Battison felt like the true detective Batman from the comics. If The Joker was a film about a broken man becoming Irredeemable, than The Batman is a film about a damaged man becoming a Force for Good!
What sold me on The Batman and his detective skills wasn't just smarts and tech. The movie showed a meticulous nature, watching and rewatching the contact lens recordings from the previous night, making verbatim entries in his journal. It wasn't just that he did "detectiving", but that he was already painstaking in his efforts and put in the work.
What Detective Work did Pattinson do? He solved a few word problems and had someone else infiltrate a compound for him. He only found out Riddler's plan by pure accident.........
Agreed. Most think the only real detective work he did was when he took out that piece of stone out of the wall to get a fingerprint from the bullet in TDK. And I must I admit, I thought the same until I rewatched the movies and paid attention
@Mister Majestic you gonna mention it? Cuz I was pretty damn sure that was it. Bugging everyone's phone isn't being a detective, it's just using your insane tech to do the job for you and it is also illegal. I think Nolan's Batman is the more tactical Batman with better strategies before entering dangerous situations while Pattinson's Batman is better in deductive thinking. I'm sure you can say that The Batman uses mini camera soft lens but that was used merely to collect evidence and it was merely a tool to help Batman find the Riddler while that TDK spying tool literally finds the Joker for him. The only detective work is scanning the bullet while stuff like planning to capture the Joker with Harvey as bait was merely a group plan and it was also more on tactical strategies than actual deductions. Same goes for the final fight with Joker.
Recency bias at work. I’m seeing it a lot with Battinson. Where people go out of their way to completely shit on every Batman before him not realizing that all have their bright spots
I think Battinson is more impressive than Bale since he's only in his second year. Bale wins because of his experience and his emotional maturity, but we'll see more of Battinson so we can't rule him out just yet.
@@KalomikaArts tf did he do in Batman Begins that was somewhat intelligent? His plan to stop Ra's was to blow up the train tracks not knowing how many people he would've killed in the process. Just re-watched the movie legit 2 days ago and he never did anything that was inherently smart. He needed high tech to actually solve anything in all of his Batman films even the bullet scene in TDK. While Battinson solved a lot of riddles either with the help of other characters or just simply on his own. The only tech he uses was the eye lens spying thing. Matt Reeves clearly intended for this new Batman to make plenty of mistakes because he knows that The Batman we know doesn't just become him in a span of 8 - 10 months even 2 years but rather a long process with a ton of experience. This Batman isn't the perfect detective just yet, even Penguin said so in front of his face. You may think he isn't the smartest detective compared to the others but at least we get to see exactly how he thinks and we know that the year 2 Batman is far from perfect. In TDK, we never really got to see him do a lot of detective work compared to TB so we don't really know Bale's Batman's flaws which makes him look like the perfect detective in just his 2 years as Batman.
@@KalomikaArts well, in fairness, that's in part because the filmmakers did a time-jump between BB and TDK and just said Baleman did those things. It's basically the benefit of TDK being a sequel.
What I really like about The Batman's detective work is how, despite being so detail-oriented and observant and intelligent, Bruce was still susceptible to having his personal biases cloud his judgement. On some subconscious level, Bruce always saw the similarities in Batman and Riddler's methodologies, and that blinded him to some pretty basic rules of investigation - like figuring out where the pictures of the Iceberg Lounge were taken from. When Batman sets up a stake-out and creepily stalks someone, he doesn't set up a permanent residence right across from his target. So, Bruce doesn't think that the Riddler would be living right across from the Iceberg Lounge; because that's not what Bruce himself does. He dismisses that crucial information as a result. The flaws in Bruce's detective work tie into Bruce's broader character arc, of recognizing how his perspectives have been limited. Bruce tried doing everything alone - but as the video says, investigation is a collaborative process. As Bruce has reached his epiphany on the value of bringing people hope - and is changing his approach to accommodate the lessons he's learned - I imagine that he'll be more successful in future investigations, as he reaches out to his community and support network more.
@@jaycole4390 it definitely is, some advice for you though…don’t try and write a book or anything in your life considering you aren’t capable of critical thinking.
@@jaycole4390 That name gives me PTSD from other assholes and trolls on yt, lacking critical thinking. If you are the same guy I wouldn't be surprised to be honest.
Um ok you are giving excuses to why batman couldnt able to solve but why didnt GCPD detectives werent able to solve? Do you think real life detectives cant solve this? Heck ordinary guys are commenting in the comment section why didnt batman not solve due to all the pictures taken from the same location. GCPD must be capable of solving this and so batman must definitely be capable solving this because the whole point is batman being better than GCPD hence he gives them value
@@heisenberg2712 I think that the murder of the police commissioner is what draws the GCPD away from investigating the source of the photos. The commissioner's grisly death, followed by the revelation that he was corrupt, is a massive emotional blow to the entire police force. The Riddler is revealing the institutions they believed in to be a sham, and the people they personally knew to be corrupt. They're more focused on the shocking contents of the photos and their ramifications, rather than where and how the photos were taken. It's harder to be objective and logical when the subject is so personal, even when the answer is obvious. It also doesn't help that the police are constantly redirecting their attention to Batman. For the whole film, the police are getting agitated by this weird bat guy who keeps on intervening in the case, showing up to crime scenes, and is getting letters sent to him directly from the killer. Batman hasn't earned their trust yet, and that's also a source of distraction from focusing on the case. On top of all that: just historically, incompetent police investigation has always been a massive issue when it comes to serial killer cases. Plus, in a city as corrupt and destitute as Gotham, I wouldn't be surprised if police qualifications were especially lax, and let in plenty of people unsuited for the job, due to corruption or negligence. (That last sentence is more of an assumption, though - not as supported by examples from the film, like I feel the rest are.)
Whaaaat? He is failed to solved so many of the riddles he was given! Took him the whole movie to figure out that Falcone was the rat. Smh. Like Riddler said he really isn't as smart as he though. Not saying he is a bad batman, but he was a bad detective.
@@RDbodybuildingreardelt tf you mean he was a bad detective? He was the smartest detective who was outsmarted by the smartest villain. Doesn't make him a bad detective. He failed to solve 1 fucking riddle while the rest he solved within seconds. Shit you'd call Bale's Batman really smart for doing 1 detective work in TDK and succeeding while calling Battinson dumb for succeeding in every single riddle but failing 1. It's genuinely hilarious to me
@@TheMicael100 OP's comment said it as if Batfleck and Bale is the only one that is focused on Batman as a character while Pattinson is not which is definitely wrong. Never said Bale wasn't tho. Maybe in TDK and TDKR but not in BB, he definitely had a decent arc there.
@@jasonalv7436 true tho, id say batfleck was indeed yes very much more focused on being an action heavy hero (considering he doesnt have a solo film and is mostly known for his action scenes on BvS) but i think what i mean is batfleck focuses on batman as a character in the dc universe, with other superheroes (considering his appearance in movies is only with other superheroes) and bale’s batman as a character in batman’s universe with his rogues and the batman lore with battinson, they did focus more on his detective side and his setbacks in his first years as batman and i can say its similar with Bale’s batman in his first years with the film only focusing more and heavily on his detective side which reeves stated
@@youtubeuser6762 I personally think that The Batman had a proper and more well executed arc compared to any other Batman movie to this day. With Batman Begins being 2nd. And yeah, I think I misunderstood what you meant with them as a character. I thought you said Battinson's Batman had no character or the movie doesn't focus on his character compared to the other 2 Batman but I guess that wasn't your intention
The obvious answer to me is Batfleck who in his limited screen time manages to hunt down several high level criminals, find all the members of the justice league, figures out how to revive Superman and how to calm him down if needed. Batfleck doesn't get the time to show alot of the detective work but it's obvious it has happened just in the background.
Honestly the mystery should have been solved in like 15 minutes in The Batman. All the photos Riddler has of the Lounge were taken from the same vantage point. How did nobody think to look at possible places the photos could be taken from? It would lead them right to Riddler's apartment
Maybe that was intentional. Going to the vantage point for all the shots would've been extremely easy. If it wasn't intentional then the directors could've just taken all the pictures from different angles but they didn't. Pattinson's Batman is smart but not that smart. He is a detective but he makes a good amount of mistakes. This seems very similar to the end of season 3 of Sherlock. The way Moriarty beat Sherlock is by making it obvious because Sherlock wouldn't expect it to be that easy which would then make him complicate things himself.
Good point. I didn't think of this at all - possibly due to the photos easily being taken from the opposite roof or not even taken by the Riddler himself.
@@jasonalv7436 same i do believe it was intentional, as batman is only on his 2nd year, he still has a lot to learn from gliding and mainly employs the help of alfred in solving riddler’s riddles and the film is basically a foundation for battinson’s future relationships with his rogues and allies
@@youtubeuser6762 Even so, I still think Pattinson is the smartest Batman due to him mostly being outsmarted by a really smart character. He also has more detective moments compared to every other live action Batman so he shouldn't be considered dumb just because he made 1-3 mistakes. Can't wait for the next Batman film after all the development he went through in this one.
Excluding Pattinson (since The Batman is basically a detective film so it instantly wins), I'd pick Affleck as the next best. I know that will upset Bale's fans since most people claim Affleck didn't do much but despite Lex playing him (to be fair he played basically everyone he talks to in the film), Affleck was studying everyone constantly. The first time we see him he's doing detective/interrogation work (albeit rather brutally but he's a grumpy old man so we'll let that slide), which then transitions to him in the batcave learning about the White Portuguese, KG Beast's involvement and also studying the footage of Superman vs Zod to learn his fighting techniques. Then after copying files from his phone and learning about Lex's connections, he goes to Luthor's and does more snooping, then he tracks down the kryptonite shipment and does even more, then decrypts Lex's files and learns about the Metahumans and so on. THEN in ZSJL we see him track down Arthur (thanks to his connections with the likes of Waller), and when he's on the plane heading home as well as with Wonder Woman in the batcave he's still studying the Metahuman files to find where everyone is, and decides who's best to find who (knowing Barry's situation would leave him to likely be excited to join Bruce, whereas Victor needed a much softer/caring touch from Diana due to his depression), and finally he's able to use his satellites to track down Steppenwolf & the Motherboxes... I dunno about anyone else, but to me that's a lot of detective work from someone who apparently didn't really do any detective work in BvS/JL.
Also a minor but important bit you missed in my opinion is when Affleck's Bruce is watching the sport fight happen, (i believe that's the same time he was encrypting the phone of KG Beast) he spoke to the fighter in his own language and told him how to beat his opponent very quickly, and it worked. None of the other Batmen spoke any foreign languages that I can recall. Even Battinson missed the bit in his film that was in spanish. The penguin had to chide him, for not understanding spanish.
@@matthewandrews3883 yes, sir. And know multiple languages is one of the top notch batman techniques in my opinion. Battinson make me sad for not knowing spanish, it was kinda disapointing
For me my favorite has to be Val Kilmer's subdued version of Bruce and his take on the Batman. He does good detective work in his movie and even more on the official Batman Forever Novelization which is great. I highly suggest fans give it a read, or listen to the audio book available here on RUclips for free.
I don't know how good of a detective Battinson could be when he never even bothered to check the angles that the photographs Riddler was sending him were taken from. Had he checked to see if there was any evidence left at the position from which The Riddler snapped the photos, he would have discovered that they were all taken from an apartment window full of Riddler-related shit, and he would have cracked the case immediately. There's also the fact that he and Gordon and dumb enough to plug an unknown USB stick that could have been full of malware straight into Gordon's computer without running it on a virtual machine, and the computer is even connected to the internet and logged into Gordon's account. Also, as soon as Riddler killed the second important city official, you'd think the GCPD would just place all prominent officials under police protection, and the DA would have never been kidnapped. Neither Batman nor the GCPD suggest this. When it comes to Batfleck… he spends a good portion of the movie assuming the "White Russian" is a person and trying to track him down, because he doesn't bother to just Google in and find out that it's in fact a boat until a lot later.
In my opinion, I feel Battinson also got played by Riddler just as much as Batffleck's by Luthor. Both were working unknowingly they were helping the villain. But that doesn't ruin them but makes the villain more dangerous. Until both Batmen realise the truth. Then it was over for both enemies.
Batfleck is definitely the most successful in his endeavors he took out his whole rogues gallery. Getting the better of Superman is no easy task. All the Batmans we're manipulated by someone but lex luthor might be the smartest human being on the planet so we could cut him a little slack there
Except Bruce figured out absolutely nothing about Clark himself on his own. Technically he only figured out his weakness via Lex Luthor’s guiding hand, and he didn’t seem to know that his machine guns wouldn’t do anything against him until he tried using them at the start of the fight. He missed plenty of vital info on Clark that would have been essential in understanding who he thought was his enemy, including the identity of his parents and his history on earth. When “save Martha” is what brings Bruce’s plans to a screeching halt, you know he’s failed as an experienced detective.
I think by the end of a trilogy the batman will edge out the dark knight in detective work. This first case showed him the flaws he still has and he'll learn to overcome them. I'm excited to see more from this universe
I think you should have put a third option in Bruce not remembering Jack saying the phrase, he was a very young boy and that was a very traumatizing event obviously, but to remember every single detail about all of that after 20 something years him not remembering that catch phrase after a while and just focusing on the parents is definitely probable especially for young traumatized child I think it should have been a third option where the trauma blinded him to certain aspects of this person
@@KeyIssues I do agree that he thinks about it often but even if you look at it now like your memory as a 9-year old versus now trying to remember a face or an image or phrase even trying to remember over the decades it still becomes distorted or muttered or something like that I'm just saying there is definite possibility that there is childhood trauma involved that would have distorted that, but don't get me wrong my personal favorite Batman is the Animated Series he's definitely the world's greatest detective! And you guys put really great evidence for your augments! You did in fact change my perception of Christian Bale Batman so I consider that accomplishment! I work at a bar in a movie theater and I talk about movies a lot and so this will actually be something I can mention.
And Batman Forever firmly establishes that Bruce has repressed major details from his memory of that period in his life. It's entirely possible that he didn't remember the face or the name until Jack's catch phrase triggered the memories. (Or who knows: maybe Bruce is now misremembering the face and the name after hearing Jack Napier say something very similar to the words used by the actual killer of the Waynes.)
The only flaw in your point is that Bruce is clearly obsessed with that moment of his life, which is a crucial part of his character, so they got that right. It's the fact that even if he had to hear the 'Dance with the Devil' phrase to relive that moment in every detail, the face of his parents' killer is something he would have never forgotten. And let's be honest here. Young Jack Napier's sadistic smile was absolutely sinister and terrifying. That image would be burned into his memory and he completely glosses over the mugshot of young Napier in the file. They definitely angled some semblance of familiarity with Napier, which is why Bruce kept digging, but it wasn't any of the digging that jogged that memory. It was a face to face with Joker and the offchance that Joker used that phrase, which he claims he always asked his victims, but he didn't utter it once before in the film when he shot and killed both Eckhart and Grissom. So while Keaton and Nicholson are two of my favorites in their roles, Nicholson still being the best Joker in my opinion (Ledger's take was amazing and the correct call for the movie he was in, for me, Jack is much closer to Joker from the comics), the writing of the 89 film definitely fumbled it for both their characters, with Bruce/Batman being the one the writing fumbled the most.
I felt that the bale version relied on tech to much vs pattinson, but also pattinson is only in his second year and has room to grow into a bigger and better detective
I really loved The Batman. This is my favorite take on my favorite fictional character. But I agree with this assessment. Dark Knight was a better detective.
In terms of straight up IQ and power it’s Ben. Detective capability is Pattinson, the skill and Bruce Wayne mask goes to Bale while Keaton gets OG points
I hope Matt reeves introduce Batmans other alias in Matches Malone, a mask he wears when he needs to infiltrate certain places that batman or Bruce Wayne can't. In the comics at least
It's shockingly easy to frame Burton Batman for murder because, well, he commits REAL murder all the goddman time, which is why I just cannot comprehend why people like that version of Batman. Same reason I don't understand people liking Batffleck.
Battinson is the acceptable detective, not great but acceptable. Did an effort to actually investigate. Batfleck got played by Lex, enough said. Needed Lex files just to learn about other metahumans. Bale needed to Fox, and broke the law by spying on everybody just to find Joker. Slept with the enemy, and also tricked by his father Ras. Keaton, the evidences are no brainer and pretty obvious especially on the Joker and Penguin's identities and motives, but too late to take action. Because of poor assessment and detective skills.
now, Christan Bale was my most favorite Batman next to Michle Keeton. But after I saw the new Batman, my mind just blew for how good it was. congrats to Matt Reeves for The Batman.
I really liked the Batman and most of the other films but this video made me realize we still have yet to see the true “Worlds Greatest Detective” side of Batman. In any film where he does actually do detective work, he still ends up getting played somehow. We haven’t seen him truly get ahead of any villain. But I guess that’s what makes the story more dynamic at the same time. It would probably get boring to see him always one upping everyone
It certainly seems possible this might shift more into Robert Patterson's Batman's favour with future movies since they really seem to want to focus on the detective angle and that batman is so early in his career.
Batfleck did it all. He did the prep, he had the body, could fight like we've come to expect from the games, he did the super spy stuff in civies... Everybody hates on Batfleck, but he was the definitive Batman. Losing to Lex isn't unexpected. Lex is technically smarter.
It is crazy how many people give Robert Pattinson Batman the greatest detective award out of all of them, even though he failed. I mean, did people even watch the movie? He did not figure out the final riddle, he struggled with all the other riddles, and had Alfred pretty much do it all.
Funny enough I think Joker or Riddler have one over on ol' Bats. They want him to play the game and sometimes they have to give him multiple hints. A normal man would fail...but Bruce isn't that much smarter than them. Anyway, that rant aside, I'd say Kevin Conroy.
ima batfleck fan so ima give my argument on why he shouldve had more points: +lex didnt manipulate him, batman wanted the smoke from the zod fight that killed his friend. lex was intercepting and adding fuel to the fire. also lex luthor is the rival to superman, as smart as superman is strong, and succeeded in killing him in that movie. also batman was having visions of the future with real world fx so his mind was under a lot of pressure +batman predicted the fight with superman. it ended where he placed the spear and he was well prepared for that encounter +while batman doesnt know supermans identity, idr if he ever sees him up close other than during the car scene. his focus was how to end the world destroying alien threat. while lex made it easier to do so, this batman was able to synthesize grenades and weapons with an understanding of their effect on kryptonian physiology. most of this is a reach but at least u sounded positive talking about batfleck lol dope vid
I'll give Battison a break since he has only one movie out, but Bale's Batman takes the cake here. Using the criteria from the video Bale's Batman wins by far. In Batman Begins he works to get evidence for the police to use against the mob before even taking down Falcone. He then gives Rachel the 'leverage' needed to get Judge Faden out of the picture with pictures of his affairs. Damn fine detecting in my book, having all the evidence before the crime. Also, in Dark Knight you have to take into consideration some things. The time between BB and DK, it's been 1 year, and Batman and the GCPD have basically taken down the mob, in 1 year! Granted in the movie they are in the final steps, but that is hell of progress in 1 year given the mob has been in control of Gotham for decades. Then enters Joker. The Dark Knight is using every detective skill in existence. Did you notice that Batman was running a facial recognition scan on Joker's face? Every American has their face on record, either by a Driver's License , Passport, or Military ID. Also, Gordon mentions that there are no print records or dental records of him. He even says that his clothing has no labels meaning they cant track where he buys his clothes. The Joker is literally a ghost in the Dark Knight. Pretty hard to track a ghost, but Batman does a decent job at least. In DKR he is going up against the entire league who he thought doesn't exist any more. Damn hard to fight an enemy you don't know exist and who have been planning for 10 years (with inside knowledge). Maybe the next Battison movies will shed more light on his skills, but right now Bale's Batman wins.
I love how Bruce didn't know what that tucker was until near the end when Ramirez the beat cop explains to him how his uncle would use one for work. Because Bruce is filthy rich rather than working class, he'd never had a use for anything like it before, thus his confusion as to what exactly it was used for aside from bludgeoning the mayor's skull.
I agree, but I also want to point out that Batman failing and being so close but not quite getting there is so important for the story. The Batman is about how he fell short, how vengeance got in the way. He learned about the involvement of his father and was blinded by his lust for vengeance, but he importantly learned from the end of the movie that he had to be more than that. In other words, I think Batbale wins against the Batison from the start of the movie, but loses against Batison at the end. Which means you could still very much argue that Batbale would take the win by the rules you set, so again, I agree, but its something to think about.
I honestly feel like Batton (Michael Keaton Batman) and Batfleck could have had a great potential in detective work in their respective portrayals and story arc had the studio executives didn't caused interference to their trilogies.
Affleck single handedly infiltrated a high security facility , stole data regarding meta humans ,learnt about superman weakness , devised a God Killing weapon. Bale used one brick to analyze the interior to match the fingerprint when the shooter loaded his gun to finally revealing Joker's plan. Bale also designed the sonar system turning every phone into a receiver and tracking Joker. Pattinson developed a contact lens to capture and analyze footage and also solved each riddle to finally catch Riddler. I my opinion Batman is the best detective
1:11 Bale has the filthiest bat suit, the way it was tactical based. Ben’s suit is nasty to tho with it’s texture! Just yoked n exaggerated with the classic grey Colorway and small ears for that cartoon/comic thickness. And I’ve always appreciated Clooney suits, they were spot on the sporty action figure suits from back in the day, I miss those they use to come with so many designs and accessories like iron man today. Also Lewis Wilson 🤣
Personally I think the Punisher that had John Travolta showcased skills that blows batman away. Shattering the Antagonists world and inner circle using subtrafuge and intelligence before shooting the Sh** out of everyone that was left.
I dont agree that Joels movies are in the same canon as Burtons at all regardless of the things that suggest so.We learn that Bruce married Selina and now we will see him older in the Flash,i dont think its gonna fit with Joels movies and propably intentionally so. How Kilmer aged to become Clooney is beyond me lmao I do know the writers of Forever and Batman&Robin propably intended them to be a continuation but everyone else at DC seems to say otherwise
We don't see that he married Catwoman. That was on the Crisis on Infinite Earths set but never in the show. The Flash movie seems to be in the other split timeline... maybe. That has absolutely no effect on the Schumacher films, which will always be in the same universe as the Burton films even if there's sequels to the Burton films that aren't connected to Schumacher.
@@newhybrid101 I mean, you're essentially trying to argue the equivalent of Terminator 3-4 being set in a different universe to Terminator 1-2 because they made the alternative sequel Dark Fate. Since both are intended to be sequels, they share those same exact events in their individual universes. I've seen people say HBO's Watchmen isn't in the same universe as the comic when it's a direct sequel. Sure, Moore might not consider it as part of his canon, but the events of the book are indeed canonical to the show. This is just how canon works. Same with Star Wars too. Legends canon and Disney canon are both different universes that share identical events in I-VI and The Clone Wars.
Has anyone noticed that RDJ's Sherlock Holmes and Robert Pattinson's The Batman had a similarity? Check the scene in Sherlock Holmes where he was writing stuff on the floor, trying to figure out who's the mysterious antagonist doing "black magic" stuff. Bruce was doing the same thing in his house after the explosion in the Wayne Manor.
Glasses are actually something that can change the way people see someone they don't know. That's one of the reasons they work for Clark. He also acts completely different from Superman. Both Christopher Reeve and Henry Cavill went out in public as Superman and Clark Kent and as Superman, they were always recognized as Christopher Reeve or Henry Cavill respectively. But with the glasses on and the loose fitting dress suit, nobody recognized them at all. There's a study that looks into the subject of people being able to recognize others they don't personally know wearing glasses and not wearing glasses and even in side by side photos, people don't recognize people they don't know personally more often than they do. As viewers/comic readers, we're privy to Superman's identity, so yeah, it seems like a dumb thing, but there is actual truth to rhe disguise.
I would agree. Honestly I hate how people were saying that Battison was the first Batman to actually do detective work when all of them did some kind of detective work, some better than others. Like how do people gloss over the whole Batman Begins of Batman actually doing detective work and finding the connections to crime bosses and actually leaving evidence to finally convict them even if they're paying off judges? Then the whole Dark Knight Joker detective stuff is crazy misleading with his plan is insane. Like how do people look at these 2 movies and say Battison is the first time they did detective work. Maybe the first time they focus most the movie on the detective work but this has happened in other movies. However I will say that with just 1 more movie Battison will probably easily become the better detective, but right now it's either a tie for me or Christan Bale is slightly the best right now
I mostly agree but don't necessarily feel it's fair to saddle the Burton Batman with the Schumacher Batman's inferior showings. They're honestly completely different characters in the way they act, react and handle things. Hell this is why most people don't even consider Forever or B&R when comparing them. Also should we really consider what goes on in Bruce's personal space as part of his detective skill? After all, in that sphere, most people are blinded by their own sense of security and comfort. Similar to how a real life seasoned detective might be good at his job but fails to realize his wife is cheating on him or is planning on divorcing him. He's just too into his case/his job to realize other things are happening. Otherwise we might consider: *Batfleck not just not recognizing Clark as Superman but also neglecting the overwhelming evidence from all over the world that Superman is a force for good and instead willingly and deliberately ignoring all that and playing into his own bias, following his emotions in order to conclude he has to kill Superman. *Bale's Batman inability to even realize that Rachel wasn't even into him, or the fact he spent literally months inside the League of Shadows but somehow was unable to work out that they're killers before he was literally asked to murder someone, not to mention getting blindsided by Thalia. *Battinson, despite being consumed by the murder of his parents and dwelling both on them and their untimely death, apparently in all this time had never worked out the actual circumstances of their death, or their shady past, to the point it completely took him by surprise and shattered his world view for a moment.
I always thought it was pretty smart how Val's Batman immediately knew to use the guards ear device to open the vault. Also, just because there are references to prior events doesnt mean that schumachers Batman is the same as Burton's, in the same way that Scott Snyder's Batman isn't necessarily the same as Morrison's. Not sure I agree with how the first 4 films were combined.
Id say its Robert Pattison, but also we should consider the experience of each Batman. 89- Batman and Robin seems to have already been established for years, Christian Bale in Begins was just starting, Batfleck was a 20 year vet, and Pattison was on year 2 All that said its between Bale and Pattison
Batman 2022 wins for me, but we can't judge it to the full extent, bc this is only the first movie in what's going to have sequels. I think I heard somewhere it's gonna be a trilogy. But that's only year 2 Batman,and he's already a good detective, so imagine him fine tuning himself in future movies.
![BLACK BAG - Official Trailer [HD] - Only in Theaters March 14](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Du0Xp8WX_7I/mqdefault.jpg)
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Can we get mcu shang-chi feats please
I really want to know if mcu shang-chi in the mcu, is wall level or more with the rings
You should do who's the strongest live action batman
Good video
@@Kid_Cozmic It's DCEU by a mile
Pattinson is the smartest and most mentally resilient because he had to collect a hundred Riddler trophies off screen before the movie could end.
200+
Lol
I UNDERSTOOD THAT
423*
245 trophys to be specific
Battison felt like the true detective Batman from the comics. If The Joker was a film about a broken man becoming Irredeemable, than The Batman is a film about a damaged man becoming a Force for Good!
It's Robbat Batinbat
@@jarvisjames Robbat Battinson
@@2plus2is-five Robbat Battinbat
@@jarvisjames Doesn't have a nice ring to it
@@2plus2is-five don't you listen to the weekly planet podcast ?
What sold me on The Batman and his detective skills wasn't just smarts and tech. The movie showed a meticulous nature, watching and rewatching the contact lens recordings from the previous night, making verbatim entries in his journal. It wasn't just that he did "detectiving", but that he was already painstaking in his efforts and put in the work.
What Detective Work did Pattinson do? He solved a few word problems and had someone else infiltrate a compound for him. He only found out Riddler's plan by pure accident.........
@@FernandoMartinez-pv1id lol Snyderboi detected.
I'm so glad someone actually realises that the Bale version actually did detective work.
Agreed. Most think the only real detective work he did was when he took out that piece of stone out of the wall to get a fingerprint from the bullet in TDK. And I must I admit, I thought the same until I rewatched the movies and paid attention
@@CommanderShepard-wq3wo pretty sure that was the only detective work he did in TDK. But maybe I missed some things
Him as a retired worn out recluse still managed to solve Selina’s identity in the beginning of TDKR
@Mister Majestic you gonna mention it? Cuz I was pretty damn sure that was it. Bugging everyone's phone isn't being a detective, it's just using your insane tech to do the job for you and it is also illegal. I think Nolan's Batman is the more tactical Batman with better strategies before entering dangerous situations while Pattinson's Batman is better in deductive thinking. I'm sure you can say that The Batman uses mini camera soft lens but that was used merely to collect evidence and it was merely a tool to help Batman find the Riddler while that TDK spying tool literally finds the Joker for him. The only detective work is scanning the bullet while stuff like planning to capture the Joker with Harvey as bait was merely a group plan and it was also more on tactical strategies than actual deductions. Same goes for the final fight with Joker.
Recency bias at work. I’m seeing it a lot with Battinson. Where people go out of their way to completely shit on every Batman before him not realizing that all have their bright spots
I think Battinson is more impressive than Bale since he's only in his second year. Bale wins because of his experience and his emotional maturity, but we'll see more of Battinson so we can't rule him out just yet.
Technically Bale was also on his second year in the dark knight
@@tomasbedoya2901 exactly. I'm tired of that stupid argument of year 2. Bale did in his first year, more than Battinson did in two
@@KalomikaArts tf did he do in Batman Begins that was somewhat intelligent? His plan to stop Ra's was to blow up the train tracks not knowing how many people he would've killed in the process. Just re-watched the movie legit 2 days ago and he never did anything that was inherently smart. He needed high tech to actually solve anything in all of his Batman films even the bullet scene in TDK. While Battinson solved a lot of riddles either with the help of other characters or just simply on his own. The only tech he uses was the eye lens spying thing. Matt Reeves clearly intended for this new Batman to make plenty of mistakes because he knows that The Batman we know doesn't just become him in a span of 8 - 10 months even 2 years but rather a long process with a ton of experience. This Batman isn't the perfect detective just yet, even Penguin said so in front of his face. You may think he isn't the smartest detective compared to the others but at least we get to see exactly how he thinks and we know that the year 2 Batman is far from perfect. In TDK, we never really got to see him do a lot of detective work compared to TB so we don't really know Bale's Batman's flaws which makes him look like the perfect detective in just his 2 years as Batman.
@@KalomikaArts pfffffff
@@KalomikaArts well, in fairness, that's in part because the filmmakers did a time-jump between BB and TDK and just said Baleman did those things. It's basically the benefit of TDK being a sequel.
What I really like about The Batman's detective work is how, despite being so detail-oriented and observant and intelligent, Bruce was still susceptible to having his personal biases cloud his judgement.
On some subconscious level, Bruce always saw the similarities in Batman and Riddler's methodologies, and that blinded him to some pretty basic rules of investigation - like figuring out where the pictures of the Iceberg Lounge were taken from. When Batman sets up a stake-out and creepily stalks someone, he doesn't set up a permanent residence right across from his target. So, Bruce doesn't think that the Riddler would be living right across from the Iceberg Lounge; because that's not what Bruce himself does. He dismisses that crucial information as a result.
The flaws in Bruce's detective work tie into Bruce's broader character arc, of recognizing how his perspectives have been limited. Bruce tried doing everything alone - but as the video says, investigation is a collaborative process. As Bruce has reached his epiphany on the value of bringing people hope - and is changing his approach to accommodate the lessons he's learned - I imagine that he'll be more successful in future investigations, as he reaches out to his community and support network more.
Its not that deep yo lmao
@@jaycole4390 it definitely is, some advice for you though…don’t try and write a book or anything in your life considering you aren’t capable of critical thinking.
@@jaycole4390 That name gives me PTSD from other assholes and trolls on yt, lacking critical thinking. If you are the same guy I wouldn't be surprised to be honest.
Um ok you are giving excuses to why batman couldnt able to solve but why didnt GCPD detectives werent able to solve? Do you think real life detectives cant solve this? Heck ordinary guys are commenting in the comment section why didnt batman not solve due to all the pictures taken from the same location. GCPD must be capable of solving this and so batman must definitely be capable solving this because the whole point is batman being better than GCPD hence he gives them value
@@heisenberg2712 I think that the murder of the police commissioner is what draws the GCPD away from investigating the source of the photos. The commissioner's grisly death, followed by the revelation that he was corrupt, is a massive emotional blow to the entire police force. The Riddler is revealing the institutions they believed in to be a sham, and the people they personally knew to be corrupt. They're more focused on the shocking contents of the photos and their ramifications, rather than where and how the photos were taken. It's harder to be objective and logical when the subject is so personal, even when the answer is obvious.
It also doesn't help that the police are constantly redirecting their attention to Batman. For the whole film, the police are getting agitated by this weird bat guy who keeps on intervening in the case, showing up to crime scenes, and is getting letters sent to him directly from the killer. Batman hasn't earned their trust yet, and that's also a source of distraction from focusing on the case.
On top of all that: just historically, incompetent police investigation has always been a massive issue when it comes to serial killer cases. Plus, in a city as corrupt and destitute as Gotham, I wouldn't be surprised if police qualifications were especially lax, and let in plenty of people unsuited for the job, due to corruption or negligence.
(That last sentence is more of an assumption, though - not as supported by examples from the film, like I feel the rest are.)
Very nice, let’s see Paul Allen’s Detective
*Very nice, let’s see Paul Allen’s Batman*
*Very nice, let's see Paul Allen's Joker*
@@skeebopbop7717 Oh wait...
Oh my god, he ever solved THE WATER MARK
@@skeebopbop7717 well we saw it and yeah…. it’s a thing… just not a very good thing…😂
Key Issues is the greatest detective he's analysing these seemingly greatest detectives
It's true
Slept on comment
In My Opinion it’s Battison, but i’m curious to see what you say because I agree with you 9/10 times.
Whaaaat? He is failed to solved so many of the riddles he was given! Took him the whole movie to figure out that Falcone was the rat. Smh. Like Riddler said he really isn't as smart as he though. Not saying he is a bad batman, but he was a bad detective.
@@RDbodybuildingreardelt He's still on his second year and has more to learn. We'll probably see him get better over time.
@@RDbodybuildingreardelt he failed to solve ONE and all the others he solved within 20 seconds
@@RDbodybuildingreardelt tf you mean he was a bad detective? He was the smartest detective who was outsmarted by the smartest villain. Doesn't make him a bad detective. He failed to solve 1 fucking riddle while the rest he solved within seconds. Shit you'd call Bale's Batman really smart for doing 1 detective work in TDK and succeeding while calling Battinson dumb for succeeding in every single riddle but failing 1. It's genuinely hilarious to me
If anything Battison wins the skinniest detective lol
battinson is really centered around batman’s detective side, where previous batman such as batfleck and bale are focused more on batman as a character
Wrong, Batfleck and Bale focused more on Batman being an action heavy hero. Battinson is very much centered around his character and his arc
@@jasonalv7436 You don't think Bale is centered around his character and arc?
@@TheMicael100 OP's comment said it as if Batfleck and Bale is the only one that is focused on Batman as a character while Pattinson is not which is definitely wrong. Never said Bale wasn't tho. Maybe in TDK and TDKR but not in BB, he definitely had a decent arc there.
@@jasonalv7436 true tho, id say batfleck was indeed yes very much more focused on being an action heavy hero (considering he doesnt have a solo film and is mostly known for his action scenes on BvS) but i think what i mean is batfleck focuses on batman as a character in the dc universe, with other superheroes (considering his appearance in movies is only with other superheroes)
and bale’s batman as a character in batman’s universe with his rogues and the batman lore
with battinson, they did focus more on his detective side and his setbacks in his first years as batman and i can say its similar with Bale’s batman in his first years with the film only focusing more and heavily on his detective side which reeves stated
@@youtubeuser6762 I personally think that The Batman had a proper and more well executed arc compared to any other Batman movie to this day. With Batman Begins being 2nd. And yeah, I think I misunderstood what you meant with them as a character. I thought you said Battinson's Batman had no character or the movie doesn't focus on his character compared to the other 2 Batman but I guess that wasn't your intention
I think Adam west because he finds the most ridiculous ways to find where the villains are or what they are going to do
Fax 😂😂😂😂
Great Scott, I agree!
😄 hahaha
The obvious answer to me is Batfleck who in his limited screen time manages to hunt down several high level criminals, find all the members of the justice league, figures out how to revive Superman and how to calm him down if needed.
Batfleck doesn't get the time to show alot of the detective work but it's obvious it has happened just in the background.
Bruh literally got played by lex ... comics batman would not have fallen for that .
@@TheGodfather-bm3ow comics Batman constantly gets tricked, have you not read anything other than the Frank Miller stuff?
Honestly the mystery should have been solved in like 15 minutes in The Batman. All the photos Riddler has of the Lounge were taken from the same vantage point. How did nobody think to look at possible places the photos could be taken from? It would lead them right to Riddler's apartment
Maybe that was intentional. Going to the vantage point for all the shots would've been extremely easy. If it wasn't intentional then the directors could've just taken all the pictures from different angles but they didn't. Pattinson's Batman is smart but not that smart. He is a detective but he makes a good amount of mistakes. This seems very similar to the end of season 3 of Sherlock. The way Moriarty beat Sherlock is by making it obvious because Sherlock wouldn't expect it to be that easy which would then make him complicate things himself.
a 15 minute movie doesnt sound like something i would pay for
Good point. I didn't think of this at all - possibly due to the photos easily being taken from the opposite roof or not even taken by the Riddler himself.
@@jasonalv7436 same i do believe it was intentional, as batman is only on his 2nd year, he still has a lot to learn from gliding and mainly employs the help of alfred in solving riddler’s riddles and the film is basically a foundation for battinson’s future relationships with his rogues and allies
@@youtubeuser6762 Even so, I still think Pattinson is the smartest Batman due to him mostly being outsmarted by a really smart character. He also has more detective moments compared to every other live action Batman so he shouldn't be considered dumb just because he made 1-3 mistakes. Can't wait for the next Batman film after all the development he went through in this one.
Battfleck vs Hardy Bane would actually be a cool fight
Excluding Pattinson (since The Batman is basically a detective film so it instantly wins), I'd pick Affleck as the next best. I know that will upset Bale's fans since most people claim Affleck didn't do much but despite Lex playing him (to be fair he played basically everyone he talks to in the film), Affleck was studying everyone constantly. The first time we see him he's doing detective/interrogation work (albeit rather brutally but he's a grumpy old man so we'll let that slide), which then transitions to him in the batcave learning about the White Portuguese, KG Beast's involvement and also studying the footage of Superman vs Zod to learn his fighting techniques. Then after copying files from his phone and learning about Lex's connections, he goes to Luthor's and does more snooping, then he tracks down the kryptonite shipment and does even more, then decrypts Lex's files and learns about the Metahumans and so on.
THEN in ZSJL we see him track down Arthur (thanks to his connections with the likes of Waller), and when he's on the plane heading home as well as with Wonder Woman in the batcave he's still studying the Metahuman files to find where everyone is, and decides who's best to find who (knowing Barry's situation would leave him to likely be excited to join Bruce, whereas Victor needed a much softer/caring touch from Diana due to his depression), and finally he's able to use his satellites to track down Steppenwolf & the Motherboxes... I dunno about anyone else, but to me that's a lot of detective work from someone who apparently didn't really do any detective work in BvS/JL.
Also a minor but important bit you missed in my opinion is when Affleck's Bruce is watching the sport fight happen, (i believe that's the same time he was encrypting the phone of KG Beast) he spoke to the fighter in his own language and told him how to beat his opponent very quickly, and it worked. None of the other Batmen spoke any foreign languages that I can recall. Even Battinson missed the bit in his film that was in spanish. The penguin had to chide him, for not understanding spanish.
@@matthewandrews3883 yes, sir. And know multiple languages is one of the top notch batman techniques in my opinion. Battinson make me sad for not knowing spanish, it was kinda disapointing
@@NUCLEARDASH yep, Affleck's Bruce spoke Russian in BvS
For me my favorite has to be Val Kilmer's subdued version of Bruce and his take on the Batman. He does good detective work in his movie and even more on the official Batman Forever Novelization which is great. I highly suggest fans give it a read, or listen to the audio book available here on RUclips for free.
The answer is simple: All of them. Because he’s Batman!
We can all agree that the Arkham Batman is the greatest detective
I don't know how good of a detective Battinson could be when he never even bothered to check the angles that the photographs Riddler was sending him were taken from. Had he checked to see if there was any evidence left at the position from which The Riddler snapped the photos, he would have discovered that they were all taken from an apartment window full of Riddler-related shit, and he would have cracked the case immediately. There's also the fact that he and Gordon and dumb enough to plug an unknown USB stick that could have been full of malware straight into Gordon's computer without running it on a virtual machine, and the computer is even connected to the internet and logged into Gordon's account. Also, as soon as Riddler killed the second important city official, you'd think the GCPD would just place all prominent officials under police protection, and the DA would have never been kidnapped. Neither Batman nor the GCPD suggest this.
When it comes to Batfleck… he spends a good portion of the movie assuming the "White Russian" is a person and trying to track him down, because he doesn't bother to just Google in and find out that it's in fact a boat until a lot later.
In my opinion, I feel Battinson also got played by Riddler just as much as Batffleck's by Luthor. Both were working unknowingly they were helping the villain. But that doesn't ruin them but makes the villain more dangerous. Until both Batmen realise the truth. Then it was over for both enemies.
Adam West. He was always asking questions.
When batman was battle those thugs in the beginning really reminded me of the combat from the Arkham games.
Adam West was the greatest Batman detective. (Batman, 1966)
Hands down
We got the 3 spidermen, now we need the 3 batmen
I think Pattinson was the best in terms of this. Not only did he do the most intelligent things, but the film portrayed it in the best way.
It’s a toss-up between Adam West and Battinson. The rest either didn’t have to solve much or failed to solve the most basic stuff.
But Battison couldn't hardly solve anything tho
The Bright Knight was simultaneously the greatest and worst detective.
It's not a toss up. Adam West is the best DETECTIVE Batman in live action
@@markmagician2471 he solved damn near every riddle within seconds and missed one
@@markmagician2471 watch the movie again lol
The greatest batman is the Adam west version batman.
Always prepared and knows basically anything.
Batfleck be like:
"You may have possibly caught Lex, but can you catch these hands?"
Battinson is the only one that actually did detective work in the movies
Did u not just watch this video?
Excellent take on this, both top picks were good possible winners.
Batfleck is definitely the most successful in his endeavors he took out his whole rogues gallery. Getting the better of Superman is no easy task. All the Batmans we're manipulated by someone but lex luthor might be the smartest human being on the planet so we could cut him a little slack there
too bad the battfleck movies are pretty shittt
@@jlyon7065 There was never a Batfleck Movie , BVS and ZSJL is a crossover movie
Yeah but Lois Lane literally figured out Lexs plan before Batman in that movie so idk if you could really cut him that much slack
Except Bruce figured out absolutely nothing about Clark himself on his own. Technically he only figured out his weakness via Lex Luthor’s guiding hand, and he didn’t seem to know that his machine guns wouldn’t do anything against him until he tried using them at the start of the fight. He missed plenty of vital info on Clark that would have been essential in understanding who he thought was his enemy, including the identity of his parents and his history on earth. When “save Martha” is what brings Bruce’s plans to a screeching halt, you know he’s failed as an experienced detective.
Obviously it's batman and Robin forever batman, he figured out how to get a batman themed credit card
Getting a Batman themed card is easy. To quote Justice league "I bought the bank" 😆
Great video! Next one should be "Which Batman is the best physical fighter?"
Batfleck nearly kill Superman if not for MARTHA.
Afleck
Adam West's Batman has solved the most cases.
Good video, totally agree
Batman without his detective prowess is just a punisher whose on super steroids that doesn’t kill…..or the FBI and DHS’ most wanted criminal
great video! you hit everything really well. definitely agree with you
Thanks !
I think by the end of a trilogy the batman will edge out the dark knight in detective work. This first case showed him the flaws he still has and he'll learn to overcome them. I'm excited to see more from this universe
I think is Adam West. He could read the letter R and my boy would desipher the villians entite plot and evil plan
Adam West cracked every case!
I think you should have put a third option in Bruce not remembering Jack saying the phrase, he was a very young boy and that was a very traumatizing event obviously, but to remember every single detail about all of that after 20 something years him not remembering that catch phrase after a while and just focusing on the parents is definitely probable especially for young traumatized child I think it should have been a third option where the trauma blinded him to certain aspects of this person
Possibly, but we know it’s something he thinks about often + the evidence was literally in the file
@@KeyIssues I do agree that he thinks about it often but even if you look at it now like your memory as a 9-year old versus now trying to remember a face or an image or phrase even trying to remember over the decades it still becomes distorted or muttered or something like that I'm just saying there is definite possibility that there is childhood trauma involved that would have distorted that, but don't get me wrong my personal favorite Batman is the Animated Series he's definitely the world's greatest detective!
And you guys put really great evidence for your augments! You did in fact change my perception of Christian Bale Batman so I consider that accomplishment! I work at a bar in a movie theater and I talk about movies a lot and so this will actually be something I can mention.
And Batman Forever firmly establishes that Bruce has repressed major details from his memory of that period in his life. It's entirely possible that he didn't remember the face or the name until Jack's catch phrase triggered the memories. (Or who knows: maybe Bruce is now misremembering the face and the name after hearing Jack Napier say something very similar to the words used by the actual killer of the Waynes.)
@@MAMoreno solid point!
The only flaw in your point is that Bruce is clearly obsessed with that moment of his life, which is a crucial part of his character, so they got that right. It's the fact that even if he had to hear the 'Dance with the Devil' phrase to relive that moment in every detail, the face of his parents' killer is something he would have never forgotten. And let's be honest here. Young Jack Napier's sadistic smile was absolutely sinister and terrifying. That image would be burned into his memory and he completely glosses over the mugshot of young Napier in the file.
They definitely angled some semblance of familiarity with Napier, which is why Bruce kept digging, but it wasn't any of the digging that jogged that memory. It was a face to face with Joker and the offchance that Joker used that phrase, which he claims he always asked his victims, but he didn't utter it once before in the film when he shot and killed both Eckhart and Grissom. So while Keaton and Nicholson are two of my favorites in their roles, Nicholson still being the best Joker in my opinion (Ledger's take was amazing and the correct call for the movie he was in, for me, Jack is much closer to Joker from the comics), the writing of the 89 film definitely fumbled it for both their characters, with Bruce/Batman being the one the writing fumbled the most.
I felt that the bale version relied on tech to much vs pattinson, but also pattinson is only in his second year and has room to grow into a bigger and better detective
The dark knight was also in his second year
I really loved The Batman. This is my favorite take on my favorite fictional character. But I agree with this assessment. Dark Knight was a better detective.
Imagine not knowing what a rat with wings is
In terms of straight up IQ and power it’s Ben. Detective capability is Pattinson, the skill and Bruce Wayne mask goes to Bale while Keaton gets OG points
This is a well put together video 👏
Thank you!
I hope Matt reeves introduce Batmans other alias in Matches Malone, a mask he wears when he needs to infiltrate certain places that batman or Bruce Wayne can't. In the comics at least
I agree TDK uses incredible detective skills, but the Batman used less tech so it was more of how Batman was as a detective.
It's shockingly easy to frame Burton Batman for murder because, well, he commits REAL murder all the goddman time, which is why I just cannot comprehend why people like that version of Batman. Same reason I don't understand people liking Batffleck.
Battinson is the acceptable detective, not great but acceptable. Did an effort to actually investigate.
Batfleck got played by Lex, enough said. Needed Lex files just to learn about other metahumans.
Bale needed to Fox, and broke the law by spying on everybody just to find Joker. Slept with the enemy, and also tricked by his father Ras.
Keaton, the evidences are no brainer and pretty obvious especially on the Joker and Penguin's identities and motives, but too late to take action. Because of poor assessment and detective skills.
Acceptable?!?! Did you even watch the film ?
Battinson isn’t supposed to be a great detective right now. He has to grow over the course of the films. Be patient.
Broke the law? Are you stupid lmao, the whole concept of batman/vigilantism is already against the law. Why is that even a factor.
@@thelonecommentor4175 right the only person that knew about it and had a problem with it was Fox
I always thought that the animated Batman was the best detective
Comparing a batman with a single movie vs other batmans having 3-4 movies on average
Such a fair comparison
now, Christan Bale was my most favorite Batman next to Michle Keeton. But after I saw the new Batman, my mind just blew for how good it was. congrats to Matt Reeves for The Batman.
I really liked the Batman and most of the other films but this video made me realize we still have yet to see the true “Worlds Greatest Detective” side of Batman. In any film where he does actually do detective work, he still ends up getting played somehow. We haven’t seen him truly get ahead of any villain. But I guess that’s what makes the story more dynamic at the same time. It would probably get boring to see him always one upping everyone
It certainly seems possible this might shift more into Robert Patterson's Batman's favour with future movies since they really seem to want to focus on the detective angle and that batman is so early in his career.
To be fair if I could get my hands on 89 Kim bassinger I wouldn’t want to read any files either.
love the video keep up the good content
Video starts at 3:54 or 6:11
If you want to skip his explanation of the criteria for the video and get straight to the point
Batfleck did it all.
He did the prep, he had the body, could fight like we've come to expect from the games, he did the super spy stuff in civies... Everybody hates on Batfleck, but he was the definitive Batman.
Losing to Lex isn't unexpected. Lex is technically smarter.
Battinson is my favourite BATMAN 😍💕❤
It is crazy how many people give Robert Pattinson Batman the greatest detective award out of all of them, even though he failed.
I mean, did people even watch the movie? He did not figure out the final riddle, he struggled with all the other riddles, and had Alfred pretty much do it all.
In my opinion, Batman is the greatest detective (MY OPINION)
Forget the rest, you forget the best, the all time great, the late Adam West!
Funny enough I think Joker or Riddler have one over on ol' Bats. They want him to play the game and sometimes they have to give him multiple hints. A normal man would fail...but Bruce isn't that much smarter than them. Anyway, that rant aside, I'd say Kevin Conroy.
ima batfleck fan so ima give my argument on why he shouldve had more points:
+lex didnt manipulate him, batman wanted the smoke from the zod fight that killed his friend. lex was intercepting and adding fuel to the fire. also lex luthor is the rival to superman, as smart as superman is strong, and succeeded in killing him in that movie. also batman was having visions of the future with real world fx so his mind was under a lot of pressure
+batman predicted the fight with superman. it ended where he placed the spear and he was well prepared for that encounter
+while batman doesnt know supermans identity, idr if he ever sees him up close other than during the car scene. his focus was how to end the world destroying alien threat. while lex made it easier to do so, this batman was able to synthesize grenades and weapons with an understanding of their effect on kryptonian physiology.
most of this is a reach but at least u sounded positive talking about batfleck lol dope vid
Good on you for including Before the Batman prequel novel.
Which did have been stricken from this entirely
I'll give Battison a break since he has only one movie out, but Bale's Batman takes the cake here. Using the criteria from the video Bale's Batman wins by far. In Batman Begins he works to get evidence for the police to use against the mob before even taking down Falcone. He then gives Rachel the 'leverage' needed to get Judge Faden out of the picture with pictures of his affairs. Damn fine detecting in my book, having all the evidence before the crime. Also, in Dark Knight you have to take into consideration some things. The time between BB and DK, it's been 1 year, and Batman and the GCPD have basically taken down the mob, in 1 year! Granted in the movie they are in the final steps, but that is hell of progress in 1 year given the mob has been in control of Gotham for decades. Then enters Joker. The Dark Knight is using every detective skill in existence. Did you notice that Batman was running a facial recognition scan on Joker's face? Every American has their face on record, either by a Driver's License , Passport, or Military ID. Also, Gordon mentions that there are no print records or dental records of him. He even says that his clothing has no labels meaning they cant track where he buys his clothes. The Joker is literally a ghost in the Dark Knight. Pretty hard to track a ghost, but Batman does a decent job at least. In DKR he is going up against the entire league who he thought doesn't exist any more. Damn hard to fight an enemy you don't know exist and who have been planning for 10 years (with inside knowledge). Maybe the next Battison movies will shed more light on his skills, but right now Bale's Batman wins.
"Bruce decides to take in this adult man as his ward" I spit my drink out laughing 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
None of the movies ever do a very in depth job showcasing how Batman is deductive and also inductive detective.
Batbale - Combat Skills
Batfleck - Physique
Battinson - Intelligence
Go Back and Adam West was always doing some investigating in the Bat Cave.
Ben couldn’t know because the glasses hypnotize people in the comics
I love how Bruce didn't know what that tucker was until near the end when Ramirez the beat cop explains to him how his uncle would use one for work. Because Bruce is filthy rich rather than working class, he'd never had a use for anything like it before, thus his confusion as to what exactly it was used for aside from bludgeoning the mayor's skull.
A lot of the mysteries Batman solves in the dark knight trilogy are solved by technology. I think that makes his feats less impressive than Batinson
I agree, but I also want to point out that Batman failing and being so close but not quite getting there is so important for the story. The Batman is about how he fell short, how vengeance got in the way. He learned about the involvement of his father and was blinded by his lust for vengeance, but he importantly learned from the end of the movie that he had to be more than that. In other words, I think Batbale wins against the Batison from the start of the movie, but loses against Batison at the end. Which means you could still very much argue that Batbale would take the win by the rules you set, so again, I agree, but its something to think about.
I honestly feel like Batton (Michael Keaton Batman) and Batfleck could have had a great potential in detective work in their respective portrayals and story arc had the studio executives didn't caused interference to their trilogies.
Next up:
Who is the toughest alfred
Battison's taught Bruce how to fight.
Physically might be Jeremy irons. Mentally it is Michael caine.
@@MuthukrishnanBellie what makes you say Michael Cain
@@dobi287 Exposition. He's the only live action Alfred whose past has been explored a bit.
@@MuthukrishnanBellie bc he was in the military? The jewel thief story?
Affleck's batman, yes, was manipulated by Lex Luthor, but hey, Lex is canonically the smartest man in the world, so it's understandable
Affleck single handedly infiltrated a high security facility , stole data regarding meta humans ,learnt about superman weakness , devised a God Killing weapon.
Bale used one brick to analyze the interior to match the fingerprint when the shooter loaded his gun to finally revealing Joker's plan.
Bale also designed the sonar system turning every phone into a receiver and tracking Joker.
Pattinson developed a contact lens to capture and analyze footage and also solved each riddle to finally catch Riddler.
I my opinion Batman is the best detective
this made me appreciate the dark knight way more than i already did
1:11 Bale has the filthiest bat suit, the way it was tactical based. Ben’s suit is nasty to tho with it’s texture! Just yoked n exaggerated with the classic grey Colorway and small ears for that cartoon/comic thickness. And I’ve always appreciated Clooney suits, they were spot on the sporty action figure suits from back in the day, I miss those they use to come with so many designs and accessories like iron man today. Also Lewis Wilson 🤣
Robert Patterson in the one out of all this batman version to uses his detective skills most in the flim
To me battinsons Ratta Alda thing really messed me up. He seemed smart bit definitely has so so much to learn. Rookie detective
Personally I think the Punisher that had John Travolta showcased skills that blows batman away. Shattering the Antagonists world and inner circle using subtrafuge and intelligence before shooting the Sh** out of everyone that was left.
I think the Batman will become a better detective with the new joker
I dont agree that Joels movies are in the same canon as Burtons at all regardless of the things that suggest so.We learn that Bruce married Selina and now we will see him older in the Flash,i dont think its gonna fit with Joels movies and propably intentionally so.
How Kilmer aged to become Clooney is beyond me lmao
I do know the writers of Forever and Batman&Robin propably intended them to be a continuation but everyone else at DC seems to say otherwise
We don't see that he married Catwoman. That was on the Crisis on Infinite Earths set but never in the show. The Flash movie seems to be in the other split timeline... maybe. That has absolutely no effect on the Schumacher films, which will always be in the same universe as the Burton films even if there's sequels to the Burton films that aren't connected to Schumacher.
As I said, it’s a split timeline regardless.
@@KeyIssues Indeed. Batman Forever is a sequel to Batman Returns.
@@probot6515@Key Issues Oooh do you two want a room?
@@newhybrid101 I mean, you're essentially trying to argue the equivalent of Terminator 3-4 being set in a different universe to Terminator 1-2 because they made the alternative sequel Dark Fate.
Since both are intended to be sequels, they share those same exact events in their individual universes.
I've seen people say HBO's Watchmen isn't in the same universe as the comic when it's a direct sequel. Sure, Moore might not consider it as part of his canon, but the events of the book are indeed canonical to the show.
This is just how canon works. Same with Star Wars too. Legends canon and Disney canon are both different universes that share identical events in I-VI and The Clone Wars.
No Adam West? Solved some of the most ridiculous shit 😂😂
I feel like the newest one is a true detective
Honestly I agree with the rankings
Has anyone noticed that RDJ's Sherlock Holmes and Robert Pattinson's The Batman had a similarity? Check the scene in Sherlock Holmes where he was writing stuff on the floor, trying to figure out who's the mysterious antagonist doing "black magic" stuff. Bruce was doing the same thing in his house after the explosion in the Wayne Manor.
There was I in 2015 thinking "awesome finally with youtube I wont spend time with commercials"
Batfleck for sure drops Bane on his head. Unless he gets some of that Burton verse venom.
Glasses are actually something that can change the way people see someone they don't know. That's one of the reasons they work for Clark. He also acts completely different from Superman. Both Christopher Reeve and Henry Cavill went out in public as Superman and Clark Kent and as Superman, they were always recognized as Christopher Reeve or Henry Cavill respectively. But with the glasses on and the loose fitting dress suit, nobody recognized them at all. There's a study that looks into the subject of people being able to recognize others they don't personally know wearing glasses and not wearing glasses and even in side by side photos, people don't recognize people they don't know personally more often than they do.
As viewers/comic readers, we're privy to Superman's identity, so yeah, it seems like a dumb thing, but there is actual truth to rhe disguise.
I would agree. Honestly I hate how people were saying that Battison was the first Batman to actually do detective work when all of them did some kind of detective work, some better than others. Like how do people gloss over the whole Batman Begins of Batman actually doing detective work and finding the connections to crime bosses and actually leaving evidence to finally convict them even if they're paying off judges? Then the whole Dark Knight Joker detective stuff is crazy misleading with his plan is insane. Like how do people look at these 2 movies and say Battison is the first time they did detective work. Maybe the first time they focus most the movie on the detective work but this has happened in other movies. However I will say that with just 1 more movie Battison will probably easily become the better detective, but right now it's either a tie for me or Christan Bale is slightly the best right now
I mostly agree but don't necessarily feel it's fair to saddle the Burton Batman with the Schumacher Batman's inferior showings. They're honestly completely different characters in the way they act, react and handle things. Hell this is why most people don't even consider Forever or B&R when comparing them.
Also should we really consider what goes on in Bruce's personal space as part of his detective skill? After all, in that sphere, most people are blinded by their own sense of security and comfort.
Similar to how a real life seasoned detective might be good at his job but fails to realize his wife is cheating on him or is planning on divorcing him. He's just too into his case/his job to realize other things are happening.
Otherwise we might consider:
*Batfleck not just not recognizing Clark as Superman but also neglecting the overwhelming evidence from all over the world that Superman is a force for good and instead willingly and deliberately ignoring all that and playing into his own bias, following his emotions in order to conclude he has to kill Superman.
*Bale's Batman inability to even realize that Rachel wasn't even into him, or the fact he spent literally months inside the League of Shadows but somehow was unable to work out that they're killers before he was literally asked to murder someone, not to mention getting blindsided by Thalia.
*Battinson, despite being consumed by the murder of his parents and dwelling both on them and their untimely death, apparently in all this time had never worked out the actual circumstances of their death, or their shady past, to the point it completely took him by surprise and shattered his world view for a moment.
I always thought it was pretty smart how Val's Batman immediately knew to use the guards ear device to open the vault. Also, just because there are references to prior events doesnt mean that schumachers Batman is the same as Burton's, in the same way that Scott Snyder's Batman isn't necessarily the same as Morrison's. Not sure I agree with how the first 4 films were combined.
Id say its Robert Pattison, but also we should consider the experience of each Batman. 89- Batman and Robin seems to have already been established for years, Christian Bale in Begins was just starting, Batfleck was a 20 year vet, and Pattison was on year 2
All that said its between Bale and Pattison
What is the song you use at 16:44? The bass sounds so good!
Batman 2022 wins for me, but we can't judge it to the full extent, bc this is only the first movie in what's going to have sequels. I think I heard somewhere it's gonna be a trilogy. But that's only year 2 Batman,and he's already a good detective, so imagine him fine tuning himself in future movies.