Book of G'Kar: "What is Truth, and what is God?"
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- Опубликовано: 9 сен 2024
- Towards the end of the series, Ambassador G'Kar finds himself exalted to the role of reluctant spiritual guru of his people. This happens when his 'private diaries' are published, against his wishes! It becomes known as the Book of G'Kar. In this clip, he addresses some of his 'cult followers'.
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The resignation o G'Kar's face when he realizes his followers want a catchy line instead of an actual revelation... Babylon 5 was truly ahead of its time.
I actually believe that they don't "want" a catchy line. They simply did not understand his previous explanation, which was attempted to show that the question itself does not have an answer.
Poor G'kar, speaking over an entire room of heads. His first answer was amazing.
I imagine that Jesus looked a little like that when he was with the apostles...
@@robertbusek30 If so, then he got what he asked for. He actually got to select his disciples after all :D
The show held such reverence for characters of faith in pitch-dark times. I wish modern shows had half the brass knocks.
"if we do not search, if we do not bring a lamp...then we see nothing." -- The ultimate tragedy of Londo Molari's character...he saw nothing when Kosh was revealed.
And yet, at the end, he slew his Keeper, G'kar, and himself to rid his world of the last of the Shadows and give it to Vir Cotto to heal. He ultimately saw the light.
@@JAMESLEVEE I sometimes wonder if Londo would have seen the Vorlons at that point...
@@robertbusek30 I like to think that is irrelevant, after all they turned out to act like any other beings who can disregard free will and infringe it with a callous cruelty. Their planet killer...
@@seamon9732 What a lot of people forget was that the war between the Vorlons and the Shadows was never about "Good vs Evil" it was about "Order vs Chaos" and the point of the story was to point out that too much of either is a bad thing. Good is objectively better than Evil but neither Order or Chaos can be considered better than the other and both are capable of both Good and Evil... hence why Sheridan and the rest chose to oppose both of them in the end in favor of letting us choose our own way somewhere in the spectrum between the two.
@@robertbusek30 He did. Their face was Adira's.
G'Kar's character arc and transformation throughout the series is one of the most inspiring, poetic, and sublime things I've ever witnessed
G'Kar gained like 200 IQ beween the first and last season.
@@FluffyFooFookins I'd say more WIS than INT. The guy asking the question was a dumbass. He just wanted his spirituality in easy, bite size morsels. Not unlike Tweets.
@@patricklyons794 True dat There's a reason why wisdom is a separate stal roll from Intelligence
Can you get over yourself...can you understand you have an ego...can you learn from your mistakes...sounds hokey but feels oh so real
@@FluffyFooFookins No, it was always there... he says so here himself, it was just he was getting in his own way by focusing on his anger and only saw darkness!
Couldn't agree more..
You can see G’kar thinking “ this must be how G’qwan felt like “
Both the Minbari and the Narn reference the 'light on the wall' when describing their religion.
Truly, it is the "Swedish meatballs" of religious philosophy.
"The 'Swedish meatballs' of religious philosophy"
Well said!
Well, both were influenced by the Vorlons as well, so a certain amount of it may come from there.
It seems very likely G'Kar used that metaphor cause he learned it from others like Delenn, since it was clearly novel to the other Narn in the room.
Wasn't there a group of human monks that believed something similar?
@@OllamhDrab exactly. It was his friendships with delenn and people of other races that helped him to reach his enlightenment. Makes sense that he would try to pass it on in order to help others learn what he learned.
Still one of the best written Sci-Fi drama's ever
G'Kar wasn't the hero we deserved, but the hero we needed.
The beauty of this scene shows that people who ask questions often times don't want an answer so much as they want somebody to give them something simple to understand but something utterly meaningless.
The analogy of the lantern is a beautiful way of describing the search for knowledge. Put ourselves in front of it, and we can only see ourselves in it. Don't bring a lantern and you're not going to find anything. But all the guy wanted was a soundbite that he could bring up when it was convenient and G'Kar gave him one. It meant nothing, but sounded profound.
I ca never get over how good the writing was. This show was a masterpiece. A once in a life time masterpiece
What is amazing is that a sci-fi show (written by an atheist, no less) devoted three minutes to a discussion on the nature of God and Truth and managed to make it so good while advancing the plot (G'Kar's dissatisfaction with becoming an icon to his people was a large part of his final actions in the show).
Was a good show but Mash 4077 was better
Some ways a sad scene. The analogy with the lantern was beautiful. But the majority of his followers (all ?) just didn't get it. They wanted a simple answer.
God and truth are the product of our search. I love it. But most wanted a deus ex machina so solve their problems, not to do the actual work of searching for the truth.
+Matthew Geier it's kinda of like what if you took a Holy Scripture, and made it into a "Religion for Dummies book series"
Poor G'Kar, and incredibly good writing.
Actually, what G'Kar ia describing ia the act of psychological projection and what is actually projected.
What is actually projected is the Imago Dei, the totality which can never be known.
Even G'Kar says that when we stand in front of the light we believe to be the center of the universe. We inflate, that is amd believe we are the alpha and omega of evrything and that we can solve anything.
This means that our Search is greater than our little selves, that what is seen on the wall is greater than our little human selves and though we project it, ultimately it isn't the little human self.
I think it's kinda fitting, he explains to them that the light is the result of the journey, and to someone without the knowledge they might see nothing.
he gives them all the information they need, but they don't understand it so they get nothing from it and ask again.
Fun Fact: This speech is the basis of my own views on the nature of "God" and the value of spirituality.
He is right. It is the allegory of the cave from Socratic thought. However the situation with the students gathered around, not getting it, and the teacher realizing they just don't get it: That is taken from the Gospel of Mark. The apostles often missed the point of the lessons, frustrating Jesus.
No matter how well you explain something , the ignorant will prefer to hear the simple answer and remain ignorant.
“What is truth? And what is God?”
“Oh, was that all you wanted to know?”
What is the ultimate irony in Babylon 5? Kosh was wise but imparted little. Delenn was wise and imparted much . G'kar from bitterness became humble when he became humble he gained wisdom and rebuilt his people. Londo molari was savvy but allowed arrogance to blind him he lost much and only in the end when his world was burned and broken did he gain wisdom. You also see all the phases of the rise and fall of empires in Babylon 5.
When the reveal Valen in earnest the greatest irony of B5 is laid bare - everything had to happen as it did even though all parties were trying to change how it would end up. And all along, there was Valen.
I think you’re making this bigger than it is. It isn’t about empires, it’s about those singular individuals….
How each of them are able to overcome themselves and reach and some quantum of solace
Or a piece of peace. James Bond movies have such stupid names when you could just be more to the point
G'Kar: You don't need to follow me. You don't need to follow anybody. You're all individuals."
Narn:" *Yes. We're All Individuals!* "
ha ha. Life of Brian reference...
I loved the silent dialog between Dr. Franklin, the skeptical materialist, and G'Kar, the religious leader. Under the Doctor's quizzical witness, G'Kar tried to keep it real; but in the end he had to give his audience what they wanted. Dr. Franklin forgave him with a smile and a shrug. What can you do?
He isn't a sceptical materialist, but a Foundationist and they believe, that the closer you get to defining God, the further away it gets.
It's strange that you would say he's a materialist. He literally left everything behind to search for God and found him(probably) as he was dying from a stab wound. Dr. Franklin understood, more than any other on the station, save perhaps some of the monks, precisely what G'Kar was speaking about and how hard it is for some(many) to comprehend it.
"What can you do about it?", indeed.
Rest well brothers, for we shall all join you in the truth someday.
@@Zektor101 Sounds like a fancy way of calling oneself an agnostic.
@@Cerberus1441 well. Kinda space agnostic. Super agnostic. But quite spiritual, in it's own way.
The sense I got from Franklin was that he understood and approved of what G'kar was saying, and commiserated with him that his would-be followers couldn't grasp it. I've known no few scientists who are deeply spiritual, believing that their research brings them insights into the mind of God.
Philosophy versus religion in a nutshell. The acolytes seek answers from an enlightened man, who gives them an enlightened answer. But because that answer was complex and required deep reflection and indeed the enlightened man's experiences to fully comprehend, the acolytes ask again. And the enlightened man relents and gives them what they want: simple answers. Comfort over Truth.
You hit the nail on the head with this one my friend.
I think this is a shallow interpretation of human dynamics which have persisted in confusion for countless centuries. It’s not that people want a simple answer, it’s that they’re conditioned to expect simple, Newtonian, if-than-else responses. They use exoteric faith as it was designed, as a shield against the unknown, while esoteric faith is the true goal. Mystics across the ages have passed down this wisdom, it’s just many people don’t see the need to pursue it, not that they seek comfort over truth. The whole point of this scene is to illustrate how the lantern shining against the wall is also fruitless in determining “truth”, as the light always casts a shadow which is assumed to be ignorance. To know “god” and “truth” is to let go of both and realize they were always there all along, and that religion and philosophy both cannot ever truly bring forth what you desire. This scene illustrates the futility in asking an enlightened being any question that you yourself cannot answer… all the being’s role is to assist the supplicant to know that they already have the answer within.
That's what I loved about this show, trying to show how our society is:
These "students" didn't want to hear the truth, they just wanted to hear what they wanted to hear, the easy lesson, not the truthful lesson. That is the way of the gullible, not the seekers.
Gullible and seekers without courage.
I think the only way for his students to understand the wisdom he is trying to impart, would be by having gone through the same experience. From complete arrogance and filled with bloodlust for revenge, to having everything you love and hold dear destroyed. Becoming truly humble and not demanding support, but offering your services to those in need around you. His story only grows deeper from there.
If G'Kar was attending that lesson as himself from the first series, he would have dismissed such gentle talk. Demanded action and his people forge a new destiny through Centauri blood.
God, I miss watching Sci-fi shows like Babylon 5.
Violent2aShadow there are no sci-fi shows like B5
@@michaelwilson612 BSG came close
@@happygoluckyscamp well, it tried, but the payoff was terrible for the time invested.
it's up thre with EVA for "aspirations above it's station" in terms of how to finish an otherwise intriguing series.
Good to watch, may as well skip the alst couple of episodes.
Nothing comes close to Babylon 5. I love The Expanse, but mostly because of it’s realism.
It’s kind of a tragedy that it was one of the first series to use CGI...it ages as well as uncooked chicken. And, ugh, the costume design is even worse!
I agree, i try watching some of the modern sci-fi shows but nothing beats some of the orignals i grew up watching like babylon 5, stargate, star trek original, tng, ds9, voyager, classic battlestar galactica, alien earth, and few others i remember but cant remember their name.
Reminds me of the titles of the last two chapters of Second Foundation: "The Answer That Satisfied" and "The Answer That Was True". Most people will only be content with a satisfying answer, without caring whether or not it's true.
"but now there was a somber satisfaction on the round ruddy face of Preem Palver - First Speaker."
Still blows my mind 30+ years after reading it.
G'Kar is one of my favorite characters in SciFi. B5 had great writing and actors.
g'kar had such an excellent arc, a truly remarkable character
TRANSCRIPT:
If I take a lamp and shine it toward the wall, a bright spot will appear
on the wall. The lamp is our search for truth, for understanding. Too
often, we assume that the light on the wall is God, but the light is not
the goal of the search, it is the result of the search. The more
intense the search, the brighter the light on the wall. The brighter the
light on the wall, the greater the sense of revelation upon seeing it.
Similarly, someone who does not search - who does not bring a lantern -
sees nothing. What we perceive as God is the by-product of our search
for God. It may simply be an appreciation of the light... pure and
unblemished... not understanding that it comes from us. Sometimes we
stand in front of the light and assume that we are the center of the
universe - God looks astonishingly like we do - or we turn to look at
our shadow and assume that all is darkness. If we allow ourselves to get
in the way, we defeat the purpose, which is to use the light of our
search to illuminate the wall in all its beauty and in all its flaws;
and in so doing, better understand the world around us.
It's nice to see G'Kar acting as an actual teacher and attempt to explain things to his followers rather than try and avoid them like he did at first.
This is truly brilliant writing, philosophy worthy of one of the great thinkers appearing in a 90s sci-fi TV show. I wonder who wrote it and where they drew the philosophy from?
Mind you, G'kar's frustration at the end where he has to make up some concrete-sounding mumbo-jumbo to appease the questioner at the end is both palpable and amusing.
Joseph Michael Straczynski wrote it. He's a legend - written for dozens of shows comic books, and many many film scripts.
Matthew Sharpe For an atheist, JMS had no qualms about addressing religion & spirituality in Babylon 5.
I don't know specifically where he drew it from but I say aw least two elements that seemed puled from The Gay Science. G'Kar development and philosophical awakening in the series seems to be giving praxis to themes in it (specifically, "the great health" comes to mind).
Matthew Sharpe I know, right?! I was astonished to see his name on an episode of The Real Ghostbusters a few years ago.
+Daniel Appleton Just because you're an atheist doesn't mean you can't be spiritual. Maybe it gives him a different perspective?
I found it quite interesting that Stephen seemed to understand what G'kar was trying to say. And also at the end, when G'kar seems a bit exasperated, Stephen also seems to understand that exasperation as well, when you see him shake his head in resignation. Of all the people there, Stephen may have gotten the most out of the talk.
I like to think, in my own head canon, that the discussions these students were having as they left prompted at least one to think about the entirety of what G'Kar said and realize the river bit didn't fit the rest, and in so doing turned on his own lantern.
Textbook proof of yet another thing Terry Pratchett got dead right (Thief of Time):
"Master, what is the difference between a humanistic, monastic system of belief in which wisdom is sought by means of an apparently nonsensical system of questions and answers, and a lot of mystic gibberish made up on the spur of the moment?"
Wen considered this for some time, and at last said: "A fish!"
And Clodpool went away, satisfied."
+Valen123456 What is a, Fish ?
@@donleonsroszavilla5734 I gave you the rod, it's your responsibility to find the fish.
Pratchett was a very wise man. I own a hardcover copy of most of his Discworld books and a softcover version of the rest. Always worth a read.
HA! damn that man could write
"God is an intelligble sphere, whose center is everywhere, and circumference is nowhere." - Heraclitus
Still gives me shivers all over after all these years.
There is a remarkable (or probably not so remarkable given JMS's ever careful layering of the storyline) between this scene where G'Kar talks of beams of light, light on walls and God; and that of the scene in 3x04 Passing Through Gethsemane; where Brother Edward speaks with Delenn and Lennier about faith.
My mom is 67 years old this year and has been going to the same church most of her life. It is....a funny little church; preaching that only THEIR denomination is the true one, that all the women have to wear dresses, that tv and the internet are tools of the world and the devil.....among other things. But, this year there's been some scandals that have rocked that church from top to bottom and I'm having conversations now with her that...I NEVER hoped to have with her about Truth, God, and what it really means to have some form of faith. I'm pretty damn proud of her. In the midst of these conversations she asked aloud, "what is God, really?" and, with a great deal of effort and a little alteration of the source, I quoted this to her....she really liked it. Thanks, G'kar.
I think about this a lot. “God looks remarkably like us” humbles me in a way that I can only assume IS divine.
This reminds me deeply of Plato's cave.
TMI - we didn't know you were that intimate with Plato...
I would like to be young again and live my life again to see all the great sci-fi series for first time. If I just could be 30 and see for first time the Star Trek movie for First time, which brought me there, and then Babylon V and the rest all of the best. I was then so young, so naive, my English was really bad and I struggled with other languages and own place in life and space, all great novels, poems, arts, experiences were waiting in my future. I was then just a child and I did so many mistakes from fear and lack of experience, when I was learning how to live. Now I understand why in the ancient Sparta would consider you adult after 30 and not earlier. But I think it is still good only for the earliest age of the legal adulthood, but I try to grow up....and Expanse is out and I am not dead yet, I could try. Wish me luck to reach a bit closer to become adult. Now I will go rewatch Babylon V for another time. Maybe I will find wisdom and heart in some new space opera... Wish me luck
"Put your face in the book"
-closes book on person's face-
You mean, some kind of Facebook?
@@Crazael "that's lesson number 1."
ruclips.net/video/oz1VNbQYiTw/видео.html
G'Kar's most impactful lesson.
I could watch Andreas as G'Kar all day long
And listen to Andreas as G'Kar all day long....
I wish G'Kar would read a book aloud. I could fall asleep to the voice and the rhythm of his speech.
Hands down my favorite G'Kar moment from the entire series :D
This is by far my favourite scene if the whole series. Man of man I love the character of G'Kar the spiritual leader
My goodness! G'kar actually had a good point! Sometimes we have to help provide that light. As a Church Chorister that's my duty according to the Chorister's Prayer.
Such a great scene, and ground in reality in modern religions. To this day people are like G'Kars followers. Confused and wanting simple explanations, or simply not looking at all. All to often people follow along like sheep and do not think for themselves.
Watching this again
I wish I could be there and hope I would hear g kars meaning I’d want to understand and not just want answers like that narn I wouldn’t want to lose out on understanding
God is a word to describe our longing for a more perfect version of ourselves. But the only god we will ever find is the god we try to be. Which is not god at all, but the best version of each other.
Beautiful
Wise
God is in every place and in every moment, God exists when someone looks for him, God exists when nobody looks for him. To think that God "depends" on us, that is a 'more perfect version of ourselves' is a reflection of the innate self-centred approach to the world of the human beings
G'Kar is a great figure, a teacher, an insperation a mentor
i love how he was clearly just making stuff up on the fly and yet still made it sound wise
Most folks who want to sit and "learn" at the feet of a spiritual master are looking for a shortcut to enlightenment. Enlightenment requires real work and can't just be found in the pages of a book.
Rarely, someone sits at the feet of the master and understands that they only offer a place to start the journey. Those guys get it, and they're willing to put in the work. Sword guy was like that
Superb and best Series ever created.
Stephen's "What can you do?" gesture and smile at the end always makes me giggle. :)
I love the knowing shrug that Franklin gives G'Kar at the end of the vid! Tryna grasp a difficult topic and teach it to those who clearly don't fully understand what he's saying!
Truth is a river; and God is the mouth of that river. Ergo, follow truth, and you will inevitably find God.
I love this cuz g kar grew and yet he couldn’t help his people due to their own blindness
Not true.... he doesnt have to make everyone listen at the same times, sometimes it only takes on person ready to listen and look and he found him. His speech to Talon is another epic scene.
Reminds me of a joke:
Flood waters were rising, a man decided he was going to wait for God to save him when his neighbors left.
The water kept rising, soon the man's house was an island, some people in a canoe said jump in we'll take you to safety, the man said he's wait for God to save him
Water still rising, the man was forced to climb to the second story, a motorboat came by, the people said come on we'll take you to safety, the man said he'd wait for God
The water eventually forced the man onto his roof, a helicopter flew over and told the man to climb up they would fly him to safety, the man again turned it down saying he'd wait for God to save him.
The water kept rising and the man drowned. he was taken to the Pearly gates and asked God why he didn't save him.
God said, "I sent you a canoe, a motorboat and a helicopter, what more did you want?"
G'kar becomes a star of his own making.
😖Oh wow this clip reminded me of my own enlightenment and how my teacher had to dumb down his lessons as he explain God to me so I could understand a glimmer of what he was trying to teach me, now I miss my mentor and those early years even more😓
The shepard only knows the general way of where to go. It is up to him to guide others to the mountain top, but ultimately the herd must find their own way
. . . poor G'Kar; I much preferred the lamp expression over the river.
I find this point of view perfectly acceptable, and I am an atheist. God as a byproduct of our search for truth, fine, might as well call it the Universe.
The universe itself is a higher power than any race
People today happily accept the idea of the Singularity where consciousness is liberated from the body and exists in the "Free" state. Perhaps they would combine into a mega entity, a "Supermind", ageless and immortal. But why be so proud to think that we would be the first to do this? Perhaps someone else did it first? Perhaps billions of years ago or perhaps in a Universe before ours? To experience requires time so perhaps that Supermind breaks pieces of itself off to insert into sufficiently advanced organisms. With our dim understanding we call these pieces "souls". We live, we experience and eventually we return to the supermind to share our memories, feelings and experiences. And slowly, the Universe learns to understand itself.
this i have believed for a long time. Delenn just said it better.
i m agnostic.... and for me is also quite acceptable mainly for one and only reason: to me religion is a sort of personal perpetual quest for spirituality that people feel the need to indulge into and if it remained personal and didnt affect other people's lives with organised religion and the problems it caused i would be fin with it , but the problem isthat organised religion as every other institution that exists in society competes for social wordly power and that moves it away from its original role makes it loose its path and lead to a shitload of issues like instituted gender discrimination, instituted pedophilia or instituted child abuse in the form of either brainwashing them with dogmatic untruths or even torturing them (ahem ....the catholic punishment system)
@@MDE_never_dies hmmm related to what troubles you you mentioned above you may want to check some of the fantasy novels of Reimond Feist's Midkemia circle/riftwar circle. In the series of books which btw follow sequentially the events that transpire in world of Midkemia during the very extended lifetime of a main character starting at his child age/ puberty and finishes with his death about 200 something years later as he becomes the greatest mage of that world and this grants him ageless almost life (he did not die of them natural causes in the end) becomes defender of his world to external threats. During the series that spans 30 books and several wars such as riftwar, serpentwar, demonwar, darkwar he often together with some other collaborating powerful individuals ponders and tries make sense of the nature of the universe and what happens to them and one of the most of intetesting theories that these discussions produce us that the universe is self aware, vast, and very young, learns through the lifes of humanoid beings and when they die one part like soul goes to reincarnate taking a new spot on the wheel after first judged by the Death godess which affects what that new spot will be like, one part goes with the gods or such and the mind or whole memmories and history of the person goes back to the universe and it gets more and more experience helping it very slowly grow and mature. As one character described it, it is like a baby and our memories and life are the puppet show from which it learns.
@@MDE_never_dies I have no idea. A short life perhaps? I work from the basis that I'm not smart enough to decide what the supermind does or doesn't want. Is knowledge infinite? If it is, then wouldn't it take infinite time to amass infinite knowledge?
Richard Bach used an analogy about life that made sense to me. You can hold a can of movie film in your hand. It's all there, beginning, middle and end. But to experience the movie you need time, you have to watch the movie frame after frame to understand it.
I agree about the ego part. On a human level I don't think it "cares". BTW that's why I always had trouble with the Abrahamic religions. The idea that the creator of the entire Universe, all seeing and all powerful apparently had nothing better to do with his time than to sit on a cloud and watch my genitals made no sense to me.
But I allow myself to wonder, as did Alice Maynell in her poem "Christ in the Universe". poetry-archive.com/m/christ_in_the_universe.html
The search for truth is the search for understanding. We seek understanding of our world around us, and through this search we begin to understand ourselves. In the process we may come to realize that everything we thought we knew is wrong. This the most invigorating and the most terrifying moment of our self understanding. In this moment, and in the end, the only thing that matters is, as you face yourself as you truly are, is that you are happy with the person you have become.
If I were a human passing by, I’d slip in, and listen intently at the back.
One of my favorite scenes from one of my favorite series.
I love Star Trek but I believed this show was it's rival because it gave a different view of what space relations between worlds would look like and it did it with such fare! The make up and visual effects were incredible, and the writing was good! I hope the revamp is just as good or better! They should make an updated movie!
I am a life long Star Trek fan. I grew up on TOS but DS9 is my favorite. DS9 was heavily inspired by Babylon 5. The exceptional writing and acting on B5, made it one of the best SciFi series ever! It is scenes like this one that made G'Kar my favorite character from B5!
I found this video thanks to Jerry Coyne talking about it on his 'Why evolution is true' website. Looks like this series would be worth looking into. Thanks for posting video.
I can easily recommend you watch the entire series. It is my favorite TV show of all time.
gamer263 Any other 'best bits' ? Time is limited, so much to see.
zytigon I don't want to spoil anything. Best bits is pretty much the entire series and the journey. G'Kar and Londo Mollari's evolution as characters are one of the many reasons I love this show.
zytigon If you're REALLY scarce on time, check out Sfdebris' analysis of the series (and the website itself). It contains most of the fundamental bits and problems. I find his commentary entertaining and quite enriching in details. It would probably work better as a post-viewing contemplation, but I guess it could also work on its own. / Sorry if my comment's a bit late.
Most of the core plot lines are wrapped up in S4, since they didn't know they were actually going to get a S5 until all the filming was done. But the writers were laying down breadcrumbs right from the start, so even though S1 seems slow, it really needs to be watched to catch everything.
There are some 'filler' episodes and performances, but you get that in any series.
G kar grew so much and I missed his words I wish I could have listened to him for hours even if only understanding very little I’d least be open
The sad part of that vid? The answer he gave was truth, Each one must find their own truth and God (if one exists). The reality is like many sheeple on earth. they just wanted him to tell them something
people don't want to think. more often then if one spends ten seconds of thought most of their questions can be answered by themselves.
Enlightenment comes from within not without.
It can't just be taught or explained, neither can it be simply passed on from one to another.
G'kar answer about the lamp and the light on the wall is very similar to Delenn's answer when asked about God and souls. It's nice when the writers remember little details. such a good show.
The analogy at the end actually makes sense. "Truth is every word that flows from the mouth of God." Jesus said, "Man does not live by bread alone, but by every word that flows from the mouth of God." Truth is that which is true. And everything God says is truth.
Franklin is smiling because G'Kar is basically reciting the basis of his religion of Foundationism, which guided him to go walkabout in "Interludes and Examinations"
God this is good writting
I felt sorry for G'kar at the end of this video. His followers completely missed the point and he knew even beforehand that they would not accept his first answer.
Funny when a sci-fy character makes more sense than a lot of modern preachers. The light symbolizes man's desire for wisdom and the river is the quest for knowledge. Only when we search for answers will we find them.
Maybe some of them remembered what he said, and would think about it harder a long time later. Sometimes that's the best you can hope for.
This series had so much wisdom in it, the creator did such great writing with it and know humanity's flaws and failings well. its such a shame that TV networks refuse to play it today, perhaps because it taught such wise lessens...................
Truth and God is the journey and revelation of one's self. G'Kar knew it's not something that could be told or explained, it something you have to experience yourself to understand.
Excellent acting writing and directing.
There is so much wisdom here, it hurts learning it. #narnways
this goes hand in hand with the scene about : soul is a non localised phenomenon that delenn talked about!
I always thought that little shrug of Franklins was the icing on this scene.
Brilliant dialogue. The butt hurt anti comments amuse. Dont like what is said. Move the hell on because this is ineffably perfect. You get it or you don't.
+SJ Wilson And if you have to have it explained to you......"Put your face in the book" JMS is a brilliant writer.
Antitheist, most likely. But they like to stick with being called atheist because it makes them blend in with the rest who keep to themselves and don't go on a spiteful rant in every comment section.
It's why I consider myself non-religious instead. I don't want the association.
Wonderful - and who is to say the great Religious Figures of the past weren't making it up on the spot just like G'kar is doing here?!
I think I'm the only one who came back here after ten years... It's harder to comment last than first
I would LOVE to see Jordan Peterson analyse/reaction to this video :D What an interesting video that would be!!
Someone send it to him somehow!
Holy shit. I just realized why Londo didn't see anything when Kosh showed himself.
'Only the sith deal in absolutes'. Its a great quote but very untrue.
Most people deal in absolutes, either god is real or he is not. Either your god is the real god, or mine is.
Real wisdom is acknowledging that you do not know the truth and in stead focus on what is right.
I believe the holy books of religions were written to guide people into doing that which is right by talking about examples.
Examples that need to be interpreted not to the letter, but as inspiration.
Religion and belief are strongly tied in together. Religion is not wrong, as long as your religion remains a belief. If you take it as full and only truth, you are on the way to self destruction.
I think the story about the lamp is so good, and just like in this show, too many do not understand its meaning.
This show did such an amazing job in its messages.
Atheism is sin and degeneracy.
Jacar knew truth is power, God is ultimate power!
I beg to differ. Truth is freedom. Power corrupts, but freedom creates.
This scene changed my life.
I was working outside of a religious institution when one of the higher up came through we talked for a bit then I asked him the question what is truth and what is god he was puzzled like his answer then I said to him TRUTH IS A RIVER AND THE MOUTH OF THE RIVER IS GOD he stared at me for a bit then drove off he avoided me after that
You know what I want...a small miniseries of Lyta and G'kar adventure...
Make it animated...and face the annoyings of the impossible task of perfectly capturing Andreas.
But...by god I want it...
It could still be done as a series of comics or books without him.
And yes, I really want it too. Have done ever since the show finished.
Rest in peace, Andreas and Richard.
And Mira.
@@AbuMaia01 And Michael,and Jerry, and Stephen, etc.
This is hilarious. JMS has a deep dark sense of humor.
The skeptic and the guru understood each other in ways the followers never could; but their simple questions - "What is truth? And what is God?" - stumped them both. The followers didn't want philosophy; they wanted poetry.
Many would assume science and religion to be antithesis of one another. Materialism vs spiritualism, but they're actually incredibly inter-related. What is science but our attempts to understand all of God's works and what we can do with them? G'Kar and Dr. Franklin each have their own lantern, and are seeking truth in their own way.
Thus, we can conclude that God is truth, and truth is ultimately subjective, which explains why the Vorlons look different to everyone. My Father often says that there is only universal, proven truth, and uses the example of "salt is salt", but would a talented Chef not see a different truth within the nature of salt as opposed to a chemist? Or comparing both to a small child's experiences with salt?
Truth is subjective.
And that is how Stephen Hawking feels whenever he has to explain his theories to normal humans ;)
After hearing G'Kar talk, I ponder why there is not a following on Earth now for his words (maybe there is and Have not searched ;-) I'm sure they'd get it wrong too!
It would have been awesome to have have KOSH say something.
Kosh was long gone by this scene, plus by this point the reliability of Vorlon instruction about religion had been cast into severe doubt.
Kosh would say NO.
Oh wow, this is pretty much the concept of "The Warp" from 40k.
Indeed- he did not want the answer to the question...
Dang it G'Kar! just explain what confirmation bias is to them and call it a day.
Simple Answers, for Simple People, and that is religion in a nutshell.
G'kar was right.
They didn't want the answer.
G.kar was the wisdom Guro of all time
"Yoooooouuurrrr Dethpicable!!!!!!"
I feel like G'Kar in this scene all of the time.
It reminds me of Jesus and Pilate. Pilate was the man that had the power to save him from cruxifiction.