Thanks Andy, Gobelpower is actually offering the DIY kit with the JK-inverter BMS now - thanks to your community-power. I could not resist and ordered one to build another battery, because capacity can actually only be replaced by more capacity. Thanks a lot for making this happen!!!.
🐕 Crazy how a few free youtube channels are providing more valuable knowledge in this space than all of the companies in this industry combined. Thank you!
@OffGridGarageAustralia hi Andy I just sent you a short video of my seplos case, they updated case a lot and you should be very happy saying what they changed.
I really enjoy your channel and I have learned so much from your videos! Thank you very much! I feel like the battery box makers are building battery boxes for reviewers and not for my needs. I wish someone would build a simple battery box that fit 16 EVE 280/304 cells, provided a compression plate, and left enough room in the rest of the box for me to mount a BMS, a fuse, and a breaker. I wish they did not have the terminals on the outside of the box, since after the system is installed, I don’t want any exposed wires. That means all the box should have on the outside is a small door to access the disconnect breaker. Everything else should be inside the box with circular knockouts to allow me to connect conduit to use to run the wires to the inverter or main busbar. I don’t need DIP switches, Ethernet/CAN/RS485 jacks on the outside of the enclosure where they are susceptible to damage. The designs I am seeing do not make any sense whatsoever for safe, reliable residential installation. And it certainly doesn’t need wheels!
The Gobelpower case is designed to go into a server rack for example. That would eliminate all of your concerns. Having doors and breakouts everywhere just makes the design more complicated and the price higher. People will complain again😉
Thanks Andy, great stuff as always 👍👍 (You’re also raising the standard of your video work to a whole new level with that intro! 🤩) Yes, LOVE ❤ the dog, we have a female Lhasa Apso (cross) and she’s very much part of the family! In fact, she’s often the boss!
I made from a Seplos 48V DIY kit , a vertical one. I filled up the bottom with plywood and added last a5mm aluminium plate. Stack the EVE280K cells and compressed them. Just like you did Andy but i filled up the space behind that 5mm plate with plywood. Then I made a trolley for it but the center of the swivel wheels are sitting right at the edge of the box for more stabilisation. Next I made a battery for my son. I made the box of plywood .I also compressed the EVE280K V3 cells and did this with 9 pcs of 8mm thread bares and some u-profile iron. Rock solid. Keep up the good work.
I saw the EEL DIY kit with the JK BMS ... very tempting. Has no LED screen which is fine with me, and a big breaker on the front panel. It also has two negative and two positive connections for parallel connections when stacking. Plus all the CAN and RS425 connections. Andy .. .if you do a test and it's good, I'll go this route. Has everything I want. JK BMS, stackable, fused, and a tray. I like the DIY of your V2 battery shelf, but don't really have the room ... but the fun of DIY, that I'll miss. About the tray ... its for a V3 box, but the JK box is listed as a V4. I sent a message on if it'll work. Will update when I get a response. As always ... 👍👍👍
Yes, got them on my website now as well. I really want to get three of them and change the vertical batteries into horizontal ones. Fun project. off-grid-garage.com/diy-kits/
Hi Andy I like watching your detailed re-views about vertical batteries. I'm waiting mine to arrive fingers crossed my Seplos V3.0 parallel setup will meet their expectations.
Congressional On 80000! I have the horizontal eel battery boxes. I have cut a space for a circuit breaker. Used spray glue to mount a piece of plastic on the top metal Mounted a computer fan in the case also.and everything on a roll round flat cart.
If anything Andy's humour is brilliant!!😂😂I am still laughing about the dog biscuit bit at the end!😂😂. We'll done on 80k!🎉 Onward and upward towards 100k!!!!!
Excellent comparison video. I think the full compression only comes into play when the batteries expand. I have bought some Braun Power cases. They come like the EEL battery cases but come supplied with heat pads & a circuit breaker (at least the 24v one does but not the 12v)
The ideal vertical case seems to be the version 3.0 (Y) of the Seplos. Hope Andy will be enabled to review this soon, as it addresses many of the compression concerns. Just received mine today.
Andy, I replied yesterday with a link to the GP-SR1-PC200 DIY Kit on the Gobel Power website, but the post was removed. From the home page, click the hamburger on the top left corner, then click on Spare Parts and scroll about halfway down the page. You'll see the DIY kit on the RHS. $600 USD in your choice of White or Black, includes the BMS and there's an option to add heating pads for $20.
🐶🐶🐶 I just (about a month ago) got one of the newer EEL horizontal with a circuit breaker. This didn't have the JK BMS but the seplos 10E. but I did get a NEEEEEY 4A balancer. This checked off most of my boxes. Flexible bus bars, circuit breaker (but no fuse), active balancing, compression (middle bar too, 9 total screws.) No complaints at all.... so far...
I'm not a fan of the 10E. It never resets to 100% correctly and has other software related 'feature' which I don't like. They are so far behind with their firmware...
Notes on cell compression: Compression absolutely reduces cell ageing during high current cycling by a significant amount, but it's is pretty unlikely in most static storage scenarios that you will be anywhere near a "high current cycling" type regime! However, a primary reason to compress your cells anyway is to avoid stress cycling on the terminals and bus bars! As the cell changes temperature and SoC it changes volume. Under compression this volume change is significantly reduced, so as a result the bus bars and terminals that effectively span between the cells experiences a lower stress. So the more: 1) you use the full SoC range of your battery 2) often you cycle your battery 3) stiffer your bus bars are 4) the higher currents you pull (in either direction) then the more you should consider compression. It's not a Black / White situation, but it is important to consider ;-)
Ciao Andy, sempre complimenti per le tue informazioni e divulgazioni, riesci a combinare professionalità e umorismo in un editor originale e di altissimo livello. Grazie 🤝🔋
I like Gobel Power for its horizontal/stackable. I'm checking to see if they offer without BMS as I am building a 2P8S, 16-cell battery for a 24V system with my DALY BMS and Active Balancer.
Just a note on the Gobel units..... They detail those units contain a 4A bluetooth active balancer..... So they would have bluetooth yes ? I am yet to unpack my units recently arrived. Thanks for a great comparison video Andy. Looks like I made the right choice 👌
Well, the Bluetooth is only for the balancer but not for the BMS or changing settings. I can add a NEEY to every box and it has BT then. Yes, Gopelpower was the right decision.
ANDY, have you considered reviewing some of the true hybrid inverters? They are extremely popular here in South Africa, namely the Sunsynk/Deye, Luxpower and some others. Thank you for your unique, but professional presentations! Regards, Johann Holtzhausen.
Dear Andy, As you said here "... This compression is enough to put these 300Kgs of force on to these batteries here..." But the 300Kgs force option is for each line of the Battery 2 lines that the total would be 600Kgs. Also last year I tried to find the relation between Nut torque for creating Kg force and I found that the 3 N.m of Torque of one M10 Nuts could create 100Kgs forces. The excel Calculation and creating Functions exist and is sent through email for your consideration.
So I bought two of the best rated batteries some months ago, because they had some good reviews. 😊 The breaker is an nice feature which should have every big battery. Dog cookies are also nice. You should really taste a dog cookie before feeding it to your dog. Quite a lot of dog food has too much salt or spíces in it, but you only will know if you taste it. Most of our family dogs have been rescue dogs. 👍
Would definitely be cool to see some of the battery’s get changed into different diy cases and all have the same amp hours to see what batteries really are lacking the juice like you were talking about diy cases
Regarding the Gobel Pack: Newer Packs (I've received mine just three weeks ago from the germany Warehouse) don't have a Fuse anymore, just the big Circuit Breaker. And the pack compresses the cells far better because the frontplate has bent edges which results in a far more rigidity of this plate. We also noticed this on a pack we unfortunately needed to disassemble completely because it suffered physically damaged cells due to improper transportation.
I love your videos. You do a great job testing and your attention to detail is top notch. However, I wish you would stop confusing Cells and Batteries. I know you know the difference so I won’t condescend, but even your website refers to where you can buy “batteries” when you are actually talking about cells. Thanks for all you do ❤
Hi Andy, regarding the compression topic ... what about using a horizontal EEL box (with proper compression) an putting it vertically on a proper stand?
Hi Andy!!! Thanks for your insides and comparisons between each battery cases. I got a question for you... Did any of these manufacturers builds a case for 24 volts batteries? So far I've seen only it on the EEL Brand. Any other manufacturers you may be aware? Many persons running their systems on 24 volts are interested on DIY batteries, as a replacement for lead acid batteries, but cases options for these are not easily found. Any input is highly appreciated. Jose Puerto Rico USA
Great videos! Question about battery arrangement: Regarding compression and immersion in electrolyte, is it recommended to be arranged with longer side vertical? I see all those laying horizontal...
In a vertical layout, the bottom battery is compressed far more than the top one due to the weight of the stack on top of it. According to specs, over compression may shorten cell life. What are you thoughts on this please?
Hi! Two questions - any concerns about using 2 different DIY battery packs? 1 = 16S with 280AH each cell with JBD BMS and 2 = 16S with 304AH each cell with JK BMS? As far as I know and learned from this channel - no worries about the mix and go ahead. Right?
Absolutely no problem and no concern. I'm running 100Ah, 135Ah, 230Ah, 280Ah and 304Ah all in parallel. As long as ever pack has its own BMS and breaker, no problem. Here is the video where I show that: ruclips.net/video/bhCSccNsQOw/видео.html
@@OffGridGarageAustralia Thank you! That was the trigger for an other order :) ! Still struggeling with the right BMS - should I switch to JK (you are conviced as I saw in your videos) or should I go with JBD (or another type). And of course - flexible bus bars or solid one.... Greetings from Austria
@@vidsbymoach I would not use anything else than a JK any more for a new build. If BD or PB series, they just work and with the active balancer, it's a no brainer. With any other BMS you have to install a separate active balancer and control it somehow, unless you have very high end batteries which are super matched. But once they age, you will most likely need an active balancer anyway.
@@OffGridGarageAustraliaAndy I did have to ask for the Epoxy sheets but they sent those for free. My cells were a little swollen so it was a ‘bar steward’ to get the compression plate on. I had to buy longer bolts. The instructions weren’t great and you have to download them. I recommend you tell everyone (on your web page with the link) that the pace BMS was set to 3.7v cell protection voltage out of the box. I didn’t get around to programming the bms until after a few weeks of operation so I hope I haven’t damaged any of my cells. If fact if anyone buys the gobel power battery please check the OVP figure. Surely Gobel/Pace should know that it should be set at 3.65v (unless they assume we will buy LiOn cells? But they don’t sell them anyway!
Hay got mine 3 weeks ago from the german warehouse... all Gobel Power GP-SR1-PC200's have Bluetooth... and are usable with the Heltec App. Maybe you got an older version with the 5A balancer.? Keep up the good work
I think Eel saw this video. I got their DIY box with the JK BMS and it has a breaker, handles and proper compression. The only thing the skipped was the epoxy sheet to cover the top of all the batteries
Hy Andy do you have any information about Enwall/Encap battery systems? It has unique specs, for degradation and temperature tolerance. Also DOD is high, I would apreciate your thoughts about this battery. Thanks for all your efforts on your chanel
At 6:43, is the bms not enough to protect the battery from overcurrent situation? Why do we need a fuse or circuit breaker, when the bms does the job already?
In my Gobel Power PC200 Premium (received middle of January 2024, cells were tested by middle of October) there is no fuse anymore only the circuit breaker. Thanks Andy for this comparison !!!!!
@@egg399.are you sure there will fit a MEGA fuse? I though I’ve seen ANL fuses in previous videos. Just received mine two batteries but haven’t a chance to check the exact dimensions yet.
When I built my diy gobel power battery I used a mega fuse to connect the left 8 cell bank to the right 8 cells. I was surprised it fitted. I assumed my eve 304ah cells were designed for it. I used 500a @@tobiaslochner
It's not recommended to use a fuse after 8 cells if that is what you guys are referring to. In case the fuse blows, it leaves the BMS with 2x 8cells but no connection in between. Some viewers have reported that this caused the BMS to fail/break.
There is no liquid inside these cells. The splash you are hearing is when they are new, and it will eventually absorb into the insulation material between the electrodes.
@@OffGridGarageAustralia so there is no disadvantage in mounting flat? De-gassing in case of ermergency is the same as with mounting upright? That would be nice :) thx!
Andy, I don’t recall you ever talking about the appropriate AIC rating of fuses and breakers for short circuit protection. The breakers and fuses (ANL?) seem to provide overcurrent protection for the wiring (you don’t specify) and in the CB case, power switching, but each battery (power source) should have fusing for overcurrent protection and short circuit protection. LFP, with its inherent low internal resistance is capable of very high currents in a short circuit fault and the low AIC protection devices may arc across and/or weld the protection devices closed which may cause a fire in the conductor insulation and also damage components. Your thoughts?
Yes, I talked about it when we built all these cases if the breaker or fuse is appropriately sized for the cables. It almost never is... The Seplos box has a 400A fuse and the bus bars are rated for ~60A, so...
You don’t worry about the low Ampere Interrupt Capacity (AIC) rating of ANL or MEGAfuse allowing an arc across the fuse (welding the fuse or CB closed) during a short circuit? I totally get using CB’s for switching but they, also, have low AIC ratings relative to the power source potential during a short circuit fault. The risk seems mitigated by the fixed installation but when you are working in the battery shelf, short circuits seem…riskier, especially with open busbar exposure. Enjoy the channel. Congrats on 80k subs.
I have just built my Seplos battery and had no issue with compression. I followed the instructions and did not add an aluminium plate in the bottom like you did. Compression plate does not bend and the batteries are nice and tight in position.
A very late question - as a supplier would you want to allow such systems to be chained together by providing 2 + and - connections? All the internal connections are designed around the need to transfer around 200A, providing 2 terminals would put the design at risk of having far higher currents being moved across the internal terminal connections. I'm currently spec'ing out a personal system using 3 of the newer SEPLOS V4 kits, it make far more sense to connect them all to a high current bus bar (1,000A) rather than deploy them as a 200A chain. Accessing the higher current is key to the design, but also any form of chaining will result in cable distance and resistance issues.
Do you sell off old units after your reviewed? I'm looking to buy/build vertical battery to replace my LG 10kw, chasing a box and 15+kw batteries. Great Show keep up good work!
Hello Andy, did you make some research if its fine to keep prismatic cells in this position? There are sources saying its fine, some say otherwise - that some plates are not properly flooded with electrolyte. What is your opinion on this?
Thank you for the Video. I really like the gobel Case but.. i cant find any without bms and without cells. I got everything here already and only need the case. Any ideas?
Hi Andy! Keep up the good work. I am upgrading my DIY battery and looking to create 4 stacks of 16 EVE MB31 cells (with 4 JK Inverter BMS’s). Do you think that works? They are 5,6 KG each so that means the cell at the bottom will need to take 15x5,6 KG of weight = 84 Kg. Would you think that is possible? Additionally->the higher you go in the stack, the lower the pressure on the cells, would that impact the lifecycle from each cell differently?
Ok out with it , where did you get those fancy red and black double bolt terminal caps I see on the eve cells in your Frankenstein battery at the 17:27 mark in the video.
the "problem" is the display. JK has only the external displays. I just ordered 2 of the horizontal eel-boxes for the the JK and will add the 4.3" JK-displays on the top. Changes of settings you cannot do at the display, only by bluetooth.
@@mandimandi2523 who really needs a display? We have our Victron system, and the Bluetooth app as well. Maybe we can fit the display outside the box, and provide it with a custom made connector.
I wouldn't bother with the display either. It's additional cost and work. If you have Bluetooth or the Peter Boards, all info is on your mobile. I may show the display integration here on the channel though. Just as a fun DIY project...
The bottom cells are getting compressed for sure, but that leaves the top cells uncompressed. If compressed cells give more cycles, are the top ones going to throw the entire battery out of sync? Who knows. I like the vertical design but decided to go after the normal horizontal boxes instead.
If correctly compressed, the weight of the batteries on top of the bottom cells should not make a significant difference. Horizontal is better, for sure.
Sehr schöner Vergleich, Danke. Ich hatte bei Gobel nach einem Gehäuse angefragt, nein sie verkaufen nur komplett. Es wäre schön, wenn es doch in den Verkauf kommt. Schade, das alle Batterieboxen und auch die BMS immer nicht nicht den Ansprüchen entsprechen. Sind wir wieder zu genau? Auch die Balancerkabel und die zum BMS sind auf einem Punkt verdrahtet. Deine Hunde verstehen nur deutsch? Sehr gut erzogen 👋 Liebe Grüße Matthias
Hallo Andy, das Gehäuse ist auf der Gobelpower Webseite unter - Spare Parts - Gobel Power 51.2V 280Ah Battery Case Kit zu finden. Es wird aber nicht beschrieben, was alles geliefert wird, also ob nur das Gehäuse oder mit BMS, Active Balance, Circut Breaker und Kabeln.
Just checking the video. A quick comment (that has been possibly done by previous people): the new Seplos case design comes with an intermediate horizontal plate (still, not vertical central one) that helps to compress a bit better. Also, it comes with flexible bus bars. No circuit breaker nor epoxy protection on the back of the front plate. Comes with BMS v3 and the active balancer board as well. So good evolution compared to the one you got, Andy. Manual remains crap ;)
Have you heard of the apexium diy kit which came with a horribly wrong manual that led to a near battery meltdown (as the busbars/fuseholder heated up beyond good)
hello, i have a Enphase system in my house and i want to keep it. But im interested in buy one of this batterys to my house. whats the best way to connect the enphase to the battery?
🐶🐶 After tasting these delicious treats I hope you're not barking in the next video ... 😂 I really like to see this part of your family from time to time.
I keep seeing the vertical batteries have the cells installed the same as the horizontally designed ones. Does this mean there is no issue with standing the horizontal batteries up on their end to be vertical? I didn't see any differences in how they are are constructedb (internally)
UL certification costs a fortune, so they are not UL listed. The chances of these batteries burning down your house are almost zero if you build them properly and use the appropriate wiring and fuses/breakers.
Is it okay to position Lifepo4 prismatic cells with terminals facing this way? I always thought only terminals facing to sky is the way, that there is electrolyte that can float down and part of battery would be dry and not work
Andy, thanks for the vertical battery review, the QSO is the same BMS as the Basen Green. Code is 888888 to unlock the BMS, here in the USA it talks under the Narda protocols (non can) Rs485. Have you had any experience with the Basen green cases, what was your take on dealing with thier customer support, I do believe that EEL will be my mainstay, unless Global power will send DIY kits to the US, on a side note it's only 3 weeks till we have the same amount of sun to do a North /South pv power intake contest. Keep up the great work.
My BMS from QSO has a different code, so might be a different BMS. It's not great, not a fan! Gobel has now the DIY kit option as well on their website. I have it linked here: off-grid-garage.com/diy-kits/ The EEL with the JK Inverter BMS looks nice. I'll get one or two if I can...
My our DIY boxes I designed and built ticks more then these boxes added together, plus other options I have added, too many to list, I looked at these awhile ago, but thankfully I didn't go down that road
Buen video analizando las 4 opciones, pero lo cierto es que funcionen bien y con buen equilibrio, aparte de respetar las normas de seguridad ya está, pero pienso que las baterías es mejor tenerlas a 1mtr del suelo y mejor 1,5mts porque con lluvia 🌧 ya tienes que correr
I wonder If the cells will have the Same cycle life If mounted horizontal or vertikal. If you have a close Look on how These cells are Put together i would really prefer a horizontal mounting Position. I have some deye rw-m6.1 batteries here, and These wall mounted batteries uses round cells. This would be the only wall mounted Batterie i would use
As far as I followed the discussion at least in Germany, many people seriously doubt that any other orientation of the cells than with the contacts to the top would kill them faster as you can watch it. Obviously the case builders are not that afraid? A common set are motor homes based on Fiat or Citroen chassis where (lead) batteries are often placed beneath the front passenger seat with less then 180 mm in height. Its really hard to find LiFePO4-cells that fit in there upright.
Well, these people in Germany should watch the Zerobrain channel where Markus explained the orientation of the cells. Don't know why there is still a discussion about it. It was also mentioned on 'Der Kanal' a while back and confirmed by EVE.
The compression of cells in a vertical battery would be uneven between the top cell and those near the bottom, due to the weight of cells that are resting above them. In other words, 300kg of force on each vertical run would mean close to 340kg of force for each of the bottom cells. So, I guess that some allowance would need to be made so as not to over-compress and potentially damage some of the cells.
Some Question about DIY build batteries: - What is with safety and guarantee. - How it is with the house ensurence companies? - This type of DIY vs. Ready to use battery systems.
@@OffGridGarageAustralia Hey Andy, what ever happened to the discussion about the legalities of these units and diy, looks like that stream was cancelled. Looking at ordering a Gobalpower unit but hesitant due to this maybe being an issue.
Schöne grüße aus dem kalten Deutschland. Kennst du dich mit dem PCE BMS aus? Gibt es da auch eine andere Möglichkeit den SOC mal zwischendurch zu Kalibrieren ohne ein top Balancing anhand der Cell Volt oder des ganzen Blocks. Habe bei 52,8 Volt an 10 Akkus 3-4 verschiedene Werte zwischen 50 und 70%.
Hello, my friend in another land ! I have the Seplos and the Seplos 3.0 7th 24v Type B 150A - batteries are 3.2v 280AH I want to use 2 batteries in series 3.42v x 2 batteries 280AH x 2= 560AH using a Seplos 3.0 7ss 24v
Thanks Andy, Gobelpower is actually offering the DIY kit with the JK-inverter BMS now - thanks to your community-power.
I could not resist and ordered one to build another battery, because capacity can actually only be replaced by more capacity.
Thanks a lot for making this happen!!!.
🐕 Crazy how a few free youtube channels are providing more valuable knowledge in this space than all of the companies in this industry combined. Thank you!
Thanks a lot for your feedback.
@OffGridGarageAustralia hi Andy I just sent you a short video of my seplos case, they updated case a lot and you should be very happy saying what they changed.
@@paprykos Another vertical box from Seplos again?
Time to update the 75,000 to 80,000 on the back wall!!! That’s a great accomplishment Andy, Way to go!🎉🎉🎉
Yes! Thank you!
I really enjoy your channel and I have learned so much from your videos! Thank you very much! I feel like the battery box makers are building battery boxes for reviewers and not for my needs. I wish someone would build a simple battery box that fit 16 EVE 280/304 cells, provided a compression plate, and left enough room in the rest of the box for me to mount a BMS, a fuse, and a breaker. I wish they did not have the terminals on the outside of the box, since after the system is installed, I don’t want any exposed wires. That means all the box should have on the outside is a small door to access the disconnect breaker. Everything else should be inside the box with circular knockouts to allow me to connect conduit to use to run the wires to the inverter or main busbar. I don’t need DIP switches, Ethernet/CAN/RS485 jacks on the outside of the enclosure where they are susceptible to damage. The designs I am seeing do not make any sense whatsoever for safe, reliable residential installation. And it certainly doesn’t need wheels!
The Gobelpower case is designed to go into a server rack for example. That would eliminate all of your concerns.
Having doors and breakouts everywhere just makes the design more complicated and the price higher. People will complain again😉
All good stuff! Loved the theatrical “coffin case” moment! ;-)
Gobel is the easy winner!
Thank you. Yes, Gobel seems to be doing most things right.
Thanks Andy, great stuff as always 👍👍
(You’re also raising the standard of your video work to a whole new level with that intro! 🤩)
Yes, LOVE ❤ the dog, we have a female Lhasa Apso (cross) and she’s very much part of the family! In fact, she’s often the boss!
Our cat is the boss over everything! The dogs are scared. And we too sometimes.
Thanks Dave!
I made from a Seplos 48V DIY kit , a vertical one. I filled up the bottom with plywood and added last a5mm aluminium plate. Stack the EVE280K cells and compressed them. Just like you did Andy but i filled up the space behind that 5mm plate with plywood. Then I made a trolley for it but the center of the swivel wheels are sitting right at the edge of the box for more stabilisation.
Next I made a battery for my son. I made the box of plywood .I also compressed the EVE280K V3 cells and did this with 9 pcs of 8mm thread bares and some u-profile iron. Rock solid. Keep up the good work.
Fantastic DIY Job! Thanks for sharing.
I think compression must take into account the normal expansion of the cells which is about 1mm, if not mistaken, according to EVE specs.
I saw the EEL DIY kit with the JK BMS ... very tempting. Has no LED screen which is fine with me, and a big breaker on the front panel. It also has two negative and two positive connections for parallel connections when stacking. Plus all the CAN and RS425 connections.
Andy .. .if you do a test and it's good, I'll go this route. Has everything I want. JK BMS, stackable, fused, and a tray. I like the DIY of your V2 battery shelf, but don't really have the room ... but the fun of DIY, that I'll miss.
About the tray ... its for a V3 box, but the JK box is listed as a V4. I sent a message on if it'll work. Will update when I get a response. As always ... 👍👍👍
Yes, got them on my website now as well. I really want to get three of them and change the vertical batteries into horizontal ones. Fun project.
off-grid-garage.com/diy-kits/
Wie immer eine Freude dir zuzuschauen und zuzuhören, egal welches Thema. Danke dir! (Dog)
Na, ist doch schoen! Danke Dir.
Entertaining video for sure.
Congratulations on 80K subscribers!!!
Thanks, Ricardo!
Hi Andy I like watching your detailed re-views about vertical batteries. I'm waiting mine to arrive fingers crossed my Seplos V3.0 parallel setup will meet their expectations.
Oha, Seplos V3.0...😬
Congressional On 80000! I have the horizontal eel battery boxes. I have cut a space for a circuit breaker. Used spray glue to mount a piece of plastic on the top metal Mounted a computer fan in the case also.and everything on a roll round flat cart.
Very nice. You made it work for you. There is always a bit DIY with these cases, right!?
@@OffGridGarageAustralia Yes there is
If anything Andy's humour is brilliant!!😂😂I am still laughing about the dog biscuit bit at the end!😂😂. We'll done on 80k!🎉 Onward and upward towards 100k!!!!!
Thanks so much
🐕 My dog-go is also a rescue. Love learning these power solutions.
🐶
80000, Congratulations, Andy!
Thank you Alex!
Excellent comparison video. I think the full compression only comes into play when the batteries expand. I have bought some Braun Power cases. They come like the EEL battery cases but come supplied with heat pads & a circuit breaker (at least the 24v one does but not the 12v)
The ideal vertical case seems to be the version 3.0 (Y) of the Seplos. Hope Andy will be enabled to review this soon, as it addresses many of the compression concerns. Just received mine today.
what's the difference?
The battery section is divided in 2 sections and both are better compressable
Andy, I replied yesterday with a link to the GP-SR1-PC200 DIY Kit on the Gobel Power website, but the post was removed. From the home page, click the hamburger on the top left corner, then click on Spare Parts and scroll about halfway down the page. You'll see the DIY kit on the RHS. $600 USD in your choice of White or Black, includes the BMS and there's an option to add heating pads for $20.
Oh yeah, and enjoy a SPAT on me!
Gobel told me they are working on it...
Thank you, I'll add it to my website. Cheers!
🐶🐶🐶 I just (about a month ago) got one of the newer EEL horizontal with a circuit breaker. This didn't have the JK BMS but the seplos 10E. but I did get a NEEEEEY 4A balancer. This checked off most of my boxes. Flexible bus bars, circuit breaker (but no fuse), active balancing, compression (middle bar too, 9 total screws.) No complaints at all.... so far...
I'm not a fan of the 10E. It never resets to 100% correctly and has other software related 'feature' which I don't like. They are so far behind with their firmware...
Notes on cell compression:
Compression absolutely reduces cell ageing during high current cycling by a significant amount, but it's is pretty unlikely in most static storage scenarios that you will be anywhere near a "high current cycling" type regime!
However, a primary reason to compress your cells anyway is to avoid stress cycling on the terminals and bus bars! As the cell changes temperature and SoC it changes volume. Under compression this volume change is significantly reduced, so as a result the bus bars and terminals that effectively span between the cells experiences a lower stress.
So the more:
1) you use the full SoC range of your battery
2) often you cycle your battery
3) stiffer your bus bars are
4) the higher currents you pull (in either direction)
then the more you should consider compression. It's not a Black / White situation, but it is important to consider ;-)
Yes, compression is beneficial for the first few cycles and high C-rating.
Ciao Andy, sempre complimenti per le tue informazioni e divulgazioni, riesci a combinare professionalità e umorismo in un editor originale e di altissimo livello. Grazie 🤝🔋
I like Gobel Power for its horizontal/stackable. I'm checking to see if they offer without BMS as I am building a 2P8S, 16-cell battery for a 24V system with my DALY BMS and Active Balancer.
They do case-only if you ask for it. Link is on my website now:
off-grid-garage.com/diy-kits/
Sir, eagerly waiting to meet you in person. Love from Bangladesh. In April i am coming to Australia. Take love. ❤❤❤
Just a note on the Gobel units..... They detail those units contain a 4A bluetooth active balancer..... So they would have bluetooth yes ? I am yet to unpack my units recently arrived. Thanks for a great comparison video Andy. Looks like I made the right choice 👌
Well, the Bluetooth is only for the balancer but not for the BMS or changing settings. I can add a NEEY to every box and it has BT then.
Yes, Gopelpower was the right decision.
ANDY, have you considered reviewing some of the true hybrid inverters? They are extremely popular here in South Africa, namely the Sunsynk/Deye, Luxpower and some others.
Thank you for your unique, but professional presentations!
Regards, Johann Holtzhausen.
I'm off grid, so cannot really review hybrid inverters. After I will upgrade the garage, we can though...
Thank you Andy, another smashing video!
Thanks Trev!
Dear Andy,
As you said here "... This compression is enough to put these 300Kgs of force on to these batteries here..." But the 300Kgs force option is for each line of the Battery 2 lines that the total would be 600Kgs. Also last year I tried to find the relation between Nut torque for creating Kg force and I found that the 3 N.m of Torque of one M10 Nuts could create 100Kgs forces. The excel Calculation and creating Functions exist and is sent through email for your consideration.
Thank you.
So I bought two of the best rated batteries some months ago, because they had some good reviews. 😊
The breaker is an nice feature which should have every big battery.
Dog cookies are also nice. You should really taste a dog cookie before feeding it to your dog. Quite a lot of dog food has too much salt or spíces in it, but you only will know if you taste it.
Most of our family dogs have been rescue dogs. 👍
The batteries are good, right?😄
I only taste it if there is only vegetable protein in it...🤢
Would definitely be cool to see some of the battery’s get changed into different diy cases and all have the same amp hours to see what batteries really are lacking the juice like you were talking about diy cases
Regarding the Gobel Pack:
Newer Packs (I've received mine just three weeks ago from the germany Warehouse) don't have a Fuse anymore, just the big Circuit Breaker. And the pack compresses the cells far better because the frontplate has bent edges which results in a far more rigidity of this plate. We also noticed this on a pack we unfortunately needed to disassemble completely because it suffered physically damaged cells due to improper transportation.
Thanks for sharing.
I love your videos. You do a great job testing and your attention to detail is top notch.
However, I wish you would stop confusing Cells and Batteries. I know you know the difference so I won’t condescend, but even your website refers to where you can buy “batteries” when you are actually talking about cells.
Thanks for all you do ❤
Thanks for the feedback. We all know the difference. At the end it's just another word as we all build batteries using batteries😄
great overview of the design of these systems
Thank you!
I got dizzy on that fisheye lense 😭
Congrats on 80K subs. 100K Lezgoow! Silver Play button
Thank you. You can't get dizzy from these few seconds, hahaha.
Great video, it would be interesting to see if those fuses are rated for 48V or not. Otherwise, they are quite useless.
Yes, they are. Some say 80V DC on them.
Great job Andy
Thanks.
Hi Andy, regarding the compression topic ... what about using a horizontal EEL box (with proper compression) an putting it vertically on a proper stand?
Yes, of course!
Hi Andy!!! Thanks for your insides and comparisons between each battery cases. I got a question for you... Did any of these manufacturers builds a case for 24 volts batteries?
So far I've seen only it on the EEL Brand. Any other manufacturers you may be aware?
Many persons running their systems on 24 volts are interested on DIY batteries, as a replacement for lead acid batteries, but cases options for these are not easily found.
Any input is highly appreciated.
Jose
Puerto Rico USA
Yes, Seplos is building the MASON for 24V as well. Link is on my website: off-grid-garage.com/diy-kits/
Great videos! Question about battery arrangement: Regarding compression and immersion in electrolyte, is it recommended to be arranged with longer side vertical? I see all those laying horizontal...
In a vertical layout, the bottom battery is compressed far more than the top one due to the weight of the stack on top of it. According to specs, over compression may shorten cell life. What are you thoughts on this please?
Hi! Two questions - any concerns about using 2 different DIY battery packs? 1 = 16S with 280AH each cell with JBD BMS and 2 = 16S with 304AH each cell with JK BMS? As far as I know and learned from this channel - no worries about the mix and go ahead. Right?
Absolutely no problem and no concern. I'm running 100Ah, 135Ah, 230Ah, 280Ah and 304Ah all in parallel. As long as ever pack has its own BMS and breaker, no problem.
Here is the video where I show that: ruclips.net/video/bhCSccNsQOw/видео.html
@@OffGridGarageAustralia Thank you! That was the trigger for an other order :) ! Still struggeling with the right BMS - should I switch to JK (you are conviced as I saw in your videos) or should I go with JBD (or another type). And of course - flexible bus bars or solid one....
Greetings from Austria
@@vidsbymoach I would not use anything else than a JK any more for a new build. If BD or PB series, they just work and with the active balancer, it's a no brainer. With any other BMS you have to install a separate active balancer and control it somehow, unless you have very high end batteries which are super matched. But once they age, you will most likely need an active balancer anyway.
@@OffGridGarageAustralia hi again! This = B1A20S15P should be the right one…. 1ampere active balancer 150a current and 16s. Any further comments? Br
Andy, I bought the case. It came with everything apart from cells, Epoxy Sheets and busbars.
Which one?
Perfect, thanks. It does not say anything on the Gobelpower website what is included. Link is in the description now.
@@GregOnSummitGobel Power DIY box. Check the link in Andy’s description box under the video.
@@OffGridGarageAustraliaAndy I did have to ask for the Epoxy sheets but they sent those for free. My cells were a little swollen so it was a ‘bar steward’ to get the compression plate on. I had to buy longer bolts.
The instructions weren’t great and you have to download them.
I recommend you tell everyone (on your web page with the link) that the pace BMS was set to 3.7v cell protection voltage out of the box. I didn’t get around to programming the bms until after a few weeks of operation so I hope I haven’t damaged any of my cells.
If fact if anyone buys the gobel power battery please check the OVP figure. Surely Gobel/Pace should know that it should be set at 3.65v (unless they assume we will buy LiOn cells? But they don’t sell them anyway!
Hay got mine 3 weeks ago from the german warehouse... all Gobel Power GP-SR1-PC200's have Bluetooth... and are usable with the Heltec App.
Maybe you got an older version with the 5A balancer.?
Keep up the good work
Yeah, Bluetooth for the Active Balancer but not for the BMS. The PACE BMS does not have BT support.
I think Eel saw this video. I got their DIY box with the JK BMS and it has a breaker, handles and proper compression. The only thing the skipped was the epoxy sheet to cover the top of all the batteries
🐕🐕I bet my 2 rescue dogs would enjoy those treats as well
They love it!
Hy Andy do you have any information about Enwall/Encap battery systems? It has unique specs, for degradation and temperature tolerance. Also DOD is high, I would apreciate your thoughts about this battery. Thanks for all your efforts on your chanel
At 6:43, is the bms not enough to protect the battery from overcurrent situation? Why do we need a fuse or circuit breaker, when the bms does the job already?
No, the BMS will not be enough. There has to be a mechanical safety device, either fuse or DC breaker. The BMS protection is in addition to that.
In my Gobel Power PC200 Premium (received middle of January 2024, cells were tested by middle of October) there is no fuse anymore only the circuit breaker.
Thanks Andy for this comparison !!!!!
Replace the short bus bar with a mega fuse
@@egg399. Thank You for the idea, I will check this alternative !!!
@@egg399.are you sure there will fit a MEGA fuse? I though I’ve seen ANL fuses in previous videos. Just received mine two batteries but haven’t a chance to check the exact dimensions yet.
When I built my diy gobel power battery I used a mega fuse to connect the left 8 cell bank to the right 8 cells. I was surprised it fitted. I assumed my eve 304ah cells were designed for it. I used 500a @@tobiaslochner
It's not recommended to use a fuse after 8 cells if that is what you guys are referring to. In case the fuse blows, it leaves the BMS with 2x 8cells but no connection in between. Some viewers have reported that this caused the BMS to fail/break.
🐕Doggone good! 🐕 - Gobel Power's fit/finish is pretty nice, if they could just nail down some of the final details.
Yes, I really like their cases and batteries. It's really high quality.
with the cells flat... the gas valve is under the liquid level right? When the cell swells or want to gas off, the fluid comes out instead of gas?
There is no liquid inside these cells. The splash you are hearing is when they are new, and it will eventually absorb into the insulation material between the electrodes.
@@OffGridGarageAustralia so there is no disadvantage in mounting flat? De-gassing in case of ermergency is the same as with mounting upright? That would be nice :) thx!
Thanks Andy!
Thank you.
Andy,
I don’t recall you ever talking about the appropriate AIC rating of fuses and breakers for short circuit protection. The breakers and fuses (ANL?) seem to provide overcurrent protection for the wiring (you don’t specify) and in the CB case, power switching, but each battery (power source) should have fusing for overcurrent protection and short circuit protection. LFP, with its inherent low internal resistance is capable of very high currents in a short circuit fault and the low AIC protection devices may arc across and/or weld the protection devices closed which may cause a fire in the conductor insulation and also damage components.
Your thoughts?
Yes, I talked about it when we built all these cases if the breaker or fuse is appropriately sized for the cables. It almost never is... The Seplos box has a 400A fuse and the bus bars are rated for ~60A, so...
You don’t worry about the low Ampere Interrupt Capacity (AIC) rating of ANL or MEGAfuse allowing an arc across the fuse (welding the fuse or CB closed) during a short circuit? I totally get using CB’s for switching but they, also, have low AIC ratings relative to the power source potential during a short circuit fault.
The risk seems mitigated by the fixed installation but when you are working in the battery shelf, short circuits seem…riskier, especially with open busbar exposure.
Enjoy the channel. Congrats on 80k subs.
I have just built my Seplos battery and had no issue with compression. I followed the instructions and did not add an aluminium plate in the bottom like you did. Compression plate does not bend and the batteries are nice and tight in position.
A very late question - as a supplier would you want to allow such systems to be chained together by providing 2 + and - connections? All the internal connections are designed around the need to transfer around 200A, providing 2 terminals would put the design at risk of having far higher currents being moved across the internal terminal connections.
I'm currently spec'ing out a personal system using 3 of the newer SEPLOS V4 kits, it make far more sense to connect them all to a high current bus bar (1,000A) rather than deploy them as a 200A chain. Accessing the higher current is key to the design, but also any form of chaining will result in cable distance and resistance issues.
Hi Andy. What about cell position inside? They are horizontal. No issue for lifepo4 cells?
Do you sell off old units after your reviewed? I'm looking to buy/build vertical battery to replace my LG 10kw, chasing a box and 15+kw batteries.
Great Show keep up good work!
Hello Andy, did you make some research if its fine to keep prismatic cells in this position? There are sources saying its fine, some say otherwise - that some plates are not properly flooded with electrolyte. What is your opinion on this?
EVE has confirmed that all orientation is OK as long as it is not upside down.
Thank you for the Video. I really like the gobel Case but.. i cant find any without bms and without cells. I got everything here already and only need the case. Any ideas?
Hi Andy! Keep up the good work. I am upgrading my DIY battery and looking to create 4 stacks of 16 EVE MB31 cells (with 4 JK Inverter BMS’s). Do you think that works? They are 5,6 KG each so that means the cell at the bottom will need to take 15x5,6 KG of weight = 84 Kg. Would you think that is possible? Additionally->the higher you go in the stack, the lower the pressure on the cells, would that impact the lifecycle from each cell differently?
Ok out with it , where did you get those fancy red and black double bolt terminal caps I see on the eve cells in your Frankenstein battery at the 17:27 mark in the video.
They are 3D printed, google it and you will find all sort of solutions. Also some which will cover the busbars.
Gobelpower empty box with JK inverter BMS, perfect solution? Does it fit Andy?
the "problem" is the display. JK has only the external displays. I just ordered 2 of the horizontal eel-boxes for the the JK and will add the 4.3" JK-displays on the top. Changes of settings you cannot do at the display, only by bluetooth.
@@mandimandi2523 who really needs a display? We have our Victron system, and the Bluetooth app as well. Maybe we can fit the display outside the box, and provide it with a custom made connector.
I wouldn't bother with the display either. It's additional cost and work. If you have Bluetooth or the Peter Boards, all info is on your mobile.
I may show the display integration here on the channel though. Just as a fun DIY project...
have you added up the KWH of all the batteries you have now?
No.
The bottom cells are getting compressed for sure, but that leaves the top cells uncompressed. If compressed cells give more cycles, are the top ones going to throw the entire battery out of sync? Who knows. I like the vertical design but decided to go after the normal horizontal boxes instead.
If correctly compressed, the weight of the batteries on top of the bottom cells should not make a significant difference. Horizontal is better, for sure.
Sehr schöner Vergleich, Danke. Ich hatte bei Gobel nach einem Gehäuse angefragt, nein sie verkaufen nur komplett. Es wäre schön, wenn es doch in den Verkauf kommt. Schade, das alle Batterieboxen und auch die BMS immer nicht nicht den Ansprüchen entsprechen. Sind wir wieder zu genau? Auch die Balancerkabel und die zum BMS sind auf einem Punkt verdrahtet. Deine Hunde verstehen nur deutsch? Sehr gut erzogen 👋 Liebe Grüße Matthias
It's on sale now, here is the link: off-grid-garage.com/diy-kits/
Yes, the Australian doggies only understand German😄
Hallo Andy,
das Gehäuse ist auf der Gobelpower Webseite unter
- Spare Parts
- Gobel Power 51.2V 280Ah Battery Case Kit
zu finden. Es wird aber nicht beschrieben, was alles geliefert wird, also ob nur das Gehäuse oder mit BMS, Active Balance, Circut Breaker und Kabeln.
Yes, got it now linked on my website and updated the video description as well. Thank you.
Just checking the video.
A quick comment (that has been possibly done by previous people): the new Seplos case design comes with an intermediate horizontal plate (still, not vertical central one) that helps to compress a bit better. Also, it comes with flexible bus bars. No circuit breaker nor epoxy protection on the back of the front plate. Comes with BMS v3 and the active balancer board as well. So good evolution compared to the one you got, Andy.
Manual remains crap ;)
Have you heard of the apexium diy kit which came with a horribly wrong manual that led to a near battery meltdown (as the busbars/fuseholder heated up beyond good)
Never heard of that kit before...
What 48v battery recommend, regardless of cost?
Gobelpower: off-grid-garage.com/li-ion-batteries/
basen makes a vertical battery solution
would you consider reviewing it ?
Sure...
hello, i have a Enphase system in my house and i want to keep it. But im interested in buy one of this batterys to my house. whats the best way to connect the enphase to the battery?
🐶🐶 After tasting these delicious treats I hope you're not barking in the next video ... 😂 I really like to see this part of your family from time to time.
Hahaha, the dogs are usually not allowed in the garage. Too much tech they could bump over...
I keep seeing the vertical batteries have the cells installed the same as the horizontally designed ones. Does this mean there is no issue with standing the horizontal batteries up on their end to be vertical?
I didn't see any differences in how they are are constructedb (internally)
Thanks Andy
I'm curious if any of these battery kits are UL listed and approved for use in the US. If my house burns down will my insurance not pay?
UL certification costs a fortune, so they are not UL listed. The chances of these batteries burning down your house are almost zero if you build them properly and use the appropriate wiring and fuses/breakers.
Has any of the DIY batteries a UL cert???
Is it okay to position Lifepo4 prismatic cells with terminals facing this way?
I always thought only terminals facing to sky is the way, that there is electrolyte that can float down and part of battery would be dry and not work
Yes, only upside down is not OK. Confirmed by EVE.
Dogs are truly mans best friend!
Especially when they get a bickie!🐶🍪
Andy, thanks for the vertical battery review, the QSO is the same BMS as the Basen Green. Code is 888888 to unlock the BMS, here in the USA it talks under the Narda protocols (non can) Rs485. Have you had any experience with the Basen green cases, what was your take on dealing with thier customer support, I do believe that EEL will be my mainstay, unless Global power will send DIY kits to the US, on a side note it's only 3 weeks till we have the same amount of sun to do a North /South pv power intake contest. Keep up the great work.
My BMS from QSO has a different code, so might be a different BMS. It's not great, not a fan!
Gobel has now the DIY kit option as well on their website. I have it linked here: off-grid-garage.com/diy-kits/
The EEL with the JK Inverter BMS looks nice. I'll get one or two if I can...
Hej Andy tak din opdatering, jeg er selv til stabelbart eel boxe, hvordan går det med jeres Fronius anlæg ? Henrik DK.
5:13 does someone know where I can finde these battery terminals gobel power uses?
I can only find the ones that are M6 that are the same designed
They are on AliExpress: M8 Terminals but M6 at the back. Same as Gobel uses.
s.click.aliexpress.com/e/_DFqvHed
My our DIY boxes I designed and built ticks more then these boxes added together, plus other options I have added, too many to list, I looked at these awhile ago, but thankfully I didn't go down that road
Your boxes are brilliant, Ross. For everyone who hasn't seen them: ruclips.net/video/u1wbmu1cqIc/видео.html
Thanks Andy" I have a further update video to upload later this week, keep up the good work Andy@dGarageAustralia
Buen video analizando las 4 opciones, pero lo cierto es que funcionen bien y con buen equilibrio, aparte de respetar las normas de seguridad ya está, pero pienso que las baterías es mejor tenerlas a 1mtr del suelo y mejor 1,5mts porque con lluvia 🌧 ya tienes que correr
Hi, does the Peter inverter communicate with the Cerbo GX?
Apexium have new 48V DIY BOX kits with 200A JK Inverter BMS and with smaller 4.3 display, but no breaker as in JK Inverter BMS ELL Box.
Ah, no breaker... bummer...
Nothing better than DOG food :D Next time will be Schnitzel Andy.😊
Schnitzel is for me!🍺🐶
I wonder If the cells will have the Same cycle life If mounted horizontal or vertikal. If you have a close Look on how These cells are Put together i would really prefer a horizontal mounting Position. I have some deye rw-m6.1 batteries here, and These wall mounted batteries uses round cells. This would be the only wall mounted Batterie i would use
I'm sure they will last a long time, either way. But I agree, standing upright is preferred.
🐕Great ending!
Thank you 🐶
lol...was that an adult rated joke at 6:15. A little beer came out of my nose laughing.
Someone got it🤣
Price, free shipping? available in U.S.?
As far as I followed the discussion at least in Germany, many people seriously doubt that any other orientation of the cells than with the contacts to the top would kill them faster as you can watch it. Obviously the case builders are not that afraid?
A common set are motor homes based on Fiat or Citroen chassis where (lead) batteries are often placed beneath the front passenger seat with less then 180 mm in height. Its really hard to find LiFePO4-cells that fit in there upright.
Well, these people in Germany should watch the Zerobrain channel where Markus explained the orientation of the cells. Don't know why there is still a discussion about it. It was also mentioned on 'Der Kanal' a while back and confirmed by EVE.
The compression of cells in a vertical battery would be uneven between the top cell and those near the bottom, due to the weight of cells that are resting above them. In other words, 300kg of force on each vertical run would mean close to 340kg of force for each of the bottom cells. So, I guess that some allowance would need to be made so as not to over-compress and potentially damage some of the cells.
kgf is not the same as kg though.
Some Question about DIY build batteries:
- What is with safety and guarantee.
- How it is with the house ensurence companies?
- This type of DIY vs. Ready to use battery systems.
That will be a discussion point in our next life stream on Jens' channel or the meintechblog.de end of March.
@@OffGridGarageAustralia Hey Andy, what ever happened to the discussion about the legalities of these units and diy, looks like that stream was cancelled. Looking at ordering a Gobalpower unit but hesitant due to this maybe being an issue.
thanks for sharing
Thanks for watching!
Is it possible to put 314ah cells in these cases?
Is it ok to mount a yixiang diy battery box vertically?
GG you are a really ALMAN i love it😆 greatings from Germany
@Andy you can update your subscriber number poster from 75.000 to 80.000. Go for the 100.000.
Yes, done it in the next video. Thank you. Wow...
Schöne grüße aus dem kalten Deutschland. Kennst du dich mit dem PCE BMS aus? Gibt es da auch eine andere Möglichkeit den SOC mal zwischendurch zu Kalibrieren ohne ein top Balancing anhand der Cell Volt oder des ganzen Blocks. Habe bei 52,8 Volt an 10 Akkus 3-4 verschiedene Werte zwischen 50 und 70%.
Thanks for all the info. I’m about to build the seplos 280L with 2A balancing, I might even video it and put it on RUclips 🦮
Hi Andy, Could you please help me with QSO bms default password? Can't find it anywhere)
could you try bms basen?
🦮🦮 love ya Andy!
Love you to, my friend🐶🍺
Hello, my friend in another land ! I have the Seplos and the Seplos 3.0 7th 24v Type B 150A - batteries are 3.2v 280AH I want to use 2 batteries in series 3.42v x 2 batteries 280AH x 2= 560AH using a Seplos 3.0 7ss 24v