of brightest colors you'll only encounter in well-graded and generally bright HDR movies. Combining that with 144 Hz and OLED's motion clarity + all the controls for optimizing the deficiencies of certain content/games there's just no reason to go with anything other unless you like to leave CNN running 24/7 🤣
I have the Sony Bravia XR 77" A95L OLED UHD Smart TV Master Series for the living room, which I also game on PS5. I also have the mid range Sony Bravia XR 65" A80L OLED UHD Smart TV for the bedroom. Mid range is such an understatement.
i have not had good luck with samsung displays, especially their tvs. some really weird issues that i never could effectively troubleshoot. lg and sony have been great for me, though. i selfishly wish oliver would have given the lg oleds a shot, but a good mini led panel should still be awesome!
I love my Samsung QN90B NeoQLED. It may not be OLED, but the blacks are incredible, and the HDR is overwhelmingly bright (for me). Couple years old now, but I still highly recommend it if anyone's looking for an alternative to OLED and have a bright room.
@makoto5280Nah, 90% of people will be perfectly happy with that sort of TV. My parents are still happy with a crappy edge lit lg from 2016. Most people can't tell the difference or just don't care.
@makoto5280 Samsung's TV's are still excellent, just not as accurate. They're the best for people who want flashy, colourful/saturated visuals. That said, I do prefer natural colours and Sony's high-end is pretty much unmatched when it comes to this. My brother and mother both have an OLED (LG C3 an Sony A85K) and my much older ZF9 LED has more accurate colours than both (maybe not with pro measuring tools, but HDR nature on it looks far more lifelike than it does on their TVs. Though if I have to be honest, I feel like OLED actually makes lifelike images look a bit fake for some reason).
I got a Samsung qn90c on sale. I thought it was a no brainer pick. Wife is blind as fuck too so she needs high contrast to see well. Also using it for computer gaming. Cant risk getting an Oled and someone forgets to close the TV. I got a big sectional sofa, and tv angle are spectacular so thats actually important.
I recently upgraded to a TCL c845k 75", and I have to be honest I was amazed with the colour vibrancy and how bright it can go in HDR content with minimal blooming. No dirty screen effect either, so I was really lucky.
My C2 spoiled me. The picture is something I haven't experienced before on any LCD, and I can't imagine going back to it. Also I'm one of those people that has a problem with very bright lights. I start squinting like crazy, so I don't need my TV to be any more bright than it currently is.
I have both tech and LCD is just better overall, I do prefer the way the light is emitted from the panel, it's more vibrant and I do appreciate that there is no need of screen saver on LCD when you leave the device for a few minutes.
Mini led imo has a lot of potential for casual content viewing and gaming. If we get much higher number of zones with better algorithms and response time, I could see myself preferring them over current oleds. However dual layer oleds are also a thing now
I get just over 1500 nits out of my Samsung 55S95B OLED and it’s to bright for my fairly dark room so I lower the brightness down a good amount. It’s such an amazing tv and I only payed $1000 for it used last year. I have no reason to upgrade at this time because I know it can go toe to toe with any tv on the market including the dimmer Sony A95L that most consider the best tv currently on the market
If you got the money then sure why not but I have a 65 A80J and a 77 A80L which combined costs as much as John's one 77 G4. I just don't get the jump in cost for the returns 🤷♂️ I'd imagine if I had that DF money though... 😂
That thumbnail picture literally depicts OLED users and fald/mini LED LCD users. :D One is overly judgy and elitist the other is just happy it's all so shinny and good. :D
You sure you aren’t confusing ASBL with ABL? 2 very different things and people seem to get them confused. ASBL can be turned off on some TVs by accessing service menus. Not sure how many. ABL can usually not be adjusted as far as I’ve heard. Unless there is a tv that allows you to. ABL usually is just about how aggressive the OLED does it. ASBL is another issue and it’s nice when you can change it.
@@Ray-dl5mplogically I think you're right. ABL is a feature to prevent over draw and heat. If you managed to turn that of fuses would likely blow in the TV.
I have an LG OLED B7 65 and now have a Hisense U8N 65 sitting right next to each other and they both have a fantastic picture. The OLEDs viewing angle takes it for me, as the U8N washes out considerably unless you're directly in front of it. Even slightly off to the side looks grey. Sucks really, as the Hisense has the better-looking and WAY brighter picture when viewed directly. But I have a very bright room and need a brighter TV. Just one that can displays some color!
My Samsung 90A broke, very similar to the 90B. Lcd died completely. First Samsung TV to die and only had it 2yrs with occasional use. My other Samsungs are 8 and 6yrs old. No issues. The 90A started hating strang issues like not turning on smoothibg or black frame. Rediculously disappointed. Best Buy have 77in LG G3 on clearance with stand. So that happened.
my biggest issue with mini led is still that dimming small bright elements to keep blooming to minimum and keep blacks black... its a literal reverse of OLED in that i wish we could have have OLED in dark scenes and LED in bright scenes 😂
1:56 and as a projector person it could instantly blind me, 16:00 nothing new for LG, I've got a 2012 LED LG projector that will run at native 120hz no problem even though it isnt meant to support it anywhere on the specs, perks of DLP tech, and pixel shifters take it to a whole new level
Purchased the original LG OLED (55-inch curved 1080p if anyone remembers) for a cool $3799 9 years ago and it lasted me all the way up until two years ago. Replaced it with a C1 in '22 for less than half the price. I'll never buy anything else.
Have been using LG OLED TVs for past 7 years, latest being C3 Evo, next I am thinking it will be G5. For me movie content matters more on the TVs, thus blacker the better. For gaming, I am waiting when 32" OLED will be acceptable for my budget, for now I am on VA 4K panel from MSI (it's ok), before I was on LG 1440p 27" IPS.
@@someshwarrao42 More like every 3 years, prior to C3 it was CX, and before that B7. Yeh, maybe I'll wait till 2026 at least this time, not that big, noticeable, changes. What I really want is 32"-34" OLED monitor with at least 144Hz at an acceptable price.
I really wanted an OLED for my next TV and ended up having to prematurely buy a new TV before I could save up. Ended up getting a really nice LCD with IPS panels and I'm pleasantly surprised with the quality. I came from an 8-year-old 4K TV with terrible viewing angles, old hdr and 60 hz. This one was 144 hz, HDR10, atmos support and all these extra bells and whistles that really improved my gaming experience. I do miss the crushing blacks I would have had on the OLED as there is a little bit of wash out but this comes very close and for the price I paid it's not bad. The viewing angles are great and the broght ness is nice. I'm with Oliver on that one. LCD technology has definitely come a very long way
I'm looking at the Samsung S95D due to the matte screen. We don't have a dedicated movie room (that you can make completely dark) so with windows and other sources of light permeating our viewing room the matte screen that we have had since 2009 is about 60% less distracting. I think the S95D is the first OLED with matte (although some random guy on the internet told me some other OLED had matte too).
I am returning S95D. if you want a bright room OLED, G4 is much better imo. The raised blacks, especially on S95D, cause the shadow details to fade away. I also had gaming issues with S95D along with audio dropouts. Also, based on HDTV TEST video, samsung oleds raise micro shadows, which makes faces look flat and without detail.
@@kasramoghaddam1389 You can't tweak the user settings or the service menu settings to correct those issues? My TV is ancient (2009) but the default settings on it were poor, and not even the user settings could really fix it. I had to go into the Service Menu using the secret remote code to properly correct the screen (which has looked excellent, for what it is, for 15 years). I just can't see getting a shiny glossy screen and then having to stare at my wife's endtable lamp in all its detail or get a good look at the backyard windows for the next decade.
@@turrican4d599 How so??? That directly contradicts all the experiences I've had. My sister in law's house has windows and a glossy screen and it's a disaster to try to watch anything.
I do think mini LED or micro LED are good shouts these days. Many panels offer 120hz or above and the black levels and contrast can be very competitive with OLED while keeping the brightness high and the price lower. Its good to have the choice though depending on your needs and budget!
Went from a Neo QLED to a QD OLED and the difference is night and day. QD OLED is brighter in anything that isnt Full Field, QLED was unbeatable in Full Field. Overall picture quality, colors, motion, gaming, are immensely better on the QD OLED. Dont really miss my QLED at all, i really thought the brightness would be a bigger issue
It’s interesting to hear Oliver’s comments about Samsung’s S95D, and is exactly what’s keeping me from upgrading. I’m leaning towards the LG G4 or Sony A95L though both TVs seem to have some software issues as of their own-no TV is perfect. They should release these high-end TVs every two years and make sure they’re at their optimal performance level. Modern OLEDs offer more flexibility than LED LCDs in terms of dark room/bright room performance, and HDR displays work better in light-controlled environments.
As far as I'm aware both the PS5 and XSX have 48 Gbps bandwidth on their HDMI interfaces, and even Techradar states this to be the case. The PS5 did initially launch with only 32 Gbps bandwidth but got a firmware update later on to fix that, and I'm pretty sure the XSX always had 48 Gbps bandwidth.
Pretty sure you and techradar are wrong. Nothing on the internet about a firmware update increasing the ps5 hdmi bandwidth either. It should be easy to test if you have a ps5 and the right tv. And the series x is definitely capped at 40 gbps (I own one and an lg cx and the lg cx will tell you what hdmi bandwidth a signal is using).
I love my CX apart from Apps often crash (looking at you Disney+) so it’s better to use something like an AppleTV but then you get the HDMI input “gremlins”
Still love my LG C9. It’s perfect except for the VRR which I just disabled. Everything just looks so good on an OLED. Brightness is plenty bright for me as well.
Surprised John didn’t mention the superior latency of OLEDs. I’d actually probably go with QLED/LCD over OLED if they had equal response times, because while the inky blacks of OLED are impressive, sometimes, maybe only in SDR content, images look too dark and detail is lost. (Crushed blacks.) But then again I don’t own a fancy modern TV, so just judging by what I see at Best Buy, and what I see/read online.
I recently bought a 42" C3 to try as a monitor. I ended up returning it because I just can't get along with that size, but even if I had liked the size, there's no way I could have lived with the aggressive ABL on it. If even half the screen was full white the brightness would be cut down significantly. I also have a Sony A80L OLED tv and don't notice the ABL on it at all which is strange.
I share Olivers preference on OLED vs LCD, I’ve tried multiple OLEDS over the years and even with the new QD-OLEDs I wanted more brightness in certain scenes lol. Sure they look great with the infinite contrast but I’d rather not spend over $1K on something and say to myself “I wish it was brighter”
They don't have infinite contrast. They don't even have better contrast. They only have a better contrast ratio, not a better contrast. Contrast is the difference between the lowest and the highest and LED simply destroys OLED when it comes to this. That's not to say that OLEDs contrast ratio doesn't mean anything, it most certainly makes for a striking image, but it's not the same as contrast.
So true, I have experienced true HDR gaming experience in the last year with my Hisense U8H (2022) which is a MiniLED QLed TV with 1500nits and really good black levels (not OLED levels) and I have replayed many games with HDR support on my PS5 and it is a game changer! Horizon Zero Down and Forbidden West are just breathtaking every time I see a machine with many luminance highlights on it, I am playing AC Odyssey and it's another game with impressive HDR Highlights, Cyberpunk 2077 a reference except for the black levels and old games with HDR looks way better than SDR or on normal QLED or LED screens with around 500 - 800 nits. I found that between 850 - 1000 nits is my sweet post for HDR at least for my room and especially for my eyes... more than 1000nits in speculate highlights is just too much even in bright rooms. I forget to mention that Injustice 2 using HDR is another example of good HDR, the game is from 2017 with regular graphics at this point but with HDR is awesome ❤.
@@mrbobo86 Most OLEDs tend to have major problems with prolonged brightness levels. If the overal image is bright for more than a few (such as a bright movie), OLEDs tend to dim the overal image to make the pixels burn out slower. Main issue is that most OLEDs also do not allow their users to turn it off. They could give people that options, but ah... then a lot more people would probably complain about burn in even if it's their own fault. So it's sorta something they do to protect themselves and to protect against consumer stupidity. Of course I'm not sure if that's what causes it for you. Could be something else, but it is a fairly common OLED issue that hardly anyone brings up in the discussion of LCD vs OLED. I think both have their advantages and disadvantages, but I don't think OLED will be able to solve its issues before LED-based tech pretty much annuls its advantages. It's why several companies have actually started to slowly move away from OLED TV's.
Funnily this conversation hits close to home with me. I've got a S90C (Modded) and had the QN900D. OLED is an easy winner in terms of picture quality, but the QLED TV's are brighter and can pack a bunch if you go with the higher end models. But you definitely don't get what you pay for with the flagship models. Olie Mack needed to mod the oled to get what he wanted, turn off ABL as an example :) some of us could have helped him out with this issue and also should have gone with a S90/92C for ultimate price/performance with the one connect issues :)
I do agree OLEDs are incredible but be prepared to experience burn-in eventually, especially if you use it with static elements, such as gaming and general OS tasks. My C9 is connected to my pc but I only use it for watching youtube and movies in fullscreen. After 4 years I have mild desktop and taskbar icons burn-in. To be fair this could've been prevented if I hid the taskbar and the desktop icons. Also, I use it in a dark environment so I never went above 60 brightness. Big reviewers often make it sound burn-in is no longer an issue but unfortunately it still is. Having seen this, if longevity is a concern, I would never buy an OLED for desktop use.
It will eventually, but as long as you don’t have a static image constantly showing on your TV, you won’t have to worry about it for a while. Like in your situation, if you hid your icons and taskbar, then your TV wouldn’t have experienced burn-in. I’d say OLED is well worth it if you can get a 5-7 years or more of a great viewing experience.
Samsung reduces the quality of the local dimming in game mode, and if local dimming is not very good but it is even worse in game mode, a Sony x95L would have been better, or bravía 7/9 or the new tcl c855/x955
PSA: G3 price right now is amazing, it's around half of G4 (depending where you live I suppose). And you get 99% of same features and screen as G4. The only major difference is 144Hz vs 120Hz. Other than that, panel, brightness etc etc is pretty much identical.
In your opinion, if buying a new tv and your interests are primarily watching fast paced sports NBA, NHL, NFL ... would u recommend Oled or save money and go with Qled .... led etc?
Have had a Panasonic fz950 since 2018. That blew me away back in 2018 but hanging for an upgrade as it didn’t have Dolby vision, hdr10+, or 120hz vrr. But I’m still happy with it. I’d imagine if I got a G4 my mind would be blown all over again. Can’t go back from oled
I upgradet from a LG C1 to a S90C for 980 Euro inc. Tax and ist a Banger bc. QOLED, dont get me wrong LG c1 WOLED was not bad, but no compare against a S90c with a QOLED Panle 2nd. Gen.
I went from a 55 oled CX to a 65 sony a95k and the difference was worth the upgrade. I think John would have liked the A95L a bit more than the G4 but the price for a 77" is ridiculous 😅
My QD-OLED monitor dishes out 1000 nits with HDR and if it's blindingly bright maybe trying a QD-OLED for that middle ground with brightness. If the monitor was any brighter I would need literal sunglasses to look at it.
It is because of ABL is the reason why I have not moved on to OLED. I'm guessing I could get used to playing in a darker room. But the ABL is a deal breaker.
There is a setting in the menu. The LG G4 does not really dim and if it does, it’s not noticeable. You’re definitely not getting any thermal throttle in the same way that you do with the Samsung oleds.
@@dslumberger I'm looking at the owners manual. What page? When I search for ABL I don't find anything. I found the pdf by searching for "lg g4 oled manual". Then downloaded LG OLED83G4WUA manual.
rockin the C2 brought last year. love it the only thing that pisses me off sometimes i get "no signal" when running my xbox and switching between things
As someone who is a massive OLED enjoyer and owns two LG OLEDs, an OLED Steam Deck, an OLED iPhone, and an OLED Apple Watch, it’s amazing to me how good modern IPS LCDs can now look even without mini-LED backlighting. The value of quality LCD panels is still there for the price, and I hope LCD never fully goes away. I just picked up a 2024 iPad Air for work and it has probably the best IPS LCD I’ve ever seen in terms of color and evenness. Is it as good as OLED today? No, but it is better than cheaper OLEDs in terms of color accuracy and consistency across the panel and at any brightness level. I’ll always prefer OLED for the absolute best experience, but using LCD no longer makes me want to vomit.
But alas we, all lcd tv owners of non Sony, must ignore the horrid and obvious dirty screen effect. It's sucks Hisense, Samsung, TCL etc have all got dirty screen effect. It's like buying a defective product and making up excuses for the purchase just so as to enjoy without regret. How pathetic is that?
@@Pandemonium088 I have a Sony 55 inch X90J and it is by far the cleanest LCD display I've ever owned. No DSE whatsoever. I'm thinking of upgrading to a 65 inch A95L OLED model this year, and I'm almost hesitant to do so because there is absolutely no uniformity issues in my current display.
I own a 55 inch LG CX & 65 inch LG C1 and let me tell you a QD-OLED is better than WOLED especially the 77 inch Samsung S90C QD-OLED and the colors are NEXT LEVEL PHENOMENAL however the LG G4 is an absolute BEAST!
I think it's mostly just placebo of people thinking it's bad. Just takes a tiny bit of getting used to it, that's all. Kinda similar how people just eat up that crap about blue light being damaging. There's no research out there that actually shows that the blue light from screens can cause harm (actually, the research that's there shows that it simply isn't the case). Blue light can cause harm to the eyes, but even a 10K nits TV wouldn't be able to deliver a level of harmful blue light.
Don't get why everyone is pushing for lg when other brand like Panasonic use the same LG panels with much more advanced electronics and better components
@@kristiangurholt59 Didn't know Panasonic wa not available in the US market; Is john living in the US? I thought he was living in EU like the other members.
I’m holding out for the Panasonic Z95A 65”. ❤❤❤ The film maker mode for gaming, combined with integer scale from 720p and 1080p and support for component and SCART, not to mention better handling of near black and better colour accuracy. The 77” doesn’t have MLA though like the 65” and 55”.
HDR game recommended settings! Start covering them... Not just with the new TVs but with ALL the TVs Digital Foundry team has. Yeah yeah gaming tech but he's only got 3 TVs So yeah might be a good opportunity to get probably hundreds of thousands of new viewers and followers!
Still great for watching 1080p blu-ray but it doesn't hold a candle to a new OLED watching a 4K-UHD blu-ray with HD. It's like going from a dvd on a tube TV 480p to your current TV and 1080p blu-ray.
@@randysalsman6992mmm I don’t know. Plasma has a picture you have to see. I just sold my gt60 Panasonic and have the Sony a95l qd. The Panasonic has a more organic stable picture dull compared to my a95l but the gt60 was amazing picture
I have an s90c and it’s plenty bright enough for me. I’m in a dark room. At this point it’s nearly impossible for me to go to LCD. Been using OLEDs for the past 10 years.
and yet johns oled will be brighter. Here is why: the local dimming zones have to always compromise between contrast and brightness, because they cant dimm independently within the zone. the more brightness you get the more washed out the picture looks (unless its pure white). Oled can use its full brighntess within every element of the scene. the per pixel contrast also gives the picture a crispness and three dimensionality lcd cant achieve. on top of that the local dimming performance on olivers panel is compromised in game mode further reducing contrast and brightness.
Yes!!! I had the exact same tearing issue with my S95D!! Called samsung technical support, and they blamed my PS5! Luckily, it was during the return window, so I switched with G4(not arrived yet).
Fan of oleds here. I've had s90c for a couple of months and I love this tv. Great blacks, amazing colours. I've been playing a lot of tekken 8. So far no burn in.
@@TheUAProdigy It works to an extent but there’s still either too much stutter or too much soap opera for me. I just hope one day we can move on from sample and hold display technology.
@@PogueSquadron I mean, have you tried Sony's implementation ?; it's honestly perfect. Also, once we get to micro led no-one knows if there will be unforeseen problems with it as well. Plus, I think OLED's will still be around.
This is very interesting conversation. I have an LG C1 as my laptop monitor, for my PS5 and Xbox series X. My living room TV is a Samsung ks8000 and I also use that for some consoles. It would be kind of hard for me to give up the brightness so I guess I can see both sides. I think my next living room TV is probably going to be at mini LED. Especially since my wife also uses it. If I ever upgrade my desk monitor I'll probably just get an OLED for that.
Oliemack should've bought the G4. Bright enough‚ no hassle. In HDR it washes the floor with the QN90D‚ as it doesn't have to fight with the local dimming algorithms. In fact‚ he should've bought Sony X95L if he wanted a MiniLED that could deliver bright AF SDR and very good HDR.
Got myself the Sony X95L mini LED in 65 inch. Best decision ever. My problem with OLED is, the reduced brightness and the inevitable degeneration of the colors plus burn-in, because it’s organic. It could achieve higher brightness, but manufacturers have reduced it and built in safety measures, which are supposed to prevent burn in. I just don’t like the idea of having to babysit my TV and knowing it will look worse.
@john Is it possible to have chroma 4:4:4, with BFI on and de-judder and de-bur working? And also have VRR working? I dont understand the limits of the settings on the tv.
The bandwidth of the graphics processor is a more limiting factor to having 444 full chroma bandwidth. The only thing you can't do with these sets is enable bfi and vrr simultaneously
I love my cx, but it's SUPER glitchy with my Series X. Netflix sometimes just goes black, or other video apps just stop playing. Games work fine, though.
Got a samsung q95t from 2020 in 75 inch and it still has the local dimming bug even after all the updates but it is a good tv in my eyes great picture..Ive been a samsung guy since decent 4k tv first arrived but im done with samsung and looking at a lg g4 83 inch know. I was worrying about burn in from the earlier models is why i didnt go oled earlier but it seems to be not an issue anymore. Samsung just do not care or fix there tvs through out updates and even go as low as nerfing the brightness out off them to try and solve there blooming issues if reported.. im hoping i notice a decent upgrade when getting the g4 then my q95t
Oliver, I experienced the same blackout issues with my S95C. Samsung replaced the entire TV with a new one, and it still drops out with my 3090 gaming PC. I've relegated it to console and Apple TV 4K playback in my bedroom. The S90C I replaced it with has been phenomenal!
TVs no longer have BFI 120Hz nowadays. It means that, for gaming, my LG C1 destroys everything you can buy these days sadly. I would love to upgrade and buy a LG G4 or a QD-Oled but I know for a fact that it would look like crap in motion compared to my LG C1 and it’s a shame. Thanks to greedy TV manufacturers who removed that feature.
I had the LG C1 and it gave me insomnia. I would turn the tv off and lay in bed with my heart racing and all wired till 2 in the morning. It was awful and wonder if it was BFI or some other motion processing in the LG. Went back to a 2009 1080p LCD and no problems. I also tried and LG Qned90 and it gave me bad headaches. Something about new tech that doesn't agree with me, which stinks because LG C1 was amazing!
But how many games do current consoles even have capable of 120Hz? Or how many people out there actually have PCs connected to TVs, especially in the living room? Imho, TVs that sit in the living room, connected to nothing but consoles, not having BFI 120Hz is probably not as big of a loss... On PC monitors though, I'd probably not buy a 144Hz+ monitors if it doesn't have BFI
Makes you wonder how he can afford such expensive tastes. I mean it just doesn't stop at TVs with him. Didn't realize video game journos got paid quite as much as he seems to. lol
That thumbnail makes John look like some kind of sentient A.I.
@@ReveriePasswe live in a simulation 😢
Not only are LG still updating the CX range, they're still updating the B7/C7 range too. My B7 got a new software update the other week, nothing immediately noticeable changed but nice to know the support is still there.
Those are security patches. Now LG is even giving OS Upgrades for Alpha 7 & 9 2022 and 2023 Models‚ and all models from 2024 for up to 5 yrs. So the new shiny TV from LG will not gonna die on the OS that came with‚ this way it will fell a little refreshed every year.
How? My B7 hasn't had an upgrade since 1992. lol. Seriously, what software are you running?
I dont even update my c9. I feel like lg is goingto break something and the tv works perfect now.
@@MirelRC my c9 from 2019 actually got a large update recently, completely new dashboard.
@@dirozx just the interface was changed.
The thumbnail makes it look like John needs a hug and Oliver is just laughing Maniacally
I'm glad you decided to keep the beard John. Looking so handsome
We did it, John is rocking a full beard. He leveled up.
Lmao
He finally grown up
I recently got a 65' S90C after having a 55' X900E, and there is absolutely a difference. Especially in terms of color and input lag.
How is the S90C in SDR? I saw it next to the X90L and it looked nice until a bright image and popped and the X90L went to 600+ nits while the S90C dropped to 200-300.
@@techsamurai11 It's good in SDR. Admittedly I'm in a dark room so I can't speak for how it looks in a living room but it gets plenty bright enough for me.
With the Peak Brightness set to high it peaks at 500nits in a 25% window & 200nits Fullscreen.
Bear in mind that it's rare that more than a quarter of the screen will be filled with bright highlights and if it was you wouldn't want 500nits blinding you across the Fullscreen anyway.
So with the Peak Brightness setting enabled the majority of the image will have identical brightness to HDR just without those super-bright peak highlights.
Setting SDR to crazy levels is silly anyway as your eyes will mostly just adjust anyway and you'll encounter far more banding artefacts.
In my opinion the far better contrast & shadows of Oled is far more important, after all you can always close the curtains to light control, but you can't fix blooming.
And remember it wasn't that long ago we were watching Plasmas that were sub-100nits and LCD's struggled to hit 300 and no one had an issue then, so any high-end TV will have no problem with SDR brightness.
And for the best image quality we should be disabling peak brightness adjustments and setting the TV to 100nits for reference quality, it's what I do for 1080p Blu-Rays anyway.
@@techsamurai11yeah I have the same issue with OLEDs, I need that sustained brightness, but some people don't, so it depends on what kind of person you are
A Sony E generation display is extremely old by today's standards so the difference would be even bigger against a modern LCD
@@techsamurai11I have the s90c 77” so the slighter brighter panel variant. Granted my apartment does not get direct sunlight but LOWERING brightness never crossed my mind in the past as it does now. Used to have a 55”Vizio 4K P series c1 locally dimmed tv from 2015. Brightness detail in a dark scene was my issue, something locally dimmed high end tvs struggled with until recently. I knew my next tv was going to OLED.
Something people can’t explain to you well is how upsizing from 55” to 77” affects your brightness tolerances. I do not turn on my lights in the living room anymore after dusk because this panel simply throws so much more light everywhere due to its sheer size. The ABL is a non issue and frankly helps my eyes from squinting even more. I can’t speak for very bright rooms but anyone who wants the best viewing experience anyway should avoid placing a nice tv in direct sunlight or very bright room. .
The exact same tv I upgraded to, I went from an LG c8 to a s90c and the upgrade was massive, so much brighter and love all the vrr etc.
My eyes hurt when a 550 nit screen goes all white, Oliver is sat in front of 2,000 nits going 'why is there no light?'.
2000 nits highlights on a 10/20% window as he said. It maxes out at around 800 nits full brightness, still quite bright sure. But I guess it depends on your environment. If you are in a dark room it'll most likely hurt your eyes but if you're in a well lit room (like me) this level of brightness isn't much of a deal.
Because you are sitting in a dark room looking at a screen... Believe it or not during overcast day the whole environment is in like 8.000 - 10.000 nit in brightness. It goes heck a lot brighter with sunny day.
But that's just it. In sunny and overcast everything is dynamically radiating light. Meaning you are not focused only on say 9000 nit bright object but there's 5000 nit 10 000 nit bright 2 000 nit bright and eyes aren't just overwhelmed by a single bright spot.
And really in order to get the full out of HDR10 we need displays that can do 10 000 nit brightness.
@@sermerlin1 I'm sure the difference really just comes down to Oliver wants all of the perks of HDR without sitting in a dark room. My original comment was tongue in cheek, it's not something I'd be mad at Oliver about of course.
You really don't need higher nits if your in a dark room. I have a Hisense R6 the nits aren't in the 1,000, however if you gets good blinds and covers for your windows you can get pure dark and perfect picture quality. If I ever do upgrade I am probably getting a Mini-LED TV like the Hisense U7K as I see no reason for OLED
the 2000 is only for hdr peak brightness holy moly cant believe people are still this clueless about this stuff, hdr has been out for like 10 years now.
Also, John, that VRR judder bug you're talking about is something RTings picked up in their review as well. They go into it a bit in their YT video on the G4
The brightness fluctuations? Ik surprised people didn't know this, it's common on oleds how it's implemented. Also why you didn't see gsync support on laptop oleds and such.
Its a problem is the tech itself, not a bug. It can easily be done on LCD because the backlight is always on and only the tft have to move
I still can't believe replaced the CX. The fact that only it and the c1are capable of doing bfi at 120 hz alone is reason enough for holfing onto it and not upgrading
I have the 65 inch A95L and it's beautiful
Yep, it’s excellent. Even though Sony isn’t known to be the gaming tv. Game mode on a PS5 looks excellent.
The only drawback is single hdmi2.1 port on such an expensive tv. The other port is for ear . It’s just a shame and a rip-off.
I’m have an LG OLED CS, it looks breathtaking, though like John I play in darkened room so the decreased brightness is not noticeable but those true black and Dolby vision is glorious
I've been waiting a long time for the right moment to upgrade, and I just got an LG C3 (on liquidation sale; they are phasing this model out) and I absolutely love it. HDMI 2.1 on all inputs, 120 Hz VRR, DolbyVision, and very very bright highlights(more than bright enough for me). I feel like it hits a sweetspot and thus right now is a great time to upgrade.
I bought a S95B QD-OLED about 18 months ago and I honestly cannot recommend QD-OLED enough. The colour and brightness is honestly unreal. You don’t get Dolby Vision but I can honestly live without it and the dimming can be aggressive but it’s easy to safely override.
QD OLED is basically CRT color quality. It blows WOLED out of the water for warm colors like yellows and reds.
I still prefer AMOLED and microLED. No quantum dot gimmicks and similar stuff.
I’m planning on getting the S90D 77 inch this Black Friday.
I feel like John upgrades his tv every 6 months LOL
Every 3 days.
His old one was a 2020 model, it's not that short a period for an enthusiast considering there have been tangible developments on the OLED front since then.
His previous was a CX…
What are you smokin’?
I think he tests many TVs including CRT and plasma
It's probably part of the sponsorship contract he has with LG...
Once you've had an OLED the deep blacks are an absolute non-negotiable forever afterwards .
I don't know, I have an AW2725DF (QD-OLED) and a Hisense U8K (Mini LED). For HDR, I'd say the Hisense delivers a considerably better experience in most real world scenarios thanks to the much higher brightness.
In real content, the benefit of the pixel level dimming is rarely visible (even scenes with extremely small bright highlights like a starry night sky look amazing on the Mini LED), while the drawbacks of OLED are quite often visible (every scene with a high APL doesn't look like HDR at all, basically).
Many games, shows and movies have a lot more bright scenes than dark ones.
I just finished Senua's Saga switching between the TV and the monitor, and I preferred the TV for basically any scene in the game, even the dark cave with the very small lights looked absolutely phenomenal, thanks to the local dimming (ruclips.net/video/05zNatvdUVo/видео.html if you don't know what I'm talking about).
Alan Wake 2 is a very similar story, even given it's very dark presentation. Local dimming works well enough to produce nearly the same deep blacks while still having much brighter highlights. The Hisense can do roughly 1700-1800 nits vs a maximum of 1000 nits on the Alienware for very small highlights. In an actual scene from the game, you're much more likely to end up with 400-500 nits in highlights.
Don't get me wrong though, they're both absolutely amazing displays and the pixel response times and colors on the OLED are just mind blowing for fast paced games. Still, I often end up being disappointed by the HDR on the Alienware given it's low brightness output after being used to nearly 2000 nits brightness (I use both in daylight and at night, btw).
Nope. I had an OLED but the burn in was crazy. Not worth. It's either micro LED 20 years from now, or mini LED now
@@2muchjpop Always hear this about Oleds as of image retention doesn't happen on every screen. Sounds like a user error.
Still trying to match the top plasmas from 15 years ago.
@@DoctorReverswhat? Oled has far surpassed anything plasma could’ve ever even dreamed of lol
My C7 (2017) got an update this month so ya they maintain support for a very long time.
I still hanging on to my beloved 2016 LG 55C6P OLED with passive 3D, very very minor burn in right bottom corner gas/ brake gauges from hundreds of hours running Asetto Corsa on it. This thing in great condition may clocking up to 3-4K usd on abay
Why did the value go up?
@@BigBoss7777777 it's rare model, supply/ demand thing. Well thought after by 3d enthusiasts. 3d content looks very good on it, it has very nice, slight curvature too. Plenty of brightness for my eyes, I kept at mid 60 in settings for movies and games, not sure why this obsession to sky high nits
@@BigBoss7777777 it's rare model, curved passive 3d, well thought after by enthusiasts. Watched Gravity, Judge Dredd, played Trine 2, Ico. HDR and 3d content looks great on it, I don't really understand all this brightness/ nits fuss, barely kept mine at 60%
I prefer 30fps content in LCD instead of OLED. With my Sony A95K, 30fps content hurts my eyes from the stuttering. I use my X900F for my PS3 & 4 content as a result.
They truly are different panel types for different use cases.
Very fair point. LCD can be gentler on the eyes with slower content.
Motion blur can go a long way to mitigate this issue in Oled if the content supports it of course
You make zero sense. There are plenty of LCD TV's nowadays that have a fast enough pixel response time which causes judder during slow 24fps/30fps content.
The problem is NOT exclusive to OLED displays.
Game motion plus on Samsung displays helps with games. With movies and tv shows you’re stuck with motion smoothing which many people don’t like. But as others have said, any decent lcd will have largely the same problem
Good choice John! The OLED LG G4 is one of the best TV's right now.
QD OLED just purchased S90c and havent been happier in that decision.
Same here, just wish I could have gotten the 75 inch. The 65 inch was on sale and with Amazon 0% 5-month payment plan made it so easy to afford when the 75 inch was full price and no payment plan, so there were no other choice but to get the 65 inch.
for sure consider modding it into an s95c through the service manual. its an insanely simple tweak to unlock more brightness at no extra risk. its using an s95c panel already
good choice btw
What matters is if you can say the same 5 years from now. If a tv can’t hold quality for at LEAST 5 years, it’s not worth having at all. Honestly a tv should last at least 10 years
Team John here, the G4 is very easily bright enough if you have any interest in accuracy, it does 320 nits fullscreen in SDR and 220 nits in HDR. You just flip on HGiG like John said and it displays basically everything exactly at its intended brightness except for the 1% of brightest colors you'll only encounter in well-graded and generally bright HDR movies. Combining that with 144 Hz and OLED's motion clarity + all the controls for optimizing the deficiencies of certain content/games there's just no reason to go with anything other unless you like to leave CNN running 24/7 🤣
But without 120hz BFI the motion performance is not good enough for gaming.
Oh dear Oli , you've dropped a bollock.
I have the Sony Bravia XR 77" A95L OLED UHD Smart TV Master Series for the living room, which I also game on PS5. I also have the mid range Sony Bravia XR 65" A80L OLED UHD Smart TV for the bedroom. Mid range is such an understatement.
i have not had good luck with samsung displays, especially their tvs. some really weird issues that i never could effectively troubleshoot. lg and sony have been great for me, though. i selfishly wish oliver would have given the lg oleds a shot, but a good mini led panel should still be awesome!
Sony Bravia 9 is the MiniLED TV to get.
It's expensive AF though
Bravia 9 is definitely an not a flagship, the G4 is totally superior....
@@Displays.1234.why?
No
Why get Bravia 9 when you can get a superior LG G4 🤷🏻♂️
I love my Samsung QN90B NeoQLED. It may not be OLED, but the blacks are incredible, and the HDR is overwhelmingly bright (for me). Couple years old now, but I still highly recommend it if anyone's looking for an alternative to OLED and have a bright room.
@makoto5280Nah, 90% of people will be perfectly happy with that sort of TV. My parents are still happy with a crappy edge lit lg from 2016. Most people can't tell the difference or just don't care.
@makoto5280the QN94/5A from the year prior was actually better than the B series 2022 release, and was the best mini-led TV of that year by a lot.
@makoto5280 Samsung's TV's are still excellent, just not as accurate. They're the best for people who want flashy, colourful/saturated visuals. That said, I do prefer natural colours and Sony's high-end is pretty much unmatched when it comes to this. My brother and mother both have an OLED (LG C3 an Sony A85K) and my much older ZF9 LED has more accurate colours than both (maybe not with pro measuring tools, but HDR nature on it looks far more lifelike than it does on their TVs. Though if I have to be honest, I feel like OLED actually makes lifelike images look a bit fake for some reason).
I got a Samsung qn90c on sale. I thought it was a no brainer pick. Wife is blind as fuck too so she needs high contrast to see well. Also using it for computer gaming. Cant risk getting an Oled and someone forgets to close the TV. I got a big sectional sofa, and tv angle are spectacular so thats actually important.
The only thing I don't like about Samsung TVs is that they don't support dolby vision
I recently upgraded to a TCL c845k 75", and I have to be honest I was amazed with the colour vibrancy and how bright it can go in HDR content with minimal blooming. No dirty screen effect either, so I was really lucky.
My C2 spoiled me. The picture is something I haven't experienced before on any LCD, and I can't imagine going back to it.
Also I'm one of those people that has a problem with very bright lights. I start squinting like crazy, so I don't need my TV to be any more bright than it currently is.
I have a 1440p CRT that does highlights better than my brighter AMOLED phone.
Love my S92C, the pop in HDR is unmatched, especially on stuff like a starry night sky where an LCD just can't compete
An lcd will see your starry night with a blazingly bright desert sun.
I have both tech and LCD is just better overall, I do prefer the way the light is emitted from the panel, it's more vibrant and I do appreciate that there is no need of screen saver on LCD when you leave the device for a few minutes.
@@Keivz LCD is good for day content, but if you watch at night time and cinematic movies, the glow is horrendous and distracting
Mini led imo has a lot of potential for casual content viewing and gaming. If we get much higher number of zones with better algorithms and response time, I could see myself preferring them over current oleds. However dual layer oleds are also a thing now
Hi, I’m here for John Oliver’s take on the new OLED TV line-up.
I have 3 OLED TVs: LG CX, Sony A80J, and Samsung S95B. The trifecta!
The cx is still going, I have a 55 inch c3 and still use the cx as my main tv
I get just over 1500 nits out of my Samsung 55S95B OLED and it’s to bright for my fairly dark room so I lower the brightness down a good amount. It’s such an amazing tv and I only payed $1000 for it used last year. I have no reason to upgrade at this time because I know it can go toe to toe with any tv on the market including the dimmer Sony A95L that most consider the best tv currently on the market
If you got the money then sure why not but I have a 65 A80J and a 77 A80L which combined costs as much as John's one 77 G4. I just don't get the jump in cost for the returns 🤷♂️
I'd imagine if I had that DF money though... 😂
Yeah the g4 is stupid expensive right now. It’s not even qd oled. And it’ll be $1000 off in a year. Just get an s90c and call it a day
@@Keivz well the mla technology is impressive but not for that price
@@thawhole9 It'd be far more impressive if it was used with a qd-oled.
That thumbnail picture literally depicts OLED users and fald/mini LED LCD users. :D
One is overly judgy and elitist the other is just happy it's all so shinny and good. :D
So...spending 5k on a TV does NOT make happy?🤔
ASBL can be turned off, if you've the correct remote. I could never go back to LCD after experiencing how good OLED is in a dark room.
You sure you aren’t confusing ASBL with ABL? 2 very different things and people seem to get them confused. ASBL can be turned off on some TVs by accessing service menus. Not sure how many. ABL can usually not be adjusted as far as I’ve heard. Unless there is a tv that allows you to. ABL usually is just about how aggressive the OLED does it. ASBL is another issue and it’s nice when you can change it.
@@Ray-dl5mplogically I think you're right. ABL is a feature to prevent over draw and heat.
If you managed to turn that of fuses would likely blow in the TV.
@Ray-dl5mp Typo mate, yes you're correct.
I have an LG OLED B7 65 and now have a Hisense U8N 65 sitting right next to each other and they both have a fantastic picture. The OLEDs viewing angle takes it for me, as the U8N washes out considerably unless you're directly in front of it. Even slightly off to the side looks grey. Sucks really, as the Hisense has the better-looking and WAY brighter picture when viewed directly. But I have a very bright room and need a brighter TV. Just one that can displays some color!
My Samsung 90A broke, very similar to the 90B. Lcd died completely. First Samsung TV to die and only had it 2yrs with occasional use. My other Samsungs are 8 and 6yrs old. No issues. The 90A started hating strang issues like not turning on smoothibg or black frame. Rediculously disappointed.
Best Buy have 77in LG G3 on clearance with stand. So that happened.
The G4 is a major upgrade, and it's definitely very bright, miles better than all the old LCD rubbish....
my biggest issue with mini led is still that dimming small bright elements to keep blooming to minimum and keep blacks black... its a literal reverse of OLED in that i wish we could have have OLED in dark scenes and LED in bright scenes 😂
1:56 and as a projector person it could instantly blind me, 16:00 nothing new for LG, I've got a 2012 LED LG projector that will run at native 120hz no problem even though it isnt meant to support it anywhere on the specs, perks of DLP tech, and pixel shifters take it to a whole new level
Purchased the original LG OLED (55-inch curved 1080p if anyone remembers) for a cool $3799 9 years ago and it lasted me all the way up until two years ago. Replaced it with a C1 in '22 for less than half the price. I'll never buy anything else.
Have been using LG OLED TVs for past 7 years, latest being C3 Evo, next I am thinking it will be G5. For me movie content matters more on the TVs, thus blacker the better. For gaming, I am waiting when 32" OLED will be acceptable for my budget, for now I am on VA 4K panel from MSI (it's ok), before I was on LG 1440p 27" IPS.
Bro why are you upgrading TVs every two years? The C3 should last 5 years at least.
@@someshwarrao42 More like every 3 years, prior to C3 it was CX, and before that B7. Yeh, maybe I'll wait till 2026 at least this time, not that big, noticeable, changes. What I really want is 32"-34" OLED monitor with at least 144Hz at an acceptable price.
I really wanted an OLED for my next TV and ended up having to prematurely buy a new TV before I could save up. Ended up getting a really nice LCD with IPS panels and I'm pleasantly surprised with the quality. I came from an 8-year-old 4K TV with terrible viewing angles, old hdr and 60 hz. This one was 144 hz, HDR10, atmos support and all these extra bells and whistles that really improved my gaming experience. I do miss the crushing blacks I would have had on the OLED as there is a little bit of wash out but this comes very close and for the price I paid it's not bad. The viewing angles are great and the broght ness is nice. I'm with Oliver on that one. LCD technology has definitely come a very long way
I'm looking at the Samsung S95D due to the matte screen. We don't have a dedicated movie room (that you can make completely dark) so with windows and other sources of light permeating our viewing room the matte screen that we have had since 2009 is about 60% less distracting. I think the S95D is the first OLED with matte (although some random guy on the internet told me some other OLED had matte too).
Careful with raised blacks with ambient light in qd oleds. You might be better off with a mini led display
I am returning S95D. if you want a bright room OLED, G4 is much better imo.
The raised blacks, especially on S95D, cause the shadow details to fade away.
I also had gaming issues with S95D along with audio dropouts.
Also, based on HDTV TEST video, samsung oleds raise micro shadows, which makes faces look flat and without detail.
@@kasramoghaddam1389 You can't tweak the user settings or the service menu settings to correct those issues? My TV is ancient (2009) but the default settings on it were poor, and not even the user settings could really fix it. I had to go into the Service Menu using the secret remote code to properly correct the screen (which has looked excellent, for what it is, for 15 years).
I just can't see getting a shiny glossy screen and then having to stare at my wife's endtable lamp in all its detail or get a good look at the backyard windows for the next decade.
@@niveketihw1897 Matte screens treat ambient light a lot wore than glossy displays.
@@turrican4d599 How so??? That directly contradicts all the experiences I've had. My sister in law's house has windows and a glossy screen and it's a disaster to try to watch anything.
I do think mini LED or micro LED are good shouts these days. Many panels offer 120hz or above and the black levels and contrast can be very competitive with OLED while keeping the brightness high and the price lower. Its good to have the choice though depending on your needs and budget!
Went from a Neo QLED to a QD OLED and the difference is night and day. QD OLED is brighter in anything that isnt Full Field, QLED was unbeatable in Full Field. Overall picture quality, colors, motion, gaming, are immensely better on the QD OLED. Dont really miss my QLED at all, i really thought the brightness would be a bigger issue
It’s interesting to hear Oliver’s comments about Samsung’s S95D, and is exactly what’s keeping me from upgrading. I’m leaning towards the LG G4 or Sony A95L though both TVs seem to have some software issues as of their own-no TV is perfect. They should release these high-end TVs every two years and make sure they’re at their optimal performance level. Modern OLEDs offer more flexibility than LED LCDs in terms of dark room/bright room performance, and HDR displays work better in light-controlled environments.
No ATSC 3.0 is a bummer in the LG G4 to me. As I live in an area with 3.0 channels and have an antenna.
Still rocking my 85" QN85B QLED. Senua's Saga HDR looks insane on it. OLED or Full Array QLED will serve you well.
The philips oled+ 959 has the same panel as the G4 but 100 nits brighter plus it has their new ambilight tech.
As far as I'm aware both the PS5 and XSX have 48 Gbps bandwidth on their HDMI interfaces, and even Techradar states this to be the case. The PS5 did initially launch with only 32 Gbps bandwidth but got a firmware update later on to fix that, and I'm pretty sure the XSX always had 48 Gbps bandwidth.
Pretty sure you and techradar are wrong. Nothing on the internet about a firmware update increasing the ps5 hdmi bandwidth either. It should be easy to test if you have a ps5 and the right tv. And the series x is definitely capped at 40 gbps (I own one and an lg cx and the lg cx will tell you what hdmi bandwidth a signal is using).
Nope. Only way you're getting use of the full 48 Gbps bandwidth is either with a PC or with a 4K-UHD blu-ray player.
I love my CX apart from Apps often crash (looking at you Disney+) so it’s better to use something like an AppleTV but then you get the HDMI input “gremlins”
Still love my LG C9. It’s perfect except for the VRR which I just disabled. Everything just looks so good on an OLED. Brightness is plenty bright for me as well.
Surprised John didn’t mention the superior latency of OLEDs.
I’d actually probably go with QLED/LCD over OLED if they had equal response times, because while the inky blacks of OLED are impressive, sometimes, maybe only in SDR content, images look too dark and detail is lost. (Crushed blacks.)
But then again I don’t own a fancy modern TV, so just judging by what I see at Best Buy, and what I see/read online.
I recently bought a 42" C3 to try as a monitor. I ended up returning it because I just can't get along with that size, but even if I had liked the size, there's no way I could have lived with the aggressive ABL on it. If even half the screen was full white the brightness would be cut down significantly. I also have a Sony A80L OLED tv and don't notice the ABL on it at all which is strange.
I share Olivers preference on OLED vs LCD, I’ve tried multiple OLEDS over the years and even with the new QD-OLEDs I wanted more brightness in certain scenes lol. Sure they look great with the infinite contrast but I’d rather not spend over $1K on something and say to myself “I wish it was brighter”
They don't have infinite contrast. They don't even have better contrast. They only have a better contrast ratio, not a better contrast. Contrast is the difference between the lowest and the highest and LED simply destroys OLED when it comes to this. That's not to say that OLEDs contrast ratio doesn't mean anything, it most certainly makes for a striking image, but it's not the same as contrast.
Uh, good insight. Never thought of distinguishing the 2@@thenonexistinghero
So true, I have experienced true HDR gaming experience in the last year with my Hisense U8H (2022) which is a MiniLED QLed TV with 1500nits and really good black levels (not OLED levels) and I have replayed many games with HDR support on my PS5 and it is a game changer!
Horizon Zero Down and Forbidden West are just breathtaking every time I see a machine with many luminance highlights on it, I am playing AC Odyssey and it's another game with impressive HDR Highlights, Cyberpunk 2077 a reference except for the black levels and old games with HDR looks
way better than SDR or on normal QLED or LED screens with around 500 - 800 nits.
I found that between 850 - 1000 nits is my sweet post for HDR at least for my room and especially for my eyes... more than 1000nits in speculate highlights is just too much even in bright rooms.
I forget to mention that Injustice 2 using HDR is another example of good HDR, the game is from 2017 with regular graphics at this point but with HDR is awesome ❤.
My LG C1 is plenty bright. It just depends on the content. Some films and TVs are just badly produced. Mostly Disney content for some reason
@@mrbobo86 Most OLEDs tend to have major problems with prolonged brightness levels. If the overal image is bright for more than a few (such as a bright movie), OLEDs tend to dim the overal image to make the pixels burn out slower. Main issue is that most OLEDs also do not allow their users to turn it off.
They could give people that options, but ah... then a lot more people would probably complain about burn in even if it's their own fault. So it's sorta something they do to protect themselves and to protect against consumer stupidity.
Of course I'm not sure if that's what causes it for you. Could be something else, but it is a fairly common OLED issue that hardly anyone brings up in the discussion of LCD vs OLED. I think both have their advantages and disadvantages, but I don't think OLED will be able to solve its issues before LED-based tech pretty much annuls its advantages. It's why several companies have actually started to slowly move away from OLED TV's.
Funnily this conversation hits close to home with me. I've got a S90C (Modded) and had the QN900D. OLED is an easy winner in terms of picture quality, but the QLED TV's are brighter and can pack a bunch if you go with the higher end models. But you definitely don't get what you pay for with the flagship models.
Olie Mack needed to mod the oled to get what he wanted, turn off ABL as an example :) some of us could have helped him out with this issue and also should have gone with a S90/92C for ultimate price/performance with the one connect issues :)
I do agree OLEDs are incredible but be prepared to experience burn-in eventually, especially if you use it with static elements, such as gaming and general OS tasks. My C9 is connected to my pc but I only use it for watching youtube and movies in fullscreen. After 4 years I have mild desktop and taskbar icons burn-in. To be fair this could've been prevented if I hid the taskbar and the desktop icons. Also, I use it in a dark environment so I never went above 60 brightness. Big reviewers often make it sound burn-in is no longer an issue but unfortunately it still is. Having seen this, if longevity is a concern, I would never buy an OLED for desktop use.
It will eventually, but as long as you don’t have a static image constantly showing on your TV, you won’t have to worry about it for a while. Like in your situation, if you hid your icons and taskbar, then your TV wouldn’t have experienced burn-in. I’d say OLED is well worth it if you can get a 5-7 years or more of a great viewing experience.
Samsung reduces the quality of the local dimming in game mode, and if local dimming is not very good but it is even worse in game mode, a Sony x95L would have been better, or bravía 7/9 or the new tcl c855/x955
PSA: G3 price right now is amazing, it's around half of G4 (depending where you live I suppose). And you get 99% of same features and screen as G4. The only major difference is 144Hz vs 120Hz. Other than that, panel, brightness etc etc is pretty much identical.
g3 has gimped image quality in game mode tho compared to g4
In your opinion, if buying a new tv and your interests are primarily watching fast paced sports NBA, NHL, NFL ... would u recommend Oled or save money and go with Qled .... led etc?
Have had a Panasonic fz950 since 2018. That blew me away back in 2018 but hanging for an upgrade as it didn’t have Dolby vision, hdr10+, or 120hz vrr. But I’m still happy with it. I’d imagine if I got a G4 my mind would be blown all over again. Can’t go back from oled
I upgradet from a LG C1 to a S90C for 980 Euro inc. Tax and ist a Banger bc. QOLED, dont get me wrong LG c1 WOLED was not bad, but no compare against a S90c with a QOLED Panle 2nd. Gen.
My favorite OLED tv is thé Panasonic HZ2000. Has incredibile Component AV inputs, great build in speakers and very good PQ.
I went from a 55 oled CX to a 65 sony a95k and the difference was worth the upgrade. I think John would have liked the A95L a bit more than the G4 but the price for a 77" is ridiculous 😅
My QD-OLED monitor dishes out 1000 nits with HDR and if it's blindingly bright maybe trying a QD-OLED for that middle ground with brightness. If the monitor was any brighter I would need literal sunglasses to look at it.
It is because of ABL is the reason why I have not moved on to OLED. I'm guessing I could get used to playing in a darker room. But the ABL is a deal breaker.
You can disable it on most LG TV's. I turned it off immediately as it's really annoying as you say
@@Simi69 how?
There is a setting in the menu. The LG G4 does not really dim and if it does, it’s not noticeable. You’re definitely not getting any thermal throttle in the same way that you do with the Samsung oleds.
@@Simi69 You can't turn off ABL, not even in the service menu. You can turn off ASBL/other similar features, but those aren't the main problem.
@@dslumberger I'm looking at the owners manual. What page? When I search for ABL I don't find anything. I found the pdf by searching for "lg g4 oled manual". Then downloaded LG OLED83G4WUA manual.
rockin the C2 brought last year. love it the only thing that pisses me off sometimes i get "no signal" when running my xbox and switching between things
As someone who is a massive OLED enjoyer and owns two LG OLEDs, an OLED Steam Deck, an OLED iPhone, and an OLED Apple Watch, it’s amazing to me how good modern IPS LCDs can now look even without mini-LED backlighting. The value of quality LCD panels is still there for the price, and I hope LCD never fully goes away. I just picked up a 2024 iPad Air for work and it has probably the best IPS LCD I’ve ever seen in terms of color and evenness. Is it as good as OLED today? No, but it is better than cheaper OLEDs in terms of color accuracy and consistency across the panel and at any brightness level. I’ll always prefer OLED for the absolute best experience, but using LCD no longer makes me want to vomit.
But alas we, all lcd tv owners of non Sony, must ignore the horrid and obvious dirty screen effect. It's sucks Hisense, Samsung, TCL etc have all got dirty screen effect.
It's like buying a defective product and making up excuses for the purchase just so as to enjoy without regret.
How pathetic is that?
@@USA92Sony also has the same DSE, no manufacurer is willing to take the extra cost to prevent this from happening.
@@Pandemonium088 I have a Sony 55 inch X90J and it is by far the cleanest LCD display I've ever owned. No DSE whatsoever. I'm thinking of upgrading to a 65 inch A95L OLED model this year, and I'm almost hesitant to do so because there is absolutely no uniformity issues in my current display.
@@Pandemonium088 Correct. But I was speaking to theirs. Which is consistently less horrid.
I own a 55 inch LG CX & 65 inch LG C1 and let me tell you a QD-OLED is better than WOLED especially the 77 inch Samsung S90C QD-OLED and the colors are NEXT LEVEL PHENOMENAL however the LG G4 is an absolute BEAST!
Until Micro Leds are available, itll always be OLED for me
in my opinion 43 inch is the perfect size, you can carry it in and out of rooms easily.
I hate any sort of automatic brightness controls. I can almost always notice it change and it makes me twitch to see it.
Funny I sit in the dark and love a searing bright display. A brighter display also means better colors.
I think it's mostly just placebo of people thinking it's bad. Just takes a tiny bit of getting used to it, that's all. Kinda similar how people just eat up that crap about blue light being damaging. There's no research out there that actually shows that the blue light from screens can cause harm (actually, the research that's there shows that it simply isn't the case). Blue light can cause harm to the eyes, but even a 10K nits TV wouldn't be able to deliver a level of harmful blue light.
I didn't think it was about harm but wear. Its wearing to a person to see blue light like these produce for long times.
So hurt? Huh?
Don't get why everyone is pushing for lg when other brand like Panasonic use the same LG panels with much more advanced electronics and better components
This
It's like the one dude is bought by LG and the other by Samsung.
DF was such a Great Channel couple years ago.
They’re not available in the US, last time I checked. But yes they are better, I have Panasonic Oled and plasma
@@kristiangurholt59 Didn't know Panasonic wa not available in the US market; Is john living in the US? I thought he was living in EU like the other members.
Really good PC compatibility and not a lot of bugs. Samsung can be buggy.
I’m holding out for the Panasonic Z95A 65”. ❤❤❤
The film maker mode for gaming, combined with integer scale from 720p and 1080p and support for component and SCART, not to mention better handling of near black and better colour accuracy.
The 77” doesn’t have MLA though like the 65” and 55”.
HDR game recommended settings! Start covering them... Not just with the new TVs but with ALL the TVs Digital Foundry team has.
Yeah yeah gaming tech but he's only got 3 TVs
So yeah might be a good opportunity to get probably hundreds of thousands of new viewers and followers!
Panasonic vt50 plasma tv am still using.
Still great for watching 1080p blu-ray but it doesn't hold a candle to a new OLED watching a 4K-UHD blu-ray with HD. It's like going from a dvd on a tube TV 480p to your current TV and 1080p blu-ray.
@@randysalsman6992 Not true. Panasonic STW60 here and it has WAY better motion clarity.
@@randysalsman6992mmm I don’t know. Plasma has a picture you have to see. I just sold my gt60 Panasonic and have the Sony a95l qd. The Panasonic has a more organic stable picture dull compared to my a95l but the gt60 was amazing picture
I have an s90c and it’s plenty bright enough for me. I’m in a dark room. At this point it’s nearly impossible for me to go to LCD. Been using OLEDs for the past 10 years.
and yet johns oled will be brighter. Here is why:
the local dimming zones have to always compromise between contrast and brightness, because they cant dimm independently within the zone. the more brightness you get the more washed out the picture looks (unless its pure white). Oled can use its full brighntess within every element of the scene. the per pixel contrast also gives the picture a crispness and three dimensionality lcd cant achieve.
on top of that the local dimming performance on olivers panel is compromised in game mode further reducing contrast and brightness.
Indeed! LCD displays suck!
Yes!!! I had the exact same tearing issue with my S95D!! Called samsung technical support, and they blamed my PS5!
Luckily, it was during the return window, so I switched with G4(not arrived yet).
Fan of oleds here. I've had s90c for a couple of months and I love this tv. Great blacks, amazing colours. I've been playing a lot of tekken 8. So far no burn in.
I love OLED, but I wish they did have some way of mitigating the stutter that comes with such a fast response time.
They do, motion settings.
@@TheUAProdigy It works to an extent but there’s still either too much stutter or too much soap opera for me. I just hope one day we can move on from sample and hold display technology.
@@PogueSquadron I mean, have you tried Sony's implementation ?; it's honestly perfect. Also, once we get to micro led no-one knows if there will be unforeseen problems with it as well. Plus, I think OLED's will still be around.
This is very interesting conversation. I have an LG C1 as my laptop monitor, for my PS5 and Xbox series X. My living room TV is a Samsung ks8000 and I also use that for some consoles. It would be kind of hard for me to give up the brightness so I guess I can see both sides. I think my next living room TV is probably going to be at mini LED. Especially since my wife also uses it. If I ever upgrade my desk monitor I'll probably just get an OLED for that.
John, I hope you disabled video overlay on your Marantz - adds unnecessary latency :)
Oliemack should've bought the G4. Bright enough‚ no hassle. In HDR it washes the floor with the QN90D‚ as it doesn't have to fight with the local dimming algorithms. In fact‚ he should've bought Sony X95L if he wanted a MiniLED that could deliver bright AF SDR and very good HDR.
LG G4 with HGIG 😍😍 The ultimate experience
Sony Bravia 9 miniLED is the brightest TV on the market now!
Got myself the Sony X95L mini LED in 65 inch. Best decision ever.
My problem with OLED is, the reduced brightness and the inevitable degeneration of the colors plus burn-in, because it’s organic.
It could achieve higher brightness, but manufacturers have reduced it and built in safety measures, which are supposed to prevent burn in.
I just don’t like the idea of having to babysit my TV and knowing it will look worse.
@john Is it possible to have chroma 4:4:4, with BFI on and de-judder and de-bur working? And also have VRR working? I dont understand the limits of the settings on the tv.
They have very low powered chips governing their picture processing so there is a limit on what can be pushed simultaneously.
The bandwidth of the graphics processor is a more limiting factor to having 444 full chroma bandwidth. The only thing you can't do with these sets is enable bfi and vrr simultaneously
I had OLED C2, got burn in around 10 months. Now I have a Mini Led QN90C, never been happier. OLED it's too expensive and doesn't last enough.
We neeeed a beamer episode!
I love my cx, but it's SUPER glitchy with my Series X. Netflix sometimes just goes black, or other video apps just stop playing. Games work fine, though.
Got a samsung q95t from 2020 in 75 inch and it still has the local dimming bug even after all the updates but it is a good tv in my eyes great picture..Ive been a samsung guy since decent 4k tv first arrived but im done with samsung and looking at a lg g4 83 inch know. I was worrying about burn in from the earlier models is why i didnt go oled earlier but it seems to be not an issue anymore. Samsung just do not care or fix there tvs through out updates and even go as low as nerfing the brightness out off them to try and solve there blooming issues if reported.. im hoping i notice a decent upgrade when getting the g4 then my q95t
Recently got a Sony Bravia 32" 4K LED Google TV for my laptop, totally state of the art gaming.
Oliver, I experienced the same blackout issues with my S95C. Samsung replaced the entire TV with a new one, and it still drops out with my 3090 gaming PC. I've relegated it to console and Apple TV 4K playback in my bedroom.
The S90C I replaced it with has been phenomenal!
TVs no longer have BFI 120Hz nowadays. It means that, for gaming, my LG C1 destroys everything you can buy these days sadly. I would love to upgrade and buy a LG G4 or a QD-Oled but I know for a fact that it would look like crap in motion compared to my LG C1 and it’s a shame. Thanks to greedy TV manufacturers who removed that feature.
I still don't know why LG has stolen us this option! And why Panasonic was forced to disable it too.
Panasonic jz2000 has BFI and probably the best PQ and sound outhere.
I had the LG C1 and it gave me insomnia. I would turn the tv off and lay in bed with my heart racing and all wired till 2 in the morning. It was awful and wonder if it was BFI or some other motion processing in the LG. Went back to a 2009 1080p LCD and no problems. I also tried and LG Qned90 and it gave me bad headaches. Something about new tech that doesn't agree with me, which stinks because LG C1 was amazing!
@@Avoicecyringinthesuburbswtf...how
But how many games do current consoles even have capable of 120Hz?
Or how many people out there actually have PCs connected to TVs, especially in the living room?
Imho, TVs that sit in the living room, connected to nothing but consoles, not having BFI 120Hz is probably not as big of a loss...
On PC monitors though, I'd probably not buy a 144Hz+ monitors if it doesn't have BFI
Love Digital Foundry. Keep it up guys.
What did you guys think about the Sony A95L for gaming? The LG G4 is cool though.
Bro just drop $4500 on tv
Meanwhile i'm in 7th Heaven with my 200€ Benq TH681 Beamer projecting on the bare wall.
Makes you wonder how he can afford such expensive tastes. I mean it just doesn't stop at TVs with him. Didn't realize video game journos got paid quite as much as he seems to. lol