Solas lets the enemy take his pawns (people), sacrifices his queen (Mythal), while the mage (himself) sits in silence waiting for an opportunity to strike the winning blow. Nice.
His tactics involve sacrificing too many pieces. He can win, but he has little of his kingdom intact. What is the point of victory if your friends are in the ground.
This has got to be one of the most clever things I've ever seen in a video game to date. It's both a reference to one of the most popular chess games of all time, and a perfect representation of how both characters think and strategize. Not only that, but it also serves as huge foreshadowing to what Solas' plans might be for DA4.
@@snowtree07 i only play a couple chess game in my life so correct me if I'm wrong. Iron Bull plays offensively by using his Arishok to take Solas pieces, while Solas on the other hand focuses on getting check mate
This is one of the most clever things I've ever seen in a videogame. 1. It's well written banter in its own right. 2. It is great characterisation: Bull revels in the fight and measures victory in enemy kills. Solas hides his intent and is focused on the endgame. 3. It is world-building: Their names for the pieces also reveal differences in their respective cultures. 4. It is foreshadowing: Solas manipulating event and people like pawns. Sacrificing pieces, including his Queen (Flemeth/Mythal), to secure victory 5. If you really want to read into it, you could view the Pawn as The Inquisitor: A piece only powerful for being in the right place at the right time to prevent Corypheus (Black's Queen) from stopping the checkmate.
I love how they put the Immortal Game in, and picked one that illustrates how the two characters think. Iron Bull treats the game like a battle, intent on destroying Solas' pieces and occasionally taking note of his material advantage as a general might keep track of numerical advantage. But he fights like a warrior, getting stuck in with his strongest pieces but paying less attention to his force as a whole. But Solas is playing a completely different game where he will sacrifice everything necessary to secure the win. He's thinking like a plotter rather than a general, and is unconcerned about the decimation of his forces because it's allowing his plan to succeed. He's not treating them as an army he'll have to preserve to win his next battle, nor treating his opponents forces as a foe that must be utterly crushed to win. He's got his plan, and his opponents won't know what hit them until it's too late.
I feel like Solas as Anderssen (one of the better players of the romantic school) makes a lot of sense. I don't agree with Bull's play style. When not in a battle frenzy, Bull strikes me as a positional player.
Funny if you put it like that: Corypheus is more similar to Solas then? Unconcerned with decimation of his pawns, he plots to win in the end.... Except he's crap.
someone else also mentioned it... "Solas lets the enemy take his pawns (people), sacrifices his queen (Mythal), while the mage (himself) sits in silence waiting for an opportunity to strike the winning blow."
Think about how Bull cherished his chargers though, and how bitter he would be if you let them die. He feels every sacrifice and does his best to preserve his army for the next fights, it's very on brand of him and I love it
This kinda reminds me of a support conversation in Fire Emblem : Awakening. Two tacticians are playing a game (supposedly chess) and one is playing to win, sacrificing pieces in doing so and the other is conserving his pieces heavily, seeing them as precious. Not quite the aame, but I still like seeing connections between games and the reL qorld, however vague they may be.
I know they are fictional characters that respectively have a rigidly-obtained eidetic memory and the ability to conjure up mental images like in dreams, but that didn't stop me from feeling MASSIVELY intelectually outclassed when listening to those two in-game...
That's probably because the game in question is a very famous chess game played between two famous and skilled players of the Romantic era. More so white, who was Adolf Anderssen, who at the time was considered the unofficial world champion.
Also does a lot of Foreshadowing to Solas because this was his play in the game pretty much. Sacrifice all the essential pieces, get the enemy distracted by what they think is a major threat and when they aren’t looking a simple pawn comes in trips up the enemy and the “Mage” takes the queen.
@@S117M4sterChief Qunari's isn't exactly known to be dim-witted. They are the same folk who invented explosives more efficient than Dwarven Lyrium bomb and a method to brainwash people without magic. The Qun strives for mastery of one's role; coincidentally, Bull is a spy in foreign lands, an exceptional degree of mental and intellectual proficiency wouldn't be surprising.
I know that this is an actual game that happened in reality and Solas isn't the author of those moves, but it really tells you a lot about his style of strategizing. He goes all out and isn't afraid to make huge sacrifices to reach his goals. In this game, the winner risked all of their important pieces on the off chance that their opponent wouldn't notice the placement of a SINGLE pawn, and that they could get to the king first. In light of what we know of his plans from Trespasser, this speaks volumes about how far he'll go. Too bad that his plans only ever seem to not backfire horribly in chess.
+Camila Fayad (warning to readers: Here be spoilers) Good synopsis. :) I did not see this connection until you described it here. Well done! :) However I will meekly point out that there are an almost equal number of 'pieces' between Iron Bull and Solas. In other words, he did not 'kill' everyone. In fact there is one more pawn of his than Bull on the board and it is a pawn, not a 'queen' nor a king nor even a 'mage' that corners the king. I think this represents something about him as well. :) He cares about the 'ordinary folk' because I think he knows very well what it's like to be them. There are many other points and similarities/representations that your comment helps me to see, and I thank you greatly for that, but I will end on a note that perhaps reveals how much of a sucker I am for Solas/underdogs. :p Remember at this time, the Breach is still in full swing, things are looking really grim for everyone, especially Solas because despite "one of the glasses is poisoned" Corypheus still has a huge advantage over the Inquisition. I think this chess match represents more of Solas' awareness of the Qun waiting for the war to weaken Thedas enough for them to take over at this time. He is running out of options and, especially, time to save the Inquisitor (note, whether he likes them or not he still saves them from the Mark). Would we not expect him to make huge sacrifices to ensure that the Redcliffe future doesn't happen? I mean, if I was in Solas' place, I'd cringe to see what the world had become too and want to fix it. To him the world has already become the Redcliffe-future, and something worse is unimaginably horrifying to him. The 'world ending' equating to tearing down the Veil and rendering the Templar/non-magic user vs. Mage/mage-user conflict, and all other current belief based conflicts invalid. ....Sorry for rambling. I do that a lot. Thanks again for such a great comment! :D
+Camila Fayad Ooops, quick note (because I wasn't really paying attention the first time), I've confused Bull's queen with his king. So it was a 'mage' that corned Bull's king after all. My propitiation of Solas' past plebdom still stands though. :)
Love how the Iron Bull isn't just a brute who can hit things, but he does actually have a brain, he knows tactics, he knows how to read people, and he actually seems like someone who would be in charge of a successful company of mercenary's He never stood a chance against the mast mind that is Solas, but still good show :)
In his first quest he made it clear that he WAS playing a tal-vashot, so he could live among the orlesians. That is his role - "The Iron Bull". Although he does like to hit things with his horns, to scream and butting, his ACTUAL role in the Qun is a SPY. He is Ben-Hassrat, OF COURSE he know tactis and people, that's what A SPY does, lol. Your comment has no sense. It seems to me you didn't understand his character at all.
@@VeenJen Did you just want to say someone was wrong without much cause because they didn’t actually say anything about Bull not being a spy but rather this being a showcase of how he is capable and can think logically and lead. Nobody said that he was solely a mercenary.
So for those confused about why the pawn is important. it actually has nothing to do with the checkmate. It blocks the queen from taking his knight at mark 3:14. The 2 knights and bishop are what seal the game. The Pawn was only important in that single turn.
Solas' gambit had a few moving parts involving a space that Bull's Arishok (Queen) would have threatened without the pawn blocking it. The pawn made sure that Bull's Arishok couldn't come in at 3:13 to kill the Knight and negate the check that forces Bull's king to move where the white Queen (3:20) and then the white Mage (Bishop, 3:33) will ultimately keep him in check mate. Note that if Solas had moved his Mage first instead of his Queen, Bull's Ben-Hassrath (Knight) would have taken it at e7 and blocked the queen from pulling off the checkmate when it moved in a turn later. Solas had to sacrifice his Queen to draw the Ben-Hassrath out of position. Again, without the pawn being where it was, Bull could have captured the Queen with his own Arishok, and the Ben-Hassrath wouldn't have had to move. Ultimately, that pawn was integral to the entire gambit that resulted in checkmate.
it's interesting. Solas sends out all his troops and sacrafices for advancement like he does in game, but no one has pointed out Bull follows the Qun. he sends out scouts ((the few pawns= Sten and other Qunari sent in Origins and ben hassrath= Bull)), slowly eases in more advanced troops, gets behind enemy lines, keeps a large fort for his king, and doesnt know how to react when some one doesnt react how he expects.
As my Lavellan is his lover, I felt my heart ache when Solas sacrifices his queen in order to win. Just a chess game, I know, but in dragon age there are hints hidden anywhere.
You weren't even important enough to be a queen,at best you're simply the piece that he calls a mage (Side note ,I know all pieces in chess can be important)
this is very interesting banter because it shows that Bull is actually a very smart person. Most people see the “Tank” character as the dumb brute, but I doubt any other character would be able to mentally play chess with an elven god
That was INCREDIBLE. Watching this game is amazing. That they both kept it in thier heads? I'm completely in love. Bull played a good, if aggressive, game, but Solas is just...well, SOLAS.
even more impressive when you consider the fact that they kept this game going mentally and then bring it up randomly during different segments of their travels
Rare cases, usually those who have chess for brains, people with wide imagination & strategic input. Techinically speaking, a bunch of really smart S.O.Bs. ^_^
dominic marino Not to mention he is probably a master tactician. Specifically saying he works well with small groups. like the 16 vs 16 style of a chess game.
"Hey, you." Begins a random passer-by. "Care to remind why BioWare weaves the best writing in the medium of video games?" "But of course." I respond. "Allow me to do so by a medium of sung chess match."
I read recently about this game again and remembered this. One of the big things about this game is that the queen was always the spearhead, and the other pieces used as support. This game turned that notion around in chess. The implications of Solas using the "lesser" pieces used to win the game have obvious applications - it's great foreshadowing. My favorite part though is the ending. With them calling each other A mage and a Tal-Vashoth respectively, two of the worst things under the Qun, stand as intellectual giants, regardless of who won.
You know, now that I think about it, this particular scene perhaps serves two purposes. One: obviously we get to know how diabolic Solas can be in terms of achieving his goals. Two: He must be playing this game with Iron bull, a Qunari spy, to figure out the mind, strategies, and workings of a Qunari spy/solider. He is playing a game of strategies, an easy way to observe what the other is capable of in terms of strategies, no?
It shows he will sacrifice everything in next game. His elven army consisting city elves/some dalish elves/his remaining sentinels. Btw Solas` story makes no sense, he doesn't like black/white stories yet he says elven gods- old ones are all bad guys BUT HE is the great saver.... Pfff.. I want to hear how the other gods see this first... I want to beat the shit out from him, and kill him Anders style if he is beyond the point of saving. Then go and kick the eleven gods asses/subdue them...(1-2 elven god will change sides thats my bet) So femLavellan transforming into a real elven leader with next MC as her second in command hue..
There are several interesting tidbits of real history being refernced in Bioware's games. Like how the Treaty of Farixen is an analogy for the 1922 Washington Naval Conference.
it's a foreshadowing for what solas does during DAI's plot, sacrificing everything to achieve his goal (especially his queen if you consider the possible romance with an elven female inquisitor)
@@ItsMeStrider I see It as your the pawn since you were at the wrong place at the right time yet you are one of the reasons everything turned out well at the end.
I'm not even a chess player but this entire exchange entranced me. I remembered putting Solas and Bull together for must of the game just to hear the end of the game, even though I understood nothing of it
GrayWolf1192 Ohhh, thanks. Now *I* feel dumb.. The basic rules for chess aren't that complicated though. The strategic part is more so of course, as seen in this game. ;)
Considering that Solas used a Mage (Bishop) to deliver check-mate...... I wonder if the final stage of Solas' grand scheme will involve himself or some other Mage assassinating a King, or maybe an Archon?
Well, Mark Darrah did post a tweet containing a video of a red book with a tower/rook and a wolf on it. It would be interesting if DA4 had some sort of chess/tactical theme, though it might be a smaller spin-off game too because Bioware has been asking players if they'd be interested in that sort of thing.
If he tries to assassinate Alistair I'll flay Solas seven ways from sunday. If he kills Bhelen I will be somewhat upsety. Yes he's a reforming equal opportunities tyrant, but he still framed a perfectly suitable heir to the throne for his crime.
I’m so happy someone synched it up with a board for those of us who can’t keep that much straight in our head EDIT: oh my god you left in sera’s “king me” I love it
It stops Bull's queen from taking Solas' knight at g7 (3:15) which forces Bull to move his King to d8 which is what traps him in position for the checkmate.
Something I like is that they start out using their own terms for both their pieces and their opponent's. But the longer the game goes on, the more they use each others' terms for the pieces. You notice it the most in the last few lines. "And now my Ben-hassreth takes your queen"
This has now become something of retroactive foreshadowing for Veilguard. SPOILERS BELOW: Solas once again tried sacrificing a Rook as a distraction, and this time it blew up in his face.
So many moments in inquisition and even in origins have a new lecture thanks to Veilguard. For all the faults the dialogs can have, they really made a good story.
If anyone’s wondering why the pawn at E5 is so important, its keeping Bull’s queen at bay so that Solas’s mage didn’t get shat on when he went in for the kill.
This visual representation of the match just made me love this game even more. I keep finding and peeling back more and more intricate details. Such an incredible game. Thanks for doing this Huevos
I like the subtle aspect that Bull actually starts switching to non-Qunari terms for the most part as the game goes on. Especially since this only occurs if he becomes a Tal-Vashoth, shows him leaving behind the Qun, in a small way.
2:50 Right here is when Solas won the game. g1 was bait. By taking the Rook, Bull had no pieces in a position to get his King out of trouble, while only having one space to retreat to after the Knight took g7. Yes I know this is the Immortal Game, still, it's fun to see it somewhere I NEVER expected it to appear in.
Took me a while to understand the brilliance of Pe5. It blocks the black queen from protecting the pawn at g7, forcing the knight to take the white queen at f6 and leave the black king unguarded.
Everyone’s talking about how devious solas is, and that’s certainly true but remember this interaction only occurs if Bull rejects the qun, furthermore at the end solas implies this whole exercise was to show bull that just because he lost the qun doesn’t mean he will lose his mind. Solas will sacrifice everything for victory, but he also cares about those around him who he deems worthy….something to consider
I got this to play in with Solas, iron bull and Cassandra in Exalted Plains. They don't do it all at the same time maybe 5-10 minutes in between parts while wondering around. and yes I did have bull save the chargers.
That is so foreshadowing to Solas' Plot but I really love their strategies. Even tho Solas' one is based on much sacrifices but there's much improvement space. So I guess based on his character, we do can convince him to change things I hope Dragon Age 4 will give us the possibility to change his mind without killing him
I know the basic rules of chess but why was that pawn move so crucial? I've been trying to figure what impact it had on the black moves but still can't understand?
I'm quite curious what would happen if Solas tried it with Vivienne because she was trying to figure out just who he is exactly with little knowledge beforehand, plus she is competent at the Orlaisian Game as well.
WrittenInShadow Thanks, I don't know much more than the basics about chess, so I wasn't aware it was actually a known game. Just looked it up on Wikipedia now. Very nice! :)
Solas lets the enemy take his pawns (people), sacrifices his queen (Mythal), while the mage (himself) sits in silence waiting for an opportunity to strike the winning blow. Nice.
That is glorious.
His tactics involve sacrificing too many pieces. He can win, but he has little of his kingdom intact. What is the point of victory if your friends are in the ground.
Logan the Krogan he achieves his goal, he doesn't care about sacrifices (or rather he accepts them for his "greater good")
Aha! We are learning strategy's how to beat him in the next game.
why do you think he won the war against the evanuris?
This has got to be one of the most clever things I've ever seen in a video game to date. It's both a reference to one of the most popular chess games of all time, and a perfect representation of how both characters think and strategize. Not only that, but it also serves as huge foreshadowing to what Solas' plans might be for DA4.
Omg *BOOM* mindblowing! O.O
Damnnn
Anyone care to elaborate on the "representation of how both characters think and strategize" bit Alison was on about?
@@snowtree07 i only play a couple chess game in my life so correct me if I'm wrong. Iron Bull plays offensively by using his Arishok to take Solas pieces, while Solas on the other hand focuses on getting check mate
snowtree07 solas sacrificed most of his pawns(the people), his queen(mythal), and used his mage(himself)to strike the winning blow.
This is one of the most clever things I've ever seen in a videogame.
1. It's well written banter in its own right.
2. It is great characterisation: Bull revels in the fight and measures victory in enemy kills. Solas hides his intent and is focused on the endgame.
3. It is world-building: Their names for the pieces also reveal differences in their respective cultures.
4. It is foreshadowing: Solas manipulating event and people like pawns. Sacrificing pieces, including his Queen (Flemeth/Mythal), to secure victory
5. If you really want to read into it, you could view the Pawn as The Inquisitor: A piece only powerful for being in the right place at the right time to prevent Corypheus (Black's Queen) from stopping the checkmate.
Or you could see the Inquisitor as the Queen. A powerful piece Bull wants to protect, and that Solas tosses away to win.
@@Her_Imperious_Condescension ooo I like that
quick pin this before it gets buried in the comments
Oh i absolutely adore this cmt thread
Veil guard could never
I love how they put the Immortal Game in, and picked one that illustrates how the two characters think. Iron Bull treats the game like a battle, intent on destroying Solas' pieces and occasionally taking note of his material advantage as a general might keep track of numerical advantage. But he fights like a warrior, getting stuck in with his strongest pieces but paying less attention to his force as a whole. But Solas is playing a completely different game where he will sacrifice everything necessary to secure the win. He's thinking like a plotter rather than a general, and is unconcerned about the decimation of his forces because it's allowing his plan to succeed. He's not treating them as an army he'll have to preserve to win his next battle, nor treating his opponents forces as a foe that must be utterly crushed to win. He's got his plan, and his opponents won't know what hit them until it's too late.
I feel like Solas as Anderssen (one of the better players of the romantic school) makes a lot of sense. I don't agree with Bull's play style. When not in a battle frenzy, Bull strikes me as a positional player.
Funny if you put it like that: Corypheus is more similar to Solas then? Unconcerned with decimation of his pawns, he plots to win in the end.... Except he's crap.
someone else also mentioned it... "Solas lets the enemy take his pawns (people), sacrifices his queen (Mythal), while the mage (himself) sits in silence waiting for an opportunity to strike the winning blow."
Think about how Bull cherished his chargers though, and how bitter he would be if you let them die. He feels every sacrifice and does his best to preserve his army for the next fights, it's very on brand of him and I love it
This kinda reminds me of a support conversation in Fire Emblem
: Awakening. Two tacticians are playing a game (supposedly chess) and one is playing to win, sacrificing pieces in doing so and the other is conserving his pieces heavily, seeing them as precious. Not quite the aame, but I still like seeing connections between games and the reL qorld, however vague they may be.
I felt them both die a little inside when Sera said "King me!"
Proof that Sera plays checkers while others play chess.
I know they are fictional characters that respectively have a rigidly-obtained eidetic memory and the ability to conjure up mental images like in dreams, but that didn't stop me from feeling MASSIVELY intelectually outclassed when listening to those two in-game...
***** Especially the mental games are completely random.
That's probably because the game in question is a very famous chess game played between two famous and skilled players of the Romantic era. More so white, who was Adolf Anderssen, who at the time was considered the unofficial world champion.
You're not the only one. I'm glad this video exists, that way I have visual context as to the game's layout.
when you realize one of Iron Bull's hobbies is getting whacked at, just think about how much more brilliant he would be if he got hit less lol
there's another great one in Sherlock Holmes: Game of Shadows between Holmes and Moriarti. Also a wonderful video breaking it down by Lord Ravenscroft
This just shows how intelligent both characters are
Zackly
vampirelordx1 I never thought a Qunari would've been able to play mental chess...impressive!
Also does a lot of Foreshadowing to Solas because this was his play in the game pretty much. Sacrifice all the essential pieces, get the enemy distracted by what they think is a major threat and when they aren’t looking a simple pawn comes in trips up the enemy and the “Mage” takes the queen.
Wreav M'dama iron bull is way more intelligent then any of us.
@@S117M4sterChief Qunari's isn't exactly known to be dim-witted. They are the same folk who invented explosives more efficient than Dwarven Lyrium bomb and a method to brainwash people without magic. The Qun strives for mastery of one's role; coincidentally, Bull is a spy in foreign lands, an exceptional degree of mental and intellectual proficiency wouldn't be surprising.
I know that this is an actual game that happened in reality and Solas isn't the author of those moves, but it really tells you a lot about his style of strategizing. He goes all out and isn't afraid to make huge sacrifices to reach his goals. In this game, the winner risked all of their important pieces on the off chance that their opponent wouldn't notice the placement of a SINGLE pawn, and that they could get to the king first. In light of what we know of his plans from Trespasser, this speaks volumes about how far he'll go. Too bad that his plans only ever seem to not backfire horribly in chess.
+Camila Fayad I know, right? Also note how he sacrifices his queen -__-
LilithWolfheart oh man, of course he would do that ;A;
+LilithWolfheart oh fuck
+Camila Fayad (warning to readers: Here be spoilers) Good synopsis. :) I did not see this connection until you described it here. Well done! :) However I will meekly point out that there are an almost equal number of 'pieces' between Iron Bull and Solas. In other words, he did not 'kill' everyone. In fact there is one more pawn of his than Bull on the board and it is a pawn, not a 'queen' nor a king nor even a 'mage' that corners the king. I think this represents something about him as well. :) He cares about the 'ordinary folk' because I think he knows very well what it's like to be them.
There are many other points and similarities/representations that your comment helps me to see, and I thank you greatly for that, but I will end on a note that perhaps reveals how much of a sucker I am for Solas/underdogs. :p Remember at this time, the Breach is still in full swing, things are looking really grim for everyone, especially Solas because despite "one of the glasses is poisoned" Corypheus still has a huge advantage over the Inquisition. I think this chess match represents more of Solas' awareness of the Qun waiting for the war to weaken Thedas enough for them to take over at this time. He is running out of options and, especially, time to save the Inquisitor (note, whether he likes them or not he still saves them from the Mark). Would we not expect him to make huge sacrifices to ensure that the Redcliffe future doesn't happen? I mean, if I was in Solas' place, I'd cringe to see what the world had become too and want to fix it. To him the world has already become the Redcliffe-future, and something worse is unimaginably horrifying to him. The 'world ending' equating to tearing down the Veil and rendering the Templar/non-magic user vs. Mage/mage-user conflict, and all other current belief based conflicts invalid. ....Sorry for rambling. I do that a lot. Thanks again for such a great comment! :D
+Camila Fayad Ooops, quick note (because I wasn't really paying attention the first time), I've confused Bull's queen with his king. So it was a 'mage' that corned Bull's king after all. My propitiation of Solas' past plebdom still stands though. :)
FYI, you only get ANY of this companion banter if you choose for The Iron Bull to become Tal'vashoth... NOT if he stays Qunari!
If Bull saves his crew and goes against his system, Solas starts to asknowledge his free will and independence enough to play chess with him. Logical.
well said girl.
lol i would imagine considering at the beginning, Solas addresses The Iron Bull as Tal'vashoth
This tells so much about Solas that he would sacrifice everything to set up a win for him.
Love how the Iron Bull isn't just a brute who can hit things, but he does actually have a brain, he knows tactics, he knows how to read people, and he actually seems like someone who would be in charge of a successful company of mercenary's
He never stood a chance against the mast mind that is Solas, but still good show
:)
In his first quest he made it clear that he WAS playing a tal-vashot, so he could live among the orlesians. That is his role - "The Iron Bull". Although he does like to hit things with his horns, to scream and butting, his ACTUAL role in the Qun is a SPY. He is Ben-Hassrat, OF COURSE he know tactis and people, that's what A SPY does, lol. Your comment has no sense. It seems to me you didn't understand his character at all.
@@VeenJen Did you just want to say someone was wrong without much cause because they didn’t actually say anything about Bull not being a spy but rather this being a showcase of how he is capable and can think logically and lead. Nobody said that he was solely a mercenary.
So for those confused about why the pawn is important. it actually has nothing to do with the checkmate. It blocks the queen from taking his knight at mark 3:14. The 2 knights and bishop are what seal the game. The Pawn was only important in that single turn.
It protects the White Queen from the Black Queen, if Bull could've done Queen to F6 he would have stopped the Checkmate
Solas' gambit had a few moving parts involving a space that Bull's Arishok (Queen) would have threatened without the pawn blocking it. The pawn made sure that Bull's Arishok couldn't come in at 3:13 to kill the Knight and negate the check that forces Bull's king to move where the white Queen (3:20) and then the white Mage (Bishop, 3:33) will ultimately keep him in check mate.
Note that if Solas had moved his Mage first instead of his Queen, Bull's Ben-Hassrath (Knight) would have taken it at e7 and blocked the queen from pulling off the checkmate when it moved in a turn later. Solas had to sacrifice his Queen to draw the Ben-Hassrath out of position. Again, without the pawn being where it was, Bull could have captured the Queen with his own Arishok, and the Ben-Hassrath wouldn't have had to move.
Ultimately, that pawn was integral to the entire gambit that resulted in checkmate.
And the pawn is main character in DA:I
Justina (queen) died, all according to solas plan.
sounds like something that solas would do. use a pawn to let HIM claim victory
it's interesting. Solas sends out all his troops and sacrafices for advancement like he does in game, but no one has pointed out Bull follows the Qun. he sends out scouts ((the few pawns= Sten and other Qunari sent in Origins and ben hassrath= Bull)), slowly eases in more advanced troops, gets behind enemy lines, keeps a large fort for his king, and doesnt know how to react when some one doesnt react how he expects.
Bit iron bull has more pieces in reserve and is now more ready to fight a protracted war.
As my Lavellan is his lover, I felt my heart ache when Solas sacrifices his queen in order to win. Just a chess game, I know, but in dragon age there are hints hidden anywhere.
If it makes you feel any better, his real queen was probably Mythal and not you :D
I have good and bad news
Good news: you're not the queen
Bad news: you are the pawn
You weren't even important enough to be a queen,at best you're simply the piece that he calls a mage
(Side note ,I know all pieces in chess can be important)
My Lavellan rouge hooked up with Iron bull, she's a redhead lol.
@@PsyrenXY damn. That's cold.....
Solas' last move has him moving the Mage right on top of the King. It's a genius reference to his own personality.
Alright, Weekes, we get it, you're CLEVER AS FUCK.
Sai WEEEEEKES *shakes fist*
and now his brain is completely rotten.
And look at him now.
Got these banters, but I have no way to visualise it in my head. Thank you! x)
Love that they made sure it was a true game, not just spouting numbers.
This isn't just any old game, it's the Immortal Game of 1851. Google it.
I mapped it out on a chessboard one time when I found the dialogue transcripts on the wiki. Was so cool to see the game play out.
this is very interesting banter because it shows that Bull is actually a very smart person. Most people see the “Tank” character as the dumb brute, but I doubt any other character would be able to mentally play chess with an elven god
That was INCREDIBLE. Watching this game is amazing. That they both kept it in thier heads?
I'm completely in love. Bull played a good, if aggressive, game, but Solas is just...well, SOLAS.
and then there's Sera...
Jason Miller uhhhh....King me?
yep
even more impressive when you consider the fact that they kept this game going mentally and then bring it up randomly during different segments of their travels
How the donk could anyone visual an entire chess board in their head?
Rare cases, usually those who have chess for brains, people with wide imagination & strategic input. Techinically speaking, a bunch of really smart S.O.Bs. ^_^
How can anyone walk trough dreams or manipulate magic? as for Bull, i'm going with the Qun giving him a super disciplined mind.
Practice? Or blood magic. Probably blood magic.
dominic marino Not to mention he is probably a master tactician. Specifically saying he works well with small groups. like the 16 vs 16 style of a chess game.
I know, right? Ben-Hassrath, remember?
The most amazing thing about this is that not only is it a real game, it also happens to reveal a lot about Solas and the way he ticks. So cool!
And Iron Bull, as well.
The Dread Wolf playing the Immortal Game, that's way too perfect
This was a real chess game? holy crap. I was reading some of the comments, fantastic easter egg.
I lost it with Sera at the end XD
+Rikusgirl001 Ah, King me!
i'm sera
"Hey, you." Begins a random passer-by.
"Care to remind why BioWare weaves the best writing in the medium of video games?"
"But of course." I respond.
"Allow me to do so by a medium of sung chess match."
That's the Immortal Chess Game of Anderssen vs Kieseritzky lol
I read recently about this game again and remembered this. One of the big things about this game is that the queen was always the spearhead, and the other pieces used as support. This game turned that notion around in chess.
The implications of Solas using the "lesser" pieces used to win the game have obvious applications - it's great foreshadowing.
My favorite part though is the ending. With them calling each other A mage and a Tal-Vashoth respectively, two of the worst things under the Qun, stand as intellectual giants, regardless of who won.
I get it! The white pawn at e5 prevents the black queen from moving to g7.
Is it me or was this hot to listen to?
Damn bull-riding fade nerd.
No-no it's not just you.
Klineyful I'm melting
As a straight guy, I agree that this is hot to listen to.
@@madhouse2594 yay everyone can appreciate their big brains
You know, now that I think about it, this particular scene perhaps serves two purposes. One: obviously we get to know how diabolic Solas can be in terms of achieving his goals.
Two: He must be playing this game with Iron bull, a Qunari spy, to figure out the mind, strategies, and workings of a Qunari spy/solider. He is playing a game of strategies, an easy way to observe what the other is capable of in terms of strategies, no?
It shows he will sacrifice everything in next game. His elven army consisting city elves/some dalish elves/his remaining sentinels.
Btw Solas` story makes no sense, he doesn't like black/white stories yet he says elven gods- old ones are all bad guys BUT HE is the great saver.... Pfff.. I want to hear how the other gods see this first...
I want to beat the shit out from him, and kill him Anders style if he is beyond the point of saving.
Then go and kick the eleven gods asses/subdue them...(1-2 elven god will change sides thats my bet)
So femLavellan transforming into a real elven leader with next MC as her second in command hue..
The Immortal Game of 1851? How the hell did THAT end up being referenced in Dragon Age?
because that set of plays has not been replicated competetively and is a piece of gaming history
There are several interesting tidbits of real history being refernced in Bioware's games. Like how the Treaty of Farixen is an analogy for the 1922 Washington Naval Conference.
it's a foreshadowing for what solas does during DAI's plot, sacrificing everything to achieve his goal (especially his queen if you consider the possible romance with an elven female inquisitor)
@@ItsMeStrider I see It as your the pawn since you were at the wrong place at the right time yet you are one of the reasons everything turned out well at the end.
It appears in many media, most notably Blade Runner.
I'm not even a chess player but this entire exchange entranced me. I remembered putting Solas and Bull together for must of the game just to hear the end of the game, even though I understood nothing of it
I got the bit after "King Me"
?
pieniaurinko He only understood the king me part of the video, at the very end.
GrayWolf1192
Ohhh, thanks. Now *I* feel dumb..
The basic rules for chess aren't that complicated though. The strategic part is more so of course, as seen in this game. ;)
"What are you doing Solas?"
When a worthy opponent starts making incomprehensible moves, you should be afraid. Very afraid.
This is the kind of quality nerd content I signed up for
Considering that Solas used a Mage (Bishop) to deliver check-mate...... I wonder if the final stage of Solas' grand scheme will involve himself or some other Mage assassinating a King, or maybe an Archon?
+Cole Jordan A month ago, but still: My mind went KABOOOM.
Mage Inquisitor.
What if...
WHAT THE ACTUAL IF.
+XxTefnutxX See this is why i never preferred mages. I agree w sera in the sense that a well placed arrow can solve all your problems.
Well, Mark Darrah did post a tweet containing a video of a red book with a tower/rook and a wolf on it. It would be interesting if DA4 had some sort of chess/tactical theme, though it might be a smaller spin-off game too because Bioware has been asking players if they'd be interested in that sort of thing.
If he tries to assassinate Alistair I'll flay Solas seven ways from sunday.
If he kills Bhelen I will be somewhat upsety. Yes he's a reforming equal opportunities tyrant, but he still framed a perfectly suitable heir to the throne for his crime.
In my game, Alistair is with my mage warden. If Solas tried anything, she would not hesitate to blood magic the shit out of him.
I’m so happy someone synched it up with a board for those of us who can’t keep that much straight in our head
EDIT: oh my god you left in sera’s “king me” I love it
what makes this even better foreshadowing is that the da4 protagonist is apparently gonna be called “rook”
after mage takes king, it is only threatened by a single rook, and the DA4 protag will be called Rook
Maker, Sera... they're playing chess... not checkers!
It took me so long to figure out why the pawn at e5 was important. Solas, you sneaky son of a bitch indeed.
i still don't get it
It stops Bull's queen from taking Solas' knight at g7 (3:15) which forces Bull to move his King to d8 which is what traps him in position for the checkmate.
ah ok, thank you
Ok, this is just amazing, one of the best banters in all BW games.
This happens when you create the game with love and passion
Something I like is that they start out using their own terms for both their pieces and their opponent's. But the longer the game goes on, the more they use each others' terms for the pieces.
You notice it the most in the last few lines. "And now my Ben-hassreth takes your queen"
I'm not sure why I was thinking of this, oh, almost ten years after it was released. Thanks much for keeping it alive!
Wow. This is really cool.
Thank you so much for doing this. This conversation is probably my favorite banter between characters in the entire game.
Now add Cullen and this could be a real party.
@Burnt Potatoes But how could Dorian cheat if its mental chess? Lol
And Leliana - she plays chess with Cullen if Dorian isn't recruited.
@@saltedbuttercups >implying Dorian is above using the verbal equivalent of distracting ur opponent and then pretending those pieces were always there
off topic, but i think Dorian and Zev would get along well
Leliana plays with Cullen if Dorian is in skyhold but you haven't spoken to him yet to recruit him
Makes me feel like an idiot. ^^
Both of us are savage Tal-Vashoth.
This has now become something of retroactive foreshadowing for Veilguard.
SPOILERS BELOW:
Solas once again tried sacrificing a Rook as a distraction, and this time it blew up in his face.
So many moments in inquisition and even in origins have a new lecture thanks to Veilguard. For all the faults the dialogs can have, they really made a good story.
If anyone’s wondering why the pawn at E5 is so important, its keeping Bull’s queen at bay so that Solas’s mage didn’t get shat on when he went in for the kill.
In all the confusion Sera got her checker piece to the other end of the board
Its nice to see the game played out in physical form, I never quite understood it with them just speaking it but it makes a lot more sense now
This visual representation of the match just made me love this game even more. I keep finding and peeling back more and more intricate details. Such an incredible game. Thanks for doing this Huevos
As we lay in wait, the dawn is near.... We will save our friend from himself, if we can ^_^
I like the subtle aspect that Bull actually starts switching to non-Qunari terms for the most part as the game goes on. Especially since this only occurs if he becomes a Tal-Vashoth, shows him leaving behind the Qun, in a small way.
"You.. sneaky son of a bitch!!!!" Best line
2:50 Right here is when Solas won the game. g1 was bait. By taking the Rook, Bull had no pieces in a position to get his King out of trouble, while only having one space to retreat to after the Knight took g7. Yes I know this is the Immortal Game, still, it's fun to see it somewhere I NEVER expected it to appear in.
Just realized that this is a remake of the “immortal game” chess match between Adolf Anderssen and Lionel Kieseritzky.
The damn fact that they both can identify what cultural name refers to which piece just off one move!
Randomly remembered this dialogue and that in one of my runs, the last bit triggered while we were limping back to camp after a dragon fight lmao
Loved this as an avid chess player. You often forget outside of the Cutscenes how clever bull is
I never get bored watching this.
Took me a while to understand the brilliance of Pe5. It blocks the black queen from protecting the pawn at g7, forcing the knight to take the white queen at f6 and leave the black king unguarded.
Gah, chess is beyond me.
Everyone’s talking about how devious solas is, and that’s certainly true but remember this interaction only occurs if Bull rejects the qun, furthermore at the end solas implies this whole exercise was to show bull that just because he lost the qun doesn’t mean he will lose his mind. Solas will sacrifice everything for victory, but he also cares about those around him who he deems worthy….something to consider
Thank u for pulling that game to visual, wondered how it played out!
This was one of my favorite parts of DAI.
I found this while trying to find a replica chess board like the one you play on with Cullen, I was happily surprised. XD
This lightens things up for me after what happened in D.A.I
Nice move Solas
This is so amazing. Also says a lot about their characters. Like Solas sacrificed his important pieces to win.
Thank you for posting this! This line of dialogue was completed in a week for me.
I'm surprised this actually played out on a standard chess board. Every board we see in game is some weird squashed hexagon shape.
Anyone else really like how Solas says “H”? I don’t know why but I just think it’s very attractive for some reason.
didn't know I'd be having emotions about a chess game, but thanks to DA I guess
I really liked this, it was hard to keep track of in the game while fighting literally everything
I got this to play in with Solas, iron bull and Cassandra in Exalted Plains. They don't do it all at the same time maybe 5-10 minutes in between parts while wondering around. and yes I did have bull save the chargers.
Now that I can see this holy shit I UNDERSTAND NOW
That is so foreshadowing to Solas' Plot but I really love their strategies.
Even tho Solas' one is based on much sacrifices but there's much improvement space. So I guess based on his character, we do can convince him to change things
I hope Dragon Age 4 will give us the possibility to change his mind without killing him
This was (and still is) very entertaining to watch and listen to.
I've never been more invested in a game than this
As a chess afficionado, when i saw the move i was like OH NO! great match tbh!
This is so much better visualized oh my gosh
the moment I SAW the pawn moving up there I started shouting at the screen.
I know the basic rules of chess but why was that pawn move so crucial? I've been trying to figure what impact it had on the black moves but still can't understand?
Nevermind,figured it out.
Solas, you do me proud XD
Is nobody going to mention the irony that the MAGE won the match? The chess piece the mage. You can’t tell me Solas didn’t do that on purpose.
I lose it at, "You're shitting me." It's such a perfect delivery.
Here again after getting nothing like this level of banter in veilguard
Solas basically does this is Veilguard. There’s a reason Rook is called that.
Watching this again while playing DA:VG, this makes perfect sense
What’s more impressive is that they’re capable of remembering where every piece is... That’s 32 pieces.
(Yes I’m fully aware it’s a game...)
Fascinating cultural comparison, this.
Oh my gosh, I love this! Thanks so much for posting the game! Chess and Solas? I'm in love!
Damn explains why Qunari spies tripped up on Solas spies.
What if this is foreshadowing Solas's moves for the next DA game? Since he is going to be the villain
The Immortal Game...
Wow this was beautiful to see in a board!
I literally know nothing about chess but was able to follow this
I'm quite curious what would happen if Solas tried it with Vivienne because she was trying to figure out just who he is exactly with little knowledge beforehand, plus she is competent at the Orlaisian Game as well.
I wondered wether that was actually a good game they came up with, and I guess it is. Thanks for visualizing it this way!
They didn't actually come up with it. Look up "the Immortal Game," and it's the same.
WrittenInShadow
Thanks, I don't know much more than the basics about chess, so I wasn't aware it was actually a known game. Just looked it up on Wikipedia now. Very nice! :)
Nice! Thanks for putting this together
Iron Bull before losing: I have the highground, Fadewalker!