thank you for telling your story, I am from south Louisiana with Roman Catholic parents and came out in 1982 the hard way. My lover's parents found out we were more than just happy college roommates and they felt compelled to contact my parents to tell them we were in a GAY relationship to keep me away from their son. It was a cataclysm, lots of intolerance, insistence we change, crying, and in the thick of the fighting, we ran away to San Francisco. We were lucky and had college degrees. We were able to get jobs, worked our asses off, and thrived. Forty three years later, we are now retired and still happily together. Our families eventually got over themselves and we are all are on good terms. Time heals old wounds and it gets better.
Micah, I know this was posted a few years ago, but thank you so much for putting it up here. I'm 27, and grew up in Virginia. I noticed a lot of parallels between our stories: betrayal from "friends", religion, family struggles, etc. Even coming up on 30, I'm realizing I still have to deal with a lot of issues, internally and externally. I just want you to know that by putting this story out there, you are helping a lot of people. It's reassuring to know I'm not alone. Thank you :-)
Lots of Gays in small country towns closeted yes but they form thier groups and keep it touch. I'm from Oklahoma and Hevener Oklahoma has all ways had lots I mean lots of closeted Gay from Jr High ....High School .. threw adult hood
Thanks for your words of wisdom. I pray people will continue to accept differences. I was much the same from ten/twelve. I’m older and had no venues etc to be true to myself and others. Finally came out in my 50’s. I’m fine but it was a long process in a homophobic world. Was married with a son prior which I loved dearly, still do.
Micah, I'm probably almost 40 years older than you but had the same religious background. It was horrible knowing I was gay, (I knew I was gay before I even knew what gay was!) but also knowing your family and church family would think you were "bad" if they knew. Didn't finally come out till my mid 30's and three children latter. Never been happier after that. My father never mentioned after I initially told my parents. Until, he was in the nursing home and my boyfriend came with me to visit my dad. I introduced him a "my friend Ralph." Latter, Ralph went out to get something out of the car and my dad said. "You're "boyfriend" seems like a nice young man." My heart jumped for joy. I said, yes, dad, he's very nice. I was satisfied at this late date in my dad's life that he could say that much. I'm so proud of all you young men posting your coming out stories. It IS making a difference to hundreds if not thousands of young men and ladies. You seem like a great person. Thanks for sharing.
I'm from South Carolina and I feel you and support you. I know so many people who have fall out plans for when their parents find out and it's heartbreaking.
Religion is a monumental chapter in the history of human Egotism. Religion is the opium of the masses. The tendency to claim God as an ally for our partisan values and ends is the source of all religion’s fanaticism. Religion a daughter of Hope and Fear explaining to Ignorance the nature of the Unknowable. The world is my country, the people are my brethren and to do good is my religion. HUMANITY IS THE SUPREME MOST IMPORTANT RELIGION. SO, TRY TO BE A HUMAN FIRST.
Micah.....I grew up in Alabama so I completely understand.and know how hard it is .....I didn't come out till I was 27....I am 47 now, so imagine what it was like coming out 20 years ago......My family is very.. very ..very religious ...and it took them 6 or 7 years to come around.... but finally they did....I have a partner now and we have been together for 16 years and he is just like any other family member now.....so don't give up on them quite yet....Keep being happy and someday maybe you can fully share your happiness with them...Stay strong!!!
"prejudice and ignorance" so true! "cornfed" LMAO!! just stumbled on this and I don't know if you still check your messages but I love this video. My bf is Japanese and we are super impressed that you learned the language in TENTH grade! Thanks for sharing your story!
I agree. I came out at 22 and I lost alot of my family my home and if it wont for my friends and kindness from people I couldn't have gotten through the pain of my own family not loving me for who I am. It still hurts. But thank you for this video, we need more of them
I adore this message as it's so 'right on' about so many things, and thank you, Micah, for calling out religion -- the sole, original source of all anti-gay bullshit. You must be about 31 now (2021) and I hope I come across an update, as you've got a great thought-processing ability going on ... to say nothing of you being freakin' adorable yourself, too. Much love to you, bro, and thanks for sharing the positive message! Many will benefit.
I just found this story, and I must say that it sounds a lot like my story, only forty years later. I did come out to my Mom when I was 18 and leaving home to go to University in the big city. She was quite accepting, and in fact suggested a few years that my room mate and I were sleeping together. That could have happened, but didn't. I never did come out to my Dad, who was so upset that my brother married a Baptist that he threatened tp boycott the wedding.I eventually went back into the closet and married and had two adopted kids, a gayson and a straight daughter. My wife never accepted our son, and asked why he didn't marry a girl and have kids she night before she died. This in spite of the fact that he was working from home so he could be with his husband twelve hours from his office. My final public coming out was on the six o'clock news Pride coverage, about ten years ago.
Great job telling your inspiring story. I'm glad you are a strong person and you stand strong for what you believe in. Consider making an update video? Hope you are doing well!
Great video Micah. How's life at 26 now? I didn't come out until later in life (50) and although I get along with my 4 children, they don't want to hear anything about my gay life and my ex-wife won't even speak to me. Hindsight is everything but in the late 60's and early 70's it was hard to come out. Climate not like today. So good for you, and yes, GOD LOVES YOU JUST THE WAY YOU ARE! Try not to give up the faith. There are so many affirming churches nowadays for same-sex couples and singles.
Yes, I experienced the same thing in the state of Georgia. I live in the state Georgia and the small town they know I am gay even though we never talked about it. So, as long as do not talk about my sexuality, my small town leaves me alone. I am gay, but I do not talk about my sexuality, because still in the United States it is still not safe to be gay.
Oh Micah, I like you. You have a lot of spunk. You’re part of a very special group. I sometimes think God made us this way for a reason. Aside from population control, and keeping women safe from horny men, there is something much larger for our purpose? I wish it was known to us now, but I’m willing to wait. I never got picked on that much, since I was always one of the tallest in all my classes, plus I have this crazy sense of humor, that seemed to attract people to me? I went into the best profession where I felt I would effect others-teaching in elementary school. It’s amazing how some young students show signs of being gay right from the start. It gives me a chance to offer the parents the heads up and some things to expect as they grow up. I keep the parents very much abreast as to what goes on in the classroom. I have an open door policy, and have a history of being able to help the “difficult child.” I hear some ugly things about some things teachers get in trouble for, and feel that some of those issues could be resolved with an open line of communication plus, a desire to really want to help children succeed. There are many folks who have no business in the classroom, and unfortunately it shows. I feel I need to share with you that I do teach in the Los Angeles School District, which happens to be a very progressive district I’m not sure what you’re future plans are, but out here in the west, things do seem to be better for LGBTQ and minority groups. The thinking is just more open, yeah we have jerks but they get silenced right away! Be well and stay safe, I’m alex from LA
One minor correction, Gay Rights started back in the 20's, got more active in the 50's and exploded at Stonewall. People were attending meetings for gay rights all over the country in the 70's and it spread far and wide from there.
Good morning Royal Highness tou are looking great and your image is so prominent and identifyable with tall dark and hansome and particularly rich. You NEED A PLATFORM to get noticed Piers Morgan is on British Morning news program and He Is The Business please can we have the interview. Its your choice. Love to see you. Heds up to you your maj.
The reason people have difficulty to accept is because of their ego. Otherwise, it is your life and your choice and your choice. I m a teacher ........ To me all my students r like kids- regardless of any preference and background they have ....... Being gay is only an orientation, if people understand ..... In life, there are some permanent things that are challenging and difficult to live with, like living with extreme health conditions etc ....
I send all my love and support to all the LGBT people of the world ❤🧡💛💚💙💜 You all are important and very valuable even though we live in a world that makes you all believe otherwise. Remember always be proud of who you are 🏳️🌈🏳️🌈🏳️🌈🏳️🌈🏳️🌈🏳️🌈 You all make from this world a better place ❤🧡💛💚💙💜 LGBT people are a rainbow of love in a world full of hate, but with difference of our straight partners, we all are united over a same flag 🏳️🌈🏳️🌈🏳️🌈🏳️🌈🏳️🌈🏳️🌈🏳️🌈 The flag of LGBT love ❤🧡💛💚💙💜 And we all must be united against hate, violence, discrimination and intolerance ❤🧡💛💚💙💜 We all are like a great family and we must fight to destroy hate ❤🧡💛💚💙💜 Remember, LGBT people is love and love always wins ❤🧡💛💚💙💜 I don't care about your race, nationality, biological gender, health condition, religion or any other condition ❤🧡💛💚💙💜 If you are an LGBT person you have all my love and my support ❤🧡💛💚💙💜 You guys are not alone in this fight and all the LGBT people of all over the world needs to understand this messagge, cause just united we will win against hate and we don't have to allow that nothing divide us. Never feel bad of who you are and never allow that this cruel world change who you really are or turn off your light and your shine ❤🧡💛💚💙💜 You all born that way and remember LGBT people of all the world, at the end, love always wins ❤🧡💛💚💙💜
You are a hottie 🔥 Thanks for your coming-out story. Hopefully, this helps others. Live your life, follow your dreams. Wishing you nothing but peace, prosperity, and happiness. Big hugs and kisses 🤗💋
I know it can anger you that you even care what your parents think in regards to the religion thing even after all these years. But family is so embedded in our hearts, they can touch & hurt us like no one else. I still deal with that with my family and it hurts that I can't share a part of my life with them knowing I don't have complete acceptance even as they smile and politely tolerate it.
I'm much older and had similar experience in greenville,sc. My Dad died young, so I never told him. My religious Mom refused to talk about it when I brought it up. Luckily she's dead now. I have no use for Christianity now. Judge not others is what they say, but it's exactly what they do. By the way, you are model handsome!
I too live in Arkansas and yes there is alot of nonsense directed at gays here. Many feel like they do because of fear and ignorance and there can be other reasons. In today's world there is absolutely no excuse for it considering how simple it is to do research and it's right there at your fingertips.
It's sad how so called Christians act any thing but Christian. The 2 basic rules Jesus said were Love the Lord. And Love your neighbor as yourself. That says it all. It sure seems like most Christians don't follow those rules though.
Hi, it sounds as if your folks are grieving the son they expected. You know, a big wedding, grandkids, family functions. Look how long it has taken most of us to accept ourselves, heck, sometimes I still have problems with it. I feel with time, education, and taking about it, they will come around? Why would we (as a certain group of individuals) elect to live a life that will be characterized by hate, bullying, and filled with so many challenges? Also, try not to be so hard on your faith. The times we are living in, are not painting a good example of what being a good Christian looks like. Plus, I do have it different simply by living in a liberal state as California. I realize how fortunate I am, but I still have that question- why me? why us? My heart bleeds when I think of all the lives that have been lost simply because we are wired differently. I wish you the best as you continue on your path. Are you still living in the south? Be well Micah. Alex from LA
Being Gay is NOT a choice. Being Bisexual IS a choice, i.e., being attracted to both sexes is a CHOICE. You choose either boy or girl. But being Gay, you're only attracted to the same sex (not a choice). Straight people are only attracted to the opposite sex. If a Straight person argues that it's a choice, all you need to say is the following: "You, who are straight, chose to be with the opposite sex. That means you were attracted to BOTH sexes and CHOSE the opposite sex, right?" You'll then hear a pin drop on the carpet, and he or she will be at a loss for words. God does not make mistakes in his infinite wisdom, where a certain percentage of the population is Gay. Why is a certain percentage of the population left handed, while the majority is right handed? Same analogy. Countless Gay, as well as Straight, are loving, caring, sharing, and productive human beings. Period and end of story.
I grew up gay in a small Arkansas town and life was hell. I still have to deal with the memories. I can’t believe I stayed here.
thank you for telling your story,
I am from south Louisiana with Roman Catholic parents and came out in 1982 the hard way. My lover's parents found out we were more than just happy college roommates and they felt compelled to contact my parents to tell them we were in a GAY relationship to keep me away from their son. It was a cataclysm, lots of intolerance, insistence we change, crying, and in the thick of the fighting, we ran away to San Francisco. We were lucky and had college degrees. We were able to get jobs, worked our asses off, and thrived. Forty three years later, we are now retired and still happily together. Our families eventually got over themselves and we are all are on good terms.
Time heals old wounds and it gets better.
Wow congratulations on 43 years together. That's really cool
Great story Richard, so glad love won for you and your lover, still together, true love. xx
Great story Richard, so glad your love for one another won out. Happy anniversary
Love is love ❤️
Great video Micah. Would love to hear more about your life and interests. You’re a great communicator and your message is really important.
From Texas. I feel your pain on so many levels.
Micah, I know this was posted a few years ago, but thank you so much for putting it up here. I'm 27, and grew up in Virginia. I noticed a lot of parallels between our stories: betrayal from "friends", religion, family struggles, etc. Even coming up on 30, I'm realizing I still have to deal with a lot of issues, internally and externally. I just want you to know that by putting this story out there, you are helping a lot of people. It's reassuring to know I'm not alone. Thank you :-)
Yeah i grew up in a MS swamp and went to vacation bible school in picayune every summer. Lots of rough shit.
Lots of Gays in small country towns closeted yes but they form thier groups and keep it touch. I'm from Oklahoma and Hevener Oklahoma has all ways had lots I mean lots of closeted Gay from Jr High ....High School .. threw adult hood
Great video! I wish you ONLY the BEST!!!!!!
Thanks for your words of wisdom. I pray people will continue to accept differences. I was much the same from ten/twelve. I’m older and had no venues etc to be true to myself and others. Finally came out in my 50’s. I’m fine but it was a long process in a homophobic world. Was married with a son prior which I loved dearly, still do.
Micah, I'm probably almost 40 years older than you but had the same religious background. It was horrible knowing I was gay, (I knew I was gay before I even knew what gay was!) but also knowing your family and church family would think you were "bad" if they knew. Didn't finally come out till my mid 30's and three children latter. Never been happier after that. My father never mentioned after I initially told my parents. Until, he was in the nursing home and my boyfriend came with me to visit my dad. I introduced him a "my friend Ralph." Latter, Ralph went out to get something out of the car and my dad said. "You're "boyfriend" seems like a nice young man." My heart jumped for joy. I said, yes, dad, he's very nice. I was satisfied at this late date in my dad's life that he could say that much. I'm so proud of all you young men posting your coming out stories. It IS making a difference to hundreds if not thousands of young men and ladies. You seem like a great person. Thanks for sharing.
You are a beautiful man inside and out
I'm from South Carolina and I feel you and support you. I know so many people who have fall out plans for when their parents find out and it's heartbreaking.
Our God is a god of love not of hate. He loves you too.
Religion is a monumental chapter in the history of human Egotism. Religion is the opium of the masses. The tendency to claim God as an ally for our partisan values and ends is the source of all religion’s fanaticism. Religion a daughter of Hope and Fear explaining to Ignorance the nature of the Unknowable. The world is my country, the people are my brethren and to do good is my religion. HUMANITY IS THE SUPREME MOST IMPORTANT RELIGION.
SO, TRY TO BE A HUMAN FIRST.
Micah.....I grew up in Alabama so I completely understand.and know how hard it is .....I didn't come out till I was 27....I am 47 now, so imagine what it was like coming out 20 years ago......My family is very.. very ..very religious ...and it took them 6 or 7 years to come around.... but finally they did....I have a partner now and we have been together for 16 years and he is just like any other family member now.....so don't give up on them quite yet....Keep being happy and someday maybe you can fully share your happiness with them...Stay strong!!!
"prejudice and ignorance" so true! "cornfed" LMAO!! just stumbled on this and I don't know if you still check your messages but I love this video. My bf is Japanese and we are super impressed that you learned the language in TENTH grade! Thanks for sharing your story!
I agree. I came out at 22 and I lost alot of my family my home and if it wont for my friends and kindness from people I couldn't have gotten through the pain of my own family not loving me for who I am. It still hurts. But thank you for this video, we need more of them
Thank you - you're a great man and I wish I'd been as together when I came out over forty years ago in Adelaide in South Australia. Love.
I really appreciated your video. I wish you a happy great long life...
Great vid Micah! From the heart for sure! Much love!
I adore this message as it's so 'right on' about so many things, and thank you, Micah, for calling out religion -- the sole, original source of all anti-gay bullshit. You must be about 31 now (2021) and I hope I come across an update, as you've got a great thought-processing ability going on ... to say nothing of you being freakin' adorable yourself, too. Much love to you, bro, and thanks for sharing the positive message! Many will benefit.
I just found this story, and I must say that it sounds a lot like my story, only forty years later. I did come out to my Mom when I was 18 and leaving home to go to University in the big city. She was quite accepting, and in fact suggested a few years that my room mate and I were sleeping together. That could have happened, but didn't. I never did come out to my Dad, who was so upset that my brother married a Baptist that he threatened tp boycott the wedding.I eventually went back into the closet and married and had two adopted kids, a gayson and a straight daughter. My wife never accepted our son, and asked why he didn't marry a girl and have kids she night before she died. This in spite of the fact that he was working from home so he could be with his husband twelve hours from his office. My final public coming out was on the six o'clock news Pride coverage, about ten years ago.
Great job telling your inspiring story. I'm glad you are a strong person and you stand strong for what you believe in. Consider making an update video? Hope you are doing well!
Great video Micah. How's life at 26 now? I didn't come out until later in life (50) and although I get along with my 4 children, they don't want to hear anything about my gay life and my ex-wife won't even speak to me. Hindsight is everything but in the late 60's and early 70's it was hard to come out. Climate not like today. So good for you, and yes, GOD LOVES YOU JUST THE WAY YOU ARE! Try not to give up the faith. There are so many affirming churches nowadays for same-sex couples and singles.
i live in mississippi so i understand FULLY
You're a great guy Micah
Dang Dude, I hope you're doing good these days an I hope your family opens up at some point.
I don't know that I was born gay, all I know is that I've been same sex attracted for as long as I can remember.
Old video but well done
Wishing you every happiness XXX X.
Yes, I experienced the same thing in the state of Georgia. I live in the state Georgia and the small town they know I am gay even though we never talked about it. So, as long as do not talk about my sexuality, my small town leaves me alone. I am gay, but I do not talk about my sexuality, because still in the United States it is still not safe to be gay.
I'm sorry that u are in Arkansas
Oh Micah, I like you. You have a lot of spunk. You’re part of a very special group. I sometimes think God made us this way for a reason. Aside from population control, and keeping women safe from horny men, there is something much larger for our purpose? I wish it was known to us now, but I’m willing to wait. I never got picked on that much, since I was always one of the tallest in all my classes, plus I have this crazy sense of humor, that seemed to attract people to me? I went into the best profession where I felt I would effect others-teaching in elementary school. It’s amazing how some young students show signs of being gay right from the start. It gives me a chance to offer the parents the heads up and some things to expect as they grow up. I keep the parents very much abreast as to what goes on in the classroom. I have an open door policy, and have a history of being able to help the “difficult child.” I hear some ugly things about some things teachers get in trouble for, and feel that some of those issues could be resolved with an open line of communication plus, a desire to really want to help children succeed. There are many folks who have no business in the classroom, and unfortunately it shows. I feel I need to share with you that I do teach in the Los Angeles School District, which happens to be a very progressive district I’m not sure what you’re future plans are, but out here in the west, things do seem to be better for LGBTQ and minority groups. The thinking is just more open, yeah we have jerks but they get silenced right away! Be well and stay safe, I’m alex from LA
Beautiful video. I like to think every day is my first. Thank you.
Thank you so much. I really just want people to know they aren't alone and that life is too short. :-)
So Shakespearean. The betrayal of a close friend. oh my.😶
One minor correction, Gay Rights started back in the 20's, got more active in the 50's and exploded at Stonewall. People were attending meetings for gay rights all over the country in the 70's and it spread far and wide from there.
Good morning Royal Highness tou are looking great and your image is so prominent and identifyable with tall dark and hansome and particularly rich. You NEED A PLATFORM to get noticed Piers Morgan is on British Morning news program and He Is The Business please can we have the interview. Its your choice. Love to see you. Heds up to you your maj.
The reason people have difficulty to accept is because of their ego. Otherwise, it is your life and your choice and your choice. I m a teacher ........ To me all my students r like kids- regardless of any preference and background they have ....... Being gay is only an orientation, if people understand ..... In life, there are some permanent things that are challenging and difficult to live with, like living with extreme health conditions etc ....
I send all my love and support to all the LGBT people of the world ❤🧡💛💚💙💜 You all are important and very valuable even though we live in a world that makes you all believe otherwise. Remember always be proud of who you are 🏳️🌈🏳️🌈🏳️🌈🏳️🌈🏳️🌈🏳️🌈 You all make from this world a better place ❤🧡💛💚💙💜 LGBT people are a rainbow of love in a world full of hate, but with difference of our straight partners, we all are united over a same flag 🏳️🌈🏳️🌈🏳️🌈🏳️🌈🏳️🌈🏳️🌈🏳️🌈 The flag of LGBT love ❤🧡💛💚💙💜 And we all must be united against hate, violence, discrimination and intolerance ❤🧡💛💚💙💜 We all are like a great family and we must fight to destroy hate ❤🧡💛💚💙💜 Remember, LGBT people is love and love always wins ❤🧡💛💚💙💜 I don't care about your race, nationality, biological gender, health condition, religion or any other condition ❤🧡💛💚💙💜 If you are an LGBT person you have all my love and my support ❤🧡💛💚💙💜 You guys are not alone in this fight and all the LGBT people of all over the world needs to understand this messagge, cause just united we will win against hate and we don't have to allow that nothing divide us. Never feel bad of who you are and never allow that this cruel world change who you really are or turn off your light and your shine ❤🧡💛💚💙💜 You all born that way and remember LGBT people of all the world, at the end, love always wins ❤🧡💛💚💙💜
You are a hottie 🔥 Thanks for your coming-out story. Hopefully, this helps others. Live your life, follow your dreams. Wishing you nothing but peace, prosperity, and happiness. Big hugs and kisses 🤗💋
I know it can anger you that you even care what your parents think in regards to the religion thing even after all these years. But family is so embedded in our hearts, they can touch & hurt us like no one else. I still deal with that with my family and it hurts that I can't share a part of my life with them knowing I don't have complete acceptance even as they smile and politely tolerate it.
I'm much older and had similar experience in greenville,sc. My Dad died young, so I never told him. My religious Mom refused to talk about it when I brought it up. Luckily she's dead now. I have no use for Christianity now. Judge not others is what they say, but it's exactly what they do. By the way, you are model handsome!
When someone tells you you are going to hell just tell them, I will save you a spot up front.
Was also outed by someone I was considered a friend. and also had a crush on a guy named ben. Kindof funny and ironic.
please stay srong. kisses from Belgium
I too live in Arkansas and yes there is alot of nonsense directed at gays here. Many feel like they do because of fear and ignorance and there can be other reasons. In today's world there is absolutely no excuse for it considering how simple it is to do research and it's right there at your fingertips.
It's sad how so called Christians act any thing but Christian. The 2 basic rules Jesus said were Love the Lord. And Love your neighbor as yourself. That says it all. It sure seems like most Christians don't follow those rules though.
awesome vid, i also have the same story
Awhh You're so cute
Hi, it sounds as if your folks are grieving the son they expected. You know, a big wedding, grandkids, family functions. Look how long it has taken most of us to accept ourselves, heck, sometimes I still have problems with it. I feel with time, education, and taking about it, they will come around? Why would we (as a certain group of individuals) elect to live a life that will be characterized by hate, bullying, and filled with so many challenges? Also, try not to be so hard on your faith. The times we are living in, are not painting a good example of what being a good Christian looks like. Plus, I do have it different simply by living in a liberal state as California. I realize how fortunate I am, but I still have that question- why me? why us? My heart bleeds when I think of all the lives that have been lost simply because we are wired differently. I wish you the best as you continue on your path. Are you still living in the south? Be well Micah. Alex from LA
See you in heaven!
B/c
Hashem does not care what you think...
Cares what you do ...
Project that love! .
52 year phase on this end, Christian Only, & your friend - strangers are friends you haven't met yet
Being Gay is NOT a choice. Being Bisexual IS a choice, i.e., being
attracted to both sexes is a CHOICE. You choose either boy or girl. But
being Gay, you're only attracted to the same sex (not a choice).
Straight people are only attracted to the opposite sex. If a Straight
person argues that it's a choice, all you need to say is the following:
"You, who are straight, chose to be with the opposite sex. That means
you were attracted to BOTH sexes and CHOSE the opposite sex, right?"
You'll then hear a pin drop on the carpet, and he or she will be at a
loss for words. God does not make mistakes in his infinite wisdom, where
a certain percentage of the population is Gay. Why is a certain
percentage of the population left handed, while the majority is right
handed? Same analogy. Countless Gay, as well as Straight, are loving,
caring, sharing, and productive human beings. Period and end of story.
my new houseboi in vegas
I'm a jew!
Um hello!
Liviticus 18:22
Coming up I was bullied because I was different. But😊😊😊it gets much better with age Hon watch out for those Baptists. Lol. 😊
Yea they are back stabbers. All of them