back in the day I started on kawasaki KH125 had 3 of them over 2 years melted them all but bloody good fun 40 years later got a ZZR1400 and ride it just like the 125 keeps you alive
I mean, I get what it means but I feel like no-one with a brain would drive an a2 or a liter bike like they drive their 125 bike, like noone with a brain would go on a ferrari like they go on a toyota aygo or yaris. And if they were to do that then the problem is the driver and not what plataform they learn on or not. 125s are designed in a way where the top end ones will reach about top legal speed or slightly above, while I agrer that the a2 bikes being quicker can get you out of a pickle by their higher acceleration, it also takes a skilled and conscient enough driver to drive it that way, which makes it not matter because the reckless driver will do reckless stuff no matter if he learns on a 125 or a 500cc
Imho I think anything smaller than a 300cc is just a waste of time. I ride a Kawasaki Z400 and it's absolutely perfect to learn on. It's got enough power to be confident on the roadway but not enough power to get yourself in too much trouble even if you accidentally get on the throttle too hard when you're first starting out. I think that smaller cc bikes like 125s are actually more dangerous than say a 400cc or 500cc because they're so slow and take so long to accelerate and respond to your inputs and they're so lightweight that the wind off other cars blows you around a lot more on the highway. But that's just my opinion and I very well could be totally wrong, it's just my personal experience. But I still think a 400cc is a perfect size to start on and then move up to a 650cc or 700cc from there, and honestly anything above a 700cc isn't really necessary to get you around anywhere and do anything you need to do on the road. Liter bikes and above are mainly for the track unless you just really want one, which is perfectly fine but they're not necessary. Cruisers are a different story of course when it comes to displacement.
Rubbish.... Smaller bikes teach you a lot without the fear of having too much power so the bike will bite you. I have ridden for the past 48 years and ridden everything from mopeds, Moto X bikes, GP bikes, 1000cc sports bikes and touring bikes as well as having 6 250cc bikes currently and a 155cc pit bike which is the bike I currently use the most. The 250cc bikes are more than quick enough to have fun on and even on track I can keep up or even pass guys on 1000cc bikes, I even have videos of me doing just that. The 155cc pit bike is about 14bhp and the most fun you can have, it is the same spec as the ones many of the BSB, WSBK riders and even a current Moto 2 race winner comes to the little Kart track to train on bikes less than 200cc. They use these little bikes as serious training tools and as quick as 99.99% of us think we could be, they are so much faster and use these bikes as part of their training most weeks. I have a Yamaha R1 also which is great and I have used it to ride to world superbike events in Italy from the UK touring through france as well as done track days on it too. Smaller bike teach you a lot and make you actually ride harder at lower speeds so you learn a lot more bike control with smaller bikes.
So I had a ZX9R as my first bike. Its all in people's heads, control your throttle and you will be fine ! Imo a small bike doesn't prepare you for a super bike anyway, A 125 can barely do 70mph and then you have the litre bikes which can do 200mph+. I guess the same way a fiesta will never make you a good bugatti driver
Why do superbike racers, Moto GP and BSB riders all ride 140cc to 190cc Pit bikes on a regular basis on Kart tracks if smaller bikes have no benefit? I would put money on even an old sod like me being able to lap you within 10 laps on either a 155cc pit bike at a kart track or within 15 laps of a full size track on a 1000cc bike. I was racing 2 stroke 250cc and 350cc race bikes which would bite you hard if you didn't have full concentration so my training bike back then was a Kawasaki KX80 so I could learn to slide a bike and control it... A very good GP rider was asked how he controlled a bike sliding.. His answer was "You don't! If you want to control a bike sliding you have to be the one to make it slide!". Small bikes teach you way more about throttle control than you would ever imagine.
@YAMR1M well I think we're talking about road riding here not track racing. Theres no part of the Bike test which requires you to "slide" around on your bike. I stand by my point. You sound like a great rider, congrats 👍
@@bigkaswrx8115 Road or track the 125cc bike makes learning to ride easier and allows you to learn quickly... OK so you don't need to learn to slide a bike for the test, but if you hit sand on the road, damp tarmac mid corner due to trees at the sie fo the road you will still get the bike slide or move around when you don't want it too.. With a big bike if you are not prepared for it or have not had it happen before on a smaller bike there is very good chance you will end up in a heap at the side of the road at best.. I was lucky to be riding 60bhp+ 250cc race bikes at 16 or 17 years old on track, but I started on a Honda C50 at 9 years old and then multiple bikes on dirt or tarmac of various sizes before I could ride on the road legally. Throttle control on a 900cc or a 1000cc bike is not something that is easy to master in every condition or every eventuality. But without having ridden or even STILL ride small bikes I would not be able to ride how I can ride even now all those years later.
@@YAMR1M I've been riding 6 years and never had a situation where I've needed to know how to "slide". Driving in rain, cold weather , leaves is basic stuff you learn as you ride. You sound like a racer, which I am not. Your also not taking into account cost. Buying smaller bikes and working your way up is very expensive. Some people (like me) can't afford to do that, so I'd rather spend what I saved on the bike of my dreams. My point is I and anyone else can start on a big bike, and if your sensible you will be perfectly fine. Been riding 6 years no slips, crashes, or near misses. And my first bike was a 143hp ZX9R which can hit 140mph+ in seconds 🤷♂️ depends on the person and how sensible they are.
@bigkaswrx8115 I started young, but I had to ride a 50cc bike at 16 and then a 125cc bike like anyone else. The skills you learn on a small bike directly transfer to the bigger bikes. Grit or gravel on the road, poor surface conditions are all easier to deal with on a smaller bike.. you can go from a smaller bike to a much bigger bike without too many issues so if it's cost related you could have jumped from one to the other after having mastered the smaller bike. But for so many it's not a great idea to do so and I have known too many get injured and stop riding or get killed over the years. I know more who have died on the road than the track. Most have only ever ridden on the road and I have only known one racer, personally, who died on the road. He was hit by a car and it was not his fault. Even now after almost a lifetime of riding I am still honing my skills and I have 7 bikes of 250cc or less and a Yamaha R1 with hopefully a KTM 1290 Super Duke or Ducati multistrada joining them next year. I would always say a novice rider will learn more from a small bike than going to a bigger bike immediately. But then I have only been riding since I was 9 years old and have 48 years of riding under my belt.
I'm in the us. So generally what you recommend to begginers is 300/400cc bikes. If had to ride a 125cc I simply wouldn't ride. Also if you can be responsible on the bike you can ride pretty much what ever. I can see your point of causing bad habits cause idk when you'd ever not be full throttle and bumping in power is simply going to cause you do do stupid things you shouldn't.
I have been riding at least 10 years longer than anyone my own age. I started riding as a child and my only goal in life was to go race, ride faster and faster with more powerful bikes. By the time I was old enough to go racing I had been riding 8 years and my first races bike were bigger than I could legally ride on the roads. But I soon realised if I couldn't ride the little 250cc and 350cc race bikes to their limits there was no point getting a bigger or more powerful and MUCH more expensive bike. I had to improve my own riding skills. I have been riding for 48 years now and I still ride on track with some current BSB and Moto 2 riders on bikes which are the same size and spec as theirs... 140cc to 155cc pit bikes. I actually have ridden more on the pit bike this year than any of my other 7 bikes. I even have some older 250cc two stroke road bikes which I have just taken to the track for a bit of fun and have ridden them in the fastest riders group and still pass guys on 600cc and 1000cc bikes. A 125cc class bike can teach you more even if you have been riding for years and years if you really want to improve your riding skills.
No, they provide a forgiving platform to learn on that won't try to kill you when you make the usual new rider mistakes..
back in the day I started on kawasaki KH125 had 3 of them over 2 years melted them all but bloody good fun 40 years later got a ZZR1400 and ride it just like the 125 keeps you alive
I mean, I get what it means but I feel like no-one with a brain would drive an a2 or a liter bike like they drive their 125 bike, like noone with a brain would go on a ferrari like they go on a toyota aygo or yaris. And if they were to do that then the problem is the driver and not what plataform they learn on or not. 125s are designed in a way where the top end ones will reach about top legal speed or slightly above, while I agrer that the a2 bikes being quicker can get you out of a pickle by their higher acceleration, it also takes a skilled and conscient enough driver to drive it that way, which makes it not matter because the reckless driver will do reckless stuff no matter if he learns on a 125 or a 500cc
Imho I think anything smaller than a 300cc is just a waste of time. I ride a Kawasaki Z400 and it's absolutely perfect to learn on. It's got enough power to be confident on the roadway but not enough power to get yourself in too much trouble even if you accidentally get on the throttle too hard when you're first starting out. I think that smaller cc bikes like 125s are actually more dangerous than say a 400cc or 500cc because they're so slow and take so long to accelerate and respond to your inputs and they're so lightweight that the wind off other cars blows you around a lot more on the highway. But that's just my opinion and I very well could be totally wrong, it's just my personal experience. But I still think a 400cc is a perfect size to start on and then move up to a 650cc or 700cc from there, and honestly anything above a 700cc isn't really necessary to get you around anywhere and do anything you need to do on the road. Liter bikes and above are mainly for the track unless you just really want one, which is perfectly fine but they're not necessary. Cruisers are a different story of course when it comes to displacement.
Rubbish.... Smaller bikes teach you a lot without the fear of having too much power so the bike will bite you. I have ridden for the past 48 years and ridden everything from mopeds, Moto X bikes, GP bikes, 1000cc sports bikes and touring bikes as well as having 6 250cc bikes currently and a 155cc pit bike which is the bike I currently use the most. The 250cc bikes are more than quick enough to have fun on and even on track I can keep up or even pass guys on 1000cc bikes, I even have videos of me doing just that. The 155cc pit bike is about 14bhp and the most fun you can have, it is the same spec as the ones many of the BSB, WSBK riders and even a current Moto 2 race winner comes to the little Kart track to train on bikes less than 200cc. They use these little bikes as serious training tools and as quick as 99.99% of us think we could be, they are so much faster and use these bikes as part of their training most weeks.
I have a Yamaha R1 also which is great and I have used it to ride to world superbike events in Italy from the UK touring through france as well as done track days on it too. Smaller bike teach you a lot and make you actually ride harder at lower speeds so you learn a lot more bike control with smaller bikes.
So I had a ZX9R as my first bike. Its all in people's heads, control your throttle and you will be fine ! Imo a small bike doesn't prepare you for a super bike anyway, A 125 can barely do 70mph and then you have the litre bikes which can do 200mph+. I guess the same way a fiesta will never make you a good bugatti driver
Why do superbike racers, Moto GP and BSB riders all ride 140cc to 190cc Pit bikes on a regular basis on Kart tracks if smaller bikes have no benefit? I would put money on even an old sod like me being able to lap you within 10 laps on either a 155cc pit bike at a kart track or within 15 laps of a full size track on a 1000cc bike. I was racing 2 stroke 250cc and 350cc race bikes which would bite you hard if you didn't have full concentration so my training bike back then was a Kawasaki KX80 so I could learn to slide a bike and control it... A very good GP rider was asked how he controlled a bike sliding.. His answer was "You don't! If you want to control a bike sliding you have to be the one to make it slide!". Small bikes teach you way more about throttle control than you would ever imagine.
@YAMR1M well I think we're talking about road riding here not track racing. Theres no part of the Bike test which requires you to "slide" around on your bike. I stand by my point. You sound like a great rider, congrats 👍
@@bigkaswrx8115 Road or track the 125cc bike makes learning to ride easier and allows you to learn quickly... OK so you don't need to learn to slide a bike for the test, but if you hit sand on the road, damp tarmac mid corner due to trees at the sie fo the road you will still get the bike slide or move around when you don't want it too.. With a big bike if you are not prepared for it or have not had it happen before on a smaller bike there is very good chance you will end up in a heap at the side of the road at best.. I was lucky to be riding 60bhp+ 250cc race bikes at 16 or 17 years old on track, but I started on a Honda C50 at 9 years old and then multiple bikes on dirt or tarmac of various sizes before I could ride on the road legally. Throttle control on a 900cc or a 1000cc bike is not something that is easy to master in every condition or every eventuality. But without having ridden or even STILL ride small bikes I would not be able to ride how I can ride even now all those years later.
@@YAMR1M I've been riding 6 years and never had a situation where I've needed to know how to "slide". Driving in rain, cold weather , leaves is basic stuff you learn as you ride. You sound like a racer, which I am not. Your also not taking into account cost. Buying smaller bikes and working your way up is very expensive. Some people (like me) can't afford to do that, so I'd rather spend what I saved on the bike of my dreams. My point is I and anyone else can start on a big bike, and if your sensible you will be perfectly fine. Been riding 6 years no slips, crashes, or near misses. And my first bike was a 143hp ZX9R which can hit 140mph+ in seconds 🤷♂️ depends on the person and how sensible they are.
@bigkaswrx8115 I started young, but I had to ride a 50cc bike at 16 and then a 125cc bike like anyone else. The skills you learn on a small bike directly transfer to the bigger bikes. Grit or gravel on the road, poor surface conditions are all easier to deal with on a smaller bike.. you can go from a smaller bike to a much bigger bike without too many issues so if it's cost related you could have jumped from one to the other after having mastered the smaller bike. But for so many it's not a great idea to do so and I have known too many get injured and stop riding or get killed over the years. I know more who have died on the road than the track. Most have only ever ridden on the road and I have only known one racer, personally, who died on the road. He was hit by a car and it was not his fault. Even now after almost a lifetime of riding I am still honing my skills and I have 7 bikes of 250cc or less and a Yamaha R1 with hopefully a KTM 1290 Super Duke or Ducati multistrada joining them next year. I would always say a novice rider will learn more from a small bike than going to a bigger bike immediately. But then I have only been riding since I was 9 years old and have 48 years of riding under my belt.
I'm in the us. So generally what you recommend to begginers is 300/400cc bikes. If had to ride a 125cc I simply wouldn't ride. Also if you can be responsible on the bike you can ride pretty much what ever. I can see your point of causing bad habits cause idk when you'd ever not be full throttle and bumping in power is simply going to cause you do do stupid things you shouldn't.
No wonder US motorcyclists have the higher amounts of accidents and deaths on bikes than the UK and Europe.
I have been riding at least 10 years longer than anyone my own age. I started riding as a child and my only goal in life was to go race, ride faster and faster with more powerful bikes. By the time I was old enough to go racing I had been riding 8 years and my first races bike were bigger than I could legally ride on the roads. But I soon realised if I couldn't ride the little 250cc and 350cc race bikes to their limits there was no point getting a bigger or more powerful and MUCH more expensive bike. I had to improve my own riding skills. I have been riding for 48 years now and I still ride on track with some current BSB and Moto 2 riders on bikes which are the same size and spec as theirs... 140cc to 155cc pit bikes. I actually have ridden more on the pit bike this year than any of my other 7 bikes. I even have some older 250cc two stroke road bikes which I have just taken to the track for a bit of fun and have ridden them in the fastest riders group and still pass guys on 600cc and 1000cc bikes. A 125cc class bike can teach you more even if you have been riding for years and years if you really want to improve your riding skills.