Honestly if they buffed Illuminate to work similar to Compound eyes I can see Starmie rising again. Near perfect/perfect Hydros, Thunders, and Blizzards would go hard
Idea for illuminate Absorbs fairy moves (fairy is the closest to light in mons and a mon that makes immense light on its own is probably light resistant)
starmie is my absolutely favorite pokemon and i would kill for another metagame where it's relevant, and honestly if that buff were to happen, it would probably put starmie back into the spotlight
Okay, okay, an Illuminate buff was something I've had in my mind for a long time, (and it doesn't really buff Starmie unfortunately) but basically...defense-lowering version of Intimidate. When the Pokemon's sent out, it basically acts like a flashbang, forcing the opponent(s) to cover their eyes, leaving them open to physical attacks
i'd say replace illuminate with regenerator and replace analytic with adaptability as well as a 10 point buff to hp and special attack and a 5 point boost to its speed to breathe new life back into it
@@Dingus_Mcbingused regenerator is enough, the rest is just overkill. Sure 115 speed is no longer that impressive but it is well enough for what I should remind you is a starfish. And analytic is good enough, and it has a more interesting place than adaptability which is the "now I hit super hard with no drawbacks ability". Sure you could give any Pokémon adaptability and 120 speed and make them good, but what makes Pokémon an interesting game is the variety and specificity of its sets, where Pokémon that may seem average at first when only looking to stats turns out to have a valuable role in the metagame. Everytime buffs are in the discussion, it always comes down to buffing the Pokemon speed. But if you buff every Pokémon speed to be super fast, then no one is.
This video was a joy to edit. Starmie was always fun to use even with that mediocre special attack it always seem to do most of the work, actually succesfully taking on Latios was my biggest memory of Starmie.
Somewhat related to the topic, I really miss Pursuit, its utility was really cool and unique and without it Ghost-types have just been allowed to run amuck from SwSh onwards.
While I understand that Ghost spam is really overwhelming to go against (no one is gonna stack Dark types or Normal types when Moonblast and Close Combat are so threatening), I really didn't like how discriminatory Pursuit felt towards certain pokemon, namely Ghosts and Psychics. Not only is Pursuit super effective against them, but a lot of offensive Ghosts/Psychics are physically frail, making even dual types that are neutral to Pursuit very vulnerable to it. It's the same with Stealth Rock. Why does a hazard have to single out such already frail types? If Pursuit was going to leave the game, they honestly should bring back Steel's resistance to Ghost type. Maybe don't put it on Steel, because Steel already had 8 resistances and an immunity (50% of the types in pokemon are resisted or ignored by Steel, this is a serious "what the fuck" moment for game balance). So maybe give the Ghost resistance to Ice or to Bug, since both types are sorely lacking in defensive utility. It also helps better differentiate Ghost and Dark for having nearly identical offensive matchups, both even only hitting the same two types for super effective damage. Dark is resisted by Dark, Fairy, and Fighting, while Ghost is resisted by Dark, and ignored by Normal. They virtually have an identical offensive type chart. Idk if Pursuit has a place in pokemon anymore when the game continually gets more and more powercrept. Imagine if Pursuit was still around for SV. Chien Pao would have had the penultimate stranglehold on the metagame, with STAB, Sword of Ruin, Choice Band Pursuits shitting on your pokemon as they try to flee, and opening holes for Iron Valiant to click CC against your now Ghost-less teams. Bisharp knew Pursuit, do you think the meta would be able to handle revenge-killing monster, Supreme Overlord Kingambit? That pokemon would come in after you get a kill, and obliterate your pokemon with Pursuit, so your only choice is to stay in and fight. But Kingambit never gets OHKO'd, so your chances of winning a fight against it are zero. Roaring Moon with Choice Banded Pursuits? For-fucking=get it. Meowscarada using Pursuit? No thank you. Hell, even the NU tier pokemon Mabostiff would be able to rip you a second asshole with Stakeout-boosted, STAB Pursuits, making even something that isn't even Pursuit-weak think twice about switching out. No, I don't personally think the move has any place in modern pokemon and we're better off having it never return to the game.
@@loudwhispre9406 The thing is, pursuit was great for countering said powercreep at least to a degree. Gholdengo becomes less prominant because it can't just come in on Corv because a free U-turn into a pursuit trapper is Ghol's death. This means, fundamentally, that hazard spam isn't nearly as effective. Pult also becomes easier to check with pokemon running Pursuit, like Scizor, or Scarf Meow, Dragapult can't just come in and fire its unresisted STAB combo anymore. Also, the ability to tera removes some of the threat of Pursuit. Instead of using your tera and switching, you could use it and attack the pursuiter, nullifying Pursuit's effectiveness a bit. Gamefreak allows Arena Trap, as well as Shadow Tag, and those abilities are far more broken than Pursuit, so it's weird they targeted this move. You're also assuming every pokemon is going to get pursuit just because it's a dark type. I think the big ones will be: Scizor, Meowscarada, Kingambit, and TTar. I don't think Roaring Moon would get the move. Also, Kingambit would probably end up banned, which (imo) would make a healthier metagame.
@@trevorwendt6274 I like Kingambit. It's stupid strong but it's one of the few things that keep ghost types from being gods. It's pretty nasty to go up against, but I'm afraid without it there wouldn't be anyone that could take its place.
@@trevorwendt6274 TTar and Scizor already had Pursuit before the move got removed, so really brave prediction there genius... In all seriousness, it hardly matters who you think would or wouldn't get Pursuit, because we thankfully live in a world where it doesn't exist. Ghost spam is really annoying given that it only has one resist and one immunity, but most Ghost types are frail and need Scarf to outspeed the entire metagame, making them very easy to sponge with a special wall, or revenge kill with your own scarfer. The only Ghost type that this doesn't apply to is Dragapult, which is just a stupidly bullshit pokemon. Its ridiculous speed tier invalidates revenge killers, since everything is slower than it, and it runs U-Turn to constantly bait in its checks and whittle them down with chip damage rather than face them directly. I think Gen 8 and 9 would be better off without Pult in OU, but that's just my personal opinion. If you find Ghold to be overwhelming you, I think you have a serious issue with teambuilding. There are no shortage of faster/bulkier Dark types that are also really good. (Meow, Moon, Kingambit), and even Tusk, who sometimes invites in Gholdengo easily punishes it with its spammable Knock Off and EQ/Headlong Rush. Rotom-Wash is a common scarfer who QUAD resists Make It Rain, has a better speed tier with its own Scarf, and has a pivot move. Both get Thunder Wave, but Ghold doesn't get Will-o-Wisp. Also Rotom is neutral to Knock Off and immune to Ground attacks. Very easy to put on a team, has answers for Ground types who think they can absorb a Volt Switch, and beats Gholdengo's most powerful attack by taking 1/4 damage from it. Hazard stacking is good for the metagame, because it punishes stall. Spikes does 1/8 max HP, 1/6 max HP, 1/4 max HP at 1/2/3 layers, and iirc, all stall pokemon except Corviknight are grounded, and weak to Spikes. If they run boots, you can either Trick them off with a Scarf, use Knock Off to get rid of them, or burn them since they won't have Leftovers to offset it. I'd say use Toxic, but it has less distribution, and most stall bastards are immune to Toxic. Toxapex, Clodsire, and Corviknight are immune, and Rest Dondozo/Natural Cure Blissey can remove Toxic, making the ramping damage tick of Toxic inferior to the more immediately threatening ticks from burns. Also stacking hazards is already kept in check by the braindead pokemon Corviknight who is immune to everything, can heal off damage with Roost, and is never OHKO'd by anything without Tera. Which brings me to my next point. If you HAVE to Tera to avoid Pursuit spam, then maybe Pursuit isn't very healthy for the game. Imagine using your incredibly OP mechanic to type-change into something just so you can switch out. And if tera gets banned in the future, what then? Pursuit being gone is fine because it only ever punished a few pokemon unfairly, physically frail mons, and Ghosts/Psychics. Again, it's a lot like Stealth Rock punishing pokemon that are already kept in check very well, but doing nothing to the actually good pokemon that need to be punished. Yeah, Ghost type needs a nerf, but Pursuit returning is not the correct way of going about it. It buffs an already good cast of pokemon, Dark types, that absolutely do not need the help. The right way to nerf Ghost types is to give a Ghost resistance to a shit type like Ice or Bug, to help along those pokemon that have such a hard time as it is, while leaving intact the power level of types that are already full of broken pokemon. Fairy and Dragon don't deserve the buff, Steel and Water absolutely don't need it, and Dark has so many broken fucking pokemon that it can't afford the buff without allowing all of the beneficiaries to get banned immediately, or risk having them ruin the balance of the game.
@@loudwhispre9406 I mean even in national DeX pursuit isn't even that popular, theres way better toys running about. Major thing is it would allow for an alternate punish to the voltturn meta game besides helmet and contact abilities
I think a big reason for Starmie's fall was Defog and thus Rapid Spin becoming obsolete. I think Starmie might actually be even OU when it comes back as Rapid Spin has become relevant again. You already know Analytics Hydro smashes all ghosts and Ice Beam smashes Dragapult. I personally can't wait for Starmie return as I am tired of running Great Tusk/Iron Treads on every single team. It not having to worry about Pursuit also helps a ton.
Corv is still an excellent defogger this gen. Whenever I run Ting lu or banded tusk I know Corvy's got my back as a reliable pivot/defogger. Gholdengo is just a momentum sink, it's a free u-turn to one of my threats.
heavy duty boots was a much bigger deal. it’s honestly hard to overstate what a negative impact that godforsaken item had on competitive play, whoever came up with that shit will answer for their sins in the next life
@@familyguyfreemoviedownload8314 Cutie booties are based and anti-hazard-pilled. Early in Gen 9 I just ran 4 - 5x boots because spinning/defogging was next to impossible with Palafin/Iron Bundle and Gholdengo being an impossible core to remove hazards against.
Man, rip starmie, such a cool pokemon too. If only it got regen or something.power creep caught up to it defensively, and speed creep caught up to it offensively. At least it had that cool meteor beam set.
Yeah, Ive never played against another player since red/blue, havent followed closely and Im not the biggest fan of the current gen, but videos like these are so entertaining, Kinda makes me wish i had gotten into competitive when I was younger
I'd love a slightly different stat spread. 520 - 60 / 75 / 85 / 100 / 85 / 115 seems alright but drop attack to 55, up the Sp.Atk would be kinda neat. Letting it borrow Esparthra's Luminary Crash would beb a dope move to throw it. No Opportunist or Speed Boost. More Weaknesses that the bird but higher base speed and better coverage to boot. That or an evolution / physical variant. Not a bulky water per se, but 520 - 85 / 115 / 80 / 50 / 80 / 110. Give it Sheer Force, Regenerator (Starfish can regenerate), and up Illuminate to see thru "Illusion", Screens and Evasion Boosts/Drops. Liquidation Maybe a Signature Move ( 80 BP, 10 PP - Physical, Psychic) that Ups Accuracy each stage, like Torch Song but uses light instead of sound.
@Weareonenation303 No miss Hydro Pump and Whirlpool for trapping would be crazy good. Thunder? Blizzard- 91%, T wave never misses and of course the whole Tera thing it gains this Gen. It covers Ice, Water, Rock, Electric and Psychic already and its Tera typing could make it even scarier.
@@david8dzg you’d be surprised how bulky it can get with investment, max hp/max defense starmies were ran in gen 3 and destroyed some of the best physical attackers in the tier, and with scald later on giving out burns it doesn’t even necessarily need to bulk up to be able to sit on physical attackers.
Starmie oddly enough became my #1 favorite Pokémon in Gen 5. Not even competitively! I was GTS traded a Japanese Staryu with perfect IVs Timid and it became actually unstoppable in my team. Love my weird little starfish😇 getting her tattooed soon too!
Starmie literally carried me in Pokemon Red/ Blue when I had no idea what were the dragon's weaknesses. Caught one to fill up my 5th slot + surf, teach it a remaining TM I had which happened to be Blizzard, at just lvl35 it outsped all the dragons and one shot them all with Blizzard lmao
For how I’d buff Starmie, I’d add a bit to its Sp. Atk and Speed, so it does what it functions as: A fast special attacker that can use Natural Cure to get rid of status conditions, or Analytic to become dangerous to switch in on.
You really should've included her 1-3 entries right at the start because she was a super star in those gens too and the creator and symbol of BeamBolt BoltBeam
Starmie might return to Ou this gen, defog essentially getting removed because of gholdengo and TTar not having pursuit and falling down makes this a good metagame for starmie, but kingambit and gohldengo are huge problems for him
I couldn't allow heatran to have a stand, that 10 second of fame so I removed him from the spotlight. Glad you like my edits. Joey's scripts are always a joy to video edit.
Starmie and Alakazam used to be the two mons you point to as consistently meta. Hell, even 9 yo me was in awe at Starmie throwing off thunderbolts on that special in Stadium.
Taking some points off from its relatively not-too-bad-ish Atk (for a Special Attacker of its time, I mean) and re-distributing those points in either Speed or Special Attack, as well as a small and general little boost (+10 points maybe?) in stats would do wonders for Starmie, without breaking the game in anyway as its avg stats would still be reasonable. 120 or 125 Speed, 110 or 115 SpA, and boom, it is good to go again as a versatile and somewhat offensive threat. Although it would probably need some sort of new ability help it out stay afloat truly. I echo what everybody else has been saying, they need to either ditch Illuminate for something else that already exists or actually buff Illuminate so that it does something (it doesn't do anything anymore nowadays).
Don't Starfish gain back cut off limbs...? I think Starmie should get Regenerator, or Starmie should get an Evolution, and the Evolution should get Regenerator!
@@heavyrain5949 says the entirety of pokemon itself, we are 9 generations in and there has never been a stone evolution pokemon that is able to evolve again, its not happening
Modest full SPA/Speed with power herb and meteor beam, ice beam, thunderbolt and expanding force Starmie under prankster genie Tailwind was a menace and literally got me into masterball Tier. It killed Groudon, Kyorgre, Gmax Charzard, most dragon legendaries. People gotta give it more credit.
Can you make a video on Barraskewda? It was dominant at multiple stages in Sword/Shield. Without Gigantamax, it's suffered a lot. But wouldn't Propeller Tail be really useful in Scarlet Violet? Follow Me and Rage Powder destroy sets. What's the problem with having a rain setter and Barraskewda on teams to counteract them? It has drill run for electric type coverage, and it has ice fang for grass. Or if you really wanna go all out, give it ice tera and terrablast to take care of grass. It outspeeds almost anything that doesn't have a set up, and base 123 attack plus a choice band or something seems like it should be on everyone's radar far more than it currently is. Liquidation, drill run, aqua jet, terra blast ice/psychic fangs/close combat. Focus sash or choice band. It'd curb stomp indeedee/armarouge, I believe amoongus is 1HKO with tera blast ice too. Completely shutting these two teams down means you're shutting down 30% of tournament teams
I feel like ALL pokemon should just be faster in their element as a rule not as an ability. And slower in their weakness. That does cause an issue with lets say, ghost or psychic types. But that can be fixed with moves to change terrain to them i suppose. Shadow zone sounds cool, idk what id call the psychic tho
Joey I’ve said this before and I’ll say it again. Don’t be afraid to let the information in the video breathe. These informational videos are always jam packed thanks to your your years of experience, but the rapid relay of facts can easily overwhelm viewers (me included) which is a shame. A few pauses just to take a breath would not only make the video longer (ad revenue) but also easier to watch.
Starmie started gen one with hydro pump, recover, ice beam, and thunderbolt. This is still the most optimal and viable Starmie set, nine generations on. Every single generation, people declare the fall of Starmie, yet Starmie has been OU in 8 out of 9, and gen 9 still has life in it yet.
Honestly starmie is still a great offensive mon, even if its hazard removing days are past it! Its very good in gen 8 uu, ru, and nu interestingly though, as its analytic boosted attacks hit hard!
Starmie is now arguably the goat fast water compared to keld and gren. Both only lasting 2 gens a piece vs 4 high relevancy. Gren practically went double Ubers, I guess gamefreak felt like dunking on ninja Icarus for sneaking it’s way into top dawg casual popularity. They wanna bury ash meanwhile pikachu gets reincarnated into the new anime.
This is kind of related but I want Trailblaze and Flame Charge to also remove hazards. They are both 50 power Speed boost moves like Rapid Spin but only the latter removes hazards. Rapid Spin has become a staple move for most mons who get it especially after the speed boost. If these two also remove hazards, they will give so much depth to Grass and Fire types. We have seen how Great Tusk becomes so threatening with the Speed boost that it just happens to get while removing Hazards. Interested to see what mons like Moltres will be able to do with it.
Too bad Starmie isnt in scarlet and violet.... Terastallizing would give Starmie so many options.... Steel Starmie would ignore all its weaknesses and its usual STAB is strong against all steel's weakness, tera electric too...
I had no idea Starmie was even good! This definitely was a very informative vid! Fascinating stuff! As a VGC player I never really looked at Starmie at all. Definitely opened my eyes though!
Honestly if they buffed Illuminate to work similar to Compound eyes I can see Starmie rising again. Near perfect/perfect Hydros, Thunders, and Blizzards would go hard
Yess
Idea for illuminate
Absorbs fairy moves (fairy is the closest to light in mons and a mon that makes immense light on its own is probably light resistant)
starmie is my absolutely favorite pokemon and i would kill for another metagame where it's relevant, and honestly if that buff were to happen, it would probably put starmie back into the spotlight
@@enzoforgets9456 Both of your ideas sound really nice.
Okay, okay, an Illuminate buff was something I've had in my mind for a long time, (and it doesn't really buff Starmie unfortunately) but basically...defense-lowering version of Intimidate. When the Pokemon's sent out, it basically acts like a flashbang, forcing the opponent(s) to cover their eyes, leaving them open to physical attacks
Starmie should just get Regenerator. I know it has natural cure, but regeneration is probably what starfish are most well known for
That would make it better
Also give it Flip Turn
That would turn it into Giga Mienshao.
i'd say replace illuminate with regenerator and replace analytic with adaptability as well as a 10 point buff to hp and special attack and a 5 point boost to its speed to breathe new life back into it
@@Dingus_Mcbingused regenerator is enough, the rest is just overkill. Sure 115 speed is no longer that impressive but it is well enough for what I should remind you is a starfish. And analytic is good enough, and it has a more interesting place than adaptability which is the "now I hit super hard with no drawbacks ability". Sure you could give any Pokémon adaptability and 120 speed and make them good, but what makes Pokémon an interesting game is the variety and specificity of its sets, where Pokémon that may seem average at first when only looking to stats turns out to have a valuable role in the metagame. Everytime buffs are in the discussion, it always comes down to buffing the Pokemon speed. But if you buff every Pokémon speed to be super fast, then no one is.
Look how they massacred my boy
The pfp is very fitting
Riahi the goat
This video was a joy to edit.
Starmie was always fun to use even with that mediocre special attack it always seem to do most of the work, actually succesfully taking on Latios was my biggest memory of Starmie.
And the thumbnail pic is beautiful
@@Giaroscope true
Somewhat related to the topic, I really miss Pursuit, its utility was really cool and unique and without it Ghost-types have just been allowed to run amuck from SwSh onwards.
While I understand that Ghost spam is really overwhelming to go against (no one is gonna stack Dark types or Normal types when Moonblast and Close Combat are so threatening), I really didn't like how discriminatory Pursuit felt towards certain pokemon, namely Ghosts and Psychics. Not only is Pursuit super effective against them, but a lot of offensive Ghosts/Psychics are physically frail, making even dual types that are neutral to Pursuit very vulnerable to it. It's the same with Stealth Rock. Why does a hazard have to single out such already frail types?
If Pursuit was going to leave the game, they honestly should bring back Steel's resistance to Ghost type. Maybe don't put it on Steel, because Steel already had 8 resistances and an immunity (50% of the types in pokemon are resisted or ignored by Steel, this is a serious "what the fuck" moment for game balance). So maybe give the Ghost resistance to Ice or to Bug, since both types are sorely lacking in defensive utility. It also helps better differentiate Ghost and Dark for having nearly identical offensive matchups, both even only hitting the same two types for super effective damage. Dark is resisted by Dark, Fairy, and Fighting, while Ghost is resisted by Dark, and ignored by Normal. They virtually have an identical offensive type chart.
Idk if Pursuit has a place in pokemon anymore when the game continually gets more and more powercrept. Imagine if Pursuit was still around for SV. Chien Pao would have had the penultimate stranglehold on the metagame, with STAB, Sword of Ruin, Choice Band Pursuits shitting on your pokemon as they try to flee, and opening holes for Iron Valiant to click CC against your now Ghost-less teams. Bisharp knew Pursuit, do you think the meta would be able to handle revenge-killing monster, Supreme Overlord Kingambit? That pokemon would come in after you get a kill, and obliterate your pokemon with Pursuit, so your only choice is to stay in and fight. But Kingambit never gets OHKO'd, so your chances of winning a fight against it are zero. Roaring Moon with Choice Banded Pursuits? For-fucking=get it. Meowscarada using Pursuit? No thank you. Hell, even the NU tier pokemon Mabostiff would be able to rip you a second asshole with Stakeout-boosted, STAB Pursuits, making even something that isn't even Pursuit-weak think twice about switching out. No, I don't personally think the move has any place in modern pokemon and we're better off having it never return to the game.
@@loudwhispre9406 The thing is, pursuit was great for countering said powercreep at least to a degree. Gholdengo becomes less prominant because it can't just come in on Corv because a free U-turn into a pursuit trapper is Ghol's death. This means, fundamentally, that hazard spam isn't nearly as effective. Pult also becomes easier to check with pokemon running Pursuit, like Scizor, or Scarf Meow, Dragapult can't just come in and fire its unresisted STAB combo anymore.
Also, the ability to tera removes some of the threat of Pursuit. Instead of using your tera and switching, you could use it and attack the pursuiter, nullifying Pursuit's effectiveness a bit.
Gamefreak allows Arena Trap, as well as Shadow Tag, and those abilities are far more broken than Pursuit, so it's weird they targeted this move.
You're also assuming every pokemon is going to get pursuit just because it's a dark type. I think the big ones will be: Scizor, Meowscarada, Kingambit, and TTar. I don't think Roaring Moon would get the move. Also, Kingambit would probably end up banned, which (imo) would make a healthier metagame.
@@trevorwendt6274 I like Kingambit. It's stupid strong but it's one of the few things that keep ghost types from being gods. It's pretty nasty to go up against, but I'm afraid without it there wouldn't be anyone that could take its place.
@@trevorwendt6274 TTar and Scizor already had Pursuit before the move got removed, so really brave prediction there genius... In all seriousness, it hardly matters who you think would or wouldn't get Pursuit, because we thankfully live in a world where it doesn't exist. Ghost spam is really annoying given that it only has one resist and one immunity, but most Ghost types are frail and need Scarf to outspeed the entire metagame, making them very easy to sponge with a special wall, or revenge kill with your own scarfer.
The only Ghost type that this doesn't apply to is Dragapult, which is just a stupidly bullshit pokemon. Its ridiculous speed tier invalidates revenge killers, since everything is slower than it, and it runs U-Turn to constantly bait in its checks and whittle them down with chip damage rather than face them directly. I think Gen 8 and 9 would be better off without Pult in OU, but that's just my personal opinion.
If you find Ghold to be overwhelming you, I think you have a serious issue with teambuilding. There are no shortage of faster/bulkier Dark types that are also really good. (Meow, Moon, Kingambit), and even Tusk, who sometimes invites in Gholdengo easily punishes it with its spammable Knock Off and EQ/Headlong Rush. Rotom-Wash is a common scarfer who QUAD resists Make It Rain, has a better speed tier with its own Scarf, and has a pivot move. Both get Thunder Wave, but Ghold doesn't get Will-o-Wisp. Also Rotom is neutral to Knock Off and immune to Ground attacks. Very easy to put on a team, has answers for Ground types who think they can absorb a Volt Switch, and beats Gholdengo's most powerful attack by taking 1/4 damage from it.
Hazard stacking is good for the metagame, because it punishes stall. Spikes does 1/8 max HP, 1/6 max HP, 1/4 max HP at 1/2/3 layers, and iirc, all stall pokemon except Corviknight are grounded, and weak to Spikes. If they run boots, you can either Trick them off with a Scarf, use Knock Off to get rid of them, or burn them since they won't have Leftovers to offset it. I'd say use Toxic, but it has less distribution, and most stall bastards are immune to Toxic. Toxapex, Clodsire, and Corviknight are immune, and Rest Dondozo/Natural Cure Blissey can remove Toxic, making the ramping damage tick of Toxic inferior to the more immediately threatening ticks from burns. Also stacking hazards is already kept in check by the braindead pokemon Corviknight who is immune to everything, can heal off damage with Roost, and is never OHKO'd by anything without Tera.
Which brings me to my next point. If you HAVE to Tera to avoid Pursuit spam, then maybe Pursuit isn't very healthy for the game. Imagine using your incredibly OP mechanic to type-change into something just so you can switch out. And if tera gets banned in the future, what then?
Pursuit being gone is fine because it only ever punished a few pokemon unfairly, physically frail mons, and Ghosts/Psychics. Again, it's a lot like Stealth Rock punishing pokemon that are already kept in check very well, but doing nothing to the actually good pokemon that need to be punished. Yeah, Ghost type needs a nerf, but Pursuit returning is not the correct way of going about it. It buffs an already good cast of pokemon, Dark types, that absolutely do not need the help. The right way to nerf Ghost types is to give a Ghost resistance to a shit type like Ice or Bug, to help along those pokemon that have such a hard time as it is, while leaving intact the power level of types that are already full of broken pokemon. Fairy and Dragon don't deserve the buff, Steel and Water absolutely don't need it, and Dark has so many broken fucking pokemon that it can't afford the buff without allowing all of the beneficiaries to get banned immediately, or risk having them ruin the balance of the game.
@@loudwhispre9406 I mean even in national DeX pursuit isn't even that popular, theres way better toys running about. Major thing is it would allow for an alternate punish to the voltturn meta game besides helmet and contact abilities
Starmie is my favorite mon. No matter what happens to various competitive metagames, it will remain one of the most iconic Pokemon of all time.
Same!! Starmie will always be my favorite, even though I prefer grass and fairy types 😅😅
I think a big reason for Starmie's fall was Defog and thus Rapid Spin becoming obsolete.
I think Starmie might actually be even OU when it comes back as Rapid Spin has become relevant again. You already know Analytics Hydro smashes all ghosts and Ice Beam smashes Dragapult.
I personally can't wait for Starmie return as I am tired of running Great Tusk/Iron Treads on every single team.
It not having to worry about Pursuit also helps a ton.
Corv is still an excellent defogger this gen. Whenever I run Ting lu or banded tusk I know Corvy's got my back as a reliable pivot/defogger. Gholdengo is just a momentum sink, it's a free u-turn to one of my threats.
@@fungalPS gholdengo shits on corv😐 if your anti hazard mon can't remove hazards in face of ghol this gen it's not reliable
heavy duty boots was a much bigger deal. it’s honestly hard to overstate what a negative impact that godforsaken item had on competitive play, whoever came up with that shit will answer for their sins in the next life
@@familyguyfreemoviedownload8314 Cutie booties are based and anti-hazard-pilled. Early in Gen 9 I just ran 4 - 5x boots because spinning/defogging was next to impossible with Palafin/Iron Bundle and Gholdengo being an impossible core to remove hazards against.
@@Skeloperch based and stallpilled
In Gen 3 OU, offensive Starmie still acts as a litmus test when team-building.
getting reverse swept by starmie really do be embarassing
Even in gen 2 as the premium spinner.
Man, rip starmie, such a cool pokemon too. If only it got regen or something.power creep caught up to it defensively, and speed creep caught up to it offensively. At least it had that cool meteor beam set.
Life orb starmie was one of my all time fav mons, such good coverage. Just chunked everything it didnt outright kill
RIP fallen hero, never forget the spin cycle champion
I have a feeling these vids are eventually gonna rocket you dude. And you deserve it!
hell yeah man, if anybody deserves it, its joey. I've yet to find somebody as dedicated to constant uploads as he is.
I would to see a follow up vid on Starmie, once ZA drops. So glad it’s coming back!
I don't play competitively anymore, but these history analysis videos are neat! Keep it up!
Yeah, Ive never played against another player since red/blue, havent followed closely and Im not the biggest fan of the current gen, but videos like these are so entertaining, Kinda makes me wish i had gotten into competitive when I was younger
I'd love a slightly different stat spread. 520 - 60 / 75 / 85 / 100 / 85 / 115 seems alright but drop attack to 55, up the Sp.Atk would be kinda neat. Letting it borrow Esparthra's Luminary Crash would beb a dope move to throw it. No Opportunist or Speed Boost. More Weaknesses that the bird but higher base speed and better coverage to boot.
That or an evolution / physical variant. Not a bulky water per se, but 520 - 85 / 115 / 80 / 50 / 80 / 110. Give it Sheer Force, Regenerator (Starfish can regenerate), and up Illuminate to see thru "Illusion", Screens and Evasion Boosts/Drops. Liquidation
Maybe a Signature Move ( 80 BP, 10 PP - Physical, Psychic) that Ups Accuracy each stage, like Torch Song but uses light instead of sound.
Give Starmie Compound Eyes and base 120 sp.atk.
That will make Starmie a lot beter
@Weareonenation303 No miss Hydro Pump and Whirlpool for trapping would be crazy good. Thunder? Blizzard- 91%, T wave never misses and of course the whole Tera thing it gains this Gen.
It covers Ice, Water, Rock, Electric and Psychic already and its Tera typing could make it even scarier.
one of, if not my fav mon. huge move pool and playstyles/roles.
This thumbnail for this video is amazing it feels like a false swipe gaming thumbnail but with it’s own spin on it
Man after i saw thes pokemon Colosseum clips. I wish game freak could do a remake for this game on the switch. The battle animations still looks good.
this video format is very good, please do more. The editing is great
Starmie is ‘what if Slowbro/king but fast’
A Fastbro, if you will.
@@gorechomp6050fastking
And frail
@@david8dzg you’d be surprised how bulky it can get with investment, max hp/max defense starmies were ran in gen 3 and destroyed some of the best physical attackers in the tier, and with scald later on giving out burns it doesn’t even necessarily need to bulk up to be able to sit on physical attackers.
Starmie oddly enough became my #1 favorite Pokémon in Gen 5. Not even competitively! I was GTS traded a Japanese Staryu with perfect IVs Timid and it became actually unstoppable in my team. Love my weird little starfish😇 getting her tattooed soon too!
Cute
Her? Its a genderless pokemon
For some reason, In gen 8 starmie was ranked as an nu/ru (idr) mon despite being very viable in uu
It was ranked there. It was used enough to get there. Just because a mob is usable in higher tiers doesn’t mean it will be
Love the script for this video really well written aim
Great video, Doc.
Thumbnail is so fire 🔥
It’s still the brightest star in my heart
0:27 was this the Annihilate skill of the Thunder Breaker class from MapleStory?
Yup
Starmie literally carried me in Pokemon Red/ Blue when I had no idea what were the dragon's weaknesses.
Caught one to fill up my 5th slot + surf, teach it a remaining TM I had which happened to be Blizzard,
at just lvl35 it outsped all the dragons and one shot them all with Blizzard lmao
For how I’d buff Starmie, I’d add a bit to its Sp. Atk and Speed, so it does what it functions as: A fast special attacker that can use Natural Cure to get rid of status conditions, or Analytic to become dangerous to switch in on.
Starmie needs +20spatk to be OU again
Its reasonable to give starmie a +10 spa buff.
Maybe +10 in Special Attack and +10 in HP for good measure
Literally only give it regenerator and it'll return to OU
You really should've included her 1-3 entries right at the start because she was a super star in those gens too and the creator and symbol of BeamBolt BoltBeam
Starmie might return to Ou this gen, defog essentially getting removed because of gholdengo and TTar not having pursuit and falling down makes this a good metagame for starmie, but kingambit and gohldengo are huge problems for him
Couldn't it just blast through gold with its raw power ?
@@陳嘉宇-y4q gholdengo is tanky and can OHKO with shadow ball, i don’t remember a move that hits gholdengo super effective on starmie
@陳嘉宇 what power? base 100 is not exceptional at all
Don't forget Meowscarada. She outspeeds, and has super effective STAB on both types.
I'm sure Ferrothorn will return to ruin Starmie's chances soon enough, too.
Me watching starmie go from OU to UU to NU in 3 generations: NO NO NO NO NO
Is it wrong that I was cackling at some of the visualizations in this video? The one where Starmie removed Heatran's platform sent me laughing. xD
I couldn't allow heatran to have a stand, that 10 second of fame so I removed him from the spotlight. Glad you like my edits. Joey's scripts are always a joy to video edit.
It used to be basically another Quagsire that managed to make it with just average stats save for speed, but they eventually caught up with it.
Starmie will always live with me as one of my favorite water types.
Nice vid mate
Love how all these comments haven't even watched the video yet and assume it's talking about starmie falling off in gen 8.
Pokemon home when? Seriously thought I'd get my boy Ursaluna by now.
Starmie and Alakazam used to be the two mons you point to as consistently meta.
Hell, even 9 yo me was in awe at Starmie throwing off thunderbolts on that special in Stadium.
Tbf it was still glorious in gen 1 when it has special as both it’s sp attacks and sp defence
Taking some points off from its relatively not-too-bad-ish Atk (for a Special Attacker of its time, I mean) and re-distributing those points in either Speed or Special Attack, as well as a small and general little boost (+10 points maybe?) in stats would do wonders for Starmie, without breaking the game in anyway as its avg stats would still be reasonable. 120 or 125 Speed, 110 or 115 SpA, and boom, it is good to go again as a versatile and somewhat offensive threat. Although it would probably need some sort of new ability help it out stay afloat truly. I echo what everybody else has been saying, they need to either ditch Illuminate for something else that already exists or actually buff Illuminate so that it does something (it doesn't do anything anymore nowadays).
I wonder how many people remember the "Death Star" Starmie set of OLD ??
T-Wave/Confuse Ray/Ice Beam/Recover
I'm the guy who requested a Starmie showdown video a while back, so I insta clicked this.
great video
The people love old gens. I really don't know how to play anything besides gen 3, but this was some nice informative content.
starmie is my favorite pokemon
Don't Starfish gain back cut off limbs...? I think Starmie should get Regenerator, or Starmie should get an Evolution, and the Evolution should get Regenerator!
Maybe like a version of galarian corsela
unfortunately since Starmie is a stone evolution it can't evolve again but definitely a regional form that's like fairy water could be amazing
@@Lunacy4
Says who? Just give it an evolution lol
@@heavyrain5949 says the entirety of pokemon itself, we are 9 generations in and there has never been a stone evolution pokemon that is able to evolve again, its not happening
@@deadblocko
It really doesn't matter lol
Modest full SPA/Speed with power herb and meteor beam, ice beam, thunderbolt and expanding force Starmie under prankster genie Tailwind was a menace and literally got me into masterball Tier. It killed Groudon, Kyorgre, Gmax Charzard, most dragon legendaries. People gotta give it more credit.
Can you make a video on Barraskewda? It was dominant at multiple stages in Sword/Shield. Without Gigantamax, it's suffered a lot. But wouldn't Propeller Tail be really useful in Scarlet Violet? Follow Me and Rage Powder destroy sets. What's the problem with having a rain setter and Barraskewda on teams to counteract them?
It has drill run for electric type coverage, and it has ice fang for grass. Or if you really wanna go all out, give it ice tera and terrablast to take care of grass. It outspeeds almost anything that doesn't have a set up, and base 123 attack plus a choice band or something seems like it should be on everyone's radar far more than it currently is.
Liquidation, drill run, aqua jet, terra blast ice/psychic fangs/close combat. Focus sash or choice band. It'd curb stomp indeedee/armarouge, I believe amoongus is 1HKO with tera blast ice too. Completely shutting these two teams down means you're shutting down 30% of tournament teams
I feel like ALL pokemon should just be faster in their element as a rule not as an ability. And slower in their weakness. That does cause an issue with lets say, ghost or psychic types. But that can be fixed with moves to change terrain to them i suppose. Shadow zone sounds cool, idk what id call the psychic tho
Not the prison esque shower thumbnail LoL :P
Starmie is my favorite mon of all time and it's fall from grace was hard to accept
Joey I’ve said this before and I’ll say it again. Don’t be afraid to let the information in the video breathe. These informational videos are always jam packed thanks to your your years of experience, but the rapid relay of facts can easily overwhelm viewers (me included) which is a shame. A few pauses just to take a breath would not only make the video longer (ad revenue) but also easier to watch.
Starmie started gen one with hydro pump, recover, ice beam, and thunderbolt.
This is still the most optimal and viable Starmie set, nine generations on.
Every single generation, people declare the fall of Starmie, yet Starmie has been OU in 8 out of 9, and gen 9 still has life in it yet.
I used a crazy NU starmie team with shedninja and zorark core it was goated that team went brazy
Shout out to the maplestory thunderbreaker annihilate skill animation
Someone save that starmie in the thumbnail
In the thumbnail Starmie dropped the soap
At 11:49 you showed Mega Latios instead of Latias, Mega Latias has yellow eyes 🤓
nice notice, can't believe I've made that mistake, you got me.
Honestly starmie is still a great offensive mon, even if its hazard removing days are past it!
Its very good in gen 8 uu, ru, and nu interestingly though, as its analytic boosted attacks hit hard!
It's sad to see Starmie fall. Out of all gen 1 Pokemon, Starmie fared the best competitively.
So less so a downfall and more a speed bump
Yo aim you gonna check out the new PU changes?
What's the game on the video footage?
Praise the lord pursuit is gone, that shit is busted
At least Starmie still goes hard in draft leagues 🥲
Now most of Gen 4 OU are lucky if they can be in RU. Even Tyranitar fall :(
Fake spinners when real trappers walk into the room
If they gave it nasty plot, it would be insane
Ferrothorn
This is what I need to know. Where did it go wrong
Good ol power creep claims another
w informational video
Was that a maplestory shark?
Starmie will always be sister
Starmie is now arguably the goat fast water compared to keld and gren. Both only lasting 2 gens a piece vs 4 high relevancy. Gren practically went double Ubers, I guess gamefreak felt like dunking on ninja Icarus for sneaking it’s way into top dawg casual popularity. They wanna bury ash meanwhile pikachu gets reincarnated into the new anime.
My favourite pokemon
Which killed my interest in (Scarlet & Violet)
its a good thing that OU isn't full of gen 1 mons
I guess you could say Starmie is not longer the STAR huh?
Shut your fucking mouth, guy. Get outta here
Adaptation has four syllables, not three.
adaption and adaptation are 2 different things
Just curious, how long does it take to write these scripts?
yo what is going on in that thumbnail
i'm still playing pokemon xd gale of darkness. i'm almost to greevil, the grand master, so he call(ed)(s) himself.
This guy honestly sounds like TrueGreen7 but idk if they’re the same person (day 1 of saying this)
Im not lol
This is kind of related but I want Trailblaze and Flame Charge to also remove hazards. They are both 50 power Speed boost moves like Rapid Spin but only the latter removes hazards.
Rapid Spin has become a staple move for most mons who get it especially after the speed boost. If these two also remove hazards, they will give so much depth to Grass and Fire types.
We have seen how Great Tusk becomes so threatening with the Speed boost that it just happens to get while removing Hazards.
Interested to see what mons like Moltres will be able to do with it.
Normal has no super effectives so it's a fair trade to balance it
rapid spin can be blocked by ghost types and those other moves can't. I think it's fine as it is
Rapid Spin only increases speed since gen 8
The others are designed specifically to increase speed
0:11 LowTierGod
The thumbnail 😂
Too bad Starmie isnt in scarlet and violet....
Terastallizing would give Starmie so many options....
Steel Starmie would ignore all its weaknesses and its usual STAB is strong against all steel's weakness, tera electric too...
CRIIIIIT! CRIIIIT THE T-TAR GRRR
So like Misty's Starmie, it became useless?
Rip Starmie 🥲
I had no idea Starmie was even good!
This definitely was a very informative vid! Fascinating stuff!
As a VGC player I never really looked at Starmie at all. Definitely opened my eyes though!
Do you like the loss of pursuit?
I wish it was the signature move of ttar lol
Ghosts are everywhere now so no
i think i want to switch to singles now
What game is the background
the 4th gen features a lot of scenes from game called Pokemon Battle Revolution for the Nintendo Wii
Yo vengo de la publicación de Nicko Stall puesto que es viable
I love starmie
Starmie fell victim to Mike Barnes 😂
I'm dead the maplestory skill in the editing