What's up PC fam! 🏀🔥 The PCL NBA Debate League Playoffs are tipping off on September 4th, and it will be epic! We’re bringing the heat with YOUR topic suggestions! That’s right-the debate topics you’ve been sending in will be in the spotlight. You won’t want to miss this! Catch all the matchups here: ruclips.net/video/5iEDPCpSFbI/видео.html
The Curry slander is crazy. Its bad enough when I hear he's not a PG. But now we hear that Curry is only who he is because of his teammates. By that logic, MJ was only MJ until he got Scottie and Rodman. Or LeBron only became LeBron when he had shooters and DWade. Magic was only as great as he was because he had "The Captain" Kareem Abdul-Jabbar and James Worthy. That point was so stupid. I definitely lost years of my life from that. Having Magic over Curry is cool but the reasoning for it is insane.
They’re stupid lol..curru been better than magic for years even the players know it’s just the old heads and nostalgia hell even magic had warriors beating lakers steph curry is top 5 etc they just wanna the bro
what they dont talk about is how hes the only reason they became who they are. Bro was putting up 24-5-9 on nearly 50-45-90 splits before he turned those guys into stars. he gave their skillsets a purpose. I dont get why they hate him so much. maybe because basketball isnt about boring ass layups and fighting no more. plus hes small light skin and not very athletic and grew up rich with both parents
😂Steph curry the only dude in history who get taxed because his teammates can pass an shoot. Meanwhile Magic played his entire career with the 2nd all time leader in pts Kareem but nobody talks about that
Rajon Rondo over Steve Nash & Brodie is absolutely criminal. He was absolutely important for Boston to win but his play outside of Boston was NOT that impressive, cut it out. I’ll never understand why scoring PG’s are held less valuable than “Traditional PG’s”.
Nah this format is so fire please keep doing these top 10s 🔥 Also STEVE NASH AT 9???? SOMEONE HAD RONDO OVER STEVE NASH?? I swear if nash was black the convos around him would change so much
bro was even born in Africa and that didn’t even help him 😂 they just mad at his MVPs but ignore his 07 finals run robbery from the horry hipcheck and Amare/Diaw suspensions 😂
@@MarzTalksSports He's literally an efficient all time passer who's damn good at shooting?? There's no other explanation other than race and his boring ass name 😂 he fits every type of PG archetype possible bar the Drose/Russ type
So Ant could pretty much disrespect the whole 80s and 90s players which includes Magic but Magic can't throw shots back? Don't throw stones while living in a glass house
About the first part of the segment on disrespect between generations. The thing is we all have to admit that players today are just better than players of the past. Thats how the evolution of sports work, they are stronger, faster, have more skills, more stamina, better understanding of the game and tactics, etc. So when we talk about older players we have to make the distinction about how great they were FOR THEIR TIME. Like Marz said, if you start to say Clyde Drexler Would beat KD or Kawhi, or that Patrick Ewing would cook AD you are just disrespecting player of today that are objectively better. The moment you do that, younger generations are going to watch the highlights and see that they have less skills than college players of today and they are going to disrecpect that old great back.
Top 10 list in order GOAT PGs - Steph Magic 2nd Tier - CP3 Oscar Nash 3rd Tier - John Kidd Zeke Russ Gary my top 10 PG list of all time consist of prime, peak, longevity, scoring, efficiency, playmaking, defense, reg szn performance and postszn elevation I left out Luka, Trae, Shai.. we need more prime seasons of them in these type of conversations…
@@MarzTalksSportsI count west in my SG list, and yeah I am not too familiar with Walt Frazier, he is a player I really would have to watch more to get an opinion on him…
Nash in his prime years was averaging 43-47 percent from 3 point range. This was with around four 3 point attempts per game. So imagine him in today's era where he would have way more freedom to chuck more 3's? He could double his 3 point attempts from 4 to like 8 a game. He would easily put up 25+ ppg in today's era. Yeah, his 3 point percentage would probably dip a bit from attempting more 3's. But he was averaging 43-47 percent from 3. Even if his 3 point percentage dipped 3 percent, he would still be a 40+ percent 3 point shooter. I feel like his game is designed for today's era. And yes, he's better than Rondo imo.
i think this can only apply to me,i try not to come across disrespectful,i think just my clear disdain for accolades means i start off w zeke in a lower standing than most cos i dont care for the 'only small players to lead a team to a title are zeke and steph' talking points. i think my eval of his game was accurate but its possible i do understate how good he still was,EXCELLENT passer who was very willing to take risks. had the ball on a string and able to get into areas on the court most others couldnt,extremely fast and agile but also a capable jumpshooter 'particularly from midrange' he reminds me a little of a PG allen iverson stylistically,relentless,fast,great handle,willing shooter on great defensive teams.
Idc what any of y'all say. It's cool to see a young dude with critical-thinking skills like Jordan. Not saying I completely agree with his Rondo take but I get where he's coming from. What he said about Stockton I agree with. So many on this channel try to undermine that man's career when he played his role as a traditional point guard to perfection.
I wanna make it clear what my individual list was: Steph Magic West Oscar CP3 Nash Stockton Walt Frazier Jkidd Westbrook I feel i explained most of my rationales for players in certain spots,if theres anything i didnt explain during the show and youd like me to,just respond to this comment with your questions.Also shoutout to Jordan i liked his perspective on things even if we didnt agree on everything.
@@Implementingdynamics Longevity was the biggest thing,i think nash peaked higher (although close) but chris pauls having some of the greatest longevity ever made it easier for me to put him above. alongside clear defensive value. (subpoint but in case someone asks) the reason longevity wasnt enough for a stockton/kidd is cos i think the peak gap was too large personally and nash still had an extended prime himself)
@@Implementingdynamicsboth are similar impactful in scoring and playmaking, Nash has that edge in offensive impact overall, but CP3 being an above average defender vs Nash being a negative defender hurts his value…
We did see magic by himself in 1991 and he led an elite offense with no Kareem and a washed worthy. Everyone on that roster fell off a cliff in 92 when he retired
Rondo over Nash I will never understand. Nash is just the MUCH better offensive player. Rondo was a pest defensively but both were so small they could be back down by damn near anyone. Nash efficiency, ISO scoring, tied with his playmaking makes him one of the best offensive weapons ever. What are we doing man. Teams SAGG off rondo ffs
His productivity ultimately only aligned with individual success where as the others pgs being compared had individual success which translated to team success.
@@philosoqhythis is just a lie,people only measure team success by winning a championship when nash undoubtably made his team better. he undoubtably made his teammates lives easier. his productivity ultimately aligned w ATG offense thats what it aligned with
Steph Magic Big O West Cp3 Nash Kidd Stockton Russ Walt Zeke so overrated IMO, usually don’t rank post and pre 3 point line together but if I do west and big o have to be there
@@victoralexander3767 Stockton is clear of zeke and so is Walt, Walt peak is higher and longevity is 1 or 2 years apart at best and Stockton longevity is way too much for zeke convos
just got CTE listening to this podcast, idk why i do it to myself. better off just showing my grandma nba player names and having her decide who's better, it'd be more accurate
1:14:05 I think Ox and Chill were wild for leaving Russ out of the top 10 PG's. He's accomplished too much to not be on the list. An MVP, 2-time scoring champ, 3-time assists champ, and the most triple doubles of all-time. With that being said, Ron having Russ 4th all-time is disgusting 🤢 1:24:36 Having to hear somebody try to argue Rondo is better than 2-time MVP Steve Nash was NOT on my to-do list today
FR 😂 THATS WHAT I LIKE ABOUT CHILL THE MOST, he and I and Marz understand the playmaking impact aspect and other tangibles that go to the offensive side, more than just scoring a bucket
@@BIGOXMedia I’m still gonna be part of the chat goofy, and ur fans won’t be able to save u now with actual judges. Maybe u can make a run in the losers bracket bum.
At 1:58:20. Jordan talks about Leandro Barboso maybe being 6th man and that being Help for Steve Nash. But when AI has 6th man of the year and DPOY he played with People in prison.
There’s only two people you could put in this top 10 next to James Harden and it works, especially with how he insisted on playing the point in that time. CP3 and Steph.
From December 5th, 2019, to February 5th, 2020, Russ played 24 games and Caplea played 23. Russ averaged 29-8-7 on 48/24/83 splits on 4 TOV. The Rockets went 16-8 in the games Russ played. Russ was playing well 2 months before Caplea was traded
@MarzTalksSports I should've noted this, but I was in class and didn't have time. But there were games during this stretch where either Russ did play and Capela didn't and vice versa that I didn't factor out
His rockets stint was underrated, the way they used him as a roll man to make decisions and how he just attacked the rim when he was wide open from three was crazy.
It's easier to find a worthy, Byron Scott and ac green as complimentary pieces than draymond and klay. The majority of championship teams are filled with role players like what was on the 80s lakers. A player like draymond is super rare and he's really the only player in that archetype which basically completely compliments Steph. Steph impact is way less without Dray on the court
Love the Russ placement but overrating Zeke, underrating Oscar, leaving off Nash and the Logo, and even thinking about putting Parker on it is CRAZY. Also Dame doesn’t really belong.
The fact that the guy who said Rondo over Nash also said that Nash had the ball in his hands all game shows he didn’t watch Nash. The guy was good off the ball and his usage rate was always relatively low. He’s NEVER had a season above 25% Usage rate for god sake
usage has no correlation to how much u have the ball. the reason nash usage rate was low was because he barely shot the ball,usage rate may be the most misrepresented stat ever
@@MarzTalksSports it shows how much of your teams plays are ran through you. Btw the reason Nash was low was because the suns shot the ball so quickly. While harden got into his half court offence damn near every possession. Btw it’s 2 completely different eras. I’m not saying Nash over harden. I’m saying Nash is so much better than rondo offensively. I don’t think rondo does 1 thing better than Nash offensively. And Nash was ball dominant but he atleast was good off the ball
@@EthicalBall thats not why nash was so low,ur not the only person who drastically misinterprets usage rate i just had this conversation in a comment section like 2 days ago
@@drenchmansports He ran better offenses. Impacted more. Its not just about boxscore stats...And he didnt actually have the ball in his hands super long compared to others. For example Nash ran a seven seconds or less offense with dantoni. Do you know how high iq and quick processing speed you need to be that type of pg? In comparison harden under dantoni was a 24 seconds or less guy. Totally different. Thats why nashs usage % was always im rhe low 20s compared to the hardens and russ' of the world who had near 40% usage rates if not above. Its a huge difference.
@@canadadry4609 because Nash didn’t shoot as many times so his usage is lower .. someone said it best .. Nash couldn’t be both , efficient and aggressive.. so he settled for being efficient. That’s my only problem with this “ omg Nash was amazing 2x mvp “ crowd. It’s like okay.. but maybe if he was that amazing like you all say he was on offense he would over power and win games by averaging 35/40 in a 7 game series against the lakers. He could’ve at least got to the finals too!
@@drenchmansports He upped his scoring in 2005 from 15 ppg to 23 ppg. He upped his scoring without lowering his efficiency...at all. He did the same in 06. And in 07. And still diming players up at the same rate too, if not more. He's had no problem upscaling his scoring , in the playoffs against the toughest of defenses no less, opposed to other pass first players that have tried to scale up their scoring , and instead of scoring more, scored at the same level but oness efficiency...like a John Stockton. Theres a big difference in their self creation abilities against the toughest defenses. You're off here. Whoever said that quote quite frankly decieved you.
@@drenchmansports And im glad you brought up the lakers. You probably misremembered that game 5 against the lakers in 2010 that you mentioned artest hit the crazy shot in. Nash subbed into the 4th quarter with 5:22- left, suns down 7. 4 mid range jumpers and 1 assist to amare for a layup later , dominant down the stretch, put fear in the lakers...tied the game...and you said kobe shut him down. How? Where? Kobe not only didnt shut nash down, he watched his teams lead dwindle down when nash subbed back in, air balled the game winner and luckily for him the ball fell into artests hands for a put back. Nash was never that lucky. In fact luck always worked against hin like not having amare in 06(and still carrying to within 2 wins of a finals appearance) and suspensions in 07. It is what it is , doesn't work out for everyone. We can also talk about game 6 in 2006, the elimination game kobe dropped 50 points...nash droped 30+ and 10+ assists himself, was responsible for just as many points for his team that kobes 50 points and 5 assists was for his team, but he won because he had a better blend of scoring and getting his teammates involved. Noone will say nash had a better game than kobe because he didn't drop 50, but he won the most important game of the series resulting in kobe quitting on his team in game 7. Nash ABSOLUTELY was able to score more while maintaining his efficiency against the best defenses of that era.
The reason nfl don’t have these types of problems is because each position has skill and a niche . It’s too many variables to use to compare positions for it to be a valid conversation
1:25:40 buddy doesn’t realize that Nash was scoring similar numbers before Mike D’Antoni and still was a elite playmaker even after… still was a great or elite playmaker for the majority of his career
Chris Paul should be number 3-him not being top 5??? That’s crazy to me. He’s probably the best defender in this top 10 list, he’s at worst the third best passer, he’s a top 5 scorer in this list-come on man
2010 in game 5 n in a series tied 2-2 ? when steve nash put the fear of God in the lakers late in the game making shot after shot to put his team back in the game? Tie game. Kobe air balls a game winner and artest tips it back in to save the day. When did kobe shut down steve nash? Trainer jordan is apparently making stuff up here...
Off the top of my head IMO (not ranking Oscar or PG’s of that era because I haven’t seen enough of them): 1. Magic 2 Steph ^^^can go either way 3. Cp3 4. Kidd 5. Zeke 6. Nash 7. Westbrook 8. Dame 9. Stockton 10. GP A few different people I think these players have an argument to me just based off me watching them: Penny, Kyrie, Rondo, Wall, Tony Parker etc…of course people I’m not ranking like Frazier Oscar etc..
This is my ideal PCL BRACKET MARZ VS JACK GIFTED VS M TELL CASUAL VS OG SWIPA VS HAIZE PEN VS ZEEZY CHILL VS ELDER PIRATE VS JOHN D OX VS DION CASUAL HAS COME A LONG WAY AND HONESTLY DION IS COMING ALONG TOO
Mars capping. Getting rid of Capela on Houston ruined the team. Russ has played with Steven Adams and made him look good. They didn't get rid of Capela BECAUSE of Russ. That's insane. They went all in on small ball and kicking it out for 3 and then their only real rebounder was Russ at that point
i addressed this exact point in the video i believe. ab russ next to adams as a primary vs in houston as a secondary and why they arent the same thing. do u actually listen to what i say?
What's up PC fam! 🏀🔥 The PCL NBA Debate League Playoffs are tipping off on September 4th, and it will be epic! We’re bringing the heat with YOUR topic suggestions! That’s right-the debate topics you’ve been sending in will be in the spotlight. You won’t want to miss this!
Catch all the matchups here: ruclips.net/video/5iEDPCpSFbI/видео.html
Rondo over Nash is probably the worst take Ive ever heard ngl
@@epicnessbeyond4834 it was Bob wasn't it lol
Not the worst take, but certainly an uphill battle to take rondo over Nash but I can see why people may want rondo over Nash.
@@BigBankJab26I can only think of one reason
@@BigBankJab26 defense the only reason, but I want my pg to be a scorer and is the best playmaker
@@SkodenMOC I agree
John Stockton at 3 is nasty ass hell
Chris Paul is a better point guard 100
The Curry slander is crazy. Its bad enough when I hear he's not a PG. But now we hear that Curry is only who he is because of his teammates. By that logic, MJ was only MJ until he got Scottie and Rodman. Or LeBron only became LeBron when he had shooters and DWade. Magic was only as great as he was because he had "The Captain" Kareem Abdul-Jabbar and James Worthy. That point was so stupid. I definitely lost years of my life from that. Having Magic over Curry is cool but the reasoning for it is insane.
they trying all of the excuses for Curry NOT to surpass Magic, why do you think they saying is not a point guard so the discussion can't even start
They’re stupid lol..curru been better than magic for years even the players know it’s just the old heads and nostalgia hell even magic had warriors beating lakers steph curry is top 5 etc they just wanna the bro
@@jessicagalvan3358No Curry been hated since 2015 Championship i watched at that time. Because He the Guy that took away lbj Rings .
what they dont talk about is how hes the only reason they became who they are. Bro was putting up 24-5-9 on nearly 50-45-90 splits before he turned those guys into stars. he gave their skillsets a purpose. I dont get why they hate him so much. maybe because basketball isnt about boring ass layups and fighting no more. plus hes small light skin and not very athletic and grew up rich with both parents
@@jessicagalvan3358you sound ridiculous
😂Steph curry the only dude in history who get taxed because his teammates can pass an shoot. Meanwhile Magic played his entire career with the 2nd all time leader in pts Kareem but nobody talks about that
They cry bout the KD move for 8 years now meanwhile magic had the luxury to play with a « top 3 player ever »
The only? Umm bill Russell, Steve Nash, Tim Duncan, and Kareem and Kobe to an extent get penalized all the time for playing with stacked teams.
@@TheIcemanthomasTim Duncan does not get taxed for that super team bullshit narrative. He never played with a top 50 player after David Robinson.
It's so silly because every top 10 player was on some stacked team.
@@TheIcemanthomasNash never does nor Russell & def not Duncan.
Rajon Rondo over Steve Nash & Brodie is absolutely criminal. He was absolutely important for Boston to win but his play outside of Boston was NOT that impressive, cut it out.
I’ll never understand why scoring PG’s are held less valuable than “Traditional PG’s”.
Rondo over Nash is NASTY WORK.
Having Rondo > Nash is just reverse racism 😂😂😂
You made me laugh bro 😂 true
🤣🤣🤣🔥
Cp3 at 7 is a disgrace
He's anywhere between 4 and 7. I got him at 5
Nah this format is so fire please keep doing these top 10s 🔥
Also STEVE NASH AT 9???? SOMEONE HAD RONDO OVER STEVE NASH?? I swear if nash was black the convos around him would change so much
@@retrey63 not gonna make it a race thing but i feel im so far on the opposite end of all nash opinions
bro was even born in Africa and that didn’t even help him 😂 they just mad at his MVPs but ignore his 07 finals run robbery from the horry hipcheck and Amare/Diaw suspensions 😂
@@MarzTalksSports He's literally an efficient all time passer who's damn good at shooting?? There's no other explanation other than race and his boring ass name 😂 he fits every type of PG archetype possible bar the Drose/Russ type
@@SkodenMOC I honestly believe pound for pound he might be the most disrespected nba all time great
@@retrey63 never won a chip and obviously the mvp 'controversy' so hes not gonna be looked on favourbaly
Rondo over Nash is pure lunacy
So Ant could pretty much disrespect the whole 80s and 90s players which includes Magic but Magic can't throw shots back? Don't throw stones while living in a glass house
Can’t ? Old heads throwing shade since forever so this is not new
Every time Ant come up, Swipa get butt hurt😂.
🤣🤣🤣🤣 he a real hater.
Us Nash fans really have an uphill battle to get this man some respect lol
Im trying
Keep spreading the good word marz
Fr man Marz and a few Nash Stans like myself gotta remind the world 🌎
Ya I hate on Nash but after wat I jus watched imma take it easy on him 😂😂
About the first part of the segment on disrespect between generations.
The thing is we all have to admit that players today are just better than players of the past. Thats how the evolution of sports work, they are stronger, faster, have more skills, more stamina, better understanding of the game and tactics, etc.
So when we talk about older players we have to make the distinction about how great they were FOR THEIR TIME.
Like Marz said, if you start to say Clyde Drexler Would beat KD or Kawhi, or that Patrick Ewing would cook AD you are just disrespecting player of today that are objectively better.
The moment you do that, younger generations are going to watch the highlights and see that they have less skills than college players of today and they are going to disrecpect that old great back.
ur gonna hate what our guest said towards the end of the show lmao
Fax
College players of today have more skill? That's some funny shit. Dumb as hell, but thanks for the laugh.
Yall need a real Houstonian (me) on there cause Rondo over Nash is ridiculous
And he won’t stop bringing up Harden, I really am in the minority of Rockets fans that do not care for Harden.
@@Steelo832thats tuff
@@MarzTalksSports is what it is I guess
Top 10 list in order
GOAT PGs - Steph Magic
2nd Tier - CP3 Oscar Nash
3rd Tier - John Kidd Zeke Russ Gary
my top 10 PG list of all time consist of prime, peak, longevity, scoring, efficiency, playmaking, defense, reg szn performance and postszn elevation
I left out Luka, Trae, Shai.. we need more prime seasons of them in these type of conversations…
@@SkodenMOC west not a pg? i feel walt frazier is being slept on alot by the community
@@MarzTalksSportsI count west in my SG list, and yeah I am not too familiar with Walt Frazier, he is a player I really would have to watch more to get an opinion on him…
@@SkodenMOC valid fair enough
No way you took defense into and put Nash in tier two
@@TheSwish_ no way you ignored the other things that put him up there as well 🤣
Nash in his prime years was averaging 43-47 percent from 3 point range. This was with around four 3 point attempts per game. So imagine him in today's era where he would have way more freedom to chuck more 3's? He could double his 3 point attempts from 4 to like 8 a game. He would easily put up 25+ ppg in today's era. Yeah, his 3 point percentage would probably dip a bit from attempting more 3's. But he was averaging 43-47 percent from 3. Even if his 3 point percentage dipped 3 percent, he would still be a 40+ percent 3 point shooter. I feel like his game is designed for today's era. And yes, he's better than Rondo imo.
Having Stockton that high is criminal 😂I just never understand the panels logic
Some of yall disrespect Zeke too much for me
i think this can only apply to me,i try not to come across disrespectful,i think just my clear disdain for accolades means i start off w zeke in a lower standing than most cos i dont care for the 'only small players to lead a team to a title are zeke and steph' talking points. i think my eval of his game was accurate but its possible i do understate how good he still was,EXCELLENT passer who was very willing to take risks. had the ball on a string and able to get into areas on the court most others couldnt,extremely fast and agile but also a capable jumpshooter 'particularly from midrange' he reminds me a little of a PG allen iverson stylistically,relentless,fast,great handle,willing shooter on great defensive teams.
Stockton is just not better than cp3 Nash or Luka. What are we doing man🤦🏾♂️
Idc what any of y'all say. It's cool to see a young dude with critical-thinking skills like Jordan. Not saying I completely agree with his Rondo take but I get where he's coming from. What he said about Stockton I agree with. So many on this channel try to undermine that man's career when he played his role as a traditional point guard to perfection.
Y’all might hate me for this but I Don’t think Russ being number 10 on this list was that bad
I don’t either
It’s not bad at all people just be hating
it’s not that bad of an opinion…
He should’ve been higher tbh. It’s like only 5-6 better PGs ever
@@TheSwagIsBackare there only 5-6 more efficient point guards?
I wanna make it clear what my individual list was:
Steph
Magic
West
Oscar
CP3
Nash
Stockton
Walt Frazier
Jkidd
Westbrook
I feel i explained most of my rationales for players in certain spots,if theres anything i didnt explain during the show and youd like me to,just respond to this comment with your questions.Also shoutout to Jordan i liked his perspective on things even if we didnt agree on everything.
Why is cp over nash?
@@Implementingdynamics Longevity was the biggest thing,i think nash peaked higher (although close) but chris pauls having some of the greatest longevity ever made it easier for me to put him above. alongside clear defensive value. (subpoint but in case someone asks) the reason longevity wasnt enough for a stockton/kidd is cos i think the peak gap was too large personally and nash still had an extended prime himself)
@@Implementingdynamicsboth are similar impactful in scoring and playmaking, Nash has that edge in offensive impact overall, but CP3 being an above average defender vs Nash being a negative defender hurts his value…
What makes Russ better than Zeke again?
I got big 0 higher and got westbrook higher than kidd stockton walt easily but cp nash gp debatable imo
Steve Nash is the most under rated player ever imo. 😊
Magic,curry,Stockton,jkidd,cp3,
Jerry west,issiah Thomas, Oscar,Steve Nash,Westbrook
A Dbz debate was something I wasn't expecting W Ron and Swipa
Lmaoo Kyrie wasn’t even a honorable mention
lol as Marz said we ain’t got time 😭
We did see magic by himself in 1991 and he led an elite offense with no Kareem and a washed worthy. Everyone on that roster fell off a cliff in 92 when he retired
Worthy was not washed that season 💀
Rondo over Nash I will never understand. Nash is just the MUCH better offensive player. Rondo was a pest defensively but both were so small they could be back down by damn near anyone. Nash efficiency, ISO scoring, tied with his playmaking makes him one of the best offensive weapons ever. What are we doing man. Teams SAGG off rondo ffs
Stockton over Shai nem is hilarious
Essence of basketball is about competition. Comparisons are inevitable.
Why do they wanna hate on Nash so much
His productivity ultimately only aligned with individual success where as the others pgs being compared had individual success which translated to team success.
@@philosoqhythis is just a lie,people only measure team success by winning a championship when nash undoubtably made his team better. he undoubtably made his teammates lives easier. his productivity ultimately aligned w ATG offense thats what it aligned with
Steph
Magic
Big O
West
Cp3
Nash
Kidd
Stockton
Russ
Walt
Zeke so overrated IMO, usually don’t rank post and pre 3 point line together but if I do west and big o have to be there
I get people might overrate Zeke but Walt over Zeke is an over correction
And honestly Stockton over Zeke is kinda crazy too.
@@victoralexander3767 Stockton is clear of zeke and so is Walt, Walt peak is higher and longevity is 1 or 2 years apart at best and Stockton longevity is way too much for zeke convos
Don’t just say Zeke is overated and not explain
@@TheIcemanthomas ppl think he’s a top 5 pg and that or better than guys like Chris Paul or Steve Nash and I cant fathom that
just got CTE listening to this podcast, idk why i do it to myself.
better off just showing my grandma nba player names and having her decide who's better, it'd be more accurate
Steph curry had the best peak ever at the PG position (2016). But magic had the best PG Szn OAT tho (1987).
1:48:49 I have Jerry West at 4 all-time. Dude was a bucket. I think very highly of Mr. West. Top 5 PG ez
You damn right Marz, JERRY AINT BETTER THAN KYRIE😂
1:14:05 I think Ox and Chill were wild for leaving Russ out of the top 10 PG's. He's accomplished too much to not be on the list. An MVP, 2-time scoring champ, 3-time assists champ, and the most triple doubles of all-time. With that being said, Ron having Russ 4th all-time is disgusting 🤢
1:24:36 Having to hear somebody try to argue Rondo is better than 2-time MVP Steve Nash was NOT on my to-do list today
Gen Z: no hesi tween tween = No skill
Gen X: facepalm
Swipa gets so bias whenever ants name gets brought up😂😂
Why is Derrick rose on there lmaoo
Jack sandbagging to eliminate Marz in the first round would be elite
i have a bad feeling thats whats happening
Trainer Jordan really likes boxscore stats.
blue shirt lost me when he said he had Lonzo over Nash lol, they just give anyone a microphone
Now if he said Magic had to quit for point shaving, he’d be wrong.
Chill is the best listener on the pannel :)
🚨🚨PC THAT DEBATE BETWEEN SWIPA AND JORDAN IS THE TYPE OF CONTENT WE NEED
That entire Rondo, Nash and CP3 convo
FR 😂 THATS WHAT I LIKE ABOUT CHILL THE MOST, he and I and Marz understand the playmaking impact aspect and other tangibles that go to the offensive side, more than just scoring a bucket
Big Ox getting the 3 seed after AI interference isnt moving me, we all saw the debates
I’m happy your vote no longer matters
@@BIGOXMedia I’m still gonna be part of the chat goofy, and ur fans won’t be able to save u now with actual judges. Maybe u can make a run in the losers bracket bum.
Rigged.
👀
@@MarzTalksSports Count it up, bro. This is public record. The AI was built by Betty Crocker 😭😭😭
W episode but Rondo over Steve Nash is crazy lol
I’m just glad nobody put Tony Parker in their top 10 also rondo over Nash is nasty and Stockton top 3 is disgusting 😂
Mars having kidd on his at 9 is crazy
Not having Gary Payton is crazy
Gary Payton dawging Steve Nash in his hey day
At 1:58:20. Jordan talks about Leandro Barboso maybe being 6th man and that being Help for Steve Nash. But when AI has 6th man of the year and DPOY he played with People in prison.
Mike d'antoni was the biggest reasons why the Suns were so good. I give him way more credit than I give Steve Nash
Yeah he was doin a hell of a job w the 04 suns
Nash still had multiple no. 1 and no. 2 offensive season impacts after the 07 szn Mike left
There’s only two people you could put in this top 10 next to James Harden and it works, especially with how he insisted on playing the point in that time. CP3 and Steph.
First, what Marz said in the beginning about the different generations, I agree with. But I also agree that the disrespect goes both ways.
Ox sensitive as all hell. Nothing Magic said was wrong ….
The Rondo disrespect is crazy!
He’s a role player. A really great one. But still a role player
@TheIcemanthomas you right RUNNING the team and ALWAYS being the smartest player on the court is a role player.
He was never the best player on the court lol@ornandowatford6539
@@brandonhagin I never said he was
From December 5th, 2019, to February 5th, 2020, Russ played 24 games and Caplea played 23. Russ averaged 29-8-7 on 48/24/83 splits on 4 TOV. The Rockets went 16-8 in the games Russ played. Russ was playing well 2 months before Caplea was traded
Hmm thanks for this,let me do some more research
@MarzTalksSports I should've noted this, but I was in class and didn't have time. But there were games during this stretch where either Russ did play and Capela didn't and vice versa that I didn't factor out
@@chikinbizkitjr13 thanks anyway its still a good start point cos i could very well be wrong on that 20 rockets team,im always open to it
His rockets stint was underrated, the way they used him as a roll man to make decisions and how he just attacked the rim when he was wide open from three was crazy.
It's easier to find a worthy, Byron Scott and ac green as complimentary pieces than draymond and klay. The majority of championship teams are filled with role players like what was on the 80s lakers.
A player like draymond is super rare and he's really the only player in that archetype which basically completely compliments Steph. Steph impact is way less without Dray on the court
THANK YOU
The real top 10 PG of all time! 1. Magic, 2. Steph 3. Zeke, 4. CP3, 5. J Kidd, 6. Russ, 7. O. Robertson, 8. Tony Parker, 9. John Stockton, 10. Dame!
Love the Russ placement but overrating Zeke, underrating Oscar, leaving off Nash and the Logo, and even thinking about putting Parker on it is CRAZY. Also Dame doesn’t really belong.
@@victoralexander3767 Zeke will forever be top 3 PGs EVER. Tony Parker is a winner and also came up clutch in a lot of big moments in the playoffs.
Why is magic above Steph? Unless your weighing accolades extremely heavy
@@448DamonXX Accolades is a part of it. But because Magic is better than Steph. 🤷🏿♂️
@@victoralexander3767Stockton behind Tony Parker is CRAZY
The fact that the guy who said Rondo over Nash also said that Nash had the ball in his hands all game shows he didn’t watch Nash. The guy was good off the ball and his usage rate was always relatively low. He’s NEVER had a season above 25% Usage rate for god sake
Guys like harden and Westbrook hit 40% the most ever in a season and yet he was glazing
It’s also 2 completely different eras. Rondo is never doing what Nash did in 06 without Amare
usage has no correlation to how much u have the ball. the reason nash usage rate was low was because he barely shot the ball,usage rate may be the most misrepresented stat ever
@@MarzTalksSports it shows how much of your teams plays are ran through you. Btw the reason Nash was low was because the suns shot the ball so quickly. While harden got into his half court offence damn near every possession.
Btw it’s 2 completely different eras. I’m not saying Nash over harden. I’m saying Nash is so much better than rondo offensively. I don’t think rondo does 1 thing better than Nash offensively. And Nash was ball dominant but he atleast was good off the ball
@@EthicalBall thats not why nash was so low,ur not the only person who drastically misinterprets usage rate i just had this conversation in a comment section like 2 days ago
Trainer Jordan likes 40% usage player like russ but leaves nash off his list because he has the ball in his hands a lot...
No because he had the ball in his hand a lot and didn’t do as much other players who had the ball in there hand a lot too
@@drenchmansports
He ran better offenses. Impacted more. Its not just about boxscore stats...And he didnt actually have the ball in his hands super long compared to others. For example Nash ran a seven seconds or less offense with dantoni. Do you know how high iq and quick processing speed you need to be that type of pg? In comparison harden under dantoni was a 24 seconds or less guy. Totally different. Thats why nashs usage % was always im rhe low 20s compared to the hardens and russ' of the world who had near 40% usage rates if not above. Its a huge difference.
@@canadadry4609 because Nash didn’t shoot as many times so his usage is lower .. someone said it best .. Nash couldn’t be both , efficient and aggressive.. so he settled for being efficient. That’s my only problem with this “ omg Nash was amazing 2x mvp “ crowd. It’s like okay.. but maybe if he was that amazing like you all say he was on offense he would over power and win games by averaging 35/40 in a 7 game series against the lakers. He could’ve at least got to the finals too!
@@drenchmansports
He upped his scoring in 2005 from 15 ppg to 23 ppg. He upped his scoring without lowering his efficiency...at all. He did the same in 06. And in 07. And still diming players up at the same rate too, if not more. He's had no problem upscaling his scoring , in the playoffs against the toughest of defenses no less, opposed to other pass first players that have tried to scale up their scoring , and instead of scoring more, scored at the same level but oness efficiency...like a John Stockton. Theres a big difference in their self creation abilities against the toughest defenses.
You're off here. Whoever said that quote quite frankly decieved you.
@@drenchmansports
And im glad you brought up the lakers. You probably misremembered that game 5 against the lakers in 2010 that you mentioned artest hit the crazy shot in.
Nash subbed into the 4th quarter with 5:22- left, suns down 7. 4 mid range jumpers and 1 assist to amare for a layup later , dominant down the stretch, put fear in the lakers...tied the game...and you said kobe shut him down. How? Where? Kobe not only didnt shut nash down, he watched his teams lead dwindle down when nash subbed back in, air balled the game winner and luckily for him the ball fell into artests hands for a put back. Nash was never that lucky. In fact luck always worked against hin like not having amare in 06(and still carrying to within 2 wins of a finals appearance) and suspensions in 07. It is what it is , doesn't work out for everyone.
We can also talk about game 6 in 2006, the elimination game kobe dropped 50 points...nash droped 30+ and 10+ assists himself, was responsible for just as many points for his team that kobes 50 points and 5 assists was for his team, but he won because he had a better blend of scoring and getting his teammates involved. Noone will say nash had a better game than kobe because he didn't drop 50, but he won the most important game of the series resulting in kobe quitting on his team in game 7.
Nash ABSOLUTELY was able to score more while maintaining his efficiency against the best defenses of that era.
1. Steph 2. Magic 3. Oscar 4. Luka 5. CP3 6. Nash 7. Kidd 8. Russ 9. Walt 10. GP
11-15 Luka, Trae, KJ, Dame and Rondo
Luka 4th and 11th?
The reason nfl don’t have these types of problems is because each position has skill and a niche . It’s too many variables to use to compare positions for it to be a valid conversation
I don’t know which was more disrespectful the Nash conversation ( the whole thing) or the John Stockton better than Luka and sga conversation
SGA has had two good seasons and has yet to do anything good in the playoffs.
Luka is understandable.
The disrespect to Shelvin Mack smh
Marz was really cooking in the Steph vs Magic debate
Dame a top 10 pg of all time is insane
1:25:40 buddy doesn’t realize that Nash was scoring similar numbers before Mike D’Antoni and still was a elite playmaker even after… still was a great or elite playmaker for the majority of his career
That dude don’t know how to interpret basketball based on his argument in Nash vs Rondo lol it was hard to listen to
I'm a big Rondo fan and can still say he is too high on this list.
The curry isn’t a pg logic is nonsense. So is Jokic a pg and is bron a pg too?
Rondo is jrue holiday level . That’s a better comparison
Mars understands the technicalities of basketball but doesn’t understand it from a competitive standpoint
Cp3 is a top 5 PG.
Jordan is a casual to me.
I don’t think so
John Stockton on timb wins them a chip no kizzy
Marz be cooking sht bro 😭😭😭
Not having Isiah Thomas in your Top 10 PG list is an interesting take for sure
Chris Paul should be number 3-him not being top 5??? That’s crazy to me. He’s probably the best defender in this top 10 list, he’s at worst the third best passer, he’s a top 5 scorer in this list-come on man
To say “and he averaged a decent amount of assist. 11 maybe 12” like that’s wouldn’t lead the nba today
We need timestamps!!!!
2010 in game 5 n in a series tied 2-2 ? when steve nash put the fear of God in the lakers late in the game making shot after shot to put his team back in the game? Tie game. Kobe air balls a game winner and artest tips it back in to save the day. When did kobe shut down steve nash?
Trainer jordan is apparently making stuff up here...
W guest panelist
Ok I fasten my sit belts getting ready for Luka disrespect.
Kidd Jrue GP and Walt the best defenders at the PG position
respect 22 lonzo for 30 games
@@MarzTalksSports if it was 50 games he would be here man, sucks since I been a bulls fan since 2010 😂 I thought we had sum special
@@howitzdone8992 He was so good i still get pissed off thinkin ab it
@@MarzTalksSports tell me abt it every time we have something good a injury happens or the refs cheat for lebron(2015)
Parker over Rondo
Off the top of my head IMO (not ranking Oscar or PG’s of that era because I haven’t seen enough of them):
1. Magic
2 Steph
^^^can go either way
3. Cp3
4. Kidd
5. Zeke
6. Nash
7. Westbrook
8. Dame
9. Stockton
10. GP
A few different people I think these players have an argument to me just based off me watching them: Penny, Kyrie, Rondo, Wall, Tony Parker etc…of course people I’m not ranking like Frazier Oscar etc..
This is my ideal PCL BRACKET
MARZ VS JACK
GIFTED VS M TELL
CASUAL VS OG
SWIPA VS HAIZE
PEN VS ZEEZY
CHILL VS ELDER
PIRATE VS JOHN D
OX VS DION
CASUAL HAS COME A LONG WAY AND HONESTLY DION IS COMING ALONG TOO
Grew up with assssssss whoopins! Facts 😂
Mars capping. Getting rid of Capela on Houston ruined the team. Russ has played with Steven Adams and made him look good. They didn't get rid of Capela BECAUSE of Russ. That's insane. They went all in on small ball and kicking it out for 3 and then their only real rebounder was Russ at that point
i addressed this exact point in the video i believe. ab russ next to adams as a primary vs in houston as a secondary and why they arent the same thing. do u actually listen to what i say?
@@MarzTalksSports don't think I got to that part. I'm assuming it was after you said what I was talking about here. My bad
@@PurpleGengar822 appreciate the honesty
@@MarzTalksSports for sure. Thanks for the content. We appreciate it. Clearly a Russ fan here. Sorry for going over the top
@@PurpleGengar822 u good dw ab it W russ fan
Og with blue shirt and beard is lowkey bias as hell
How can you say that ?
are you guys doing the other positions as well?
yes
Nash winning back to back MVP'S, is one of the biggest travesties in the history of the award!
I’m so glad Ron is a Russ fan 😭😭😭 he be holding it down fr, RUSS IS A TOP 5 PG OF ALL TIME, I’m tired of ox and chill disrespecting greatness