I Used Gentoo for a Week - Should You Try Gentoo?
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- Опубликовано: 26 авг 2024
- I talk about my week with Gentoo Linux.
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#ramble #gentoo #thelinuxcast
You went from planning to never bother with Gentoo, and setting the donation requirement really high in hopes of never reaching it, to "would I recommend Gentoo to others? Hell yeah I would!" That's growth right there
Gentoo is a concept I wholeheartedly agree with, it's a way to learn what exactly goes into installing, from the kernel to the journal where you write manuscripts. I need to work on my patience before I seriously use Gentoo lol.
Utilize the irc. They are very helpful. Additionally, you really don't need to follow every single step in the handbook. Nor do you need to compile to the kernel, Gentoo-kernel-bin is great.
Well, if someone has a lot of free time to fck with compiling then yeah, it's a thing. Otherwise, it's too much
@@jumbojet999 It's really not that bad, give it a go and prove me wrong though :)
honestly gentoo is really nice
Gentoo wiki is a lot better than arch wiki. Arch wiki doesn't tell you how to format drives, Gentoo wiki tells you what an IP is
I left Gentoo 10 years ago also calling it a good learning experience (a bit tired and frustrated). Came back 2 years ago using Ubuntu meanwhile (getting a little annoyed about the direction they are going). Have used Gentoo as a daily driver since. The customization is what you hate or what you love about it. And I finally love it and can never go back :)
I'm so nostalgic about this! It must be about 18 years since I discovered Gentoo and I used it for about 4-5 years as my daily driver. Bit of advice - have daily backups, you will mess up your system and at least I couldn't blame the devs in nearly all of the incidents😉
Ditto! 😀
This is why I reinstalled my entire linux setup on ZFS a few weeks ago. Snapshots are a beautiful thing. BTRFS has those too, but I liked the idea of ZFS boot environments because I like to play around with different distros and being able to just install them in a new ZFS dataset has all the benefits of a VM (no commitment, since you don't have to repartition) while still allowing you to run it on hardware.
Just installed gentoo for the first time a few days ago and ZFS snapshots have Already saved me from breaking something multiple times
@@gh0stcassetteThis can also be done in BTRFS too! Although you have to get your hands a little dirty to make GRUB work with it, in my case I use my Arch's GRUB as the main one (the one on the EFI partition) then I make custom entries and point them to each distro's GRUB config (It could be done with just 1 GRUB, but you'll have to edit the config every time you update a distro that isn't the main one)
You can definitely go through any step of the Gentoo install whenever. That's what chroot is for!
If you chroot and need a package that the new root doesn't have, use screen, a second tty, or just exit chroot and re-chroot once you're done with it.
There are 3 amazing learning experiences that I have had with learning to build and install software from source on a system: 1) The FreeBSD Ports collection. 2) Compiling the Ubuntu kernel (I needed specific configuration for certain laptop hardware). 3) Installing Gentoo.
But the issue is, when you really want to updated frequently, things count up and start taking a LOT of your time and also electric energy cost.
In my opinion the practice of packages being built on built servers in the cloud is a generally more viable solution for most cases, unless you have really specific requirements, other than a great learning experience.
But you can indeed do very specific stuff. Possibly really interesting is are also the specific GCC compiler optimizations that you can configure when building software yourself, great for optimal performance results.
I ran Gentoo for about 6 months and then I went back to Arch. There's really not that much benefit to gentoo unless you're VERY interested in maintaining all sorts of stuff yourself. It can be a bit time consuming. Sometimes I get the itch to try gentoo again but quickly realize that there will be literally zero difference for me over arch.
Yeah this, for someone who's gonna actually utilize all the compiler flags and actually benefit from it, I totally get it, but I'd end up using the binaries anyway and anything that needs compiling I'd probably get as-is without messing with it which defeats the whole purpose of using it. It has an awesome wiki and it's a great system with more customizability and modularity than Arch but not by such a great margin that most of us would benefit from, while making the system much more tedious to use and maintain, especially without the top of the line hardware.
Are the repositories packaged in the same manner? I’m just tired of the Arch repo slowly becoming a bloat fest with all the dependencies these days. I just want mesa for X11 but the arch mesa package ships configured for both wayland and X and includes all the wayland packages and configuration files that I’ll never need.
@@christopper1668 take your meds
I'm back on Arch as well but simply because my laptop can't handle Gentoo. I'm really missing Gentoo , don't even like pacman anymore. But I won't have to wait for long, I'd install it on my first build
@@ihate4chanmaybe it might be time to try Gentoo again? They recently announced that they are releasing an official binary repository- I imagine you can set up a binary install and then choose what you want to compile, either replacing what you have or when getting new packages
Welcome to the world of Gentoo. Thanks for stressing the fact that it really isn't difficult. Tedious? Yes. I'll give it that, but assuming a basic knowledge of Linux - partitioning being especially useful - Installing Gentoo is, as you said, pretty much like installing Arch only from source rather than binaries. Under the pretty installers - the same exact steps happen when you install any Linux distro because Linux is Linux and all the same things need to happen for it to work.
About your Pipewire comment, though... While you can use the sound-server and daemon use flags to assure that PulseAudio, not pipewire, is used as the sound server and for Bluetooth, etc., completely excluding any pipewire packages is not possible - or at least not practical - because there is no pipewire use flag and certain pipewire packages are required by several other media packages that you'll need regardless of the sound server used, or are required by particular DE's Trying to change that would create more problems than any perceived problems it might solve.
Also, it's Portage (emerge is just the command), and in a fundamental sense, Portage IS Gentoo. There isn't one without the other. Without Gentoo, Portage is just a cranky, anal-retentive, out-of-work, nagging package manager with no friends, and without Portage, Gentoo is basically Slackware. Portage does have a fairly steep learning curve, but that's because it does so much more than a typical package manager, and once it clicks, it's fantastic. Learning Portage makes the file system itself simple to understand and transparent. Portage, once understood, is what makes Gentoo virtually unbreakable and easy to manage. It makes reconfiguring the system for different DE's or use cases simple because your job is to determine what you want the computer to do, and then Portage determines which specific packages to pull-in or get rid of for that to happen and presents you with USE change choices if multiple options exist.
I've used Linux for thirty years and Gentoo for the last decade. Gentoo was the first distro where I ever experienced a stress-free, non sphincter-clenching upgrade once I understood that Portage, with its nit-picking ways, simply will not allow instability or a broken system because not a single change will be made before every last dependency, conflict and reverse dependency that could cause a problem is resolved. There are ways to "trick" portage, but doing so is stupid and anyone who does, deserves what they get. The thing that makes Gentoo seem difficult at first is also what makes it rock-solid and simple later on. Any time I've reinstalled Gentoo, it was because I wanted to, not because I had to, and there are not many distros whose users can honestly say that. All the up-front work more than pays off down the road.
16:20 your "hell yeah" sounded so wholesome for some reason lol
Minute 4: The most important benefit of using Gentoo is the performance and boost of your os, because "every" packages are compiled only for your system/hardware. The opposite of this is, the time consuming, compiling the whole gnome/xfce can take some time.
I used Gentoo a long time ago, where you have to build it from stage1, the setup time was horrible on the old computers.
Gnome is a pain in the ___ on Gentoo because it likes systemd and Gentoo absolutely does not like systemd. Xfce, on the other hand, doesn't take that long to install and works fine using any desktop profile. I installed a system with Xfce yesterday and the complete process from unpartitioned disk to complete Xfce4 desktop with all the optional bells and whistles for the panel took around 4 hours. If you don't insist on Firefox, browsers are no longer an issue because most are available as binaries. Firefox also has a binary option, but it ends up pulling in a couple dozen other packages that do not, so even that takes time.
The fine-tuning of packages is great for some people, but not why I use Gentoo. That usually involves spending hours or days in an attempt to save microseconds here and there. I use Gentoo because Portage - assuming you don't use any of the "tricks" (like a "package_provided" file) to get it to ignore dependencies, makes Gentoo virtually impossible to break and makes upgrades entirely stress-free.
emerge allows you to do complex stuff in very easy and automated way. Been using gentoo over a year a still learn new stuff about it, but it is intuitive.
Honestly surprised you actually did it. Thanks Robert!
installing Gentoo is quite fun, but the second I login and start using it... oh man... I don't have that kind of time on my hands 😆
It's called tell portage to do something, then go to bed/work/school/cook dinner/do laundry
I've used Gentoo for ~2 years, good learning experience. What I've learned:
1) Manual encrypted installation, including detached luks headers and /bood on a separate external USB key, it acted like a UbiKey for booting, nothing was on HDD except encrypted data.
2) What's initramfs and how it's built, did my own manually.
3) Kernel configuration, lots of options explored, tested mitigations=off etc.
4) iptables, wireguard configuration.
5) btrfs, snapshots, manually.
6) Compiler flags, deeper per package components and their relations.
7) Personal git repo with my own ebuilds and source patches.
Did I like Gentoo? For learning yes, but I will not run Gentoo again. Consider it as a university, you don't stay in a university forever, at some point you gotta move on.
All of those points you can do on other distros like Arch except Gentoo shines on 3. and 6. if you want that level of customisation of compiling kernel and compiling packages.
_Consider it as a university, you don't stay in a university forever, at some point you gotta move on_
Why would you consider it that way?
It's perfectly fine as a full time operating system, there's no reason why you 'gotta move on' at all
"Consider it as a university, you don't stay in a university forever, at some point you gotta move on"
And then we have engineers who "forgot" calculus, cs majors who don't remember the OSI network layers and so on.
People are going for a computer science degree, and then using 1% of it (html css and js) and forgetting all the rest. I would much rather graduate from the university, but still revisit the topics daily to keep refreshing the knowledge I've acquireed
I agree with you about the benefit from installing Gentoo being the learning. I learned so much useful things from the times that I installed it.
for the wallpaper to stay you gotta add "feh --bg-center (image)" to bashrc (i use bspwm so i would add it to bspwmrc)
I don't touch picom's options because every time I touch picom's config it fucks everything up. Really though I have picom just for some basic tarnsparencies (terminal, dwm bar, thats it). Maybe try wayland and see if that fixes the screen tearing.
Honestly Gentoo is it's own special beast, I myself have about 20 different alias for doing anything with emerge.
What do I recommend for Gentoo?
Don't watch youtube tutorials, read the gentoo wiki. You wanna put the arch wiki to shame? Read the Gentoo Handbook.
Gentoo Wiki is probably the best Linux tutorial out there.
I remember installing gentoo on an amd athlon x2 laptop with 2 or 4gb of ram in like 2010? Gnome 3 took like 20 hours to compile
You need a compositor like compton (in the old days) to fix screen tearing. Just install the full KDE package, supports open GL, screen teaing gone. Gentoo is amazing for beginners who like to really sink their teeth in. If you're not a quiter, gentoo definitely is very informative to use and learn from. Got me into Linux.
I have used gentoo since 2013 as my primary OS, I don't dual boot to Windows except to do updates.
I use FluxBox as a desktop, because it is light weight.
in General and as an overal non written rule you will have some time to spend while setting up your system because you dont have a plan on how you will need a system to work in the first place. Gentoo is pretty flexible so it will not do anything you dont tell it to do . Speaking about upgrades .. gentoo uses 2 main branches the "unstable" and the "stable" one. as in other distros you will have frecuent upgrades ( from the latest stable package ) in "unstable". Stable is kind of debian like ( kind of ) oriented branch you U will not find that many upgrades if you remain in that. Once a fixed configuration is a thing you are happy with is just upgrade the system from time to time . One a months is adviced in stable in my opinion because you will not have as I said that many upgrades . I've been using gentoo for more than a decade as my daily driver . of couse U'll have some issues but as your kind of "skills" builtd up using portage you'll fine using a system fit to your needs is just a must.
Gentoo is friggin awesome. For those who have the patience and skill set, it's the best distro out there.
Yep. Agreed! Been my distro of choice for 20 years!
Masochist's of the world unite.
thank you for your opinion on gentoo. you give me a little motivation to try it. will read the manual and try to install it on my own if i will be able to
I remember back in school when I was a gentoo noob, I installed and reinstalled gentoo so much that I could so it almost completely without the handbook.
Now I switched over from arch to gentoo fulltime. Once it works, it works better than anything else.
I'm a noob here, but I explain it to myself like that: "pacman -S" means sync. So if you give it a name of a package it syncs the repos and if it doesn't see the package on your drive it suggests: hey, do you want to install it? If it sees it, it simply suggests a re-install. I explain to myself "pacman -Syu" like this: S means sync the repos, y means update and u means upgrade the packages (if any). This is most probably wrong, but that's what helps me remember these flags. And also if S means sync, s means search. So you search packages like that "pacman -Ss". But again, these are just my associations, they are probably wrong.
I've used gentoo for since it came out (about 20 years ago). I've did lots installs that had KDE or GNOME on them but mainly what I use it for these days is a server with command line. You can optimize so much stuff and keep overhead low. As far as Server space I still love Gentoo. My desktop is Debian though. Quick and easy to install things.
Haha, it's funny that you mention this because I have been think of doing a server install and been trying find someone other than my daily driver (Gentoo) to do it. Might just go for it now.
do you use debian sid?
Here's a pretty good description of gentoo from mental outlaw: "if it moves, compile it". Just keep that in mind when installing and using gentoo and you won't really encounter much unexpected stuff
appreciated your thoughts!
using wayland fixes everything
bro i love so much but u need take care of ur health and start working out man
I used Gentoo Linux I think I am actually insane just a Linux user thing I guess
Glad I found your channel, you look like a cool guy. I'm gonna subscribe!
Gentoo isn’t for me. It has too many parts that are Gentoo specific. I am not interested in learning the Gentoo way when there is so much to learn about Linux. Yes, I’ve installed and used Arch as my daily driver. I downloaded and installed Slackware 15 a while back. I love it. It is my daily driver today. I’m using bspwm on it. I look forward to your long term Slackware review
If I can get it installed, that will happen eventually. Something keeps it from booting into the installer, and IDK what. I did it fine in a VM.
What Terminal is that? The little Icon with the pointer thingy is cool stuff!
I am gonna do a VM of Gentoo first and try and see if I can get System76 flavor of Gnome (Cosmic) for the DE. If I can get that working, it will replace Arco as my secondary OS.
Use gentoo if you want to learn more about low level stuff, or have a lot of free time
“masked” is the source of all pain........
Been on ubuntu for 8 months now,
and gentoo has always captured my curiosity. Im looking to take my linux understanding to another lvl. Especially after bitwig announced support for linux. Windows is taking a hike, and opensuse seems more interesting than macos which ive yet to try out.
Perfect timing on the video lol🖖🏼
Maybe try arch first? Dunno about your experience aside from 8 month Ubuntu, but as a learning curve I'd try arch to see what this is about. Peace
Runing Bitwig on both Gentoo and Arch, it's pure bliss especially thanks to pipewire as well. You won't regret it.
Still working as of today! Thank you!
Gentoo, the only linux distro that was the perfect match for me, no more distro hoping, well documented and once installed (real pain in the ass), it just works, not even once got screwed in any way.
*heard picom* ...
I have to use --experimental-backends and stick to --backend xrender, with nouveau drivers. Also --no-use-damage seems pretty important. I've been able to get away with "better" settings with other hardware, but those are the ones that make --vsync work on my main system.
why would you do that? I found it too much for me to continue with gentoo! I built a distro with LSF which was more rewarding.
i've had issues with screen tearing 2 . that was a long time ago though.
i remember there being a setting with composition in kde plasma that tells the system to redraw the entire screen but i forget exactly where or what the setting was called.
This shows that Debian is truly universal, you have fixed and rolling releases, both support source based installations.
Still, Arch Linux is preferable to Debian Sid.
@@rishirajsaikia1323 Thanks for your opinion, but I disagree. :D
@@mzs114 give some points on how
@@rishirajsaikia1323 Already gave you one reason(original comment), what reason(s) is arch universal? Debian supports 10+ architectures!
A user can choose stable, or rolling releases on any of them, this is not easy, compared to Debian only Gentoo comes half way and Arch dwarfs in front of these giants, that does not mean Arch is irrelevant, it is useful for the wider community as their users test and report bugs helping other users.
The problem with Debian unstable is that it's not the focus, it's more of a testing environment, as a result it's much less stable than Arch, which despite being rolling, is meant to be reliable. I mean Debian is cool but using Debian Sid kinda gets rid of all the benefits Debian offers while not offering everything Arch does.
Props to arch, LFS and Gentoo user's. But us mere beings will stick with easier distros. :D
Love you videos. :)
really EXCELLENT... thankyou
I get that you're proud of your system...you definitely should be after all of the self-abuse and flagellation that you went through to get there. But there comes a time for making priorities, picking your battles, choosing your hill to die on. I love tinkering with Linux as much as the next person, but wow! Having to tinker that much should come with a paycheck for it lol.
Again, unless all of that somehow is furthering your career, that's a massive chunk of life that you just can't get back, when to 99.9% of the public, a low-labor distro is perfectly good. I definitely applaud your dedication to the complete Linux world, for sure. 👍
yeah for me, in my experience, Gentoo is NOT a good gaming OS, and being a gamer, im going to wipe Gentoo and go back to StormOS.
How tf is gentoo not a good gaming os it is legitimately no different to any other linux distribution and it offers 0.687% better performance due to compiling stuff
Thank you, it works perfect!
you can make the wallpaper stay by adding the command to your ~/.xinitrc file
example:
xcompmgr &
feh --bg-scale ~/background.png
dwm
~
~
~
~
Then, when you run startx, it will initialize the background image before starting dwm.
I have awesome window manager on linux lite and no compositor and no screen tearing thanks to this.
xrandr --output youroutputhere --set TearFree on
So i have this in my rc.lua and it executes when i log in.
xrandr --output eDP --set TearFree on
Disable hardware acceleration to deal with screen tearing
with computers being as powerful as they are today, WHY do we need to compile packages for speed, removing support for various dependencies? i ran gentoo for a year, and just couldn't justify the time for it all.
It's not as much for speed as for removing dependencies for stuff you don't want. Why would you want more packages, libraries etc that have their own dependencies and potential security problems etc if you would be better off without them?
2,7gigs of RAM usage.
now this rare review is REAL authentic daily productive modern working env ~
Since i switched i never want to go back
I want to try Gentoo but I am intimidated by building the kernel and the machine I would install it on is an x220 ThinkPad…. Long compile times
Gentoo sorts the men from the boys.
{just set dependency tree trying to solve it}/*be self aware
You pore brave souls. I have tried Sabayon several times for years. Believe it or not, that was the reason I tried Linux in the first place 10 years ago! The Merge thing bit me in the asses everytime. I screwed it up so bad I borked it and would not boot. Then I would go back to Window 7. I have not nor do I plan to try it again or Gentoo at all. So no! Arch and Debian is for me... :-P
Thanks Matt!
LLAP
Scared, say scared.
Bwahahahaha!
Take care Bruce! 🙂
I was using this distro for learning purposes back in the days of Gentoo 2005.
A couple of days ago I've noticed that I cannot install the recent Gentoo on retro PC (Pentium II and Pentium 4). Why? Because the developers put EFI boot into the x86/i486 installation media.
The beauty of gentoo is that you can use any live media you want to install it. You can use Linux mint or void or whatever you want to install it.
You can use another distro, you dont need Gentoo images for installing. I used Fedora, Ubuntu, Debian. You need only network, disk utils and chroot.
I installed Gentoo, and I love it.
Try funtoo undead usb. Funtoo doesn't really have the masking problems.
--vsync nor --refresh-rate worked in picom?
--vsync did not, which is odd because usually it does.
The -S means sync
Sync /= install. IMHO.
@@TheLinuxCast But you use S for update and such also. You are syncing local packages with the repo IMO
@@oalfodr Yep, that's the reason
i used gento for ~15 years, i used GNU/Linux for ~20years
THANK U BOSS!
0:49 for gpu why does it say 470/480/570/570X/580/580X/590 does he had 7 gpu's and if so why would he do that?
Neofetch does that. It's just one.
Fuck it. I am happy with my Fedora and I will stick to it forever. 😂
Hi, what is your desktop interface? much cool than gnome
Funny thing is that I spent all day installing gentoo and was taken to a grub error and says to first load the kernel. So I think I messed up at compiling the kernel. So I will try and try and try when I get free time to install gentoo. Anyway did any of you guys had the same error and how did you fix it?
I was so annoyed. 😂
I got a kernel-panic at boot, gave up after over a week of learning the ins and outs of Gentoo. And I now run Arch, but I WILL succeed with Gentoo. just not right now, I am ALL in for learning all about how Linux works. right now Im trying to resolve issues with Nvidia-drivers and my samsung tv getting the wrong DPI-numbers. everything is scaled for a 7 inch screen iThink.
@@desmondsparrs good luck. You doing much better as you were able to get it boot to the kernel. I am just stuck at grub. 😭😂
@@JonathanSteadman2003 lol I only got past grub, "kernel panic" sounds like a bad thing to me haha. It kinda was expected though. But I am committed and obsessive as HELL so I will try to succeed at getting to a desktop..in Gentoo.. at some point. But I will do it in a virtual machine instead on bare metal as I should've done from the beginning, because I can at least pause my work and procrastinate my project to the future lol
@@desmondsparrs yeah virtual machine is best for new users. Also kernel panic is not what you want to see. It's bsod but for Unix and Unix like system. Anyway good luck with Gentoo. :)!
Gentoo rocks!
the simple answer is no.
the more complex answer is no.
what fetcher do you use?
That's Neofetch. My config is in my dot files, link in the description.
Please, review of Calculate Linux!
For me the experimental flag for picom solve 99% of screentearing problems.
A week? That's not long enough, you might never see a login prompt!
I used Gentoo on some older Core 2 Duo era machines for quite a while and still do use it on my desktop, and the compile times are only really a problem with very specific pieces of software-qtwebengine (basically chromium), Firefox, the Rust toolchain, Wine/mono etc. I definitely learned more about Linux from it than any other distro, though, and it's still one of my favorites.
Screentearing - what is this? Never have such problems with Sway :)
Have you considered using Wayland? I think it just magically fixes any vsync issues
I can use wayland, but it doesn't work well with OBS yet, so that'd mean no more videos. Or at least it hasn't worked with OBS for me. I know other people seem to have better luck with Wayland and Pipewire than I do.
@@TheLinuxCast if Wayland fixes the vsync issue, perhaps a good workaround would be to use Wayland for day to day stuff and X11 for OBS whenever needed
As always, everything is super. Waiting for new cheats from your side
Gentoo isn't faster than other distros in the real world.
However Gentoo does allow you great customization than any other distro.
Hi! The discord invite is expired :(
Dont know if it is just for me but can you pls make another one?
Here you go,. discord.gg/bPJ4A3bPbV
I had to shut it down at one point because of douche bags, that's why all the old videos have old linkx
'-S' stands for '--sync', it makes sense.
The second I saw you I subscribed and smashed the like button u look like u know a thing or 2 about a command line
Gentoo is 100% FOSS ?? Or does it have some _non-free binary blob_ in the kernel??
You get to decide that yourself
Its the regular linux kernel so some non free stuff does exist in the kernel using the libre kernel is possible to use prety shure.
S stand for sync which I mean kinda makes sense... somewhat.. the one that dont make sense at all is the flag "y" which stands for refresh... devs be getting high when making this shit up.
no please 😂
BEEST!!!
🥇
I installed Gentoo. It didn't cost me $200
i wish someone would pay me $200 to install gentoo
good work king, love you
I use Gentoo on the daily and I love it, but it's definitely not for everybody. I will say though, `--autounmask=y --autounmask-continue` helps with mask issues when you're just learning the system.
My IQ is a bit too low to install it.
if you've commented on this vid, ur IQ already high enough to install gentoo
Emerge is incredibly slow thanks to Python!
Now... Linux From Scratch =P
No way.
@@TheLinuxCast C'mon... You KNOW deep down, it's on the check-list and you might as well.
Banish Pipewire! 🤣🤣🤣
Gentoo is for people that don't value ones times
If you have an Nvidia card, you can try the below setting as a kernel parameter in grub or something to fix the screen tearing issue.
nvidia-drm.modeset=1