Yeah, powerscaling with undertale is pretty confusing, since the gameplay is a bullet hell style game. It is hard to identify a character's destructive capabilities by just playing the game, so a lot of different statements have to be interpreted and used as feats. And aus are not only confusing, but also inconsistent since they can have even more different interpretations Great video! I've wanted someone to discuss this topic for a while now.
powerscaling is basically impossible to get right in the UT fandom tbh also the power levels of everyone depends on the AU and how peopls see it. I think the creator of Killer!Sans explained it good in a short comic or smt, gotta show u when I can find it again lol
I was always curious about the power scaling aspect of UT and your video helped give me some more insight into the idea of it, I look forward to more content from you! Also you may want to lower the background music a bit, it's kinda hard to hear your voice over it sometimes.
I take things at face value : sonic for example has the light speed dash as that and I take that normally. but some people think the light speed dash is actually fucking the speed of sound like literally if the dreamcast had light speed shit then the device would be dead before it was even out for sale ;w;.
Chara powerscaling has messed me up so many times... so many arguments -_- it is even more challenging to scale them in specific when we know UT is a game in canon. Is their feat considered less because Chara only managed to supposedly erase the world while the game itself is still playable? Is it even their feat when Frisk has to put so much effort into the run? We know Chara and Frisk share the body kinda, does that mean that Frisk is the one who erases the world? Thinking about it hurts my head
Agree, chara's scaling is a mess however if we think more logically they're scaled to mountain or island level because when you boot up the game again you can hear the wind passing by likely chara and frisk are just sitting there close to the barrier in the buried underground so definitely not universal like other ppl would say. Their speed can be measured to supersonic+ not FTL cuz if it was Chara would be instantly hit so we just dodge it like how you dodge a pistol that is about to fire. Chara's strength seems vague but not destructive capacity at least this is how I see it.
People really got super MAD when i started saying Undertale scaling is weird, even insultingme or saying i had mental disorders xD, mostly because monsters use magic, so it can not be taken literally, for example Frisk dodging "sound" from a dog, but its not sound, its just that the monsters use Magic bullets that just ressemble that thing
I realized that powerscaling when it comes to Undertale AUs can be unfair and pretty dumb when you think about it. Like, how come a glitched skeleton (Error sans) that was formerly geno sans can suddenly gain the power to destroy AUs, including ones with infinite timelines + is lightspeed because his gaster blaster was apparnetly confirmed to be a literal light laser beam or something but a oc that’s the conceptual embodiment of positivity across MULTIVERSES (outside the utau verse) is considered weak? How come a skeleton with the power of Ink manipulation / creation abilities is falsely portrayed as a god / creator + is viewed as universal just because hes in the doodlesphere??? How come pointing out statements that the creator of an AU says online but can’t animate it “is considered an NLF,” but one statement from another creator thats vaguely stated in a comic is not considered a NLF?
I assume the conceptual thing is dream sans? I actually need to know this stuff cuz I think dream is utau only (But even then it makes no sense how dream doesn't >> error but that's more a lore thing and lore accuracy scaling is iffy) Ink is likely seen that way since I think he helps writers with their aus and people mistook it as him creating them, there a diff in making and helping to make an au.
@@aidiot778 Yeah the conceptual being is Dream Sans. Joku stated that Dream and Nightmare can travel thru multiverses before + and in the comic, the tree of feelings and the apples are “essential to the multiverses.” And Nightmare’s goal is to remove positivity in every multiverse by killing Dream / turning the last positivity apple into a negative one so every multiverse will be filled with negativity and destroy themselves.
@@purpledshadow I think the fault with that lies in Joku saying it's "every multiverse" which would imply big time verses such as db or anything else comply with it. I think Joku meant either his own verse or every undertale multiverse due to it not being hinted anywhere else. I wouldn't disagree if this was hinted in some of my favorites (Db, digimon, dark souls, sekiro, really the basic picks for anime and games) but it doesn't apply to them, he's the concept of positivity in his own multiverse, nowhere else. Edit: I forgot to mention if Dream is the concept of positivity across the multiverses then Reaper should be the concept of death (Or any sans that embodies a concept) Also Error > Dream is false I think people push that because they believe Dream is just weak when in reality he's second to the non pure powerscaling sans aus
@@aidiot778 + Joku has also stated that Dreamtale never originated from the undertale multiverse. It was just moved there / the tree of feelings was moved into the undertale multiverse by Nim before they died in order to stay away from other 2 guardians. I think the main reason why ppl say the Dream is weak is because of the fact that he can only really use his own strength / his daggers to fight someone other than Nightmare (because the positivity arrows only directly damage Nightmare but not others)
@@purpledshadow Yeah no people underestimate dream and at one point I did too, but you can see why I don't believe the conceptual being part though right? Also as for people thinking Dream is weak it's moreless misunderstanding and I hate that but what can we do, Dream > Error/Ink but I think Error being stronger just sounds a bit better since positivity is usually overshadowed by negativity (Killer vs swap being an example, swap can grow and beat killer but for a while killer wins)
Spongebob destroyed reality by pulling on a string for too long.... Spongebob > Saitama..... easy In regards to Sans needing the KR to do dmg. I don't think that's the case, since Flowey told Frisk that Sans was a big problem for him and caused him to do a lot of resets. Not only that but Sans is confident that he would be able to kill the Human even during their True Pacifist run. He straight up tells Frisk that while giving them dinner....
I do believe apart from the fact from frisk can just retry any monster thats absorbed multiple human souls is stronger than any other monster and a group of humans smaller than the amount of souls they have absorbed (frisk only beat omega flowey because of the other souls rebelling) sans is awkward because of kr but i think kr scales based on the amount of kills a human/monster has so i think most can beat sans Id say undyne is probably strongest outside of karma and human souls shenanigans (mostly because of undyne the undying and the fact she has suplexed boulders just because they can in her neutral/pacifist fight) just my opinions on this stuff
i've been wanting a video like this to exist for a while now... the fact that the narrator completely lies about some monsters' ATK and DF stats doesn't help with this either.
Those who have feats are in weakest to strongest Horror!Sans >>>> Glitchtale characters >>>> Delta >>>>>> Underverse (I heard underverse characters are Multi block) Epictale characters >>>>>> Reapertale >>>> Alphatale as a terrible and beginner scaler I am not that consistent Horrortale is being scaled from Horror!Sans who pierced huge bones to that core in Hotlands Glitchtale meanwhole being scaled to...Building (idk these were from friend's scalinga) I haven't watched Glitchtale for years so I forgot all the feats they did. Someone clear me out :( Delta manages to create a Huge beam 5 times his size ( I am not a math person) that destroyed the groujd also. Probably that would be muiti block at best In 0.4 underverse Fell, swap and classic manages to destroy the Area they werenin unfortunately we can't calculate it all because it was off screen. Cross destroyed those walls in 0.3 part 1 across a whole block (which is like small building I guess?). Killer also destroyed the ground in that Killer vs dream fight... Epictale is currently being scaled from epic who managed to destroy a whole giant forest using his blasters Reapertale is scaled from Sans who is stated to be like a blackhole or somethin. I heard low 2-c but never knew what was the scans Alphatale being low complex multiversal to hyperversal at best due to 404 destroying a Hyperverse with at his best during his fight with omni sans. However it may be scaled higher because of the shit I don't know So yeah..I am not good at this
I have an issue with what you said about KRMA. We don’t actually know how that works, people just called it KRMA one day and everyone went with it, it’s a false narrative that people have placed for the sake of it. So we don’t know if it’s just limited to people who have sinned so that argument doesn’t exactly strike me as that profound.
You can’t fully blame people for placing it like that. The player has killed basically the entire underground and having Karma for it would make sense as Sans is the judge. It wouldn’t be too far from the sense that it would literally Karma
So my type power scaling with this stuff is very weird for example horror v dust atk goes to horror cause weapon destructive atk goes to dust abilitys goes to dust ig and big dust cause he remembers every reset feats I'd say horror cause he lived getting hit at one hp df horror cause immortal to an extent speed I'd say equal cause no feats or stats ether way endurance dust cause more lv hp horror yet horror still wins or ties cause he's immortal and killer is weak man so weak In cannon tldr cannon scaling sucks
Killer literally one shot ink and dream in 2v1 so how is he weak ? Also killer got 9999999lv and can tank nm attacks also killer got regeneration and code manipulation
@@teasea3022 bro killer literally tanked ink and dream attack also swap attacks so also there’s this (Rn people are separating the old killer ( the version who one shot ink and dream and got 999999lv (in short the version am using) )from the new killer (the version who as u say got 1hp but then again both are canon )
Yeah, powerscaling with undertale is pretty confusing, since the gameplay is a bullet hell style game. It is hard to identify a character's destructive capabilities by just playing the game, so a lot of different statements have to be interpreted and used as feats. And aus are not only confusing, but also inconsistent since they can have even more different interpretations
Great video! I've wanted someone to discuss this topic for a while now.
powerscaling is basically impossible to get right in the UT fandom tbh
also the power levels of everyone depends on the AU and how peopls see it. I think the creator of Killer!Sans explained it good in a short comic or smt, gotta show u when I can find it again lol
I was always curious about the power scaling aspect of UT and your video helped give me some more insight into the idea of it, I look forward to more content from you!
Also you may want to lower the background music a bit, it's kinda hard to hear your voice over it sometimes.
for me undyne the undying is one of the strongest falling behind is. sans because literally sans only deals 6 damage per bone (KR counted)
I take things at face value :
sonic for example has the light speed dash as that and I take that normally. but some people think the light speed dash is actually fucking the speed of sound like literally if the dreamcast had light speed shit then the device would be dead before it was even out for sale ;w;.
Chara powerscaling has messed me up so many times... so many arguments -_-
it is even more challenging to scale them in specific when we know UT is a game in canon. Is their feat considered less because Chara only managed to supposedly erase the world while the game itself is still playable? Is it even their feat when Frisk has to put so much effort into the run? We know Chara and Frisk share the body kinda, does that mean that Frisk is the one who erases the world? Thinking about it hurts my head
Agree, chara's scaling is a mess however if we think more logically they're scaled to mountain or island level because when you boot up the game again you can hear the wind passing by likely chara and frisk are just sitting there close to the barrier in the buried underground so definitely not universal like other ppl would say. Their speed can be measured to supersonic+ not FTL cuz if it was Chara would be instantly hit so we just dodge it like how you dodge a pistol that is about to fire. Chara's strength seems vague but not destructive capacity at least this is how I see it.
I mean, of course the game where many things are up to personal interpretation would be a nightmare to powerscale.
People really got super MAD when i started saying Undertale scaling is weird, even insultingme or saying i had mental disorders xD, mostly because monsters use magic, so it can not be taken literally, for example Frisk dodging "sound" from a dog, but its not sound, its just that the monsters use Magic bullets that just ressemble that thing
I have seen so many people say that mtt can genocide a au but if you actualy check they have NOTHING that can make a dent in God of hyperdeath asriel
yeah looking back it is confusing with the scaling
Surprised you never mentioned the coded hp values and the check stats.
I realized that powerscaling when it comes to Undertale AUs can be unfair and pretty dumb when you think about it.
Like, how come a glitched skeleton (Error sans) that was formerly geno sans can suddenly gain the power to destroy AUs, including ones with infinite timelines + is lightspeed because his gaster blaster was apparnetly confirmed to be a literal light laser beam or something but a oc that’s the conceptual embodiment of positivity across MULTIVERSES (outside the utau verse) is considered weak?
How come a skeleton with the power of Ink manipulation / creation abilities is falsely portrayed as a god / creator + is viewed as universal just because hes in the doodlesphere???
How come pointing out statements that the creator of an AU says online but can’t animate it “is considered an NLF,” but one statement from another creator thats vaguely stated in a comic is not considered a NLF?
I assume the conceptual thing is dream sans? I actually need to know this stuff cuz I think dream is utau only (But even then it makes no sense how dream doesn't >> error but that's more a lore thing and lore accuracy scaling is iffy)
Ink is likely seen that way since I think he helps writers with their aus and people mistook it as him creating them, there a diff in making and helping to make an au.
@@aidiot778 Yeah the conceptual being is Dream Sans. Joku stated that Dream and Nightmare can travel thru multiverses before + and in the comic, the tree of feelings and the apples are “essential to the multiverses.” And Nightmare’s goal is to remove positivity in every multiverse by killing Dream / turning the last positivity apple into a negative one so every multiverse will be filled with negativity and destroy themselves.
@@purpledshadow I think the fault with that lies in Joku saying it's "every multiverse" which would imply big time verses such as db or anything else comply with it. I think Joku meant either his own verse or every undertale multiverse due to it not being hinted anywhere else.
I wouldn't disagree if this was hinted in some of my favorites (Db, digimon, dark souls, sekiro, really the basic picks for anime and games) but it doesn't apply to them, he's the concept of positivity in his own multiverse, nowhere else.
Edit: I forgot to mention if Dream is the concept of positivity across the multiverses then Reaper should be the concept of death (Or any sans that embodies a concept)
Also Error > Dream is false I think people push that because they believe Dream is just weak when in reality he's second to the non pure powerscaling sans aus
@@aidiot778 + Joku has also stated that Dreamtale never originated from the undertale multiverse. It was just moved there / the tree of feelings was moved into the undertale multiverse by Nim before they died in order to stay away from other 2 guardians.
I think the main reason why ppl say the Dream is weak is because of the fact that he can only really use his own strength / his daggers to fight someone other than Nightmare (because the positivity arrows only directly damage Nightmare but not others)
@@purpledshadow Yeah no people underestimate dream and at one point I did too, but you can see why I don't believe the conceptual being part though right?
Also as for people thinking Dream is weak it's moreless misunderstanding and I hate that but what can we do, Dream > Error/Ink but I think Error being stronger just sounds a bit better since positivity is usually overshadowed by negativity (Killer vs swap being an example, swap can grow and beat killer but for a while killer wins)
6:18 maybe its because the fight is longer than any other
And because he is waving his arms around like a madman for blue soul, using crazy powerful attacks, and dodging.
Pretty much undertale au power scaling is a big mess :D
I aggre
i agree
UNDERTALE doesn't really work in crossverse battles if you think about it...
Spongebob destroyed reality by pulling on a string for too long....
Spongebob > Saitama..... easy
In regards to Sans needing the KR to do dmg.
I don't think that's the case, since Flowey told Frisk that Sans was a big problem for him and caused him to do a lot of resets. Not only that but Sans is confident that he would be able to kill the Human even during their True Pacifist run. He straight up tells Frisk that while giving them dinner....
Allat just for Goku to solo 🔥🔥🔥✍️
Allat just for Goku to solo 🔥🔥🔥✍️
Allat just for Goku to solo 🔥🔥🔥✍️
Allat just for Goku to solo 🔥🔥🔥✍️
@@Reminesu U a sans fanboy or a goku fanboy?
I do believe apart from the fact from frisk can just retry any monster thats absorbed multiple human souls is stronger than any other monster and a group of humans smaller than the amount of souls they have absorbed (frisk only beat omega flowey because of the other souls rebelling) sans is awkward because of kr but i think kr scales based on the amount of kills a human/monster has so i think most can beat sans
Id say undyne is probably strongest outside of karma and human souls shenanigans (mostly because of undyne the undying and the fact she has suplexed boulders just because they can in her neutral/pacifist fight) just my opinions on this stuff
i've been wanting a video like this to exist for a while now... the fact that the narrator completely lies about some monsters' ATK and DF stats doesn't help with this either.
@@Person76439 that's completely true! i didn't phrase that very well
there is a thing that is highly agreeable :
the child kill- I mean dusttale sans will beat undyne the undying.
Those who have feats are in weakest to strongest
Horror!Sans >>>> Glitchtale characters >>>> Delta >>>>>> Underverse (I heard underverse characters are Multi block)
Epictale characters >>>>>> Reapertale >>>> Alphatale
as a terrible and beginner scaler I am not that consistent
Horrortale is being scaled from Horror!Sans who pierced huge bones to that core in Hotlands
Glitchtale meanwhole being scaled to...Building (idk these were from friend's scalinga) I haven't watched Glitchtale for years so I forgot all the feats they did. Someone clear me out :(
Delta manages to create a Huge beam 5 times his size ( I am not a math person) that destroyed the groujd also. Probably that would be muiti block at best
In 0.4 underverse Fell, swap and classic manages to destroy the Area they werenin unfortunately we can't calculate it all because it was off screen. Cross destroyed those walls in 0.3 part 1 across a whole block (which is like small building I guess?). Killer also destroyed the ground in that Killer vs dream fight...
Epictale is currently being scaled from epic who managed to destroy a whole giant forest using his blasters
Reapertale is scaled from Sans who is stated to be like a blackhole or somethin. I heard low 2-c but never knew what was the scans
Alphatale being low complex multiversal to hyperversal at best due to 404 destroying a Hyperverse with at his best during his fight with omni sans. However it may be scaled higher because of the shit I don't know
So yeah..I am not good at this
Alphatale is high outer.
I have an issue with what you said about KRMA. We don’t actually know how that works, people just called it KRMA one day and everyone went with it, it’s a false narrative that people have placed for the sake of it. So we don’t know if it’s just limited to people who have sinned so that argument doesn’t exactly strike me as that profound.
You can’t fully blame people for placing it like that.
The player has killed basically the entire underground and having Karma for it would make sense as Sans is the judge.
It wouldn’t be too far from the sense that it would literally Karma
ruclips.net/video/HgoDYEiVacc/видео.html these guys found a way to power scale in undertale
So my type power scaling with this stuff is very weird for example horror v dust atk goes to horror cause weapon destructive atk goes to dust abilitys goes to dust ig and big dust cause he remembers every reset feats I'd say horror cause he lived getting hit at one hp df horror cause immortal to an extent speed I'd say equal cause no feats or stats ether way endurance dust cause more lv hp horror yet horror still wins or ties cause he's immortal and killer is weak man so weak In cannon tldr cannon scaling sucks
Killer literally one shot ink and dream in 2v1 so how is he weak ? Also killer got 9999999lv and can tank nm attacks also killer got regeneration and code manipulation
@@bruhntastic3021 exactly weird
He has one hp his lv doesn't help his stats because it's weird
@@bruhntastic3021 and 9999999999lv is fanon
@@teasea3022 bro killer literally tanked ink and dream attack also swap attacks so also there’s this
(Rn people are separating the old killer ( the version who one shot ink and dream and got 999999lv (in short the version am using) )from the new killer (the version who as u say got 1hp but then again both are canon )
the hells madness sounds like another cringy oc
Dude don't judge something before it comes out
@@teasea3022 na
@@sansdeltarune6969 TFYM NAH
@@teasea3022 am gonna do my own thing
@@sansdeltarune6969 no spider man its a Canon event you don't understand