A double treated 2x8 with 4 posts would suffice just fine on some adequate foots. Not all of those posts seem to be on footings, just the concrete slab. Also, the flashing is destined to fail being that it is on the face of the T111 siding and not tucked up behind it. It’s completely reliant on caulking and that will inevitably fail and leak which will lead to rot. Otherwise not too bad.
I also live in the pacific NW. A few months ago, we had a huge snowstorm with extremely wet, heavy snow. Happens maybe every 10 years. The header beam not only has to carry the weight of the framing and plastic, it has to carry whatever snow load happens, or it will collapse, and can do serious damage to the wall where it is bolted in. We are at sea level off interstate 5. At higher elevations, the snow loads get a LOT heavier.
4x12 seems overkill even with fewer posts, but then maybe that Washington rain really piles up. Little more slope and gutters would be a significant improvement.
I grew up in WA. This small slope is common. And within two years the gullies on the plastic roofing will be full of sludge. These types of roofs need to be cleaned with high pressure washers 2 to 3 times a year. They are nice for letting light in, but they do collect crap. If you don't maintain them, they end up looking like crap. Otherwise they are quite nice covers.
4x12 is WAY overkill on a bigger patio than this. Especially with todays prices I'm in a area with heavy snow loads. I'd feel confident with just 4 4x4s in the front. 6x6 if you had to.
Hold up lil homies.... Wouldn't a 4x12@20 be a good enough span for the visual 20ft available? Given the posts are 4 x6's. Idk he's very quick videoed. Help me out here. Also
@@cannaberx2 no I'd put a 4x6 not a lvl and if you do use 2-2x12s you still have to sandwich half inch plywood between them so that when it sits flush on the 4x4 post instead of being a ¼in short on each side if you only sandwich the 2x12 together
@David Bryant Try to sell your house with an improvement that hasn't been permitted. You'll be forced to take it down, or bring it up to code to make it 'sellable'. Any buyer that agrees to purchase a home knowing the improvements haven't been permitted is just asking for trouble. There is a reason for building codes.
@David Bryant There are reasons for building codes, thank goodness. Just because you don't like being told what to do does not mean that the rest of us don't appreciate the benefits of those rules. You are among the the ones the rules protect us against.
Home Inspectors are not allowed to cite code violations, for liability issues. We are safety inspectors. We identify potential issues that we see and the potential hazards it may pose to the buyer. It is strictly up to the buyer if they wish to further pursue what we identify on our report. This is a common misconception associated with our inspections. Do I agree with his assessment and would I write it up? Absolutely. Why? Because if that structure injured someone, who do you think the buyer is going to go after? That's right...the inspector; because YoU dIdN't PuT iN tHe RePoRt 🙄
The slope exceeds the minimum slope recommended by the manufacturer, it is not a code violation. The 4x4 exceeds the minimum beam size for the span, it is not a code violation. The post spacing is not a code violation. The lack of a gutter is not a code violation. You know what is important, and you didn't notice? It looks like the "flashing" is attached to the surface of the siding and sealed with silicone, not underneath the siding. Hard to see in the video, but if it is, that will very likely leak and lead to damage to the structure.
I'm a Home Inspector as well. You're right, it doesn't look like the flashing is under the siding. It's a pain to do, but you would cut about two inches above the bottom of the siding and slide the flashing under it.
The post spacing is determined by the live load, snow load and rafter span. All of which is calculated and beyond to scope of a home inspection. However, an inspector should have a rough idea of the beams are too small.
Very good short and simple video, I hope many people view this before they make header size mistakes. Too many times I have seen undersized headers or beams and sagging roofs, especially in the winter as the snow is melting.
@@AJ7- even taking into account the new earthquake standards here in the PNW.? You should see the footer that was required for my neighbors 1 wall up remodel. The one story garage was upsized 1 more story and the outside wall had to be 2x6 and the footer was a massive 2 foot wide 3 foot deep concrete base. I saw that and was stunned and he said the engineers were using the new standards. I said so your addition stands but the old 1962 remainder will fall down? Lol...
A 4x12? You are out of control. A 4x6 with posts every 8' is totally sufficient for this. There is no load so to speak except the 2x6's. You might get snow, but the plastic will fail before the 4x6 would. Please cite your code source for telling us a 4x12 is best. That's malarky.
This is what I was sayin. We building a deck or a patio cover? These inspectors are out of control. If sandwiched (2) 2x6’s on a notched 6x6 are used on decks and are enough for a shit ton of live load what this guy has should be more than enough unless he’s in a snow area, which like you said the roof will probably fail way before the frame does.
inspector/general 25 yrs. As an inspector it’s not your place to critique the construction if it appears to be non-standard for the municipalities building standards it should be called out. That’s for the municipality to Judge. It’s your job to state if it’s safe or unsafe.
The ledger board bolts are too far apart as this installation probably needs a bolt every 18", it has at least one improper footing (pier blocks aren't allowed by code), the vinyl roof panels may not be adequately rated for the snow load in your(our) area, each post needs bracing, not just the outer ones. If they had used a 4x8, 2x10 or greater, they could have spanned the width with 3 posts. This cover definitely wasn't engineered or permitted, so if the city catches it, it most likely will have to be removed.
Different cities have different codes, that’s why I live in an area where that’s not so important. Think about the people buying a house after someone else’s crappy remodel or improvement
Cool video, will definitely look for more like this. We occasionally get deep snow and I remember several marinas with boat covers collapsed under the weight of the snow, especially when it started raining and the snow got really heavy.
I am a 16 year home inspector. Yes the beam is undersized. Corrugated roofs are ok at that pitch. The ledger board cannot be attached to the siding. It should be attached to the framing of the structure. There are insufficient amounts of lag screws. Nails are not able to withstand sheer force. The flashing should be tucked under the siding so that it acts as counter flashing. Caulking will wear out and leak. The posts are missing 1" stand off bases. Other than that the rest is just opinion and a lot was missed.
I can surely use a or I meant build a patio cover in this texas sun before summer time...hmmm...thanks so much for the information...I learned a whole bunch.
Always nice to see the weekend warriors come out and give their opinions. This guy was spot on but hey, just a home builder who knows the importance of building to code talking. Thank you sir for an excellent post.
If they had attached it to the house any higher, they would have been above the band board, that they needed to bolt to. So, how do would they anchor it?
@@jayhaines1792 find and lag into the studs. It wouldn't be hard. I'd be willing to bet they couldn't comfortably reach higher with their ladder and went with it
The entire thing should have been "raised". It's low as it is. And there should be more slope. Too little slope and water can be blown up the slope. He was stating the entire thing should be higher, more slope, and to equate for the load and short beam, it should have been raised up. Many time he explains why
4x12? There's no need for that. If there's a concern about snow loads (PNW gets wet, heavy snow on occasion) that crappy translucent "roof" will fail long before anything else. A 4x8 might be nice though, and could catch the rafters as well.
actually the flashing on top of the corrugated roof was not done correctly and you said it was "really, really good"....NOT ! ... you'd be wrong about that
The post and beam structure here is perfectly legit. His "we would like to see" has nothing to do with acceptable loading. There may be more posts because of a lack of footings. Putting more posts is acceptable over 4" flat concrete. It is also an architectural choice. And a gutter. Are you kidding me. What he didn't call out was the lack of sufficient number of lag bolts to secure the ledger.
Wouldn’t a couple of 2 x 6’s to form a 4 x 6 on the leading edge be enough? I agree with the 4 x 4 being insufficient, they used 2 x 6’s everywhere else.
Hey Joe Brock, I am a remodeling and new construction contractor. If I may recommend, use 6x6 posts, 2x10 header with 2x8 rafters on 16" centers. The small added cost will save you down the road and give you peace of mind when you are finished. I am in the middle of a 12x36 deck with a porch roof. For joists on the deck I used 2x10's. This will allow my customer to one day turn this area into living space. But trust me, you want to go beyond minimum spans. Also, build in multiples of 4.
And here I am nailing a 2x4 to soffet area running 2x4s and tossing galvanized pool wall overlapped. After a year or so I definitely did not need 4x6 and 2x6 or 8 to support 50 lbs of flat roof. Not tryi g so support Dumbo, should he fly by and take a break. LOL
Polycarbonate plastic panels? They photochemically degrade over time. 8 to 10 years of life. I replaced mine with fiberglass panels that can be easily repaired. The polycarbonate panels had turned to dust... no repairing .
@@RossMalagarie You really have to look at what your local code says. Generally, 4x6 is adequate for certain distances depending on factors, such as your local snow load, wind criteria, how long the joists are and what the joist spacing is. These covers really need to be engineered and put through the permit process. This particular cover wouldn't pass inspection for several different reasons.
Wil Morris not necessarily should the flashing be set underneath that like saying lets cut the stucco and put flashing underneath well guess what when you do that your creating a spot for water to get into the house when it was already sealed duh.
You’re right! This guy Tim Buchanan have no idea what he’s talking about. First of all this is not stucco, it’s t-111 siding and the ledger is supposed to be fastened directly to the studs. Flashing goes underneath the siding and house wrap and the same goes for stucco siding.
Yeah, they probably could have made their cuts, then tucked flashing under+behind the siding. Not hard to do. just more efforts and work... But... That's what it takes, doing things the right way.
@@Tkt-mw1jn when you attach the ledger directly to the house by cutting the siding or stucco you create a spot for water to get in. If you leave the stucco or siding then attach the ledger water can't get in. It's not rocket science. Maybe you don't know what your talking about.
My patio cover was unpermitted..just found out today. I had to demolish my garage a month ago. The inspector came and told me to remove my patio roof and the bathroom next to it. I was so pissed.. I didnt know it didnt have a permit. This sucks.
Also, if you do a remodel or expansion over a certain size you may be required to bring the whole house up to modern code. If you bought the house this way you may have legal recourse against the seller.
@@lelandsmith2320 Unless he is dead, or sold the house AS IS which is how I plan to sell mine. I am sure my finished basement was unpermitted when I bought the house and they didn't say shit then, don't come complaining now.
@@integr8er66 Well, if you try to sell the home and the buyer's inspector finds out the basement wasn't permitted, you could be in for a surprise...you may lose the sale and/or be forced to bring it up to code (proper ingress/egress, windows, ventilation, etc.). Your mistake when originally purchasing the home is your mistake, not the potential buyer's.
lol 2x4 in general hold up extremely well matter fact homes are built with 1x3” so a patio with only 100-200lbs ontop ain’t going anywhere with these 2x6 used!!!
These all sound just like comments from you. Example: you mentioned that it was sloped but you would like to have seen a "little more" slope?? You have a responsibility to tell someone if they got it right or got it wrong. You are not a policy maker you are only to show if proper slope was achieved or not. People do not hire you for your opinion. What if the slope was spot on but your opinion swayed someone. Even if you are an engineer why should correct work be negatively commented on or vice versa for incorrect work. I sold a house that not only met code it went beyond code in many areas yet the inspector for the buyer put his opinnions in as "gosple". He created huge problems that had to be sorted out by hiring an engineer that showed everything was in compliance. (The original inspector had to pay the $800 engineering bill!)
Keep telling yourself that if it makes you feel better. I make six figures with my "zero experience in life" as a realtor. Hell it's so easy that i have no idea why i keep getting more and more clients every year :)
Chapman Clips I completely agree. Especially concerning occupational differences. Home inspectors and realtors are not builders yet they like to make everyone think their experts in all trades. Home inspectors were supposed to be "code" inspectors not building inspectors. Big difference. Same goes for realtors. They sell property, period. The majority of realtors I've known know nothing about construction, history of the property or demographics of the neighborhood. Their salespeople who make their living off selling. Some do it successfully others they get by. However, they're not building experts. Computers and the internet have changed occupations over the years. Automobile salesmen have decreased because people are realizing they can do their own research online, pick out a car and go pick it up. How soon will it be before the public does the sale in the real estate industry. Not beating up on realtors or inspectors, but when you try to act like like a master of all knowledge, you will suffer for it in the long run.
I can see a lot of water penetration running on the beam above de posts. Flashing against the wall pretty short and also needed to be caped with a 1x4 and caulked top of the board Looks like a kid built it, need to consider snow weight
Someone spent a lot of money to do this, even if they intended to pass the costs to someone else. A 4 x 12 shouldn't be needed for a patio cover support, and a patio cover shouldn't be 'winked' into a balcony atop a half dozen lag bolts. Was this a 'creeping contractor construction (and retouch, and retouch, and so on) or an enclosable patio? That water damage looks like it was planned, it is so widespread.
You can do it right or do it to code. For the weight these 4x4 are fine...if not ugly. If we permit ugly aluminum awning companies to have those little 1x1s those 4x4 are more of such a light weight with down or uplifting. Many ways to skin a cat!
Thank you for this video. Would you be comfortable if I installed a 6x12 on top of a 6x6 post? (With no notch) just place on top with brackets. Like this video. This is a 16x32 lean-to roof with 5- 6x6 posts 8 feet apart 12 feet high on the wall and drops to 8 feet where the post are. Thank you for any future and all the advise from previous videos.
Jim- great vid. I have a question; Is it ok to attach a pergola to a house without using a ledger board? In other words, just screwing the joists directly into the stucco on the house? I have seen a few photos where that has been done and it sure seems like it would work.......? Thanks from California
Jinx D.Clown No! It’s critical and code to have a ledger especially on stucco. Unless you’re doing a freestanding cover you have to cut out an opening and expose the studs and fasten the ledger directly to the stud. Install a weep screed/drip screed underneath both stucco and house wrap and counter-flash it with an “L” flashing.
Do you have snow loads? 4x4's are plenty for that application. And you'd want to shorten the posts by 2". I'm a plumber and I'm a better carpenter than you.
Built plenty of patio and porch coverings with nothing but a double 2×6 leading edge beam and it withstood West Virginia mountain snow load just fine. The only thing a building inspector knows is what an engineer writes down in a code. As a tractor trailer mechanic I can confidently state that engineers design shit that fails all the time.
@Lee G that depends. Is the edge of the slab on top of a footer? Is it a wooden porch with the post set on a poured column? Is it a block wall that's already on a footer with a slab on top? Are you trying to test me because you disagree with my comment or are you asking in earnest? Is a hundred year old balloon framed house on a stacked stone Foundation with no footer at all, still standing because it was a substandard structure?
@Lee G check your local codes to keep yourself out of trouble - but if it's 9 inches thick at the last two feet, I can't see why you'd have any issues setting your posts on top of the existing concrete, as long as they are well secured to the slab. If you want more overhang and to get your posts further out past the slab, people set posts on top of two foot deep, sono-tube poured columns all the time and use post brackets to secure them.
How many posts is 100% something the owner should decide so long as there are enough to support the weight. Also that far from the house foundation gutters should be optional. If it was me and you made me add a gutter against my will I would add it and add a downspout at every post
Lol this is funny. "Add a few posts" hahah that 4x4 is holding that patio cover just fine. It's got a clear roof on it not 1000lbs of shingles. U should avoid giving advise since you don't understand what your talking about.
he said it needs ANOTHER post. 1:23 He said those posts should of been bigger to use less posts. But with the size that's on there now, he says it needs another post. avoid commenting on my posts, if you don't comprehend.
His concern was that the horizontal beam was only a 4x4. That small of a beam, in his estimation, would require another post. You can see that 2 posts have already been added after the fact and that there is one span that is larger than the others. His recommendation is to use a bigger beam so that you can use fewer posts.
If you want it for the looks, but for a metal or plastic roof like this one I think a 4" x 6" header across the top and post every 8' should be more than adequate. But for a plywood and shingle roof I would use 2" x 8" rafters on 16" instead of the 2" x 6" on 16' center rafters used on this
Agree with most comments about overkill with a 4x12, but main objection is cheap, corrugated, plastic roof cover. First hail storm will make swiss cheese out of that crap roof. Even corrugated meta would last a little longer.
Wow, that patio cover is actually a piece of junk. The flashing is done wrong. It's supposed to be tucked under the bottom of the siding, not on top. Whoever did it was too lazy to pull the bottom of the siding out, remove the lower nails and tuck it under, so they caulked the top. No need for the braces between the 2x6's, it's an option to eliminate sway. The roof is leaking in spots, hence the water damage occurring on some of the wood. 2x4's are adequate, depending on the length to the outside posts. Hopefully the ledger board bolts are sunk into frame and not just into the siding. The 4x4 posts are fine, but with the weight of the 2x6's on it, 4 posts are necessary, but the 6 are actually fine, but awkward as hell. Raise it higher for more slope? Then there would be not enough slope for proper drainage.
He totally ignored all the things done wrong to point out that he would PREFER less posts. It’s rare to find a “home inspector” that actually knows what he’s talking about. But, fear and ignorance by the average buyer and popularity of everybody else using an inspector keep this market rolling.
Well, if the home you're intending to purchase has been "Rube Goldberg'd" by the owner, an inspector is worth the cost. Especially if you try to make an improvement and learn after the fact the changes to the 'Rube Goldberg'd" home had never been permitted in the first place. Then its on you.
@@photog1529 I have no idea what you mean by “Rube Goldberg’d”. Poor guy. It appears that your using his name in an attempt to trash some work by someone who built or owned a house you bought without fully checking it out. Which proves my statement about ignorance by would-be buyers. Remember, the word ignorance means that one just doesn’t know. Due diligence to exercise caveat emptor and fully check out anything (be it a pair of socks or a mansion) before buying it is key to making a good purchase that you’ll continue to be happy with. Sorry Mr. Goldberg if I’ve been anything less than careful with your name. And, yes, a GOOD inspector- when one can be found- is worthwhile in helping to find those hidden “gems” performed by not so experienced people who have believed they could do it themselves. Point here is, if you haven’t got the expertise, then hire someone who does. By the way, someone else’s not pulling a permit has nothing to do with a present day project. A permit is just a magic piece of paper giving temporary permission to build or improve from the current state. It’s secondary purpose is to generate revenue (taxes and fees) at the local level. It does not necessarily ensure quality workmanship. (Contractor for 20+ years, Carpenter for 27+) Work done in the past falls under existing conditions. The permit allows one to change or add to it but does not require anything more. So, in one sense it is “on you” to make sure you’re making a good purchase. But, in the other sense, it’s not “on you” that someone who owned the house before you didn’t pull a permit. Not knowing Mr. Goldberg I’m inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt and say he may have been doing his best at the time. We all have at times.
@@fomoco300k Lighten up, Francis. 'Rube Goldberg'd' is an old term that means someone attempted a DIY job and effed things up because he or she just wanted a quick repair or didn't want to pay someone else to do it. You must be young or woke. Maybe you'd be familiar with the term 'McGyver'd' instead. Jeezus.
I am going to build a lean connected to my barn app. 12' wide and 26' long. Should I use 2"x4" or 2"x6" for the joists and rafters? How far apart? What size posts? The only weight is metal roofing which is on the side of my barn.
No. Just no. If I wasn’t clear... No!! You cannot span 12’ with teeny tiny lumber and expect it to do anything other than sag. PLEASE hire someone who knows how to build this addition! For your own good....
Thats shit advice...1) 4x6 posts and cross post on top is fine not 4x12 wtf....2) it deff does not need another 4x4 due to the very very light roof they have on it and 3) a gutter is not needed especially if owners want to hear and see the water fall when it rains....bad advice if anything the ony thig wrong with that porch is on the flashinnon top next to home wall should have been culked in between the gooves of roof becasue although there is a slope water can run backwards on a heavy rain day
I'm a home inspector. There is absolutely nothing wrong with this patio cover. All of this means comments are BS. He has no idea what he is talking about, trying to make his job harder then it is and, btw.. the flashing up top y ou u mentioned? Itll work, but it's wrong and will eventually rot the smart siding. You make my profession a joke dude
A double treated 2x8 with 4 posts would suffice just fine on some adequate foots. Not all of those posts seem to be on footings, just the concrete slab.
Also, the flashing is destined to fail being that it is on the face of the T111 siding and not tucked up behind it. It’s completely reliant on caulking and that will inevitably fail and leak which will lead to rot. Otherwise not too bad.
Finally, a reasonable and well thought out comment! Thank you for stating something thought out and respectable and doing it eruditely.
If it were tucked behind it wouldn't that create a situation that traps water behind the siding which will lead to rot?
4x12 horizontal is over kill. But thicker horizontal would be better with less vertical posts. Agree there.
I also live in the pacific NW. A few months ago, we had a huge snowstorm with extremely wet, heavy snow. Happens maybe every 10 years. The header beam not only has to carry the weight of the framing and plastic, it has to carry whatever snow load happens, or it will collapse, and can do serious damage to the wall where it is bolted in.
We are at sea level off interstate 5. At higher elevations, the snow loads get a LOT heavier.
4x12 seems overkill even with fewer posts, but then maybe that Washington rain really piles up. Little more slope and gutters would be a significant improvement.
I grew up in WA. This small slope is common. And within two years the gullies on the plastic roofing will be full of sludge. These types of roofs need to be cleaned with high pressure washers 2 to 3 times a year. They are nice for letting light in, but they do collect crap. If you don't maintain them, they end up looking like crap. Otherwise they are quite nice covers.
@Tedd Schroth There is probably a requirement to accommodate for snow loads.
4x12 is WAY overkill on a bigger patio than this. Especially with todays prices
I'm in a area with heavy snow loads. I'd feel confident with just 4 4x4s in the front. 6x6 if you had to.
Hold up lil homies.... Wouldn't a 4x12@20 be a good enough span for the visual 20ft available? Given the posts are 4 x6's. Idk he's very quick videoed. Help me out here. Also
It would've been good to talk about the post to beam hardware and the post to slab/footing hardware for a more complete run down, in my opinion.
Agree with the larger beam to help carry all that weight from the 2x6s and some additional slope.
We built our cover with 2x4s and it took a 4 ft snow load one winter.
4"x12"? Are you planning on parking a car on it?
I thought the same thing. A 4" x 12"? I thought a 4" x 6" would have been good enough, with post on the ends and every 8'
4x6 is all you need there is no osb or much weight except the 2x6 rafters that plastic roofing is really light and sheds water well
When he said 4x12 he meant 2-2x12 sandwich together! People talking crap usually don't even know how to use a circular saw
@@cannaberx2 no I'd put a 4x6 not a lvl and if you do use 2-2x12s you still have to sandwich half inch plywood between them so that when it sits flush on the 4x4 post instead of being a ¼in short on each side if you only sandwich the 2x12 together
@@cannaberx2 yes that was my guess also, my point was a 4x12 was not needed as a 4x6 with posts every 8' would be more than sufficient for that load
Thank god I watched this, I was going to use 36 inch round concrete columns ,,, whew!
64 " is Better . It's just because i make concrete ...$$$
4 - 6X6 posts and 2x10 header on drip side.
Sounds like a lot of “wants” and “wishes”, without providing any codes or standards references.
Attaching to the house, without a permit, will get you a tear-down violation in my state.
@David Bryant Try to sell your house with an improvement that hasn't been permitted. You'll be forced to take it down, or bring it up to code to make it 'sellable'. Any buyer that agrees to purchase a home knowing the improvements haven't been permitted is just asking for trouble. There is a reason for building codes.
@David Bryant There are reasons for building codes, thank goodness. Just because you don't like being told what to do does not mean that the rest of us don't appreciate the benefits of those rules. You are among the the ones the rules protect us against.
Home Inspectors are not allowed to cite code violations, for liability issues. We are safety inspectors. We identify potential issues that we see and the potential hazards it may pose to the buyer. It is strictly up to the buyer if they wish to further pursue what we identify on our report.
This is a common misconception associated with our inspections. Do I agree with his assessment and would I write it up? Absolutely.
Why? Because if that structure injured someone, who do you think the buyer is going to go after?
That's right...the inspector; because YoU dIdN't PuT iN tHe RePoRt 🙄
The slope exceeds the minimum slope recommended by the manufacturer, it is not a code violation. The 4x4 exceeds the minimum beam size for the span, it is not a code violation. The post spacing is not a code violation. The lack of a gutter is not a code violation.
You know what is important, and you didn't notice? It looks like the "flashing" is attached to the surface of the siding and sealed with silicone, not underneath the siding.
Hard to see in the video, but if it is, that will very likely leak and lead to damage to the structure.
If I had to guess, I'd say that slope is less than 1 in 12.
Just curious, how would you put the flashing underneath the siding when it's solid all the way across
Don't get exsided
I'm a Home Inspector as well. You're right, it doesn't look like the flashing is under the siding. It's a pain to do, but you would cut about two inches above the bottom of the siding and slide the flashing under it.
The post spacing is determined by the live load, snow load and rafter span. All of which is calculated and beyond to scope of a home inspection. However, an inspector should have a rough idea of the beams are too small.
Very good short and simple video, I hope many people view this before they make header size mistakes. Too many times I have seen undersized headers or beams and sagging roofs, especially in the winter as the snow is melting.
4x12, is that person trying to build above that, I might be wrong but the only weight I see on that patio is some 2x6s
He saying that if they had 4x12 or bigger beam u wouldn't need so many posts
@@AJ7- even taking into account the new earthquake standards here in the PNW.? You should see the footer that was required for my neighbors 1 wall up remodel. The one story garage was upsized 1 more story and the outside wall had to be 2x6 and the footer was a massive 2 foot wide 3 foot deep concrete base. I saw that and was stunned and he said the engineers were using the new standards. I said so your addition stands but the old 1962 remainder will fall down? Lol...
@@Eastbaypisces o
@@Eastbaypisces hey but a 4" x 6" should be good enough as the only weight is 2" x 6" rafters and a thin plastic roof
@@AJ7- in this case a 4" x 6" with posts every 8' would be adequate?
A 4x12? You are out of control. A 4x6 with posts every 8' is totally sufficient for this. There is no load so to speak except the 2x6's. You might get snow, but the plastic will fail before the 4x6 would. Please cite your code source for telling us a 4x12 is best. That's malarky.
This is what I was sayin. We building a deck or a patio cover? These inspectors are out of control. If sandwiched (2) 2x6’s on a notched 6x6 are used on decks and are enough for a shit ton of live load what this guy has should be more than enough unless he’s in a snow area, which like you said the roof will probably fail way before the frame does.
He's from the government and he's there to help!
Reagan was right.
If you listen to him he says to use a 2x10 so you only need 3 posts and have a better view. He was not talking about load bearing.
Double beam 2x8 is the way to go and ya 8’ apart is perfect with that … complete build is trash I would be embarrassed
@Tedd Schroth There is probably a requirement to accommodate for snow loads.
inspector/general 25 yrs. As an inspector it’s not your place to critique the construction if it appears to be non-standard for the municipalities building standards it should be called out. That’s for the municipality to Judge. It’s your job to state if it’s safe or unsafe.
The ledger board bolts are too far apart as this installation probably needs a bolt every 18", it has at least one improper footing (pier blocks aren't allowed by code), the vinyl roof panels may not be adequately rated for the snow load in your(our) area, each post needs bracing, not just the outer ones. If they had used a 4x8, 2x10 or greater, they could have spanned the width with 3 posts. This cover definitely wasn't engineered or permitted, so if the city catches it, it most likely will have to be removed.
Different cities have different codes, that’s why I live in an area where that’s not so important. Think about the people buying a house after someone else’s crappy remodel or improvement
Cool video, will definitely look for more like this. We occasionally get deep snow and I remember several marinas with boat covers collapsed under the weight of the snow, especially when it started raining and the snow got really heavy.
I am a 16 year home inspector. Yes the beam is undersized. Corrugated roofs are ok at that pitch. The ledger board cannot be attached to the siding. It should be attached to the framing of the structure. There are insufficient amounts of lag screws. Nails are not able to withstand sheer force. The flashing should be tucked under the siding so that it acts as counter flashing. Caulking will wear out and leak. The posts are missing 1" stand off bases. Other than that the rest is just opinion and a lot was missed.
Does your area require 1" stand offs for the posts?
I can surely use a or I meant build a patio cover in this texas sun before summer time...hmmm...thanks so much for the information...I learned a whole bunch.
Double 2x6 or 2x8 beam 1/2 inch plywood sandwich is plenty...flashing on top should be taller so splashing dosent rot bottom of siding...
Those who can do, those who can't are inspectors
Always nice to see the weekend warriors come out and give their opinions. This guy was spot on but hey, just a home builder who knows the importance of building to code talking. Thank you sir for an excellent post.
If they had attached it to the house any higher, they would have been above the band board, that they needed to bolt to. So, how do would they anchor it?
@@jayhaines1792 find and lag into the studs. It wouldn't be hard. I'd be willing to bet they couldn't comfortably reach higher with their ladder and went with it
@@Beandiptheredneck in my area, there has to be a band board. The studs aren't thick enough to lag into, due to the size of the lag that's used.
@@jayhaines1792 are you referring to the rim joist of the floor? Because anything else is still going to be mechanically fastened to the studs somehow
Holy crap I've literally been to this house.
is it true in Seattle if you build this that you must let one homeless person stay under it at all times?
Yes or the mob will burn it down.
Ah heck, they'll want to burn it down anyway.
:47 It's built well everywhere but it seems like they skimped on lag bolts. Didn't think you could use deck screws or common nails.
Thanks from ten years ago
Wouldn't raising it higher give less slope not more? You want side away from house lower not higher for water run off.
The entire thing should have been "raised".
It's low as it is. And there should be more slope.
Too little slope and water can be blown up the slope.
He was stating the entire thing should be higher, more slope, and to equate for the load and short beam, it should have been raised up. Many time he explains why
Raise it on the house side is what he meant.
You can see where it's been leaking - a lot. 32:00
And it doesn't need a 4X12. Not per code and not for any reason.
Does that ledger have to be bolted to the sheathing? or over the siding it's ok?
@@titanpaintingremodeling7418 The ledger gets bolted to the framing as the sheathing isn't strong enough.
Fast forward ten years and people are waiving the inspection and paying 10%-20% over asking price.
2 of the posts have footings? That looks really stupid. 4x12 would be too much.2x8 maybe max. Good video
4x12? There's no need for that. If there's a concern about snow loads (PNW gets wet, heavy snow on occasion) that crappy translucent "roof" will fail long before anything else. A 4x8 might be nice though, and could catch the rafters as well.
It's Seattle. 1 inch of snow is a national emergency and they close the city down. There are no snow loads
@@ceruleanspirit I used to live in Seattle, and we got snow back in the 90s. Not often, but we did. I guess things have changed?
In my very honest and humble opinion, I would have used 4 posts with 4"×6" or just 6"x6". A 3" more slope for the rain with the rain gutters .
actually the flashing on top of the corrugated roof was not done correctly and you said it was "really, really good"....NOT ! ... you'd be wrong about that
The post and beam structure here is perfectly legit. His "we would like to see" has nothing to do with acceptable loading. There may be more posts because of a lack of footings. Putting more posts is acceptable over 4" flat concrete. It is also an architectural choice. And a gutter. Are you kidding me. What he didn't call out was the lack of sufficient number of lag bolts to secure the ledger.
Wouldn’t a couple of 2 x 6’s to form a 4 x 6 on the leading edge be enough? I agree with the 4 x 4 being insufficient, they used 2 x 6’s everywhere else.
Double 2x6s need lots of fasteners to hold it together which mars the appearance.
Hey Joe Brock, I am a remodeling and new construction contractor. If I may recommend, use 6x6 posts, 2x10 header with 2x8 rafters on 16" centers. The small added cost will save you down the road and give you peace of mind when you are finished. I am in the middle of a 12x36 deck with a porch roof. For joists on the deck I used 2x10's. This will allow my customer to one day turn this area into living space.
But trust me, you want to go beyond minimum spans. Also, build in multiples of 4.
sounds excessive. 2x10 header? 2x8 rafters? thats huge
And here I am nailing a 2x4 to soffet area running 2x4s and tossing galvanized pool wall overlapped. After a year or so I definitely did not need 4x6 and 2x6 or 8 to support 50 lbs of flat roof. Not tryi g so support Dumbo, should he fly by and take a break. LOL
Thank you for making this video. It helped me immensely!
Iam sure any improvements and up grades he can give you his brother in law's phone number
Our buildings lasted longer In the days where we had no inspectors
Polycarbonate plastic panels? They photochemically degrade over time. 8 to 10 years of life. I replaced mine with fiberglass panels that can be easily repaired. The polycarbonate panels had turned to dust... no repairing .
Ok flight crew, prepare for landing
I live in Oregon in a 70s neighborhood. I can't understand why the builders didn't cover ANY of the patios on any of the houses in my neighborhood.
people were as cheap then as they are now
4 x 12! Dang!
Just a doubled up 2x12 no big deal
@@justinballard7242 Double 2x12 needs lots of fasteners to hold it together which mars the appearance.
Yep thought 4" x 6" was good enough with posts every 8'
@@RossMalagarie You really have to look at what your local code says. Generally, 4x6 is adequate for certain distances depending on factors, such as your local snow load, wind criteria, how long the joists are and what the joist spacing is. These covers really need to be engineered and put through the permit process. This particular cover wouldn't pass inspection for several different reasons.
that flashing didn't look like it was set underneath the siding as it should be
Wil Morris not necessarily should the flashing be set underneath that like saying lets cut the stucco and put flashing underneath well guess what when you do that your creating a spot for water to get into the house when it was already sealed duh.
You’re right! This guy Tim Buchanan have no idea what he’s talking about. First of all this is not stucco, it’s t-111 siding and the ledger is supposed to be fastened directly to the studs. Flashing goes underneath the siding and house wrap and the same goes for stucco siding.
@@timbuchanan7264 Says the guy that didn't catch the 10 lags and countless screws in to the siding creating water issues...
Yeah, they probably could have made their cuts, then tucked flashing under+behind the siding. Not hard to do. just more efforts and work... But... That's what it takes, doing things the right way.
@@Tkt-mw1jn when you attach the ledger directly to the house by cutting the siding or stucco you create a spot for water to get in. If you leave the stucco or siding then attach the ledger water can't get in. It's not rocket science. Maybe you don't know what your talking about.
Jim, I'm planning on building a patio cover. This video is very informative. Thanks.
My patio cover was unpermitted..just found out today. I had to demolish my garage a month ago. The inspector came and told me to remove my patio roof and the bathroom next to it. I was so pissed..
I didnt know it didnt have a permit. This sucks.
CMA Nurses
Eric X tell him to eat shit! It's your house not his.
Also, if you do a remodel or expansion over a certain size you may be required to bring the whole house up to modern code.
If you bought the house this way you may have legal recourse against the seller.
@@lelandsmith2320 Unless he is dead, or sold the house AS IS which is how I plan to sell mine. I am sure my finished basement was unpermitted when I bought the house and they didn't say shit then, don't come complaining now.
@@integr8er66 Well, if you try to sell the home and the buyer's inspector finds out the basement wasn't permitted, you could be in for a surprise...you may lose the sale and/or be forced to bring it up to code (proper ingress/egress, windows, ventilation, etc.). Your mistake when originally purchasing the home is your mistake, not the potential buyer's.
lol 2x4 in general hold up extremely well matter fact homes are built with 1x3” so a patio with only 100-200lbs ontop ain’t going anywhere with these 2x6 used!!!
Home inspectors...the mall cops of the real estate industry.
These all sound just like comments from you. Example: you mentioned that it was sloped but you would like to have seen a "little more" slope?? You have a responsibility to tell someone if they got it right or got it wrong. You are not a policy maker you are only to show if proper slope was achieved or not. People do not hire you for your opinion. What if the slope was spot on but your opinion swayed someone. Even if you are an engineer why should correct work be negatively commented on or vice versa for incorrect work. I sold a house that not only met code it went beyond code in many areas yet the inspector for the buyer put his opinnions in as "gosple". He created huge problems that had to be sorted out by hiring an engineer that showed everything was in compliance. (The original inspector had to pay the $800 engineering bill!)
@@ChapmanClips And guys like you, who have no Realtor experience, give their opinions on real estate when you have no idea what you're talking about.
Keep telling yourself that if it makes you feel better. I make six figures with my "zero experience in life" as a realtor.
Hell it's so easy that i have no idea why i keep getting more and more clients every year :)
Chapman Clips I completely agree. Especially concerning occupational differences. Home inspectors and realtors are not builders yet they like to make everyone think their experts in all trades. Home inspectors were supposed to be "code" inspectors not building inspectors. Big difference. Same goes for realtors. They sell property, period. The majority of realtors I've known know nothing about construction, history of the property or demographics of the neighborhood. Their salespeople who make their living off selling. Some do it successfully others they get by. However, they're not building experts. Computers and the internet have changed occupations over the years. Automobile salesmen have decreased because people are realizing they can do their own research online, pick out a car and go pick it up. How soon will it be before the public does the sale in the real estate industry. Not beating up on realtors or inspectors, but when you try to act like like a master of all knowledge, you will suffer for it in the long run.
I can see a lot of water penetration running on the beam above de posts.
Flashing against the wall pretty short and also needed to be caped with a 1x4 and caulked top of the board
Looks like a kid built it, need to consider snow weight
That "plastic glass" is called polycarbonate. You'd think an inspector would know that.
Someone spent a lot of money to do this, even if they intended to pass the costs to someone else. A 4 x 12 shouldn't be needed for a patio cover support, and a patio cover shouldn't be 'winked' into a balcony atop a half dozen lag bolts. Was this a 'creeping contractor construction (and retouch, and retouch, and so on) or an enclosable patio? That water damage looks like it was planned, it is so widespread.
4x12 for the beam lol? This guy shouldn't be a property inspector if he thinks that is required ffg or this roof by any means.
You can do it right or do it to code. For the weight these 4x4 are fine...if not ugly. If we permit ugly aluminum awning companies to have those little 1x1s those 4x4 are more of such a light weight with down or uplifting. Many ways to skin a cat!
Why would an inspector care about gutters? There weren't any gutters on the slab below. The water goes to the same place.
Thank you for this video. Would you be comfortable if I installed a 6x12 on top of a 6x6 post? (With no notch) just place on top with brackets. Like this video. This is a 16x32 lean-to roof with 5- 6x6 posts 8 feet apart 12 feet high on the wall and drops to 8 feet where the post are. Thank you for any future and all the advise from previous videos.
Is the flashing behind the siding?
With such a low slope that flashing is not going to keep the water away from the side wall. This inspector has some deficiencies.
That's my thinking, also.
Excellent info
Seattle has laws on building but none on the lawlessness? Sounds about right
Jim- great vid. I have a question; Is it ok to attach a pergola to a house without using a ledger board? In other words, just screwing the joists directly into the stucco on the house? I have seen a few photos where that has been done and it sure seems like it would work.......? Thanks from California
Jinx D.Clown
No! It’s critical and code to have a ledger especially on stucco. Unless you’re doing a freestanding cover you have to cut out an opening and expose the studs and fasten the ledger directly to the stud. Install a weep screed/drip screed underneath both stucco and house wrap and counter-flash it with an “L” flashing.
The flashing and drip screed goes on before ledger
No!!
No problem
This is why you should submit plans to the building inspector before diving in.
Thanks for the advice!
Do you have snow loads? 4x4's are plenty for that application. And you'd want to shorten the posts by 2". I'm a plumber and I'm a better carpenter than you.
Good jobs
thanks for this video post, Im about to design a simular patio cover for my home. I will for use 4x6's and no 2x4's !
Built plenty of patio and porch coverings with nothing but a double 2×6 leading edge beam and it withstood West Virginia mountain snow load just fine. The only thing a building inspector knows is what an engineer writes down in a code. As a tractor trailer mechanic I can confidently state that engineers design shit that fails all the time.
What was your max span with double 2×6?
@Lee G that depends. Is the edge of the slab on top of a footer?
Is it a wooden porch with the post set on a poured column?
Is it a block wall that's already on a footer with a slab on top?
Are you trying to test me because you disagree with my comment or are you asking in earnest?
Is a hundred year old balloon framed house on a stacked stone Foundation with no footer at all, still standing because it was a substandard structure?
@Lee G check your local codes to keep yourself out of trouble - but if it's 9 inches thick at the last two feet, I can't see why you'd have any issues setting your posts on top of the existing concrete, as long as they are well secured to the slab.
If you want more overhang and to get your posts further out past the slab, people set posts on top of two foot deep, sono-tube poured columns all the time and use post brackets to secure them.
@@jamese9283 8 ft.
Lag bolt every 6 feet on the ledger? Not good. Also need to verify what type of nails were used on the joist hangers.
We building a deck or a patio cover? Realistically speaking unless they’re in snow areas this would be more than suffice for rain.
Does this ledger have to be bolted attached to the sheathing of the home?
What holds it down when the wind picks up?
plastic clear glass? corrugated plastic roof panel?
6x6 times 3. Flashing was inadequate.
Why do some posts have deck blocks? Those deck blocks look like a trip hazard, not fun on cement. Otherwise it looks ok i guess.
Seems like those posts with the blocks were added later because of the excessive deflections of 4x4 “beams”...
This all sounds like the way HE would want it.....
That new patio roof looks bitchin.!
Actually, it looks like crap.
How many posts is 100% something the owner should decide so long as there are enough to support the weight. Also that far from the house foundation gutters should be optional. If it was me and you made me add a gutter against my will I would add it and add a downspout at every post
Would 3 6x6 vertical posts and a 6x6 beam been sufficient?
That’s perfect
Notch the post and add two 2"×8" boards together, secure it to the Post using two lag bolts at each post and that should be strong enough.
Little slope more posts for a better snow load ! Da !
Lol this is funny. "Add a few posts" hahah that 4x4 is holding that patio cover just fine. It's got a clear roof on it not 1000lbs of shingles. U should avoid giving advise since you don't understand what your talking about.
he said there only needs to be 3... open your ears
needs to be strong to handle a snow load .. silly .. not overbuilt
he said it needs ANOTHER post. 1:23
He said those posts should of been bigger to use less posts.
But with the size that's on there now, he says it needs another post.
avoid commenting on my posts, if you don't comprehend.
He mentioned it needed another post because it's missing one. The spacing is greater there than between all the other posts.
His concern was that the horizontal beam was only a 4x4. That small of a beam, in his estimation, would require another post. You can see that 2 posts have already been added after the fact and that there is one span that is larger than the others. His recommendation is to use a bigger beam so that you can use fewer posts.
I appreciate it
About to have this very thing done is 6x6x12 better than 4x4x12?
If you want it for the looks, but for a metal or plastic roof like this one I think a 4" x 6" header across the top and post every 8' should be more than adequate. But for a plywood and shingle roof I would use 2" x 8" rafters on 16" instead of the 2" x 6" on 16' center rafters used on this
I was wondering, what’s with the Two Toe Stubbier’s.
When your post is a few inches short.
It seems more like an opinion than an actual inspection report. Does this meet code?
Jack De Haan No way
Agree with most comments about overkill with a 4x12, but main objection is cheap, corrugated, plastic roof cover. First hail storm will make swiss cheese out of that crap roof. Even corrugated meta would last a little longer.
What about diagonal bracing?
flashing installed so incorrectly
Wow, that patio cover is actually a piece of junk. The flashing is done wrong. It's supposed to be tucked under the bottom of the siding, not on top. Whoever did it was too lazy to pull the bottom of the siding out, remove the lower nails and tuck it under, so they caulked the top. No need for the braces between the 2x6's, it's an option to eliminate sway. The roof is leaking in spots, hence the water damage occurring on some of the wood. 2x4's are adequate, depending on the length to the outside posts. Hopefully the ledger board bolts are sunk into frame and not just into the siding. The 4x4 posts are fine, but with the weight of the 2x6's on it, 4 posts are necessary, but the 6 are actually fine, but awkward as hell. Raise it higher for more slope? Then there would be not enough slope for proper drainage.
2by 6s are necessary for a snow loading ... If there was no snow fall 2by 4 would work .. you berk
THE FLASHING GOES OVER THE BOTTOM SIDING AND UNDER SHINGLE AT TOP ROBBIE MY BOY YOU DONT WANT WATER UNDER THE SIDING NOW DO WE?
Your wrong
The beam was fine.
Thanks for the tips
Needs diagonal bracing
He totally ignored all the things done wrong to point out that he would PREFER less posts. It’s rare to find a “home inspector” that actually knows what he’s talking about. But, fear and ignorance by the average buyer and popularity of everybody else using an inspector keep this market rolling.
Well, if the home you're intending to purchase has been "Rube Goldberg'd" by the owner, an inspector is worth the cost. Especially if you try to make an improvement and learn after the fact the changes to the 'Rube Goldberg'd" home had never been permitted in the first place. Then its on you.
@@photog1529 I have no idea what you mean by “Rube Goldberg’d”. Poor guy. It appears that your using his name in an attempt to trash some work by someone who built or owned a house you bought without fully checking it out. Which proves my statement about ignorance by would-be buyers. Remember, the word ignorance means that one just doesn’t know. Due diligence to exercise caveat emptor and fully check out anything (be it a pair of socks or a mansion) before buying it is key to making a good purchase that you’ll continue to be happy with.
Sorry Mr. Goldberg if I’ve been anything less than careful with your name.
And, yes, a GOOD inspector- when one can be found- is worthwhile in helping to find those hidden “gems” performed by not so experienced people who have believed they could do it themselves.
Point here is, if you haven’t got the expertise, then hire someone who does.
By the way, someone else’s not pulling a permit has nothing to do with a present day project. A permit is just a magic piece of paper giving temporary permission to build or improve from the current state. It’s secondary purpose is to generate revenue (taxes and fees) at the local level. It does not necessarily ensure quality workmanship. (Contractor for 20+ years, Carpenter for 27+)
Work done in the past falls under existing conditions. The permit allows one to change or add to it but does not require anything more.
So, in one sense it is “on you” to make sure you’re making a good purchase. But, in the other sense, it’s not “on you” that someone who owned the house before you didn’t pull a permit. Not knowing Mr. Goldberg I’m inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt and say he may have been doing his best at the time. We all have at times.
@@fomoco300k Lighten up, Francis. 'Rube Goldberg'd' is an old term that means someone attempted a DIY job and effed things up because he or she just wanted a quick repair or didn't want to pay someone else to do it. You must be young or woke. Maybe you'd be familiar with the term 'McGyver'd' instead. Jeezus.
Should you caulk the joint between the knee brace and the post/beam?
I am going to build a lean connected to my barn app. 12' wide and 26' long. Should I use 2"x4" or 2"x6" for the joists and rafters? How far apart? What size posts? The only weight is metal roofing which is on the side of my barn.
No. Just no. If I wasn’t clear... No!!
You cannot span 12’ with teeny tiny lumber and expect it to do anything other than sag. PLEASE hire someone who knows how to build this addition! For your own good....
Would you use lag bolts or lag screws to attach to house? And what size bolts? ( length) thanks
No.
Thats shit advice...1) 4x6 posts and cross post on top is fine not 4x12 wtf....2) it deff does not need another 4x4 due to the very very light roof they have on it and 3) a gutter is not needed especially if owners want to hear and see the water fall when it rains....bad advice if anything the ony thig wrong with that porch is on the flashinnon top next to home wall should have been culked in between the gooves of roof becasue although there is a slope water can run backwards on a heavy rain day
The dude sounds like an asshole, it’s their property and their money, unless ya wanna pay for it yourself?
I'm a home inspector. There is absolutely nothing wrong with this patio cover. All of this means comments are BS. He has no idea what he is talking about, trying to make his job harder then it is and, btw.. the flashing up top y ou u mentioned? Itll work, but it's wrong and will eventually rot the smart siding. You make my profession a joke dude
"It'll work, but its wrong". Yeah, I'll want you inspecting a property for me. Talk about a joke.
Plastic clear glass?