Wing Chun Kungfu vs Muay Thai
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- Опубликовано: 13 май 2024
- One of the most interesting attempts by a Wing Chun practioner to try to go against Muay Thai. What was up with those chain punches constantly in the air? They definitely only wasted energy and left the face open. Let us know what else you saw from this sparring session.
Original video that we analyzed: • 功夫網聚-C-12 泰拳 VS 詠春
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#fight #commentary #breakdowns #kungfu #wingchun #muaythai
Timecodes:
0:00 Initial commentary
3:11 Slow motion commentary
7:08 Wing Chun question for viewers
8:22 Keeping martial arts indie
8:30 Serenading 
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For someone who was fighting textbook I thought he did not that bad. Especially compared to some KF “masters” who didn’t resemble any training. Looks like this dude was at least figuring things out
Agree, tho the pre fight posture was never meant to be used as a fighting pose as far as I was taught
Diu!
@@Ed7501 😂 say it with pride!
@@joedrock2 fr, the legs being like that is a training method just like Shaolin Kung Fu people do the horse stance and even throw punches from there while training!
You are not supposed to fight from the horse stance!!
And about the hand position from the Wing Chun stance, i'm pretty sure that it is supposed to be like that only with weapons, yeah you could use it for unarmed but i don't know if it really was supposed to be used like that...
@@jestfullgremblim8002 it's a frozen chain punch, but everything is just attacking the center until/unless something gets in the way! It's really all just making bridge, in a fight it's an easy way to get ones arms trapped
A key fundamental of WC is closing the gap.
WC goes in. Once bridge is established, attack with hands and feet until threat is over.
He keeps reseting to training stance, I suspect he's not massively used to sparing
Still taking this in, but right away wing Chun guy is not being aggressive enough!
💯!
Looks like he's in a training stance for most of the fight, he's looking for the bridge, but not from a fighting stance, going to struggle like that.
Wing Chun guy here... he's not chain punching, he's changing lead hands most of the time. Sometimes he's reacting to feints trying to intercept punches.
Agreed 👍🏾
That's what I was thinking. I don't think he did bad, he wasn't super familiar with everything he should have been doing and probably not too used to sparring either. I say, props to him!
No terrible but def needs more live sparring experience
This is not a Wing Chuan master, the real Wing Chuan is more of an extreme close quarter fighting, meaning he will be some up close in the face that his opponent can’t kick or punch straight.
These guys have a long way to go, but at that point in time, sparring with a fellow novice is exactly what they need to get that reality check and motivation to improve. That said, the video is clearly years old, so you gotta wonder what happened after
If I'm MT guy here I only throw those kicks because there was no kick defense for the most part and looked like WC guy was just throwing those punches so I'd not want to enter into a mutually beneficial range and keep it to a range where only I benefit.
I turned the sound off . Way better . Ok neither of these guys are masters by any means however it takes discipline to stay within the confines of any set system , especially when competing with an unfamiliar style . Kudos to both of them for actually participating instead of just uploading or watching a video.
When the time and rhyme of the 'chain-hand' is spotted, then the situation gets worse. A chain punch without pursuing the opponent's face (keeping the pressure), the chain punch decreases its 'smaller people can beat bigger people' possibility.
7:15 紅船詠春、永春、梁贊、梁二娣、蛇鶴詠春
I don't think its chain punching hut rather guard shifting, like old Pugilists did in Europe.
Was that just a spar session.
Hey Jerry are you getting some of these videos through wechat ? I noticed that videos shared through it will get auto compressed and thusly speed up the video
The inward knee crossed legs thing bothers me, that's part of the forms but really isn't a fighting stance, it will happen for a split second when shifting to face the opponent 🤷♂️ still cool though, did better than most "masters"
Yes. The whole knees in, elbows in stance is to create muscle memory. I dunno why people think it applies to combat as, "you have to stand like this".
@@farkinarkin5099 yeah no fight stance is static, this guy did solid in it though, but would've done better if he wasn't that ridged
Good basics, didn't watch enough Donnie Yan movies, wingchun uses high kicks in certain situations. Wooden dummy training gives some some advantages over any opponent again in certain situations. Then didn't utilise explosive attacks or counter attacks..One thing had in good order was center line. No low side kicks to notice. If mastered they can be devastating. Generally good performance for someone who possibly trains mostly in super safe conditions. Maybe one day can do something... still needs to watch more movies, spar real opponent and do some heavy punching, kicking, throwing, etc...
I think if you understand different defenses and range you can use that hand position. You definitely need to understand when and how to cover up, and I’d like to see this guy get his chin down and shoulders up a little higher.
The signature WC hand posture should never be applied in sparring. Even though this guy did a little better by switching between two hands but the move is highly predictable and the opponent can time it. Also the WC should defend the kick with either leg check or intercept, not with hands.
He needs to step in! Amd stay there, but ya gotta be soft enough and springy enough to make it work
Wing Chun guy should use elbows when in the clinch. Maybe he is a beginner?
Wow see that, u right jerry and proper chain punches both hands should not be away at the same time!!
So.. no elbows or knees? This looks mire like kickboxing vs wing chun
WC's footwork and leg work preventing and trapping strikes are lacking.. also its not just blocking or parrying but redirecting and counter-striking up-close.
MT: not using his teeps properly..
Both arent using elbow strikes (by agreement?) 😅
Is the default for wing Chun a defensive art? If so I feel like it could be used offensively a.k.a. a bit more aggression.
Every successful WC artist I've seen applies it aggressively, you need to have footwork to make those chain punches actually have any force and to be able to push someone back, you can see this guy was just arm punching and had no force behind his chain punches
@@Autonamatonamaton There's a sifu in the area. I've been wanting to learn so bad.
Wing Chun is supposed to be an attacking, close range style, and once you're in close you stay there. Also no high kicks, at least not if you're from Ip Man / Wong shun Leung lineage. Definitely won't work if you play at a (kick) boxing guy's range.
@@blackpanther6389 I'd go and check out the class and see what it's like. If you want to just learn a martial art for personal development and because you enjoy the style, just watch and see if it's got a positive vibe, people seem happy to be training there, and the people look healthy and confident.
If you're trying to learn how to get into fights or competition, you need to be a bit more selective with where you train and if it will be applicable to serious fighting against determined, skilled opposition. I'm not saying that Wing Chun can't do that, because it can (see lots of videos from this channel) but you need to be much more discerning with what school you attend because if you go into fights with poor training you can get badly hurt
"This works in the movies".
---Wing Chun Guy.
You can't use the main crux of wing chun, which is trapping, whilst wearing gloves. Doesn't work in sparring application. Chain punch bs.
Yo this dude held his own I'm sure if it wasn't sparring the guy with muy thai would of won for sure. All in all wing chun with great precision and technique is one of the best material arts you could ever learn , speed like lightning , strength unimaginable 💯
those side kicks look more like Sanda than Muay Thai
He's using those chain punches to set up a trap definitely has a good foundation but i agree he can set up a chain with a higher guard.
Is this a set up
WC guy hasn’t been sparring outside his own school. He’s way too passive… waiting for his opponent to attack. Dunno, 🤷🏾♂️ different schools different approaches. I see this often with WC chain punching. Chain punching has it place. It’s only a waste of time when you use consistently to close the gap? Numerics or Blast as it it known in JKD can be extremely effective in the right hands. It’s not only a striking technique.
That being said I’m a WC guy, I was taught to check the lead arm first. Create a contact point, not jump in recklessly?!?… You’ll get check hooked and blind hook all day. Can’t understand why my WC community isn’t getting this basic beginners concept?
Jerry you did a view with one of my Sifu’s. Master Redmond drop some knowledge in that video you did on the beach.
I like the wing Chun spirit. He look like he put some time in.
You can tell is a very light sparing if the Muay thai want hurt him only three kicks are enough to put down the wing Chung guy
He is holding back from using the elbows 🥸
Where is 1 inch punch?
This is going to be interesting
First video of a sparring match where it starts to look like wing Chun, still he needs to press to have any real chance.
its soft spar, the attack stop after nearly touch your opponents.
I am reminded of the fight scene from Ip Man 3, between Wing Chun Master Ip vs Muay Thai Boxer. Again, the success may go to the more talented opponent, and,not necessarily, the particular fighting art. Che ck it Out! Ciao!!!
The lineage which I think he maybe displaying is ... Sum Ting Wong 👊 Wing chun
Wing Chun guy needs to consider himself grateful that Muay Thai guy wasn't throwing knees, elbows, switch kicks, and low calf kicks. Also wasn't applying Muay Thai plum as much for more secure clinch strikes. Long story short wing Chun guy looked like a boy fighting a man in there
"WingChun" guy needs to learn Wing Chun clearly this is NOT WING CHUN
And they’re obviously in different stages of their training.
The winchun guy tried to catch all of punches and kicks from the Thai guy. This is incorrect compare to the basic theory of Winchun techniques. In winchun, we dont trade, we strike at the same time the opponent throw their strikings but set up at the different angles, not at the straight line. Even we missed, continue to shift to different angles, this is still way more effective than try to catch these power. Muay Thai is built to keep a very high pressure in straight line combat, so please dont trade with them 😂
I came from leung ting, but we left the organization! My sifu was full contact fighter before he got to wt. I like sifu Fernandez wing chun do, he incorporates boxing and pressure testing!
Got any footage?
@@FightCommentary ruclips.net/video/aCzo-z0f2EU/видео.htmlsi=INgJ4FacePj0sUpD
@@FightCommentary used to b a gr8 one of him testing a student for technician, 45 min of continuous chi sau, beating on each other n pressure testing!
@@joedrock2Yeah, but where is it? Most of his footage was deleted and reuploaded.
@@MrAlepedroza I dunno but I'm sad I couldn't find it!
Why wing chun weared a glove.
It was unfair
Have you heard of Chin Na
I see why Bruce Lee combined styles, that Wing Chun alone is not affective.
How about Shaolin vs MMA?
I'll see what we can find! There's too many monk cosplays, so we have to look for actual monks. Very rare.
I would guess he keeps chain punching because he is either just intimidated, or he just is unsure about what hes doing (meaning as an amateur in sparring).
he has no idea wat hes doing, chain punching is a concept not a technique. its the idea of constant pressure
Who the "f" is the wing chun guy?, he's clearly just a student! And not a very good one! Why is he chain punching thin air??? And not kicking? Why even bother filming that?
Narrator guy if you are going to report a bout, report it in biased
He's lucky this was a pretty light sparring session, or our Wing Chun friend would have come out with brain damage. I'm actually curious about something, though: I think chain punches are misunderstood by modern practitioners because from I can tell it's a punching drill, not an attack. Most Kung Fu styles, I suspect, are more grappling than striking. The strikes are only meant to knock the opponent off balance while you perform a grappling move. That's why the robot arms he's doing is a punching drill to increase speed fast twitch muscle strength.
What do you all think? Is that style of punching actually meant to attack someone, or is it a drill? Because what he's doing here is equivalent to a boxer trying to win a fight with speedbag technique.
It's both. But you're supposed to use it aggressively while pushing forward. Originally it was designed for use with butterfly swords which makes it MUCH more effective. Now days Wing Chun is much more effective if used as part of a combo of martial arts, like boxing or Kempo...or both. Throw in some wrestling or BJJ and it becomes really well rounded. Of course you can always argue it isn't really WC at that point so... 🤷
Wrong. Most Kung Fu is striking with a healthu dose of grappling mixed in, like Sanda. Sanda would be a template of what most Kung Fu would be if trained properly.
@@joshuahogan3475 The stance while throwing those punches lacks any real mobility, so it's hard to be aggressive with it. That and the punches don't amount to much anyway. Aside from looking cool, it doesn't add anything all that useful to the mix, and like you said, with all that MMA, you're not really doing Wing Chun anymore. I seriously think contemporary instructors were left guessing at its meaning, and are applying a drill in live combat - which is why it's so impractical. As a punching exercise, it's excellent.
@@justinwallace269 that stance is meant for extremely close ranges with almost no room to move. Wing Chun has other stances that offer a lot more mobility. But you're correct, the punches themselves don't offer a lot of power, you're supposed to drive forward with each punch using momentum and your bodyweight to add power, which he doesn't do. Even then you don't JUST chain punch. You don't do more than five in a row and then follow up with something more effective after using the chain pinches to open up a strike to somewhere more vital. This guy seems extremely inexperienced, he has maybe two or three techniques and no way to break free of the clenches. He's also trying to be a distant fighter when WC is designed for extremely close fights until you reach high levels in the art. Bruce Lee described it as two men fighting in a phone booth and that is a pretty accurate description! Unless you have been taught the butterfly swords your best bet using just Wing Chun is to close the distance and fight at almost grappling range. And for the love of all, fight from Bowman stance not horse rider until you are that close! 🤦
@joshuahogan3475 Yeah, that was the impression I had from watching a number of fights and trying it out when I was in high school. Most of the time, when someone tried to show off with it, they just got shot in on and taken down. My friend and I sparred a little when he was teaching me some Jeet Kune Do, but it didn't go the way we expected. He'd been training Wing Chun and Jeet Kune Do for 14 years. All I had at the time was a yellow belt in Taekwondo and some boxing videos I watched, yet I totally schooled him in the sparring sessions. That was a huge red flag for both of us.
As a drill, I think these would be great for building up speed. Straight punches are safer for the hand and wrist, and a solid pop to the face with a fast one can distract people while you're pulling off a grappling technique, but I personally would never use that sort of posture or footwork, because it's asking for trouble and doesn't offer enough benefit to be worth the risk.Theres just so many better techniques at that range.
☝🏿🔍🤔🔥🔥! The Wing Chun guys having trouble because he is not an expert in Wing Chun he doesn't know about trapping the hands or pushing the hands away to counter balance the Muay Thai fighter !
Cue the wing chun guys in the comments spouting the no true Scotsman fallacy
No true Ip man? ... 😁
I mean, yeah i know what you mean, but hear me out 😭😭😂😭😭
Wing Chun is not supposed to be used like this goddamn! When unarmed, it is mainly a "grappling" style that has a lot of striking (just like Taijiquan, Baguazhang and even Bajiquan)
And that's when unarmed, because just like Xing Yi quan, Wing Chun's main thing was weapon work originally.
What i'm saying is facts so this time it is no fallacy. But i do admit that Wing Chun schools are teaching some BS in the sense that they might teach you a technique that does work but do not teach you how to make it work.
If you go to a Wing Chun school and show them stuff from other arts that is proved to work, they won't be able ti use either 😂
@@jestfullgremblim8002 there's no evidence for any of that. Wing chun people just invent history to explain why it never works.
☝🏿🤔🔍🔥! To defeat the Muay Thai fighter The Wing Chun guy has to stop chain punching and keep his arms far apart and play defense this way he can see the Muay Thai mistakes and beat him when the wind chime guy keeps chain punching he throws off his own defense system !
Is that WC guy imitating Thomas the Tank chugging up a hill saying, I think I can, I think I can? What a joke.
The wing chug guy should go after the other guy all the time. And not chain punch all the time. Not bad foot work. 🤔☯️
Low leg kicks from the start would of just took this guy straight out.
He did check the leg kicks thrown at him, look again.
Muay Thai guy isn’t as advanced but proves even a couple months can get you whooping ass with someone who doesn’t train at all
They were cartoons playing
Maybe those chain punches could work well while in the clinch 🤔
It wouls be a valid tactic, but wouldn't be a free ride against an earnestly applied thai plum with at least knees allowed
@@mengmao5033true but I’m
Thinking in terms of the Muay Thai fighters perspective; if you already have a good Muay Thai base and are comfortable in the clinch then that chain punching would be a good unorthodox technique to utilize to surprise your opponent.
Doubtful; you can barely generate force punching when being clinched unless you are clinching back and "Dirty Boxing".
@@poeguru88 no argument from me. Having a good clinch game will let you mess around with bursting through with some fast punches from inside their clinch. Vs someone who only has theoretical understanding of the clinch range
Its like he dont know his ranges or the concept truly
Wing Chun guy definitely has little experience in application, he still uses classroom Wing Chun like how if a non native English speaker goes from academic English in the classroom to informal English in the streets.
Don't break the bone
Ya but they got nothin on Wang Chung!
MT great
Either one, with their chins that high in the air would have flattened within seconds by an average trained good amateur boxer.
Calm down young fella😂
I will tell the average man a secret of martial arts, The absolute best martial arts, are the one's that are practiced by YOU.
Wing chun guy needs more sparring experience.
So does the MT guy, but they're at the right skill level to be sparring each other
Or even to learn Wing Chun 🤣🤣🤣
He has potential.
Muay Thai…vs Wing Chun?
Muay Thai has 4 effective weapons vs two…and
For stand up fighting Boxing is king..
Where do you find this s*** it's always some dude that has zero squab abilities
Randy williams crca wing chun is the real deal! This guy needs real training..
His school is called CRCA Wing Chun?
If the Wing Chun guy actually had more experience than he does he's a noob
You talk too much bro! 😮
If you don’t want to hear commentary on a commentary RUclips channel, why not just watch the original video that he links in the video description?
It’s fight COMMENTARY BREAKDOWNS, did you assume this was some type of support group for people going through rough times in the comments? Wtf
What's "Commentary" mean to you clown?
What part of "Commentary" in the Fight Commentary Breakdowns title don't you understand?
Show more Mauy Thai
He looks like an amateaur Wing Chun practitioner to me. That's not an insult, just an observation. I think you have to get far into the Wing Chun system (forms) before the art becomes highly effective. Seems to me like the moves you would commonly use in sparring, are taught far into the system, not at the start.
Wing Chun guy not haven't perfected the style yet. So this doesn't prove anything.
Chu shung tin is the best,
Meat and potatoes.
Mindful wing Chun.
Kung-fu doesn't look anything like the choreography of kung-fu movies in real life does it ? The best kung-fu fight seen for me in a movie was Bruce Lees battle with the guards in enter the dragon !
Wing chun will be undefeated if they drink redbull cause it gives them wings😂
Wing Chung guy is too slow, bring back the glory's of Wing Chun at least Bruce Lee style
This is a unfair evaluation of whin chun because if you teach harry poter whin chun hes still harry hap
Wing chun guy was lucky the muay guy wasnt a good boxer
This is a unfair evaluation of whin chun because if you teach harry potter whin chun hes still harry potter
This is a wing chun fighter who lacks real fight experience. And his wing chun is novice at best.
In my fighting days there was no internet so I don't have videos but man, I will record a sparring session one day to show how wing chun is applied. He is doing basic movements ment for practice drills. I still don't know where that so called wing chun hand guard cames from. I mean it is for weapons not for empty hands.... there is hand guard in the first form but everyone keeps missing it. 😂😂😂. I wander any of you can tell where and what it is 😂. I give you a cookie!!
In short: no wing chun was used here. Nothing to see... haha.
curious. Please tell me. I just went trough the first form but didnt find it.
It seems every WC lineage has practitioners that disagree with applications from other schools. Looking forward to the footage
@mengmao5033 it is not a disagreement from my part. This guy never sparred, does not learn how to put the principles into action in pressure testing. Take a look at Alan Orr and his students for example. They actually train to apply wing chun. And it's only one example. WSL lineage is a good example too. I don't 'swear on' a lineage per say. I think all has something to offer but at the end it comes down to the training method. Sparring is essential in any fighting art or sport.
@sbgbreakfastclub at the end part of the first section. More hints: you do it simultaneously with both hands. 😉
Basically there is no part in any form where this "famous wc hand guard' is shown. It's in the weapon form... butterfly knife form. But with empty hands makes no sense. The one I use is at the end part of the 1st section of sil lim tao.
@sbgbreakfastclub oh man! I ment 2nd section of sil lim tao. 😀😃🙂🙃
After the double gum sao you do double jum sao. This section is about recovery and defensive actions.
NOW THAT WAS REAL MUY TAI!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1!!111!!! CHINA NUMBER -10000000000!!!1!! NOTHING FROM CHINA WORKS EVER!1!!!!1!
Plz dont do either of these in a streetfight. You will lose!
Wing Chun nowaday is for displaying purposes only..
Hey need to get a proper Muay thai fighter
And wing chung fighter in stead of novices
What a waste of time
Real wing chun does not fight this way! This guy gives the art a bad name.
Ur hilarious fr
Ngl this doesn't look much like muay thaibhe moves his feet a lot more his kicks are more snappy and he isn't as rooted though based on his clinch e probably did do muay thai
OMG another embarrasing WC demonstration. The knees-in stance is just for training and isometric force development in siu nium tao form, not for combat! Poor guy.
Wing Chung I don't think was ever taken serious as a fighting style even in ancient China. I was told that against a person who has zero fighting experience it can be minimally effective. I saw a CCTV of a fight in a China mall among 18 or 21 year Olds and they were not using so silly Wing Chung with silly stance, these guys were trained and training, but I don't know in what, but it was impressive. Maybe it was South Korea bc it looked a lot more like TKD, I'm pretty sure it was China. I took Shotokan in a school back when I was a kid in the 80's. It had always been a Judo school for as long as I can remember, but then they started teaching Karate. What they did back then, I don't think they would or could do to kids now. We had one Sensi, no junior teachers and we were the first class. They or he was really rough on us and it was very traditional even making us learn Japanese. We used no pads and after a while, we had to have real sparring punching inches from the face or other body part. It did teach us major control and hitting a target. There were some tense moments between a man and a woman onetime and he was a humble black guy who hit her by mistake. They were older than us, twenties, and she was black too and after that she was really trying to hit him and get even. He had to use everything he learned to avoid her because they were close in height. It was wild. The same guy was in front of some little kid (I was like 12, 13, 14) and we were doing these reverse kicks and the kid was too close and the guys legs were too long and he kicked the kid right in the face. It was a complete accident though, but I held in my laughter. The school actually still exists over 30 years later in a couple of locations and one guy who was in the first rotation stayed with it and is now an instructor himself. Years later I got into a lot of bad stuff and street fighting and only three times did I use it, and one was me getting jumped by three guys. I took a good beating, but when I flipped a guy standing over me punching the side of my face, I clipped his leg, did this hip thing and he landed hard on his back. They couldn't believe I was now back on my feet and they started accusing me of hitting a guy with broken ribs. Yeah but you guys got me to my hands and knees while one guy kicked me in the face over and over and the other guy was over me hitting me on the left, then the right side of my face. I remember consciously thinking "I don't know how much more I can take of this) and then it clicked, I stopped trying in vain to block shots to my face and clipped his leg with my right arm, placed in the right place, and when I stood we immediately fell hard. It was crazy, but I was happy the one guy wasn't hitting me in the back of the head and I did throw the first punch because they were def planning on robbing me and they didn't get a thing.
Wing chung???😅😂😅 wing chun! , CHUN no "G" ! Also you write too much!!!
This in not serious wing chun. It's foolishness.
I have seen these types of rigged fights plenty of times. The other guy is invariably more adept and experienced than wing chun guy. Bottom line is that both guys have to be of the same calibre.
That's not muay Thai
Not ipman 😂
What the stupid fight