How often and how much should I charge?
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 16 окт 2024
- In this video I explain how often you should charge and what charge limit you should set. There is no simple answer to this. It depends on how you use the car and how fast charging you have at home.
You can get free supercharging when buying a Tesla Model S or X by using my referral link:
ts.la/bjrn3169
Most of my music is from Artlist.io. If you sign up for one year and use my referral link, you will get two months free:
goo.gl/ZWEY76
Donation links:
streamlabs.com/...
/ teslabjorn
My live channel:
/ teslabjornlive24
Teslabjørn Discord server:
/ discord
Reduce food waste and get great deals on food:
toogoodtogo.no/
Great video. I learnt something very critical about my driving habits now so when I get my Tesla, I will know how to charge. Thanks
Hi Bjørn great video again. Can I summarise this way? I would say to charge at home as much as it is required for your daily routine, always leaving the battery as close as 50% state of charge as possible, so for example if your daily routine is using 40% of the max range, you would constantly stay between 30% and 70% state of charge, and then add to that what is needed to reach the next supercharger, if it's not enough already, so that you're always ready for your daily routine as well as any unforeseen longer trip. Also keep in mind that once in a while, preferably just before a long trip, it may be wise to fully charge the battery to 100% to allow the BMS to recalibrate and equalise the battery pack. Finally, try to stay between 25% and 75% state of charge because it's there that the supercharging speed is the fastest, so you would not loose much time charging.
ruclips.net/video/QRPze4f0gsQ/видео.html
Hi Bjorn, definitely hard because so many people have so many different scenarios. Since my Model S 85 is a weekend car (for the moment, will change in the future) I generally charge to 50 - 60% and the battery does not receive a charge for 1 - 4 days depending on how much charging was needed for my Plug In Hybrids. If I had one more plug I could keep it plugged in indefinitely but I am at the extent of my electrical system for the exterior of my house.
I like that Teslas' have active thermal management versus a passive one like the Leaf. I feel less anxiety for leaving the car out in the hot sun or colder weather knowing that the car will take care of itself as long as I have sufficient charge.
Love your videos and stay up way too late watching them.
Tesla Bjorn: The MAN, The Myth ... THE LEGEND! Very clear explanation and valuable information for all ~ Thanks :-)
Thanks for the great info. A lot of new Ev owners coming and this answers alot of questions.
That is excellent advice. Many Tesla owners say how great that they only need to charge once a week by charging to 100% then discharging close to zero like my brother-in-law. I told him that he should charge every day and only to 80% or so because he only uses 15% per day. He told me that Tesla batteries are special that they don't degrade if you're typically discharging from 100% to zero, otherwise Tesla would put in buffers like other EVs. I don't think that's true but what can you do.
I have a model S 85 2013 I charge to 80% most days -I go on a trip very regularly those days I charge to 90 - I try to very rarely Supercharge but of course do if I think it will be close. At home and another location I have Tesla 220 charger set at 50 amps perfect to get me full by next day. I love the car and love driving electric-so far much less hassle than ICE car
My Model 3 just arrived in Anchorage! I will be commuting about 20 miles per day, so I think I'll set it at 55% or 60%. No range anxiety!
For me, I live near Chicago and the cold temp affects the battery terribly, so I charge to 85% everyday and I use sentry mode all the time so that eats the battery up while I’m at work. I always charge it when I get home I try not to let it go under 50% or 40%. Cold temp really drains the battery.
You should only try to keep it above 10%...it's best life is when kept between 10-80%
I only have a Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV but I use it as a TAXI so far in 6 months it has done around 22,000 miles as a Taxi. When not in use it is on charge 100% of the time. When I got the car at 58,900 miles the battery had degraded to 84.4% in the 3 Years 10 months of its life! However it had only been recharged some 100 times. Since then and with many rapid charges (sometime 3 x a night from 25% to 80%) the battery is now at a genuine 96.6%! which is quite an improvement. This is confirmed by the longer charging times and amount charged (on rapid charge) and also increased range on EV only which is now a solid 25 miles and frequently closer to 35 miles. The ICE engine cuts in at 25% to 30% battery capacity then the car becomes a HYBRID 4x4 until I can charge it again. I believe the constant slow charging allows the BMS to get the battery fully sorted and balanced. whatever is the cause its now running far better than before other Users of the PHEV on a forum have tried the same and got similar results. I.E improving battery capacity .
I thinks it is improves what BMS thinks about the battery but not the battery itself :)
Yes my point entirely but you see the BMS controls the car to a degree in that when the 1st battery in the pack hits its max volts (regardless of the rest of the pack) the charging of the whole pack is shut down the same on discharge once the 1st battery drops to its lowest safe voltage the BMS will shut down the car. Frequent slow charging frequently allows the BMS to balance out the pack far better than just charge and go. Likewise similar to the older tech (NMH NICAD) giving the battery a kick with a rapid charge seems to help keep the electrolyte working and in some cases wakens it back up and stops it getting "lazy". My total charge and battery capacity have both recovered from a low 88.2% 33.5Ah at 96865 Km to now 96.6% 36.7 Ah at 128166 Km time taken to charge and amount charged have also gone up.
Hi Bjorn , great video. I just got my model Y 2022. Would you mind to give an update on charging strategies considering the advances of batteries if any difference applies in 2022?
Thanks for explaining this. I have the 2021 ioniq and really appreciate your videos! Thanks again 🇨🇦
Great video Bjørn and very interesting 😄
I live in a Condo, no charging station. I don't drive well under 300 miles per week. So Can I super charge to 100% once per week with normal battery life. Maybe 90% would be ok too? I live in San Diego, CA and retired.
Different videos give different ideas... Another EV video said that according to some laboratory tests, the best possible scenario is to try to keep the charge level between 65% and 75%, the battery degradation was considerably less than e.g. charging repeatedly between 20% and 80%, which is what many people use as a rule of thumb (me included). I guess the lower the charge gets, "depth of discharge" becomes an issue. Many battery manufacturers give their recommendation what the maximum normal depth of discharge should be.
At the same time, some other sources have indicated that if you plan to leave the battery/car to storage for a longer periods of time without any use, then you should set the charge level to either 50% or 60%.
Anyway, in active use, I guess the best idea is to set the charge max limit normally to 75% or 80%, and charge as often as possible.
Another thing I've tried to understand... some people claim that _sometimes_ you should charge your car battery to full 100%, like once a month or two months. They refer to "cell balancing" with this practice, but I haven't fully figured that one out yet... Anyway I guess if you charge it to 100%, you shouldn't leave it there for a longer time.
I have a P85DL and I always charge to 90% and charge when I am down to 10% because I am too lazy to plug it in every night. The car is quicker with a high charge which I enjoy. Of course, when I go to the dragstrip I charge to 100%.
I had to buy a little fan for my tablet cause I can't disable fast charge, and here in Spain we don't go below 20°C already :( Although I keep it max 60-80%... Same for my phone. Very good and useful information.
Change the cahrger with a slow charge one
Use a laptop to charge and you will be limited to the rating of the USB port you are connected to. With most USB 2.0 ports that is 0.5 amps. There are apps that can remind you to remove the tablet from the charger at a set percentage and to connect it to a charger at a set percentage. That should help you keep the temperatures low. It does in California which has a similar climate to most of Spain.
I'm not sure using a laptop is the smartest move, as the power may fluctuate during the charge. You can use a low power wall charger
+Kévin Lind
There is no risk. You volunteer to reduce stress on the battery in order to maximize the investment. Most times people don't need to blast energy into their batteries, they can just leave it to slowly fill till the morning.
Markle2k The issue is not to slow charge, it is to do it with a laptop. The motherboard won't provide a steady charge rate which will put more stress on the battery.
As a new EV driver, this is exactly what I needed to know. Thank you.
I always charge my '21 Model 3 to 90% at home since I finally got a 32A blue industry socket installed. Asked Tesla about how high I should charge for daily use, and he said 90% is fine, no issues. I do however, take care not to drain the battery lower than around 50% during daily use. And since I love driving it, I drive it almost every day, so it doesn't stay at 90% long.
There is no way I am keeping the car longer than around 4 years anyway, since I want a car with warranty, so I suspect I will hardly notice any degradation anyway unless I rack up some serious miles.
Is charging to 100% occasionally important for battery balancing, or is this unnecessary?
Thanks Bjorn, another great video.
16 amps damn!!! i used to charge my model s at 48 amps and used to complaint about it, now I charge at 72 amps in my model x which tbh is great. But 16 amps I would be desperate for charging speed.
How often do you recommand to do a almost full discharge and then charge to 100% to get the BMS calibrated.
once every 3 months...
+kitchendog No need to for most people.
Nice and informative video. Great!!!
Fyi...
NiCd = Nickel Cadmium
NiMh = Nickel Metal Hydride
Great video my man. It answered all my questions.
question... in home charging you can choose the amount/rate of ampere you want to charge, can you do that as well in the supercharger?
It’s only user-adjustable for AC charging, not DC fast charging.
+Sergio Nogueira nope
Very good explanation of the charging limit selection ! One question, if I am leaving for overseas and won’t be back for one month or even longer, what charging limit should I chose ? Thanks for your help !
something betueen 50 and 60% will be ok....
and remmeber to charge it a bitt after you come back
Which is the best batt % to restore tesla battery? When leaving the tesla without ise for a week
I have a question. Let's assume that you don't use your Tesla for a month or so. You leave it in the garrage plugged in. You set the upper limit for charging at about 50%. What would be the total energy consumption (in a period of a month) for just preventing to discharche your battery and keeping it around 50%???
And is the auto-discharge time (let's say at ratio of 5% discharge compare to previous state) any different for 50%, 70%, 90%, 100% charged battery?
Hi Bjorn, what about people who living in apartments and do not have own "charging capabilities"???? Thanks.
Very informative. Lithium ion “characteristics”
Hi Bjørn! Can you make a video comparing public charge stations here in Norway? I'll be new on the EV and I can't charge at home...tks
+Rbto 71 ruclips.net/video/7l3UepKy_Sk/видео.html
Thanks for the good info. Also it scares me a little. I drive in a warmer climate (Italy, south of Rome). I use the Tesla only for weekend commuting (500km one way). Therefore always start with 100%, arrive with less than 5%. About half of my charges are Tesla Supercharger fast charging. So what do you think? When do I have to change my battery?
I think it's crucial that you time your 100% charge to finish at departure time, which you probably do.
Personally, I would charge to 70% and plan a supercharger stop around 30%. Supercharger infrastructure in Italy should have improved enough to allow for this if I look at the map.
Yes, it is better to bounce between 90% and 10% SOC.
rzvqvb . If you start South from the Tuscanies Coast about Island Elba. You have the first and only one until Naples after 350 km at Ceprano. So for now still problematic. Should change in 2018 with SC at Grosetto and Civitavecchia
What you can do if you must charge during the night 23:00-7:00? (because is cheaper)? I usually charge my small range vw-eup up to 80% or 90% depending how many km I have to do next day. I charge this high in order not to come under 30% during the day! I usually bring the car back with 40-50% battery after the daily jobs to do. So my daily charge range is around 40-50% up to 80-90%. I hope that is good. I charge during the night with the slower possible Amper (5).
Good breakdown Bjorn! Basically, charge daily as much as possible without overcharging with the knowledge of one's driving distance and habits(including off-roading on a snowy mountian, right Bjorn? 😆)
Richard Petek - I will agree with the 70% charge along with the 80% - 85% charge. My average daily drive miles is between 30 miles and about 50 miles, more or less per day.
Got it! Thanks for the percentage breakdown 🤙🏽
Do you think it would be worth buying a Tesla model x in romania to travel
Hey Bjorn, why do you have AC unit on your house? Does it get hot in Norway summer time?
It could also be for heating. Electricity is very cheap in Norway (compared to Denmark).
This man earnd his invitations to Tesla's events.
I charge it everyday to 90 % everyday. It’s 2022 M3. I might use about 10% to 15% daily. I have a regular 110 so I get 5 miles per hour btw. Is that ok for daily charging ?
My general charging prifile is 80%.But to be onest i only need 50 %.Is it etter for batteri if i charge to 50 % than? I have Porsche Taycan with big batt.
If you only rapid charged to 80 % and discharged to 20% you would possibly see an improvement in the battery and a reduction if not reversal of the losses you have experienced against new battery.
+Bill Armstrong Degradation is irreversible.
Only if it is true degradation. Batteries out of balance will show up as "degradation" because it reduces the entire pack both ends of the charge cycle. The BMS will stop the charge when the 1st battery hits its top voltage likewise it will kill power when the 1st battery reaches its lowest safe voltage. Even 0.04V difference in 1 battery will affect the whole pack. Richard Petek well I am not alone in being able to resurrect Mitsubishi PHEV batteries by doing exactly what I have stated above.. so maybe the "degradation" you are seeing is simply batteries out of balance or batteries getting "lazy" I am not qualified to say, all I can tell you is plain and simple facts produced by careful analysis and checking and of course I am not alone in being able to "recover" PHEV batteries this way.
Physical damage done yes I agree however this is only really caused by either running the batteries below 20% or rapid charging to above 80%, slow charging to 100% seems to cause no damage to PHEV batteries. However Mitsubishi do run very "conservative" battery voltages. They never go above 4.1 volt or below 3.6 volts however because its a PHEV it is also a hybrid so it reserves the last 25 to 30% battery capacity for Hybrid use. So maybe the way to preserve and avoid physical battery degradation / damage is to stop rapid charging above 80% and recharge when the battery gets to 25 / 30%?
Evidence is to the opposite my friend. The Battery University is out of date. Technology is moving far faster than their editing / updating system. The facts do not lie. at 96865 Km battery capacity was 88.2% and 33.5 Ah (4 years old and charged for only about 100 times) now at 128166 Km my capacity has risen to 96.6% and 36.7Ah with well over over 500 recharges on the pack (400 in the last 6 months). Many Nissan Leaf cars used as Taxis are showing little to no battery degradation even when recharged 4 or 5 times a day for the last 2 to 3 years! This is in a cool climate however and their batteries frequently sit at around 45 to 50 degrees C all the time. The packs in the Mitsubishi are of course climate controlled, even it seems while the car is turned off leading to some "phantom" capacity drain if you live in a climate where the average temperature can exceed 34 Degrees C.
Hi Bjorn, Are charge cycles not an issue if you charge every time you can?
+The EV Puzzle No. One cycle is not counted as one charging session.
I have a question. I set my S to about 75% charge. Even at that. Most days I don’t go below 50%. It’s an 85kwh. Anyway. I also take long trips but only 2 or 3 a month and they are always planned. Should I charge less during the weeks where I am not driving much? So I can use the lower portions of the battery, or does that matter ? I always keep it plugged in but only charge overnight when the electricity is cheap.
+Chris Bates You could go 65-70 %.
didn't that big spreadsheet show that even 90% -> 10% is enough to get many many more cycles, and going 80% -> 20% has barely any more but obviously much less useable power
didn't that big spreadsheet show that even 90% -> 10% is enough to get many many more cycles, and going 80% -> 20% has barely any more but obviously much less useable power
Bjørn Nyland thanks. I changed it. I was thinking that it is t one big battery but hundreds of little batteries and if this down at the 30% are only used on longer less frequent trips it may be bad. Thanks again
Will Darling where can I find the spreadsheet?
I have my charger set ar 56amps, but tesla limits charging at 48amp max. Mine is P75 370km range, but getting 365 fully charged
If you need to store your car for a few weeks, say while on holidays, is it best to have the battery at 50%?
I dont own a tesla but I'm pretty sure that's optimal. Just watch out for phantom drain!
Think day use it's good between 20 to 70 percent
Hi TB, my car is largely stood and not getting too much use atm, I am charging it to about 60-70% then letting it run down to about 30% through parasitic loss (running climate during the day and systems/dashcam running). What should I be doing?
Just continue your current charging habit. 30% to 70% is in the middle, so less degradation.
What is fast charging? Where I lived before I only had 16amp and that was find for the 85KW battery pack, now I have 16amp 400V and that I think is pretty fast. I always charge to 70% daily and drive it down to 60-50% when on trips I set the limit to 90% charge. But every day I could lower the amp and not do 11KW to just fill 10-20%. What is ideal charge speed for home charging with scheduling so the the battery is charge to 70 right before leaving home? What do you guys think? I have heard the 32amp 230v is ideal that gives approximately 7,4 KW.
*85 kWh
And I would like to point out that when I charge to low SOC I loose displayed range:)
I think that in a nearest future the batteries will be significantly better and we won't worry the way of charge.
what is it to dislike bout this informative video. 🤔
I never understand why anyone would click a dislike button, unless there is something offensive or against your political beliefs.. just move on, you don't have to watch.. crazy
Hi Bjorn, Thanks for putting this one out man. This video was able to answer a few questions I had about maintaining battery health. Keep up the good work ok ?
Don't fast charge BEFORE a long trip, just drive right away and fast charge during the trip instead. You will charge faster the less battery you have left and it will wear down less. Only pre-charge if you have time to do it slowly.
Excellent information, as is all your videos! A point of concern for me: I live in a high rise apartment building here in New York City - no charging is available in the garage here where I park. I can only use Tesla chargers. I have a 2018 Model X 75D - I usually charge to about 175 miles (don't have a percentage indicator) - am I doomed to a shorter battery life?
Just switch the display to energy instead of distance in the settings.
Answer at 9:28 Great video.
Great help
3:30 "I wish I had 32 amps." I discussed this recently with a Tesla salesperson and they said that a European Tesla can't charge at 32A on AC. The onboard charger is limited to roughly 24 amps (i.e. 16.5 kW at 3-phase). Upgrading to 32A would not give you what you expect. However if you charge at single phase now, an upgrade to three phases would give you three times the charging speed.
32 A 1 Phase will give you 7.3 kW. That what Bjorn is wished for.
+Jeroen van Montfort I was referring to 230 V 32 A.
hello bjorn, love your videos,
can you please tell me how much the battery will degrade over time, if we used your methods ?
like lets say i charge to 60% because i have a pretty stable driving habit .. after how many months (approx.) would i start to notice degrade and how bad would it be approximately in KW/H or range ?
salah kilani, not months, years. Check Teslanomics, he made a video about battery degradation:ruclips.net/video/Gb_i4ihsJ1w/видео.html
Is there a scientific explanation about the statement that fast charging is ruining the battery? I have the feeling this could only be a myth to prevent ppl from using free supercharger too often. :)
+tehdime Higher temperature degrades the battery faster. Fast charging results in higher temperature.
Bjørn Nyland thank you
What is fast charging? Where I lived before I only had 16amp and that was find for the 85KW battery pack, now I have 16amp 400V and that I think is pretty fast. I always charge to 70% daily and drive it down to 60-50% when on trips I set the limit to 90% charge. But every day I could lower the amp and not do 11KW to just fill 10-20%. What is ideal charge speed for home charging with scheduling so the the battery is charge to 70% right before leaving home? What do you guys think? I have heard that 230v32 Amp is ideal for the battery that gives approximately 7.4KW speed.
This is a much more comprehensive study of Li Ion battery charge/discharge:
batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_prolong_lithium_based_batteries
Note the article around Figures 6 and 7. To maximize battery life, the data suggest narrowing the charge-discharge cycles and avoid discharge below 25%. So, 50% max charge really isn’t optimal (and likely is the reason why the minimum charge setting on a Tesla is 50%). 70% seems a better, routine max charge level for day-to-day driving in an urban environment with nightly recharging.
Summary:
• Li-Io best stored at 70%.
• Charged better slower than faster.
• Used best in the upper half of the battery capacity.
• Charge it as often as you can, it doesn't hurt the battery if it's charged more often, at random levels of charge.
So yes, charging it daily to 100% is no issue, but charging to 100% daily and let it sit the whole night as this charging level is an issue.
+Ruben Kelevra Charging daily to 100 % is not good for the battery and not recommended.
Bjørn Nyland this is obviously false, charging an Li-Io up too 100% do not degrade it, but storing it at high state of charge do degrade it.
That's why it's convenient to just plug it in and charge up to 70-80%. It can just sit the whole night or over a weekend without hurting the battery unnecessarily.
But if you plan to use the battery at a given time, know the charging rate and that you'll consume at least 20%, charging it daily to 100% is no issue at all. If you can avoid discharging below 50% by charging it up to 100% right before leaving, you would theoretically increase the lifetime of you battery significantly.
This are facts Wikipedia listed in the german Wikipedia article on that battery type, not personal opinion.
In order to reach 100 %, you have to spend time at high SoC. It's not recommended to sit and wait at a fast charger to 100 %. Therefore most people will slow charge at home to 100 %. That means that the time the battery spends near 100 % is long. Charging to 100 % is not recommended.
Bjørn Nyland the high state of charge degredation is more a long term storage issue, so e.g. you don't want to charge your laptop battery to 100% and store it on a shelf for months. That's why battery's always ship with around 70% state of charge. Letting it sit for an hour has no significant long term effect.
Discharging a battery regularly below 50% on the other hand has, so if you can avoid this, by charging it at 11/16.5 kW at home right before leaving to 100% is better than beeing conservative and charge the battery to 60% and discharge it to 30% - what some people do.
Charging the battery up until you leave is also a good habit, since the battery will be warm and you don't have to waste additional energy to heating it up. So charging over night to 90% and set it to 100% continuing charge when you wake up, for example, while also preheating, gives the best energy efficiency and the longest battery life.
Bjorn Nyland, Yes you completely right, and the last investigations about EV charges said the same that you say. It's simple, because when you charge the battery to 100%, the battery is at its maximum voltage and capacity, therefore warmer, so according to with what you said, 100% to a long time it's so bad, yes you right. And it is more than proven in first generation EVs. Being small batteries, they charge 100% every day and last a short time.
With smartphones I always charge to 100% and discharge to less than 20% and I never had a phone battery go bad. My current phone the Galaxy Note 2 is on its original battery and no problems with it, while all my friends have battery problems after 2-3 years and are forced to replace their phone.The only thing I do is to never interrupt the charge and let it go to 100%. Never short cycle it. I know this should not apply but somehow It works for me.
I know, but other people batteries go completely bad after 2-3 years . All my friends are having severe problems. Not me.
I have an iPhone X, I discharge to 40% usually even 30% makes me cringe already then charge to 70-80% and I keep it in that range, it's easy because I'm mostly on desktop and I have wireless charging so all I have to do is put it there wait until it's time I usually check my phone every now and then for notifications etc anyway so when I see it's roughly time I remove and the battery lasts all day pretty much, if I'm not on 4g, if I go out and I'm on 4g then I charge to 100% and wouldn't let it discharge past 30% either.
My MacBook I have 2 type-c monitors and I don't want it to charge to 100% either so I found that with my 2 monitors plugged in since I use it as a desktop/workstation and it's always plugged in I found that a nintendo switch charger was just the right amount of power to keep it from charging so I just charge to 50-70% and use a power supply that is not gonna charge the laptop and run the ground/earth through another type-c port since it's double insulated and I don't like tingles. But then I'm basically an engineer and this just comes naturally I guess some people may feel like it's way too much of a hassle to keep things at the right percentage.
At least Tesla and some laptop companies like Lenovo do have a way to control/stop charging when you don't want it to fully charge but most companies just let the customer fully charge, the usual planned obsolescence specially for devices that are much harder to replace batteries and the parts aren't easy to find, remember we're talking about a replacement part that you will need years from now when the device is no longer a flagship or even being sold, but the bottom line is this, if you take care of your battery when it gets old it will still be quite good and you won't have to replace so an extra year, two even more who knows.
I have over 20 devices that take Li-Ion battery and that's not a lot if you think about from toothbrushes to phones and speakers, headphones try to keep everything at the right range without driving you insane XD
Is degradation greatest discharging deeply or recharging highly -- or both?
// Many opinions on this topic. One reasonable charging/use opinion I've adopted is the 30% - 75% (midrange window).
// FWIW = "For What It's Worth"
Both. The best way to think about is that when fully charged or discharged, all the lithium is at one side of the battery or the other (anode or cathode). In either situation the lithium ions are most concentrated and so most chemically reactive. If you're at 50% charge the lithium ions are evenly distributed between the anode and cathode and are therefore minimally reactive.
+Robert Hutton -- Thank you. Useful "lithium distribution/ concentration" conceptualization.
Im a little hesitant to take your advice considering you had your battery replaced twice.
that was not because what he says, that was because what he does. he is right in this video and he already acknowledge that he uses superchargers alot and that is bad for the battery... Tesla also says that you should not use it frequently, just in longer road trips.
That happens once or I missed something ? :)
+Wilhelm wang You clearly had no clue. The issues resulting in battery replacement was not due to degradation. First case in Millennium Falcon was a well know weak power switch failure. Second case with Optimus Prime was unknown. But I had no abnormal degradation in the old pack.
In both cases, Tesla could have fixed the battery and then returned it to me. Many other people got that treatment. But also many people were given a new pack.
In all cases, degradation is not the case.
I agree that is in an ignorant comment.
Non-intellectual comments are not cool!
Hi
......first.....