So about this Israel Folau situation | A Squidge Aside
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- Опубликовано: 18 сен 2024
- Two years ago, Israel Folau was the star of Australian rugby, the gliding record-breaker who you paid to see. A few tweets later, you find stars in the words used to describe him, the man dropped by the Wallabies and now more associated with homophobia than hotstepping. Squidge Rugby investigates Folau's dismissal by Rugby Australia, and the debate surrounding his recent actions...
If you've enjoyed any of the channel's content, you can also support Squidge Rugby on Patreon by visiting / squidgerugby , so I can buy LEGO or something to help me get out of Folau's headspace.
Would have liked to see him sit down for a friendly chat with the gentleman that is Nigel Owens
I think both would be civilized.
1969cmp - agree...civilised, respectful but disagree. It's a shame others can't seem to interact in the same way. as evidenced by this video.
Owens has publicly stated that whilst he disagrees with folaus behaviour posting those tweets, that folau and Billy vunipola have been nothing but respectful towards him. And that he would ref both of them again with no issue.
David Jennings if only it were that simple. I’m sure they would be both civilised but then Nigel Owens probably wouldn’t be too bothered.
However for any young gay rugby player who idolised Falou I’m afraid it’s not such civilised behaviour from him. He has abused his position in life to make others feel less than him and his righteous religion and for that I have no sympathy for him. He is trying to perpetuate the myth that being gay is somehow wrong and shameful and that’s even if you take his comments outside of the context of religion.
@@ahlads Then we need to ban Abrahamic religions which advocate for the persecution of homosexuals. If it's so horrible to express this point of view out loud, then do you tolerate the existence of these very belief systems that lead to this point of view in the first place?
20 minutes long but takes me 2 hours to finish as i pause everytime i see subtitles
Well @@mikespearwood3914 why are you wasting your time here then leaving nasty comments? Do us all a favour and fuck off.
@@mikespearwood3914 make sure you keep giving him views and comments though!
Guys he's kidding, laughing at all the funny captions that show up, not hating
@@reb2258 it's been a year, but I think it's still worth noting that they were talking about a deleted comment of someone else
@@crizzl380 i see, thank you :)
This channel will blow up. Cant wait for more content during the worlds. Keep it up bro
As Gerry Thornley in the Irish Times said, Folau has the right to free speech but Australian rugby has the right not to be associated with that speech.
@Spoon
Yes you are right , wether we agree or not, Falou is very aware of that as far as Rugby Australi is concerned, So lets forget about all the little details and go back to basics, He was very aware of his employees views and had been warned, Yet he decided to ignore his warning, Whose fault is it that he is where he is now ,? Well its his isnt it, He had a choice to leave, and say what he wants , Or to stay , and keep his views private, But he decided to stay and continue the same behavior, You dont have to be a rocket scientists to see that he has done it to himself, He made a conscious choice
@Spoon oops sorry, didn't mean to lecture you
Israel should be allowed to speak his mind.
I'm not against homosexuality in any way
His religious beliefs are his and that is what he believes.
Rugby Australia should keep quiet Israel is not giving the brilliant Sport of rugby a bad name it has nothing to do with rugby it is "His religious beliefs"
He can still play the game just as good if not better
Rugby Australia Please grow up and see things as they are "REALLY"
@@johnkewley He is allowed to speak his mind. No one is stopping him. But whether he likes it or not he represents his country. His country has every right not to be associated with his ideas.
@@johnkewley You break the rules of the job you are disciplined. Not sure how this is escaping you :/
Personally I hope he signs for Stade Francais,
That way he can spend the rest of his career in a Pink Shirt.
You win.
Even better if they change to rainbow shirts :)
Trump means fart in Scotland pink if you didn’t know was considered to be a Colour for boys and that only changed early last century. So not as uncomfortable as you think.
@@Brad-il9mw or pink as the colour that homophobes don't want to be seen wearing.
The alphabet people commit suicide far more frequently than the general population because the issues they are dealing with are far more serious and complicated than the general population. It is not because they are abused. It is because of what they are and cannot deal with. Stop trying to shame and blame others for problems that they did not create nor have any role in solving. Grow up FFS.
If you are not at least 5 things on Folous list you're boring and we can't be friends
Hell, let's make a weekend of it and work through the whole list. :D
dannyboywhaa hi list was literally, drunks, yer I don’t mind a drink so yea me, homosexuals, yea not me but each to there own, adulterers, not me, liars, not going to lie I’ve told a few lies in my time and if you say you have not your a bigger lier then most of us, fornicaters, who hasn’t, thieves also not me, atheists, 100% me who believes in children’s stories and idolaters, not me so I literally got 4 the list your pulling is from thin air, the list is in this video maybe have a look haha
@@dannyboywhaa3146 What list are you talking about? The Bible endorses slavery, child molestation, incest. None of which are on this list for that reason. But getting drunk condemns us to hell 😂😂
I can't get laid so I only have 4.
@@adsensedd I suppose I could take one for the team and get you up to six.
As a Dragons supporter I do not now fear hell. It can’t be worse than giving up my time to go to Rodney Parade.
I mean at least the Dragons are real...
@@saoirsedeltufo7436 You could have fooled me!
Well if you heard if you go to hell you will burn forever of time but won't die. Want to feel that for eternity?
@@woak1679 that is your perception of hell
u will regret that decision[if u reject god when god puts his appearance on this earth and judges all from the gates of hell open and u get one glimpse of it ur going to repent faster than a minute to another minute but it will be too late because the grace of god which he has shown to us by keeping us alive cuz it is wriitten that it is because of his compassion y we are alive and it is written that whom he chasteneth he loveth and whom he correcteth he loveth and that god is love. that grace and mercy will be no more because u would have received enough time to repent of your sins] hell is hotter than the sun because it is the anger of god manifested because it is written a fire is kindled in my wrath [ Gods talking]
So Stuart Hogg is the best fullback in the world now?
you spelled *Willie Le Roux wrong there buddy
liam williams mate
Hogg has the best wig in world rugby. No doubt about that.
Nah bro Folau was never the best fullback in the first place. He’s an amazing winger but Cheika plays him fullback. Ben Smith has that title if not Hogg or Le Roux
Indiana Williams Ben Smith has been playing on the wing a lot more recently, if Hogg didn’t get injured in the six nations then we probably would have beaten wales and England
Massively important video from one of the best rugby creators out there, really appreciate the time and effort that went into this and the patience to explain the issue to those who don't understand or agree and that's honestly amazing, thank you!
“Supporting the Dragons” as a dragons fan, I can confirm it is hell.
squidge looks like randall from monsters inc.
Leo H sssh you hear that? It’s the winds of change
@@crazyforcoffee5950 Surprisingly appropriate for this video
Ikr
Never written a comment on any RUclips video before, but feel compelled to do so after watching this video. I have enjoyed your videos for a while now and find them insightful, informative, funny and I love the analysis but this is the best to date. Not that it makes any difference but I’m a middle aged straight armchair rugby fan who couldn’t agree more with your eloquent message in this video and more power to you to keeping on pushing it out. Keep on using your platform for saying what so many of us feel.
Well said.
And in the same light israel folau should sit down and shut up cause he's in the public eye. C'mon it's so easy to see the hypocrisy of the left.
@@jeffjefferson3364 what are you hoping for? Dan made no mention of what Israel should do. Squidge Rugby makes the explicit point that Israel is a bigot and that he should stop being bigoted because being bigoted is, by definition, a bad thing.
By the way 'the left' is not, by definition, a bad thing. Please stop being bigoted.
@@ed1726 bigoted in your opinion. I do believe folau is bigoted but that's not illegal in itself. You have to actually do something to discriminate others for it to be illegal.
Dan is suggesting squidge speak his views from his soap box with all of his followers watching which is apparently great.
Yet folau cannot speak cause he's in the public eye. But so is squidge rugby? So if one is allowed to express their opinion surely both are, and squidge rugby has been far less respectful to folau than folau has been to those who don't agree with his religious beliefs.
Listen to the language both use squidge has no right to be so self righteous with the way he's talking which is far more offensive.
@@jeffjefferson3364 If you say something is my opinion then you state a truism. This is pointless. However that's not really what you are saying, what you are saying is that I am wrong but that you don't know why and can't make a logical argument against it so are forced into an illogical argument.
No one said Folau should be arrested. Squidge said he doesn't agree with what Folau has said and that he finds it objectionable. He then carefully listed his objections.
Dan agrees with Squidge so therefore he logically would agree that Squidge should express his views. This seems entirely reasonable to me. Squidge has viewers because people like his content, again this seems completely reasonable.
Squidge explicitly says that Folau does have free speech and should have free speech. He does say he has more responsibility due to his public position but this is simply true.
I don't know how you can accuse Squidge of being self righteous because if telling people they are going to hell isn't self righteous then I don't know what is.
Really cool to see you using you platform for this kind of message. Respect x
I respect his right to practice his religion within reason and have his own opinions, I also respect his employers right to remove employees who do not coalesce with company views and policies
That's illegal if it's because of someone's religion. In Australia anyway.
Mr. M precisely
Yet they employed him with full knowledge of his stance. So its total bullshit.
Ye convict him of wrong think!!! Straight to gulag!!
What's the phrase people like Christians like to say again...ah, that's right, assimilate or gtfo. He didn't assimilate, so now he's gotta gtfo
Folau seems okay with murderers, dictators and my mother in law.
Does your mother in law play Rugby per chance?
....I hear the aussies are out sourcing new talent at the moment......
Your mother of law is pretty bad tbf
@Berkshire 88 so have christians whats ur point?
@@philipwilliams5808 by that logic everyone who does something bad isnt a christian anymore. Almost all christians dont live by the bible a 100%, thats not an excuse and there have been so many wars in the name of religion, those people are not atheists.
Los die man in vrede, boet
I think this is the best video you have done. Thank you. A lot of this issue stems from the history of missionary work in the pacific islands. In the 19th and early 20th centuries missionaries who spread christianity through the region preached a very conservative theology. It was the same missionaries who introduced rugby to the region.
If this is the best video on this channel, it means you do not watch this enough. I enjoy more the 'rugby' themed videos, if the man is an idiot i don't wanna hear about it.
Did Aberigonals and Pacific Islanders love gays before Christianity?
RealTalkWithTheBison this is the most important video. Rugby games come and go, regardless of the stakes. This is a great video highlighting Israel Folau as being a homophobe and encouraging intolerance for intolerance.
hadyn milton 🤦♂️
Adam, Ashley and Cooper😂😂
Unreal video man lots of love from Ireland 🇮🇪🇮🇪
Actual Irish or lived here for 3 years?
@lizard ledgend Irish.
www.johngrenham.com/findasurname.php?surname=Garry
John Coleman joe Cole
lizard ledgend I’m from Ireland , Kerry
@Tom Garry, it’s a small country, I’m from Limerick and living in Firies parish, living in Kerry 21 years.
Incredible commentary and analysis as always Squidge, keep up the good work.
Awesome video! Great job Squidge, entertaining, educational and hilarious all together. Keep doing what you're doing. The rugby analysis is dopeness but it's taking the time to use your platform to spread important messages like this that should be the responsibility of everyone who has the following to share it with! Outstanding as always!
This is a amazing video it's still as funny as usual but still get's across these main points. This helped my friend as he is gay and is in the rugby community and read Folau's tweets and actually got hurt and lost hope so the second I saw this in my inbox even before I watched it I sent it to him now he's happy and himself again. Thanks you
Bullshit, the world is filled with support for the LGBT community and has been for years now. Rugby has a large gay following and champions (Haskal, Pokock etc.). If this mate of yours is not made up for likes then he is one very weak individual to ignore the masses and listen to one person who is being vilified for his beliefs.
Izzy saying what he said is ok. I’m glad he says what he thinks. I vehemently disagree with him, but that doesn’t make me resent him. Actually, I pity him.
He didn’t say gay people deserve to burn in hell. He said they will. He believes this is a fact because they have disobeyed the commands of an omnipotent being. He truly believes that he is trying to help gay people avoid this eternal torture.
I am sad that he thinks like this, but you cannot coerce someone into believing what you believe. Education is the best chance of helping Izzy. Resorting to name calling is petulant.
On a side note, Rugby Australia has every right to terminate his contract as he breached it.
The thing is, it wasn't in his contract. Does that mean he shouldn't be fired?
Alex Hollywood get what you’re saying. But homophobia shouldn’t exist regardless of belief (I don’t think you’re defending his actions btw). When Folau has a platform as big as he has/had he should know not post any comments based on politics and/or religion. He deserves what he gets not off of just beliefs but off of pure stupidity and arrogance.
Frank Hippolite I didn’t know that. I thought there was a clause in his contract about social media use.
If you’re right, then I don’t think he should be fired, but he should be bought out of his contract for the sake of team cohesion.
hadyn milton well, we can definitely both agree on your first point. Perhaps I’m being naive, but I find myself hoping that his actions were as a result of extremely misguided, yet well intentioned ignorance, rather than arrogance.
Folau may not have said they deserve to burn in hell but he has to adopt that position regardless of whether he says it or not. If he takes the point of view that they do not deserve it then it follows that his God is not just. In any definition of God that I have come across, it is not possible for him to be unjust as he has absolute moral authority. You would be hard pressed to find a devote Christian that would take a view that God is unjust. So, on appearance, he is not explicitly saying that they deserve it but it is a position that he has to hold.
Word is that he has now joined the DUP and will now be holding the British government to ransom lol
So have you been up in arms about the rugby 7s being held in Dubai, from a country were there is horrible repression against LGBTQ people? Seems a bit hypocritical to me
@@aferguson850 what's hypocritical? Are you comparing the DUP's repression of N.Ireland people to that of the people of the UAE. Neither seems right does it?
That’s y Theresa is weak and should of sided with Sinn Fein
There would be no point in even trying to have a coalition with sinn Fein because they refuse to go to the British parliament and wouldn't help Theresa may get bills through as they can't vote if their not there
Sinn Fein are a bunch of IRA scums, Jerry Kelly broke out of the Maze Prison by holding an officer at gunpoint, Gerry Kelly carried the shankill bomber coffin and Michelle O’Neils dad was a hardcore paramilitary man. Sinn Fein are discussing and they side with terrorists
I wish that everyone was shown this video, unbelievable message and perfectly explained.
And mostly nothing to do with the actual legal ramifications.
Thank you for all the videos thus far sir. I enjoy your analysis. You have a fine understanding of the game, and an obvious love for both the sport and Alun Wyn Jones which I find charming. I'm Irish, and I too think the man is a legend, but we are still a bit out of sorts over how Wales duffed us up so convincingly, to win a well deserved Slam. Just wanted to say thanks for making me laugh regularly and now instilling the somewhat faint hope, in the dafter parts of my brain that, perhaps the next time I am feeling down, Michael Hooper just might pop by with 4 beers and a smile to help me through the day.
Thanks Squidge. Keep up the good work.
I think more than simply address the issue at hand, bringing up the often unspoken aspect of freedom of speech that is freedom of consequence was really thoughtful and on point
It's illegal to discriminate against religion and politics in the work place in Australia. He committed no hate crime. The Australian rugby union are now in very very hot water. If they are not careful about how they word what he did to breach his contract in the code of conduct hearing they could end up committing a hate crime themselves.
Adam Porter what a pathetic response, did you watch the video at all? You are grasping at straws to try protect him
Even if there weren’t grounds to fire Folau on grounds of his views, he still directly contravened the terms of his contract.
And to address the idea that they broke any law, how?? Folau is still perfectly free to express his views no one has stopped him from doing that, the Australian Rugby Union have just expressed their own freedom by making it clear they don’t want to be associated with his views
@@keirlamont2806 so in Australia it is illegal to discriminate against political or religious view in the workplace under the fair work act. Israel folau has committed no hate crime.
The fact he was expressing his beliefs and freedom of speech OUTSIDE of the workplace, which was then used against him as a reason to terminate his contract(which is in contradiction to his rights and is superseded by state and federal law in Australia) is illegal.
Even if it was inside the workplace it would still be illegal.
They will have to prove that his comments were a hate crime, and it doesn't seem to be the case. I've seen a video on a rugby show called off the ball which had a lawyer present to question on the situation and even he said he didn't think it was hate speech or hate crime.
Adam Porter you’re still grasping at straws: let’s make this abundantly clear: there were terms in his contract, he broke those terms, that’s not discriminatory that is basic workplace practice
Respect, mate. I'm supporting you all the way!
I have to wonder what Nigel Owen had to say..... Awesome video, well done.
Well done for putting such a clear and well worded piece together. Absolutely nailed it. Really happy to see you not being afraid to show your heart at the end. Rugby can be such a great team sport, it has always saddened me when racism, sexism and homophobia has been tolerated in the changing rooms and elsewhere. I hope this video will go some way to changing all that. Respect!
Do you have any specific episodes of racism in rugby? Names, places, times etc?
@@kenrehill8775 just from playing club rugby over the years in different clubs, racist jokes being told and tolerated, odd racist comments to non white players. Never anything malicious but just that this was considered by some as part of the normal banter. I haven't played for almost 7 years though.
@@jimmydodger4622 right, but it’s not systemic is it?
@@kenrehill8775 no, I don't think so. In fact I think despite this sort of behaviour in club rugby that rugby at the bigger scale makes a very good effort to be inclusive and accepting. Much better than some other sports.
I dont agree with Folau. But everyone has their right to an opinion no matter what it is, not everyone has to agree with it. Also he's not going out and beating up gays or anything. Theres places in the world where gays are murdered. We should help these people and no freak out about tweets...
and RA has the right to fire him. that's what happened, why you acting like he's been martyred? he just got fired, thats it.
He hasn't been thrown in prison for this mate, he's just lost his job.
100% agree that he broke the terms of his contract and so it should be terminated. I'm sure he could have signed elsewhere without those stipulations or responsibilities if his need to post moronic shit was that great.
But 'hate speech' as a concept is equally as moronic. If he was to even post a stupid opinion about one individual because of those or similar reasons, then it would be still construed as hate speech because he would be offending everybody who held the beliefs of that individual. We all belong to multiple groups, and so any negative opinion or question posed to any person or group based on their ideals is 'hate speech'. Most practicing Jews, Muslims and Christians use 'hate speech' , I used 'hate speech' in calling his views stupid, Squidge used 'hate speech' in expressing disdain for his religious views, even calling out radicals from all cultures is technically 'hate speech'. There is only speech, whether it's good or bad depends on your own personal experience, but it's important to hear all opinions so we can converse and decide what to except or avoid as Individuals, and also, in an ever more diverse west, decide which groups can coexist peacefully even in disagreement. A radical Christian believing Gay people be treated or a Muslim believing Gay people should be killed are things we need to hear, and to not be able to question individual or group ideals due to fear of accusations of 'hate speech' and 'hate speech' laws lead to a lot of dark corners to hide in for real evil people willing to actually act on bigoted views.
Great video as usual Squidge!
Spot on m8. They are opening the door to an evil that will eventually consume them all, in the name of "Virtue" and sacrificed on the alter of "Inclusivity". None so blind as those that will not see.
Wow, a well reasoned, entertaining, firm video on a controversial topic that wasn't just a shit throwing contest. Colour me impressed.
So.... why don’t you have a podcast??
A Macdougall I would most definitely watch this
He does ;)
This is such a brilliant, comprehensive and well-argued take (and a genuinely funny video). Thank you for using your platform to stand up for what matters 💘
What is clear is that he has no idea about the law.
"Who deserve fewer rights ..." Where did Folau state that gay people have or should have fewer rights than people of any other sexual orientation? He stated an opinion based on a fundamentalist Christian belief. You obviously don't agree with it, and neither do I, but if you want to practice and be some sort of paragon of inclusivity and tolerance in Rugby, then perhaps you should also be mature enough to tolerate views which don't run parallel to your own ideology. Otherwise, you also come off as the very thing you accuse Folau of being. The name-calling only demonstrates that you're getting far too worked up over this.
Paul Coffield This is the absolute best response I’ve seen to this post and situation. So well said.
1. Anybody else think that this is an orchestrated attempt to have a pre-season at a French club?
2. Brave post Squidge, knowing the backlash from followers of Old Testament angry god. Evolution will look after these guys. I, like many of your fans, are right behind you..... (in a non-gay way)
Love your work.
The post was from the New Testament. Nice try. Old and New Testament God are one. If you think Folau is bigoted and hateful then all Christianity is period. But you know we are not.
Brave post? It would be braver to condemn Rugby Australia. This is a virtue signalling post that panders to the liberal majority. He knows he'll get patted on the back for this one. So no bravery here.
love your channel. best rugby channel out there. And thats coming from a football and rugby fan
Wow I came to read the comments and this is not at all what i expected. You're a wholesome lot aren't you? Squidge I'm so pleased you were open about it good for you
I get the fact that the ARU can sack Folau for breaking the terms of his contract but how is it fair if his contract is different to other players in terms of rights (Obviously wage is unequal). If Folaus freedom of speech is restricted why isn’t every other player following the same terms. Pocock is an environmentalist and posts a lot about environmental and political issues. You can’t pick and choose who gets freedom of speech and who doesn’t. If one person has it then they all have to have it otherwise it’s unfair.
Do you also think NDA's are unfair or that spilling official secrets isnt treason?
The latest reports is that there is no social media clause in the contract that he signed. Sadly, rugby is getting into the business of suppressing religious views and pushing agendas that have nothing to do with rugby. Rugby used to sport that brought people together. I strongly disagree with Folau views but he shouldn't be silenced. The latest actions against him are divisive to the sport.
Even as a overly self loving conservative, Squidge put this really well. He deserves some decent credit for it👍
You say that because he's a Southerner.
Neither Nottingham, Wales or Derby are the south mate
What comes through in this, I think is at the heart of Rugby. Fair representation throughout, with a passion to uphold that fairness. Perfectly explained and bloody well said Squidge.
Totally agree with the opinion vs hate speech stuff but watching this made me think of something: what if, just what if Folau does love everyone (as he says he does) but also genuinely believes what the Bible says about homosexuals going to hell? Is it possible that he is just trying to save their souls from eternal damnation? Has he ever expressed an opinion that suggests he agrees that they SHOULD go to hell? Or is he just trying to warn them so that he can prevent them from going to hell?
Daryl Jones that’s a great question.
And I personally think you’ve answered it yourself. Read the Bible and you see that Christians are taught to pity sinners, but never hate, and still love.
So, if Folau does see it the way you just outlined; is it really hate speech? Furthermore, can you really say that you “totally agree with the opinion vs hate speech stuff”?
@@mylesmw suggesting that all members of a particular societal group should burn in hell is hate speech. It is not an opinion unless the person who said it knows each person in that group individually. Otherwise it is a generalisation. So, yes, I stand by the opinion vs hate speech stuff.
As for what the Bible says I cannot put my faith in a book that encourages a man to sacrifice his daughters to be gang raped and brutally murdered for the sake of a couple of men he's never met!
@@daryljones341 Firstly, he never said they "should" burn in hell. In fact, nor did he even use the phrase "burn in hell".
Secondly, your definition of the word "opinion" is skewed. Whether he knows any person in said "group" or not, that's irrelevant. An opinion is a view that isn't necessarily factually or morally correct. That's it.
So tell me - his opinion is determined by his religious view. He makes that very clear. What do you determine, in all of this, is hate speech?
You can even see in his posts, that are shown in this video, that he is "just trying to warn them so that he can prevent them from going to hell" - these are your words.
This is shown by his post's caption saying "...will end up in Hell unless you repent. Jesus Christ loves you and is giving you time to turn away from your sins and come to him". This is exactly what you were referring to.
So, is that opinion? Or is that still hate speech?
As for your last point - neither can I put my faith in such a book. I am an atheist anyway. But, you do understand the risk of assailing a religious man for expressing religious views, don't you?
I can't believe I didn't know about any of this
(8;30-8:42) made me understand hell better....Thank you
Sakhe tshoni shouldn’t do bad things when u are alive then!!
I have been to hell, and it's real, they told me, to tell homosexual, they are not welcome in hell, only folau, so, Qantas rugby Australia, go and kissed folau, and makeup with folau, and, win the world cup for me, and leave hate to me is my job's, kindly regard! Satan
As a Catholic I would like to what you said about the Bibles ideals hit the nail on the head
Joseph Buckley catholics arent really Christians though are they? Like they have unbiblical beliefs such as confessing to pastor, praying to Mary, and babtism as a baby.
Matthew Olls Catholics are Christans - all non Catholics that call themselves Christian's (Protestants) originally stemmed from the Catholic Church - what the Protestants have done is remove the parts of the Bible they don't like and removed practices for no particular reason
Joseph Buckley that’s hilarious, given Catholics literally made shit up (e.g. purgatory, selling indulgences, the Pope, religious hierarchy) in order to exploit the people, keep them in check and get lots of money
Joseph Buckley oh also the Orthodox Church far predates Catholicism (Catholicism is technically heresy, and was a weird spinoff) so claiming all non-Catholic Christians came from Catholicism is a load of bullshit
Matthew Olls that’s a ‘no true Scotsman’ fallacy. All Christians cherry pick and make shit up because the bible is completely contradictory, so it would be impossible to hold it all. All Christians decide which to ignore and which to uphold. I agree that they believe in some unbiblical stuff but that doesn’t mean they aren’t Christian
I do like your videos but this one wasn't great.
Doesn't agree with gay marriage=Thinks homosexuals are subhuman. Is a massive stretch for an argument. There was a gay man head of 'against gay marriage' campaign in Ireland during the referendum.
Also I really don't agree with that statement "it's not an opinion, it's hate speech." So anything that is classified as hateful isn't a belief or an opinion?
I don't know, I honestly don't agree with "oh you're free to say and think whatever you like, but you'll more then likely be fired if we don't agree with you."
The only real argument they do have is that it was in his contract....but it ain't great. everything else is a stretch.
it's not even a hate crime otherwise the police would have been onto it. Needs incitement to violence which there is not. Our learned video friend is not as learned as he thinks.
Fair play to you, Squidge. Concise and to the point.
Squidge you post some of my favourite content on RUclips let alone Rugby, ✌️🙏, peace be with you bro👍.......Carmarthen Quinns forever👍😀👍👍✌️❤️
We literally have Beale on the team. Have you seen that guys rap sheet? Domestic assault, drink driving, street fights, photo of him with a dude doing ice and more. And we celebrate him as one of our best. But put up some religious quotes and you'll not only lose your job, but your name will be blacklisted from all pro Australian sports lol.
Whataboutisms
Such a good point. You should make a video about that like to keep things a bit more balanced.
Well done Mr Squidge Rugby man. So clearly and eloquently put. I am a Christian and I TOTALLY agree with your take on the bible, the central message is love, and nothing about what Folau did was loving. In fact it makes him a hypocrite for all the reasons you suggested, especially about his contract. Folau is a sinner in need of forgiveness as much as anyone he claims need to 'repent'. Such a difficult video done with care and clarity, nice one.
Your video has some good points but to suggest that Israel doesn't love hate because he doesn't want to marry isn't a strong connection. You got a little to reactive to this. He doesn't believe in the act of homosexuality, so he didn't vote for it to be legalised. It's similar to the abortion debate, just because you don't agree with one side of that debate doesn't mean you don't love the individual.
If you believe someone doesn't deserve a basic human right then you don't love them. That's very simple.
I understand why you are against his opinions, most Wallabies fans agree with you and when he spoke we’re like 🤦♂️🤦♀️, but the sad thing he’s been raised in a highly rigid Pacific Islander Mormon family, and these views have been engrained into him since birth. It’s a societal issue here in Australia, because we have a lot a staunch Christian fundamentalists clashing with the more progressive society as a whole, and most of the said Christian’s come from cultural minorities especially the pacific islands, I as an Australian and wallabies fan feel like we missed a chance to bridge a divide. because both sides are more hardline then ever. And as passionate as you are, and by the way fundamentally correct, this is fuelling the fire, if you have been told something and I mean with the religious righteousness you can imagine Mormon’s would speak with, being attacked from a RUclipsr on the other side of the world would you change your mind or dig your heels in?
We live in strange times when people think the word of the Lord is Hate Speech! #Justice4Folau
Amen
Well done, mate. I don’t agree with all of your views on our favourite game but you’ve hit the nail on the head here. Thanks for the video, for taking a position and for taking the time to make this.
Honestly been waiting for your take all week
Lots of Islanders feel strongly about their Christian faith. Are you saying they're all scumbags?
I hope this scandal and the sheer number of professional rugby players involved in 'liking' folau and billy's posts get World Rugby thinking, as union clearly still has a problem with homophobia amongst players. I think a positive outcome of this fiasco would be that rugby unions and clubs go into hyperdrive working with LGBTQ+ charities to raise awareness and support for these people that would be victimised by bigots such as folau. This problem is not going to go away and it needs to be attacked in a tough but constructive manner.
So they can fuck up each others arse.
You can’t be a victim from Folau’s words if you don’t let it. If an organization fires him for his beliefs so be it. It’s a principle I don’t appreciate but understand. They don’t want to be associated with his opinion.
Rugby should be about rugby. Keep the sjw politics out of it. Just steer clear of politics don’t dive head first into it
You cant force me to like those who fuck other mens arse man , its a disgusting thing you can ever thing of. I got a relative who become one he know he will never come near me.
girshin you don’t appreciate someone being fired for breaching a contract?
@@saoirsedeltufo7436 No because of the wrong reason , the Qantas c.e.o want it not rugby Australia.
Folau also received support from an unlikely place - Liberal Australian member of parliament Tim Wilson, who is gay and proposed to his husband-to-be in parliament while speaking on the same-sex marriage bill in 2017.
‘There is a need for people to be able to express their views on something like religion, and their religious beliefs, without censorship,’ said Wilson, who also had a warning for Rugby Australia.
‘I don’t know the details of the EBA [enterprise bargaining agreement] or the contractual arrangements that sit between them [Rugby Australia] and Israel Folau, but I would have thought that Rugby Australia should be very cautious in how they are conducting themselves.
The reasonable side of the argument. No swearing or insults as in the above video. Here is a man who has every reason to call Folau a bigot but does not. Respect.
This video isn't just about Israel Folau, this video isn't just about Australia, this video isn't just about Rugby, this isn't just about religion, this is video is about the world WE want to live in, and I can only thank you for producing it and spreading love, care, and understanding around the world. most importantly, however, thank you for trying to make the world a better place.
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Probably the most important video you'll ever make! Definitely the best one you've made so far. I'm just gonna put it on repeat all day so the average viewing time gets bumped up just a little bit. I hope everyone watches all 20 minutes and 50 seconds of the video, gives it a thumbs up and comments so that it is spread around the globe and you get a viral video.
Dude - love your Rugby vids, keep them rolling. This Folau guy is a god struck fool. He's used his rugby platform to sell his crappy beliefs - shame on him. Point of fact that has escaped Folau - hes going to hell!!!! why?
He told Rugby Australia he'd walk away from Rugby without delay if he broke his agreement - well he's broken it but hasn't walked. That makes his a liar and as liars are on his list he's off to hell I imagine.
I'll take one Nigel Owens over a million Folaus.
Love rugby and love your work mate - keep it up.
9:31 he did express an opinion tho he didn’t confront anyone no one has to follow him, why shouldn’t he be allowed to voice his views when others can. Plus he said I’m his first tweet there that he LGBTQ people so it isn’t hate speech hate speech would be like ‘I hate all gay people’ rather what he said was while he respects their views he personally doesn’t believe it’s right. I think it’s scandalous that he has lost his job because he voiced his opinions. In 30 years time say theoretically pedophillia is legal and I say I think it’s wrong, surely that’s just free speech furthermore they are born with the feelings it isn’t a choice, the same as LGBTQ while I am not saying they are the same in his mind they are so why shouldn’t he be allowed to say that
Great point
You aren't multi-millionare, who is a role model to fans across a nation and whose views could quote literally make or break young fans. He may express his views, as he has done, but a privatised organisation that pays his salary has every right to nullify a contract that wasn't upheld.
ThisISREALLYDumb yes but that’s my point free speech is where you are allowed to voice your views and so am I and so is he. I think they are in their rights whilst I don’t agree with it . 2 surely you saying you hate him is hate speech which supposedly shouldn’t be allowed 3 yes while you make the point that they don’t hurt anyone he doesn’t agree with it personally so why should he have to agree with it
Niall Dowds but why because he is influential shouldn’t he have free speech and
Niall Dowds they have a right to nullify his contract but I am merely commenting on what he said in the video that he shouldn’t be allowed to voice his views because people agree with it, people aren’t forced to follow his twitter or see it, they choose to
I salute you!
This is the perfect answer!
Sad thing is that even if Israel quits rugby , he is still gonna make mad money doing lecture tours and talk shows with the american right after they paint him as some kind of free speech "martyr" and a "persecuted" christian. It fits their narrative well.
Hows Australia been doing since they sacked Folau to appease their LGBT Gods
Fuck homophobes
I wondered where that phrase came from, I’ve being saying it for years:
It’s important to be intolerant of intolerance.
I will not tolerate your intolerance John.
@Monaleenian I used to live in no 1 Compostella, are you being oppressed?
@995sean so we should criminalise homosexually again?
Are the homosexuals oppressing you?
@@ClannCholmain no cause that would be intolerance. You can hold intolerant views all you want but it's acting upon those views that's the problem.
If the ARU came out and publicly made a statement where they expressed support for all members of the community id be ok and even said they think folau is going to hell for what he said I'd be ok with it. But acting on their intolerance by taking away his livelihood is too far.
If you start doing that they Christians can sack atheists, straight people could sack employees seen at gay pride parades. It's a rabbit hole we don't want to go down
@995sean Okay, go to hell!
How does that sound?
Best line I’ve heard on this topic “no one looks at a racist and think hmm” this is bullying and belittleing LGBT community members which is not fair on another human
great vid squige. As an Australian I am disappointed in what has happend and completely agree that folou is a twat. I was one of those kids who had a poster of Folou on my wall, and after seeing the things he had said late last year I tore it down. Thanks Squige. Great vid
No he voted no on the vote because it is his part of his religion he is saying he loves everyone but would vote no on same sex marriage based off his religious beliefs
Couldn’t agree more with everything you said in this video. We simply do not have time for these attitudes in sport anymore.
Mad respect, bugger Folau. Despite the fact he's world class the beautiful game we all love doesn't need this hatred!!
Acid Rain84 literally ‘bugger’? ;)
What you actually say you don't need God and His word, you will then definitely meed those baby killers and sodomites in hell.
Folau loves them and he is only warning them to come out of that.... Jesus I coming soon
Acid Rain84 we will miss his rugby but not his personality.
@@crazyforcoffee5950 you will miss him in hell too because the Lord God Almighty creator of heaven and Earth is calling many to redemption by coming out of the falsehood religious system and celebration which is full of paganism and idolatry and bondage and blindness.
Squidge you do realise religion is also a human right?
As long as you keep your religion to yourself
Jeremy Atkinson then the gays keep their sexuality to their self
Jeremy Atkinson I guess freedom of speech must just be kept to ourselves to 😒
@@Jt94234 As has been stated using one's fame to spread a message that a particular group is equivalent to the lowest form of human is hate speech. I'm an atheist.
Jeremy Atkinson what’s the difference between him and a priest? People act like they only just found out that christians don’t agree on homosexuality, it’s been common knowledge it’s part of the bible
Folau on twitter- ah so i see i got loads of negative responses on the homosexual post.... let me make it even worse!
Folau is not saying homosexuals are 'sub-human', he is in fact saying the opposite. As a Christian he believes that sin is human nature and this is why they need to repent. He's not saying homosexuals are worse than anyone else as people are suggesting.
still anti-gay though
And his 'opinion' is based on a mis-reading of Leviticus.
It says that a man shall not 'lie with' (do the business) with a man as with a women.
What this really means is that, as back then, women were property (daughters, wives or slaves) a man should lie with a man as an equal and not treat him like an inferior.
QED
Can you explain what you said with easier vocabulary. Im to dumb to understand what you said
Not very Christ-like of him, is it? Stuff like this really hurts me as a Christian.
George Botha lees jou Bybel
Why does it offend you so much if you don't believe a word of it? Curios.
it doesn't bother when anyone, let alone influential people with massive platforms, denigrate certain people as subhuman because of who or what they are?
He's in titled to freedom of speech. The Christian belief is a right and now he's being punished for what he believes in.
He's being punished because he didn't abide by his contract about not saying hateful bullshit online
Tarmon2121 how was it hateful??
@@icecoldbigbog9937 *All people i dont like deserve to go to hell*
Don’t agree at all with you saying we should bully homophobia. Some parents pass on bigotry to their kids who don’t know any better. Bullying is never the answer.
'Bullying' is perhaps a poor choice of words but we should surely criticize their homophobia.
Ya criticize for sure. I'm just saying if you bully the homophobe who doesn't know any better you're asking for trouble.
Just think people should stand up and say they won't tolerate it, instead of bulling, Educate, Although it is hard to educate those that are brain washed through religion, Not saying all religious ppl are brain washed
Just don't tolerate homophobes
@@aussiesheila9495 So in the name of tolerance and inclusiveness why is he not being tolerated? We can tolerate the gay community but not the Christian community?? Should not the law treat all equally?
@@dulls8475
You have got to be kidding , we have to tolerate all religions, you cant speak out against the church or religions, Religions are a law of their own, and use their book to protect them , from intolerance, Just like Falou is using it , saying negative about gay ect , then saying its his religous beleif, How about his personal beleif, I think he is just using religion to state his personal beleif , Intolerance and biggotary is taught , All these religions use their man written book to suit themselves, and hand pick what they want to follow, If his so by the book ,Why is he tattooed? ???????????
How do you not have at least 1 million subscribers?!?!?
Tonne of strawman arguments here
Virtue signaling in rugby. We're all fucked now.
As an Australian i think the ARU made the decision, it will be a loss for sure and we will continue to lose for the foreseeable future, but that kind of rhetoric is something we can do without.
the whole marriage thing, he just views marriage differently. he views it as something between a man and a woman. he believes that to be the definition and that that definition cant change. he has a description of marriage that cant include two of the same sex and that is that. nothing you can do to change that. its not hatred, its not denying human rights, its just a different understanding of what those human rights are. we all have the right to marriage, some people see that one way, some see it the other. we all also have the right to life and we know how peoples opinions differ on that topic. we can view things differently without being hateful, these rights arent clear cut. the right to marriage doesnt stipulate what constitutes a marriage, the same way the right to life doesnt tell us when that right begins.
This is the best video you’ve done.
Thank you
Though usually not a fan of your anti England content but tbh it’s usually fair. Still thank you for this video and addressing this bigotry and homophobia.
Finally as a political student someone uses the term freedom of speech correctly thank you squidge. The only way folau would have his freedom infringed is if the government persecutes him
You will find it is the Government has in place laws to protect Folau's views anyway. I have a feeling the ARU has dropped the ball on their own try line. Issues with workplace protocols for sacking a player appear not to have been followed as well as protection under the human rights acts and workplace laws. It is far more complicated then his freedom of speech. Could you tell us all what the correct way is to use the term "freedom of speech" is?
@@dulls8475 just a vague concept these idiots don't understand. they like the sound of it, but believes it shouldn't apply when they disagree with you.
So he was sacked for quoting from the bible. How has his right to free speech not been infringed?
As a women’s rugby player I really don’t understand how men’s rugby is so homophobic (loads of us are lesbian or bi). You’re literally getting sweaty and hugging people of the same gender for 80 minutes...
Also seriously good video Squidge, thank you so much, I cannot overstate how much this means to me to have such wonderful and boundless support for the LGBT+ community
Because a couple of homophobes play rugby it doesn't mean the whole sport is homophobic, that's a moronic statement. I play rugby and have complete opposite views to Israel Folou. Also your other point about getting sweaty and hugging people? I don't know what women's rugby is like but I have never been hugged during a game of rugby unless I scored a try, if you're equating hugging with tackling well then you've never played the sport.
Rush380 I never claimed men’s rugby was completely homophobic. But it has a degree of homophobia institutionalised in it unfortunately, and far more homophobia that the women’s game
It’s a fecking metaphor, of course I don’t think tackling is the same as hugging. Are you that thick?
Rush380 please go on google and look up the definition of ‘joke’ or ‘a little light craic’
Because physical contact isn’t sexual contact. Context matters
girshin no shit, it’s a joke...
Thank you so much for this video Squidge. As a gay player I was really concerned how the rugby community would react to Folau’s comments and if they’d try and minimise the damage and twattery he committed. Thankfully I’ve seen so many people come together to call out homophobia (though I’m still not going to delve into these RUclips comments). Thank you so much.
Someone should send Folau the video from the West Wing when Bartlett calls out the doctor who called homosexuality an abomination whereby there are other examples in the bible of stuff that is just ridiculous nowadays (or ever) such as stoning people to death for planting different crops side by side.
I actually don't give a shit what he said, we need him on the team. The Wallabies are arguably in the worst form ever, and he's arguably the best player we've ever had. It's like sacking Captain America from the army, I'm sure Captain America is against gay marriage too, since he's extremely old fashioned, and believes in God. But the army is never gonna sack him, BECAUSE HES THE BEST DAMN RUGBY PLAYER THE ARMIES EVER HAD.
Only within the first couple minutes of the video. Not supporting gay marriage does not make you homophobic. Marriage is historically a unity between a man and a woman and has been for thousands of years. I personally voted for gay marriage in my own country, but to say that under article 12 of the UDHR that marriage between two same sex people is a human right according to that declaration is inaccurate. The interference in same sex marriage is absolutely understandable and certainly not arbitrary from a traditionalist standpoint. That article was designed to protect privacy.
I think Squidge mainly was pointing out that he was homophobic because he thinks all gay people should and will go to hell. I agree that not supporting gay marriage is in no way the same as hating gay people or homophobic, but saying they should all go to hell through no fault of their own does seem to be a discriminatory statement.
@@Provenom100 ye I agree, it is absolutely discriminatory but it is not a violation of their human rights.
Come to NZ Falou, you're a great rugby player
You can have him 😂
Shirleen Taylor and you can get knocked out in the pool stages of the World Cup without him 😂 gay people are clearly more important to you than winning the World Cup
no thanks
@@johnpender2428 I think athletes consuming poison, AKA alcohol, should be a good enough reason to ban athletes too. I guess it all depends on individuals belief systems. Athletes should be judged by their athletic performance rather than their beliefs.
@@johnpender2428
I don't give 2 shits about Ruby, and couldn't care less if we loose,
Gay people are just as significant as you me or anyone else, His entitled to his opinion, but he's surely not an idiot, after being warned, he stil had to push the envelope, He can preach what ever he wants in church,
It’s his religion ffs
No it isn't. As someone who grew up in South Africa during the Apartheid era, I have experienced first hand how bigots hide behind THEIR interpretation of a Biblical passage. Cain killed Abel, his descendants were marked for all of time, so white people were OBLIGED to persecute and kill black people??? The NGK (Dutch Reformed Church), a Christian church, was the propaganda machine of the Apartheid government! On that subject, I wonder if Folau would have even survived that era...
His list was from ancient passages known as the Holy Codes, that also forbid things that Folau is happy to do - tattoos, wearing cloth from two different threads, cutting hair and beard, working on the Sabbath, etc. It even describes and prescribes a Kosher diet that no Christian, myself included, feel obliged to follow. So why the selective list of 'sins', all of which allow him to point a figurative finger at other people for doing things he himself is opposed to, while dodging every bullet with his name on it in the same passages? That is why it is considered bigotry and in my humble opinion, is actually an insult to his (and my) religion which does indeed teach love and tolerance.
Israel is stating his opinion which is influenced by his religion, actually it's not homophobia... he never once said he hates gay people, he's just saying that he disagrees with the fact that they practise homosexuality, but he has never once said he hates the people themselves
still anti-gay though
@Bugler55 No, but they should treat everyone with respect.
@Bugler55 No one's forcing anyone to do anything. Having sanctions on people being a dick is a common part of humanity everywhere - laws. Do you consider laws to be forcing people to be nice?
@Bugler55 no one was forced to think anything. folau can still post what ever he believes and get a job where being anti-gay is cool with his employer. RA can find a new 15. whats the problem?
@Bugler55 You don't have choice when you show up to work and you are the skin colour that you are. You do have a choice when you go to work and decide to tell gay people they are going to hell.
Your analysis of what the Bible is and what Christianity should be is just as brilliant as your incredible rugby analysis. This video is so spot on and thank you for taking the time to make it
Your finest work yet sir. Well played.
Well said
Now you are proven wrong because. The Australian courts has decided Aus rugby was wrong and pay up. May Freedom of speech live long. Israel love people, to warn them to avoid eternal hell.
"expect something closer to what you expect next week". I'm enjoying that line way too much, probably.
I respect squidge rugby for rightly saying what folau said was frankly, wrong and disgusting
Folau successfully sued the ARU for 3 million dollars, so be careful what you say or you could be next.