@@rneedham667 yes ""youre degree"", you talk worse English than the Turkish people in Germany speaks German. Well done. How can ameridumbs have worse English than someone who speaks English as a third language? Wow that's just hilarious, like what are you telling customers at mc donalds? Whats youre order? You're want some fries with youre burger? omfg LMFAO
Why do we act like teenagers from previous generations were these 145 IQ geniuses who looked up to philosophers and scientists ? They’re teenagers. The Kardashian’s are pretty and entertaining. They’re supposed to like dumb shit. And I’m not even sure the average kid looks up to the Kardashian’s. I think that’s pretty rare. Maybe they like the their makeup or clothing but I don’t see the problem with that. More kids are getting educated. More kids have progressive political views. I promise you the Kardashian’s are not holding this generation back.
@@straight_outta_jail ; Young people will always be retards, only if those of us whom are supposed to be a adults, keep acting just as, or even more retarded than the young people. Young people have a tendency to mimic the adults in their lives; hence your clue as to why so many young people seem to be retarded.
@@newworld3844 considering that automation and A.I. hold the potential of bringing cataclysmic events to humanity, i agree with you that the kardashians are not that big of a deal for this and/or coming generations
Regarding the value of education, we really need to get sports out of schools and form clubs outside education like they do in Europe? Why? In most schools athletes have a higher worth both socially and economically to the school than intelligent students who want to attend university. The result is that many of the athletes and students belittled the nerds! Why study when your peers only reward you if you have a ball in your hand! Most students can't name a Nobel prize laureate, but most people can say who Babe Ruth was, for example!
@fredrika27 This assumes that athletes can't be intelligent students and vice versa. This is not the case. Also, that is quite a ridiculous reason for wanting to get sports out of school. Schools want good students just as much as good athletes. Who do you think there are more of? 30 guys on the football team or 2,000 students paying tuition?
@@calebr7199 actually the 30 people playing basketball makes the school so much money per person also the students are paying for a service which splits out the payout whiles the basketball player gives the university straight cash
The Education system really is flawed. I’d love for you to look into it. Especially the cost cutting measures like how teenagers are forced to go to to schools at early times despite sleep researchers conclusions.
There are many problems but one of the easiest, though more expensive solutions, is pre-k education. As the cost of child rearing increases parents have less time to nurture in the way that they'd like, funding pre-k would be a massive boost. www.thoughtco.com/importance-of-early-education-2774216 Investment in education benefits society as a whole.
Yes, it's terribly flawed. From removing the Humanities from our Common Core to the standardized test obsession to authoritarian settings to the overemphasis on sports and social achievements, it's disgusting and does not improve peoples' lives. All our public schools do is make you accept that you're a menial worker under someone elses' authority for life.
OMG, are you kidding? Poor babies have to get up and go to school. Wah! No, the main problem is parents who don't encourage and help their kids to go to college. Parents who should never be parents. My dad quit school at 15 to work to help support his family, but he wanted all of his children to go to college. Only 1 out of 5 did not go, and she's the only Republican.
@cj p Honestly, you're the one who seems butthurt and on the offensive. If it literally takes a copy and paste to disprove what you are saying, which by the way is called referencing and presenting data with factual evidence, then you need to come up with better arguments.
Add stress from poor health care, poor nutrition, lack of quality time from parents working multiple jobs not to mention lead in the water , these restricting cognitive develipement in children, and the problems of poverty compound themselves.
My mother sometimes used a very old quote about capitalists and clergy: "You keep them dumb, I'll keep them poor." Seems little has changed since that quote was invented in the 19th century.
There are plenty of people leaving college without any critical thinking ability because textbook companies make the powerpoints, write the exams, and dictate what is taught (mostly by untrained grad students who find out what classes they are teaching a week or two before classes start).
True. My Differential Equations was a graduate student whom they told to give this class ONE week before classes began. At first it was horrible becauae he didnt really have any lesson plans prepared... But he has adpated by now. In my electromechanics class, the proffesor didnt show up the first day of class. We called the engineerimg department and asked if she was coming and it turns out... SHE DIDNT EVEN KNOW she was giving this class 😂 Next class another proffesor came o give the class.
Remember the day in which parents worked hard labor jobs, just so that their children had the opportunity to attend higher education and have a better job and easier life? And there was a day, you could not go further up the ladder, unless you had some paper stating you received a degree in something.. Then came the Bush family.. and then came Cheney who attempted to raid the funding system..
@@shannonbloom4133 I was still playing in the dirt during those days, thankfully. But I do remember Cheney trying to divert money and basically bankrupt that specific department and change the system where bank and investors would have direct access for student loans. And I remember the hell one of my family members went through in attempting to figure out where all the money went in national HUD after little W's reign. Files had been shredded and documents missing. And I remember the long lasting affect his No Child Left Behind program rendered to several graduating classes. The result was a general dumbing down of America. That's what Republicans do. They don't see that educating the masses makes a nation stronger. They don't want any of their precious money paying for services that everyone else pays for. They send their kids to Notre Dame, to Baylor and other private schools to be better than everyone else. How dare someone from poorer background be smarter and work their way to the top. They don't belong there.. Darwinism in action, not social Christianity..
@@seanwjones07 what specifically was all bullshit? My father was a laborer.. He dug ditches and poured concrete his entire life after serving in the war. My mother was a homemaker who gardened, canned, sewed all our clothes, kept house. They like other couples realized it wasn't right to damn their children to a life of hard servitude like they'd had and broken their bodies. My father had to retire early because of that He drew a small union pension when he did retire along with fighting for his social security benefits. They fought to keep their heads above water until those duly earned benefits came to fruition. Until then, we hunted wild lettuce in the woods for mama to cook up with a pot of beans and pan of cornbread. We would dumpster dive for thrown away day old produce to make cabbage soup. When open air dumping was still legal, we'd prowl through items people had thrown away, take home and clean so it could be sold at the flea markets. They did all that so I could go have a better life. That's what parents do.
ursaltydog I’m talking about the lies American society told the people. We had crooks and plutocrats destroying the country while they kept gas lighting the people on if you work hard and go to school you’ll have a better life than your parents. It clearly didn’t turn out that way with the worst income inequality since the gilded age.
Thanks for the insult. Like I don't get enough off Trump supporters. You must have thought I was one having a go for no reason. Not so just a harmless observation that he wasn't actually in the video
I feel for you. My grade school in the seventies had 45 students to one teacher no aides! It was a private school. The teachers were always frazzled and stressed out due to this overwhelming ratio
Thing is, from what I've seen getting a college degree in the US can be an absolute joke. When an American friend of mine was doing his homework for college I asked him to show me some of the problems and assignments he was given every now and then and it was mostly essays, multiple choice tests and math problems so simple anyone above 9th grade could solve them. And this guy was going for a degree in Biology. In fact I've written up an essay or two for him when he was hung over and would rather catch up on sleep (nothing else to do during night shift) and he could just hand those in unedited and get a pretty good grade even though I knew nothing about the topic initially and don't speak English as my first language. Nobody noticed or cared.
@@Fordragon Maybe, but this was not some online course he was doing. It was a supposedly well-known college somewhere in MO, with classes and a campus and everything. Obviously a sample size of one doesn't say too much, but I was still somewhat shocked because I had to do way more and way more difficult stuff at the German equivalent to US high school. I struggled to comprehend how some were failing those same classes according to said friend.
I have two questions What college is he going to because we have some that are way worse then others and is it a community college two where is he at because if hes a first year or maybe even second for me i felt like it was all catchup stuff for the people who didn't get a good education in highschool then we stated to get much more advanced throughout the second year in the medical field at least i really think our highschool education is what needs to be fixed we pack so much stuff into there that people will not need to know in the future that they dont even learn all of it because theres no time to in highschool i remember getting home and having to work on a paper almost every night and then 50-100 questions in my physics and math classes which dosent allow everyone to learn the material because they just hold the information for a few weeks or months until there exams and then forget it all
@@ottoernst3735 Sorry, I don't remember which one he went to, and I don't want to talk badly about a decent college by mistake, especially if the qualitative differences between them are as pronounced as people say. I do remember however that it was mostly during his second year there that I occasionally "helped" out.
@@Krawurxus yeah man, the differences between universities here can be very drastic. Even for well-known schools, you're not going to get as good of an education in the New Mexico state university system as you will in the California one, for example. It varies a lot from state to state, so we have 50 very different quality education systems throughout the country.
@Karen Reed I'm not an American and I don't live in America. I already went to University here, thank you very much, albeit for a degree in a completely different field than Biology, which is what my friend was studying, and I was merely talking about the one brush with higher education in the US that I had, stating my observations in this one particular case. Which is why, as others replying to my comment have already observed, I said that it CAN BE a joke, not that it nessecarily is. Also, that person I mentioned was complaining about the material being too easy as well, fearing he would be insufficiently prepared for the lab job he was looking to get into.
I got 98th percentile on my high school cognitive test. Now I have a master's degree and have lived in a homeless shelter because I'm medically limited to a desk job and people don't want to interview me for them.
"The problem is education correlates with income and income correlates with all kinds of different kinds of divides in society." Hasn't that always been the case? It seems to me what has changed is we are losing more jobs that pay a living wage and don't require higher education and this is having political ramifications. It seems a perfectly understandable reaction to resent people who have the intellectual tools and financial opportunities to have a comfortable life when what was considered middle class is no longer available to you. I don't think the answer is to push people with lower IQ into higher education but to create meaningful work for more citizens that allows them to meet their basic needs. The Republicans have tapped into this frustration in a way Democrats have not, which is a successful strategy because, whether you like it or not, politicians are not incentivized to solve problems but to get elected. ANDREW YANG 2020.
There are more jobs for people who are skill-less but adapt faster to basic skills or are able to make good normative decisions (ie; managers), then those who spend 4 years learning how to develop skills. Skill based jobs are lacking and, even worse, far too dynamic in the modern artificial economy. There are people walking around that can do calculus that work the same jobs as people with GEDs. The neglect of the mid-high level skill-set should be cause for concern.
Education is my 3rd most severe issue in America (behind Climate Change #1 and Corruption #2) because in America we have not moved on from a system that was established in the Industrial Age to churn out factory workers almost 90 YEARS AGO! America has consistently ranked in the bottom of 1st world countries and 30th-26th in countries that have public education at all. I think critical thinking should be taught in grade school, not when you reach collage and really have to rethink how you view logic and people after you are an adult. But then Republicans would have less suckers to scam and we can't have that now can we?
I remember when my family could not afford the money for the standardized testing forms in high school. It was the first time that I realized that my fate had already been decided by my parents income.
I know, the urban rural divide is destroying America. Right now urban areas are doing well because of education, and rural areas are economically depressed because of a lack of an education
Many do not attend higher education, because at a high school level, students are already divided into "university versus technical" path.. Basically labeling students as college material, and those who would do best in technical pathways, not attending college or only attending for a certificate program. Our junior college attempts to identify prospective students who haven't received enough education on the high school level in order to succeed in college, and those numbers are going up because the education system does what they can to get by. It realistically doesn't have anything to do with cognitive abilities nor intelligence, but the ability to have retained basics... More incoming freshmen are forced to take remedial classes (or refresher courses as colleges don these more sensitive labels) merely to bring the students up to a level to handle junior college course requirements. One cannot show cognitive abilities unless they can show they have retained fundamental knowledge in math, science, spelling and grammar. Incoming students don't even know what a footnote is, two basic ways to prepare a composition, mastered algebraic formulas and basic statistics, have some knowledge of biology, chemistry and earth science. Kindergarten level is expected to already comprehend certain 5 letter words and write them correctly in sentences, to know and operate an internet browser. So, this educational divide will become greater and people will be left behind in poverty who are older, who have worked labor jobs their entire lives and are either too old, bodies infirm at young ages or cannot be reeducated for higher technical jobs.
The thing is that not everyone actually wants to go to college to learn. Sure there are fields that need education such as doctors and engineers but what has happened to the real pursuit of knowledge. People no longer go to college becuase they want to learn but because they want a higher paying job. Knowledge is second to money for them
I would argue that many of the students who took the Tech School route are doing better financially than those with Masters in Modern Dance. If we're making economic achievement the focus of a successful life.
@@demonvictim I can see that of some professions... It's always been there, the lure of money over substance. Some do it because it's what their fathers or mothers expect of them, to follow in their footsteps. When I went to college, I wanted to learn how to help others. I do that everyday now. But, college was a totally different world. A way to meet and experience new people whom otherwise if staying in one's little town, in our own box, we wouldn't get to know. And to know there were others like me, and I wasn't alone in the world. I almost didn't finish.. almost. But I toughed it out and glad I did, no matter the manner in which I had to do it.
@@dougn2350 They might be for awhile money-wise. But their industry depends heavily upon service industry and how the nation is doing economically as a whole. At least those with Masters in Modern Dance aren't sheltered. to the point they believe the only people who deserve jobs, who deserve medical care, who deserve freedom are themselves. But that goes back to Humanities versus Science or Business degree argument. If my cousin had had at least a degree in "something" he was told, he'd have made district manager (his own had a bachelors in History). Because he left college 30 credit hours short to help his mother and siblings, no matter he'd spent 35 years in retail and managed 5 stores at one time when other managers quit, no matter he knew bookkeeping backward and forwards, no matter he saved the company 500,000 dollars worth of Shrink in one quarter, he was continually passed up for promotion. And so he languished as a salaried slave making the company money until his back went out. Where was their loyalty then? Nowhere. They replaced him with much less quality to start the deadly cycle over again. Promoted brats who hadn't worked a hard day in their lives pushing freight, dealing with personnel issues or difficult customers. On top of that, the company in appearing EEOC, hired and promoted minorities with less education and with as little as a year of service. And we wonder why those in the service industry and technical path think the way they do about minorities. If my cousin hadn't had the college he'd had, been exposed to race relations while growing up in Memphis TN during the civil rights era with a mother who marched with Martin Luther King, he'd have a hardened heart and Trump supporter too.
ursaltydog I know a few ppl who manage to make it to college in their 30's and today they have multiple degrees with good jobs. So older ppl are not entirely lost, it just depends on you. The person is you want that education and if it's for you.
Intelligent commentary. Thank you for uploading. Additional note: The I.Q. was developed by the military to determine which recruits would be absolutely useless and be unable to be trained to do ANYTHING useful at all. It was found that an I.Q. less that 86 and the recruit could not be trained to do anything useful at all IN THE ARMY. The I.Q test was only developed for the significance of the negative scores. This corresponds to the observations about "economic success" mentioned in the commentary.
I'm a multiple STEM degree graduate and I can tell you there isn't any political bias. Numbers and data speak for themselves. Republicans will say climate change is a hoax and they will say that as an opinion. However, isotopic chemistry, advanced mathematics and physics are not based on opinion. There is so much false equivalency going on. The straight forward linear stuff is easy to do. It is the multivariate, non-linear data sets that are difficult to understand. The jury is still out but I have a hunch it will quite some time before AI can solve those kinds of problems due to boundaries put into the problem. Humans can dream whereas AI doesn't have that ability...yet. IBM Watson can win at chess, but chess has a distinct set of rules (boundaries).
Landwy The politicization has occurred in the humanities departments, not the stem departments. These subversives haven’t yet worked out how to undermine the stem programs except by lowering standards for affirmative action cases. The humanities are completely compromised by these Neo-Marxists, feminists theory queer theory race theory, it’s truly disgusting how far we’ve fallen in the last hundred years. They are the ones pushing the pseudoscience regarding race and gender we find so commonplace in mainstream culture today.
@@neosav7476 The "subversives" are the anti-intellectual right-wingers who want a dumbed down America, because ignorant voters are more likely to be Republican voters.
@@neosav7476 - I'll wager that if you teleported a million people to an uninhabited planet capable of supporting human life and wiped their memories, you could come back in 1000 years and find their science books would be much the same as ours at the same stage of technological development, but their humanities books would be completely different.
And america is in no ways founded as a democracy but just as many if not more dipshit act like it is. I like the secular laws but a democracy is the fastest way to implement one.
David living in the Ivy League area (Boston) is in a case by itself. These schools are not about a well rounded education, but rather finding communication circles. The basic types of students that go to Ivy League Schools are: 1). Brilliant student (even less of those at Ivy League schools than in earlier times). 2). Legacy student (son or daughter of a former Ivy League graduate). A much higher proportion than in earlier times. 3). Bought your way in. (Jared Kushner, George Bush, etc.). A much higher percentage than in earlier times. 4). Helicopter parents forced their kids to regurgitate facts to pass tests. This is the Singapore or Chinese method; versus Finland with emphasis on critical thinking skills. 5). Major in finance of some other mostly easy field of study to say they have a degree from Harvard. 6). ??. (Please contribute). Don't get me wrong, but especially at the graduate level for instance, Harvard's Medicine, Government, and Law schools are top notch. Trump got a degree from Penn State by using a back door to get in. Wharton was a terrible school at the time Trump attended there, but it was a way of getting a Penn State diploma. Wharton is now a first rate school. A STEM graduate will in most cases be a better graduate and able to function in a data driven world better than a sociology major. Remember, it was unemployed physics graduates that became wealthy day traders and not finance or economics majors. The divide between Ivy League and state schools might get larger in the future. Ivy League Schools are all about building communication circles and attendance. State schools offer a far better education, but state and federal monies are waining. These students will receive on-line classes instead of residency at campuses at Ivy League schools. Wealthy Republicans are willing to put junior in the expensive Ivy League school, but are unwilling for their taxes to go up so state schools can provide a good education for the children of peons.
Look whats up is Social Studies, History and what used to be called Civics. We are under the gross misconception that Democracy is an artefact, a noun like a consumer purchase, instead of a fragile messy process that demands an ethical commitment from society; that demands a degree of participation; that demands an informed electorate; that demands an enlightened prioritization of PUBLIC EDUCATION. America has long since failed in these areas. Now that a recent Stanford study has declared that America is no longer actually a Democracy but an Oligarchy: We are paying the price.
Ah yes, dread the lackluster social engineers. I can hear Putin blustering against exceptionalism. (And Trump demanding: “But I get to be president. Right?)
I blame the internet, starting 25 years ago and further back, people came home from work and after dinner they tinkered with some kind of hobby as the televsion droned on in the background. Now, people spend their entire day, even at work or school, with an electronic contraption in their hand, watching or reading the most insane "theories" about everything from soup to nuts, making them think they "know" what's going on in the world but in actuality dumbing them down even further. In another 25 years no one will know anything without their connection to the internet.
David do a show about the congressional committee that investigated the tax exempt " educational " foundations in the fifties and they where approved in the 20's and see how the truth was crushed and the foundations were allowed to go forward and subjugate our educational system.
There is no such thing as “liberal indoctrination” in our colleges and universities. None whatsoever. That problem is rooted in K-12 education that teaches American mythology as history and then when you get to college and find out it was just a bunch of rah rah nationalist nonsense, that might appear like indoctrination when young Americans go against the nationalist narrative. But that doesn’t make it liberal indoctrination. The problem is that all of this is deliberate, which speaks to your closing remarks about public education being starved in favor of charter schools.
This makes me feel somewhat better. I tested out as a Promethian as a child. The actual score doesn't really matter. But because of the way my life has gone and un-diagnosed (until about 5 years ago) Asperger's Syndrome. Now I live at home with my parents and have been unemployed for 4 years. My parents are elderly and need some care. I can't get a job locally because everyone assumes I'll move if something better comes along or that "I'm too smart to be here" (Rural Saskatchewan). So, no, having a high IQ is not always a ticket out of wherever. But knowing that my life outcomes are to some degree not completely my fault helps. Thanks.
He brings up that the US produces a lot of degrees but it falls behind when it comes to STEM. So The Logical question would be what are these degrees in? Because having degrees in fields that don't produce is not a sign that the population is more educated. It would be a sign that the mediocre has become the new standard.
Kind of reminds me of a Star Trek episode, "The Cloud Minders" where there is an elite class of intellectuals living in a Utopian city and the general population works in the mines to support it. I mean, obviously the intent of the episode was to comment on elitism, but funny how it's almost literally manifesting itself now.
I once commented that realigions are where lazy minds go to prosper ..... aspiring to being gullible and ignorant at the same time is not a good life choice ..... god if you will, doesn't want you to waste your life , if your wrongly thinking your right .
I actually think learning religion is a great placeholder for certain people to prosper. For instance back in the day whether or not the earth was flat while it was wrong had absolutely no effect on a farmers daily life and allowed them to not have worries. There are certainly dangerous results from religion such as the witch hunts and human sacrifice but the roles that religion take today is mostly centered around death and what it brings. Unless you are determined to find out what happens after death it is better to set up your own image of death and keep it in the back of your mind. Im against organized religion becuase it tends to be used to control people but people being spiritual and open minded is a great thing
This is simply untrue. Some of the most intelligent people I've met were religious. A person's religious beliefs is completely independent of their ability to reason and think critically.
Through out history many top scientists came from the church. It was an institution with a lot of resources and had the best education. I think the educational divide isnt Red and Blue, it is rich and poor. Brilliant minds are not coming from public schools of Democrat run big cities.
When a country boast itself of being number one again and again, how can that nation improve ? If the whole identity of United States is that they are the exceptional country among others, how can you think that America is wrong in any instances ?
trump supporters as a whole most likely don't have passports. They are on the inside of a bubble looking out, rather that a well travelled worldly individual on the outside looking in. The ignorance has led to a destroyed america already and that is how such a buffoon such as trump got voted in. The US has mostly good people within its Borders, but being taken down the drain by the intellectually clueless. I truly hope the states can turn itself around. It will take decades.
@@truthplease7137 Americans as a whole do not have that many passports but the way US has stagnated in the last 40 - 50 years is astonishing. They were a nation that was due to circumstances like never been bombed in WW 2, ahead of everyone,. Japan, two nuclear bombs, Germany bombed out, England also, other European nations were building their infrastructure out of constant need of everything. Now their schools are prisons, now their damns and water pipes are crumbling, the Flint water situation is not a bug but a feature, the bridges stays broken because that money has been given to the Pentagon and constant war machine, that keeps on grinding with a budget that is larger than next seven largest military budgets around the world, combined. And they still use checks to get their salary and pay their groceries with them too.
@@truthplease7137 I am a Finn, so cold weather bonds us :) Yea, we had our cities bombed but we build them anew and had all kinds of shortages, first coca-cola came 1952. So comparing the booming US economy and wealth in the 50s to other WW2 nations is like that they were from an other planet. "Victim of terrorism within itself" Oh, they sure are but how paranoid they are of their own government is ludicrous. Someone wants common sense gun laws, nope, they are going to take all our guns away..lults NRA wanted that blind people could buy guns, see, its their right.... I am not coming to USofA, too many guns.
Matthew 19:21 “Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me.”
"Social mobility is hard" - in the USA, yes. The land of the "American Dream" is being left behind by other countries and other systems. Have a guess which ones......
If you had a good example why not just share it? I'd guess you're talking about Germany and Japan, although your smugness alludes to some other incorrect answers.
The education system in the US needs to be revived. It needs to be funded everywhere so there can be a chance of equality. Should not depend on local tax base. People need to learn for a lot more reasons than just a job. More to life than just work. At least that is the way it should be.
I'm one of those foreign students who have benefited greatly from Uni. My teachers all recommended I go to the army due to my poor English. But I pushed through, with the help of my parents and now I'm in business school in AUC one of the top 50 universities in the world.
just throwing this out there... Having studied at a couple of different tertiary institutions, perhaps the biggest benefit I got was the change to my thinking. There are a number of attributes people in academia seem to exhibit, some being: The ability to accept being wrong The ability to change their mind A commitment to lifelong self improvement Critical Thinking - that old chestnut Problem solving Being prepared to take calculated risks Prioritising truth over belief These are not unique to academia, but they do seem more prevalent there. Students develop these skills through a combination of structured and social learning (citation required :)), and perhaps these attributes are important in their future success - not just the knowledge or the qualifications they gain? After all, look how many people succeed in industries completely unrelated to their field of study. Conversely, maybe it is a lack of these skills that prevents some non-tertiary educated people from continuing to grow as individuals, and this, in turn, puts socially imposed limits on their potential? Could this be another cause or form of social disparity: learned behaviours, world views, and expectations? Could it be that, by denying some people this experience (or enabling them to avoid it) we are creating inequity and inequality based, essentially, upon the perception of their place in the world?
Coming from a very poor rural school in the south with a graduating class of 44 kids and only 29 of us had the grades to graduate at all... yeah there are a lot of people who do view education as a bad thing. The students themselves tend to not care and their parents don't care either. That was the biggest problem my class faced was those 15 students who were very disruptive and pointedly rude who faced no recourse at home. If they were punished in school the parents would blame the teachers and staff. My senior year my English teacher told me I didn't even need to come. He'd mark me as there even if I didn't want to come in since that was the only class I had where my attendance was taken. Because the good students by that point were all ready to be done. But our classes average reading level was 7th grade and at least 2 people in my class had a reading average below third. They were very proud of that fact. He had to put all his efforts into reigning in the wild nature of the class and attempt to get these students ready that he pointedly couldn't really give us the time or the focus to work with the students who didn't need it. I found out a while later that my school wasn't accredited when we graduated. It only couldn't close because there was no other school to send us to. Where I am from education was massively under valued and still is. My experience with my public education made me not want to do college. Not that I could have anyway because my family was poor. We couldn't always put food on the table and I had to start working when I turned 16 to help pay for food, electricity, the mortgage etc... The success of education I think depends on where your starting point is and the continued support during the process. Personally I'd love to go to college. But I see all my friends and coworkers where I work who have degrees. They cant use them to get jobs that allow them to afford to live alongside making those student loan payments. My job didn't use to require a college degree and now it does and it pays less now than when I started.
We see the same thing here in Canada and when you mention the long term effect on the well being of the country you, and by you I mean me, are met with blank stares. I'm not sure why no one has ever even seemed to understand that there could be a connection between the two.
@@zacharekski9385 Exactly our point. Corporations are transnational and they determine government policy but many blame the government rather than corporations for the situation we find ourselves in.
When they say "Democracy dies in darkness" this is what it should mean. The darkness of ignorance and non-education. The problem is we have people making mor ethan 10 times as much as other people, so their kids get a pretty huge headstart in life with connections etc.
You brough up some importa nt and valid points here. I m in Software engineering, and I have notice the rising salaries for professionals in the tech industry in general. I think salaries are almost too high in this area. I realize how this sounds....
The core problem is that our system encourages the most intelligent to pursue economic goals, yet we do not compensate educators. Thus, the increasing demand for teachers as more children attend school is filled more and more by less intelligent people. As more people attend post-secondary education as a matter of course, people who should be teaching high school are teaching college, and so on down the line. The problem is exacerbated, and we end up with a vicious cycle, ending up with the worst (least intelligent) teachers teaching in K-6, where we arguably need the best in order to give the kids a solid foundation of HOW to think. I know it's a gross generalization, and I'm not knocking those conscientious teachers who are trying their best, but we really need to refocus our societal priorities.
This is something I definitely felt should be talked about more. It's difficult as liberals we want to help the unfortunate but in cases we are enabling natural selection to be canceled out which causes this divide. Additionally lack of mental health help can increase the odds of lower intelligent children. Education is setup as a one size fits all etc. This is another massive problem.
The US has always been anti-intuition, pro-rationality - although cognitive scientists are now agreeing that IQ is not all there is to rationality. But intuition neglected has a special role in creativity and invention, especially when it's combined with reason/rationality. However, such a (modular/multi-process) model of mind would go against what the intelligentsia would like to uphold, so they strive for models of thinking that dichotomy reasoning and intuition, and paint intuition as a source of errors. And for 'intelligence' (for lack of a better word) tests, we still use the working memory paradigm (reason based), which are essentially glorified short term memory tests - IQ.
Great video. This is why it is better with a "high tax" society in order to more balance out all these issues as much possible. But this is probably something America will never have as the "culture" will not allow such a change, regardless if it is good or bad. You are stuck with the system you have and if you want something different the only solution is to move to another place like Canada or somewhere else.
This is David's way of taking a shot at the people that disagree with him. Like the hate mail he gets and the negative comments he recieves. So he's talking about intellegence right after he criticized people sending him ignorant mail and grammatical errors in the comment section.
top 8 reasons that the education system in America is not working (plus some extras) 1) No parental involvement. 2) Students don't see school as a privilege and don't feel invested in the outcome beyond whatever they can get away with at home. 3) Students are placed in classes according to age, not proficiency with the material (therefore the work often feels impossible, or like a waste of time//busywork) 4) Proficiency with the material offers students no tangible benefits. 5) The education system is overly concerned with memorization; not concerned with critical thinking, decision making, philosophical discussion, debate, and self-directed completion of a task. 6) There is almost zero emphasis on practical skills that carry over from school to life. 7) Standardized testing is USELESS! (no, don't get rid of it, USE IT for god sakes!) 8) No money. Teachers are underpaid, facilities are old, equipment is old... 9) Textbooks aren't used properly. Students aren't encouraged to read real books independently. 10) Too much interference from political structures. 11) The total and complete lack of ACTUAL liberal-atheist-illuminati indoctrination. Also, the lack of conservative indoctrination. And Nazi indoctrination... and conspiracy theories indoctrination. 12) We demand teachers to be well educated/passionate/competant, and then we treat them like substitutes. Here's your lesson plan for the next 8 months, see you at the teachers workshop next friday where we will discuss "reading by numbers."
Numbers 2, 5, and 8 are the big ones, IMO. 1 and 12 too, but I feel they would cease to be very important with better student engagement and adequate funding/wages.
@@siukong Funding isn't everything. I've had the "privilege" of attending "well funded" and poorly funded schools. You can build a 35-50 million dollar school without changing the quality of the education one iota. (PS I googled 50 million dollar highschool? MULTIPLE texas HSs with 60-70million dollar FOOTBALL STADIUMS. I rest my case) My personal opinion is that if you gave teachers, say $2000 per year for class-related purchase orders (50 bucks a kid, no I don't mean so they can buy paper and make copies that shouldn't be their responsibility), and the autonomy to teach the subject the way they wanted, the quality of the education would go waaaay up. That's simply an allocation issue. #3 is also HUGE. Students shouldn't be grouped according to age, they should be grouped according to what they know. You are NEVER going to be able to teach a kid who doesn't understand exponents how to do algebra. It's just not going to happen, and while sure, the teacher can invest time in reviewing every single basic concept that might trip-up any student who's math-skills are inadequate(or rush by students ignoring their individual needs,) that style of education kills any kind of educational momentum and desire on the part of the students and the teachers. #6 I also feel is pretty important, but couldn't really be accomplished without substantially restructuring the education system and also, probably increasing funding. I agree, 10 is only big insofar as it's the cause of funds being funneled away from students and every now and again somebody makes a big deal about something that really isn't important (but it makes you sound like an idiot if you don't know it) But they are all pretty important actually... except maybe 7. Standardized testing is only (really) important to make sure that there aren't major holes in the system that just get ignored. That being said, I would have liked to have had my test returned to my teachers and I so that we could have used it for something constructive
@@TheBrothergreen Well perhaps I misspoke. When I mentioned "funding" I meant it in the sense you do. Specifically so that teachers can properly do their jobs and receive a wage that reflects their true value (because after all, nothing else we do or say about how we value teachers is going to matter much if we don't back it up with commensurate compensation). And I don't disagree with any of your points. They're all important, just some more than others _in my opinion_ . #3 for example I entirely sympathize with as someone who essentially twiddled my thumbs for entire classes in middle school because I already knew the math being taught (the teacher literally let me sit in the hallway and work on something else). I also had one year where my gifted class was combined with the "bad behaviour / learning disability" class for several periods a day for some nonsensical reason. However, we do already have some degree of separation within grades based on proficiency, and in extreme cases even have students who skip a grade. You seem to be suggesting something more - something that would require a complete and drastic overhaul of the system. While ideal in a vacuum, it's a very difficult prospect to consider given the resources we will likely be able to devote to education, and so shouldn't be at the top of our priority list.
@@siukong you're right, it's hard to make a credible argument in the RUclips comment section. If you've got 10 minutes to kill, this video summarizes the conversation I'm trying to cliff-notes, encapsulated by point #3. (especially starting around 6:40, but it's worth watching the full 10 minutes, if you can spare them.) ruclips.net/video/zDZFcDGpL4U/видео.html You're right. We DO have to throw out the entire school system and start over. It's not just a matter of upping teacher's salaries, and then raising your standards... that's not enough, not nearly good enough. -Professor R. J. Lupin
Equality of outcomes depends on rigidly you define equal. Making a case for some redistribution downward to poor people is not to be lumped in with a "one size fits all equality". Meritocracy is a fine concept until it starts becoming a justification for staggering levels of inequality in a winner take all economy.
This was just pulling your car to the side of the road, taking out your map and evaluating where you are. I've got a whole bunch of 'So?' in my intestinal tract. Give it a few hours and I'll be flushing this knowledge.
DAVID! I have known this of my republican relatives but you have articulated it so well! "The biggest problem is that ignorance and lack education are increasingly seen as a badge of honor in some circles. We have talked about how on the Republican side there is more and more demonization of higher education as liberal indoctrination. In the short term this helps republicans get elected because you have people who are proud of not being educated or of being anti-intellectuals and they are overwhelmingly voting for republicans."
Very interesting data. Here in the UK there's been a big political push to make exams harder. Because apparently they've gotten too easy - at least according to all the old people. If the trends found in the US can be found here too then that would suggest they're kind of wrong, at least as far as their view that everything is easy and the "undeserving" are getting an easy ride.
In k-12 I was labeled special education and dropout in the 10th to go to the Marine Corps eventually. I wasn’t allowed to take regular classes until 9th grade. Using the GI bill. I have degrees in philosophy, finance, and mathematics. In the areas where African Americans are concentrated are still not well suited for education. The teachers and the principal put their heart into it, but the power structure is southern to its core. The United States is seeing them normalized. Although my wife happens to be white, the United States is seeing white people as I saw them my whole childhood in HD. A lot of extraordinary people helped me learn not to hate. Many in my class didn’t have the opportunities that popped up to save me from the life I would have ended up with there. This was in Chattanooga, Tn. I’m 39. I really wish that I could go into those numbers used and have them account for the real United States because there are so many tricks used in schools that waste the key developmental years and make Universities a bit of a landmine. The first part is that minorities come in with a good reason to not trust any of the people they meet in their classes which their classmates will magnify because we don’t know each other in essential ways.
I wouldn't say that all liberals are smart, nor would I say that all conservatives are dumb. However, there is an overwhelming trend of the above average intelligent minority tending to sway towards more liberal beliefs. One of my teachers used to say, "It's not your IQ that matters, but what you do with it." Very true words. If you try to call out a conservative for being dumb and not understanding the issues, they just retreat further into ignorance and resort to name calling and partisan slurs. If you calmly try to question the 'reason' for their beliefs, it's easier to sway them to understand how supporting the wealthy does not improve their life or help them.
This divide between people receiving higher education and academic achievement is simple. There's a lot of trash being taught in university. If you're getting a degree in, say, Engineering, that's a useful skill with high academic qualities. If you're getting a degree in, for example, gender studies, that doesn't really translate into any real career field. Philosophy majors pretty much have the career of teaching philosophy. We need to refocus education back into more useful and productive skills and less on navel-gazing. Engineering, medicine, computer sciences, agriculture, general science, journalism, law all need to be more focused upon. Technical schools need to be made more accessible and less stigmatized as well.
Brilliant video. This is one of the few topics where Jordan Peterson was correct (hey, a clock is right twice a day, right?). I'm a child care worker part time - and I often come face to face with the fact that public school in America is absolutely fucked. We need to do something about the way we educate our kids.
Some measures of achievement -- it was an NRC study but I forgot what the name of the assessment was -- suggest that achievement has been stagnant the last 40 years (with a slight dip in the 80's). So technically we're not doing worse, just comparatively worse as other countries are improving. That's why there are new pushes to improve education (common core, NGSS) to attempting to use evidence-based approaches to teach those higher level cognitive skills. The problem is that it is challenging to teach those skills as well as teach teachers to teach those skills (lol sorry for the repetition). More research especially needs to be done in the latter topic. Additionally, the university system is lagging behind high schools in adopting these techniques though some large R1 research universities are just starting to change. (I worked at a top 20 R1 a few years ago and they literally just started changing all of their lower div science and math classes.) They're including "active learning" techniques, clicker use for large classrooms, problem-based learning, etc. People are trying to fix this issue now but for sure extra funding would help make that happen faster--in terms of both training and research. Additionally there are a lot of motivational/psychological issues that people are now looking at (see the motivation paper in Science --the journal-- that literally just got published about negative fixed mindsets of the instructors disproportionately affecting underrepresented minority students). I guess my point is that some people are trying to address this right now but the current political climate is certainly not helping. Additionally, I don't know if that pride in lack of education is new--I recently saw a doc about Kent State and they showed interviews of people at the time who had remarkably similar opinions about higher education.
Intellectual dishonesty is a serious disservice to advancing the discourse and constantly I hear really smart people say things they know are not true. I’ve yet to understand this
Correct me if I'm wrong, but there are no minimum requirements for US highschools are there? So if your students don't perform that well, and you want to look good anyway, just make tests easier. And then if highschool kids lack education, universities and colleges have to adjust too. I briefly studied at a US middle-of-the-road university (Idaho) and I was totally unimpressed by the education level. And that was back in 1996. Another issue I remember reading about, was that US schools heavily rely on funding from local governments. Meaning poor areas tend to have inferior education. A vicious cycle. And then there is of course money for public education being rerouted towards charter schools, and DeVos is only making that worse.
Don't use PISA scores as a proxy for academic achievement. By necessity the reading and writing tests change depending on the language that the students speak. So they are not actually a standardized test.
Actually, David, I’ve heard that has been new data that contradicts the idea that you won’t benefit much more from a 150 IQ than a 120 IQ. There were studies done on 13 year-olds taking the SAT. There were 13 year-olds who got 1300 and 13 year-olds who got 1600. At that point, they haven’t reached the peak of their intelligence yet. When they’re older, they can score 1600, but the ones who got 1600 at age 13 did better in life than the ones who got 1300 at age 13.
If you use the internet properly you can become extremely well informed and educated about many things. Using it properly does not include social media or attention seeking or buying the latest Chinese crap. It also doesn't include seeking out people that don't agree with you and being obtuse and abusive toward them. It could have been a wonderful thing.
Most Politicians and main stream media anchors are some of the most unintelligent yet convincing people in the country. This is an issue because people tend to listen to and follow these people.
This will always be around to some degree, but only by making education free and system itself optimized can you minimize this gap. When you have such a barriers in place for education it's not really helping the matter at all.
What are the chances that a child born in a cabin in Kentucky whose father is an impoverished laborer and who was self educated could become President today? I bet that our current living past presidents would not feel that it can’t happen because the standard needed to fill that position is so much higher today. Our declining support of even basic universal education has resulted in our citizens making choices that have resulted in our getting the government we deserve.
I don't necessarily have data on me now to back this up, but I've a good reason to believe that this divide where more people graduate but less are good at the core subjects is due in large part to the lack of funding for education. Standard testing isn't a great indicator for success but the lack of funding for education at college means that people look for shortcuts and also schools PROVIDE shortcuts for getting through programs faster with less knowledge needed to pass subjects. Also probably less qualified teachers are probably normal (not to say they don't eventually BECOME qualified) because good professors often leave for more lucrative positions requiring colleges to hire new professors all of the time. These new professors take time to learn, and in an ideal situation would spend time learning under other more pronounced professors for awhile before having their own class room (but can't since most are leaving). I say this as a student myself whose seen my major's program swap out multiple teachers every single year. The incentives to stay at a low paying teaching job are just too little to keep experience professors most of the time, unless they've earned a higher position in the department.
I disagree with you about a lot, but lets go ahead and break-down what you are talking about into a few categories. First, your main premise is: *_Schools aren't performing due to lack of funding._* On the surface, I agree with this statement, lack of funding in education is a huge issue, however, then we get into the evidence that you provide. First, you seem to be only looking at college-level education which is amazingly well-funded compared to k-12. If I followed your logic correctly, it goes something like this: College students are poor -> College students get jobs/work while in school -> College students don't have time to study -> Colleges accommodate students who don't have time to study -> *also college professors suck -> end result poorly educated college graduates. This is wrong for so many reasons. First, it assumes that the students who work their way through college aren't good students. Second, it assumes that the majority of students work their way through college(really work their way through, not just financial aid and work-study.) Third, it assumes that this whole phenomenon is caused by a mixture of teachers and students putting forth insufficient effort (which you then attribute to a lack of money.) I disagree on all counts. First, Most BA students who attend University do not hold down a 2nd job. Masters and above, it's pretty common, but you can get a BA without doing so, and most people opt to go that route. Second, Most students, at most schools (who are not holding down a 2nd job) are not spending even the majority of their time either in-class or studying. It doesn't happen. Third, Students are motivated to get good grades. That's what they want to do. *if* they are taking short-cuts, it's because they CAN take short-cuts without fucking themselves over. This behavior occurs whether they have a job or not. Fourth, it is not my experience that students who work their way through college leave with a lesser education on average. In fact, if anything, the freedom awarded by having a less demanding schedule can lead to bad-habits (like partying/ hanging out with friends) and therefore the opposite might be true. As for teachers: _According to the U.S. Department of Labor, [Academic year 2007] salaries for full-time faculty [at universities] in the U.S. averaged $73,207. _*_By rank, the average was $98,974 for professors,_*_ $69,911 for associate professors, $58,662 for assistant professors, $42,609 for instructors, and $48,289 for lecturers._ Now granted this isn't competitive with the private sector, but it is respectable, and it's worth keeping in mind.
Idiocracy is becoming a reality. It's actually really exciting. Soon you'll be able to attend law school at CostCo.
Is that where you got you're degree?? LOL!
That only makes sense if you ignore the Flynn Effect and rising graduation rates. Americans are smarter and better educated than they used to be.
hes talkin like a f*g, get'em
@@rneedham667 yes ""youre degree"", you talk worse English than the Turkish people in Germany speaks German. Well done. How can ameridumbs have worse English than someone who speaks English as a third language? Wow that's just hilarious, like what are you telling customers at mc donalds? Whats youre order? You're want some fries with youre burger? omfg LMFAO
@@Kajiyaification america is a nation of immigrants, so i guess you are speaking about yourself!😀😀😀
When the Kardashians are looked up to by millions of impressionable teens, education is an uncontrollable dumpster fire
Some of these idiots are more than just dumb, they have a noticeable cruel streak.
Why do we act like teenagers from previous generations were these 145 IQ geniuses who looked up to philosophers and scientists ? They’re teenagers. The Kardashian’s are pretty and entertaining. They’re supposed to like dumb shit. And I’m not even sure the average kid looks up to the Kardashian’s. I think that’s pretty rare. Maybe they like the their makeup or clothing but I don’t see the problem with that.
More kids are getting educated. More kids have progressive political views. I promise you the Kardashian’s are not holding this generation back.
@@straight_outta_jail ; Young people will always be retards, only if those of us whom are supposed to be a adults, keep acting just as, or even more retarded than the young people. Young people have a tendency to mimic the adults in their lives; hence your clue as to why so many young people seem to be retarded.
@@newworld3844 considering that automation and A.I. hold the potential of bringing cataclysmic events to humanity, i agree with you that the kardashians are not that big of a deal for this and/or coming generations
New World that’s what a kardashian fan would say.
Regarding the value of education, we really need to get sports out of schools and form clubs outside education like they do in Europe? Why? In most schools athletes have a higher worth both socially and economically to the school than intelligent students who want to attend university. The result is that many of the athletes and students belittled the nerds! Why study when your peers only reward you if you have a ball in your hand! Most students can't name a Nobel prize laureate, but most people can say who Babe Ruth was, for example!
@fredrika27
This assumes that athletes can't be intelligent students and vice versa. This is not the case. Also, that is quite a ridiculous reason for wanting to get sports out of school. Schools want good students just as much as good athletes. Who do you think there are more of? 30 guys on the football team or 2,000 students paying tuition?
@@calebr7199 actually the 30 people playing basketball makes the school so much money per person also the students are paying for a service which splits out the payout whiles the basketball player gives the university straight cash
In all my classes with athletes I've never seen one put forth anything but typical student behavior or better.
@MankeySpankey
Nice anecdotal evidence. In my school all the top students were atheltes. I guess then all athletes are straight A students.
wonderful point thank you for this post
The Education system really is flawed. I’d love for you to look into it. Especially the cost cutting measures like how teenagers are forced to go to to schools at early times despite sleep researchers conclusions.
+ You are spot on davie. Flawed FUNDAMENTALLY.
The 7:15 am alarm bell at the local HS is the least of the problems with the modern education system.
There are many problems but one of the easiest, though more expensive solutions, is pre-k education. As the cost of child rearing increases parents have less time to nurture in the way that they'd like, funding pre-k would be a massive boost.
www.thoughtco.com/importance-of-early-education-2774216
Investment in education benefits society as a whole.
Yes, it's terribly flawed. From removing the Humanities from our Common Core to the standardized test obsession to authoritarian settings to the overemphasis on sports and social achievements, it's disgusting and does not improve peoples' lives. All our public schools do is make you accept that you're a menial worker under someone elses' authority for life.
OMG, are you kidding? Poor babies have to get up and go to school. Wah! No, the main problem is parents who don't encourage and help their kids to go to college. Parents who should never be parents. My dad quit school at 15 to work to help support his family, but he wanted all of his children to go to college. Only 1 out of 5 did not go, and she's the only Republican.
"I have a high IQ, believe me. I'm like a smart person" who does this sound like
@cj p if your arguments can be easilly debunked by copy/pasting from the internet, then maybe you need better arguments? Just sayin'
@Mr President
Tell it to @cj p
@cj p you loose an argument and afterwards you claim it was a joke. now you are the joke hereXD. joke`s on you!! HAHAHAHA
@cj p HAHAHAHAHA, now all you got is pointless insults. being defensive like that proves you know you talked shit and cant admit it. HAHAHA
@cj p Honestly, you're the one who seems butthurt and on the offensive. If it literally takes a copy and paste to disprove what you are saying, which by the way is called referencing and presenting data with factual evidence, then you need to come up with better arguments.
Add stress from poor health care, poor nutrition, lack of quality time from parents working multiple jobs not to mention lead in the water , these restricting cognitive develipement in children, and the problems of poverty compound themselves.
My mother sometimes used a very old quote about capitalists and clergy:
"You keep them dumb, I'll keep them poor."
Seems little has changed since that quote was invented in the 19th century.
Who made that quote?
@@ericmann770 My mother never told me where she got it from, so frankly: I don't know. Some damn socialist I reckon. ;-)
“The secret of freedom lies in educating people, whereas the secret of tyranny is in keeping them ignorant.”
~Maximilien de Robespierre
There are plenty of people leaving college without any critical thinking ability because textbook companies make the powerpoints, write the exams, and dictate what is taught (mostly by untrained grad students who find out what classes they are teaching a week or two before classes start).
True. My Differential Equations was a graduate student whom they told to give this class ONE week before classes began.
At first it was horrible becauae he didnt really have any lesson plans prepared... But he has adpated by now.
In my electromechanics class, the proffesor didnt show up the first day of class. We called the engineerimg department and asked if she was coming and it turns out...
SHE DIDNT EVEN KNOW she was giving this class 😂
Next class another proffesor came o give the class.
Not to mention most of the students only care about "is this going to be on the exam?" instead of actually developing a true grasp of the material.
And might this be why a lot of a Conservatives can boast a diploma and claim to be educated?
Remember the day in which parents worked hard labor jobs, just so that their children had the opportunity to attend higher education and have a better job and easier life? And there was a day, you could not go further up the ladder, unless you had some paper stating you received a degree in something.. Then came the Bush family.. and then came Cheney who attempted to raid the funding system..
Sorry, but Reagan started cutting programs, grants and funding for higher education.
@@shannonbloom4133 I was still playing in the dirt during those days, thankfully. But I do remember Cheney trying to divert money and basically bankrupt that specific department and change the system where bank and investors would have direct access for student loans. And I remember the hell one of my family members went through in attempting to figure out where all the money went in national HUD after little W's reign. Files had been shredded and documents missing.
And I remember the long lasting affect his No Child Left Behind program rendered to several graduating classes. The result was a general dumbing down of America. That's what Republicans do. They don't see that educating the masses makes a nation stronger. They don't want any of their precious money paying for services that everyone else pays for. They send their kids to Notre Dame, to Baylor and other private schools to be better than everyone else. How dare someone from poorer background be smarter and work their way to the top. They don't belong there.. Darwinism in action, not social Christianity..
ursaltydog Sounds like it was all bullshit.
@@seanwjones07 what specifically was all bullshit? My father was a laborer.. He dug ditches and poured concrete his entire life after serving in the war. My mother was a homemaker who gardened, canned, sewed all our clothes, kept house. They like other couples realized it wasn't right to damn their children to a life of hard servitude like they'd had and broken their bodies. My father had to retire early because of that He drew a small union pension when he did retire along with fighting for his social security benefits.
They fought to keep their heads above water until those duly earned benefits came to fruition. Until then, we hunted wild lettuce in the woods for mama to cook up with a pot of beans and pan of cornbread. We would dumpster dive for thrown away day old produce to make cabbage soup. When open air dumping was still legal, we'd prowl through items people had thrown away, take home and clean so it could be sold at the flea markets.
They did all that so I could go have a better life. That's what parents do.
ursaltydog I’m talking about the lies American society told the people. We had crooks and plutocrats destroying the country while they kept gas lighting the people on if you work hard and go to school you’ll have a better life than your parents. It clearly didn’t turn out that way with the worst income inequality since the gilded age.
The scary truth . Best one yet to encapsulate the American decline. Point by point. good work Dave and Pat.
They should rename it "the David Patman Show".
Lol
Pat didn't do anything
@@Bladerunner-yd5lk Pat is the producer. If you can't see him, he's still there . You assclown.
Thanks for the insult. Like I don't get enough off Trump supporters. You must have thought I was one having a go for no reason. Not so just a harmless observation that he wasn't actually in the video
@@Bladerunner-yd5lk thanks sorry.
As a teacher, I can say that just attending high school doesn't count for much if there are 35+ students per class
I feel for you. My grade school in the seventies had 45 students to one teacher no aides! It was a private school. The teachers were always frazzled and stressed out due to this overwhelming ratio
Thing is, from what I've seen getting a college degree in the US can be an absolute joke. When an American friend of mine was doing his homework for college I asked him to show me some of the problems and assignments he was given every now and then and it was mostly essays, multiple choice tests and math problems so simple anyone above 9th grade could solve them. And this guy was going for a degree in Biology.
In fact I've written up an essay or two for him when he was hung over and would rather catch up on sleep (nothing else to do during night shift) and he could just hand those in unedited and get a pretty good grade even though I knew nothing about the topic initially and don't speak English as my first language. Nobody noticed or cared.
@@Fordragon Maybe, but this was not some online course he was doing. It was a supposedly well-known college somewhere in MO, with classes and a campus and everything. Obviously a sample size of one doesn't say too much, but I was still somewhat shocked because I had to do way more and way more difficult stuff at the German equivalent to US high school. I struggled to comprehend how some were failing those same classes according to said friend.
I have two questions What college is he going to because we have some that are way worse then others and is it a community college two where is he at because if hes a first year or maybe even second for me i felt like it was all catchup stuff for the people who didn't get a good education in highschool then we stated to get much more advanced throughout the second year in the medical field at least i really think our highschool education is what needs to be fixed we pack so much stuff into there that people will not need to know in the future that they dont even learn all of it because theres no time to in highschool i remember getting home and having to work on a paper almost every night and then 50-100 questions in my physics and math classes which dosent allow everyone to learn the material because they just hold the information for a few weeks or months until there exams and then forget it all
@@ottoernst3735 Sorry, I don't remember which one he went to, and I don't want to talk badly about a decent college by mistake, especially if the qualitative differences between them are as pronounced as people say.
I do remember however that it was mostly during his second year there that I occasionally "helped" out.
@@Krawurxus yeah man, the differences between universities here can be very drastic. Even for well-known schools, you're not going to get as good of an education in the New Mexico state university system as you will in the California one, for example. It varies a lot from state to state, so we have 50 very different quality education systems throughout the country.
@Karen Reed I'm not an American and I don't live in America. I already went to University here, thank you very much, albeit for a degree in a completely different field than Biology, which is what my friend was studying, and I was merely talking about the one brush with higher education in the US that I had, stating my observations in this one particular case. Which is why, as others replying to my comment have already observed, I said that it CAN BE a joke, not that it nessecarily is.
Also, that person I mentioned was complaining about the material being too easy as well, fearing he would be insufficiently prepared for the lab job he was looking to get into.
I got 98th percentile on my high school cognitive test. Now I have a master's degree and have lived in a homeless shelter because I'm medically limited to a desk job and people don't want to interview me for them.
"The problem is education correlates with income and income correlates with all kinds of different kinds of divides in society." Hasn't that always been the case? It seems to me what has changed is we are losing more jobs that pay a living wage and don't require higher education and this is having political ramifications. It seems a perfectly understandable reaction to resent people who have the intellectual tools and financial opportunities to have a comfortable life when what was considered middle class is no longer available to you. I don't think the answer is to push people with lower IQ into higher education but to create meaningful work for more citizens that allows them to meet their basic needs. The Republicans have tapped into this frustration in a way Democrats have not, which is a successful strategy because, whether you like it or not, politicians are not incentivized to solve problems but to get elected. ANDREW YANG 2020.
There are more jobs for people who are skill-less but adapt faster to basic skills or are able to make good normative decisions (ie; managers), then those who spend 4 years learning how to develop skills. Skill based jobs are lacking and, even worse, far too dynamic in the modern artificial economy. There are people walking around that can do calculus that work the same jobs as people with GEDs. The neglect of the mid-high level skill-set should be cause for concern.
Education is my 3rd most severe issue in America (behind Climate Change #1 and Corruption #2) because in America we have not moved on from a system that was established in the Industrial Age to churn out factory workers almost 90 YEARS AGO! America has consistently ranked in the bottom of 1st world countries and 30th-26th in countries that have public education at all. I think critical thinking should be taught in grade school, not when you reach collage and really have to rethink how you view logic and people after you are an adult. But then Republicans would have less suckers to scam and we can't have that now can we?
I remember when my family could not afford the money for the standardized testing forms in high school. It was the first time that I realized that my fate had already been decided by my parents income.
When I was younger I thought I was so smart, as I get older, I realize how stupid I really am.
Intelligence? Well, that rules out our so-called president.
Vampires exist.
I know, the urban rural divide is destroying America. Right now urban areas are doing well because of education, and rural areas are economically depressed because of a lack of an education
Many do not attend higher education, because at a high school level, students are already divided into "university versus technical" path.. Basically labeling students as college material, and those who would do best in technical pathways, not attending college or only attending for a certificate program. Our junior college attempts to identify prospective students who haven't received enough education on the high school level in order to succeed in college, and those numbers are going up because the education system does what they can to get by.
It realistically doesn't have anything to do with cognitive abilities nor intelligence, but the ability to have retained basics... More incoming freshmen are forced to take remedial classes (or refresher courses as colleges don these more sensitive labels) merely to bring the students up to a level to handle junior college course requirements.
One cannot show cognitive abilities unless they can show they have retained fundamental knowledge in math, science, spelling and grammar. Incoming students don't even know what a footnote is, two basic ways to prepare a composition, mastered algebraic formulas and basic statistics, have some knowledge of biology, chemistry and earth science. Kindergarten level is expected to already comprehend certain 5 letter words and write them correctly in sentences, to know and operate an internet browser.
So, this educational divide will become greater and people will be left behind in poverty who are older, who have worked labor jobs their entire lives and are either too old, bodies infirm at young ages or cannot be reeducated for higher technical jobs.
The thing is that not everyone actually wants to go to college to learn. Sure there are fields that need education such as doctors and engineers but what has happened to the real pursuit of knowledge. People no longer go to college becuase they want to learn but because they want a higher paying job. Knowledge is second to money for them
I would argue that many of the students who took the Tech School route are doing better financially than those with Masters in Modern Dance.
If we're making economic achievement the focus of a successful life.
@@demonvictim I can see that of some professions... It's always been there, the lure of money over substance. Some do it because it's what their fathers or mothers expect of them, to follow in their footsteps. When I went to college, I wanted to learn how to help others. I do that everyday now. But, college was a totally different world. A way to meet and experience new people whom otherwise if staying in one's little town, in our own box, we wouldn't get to know. And to know there were others like me, and I wasn't alone in the world.
I almost didn't finish.. almost. But I toughed it out and glad I did, no matter the manner in which I had to do it.
@@dougn2350 They might be for awhile money-wise. But their industry depends heavily upon service industry and how the nation is doing economically as a whole. At least those with Masters in Modern Dance aren't sheltered. to the point they believe the only people who deserve jobs, who deserve medical care, who deserve freedom are themselves. But that goes back to Humanities versus Science or Business degree argument.
If my cousin had had at least a degree in "something" he was told, he'd have made district manager (his own had a bachelors in History). Because he left college 30 credit hours short to help his mother and siblings, no matter he'd spent 35 years in retail and managed 5 stores at one time when other managers quit, no matter he knew bookkeeping backward and forwards, no matter he saved the company 500,000 dollars worth of Shrink in one quarter, he was continually passed up for promotion. And so he languished as a salaried slave making the company money until his back went out. Where was their loyalty then? Nowhere. They replaced him with much less quality to start the deadly cycle over again. Promoted brats who hadn't worked a hard day in their lives pushing freight, dealing with personnel issues or difficult customers.
On top of that, the company in appearing EEOC, hired and promoted minorities with less education and with as little as a year of service. And we wonder why those in the service industry and technical path think the way they do about minorities. If my cousin hadn't had the college he'd had, been exposed to race relations while growing up in Memphis TN during the civil rights era with a mother who marched with Martin Luther King, he'd have a hardened heart and Trump supporter too.
ursaltydog
I know a few ppl who manage to make it to college in their 30's and today they have multiple degrees with good jobs. So older ppl are not entirely lost, it just depends on you. The person is you want that education and if it's for you.
The fascinating/disturbing part is that the crazies think we've lost our minds.
Apropo of nothing, when the outcomes are consistently unequal, it is foolish to assume that the opportunities *are* equal...
Intelligent commentary. Thank you for uploading. Additional note: The I.Q. was developed by the military to determine which recruits would be absolutely useless and be unable to be trained to do ANYTHING useful at all. It was found that an I.Q. less that 86 and the recruit could not be trained to do anything useful at all IN THE ARMY. The I.Q test was only developed for the significance of the negative scores. This corresponds to the observations about "economic success" mentioned in the commentary.
Proof?
@@ShidaiTaino Sorry, no bibliography, just a note... Do a little google research on the history of the I.Q and you will find the assertion true.
I'm a multiple STEM degree graduate and I can tell you there isn't any political bias. Numbers and data speak for themselves. Republicans will say climate change is a hoax and they will say that as an opinion. However, isotopic chemistry, advanced mathematics and physics are not based on opinion. There is so much false equivalency going on. The straight forward linear stuff is easy to do. It is the multivariate, non-linear data sets that are difficult to understand. The jury is still out but I have a hunch it will quite some time before AI can solve those kinds of problems due to boundaries put into the problem. Humans can dream whereas AI doesn't have that ability...yet. IBM Watson can win at chess, but chess has a distinct set of rules (boundaries).
Landwy The politicization has occurred in the humanities departments, not the stem departments. These subversives haven’t yet worked out how to undermine the stem programs except by lowering standards for affirmative action cases. The humanities are completely compromised by these Neo-Marxists, feminists theory queer theory race theory, it’s truly disgusting how far we’ve fallen in the last hundred years. They are the ones pushing the pseudoscience regarding race and gender we find so commonplace in mainstream culture today.
@@neosav7476 The "subversives" are the anti-intellectual right-wingers who want a dumbed down America, because ignorant voters are more likely to be Republican voters.
@@neosav7476 - I'll wager that if you teleported a million people to an uninhabited planet capable of supporting human life and wiped their memories, you could come back in 1000 years and find their science books would be much the same as ours at the same stage of technological development, but their humanities books would be completely different.
Landwy - Please go to explain findings of evolutionary psychology to a gender studies department. :D
I watch Rick and Morty so I’m good.
Lol 👍
I didn't brush my teeth, but I ate some Thin Mints so I'm good.
Love Rick and Morty!❤
There's also another committee Senate committee in the late 1700's which unanimously stated that America was in no way founded as a Christian nation.
And america is in no ways founded as a democracy but just as many if not more dipshit act like it is. I like the secular laws but a democracy is the fastest way to implement one.
secular Republic
Great video David
Education of the masses is the enemy of an oppressive government.
One of your most important topics ever posted, we have 2 classes in America, the thinking class, & the unthinking class .
David living in the Ivy League area (Boston) is in a case by itself. These schools are not about a well rounded education, but rather finding communication circles. The basic types of students that go to Ivy League Schools are:
1). Brilliant student (even less of those at Ivy League schools than in earlier times).
2). Legacy student (son or daughter of a former Ivy League graduate). A much higher proportion than in earlier times.
3). Bought your way in. (Jared Kushner, George Bush, etc.). A much higher percentage than in earlier times.
4). Helicopter parents forced their kids to regurgitate facts to pass tests. This is the Singapore or Chinese method; versus Finland with emphasis on critical thinking skills.
5). Major in finance of some other mostly easy field of study to say they have a degree from Harvard.
6). ??. (Please contribute).
Don't get me wrong, but especially at the graduate level for instance, Harvard's Medicine, Government, and Law schools are top notch. Trump got a degree from Penn State by using a back door to get in. Wharton was a terrible school at the time Trump attended there, but it was a way of getting a Penn State diploma. Wharton is now a first rate school.
A STEM graduate will in most cases be a better graduate and able to function in a data driven world better than a sociology major. Remember, it was unemployed physics graduates that became wealthy day traders and not finance or economics majors.
The divide between Ivy League and state schools might get larger in the future. Ivy League Schools are all about building communication circles and attendance. State schools offer a far better education, but state and federal monies are waining. These students will receive on-line classes instead of residency at campuses at Ivy League schools. Wealthy Republicans are willing to put junior in the expensive Ivy League school, but are unwilling for their taxes to go up so state schools can provide a good education for the children of peons.
A very good segment, quite informative
David, you’re pitching Idocracy a couple of decades late my friend.
But maybe it’s time for a soft-reboot?
Idiocracy came out less than 13 years ago.
BobbyBaboon #IGotServed
Soft reboot? How about a fresh install? Of a new OS? Something along the lines of Ubuntu perhaps?
Look whats up is Social Studies, History and what used to be called Civics. We are under the gross misconception that Democracy is an artefact, a noun like a consumer purchase, instead of a fragile messy process that demands an ethical commitment from society; that demands a degree of participation; that demands an informed electorate; that demands an enlightened prioritization of PUBLIC EDUCATION. America has long since failed in these areas. Now that a recent Stanford study has declared that America is no longer actually a Democracy but an Oligarchy: We are paying the price.
Ah yes, dread the lackluster social engineers. I can hear Putin blustering against exceptionalism. (And Trump demanding: “But I get to be president. Right?)
I blame the internet, starting 25 years ago and further back, people came home from work and after dinner they tinkered with some kind of hobby as the televsion droned on in the background. Now, people spend their entire day, even at work or school, with an electronic contraption in their hand, watching or reading the most insane "theories" about everything from soup to nuts, making them think they "know" what's going on in the world but in actuality dumbing them down even further. In another 25 years no one will know anything without their connection to the internet.
David do a show about the congressional committee that investigated the tax exempt " educational " foundations in the fifties and they where approved in the 20's and see how the truth was crushed and the foundations were allowed to go forward and subjugate our educational system.
There is no such thing as “liberal indoctrination” in our colleges and universities. None whatsoever. That problem is rooted in K-12 education that teaches American mythology as history and then when you get to college and find out it was just a bunch of rah rah nationalist nonsense, that might appear like indoctrination when young Americans go against the nationalist narrative. But that doesn’t make it liberal indoctrination. The problem is that all of this is deliberate, which speaks to your closing remarks about public education being starved in favor of charter schools.
Bernie 2020! Education for the poor raises all boats ( including those in Trumpland)
This makes me feel somewhat better. I tested out as a Promethian as a child. The actual score doesn't really matter. But because of the way my life has gone and un-diagnosed (until about 5 years ago) Asperger's Syndrome. Now I live at home with my parents and have been unemployed for 4 years. My parents are elderly and need some care. I can't get a job locally because everyone assumes I'll move if something better comes along or that "I'm too smart to be here" (Rural Saskatchewan). So, no, having a high IQ is not always a ticket out of wherever. But knowing that my life outcomes are to some degree not completely my fault helps. Thanks.
He brings up that the US produces a lot of degrees but it falls behind when it comes to STEM.
So The Logical question would be what are these degrees in?
Because having degrees in fields that don't produce is not a sign that the population is more educated. It would be a sign that the mediocre has become the new standard.
Kind of reminds me of a Star Trek episode, "The Cloud Minders" where there is an elite class of intellectuals living in a Utopian city and the general population works in the mines to support it. I mean, obviously the intent of the episode was to comment on elitism, but funny how it's almost literally manifesting itself now.
I once commented that realigions are where lazy minds go to prosper ..... aspiring to being gullible and ignorant at the same time is not a good life choice ..... god if you will, doesn't want you to waste your life , if your wrongly thinking your right .
All I can say to that I just hope English isn't your native language because your argument isn't
convincing anyone with how poorly written it is.
I actually think learning religion is a great placeholder for certain people to prosper. For instance back in the day whether or not the earth was flat while it was wrong had absolutely no effect on a farmers daily life and allowed them to not have worries. There are certainly dangerous results from religion such as the witch hunts and human sacrifice but the roles that religion take today is mostly centered around death and what it brings. Unless you are determined to find out what happens after death it is better to set up your own image of death and keep it in the back of your mind. Im against organized religion becuase it tends to be used to control people but people being spiritual and open minded is a great thing
This is simply untrue. Some of the most intelligent people I've met were religious. A person's religious beliefs is completely independent of their ability to reason and think critically.
Through out history many top scientists came from the church. It was an institution with a lot of resources and had the best education. I think the educational divide isnt Red and Blue, it is rich and poor. Brilliant minds are not coming from public schools of Democrat run big cities.
@@daniellove162 Obviously because democrats need to keep people stupid so they still get votes...
When a country boast itself of being number one again and again, how can that nation improve ?
If the whole identity of United States is that they are the exceptional country among others, how can you think that America is wrong in any instances ?
trump supporters as a whole most likely don't have passports. They are on the inside of a bubble looking out, rather that a well travelled worldly individual on the outside looking in. The ignorance has led to a destroyed america already and that is how such a buffoon such as trump got voted in. The US has mostly good people within its Borders, but being taken down the drain by the intellectually clueless. I truly hope the states can turn itself around. It will take decades.
@@truthplease7137 Americans as a whole do not have that many passports but the way US has stagnated in the last 40 - 50 years is astonishing.
They were a nation that was due to circumstances like never been bombed in WW 2, ahead of everyone,.
Japan, two nuclear bombs, Germany bombed out, England also, other European nations were building their infrastructure out of constant need of everything.
Now their schools are prisons, now their damns and water pipes are crumbling, the Flint water situation is not a bug but a feature, the bridges stays broken because that money has been given to the Pentagon and constant war machine, that keeps on grinding with a budget that is larger than next seven largest military budgets around the world, combined.
And they still use checks to get their salary and pay their groceries with them too.
@@truthplease7137 I am a Finn, so cold weather bonds us :)
Yea, we had our cities bombed but we build them anew and had all kinds of shortages, first coca-cola came 1952.
So comparing the booming US economy and wealth in the 50s to other WW2 nations is like that they were from an other planet.
"Victim of terrorism within itself" Oh, they sure are but how paranoid they are of their own government is ludicrous.
Someone wants common sense gun laws, nope, they are going to take all our guns away..lults
NRA wanted that blind people could buy guns, see, its their right....
I am not coming to USofA, too many guns.
Could? Seems it already has a good start.
Matthew 19:21
“Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou
hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven:
and come and follow me.”
"Social mobility is hard" - in the USA, yes. The land of the "American Dream" is being left behind by other countries and other systems. Have a guess which ones......
If you had a good example why not just share it? I'd guess you're talking about Germany and Japan, although your smugness alludes to some other incorrect answers.
@@dakota2610 Smugness? It's the same countries that hit the tops on most of these lists - Denmark, Norway, Finland, Sweden and Canada.
"The reason they call it the American Dream is because you have to be asleep to believe it." - George Carlin
The education system in the US needs to be revived. It needs to be funded everywhere so there can be a chance of equality. Should not depend on local tax base.
People need to learn for a lot more reasons than just a job. More to life than just work. At least that is the way it should be.
/r/iamverysmart
SMRT!
Linking reddit outside of reddit is very lame.
I prefer "stupid" to "cognitive underclass" but ok
I'm one of those foreign students who have benefited greatly from Uni. My teachers all recommended I go to the army due to my poor English. But I pushed through, with the help of my parents and now I'm in business school in AUC one of the top 50 universities in the world.
All thanks to GOP.
just throwing this out there...
Having studied at a couple of different tertiary institutions, perhaps the biggest benefit I got was the change to my thinking.
There are a number of attributes people in academia seem to exhibit, some being:
The ability to accept being wrong
The ability to change their mind
A commitment to lifelong self improvement
Critical Thinking - that old chestnut
Problem solving
Being prepared to take calculated risks
Prioritising truth over belief
These are not unique to academia, but they do seem more prevalent there. Students develop these skills through a combination of structured and social learning (citation required :)), and perhaps these attributes are important in their future success - not just the knowledge or the qualifications they gain? After all, look how many people succeed in industries completely unrelated to their field of study.
Conversely, maybe it is a lack of these skills that prevents some non-tertiary educated people from continuing to grow as individuals, and this, in turn, puts socially imposed limits on their potential?
Could this be another cause or form of social disparity: learned behaviours, world views, and expectations?
Could it be that, by denying some people this experience (or enabling them to avoid it) we are creating inequity and inequality based, essentially, upon the perception of their place in the world?
Lol this was released on my b-day...lol
Thanks for the great videos keep up the great work!
I also think we need to start encouraging trade jobs more.
Yes go to trades. Less competition for my children and less I have to pay to my plumber
Coming from a very poor rural school in the south with a graduating class of 44 kids and only 29 of us had the grades to graduate at all... yeah there are a lot of people who do view education as a bad thing. The students themselves tend to not care and their parents don't care either. That was the biggest problem my class faced was those 15 students who were very disruptive and pointedly rude who faced no recourse at home. If they were punished in school the parents would blame the teachers and staff.
My senior year my English teacher told me I didn't even need to come. He'd mark me as there even if I didn't want to come in since that was the only class I had where my attendance was taken. Because the good students by that point were all ready to be done. But our classes average reading level was 7th grade and at least 2 people in my class had a reading average below third. They were very proud of that fact. He had to put all his efforts into reigning in the wild nature of the class and attempt to get these students ready that he pointedly couldn't really give us the time or the focus to work with the students who didn't need it.
I found out a while later that my school wasn't accredited when we graduated. It only couldn't close because there was no other school to send us to.
Where I am from education was massively under valued and still is. My experience with my public education made me not want to do college. Not that I could have anyway because my family was poor. We couldn't always put food on the table and I had to start working when I turned 16 to help pay for food, electricity, the mortgage etc... The success of education I think depends on where your starting point is and the continued support during the process.
Personally I'd love to go to college. But I see all my friends and coworkers where I work who have degrees. They cant use them to get jobs that allow them to afford to live alongside making those student loan payments. My job didn't use to require a college degree and now it does and it pays less now than when I started.
We see the same thing here in Canada and when you mention the long term effect on the well being of the country you, and by you I mean me, are met with blank stares. I'm not sure why no one has ever even seemed to understand that there could be a connection between the two.
And look at what's happened now, globalists rule Canada
@@zacharekski9385 Exactly our point. Corporations are transnational and they determine government policy but many blame the government rather than corporations for the situation we find ourselves in.
When they say "Democracy dies in darkness" this is what it should mean. The darkness of ignorance and non-education. The problem is we have people making mor ethan 10 times as much as other people, so their kids get a pretty huge headstart in life with connections etc.
You brough up some importa nt and valid points here. I m in Software engineering, and I have notice the rising salaries for professionals in the tech industry in general. I think salaries are almost too high in this area. I realize how this sounds....
The core problem is that our system encourages the most intelligent to pursue economic goals, yet we do not compensate educators. Thus, the increasing demand for teachers as more children attend school is filled more and more by less intelligent people. As more people attend post-secondary education as a matter of course, people who should be teaching high school are teaching college, and so on down the line.
The problem is exacerbated, and we end up with a vicious cycle, ending up with the worst (least intelligent) teachers teaching in K-6, where we arguably need the best in order to give the kids a solid foundation of HOW to think.
I know it's a gross generalization, and I'm not knocking those conscientious teachers who are trying their best, but we really need to refocus our societal priorities.
This is something I definitely felt should be talked about more. It's difficult as liberals we want to help the unfortunate but in cases we are enabling natural selection to be canceled out which causes this divide. Additionally lack of mental health help can increase the odds of lower intelligent children. Education is setup as a one size fits all etc. This is another massive problem.
The US has always been anti-intuition, pro-rationality - although cognitive scientists are now agreeing that IQ is not all there is to rationality. But intuition neglected has a special role in creativity and invention, especially when it's combined with reason/rationality. However, such a (modular/multi-process) model of mind would go against what the intelligentsia would like to uphold, so they strive for models of thinking that dichotomy reasoning and intuition, and paint intuition as a source of errors. And for 'intelligence' (for lack of a better word) tests, we still use the working memory paradigm (reason based), which are essentially glorified short term memory tests - IQ.
Great video. This is why it is better with a "high tax" society in order to more balance out all these issues as much possible. But this is probably something America will never have as the "culture" will not allow such a change, regardless if it is good or bad. You are stuck with the system you have and if you want something different the only solution is to move to another place like Canada or somewhere else.
I don't agree with David on everything, but on this subject he nails it.
This is David's way of taking a shot at the people that disagree with him. Like the hate mail he gets and the negative comments he recieves. So he's talking about intellegence right after he criticized people sending him ignorant mail and grammatical errors in the comment section.
top 8 reasons that the education system in America is not working (plus some extras)
1) No parental involvement.
2) Students don't see school as a privilege and don't feel invested in the outcome beyond whatever they can get away with at home.
3) Students are placed in classes according to age, not proficiency with the material (therefore the work often feels impossible, or like a waste of time//busywork)
4) Proficiency with the material offers students no tangible benefits.
5) The education system is overly concerned with memorization; not concerned with critical thinking, decision making, philosophical discussion, debate, and self-directed completion of a task.
6) There is almost zero emphasis on practical skills that carry over from school to life.
7) Standardized testing is USELESS! (no, don't get rid of it, USE IT for god sakes!)
8) No money. Teachers are underpaid, facilities are old, equipment is old...
9) Textbooks aren't used properly. Students aren't encouraged to read real books independently.
10) Too much interference from political structures.
11) The total and complete lack of ACTUAL liberal-atheist-illuminati indoctrination. Also, the lack of conservative indoctrination. And Nazi indoctrination... and conspiracy theories indoctrination.
12) We demand teachers to be well educated/passionate/competant, and then we treat them like substitutes. Here's your lesson plan for the next 8 months, see you at the teachers workshop next friday where we will discuss "reading by numbers."
Numbers 2, 5, and 8 are the big ones, IMO. 1 and 12 too, but I feel they would cease to be very important with better student engagement and adequate funding/wages.
@@siukong Funding isn't everything. I've had the "privilege" of attending "well funded" and poorly funded schools.
You can build a 35-50 million dollar school without changing the quality of the education one iota. (PS I googled 50 million dollar highschool? MULTIPLE texas HSs with 60-70million dollar FOOTBALL STADIUMS. I rest my case)
My personal opinion is that if you gave teachers, say $2000 per year for class-related purchase orders (50 bucks a kid, no I don't mean so they can buy paper and make copies that shouldn't be their responsibility), and the autonomy to teach the subject the way they wanted, the quality of the education would go waaaay up. That's simply an allocation issue.
#3 is also HUGE. Students shouldn't be grouped according to age, they should be grouped according to what they know. You are NEVER going to be able to teach a kid who doesn't understand exponents how to do algebra. It's just not going to happen, and while sure, the teacher can invest time in reviewing every single basic concept that might trip-up any student who's math-skills are inadequate(or rush by students ignoring their individual needs,) that style of education kills any kind of educational momentum and desire on the part of the students and the teachers.
#6 I also feel is pretty important, but couldn't really be accomplished without substantially restructuring the education system and also, probably increasing funding.
I agree, 10 is only big insofar as it's the cause of funds being funneled away from students and every now and again somebody makes a big deal about something that really isn't important (but it makes you sound like an idiot if you don't know it)
But they are all pretty important actually... except maybe 7. Standardized testing is only (really) important to make sure that there aren't major holes in the system that just get ignored.
That being said, I would have liked to have had my test returned to my teachers and I so that we could have used it for something constructive
@@TheBrothergreen Well perhaps I misspoke. When I mentioned "funding" I meant it in the sense you do. Specifically so that teachers can properly do their jobs and receive a wage that reflects their true value (because after all, nothing else we do or say about how we value teachers is going to matter much if we don't back it up with commensurate compensation).
And I don't disagree with any of your points. They're all important, just some more than others _in my opinion_ . #3 for example I entirely sympathize with as someone who essentially twiddled my thumbs for entire classes in middle school because I already knew the math being taught (the teacher literally let me sit in the hallway and work on something else). I also had one year where my gifted class was combined with the "bad behaviour / learning disability" class for several periods a day for some nonsensical reason. However, we do already have some degree of separation within grades based on proficiency, and in extreme cases even have students who skip a grade. You seem to be suggesting something more - something that would require a complete and drastic overhaul of the system. While ideal in a vacuum, it's a very difficult prospect to consider given the resources we will likely be able to devote to education, and so shouldn't be at the top of our priority list.
Lol welcome to our future most kids you see today will be criminals or victims
@@siukong you're right, it's hard to make a credible argument in the RUclips comment section. If you've got 10 minutes to kill, this video summarizes the conversation I'm trying to cliff-notes, encapsulated by point #3. (especially starting around 6:40, but it's worth watching the full 10 minutes, if you can spare them.)
ruclips.net/video/zDZFcDGpL4U/видео.html
You're right. We DO have to throw out the entire school system and start over. It's not just a matter of upping teacher's salaries, and then raising your standards... that's not enough, not nearly good enough. -Professor R. J. Lupin
It is more of a question of what kind of education is available i.e. what kind of things are students being taught in schools, colleges, universities.
David, you are only that strong as your weakest member in society. So lift the weak ones first for society.
Equality of outcomes depends on rigidly you define equal. Making a case for some redistribution downward to poor people is not to be lumped in with a "one size fits all equality". Meritocracy is a fine concept until it starts becoming a justification for staggering levels of inequality in a winner take all economy.
If your cognitive ability is insanely low and your ego is off the charts, you could get elected president.
Thanks for the chuckle..
the sad thing is that many Americans believe him to be very very smart. Obviously our Educational System need redesigning.
This was just pulling your car to the side of the road, taking out your map and evaluating where you are. I've got a whole bunch of 'So?' in my intestinal tract. Give it a few hours and I'll be flushing this knowledge.
I deal with absolute stupidity a dozen times a day! People can't think their way out of a wet paper bag anymore.
DAVID! I have known this of my republican relatives but you have articulated it so well! "The biggest problem is that ignorance and lack education are increasingly seen as a badge of honor in some circles. We have talked about how on the Republican side there is more and more demonization of higher education as liberal indoctrination. In the short term this helps republicans get elected because you have people who are proud of not being educated or of being anti-intellectuals and they are overwhelmingly voting for republicans."
Very interesting data. Here in the UK there's been a big political push to make exams harder. Because apparently they've gotten too easy - at least according to all the old people. If the trends found in the US can be found here too then that would suggest they're kind of wrong, at least as far as their view that everything is easy and the "undeserving" are getting an easy ride.
Also, with standardized testing, teachers are teaching to the test and NOT to the needs of the students.
In k-12 I was labeled special education and dropout in the 10th to go to the Marine Corps eventually. I wasn’t allowed to take regular classes until 9th grade. Using the GI bill. I have degrees in philosophy, finance, and mathematics. In the areas where African Americans are concentrated are still not well suited for education. The teachers and the principal put their heart into it, but the power structure is southern to its core. The United States is seeing them normalized. Although my wife happens to be white, the United States is seeing white people as I saw them my whole childhood in HD. A lot of extraordinary people helped me learn not to hate. Many in my class didn’t have the opportunities that popped up to save me from the life I would have ended up with there. This was in Chattanooga, Tn. I’m 39.
I really wish that I could go into those numbers used and have them account for the real United States because there are so many tricks used in schools that waste the key developmental years and make Universities a bit of a landmine. The first part is that minorities come in with a good reason to not trust any of the people they meet in their classes which their classmates will magnify because we don’t know each other in essential ways.
I wouldn't say that all liberals are smart, nor would I say that all conservatives are dumb. However, there is an overwhelming trend of the above average intelligent minority tending to sway towards more liberal beliefs. One of my teachers used to say, "It's not your IQ that matters, but what you do with it." Very true words. If you try to call out a conservative for being dumb and not understanding the issues, they just retreat further into ignorance and resort to name calling and partisan slurs. If you calmly try to question the 'reason' for their beliefs, it's easier to sway them to understand how supporting the wealthy does not improve their life or help them.
Thanks for mentioning charter schooks David.
This divide between people receiving higher education and academic achievement is simple. There's a lot of trash being taught in university. If you're getting a degree in, say, Engineering, that's a useful skill with high academic qualities. If you're getting a degree in, for example, gender studies, that doesn't really translate into any real career field. Philosophy majors pretty much have the career of teaching philosophy. We need to refocus education back into more useful and productive skills and less on navel-gazing. Engineering, medicine, computer sciences, agriculture, general science, journalism, law all need to be more focused upon. Technical schools need to be made more accessible and less stigmatized as well.
Brilliant video. This is one of the few topics where Jordan Peterson was correct (hey, a clock is right twice a day, right?). I'm a child care worker part time - and I often come face to face with the fact that public school in America is absolutely fucked. We need to do something about the way we educate our kids.
Knowledge is power.
Don't worry too much David. Remember, the bigger the circle of light, the bigger the perimeter of darkness. Namaste.
Some measures of achievement -- it was an NRC study but I forgot what the name of the assessment was -- suggest that achievement has been stagnant the last 40 years (with a slight dip in the 80's). So technically we're not doing worse, just comparatively worse as other countries are improving. That's why there are new pushes to improve education (common core, NGSS) to attempting to use evidence-based approaches to teach those higher level cognitive skills. The problem is that it is challenging to teach those skills as well as teach teachers to teach those skills (lol sorry for the repetition). More research especially needs to be done in the latter topic. Additionally, the university system is lagging behind high schools in adopting these techniques though some large R1 research universities are just starting to change. (I worked at a top 20 R1 a few years ago and they literally just started changing all of their lower div science and math classes.) They're including "active learning" techniques, clicker use for large classrooms, problem-based learning, etc. People are trying to fix this issue now but for sure extra funding would help make that happen faster--in terms of both training and research. Additionally there are a lot of motivational/psychological issues that people are now looking at (see the motivation paper in Science --the journal-- that literally just got published about negative fixed mindsets of the instructors disproportionately affecting underrepresented minority students). I guess my point is that some people are trying to address this right now but the current political climate is certainly not helping. Additionally, I don't know if that pride in lack of education is new--I recently saw a doc about Kent State and they showed interviews of people at the time who had remarkably similar opinions about higher education.
Im feeling the growing intellectual divide time to see pakman vs Kyle kulinski debate
Intellectual dishonesty is a serious disservice to advancing the discourse and constantly I hear really smart people say things they know are not true. I’ve yet to understand this
The intellectual, educational, social, & moral divide in America could not be more clear....
Won’t matter there’s always going to be people who want to stay in the top of the ship when it flips over.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but there are no minimum requirements for US highschools are there? So if your students don't perform that well, and you want to look good anyway, just make tests easier. And then if highschool kids lack education, universities and colleges have to adjust too. I briefly studied at a US middle-of-the-road university (Idaho) and I was totally unimpressed by the education level. And that was back in 1996. Another issue I remember reading about, was that US schools heavily rely on funding from local governments. Meaning poor areas tend to have inferior education. A vicious cycle. And then there is of course money for public education being rerouted towards charter schools, and DeVos is only making that worse.
It's really hard to stomach people who take pride in stupidity. I think arrogance might be the downfall of America.
david, how to solve the problem? i wanted to hear that.
Sounds like someone explained a watered down version of The Bell Curve to this guy.
Don't use PISA scores as a proxy for academic achievement. By necessity the reading and writing tests change depending on the language that the students speak. So they are not actually a standardized test.
Actually, David, I’ve heard that has been new data that contradicts the idea that you won’t benefit much more from a 150 IQ than a 120 IQ. There were studies done on 13 year-olds taking the SAT. There were 13 year-olds who got 1300 and 13 year-olds who got 1600. At that point, they haven’t reached the peak of their intelligence yet. When they’re older, they can score 1600, but the ones who got 1600 at age 13 did better in life than the ones who got 1300 at age 13.
If you use the internet properly you can become extremely well informed and educated about many things. Using it properly does not include social media or attention seeking or buying the latest Chinese crap. It also doesn't include seeking out people that don't agree with you and being obtuse and abusive toward them. It could have been a wonderful thing.
The illusion of knowledge is a greater threat to society. Einstein said wise words about the illusion of knowledge.
I wish there was a DP playlist on intelligence and related topics.
Most Politicians and main stream media anchors are some of the most unintelligent yet convincing people in the country. This is an issue because people tend to listen to and follow these people.
This will always be around to some degree, but only by making education free and system itself optimized can you minimize this gap.
When you have such a barriers in place for education it's not really helping the matter at all.
What are the chances that a child born in a cabin in Kentucky whose father is an impoverished laborer and who was self educated could become President today? I bet that our current living past presidents would not feel that it can’t happen because the standard needed to fill that position is so much higher today. Our declining support of even basic universal education has resulted in our citizens making choices that have resulted in our getting the government we deserve.
I don't necessarily have data on me now to back this up, but I've a good reason to believe that this divide where more people graduate but less are good at the core subjects is due in large part to the lack of funding for education. Standard testing isn't a great indicator for success but the lack of funding for education at college means that people look for shortcuts and also schools PROVIDE shortcuts for getting through programs faster with less knowledge needed to pass subjects. Also probably less qualified teachers are probably normal (not to say they don't eventually BECOME qualified) because good professors often leave for more lucrative positions requiring colleges to hire new professors all of the time. These new professors take time to learn, and in an ideal situation would spend time learning under other more pronounced professors for awhile before having their own class room (but can't since most are leaving). I say this as a student myself whose seen my major's program swap out multiple teachers every single year. The incentives to stay at a low paying teaching job are just too little to keep experience professors most of the time, unless they've earned a higher position in the department.
I disagree with you about a lot, but lets go ahead and break-down what you are talking about into a few categories.
First, your main premise is: *_Schools aren't performing due to lack of funding._*
On the surface, I agree with this statement, lack of funding in education is a huge issue, however, then we get into the evidence that you provide. First, you seem to be only looking at college-level education which is amazingly well-funded compared to k-12. If I followed your logic correctly, it goes something like this: College students are poor -> College students get jobs/work while in school -> College students don't have time to study -> Colleges accommodate students who don't have time to study -> *also college professors suck -> end result poorly educated college graduates.
This is wrong for so many reasons. First, it assumes that the students who work their way through college aren't good students. Second, it assumes that the majority of students work their way through college(really work their way through, not just financial aid and work-study.) Third, it assumes that this whole phenomenon is caused by a mixture of teachers and students putting forth insufficient effort (which you then attribute to a lack of money.) I disagree on all counts.
First, Most BA students who attend University do not hold down a 2nd job. Masters and above, it's pretty common, but you can get a BA without doing so, and most people opt to go that route.
Second, Most students, at most schools (who are not holding down a 2nd job) are not spending even the majority of their time either in-class or studying. It doesn't happen.
Third, Students are motivated to get good grades. That's what they want to do. *if* they are taking short-cuts, it's because they CAN take short-cuts without fucking themselves over. This behavior occurs whether they have a job or not.
Fourth, it is not my experience that students who work their way through college leave with a lesser education on average. In fact, if anything, the freedom awarded by having a less demanding schedule can lead to bad-habits (like partying/ hanging out with friends) and therefore the opposite might be true.
As for teachers:
_According to the U.S. Department of Labor, [Academic year 2007] salaries for full-time faculty [at universities] in the U.S. averaged $73,207. _*_By rank, the average was $98,974 for professors,_*_ $69,911 for associate professors, $58,662 for assistant professors, $42,609 for instructors, and $48,289 for lecturers._
Now granted this isn't competitive with the private sector, but it is respectable, and it's worth keeping in mind.