I was vegetarian for over 35 years.. May 2024 I switched to a meat 🥩 diet… I have better energy.. I think meat is better protein than vegetable protein.. I had low energy with vegetables 🥦. Plus my blood 🩸 sugar is now normal.. I was pre diabetic as a vegetarian.🥗
What most ppl overlook is that it might not be the protein itself, animal protein sources are rich in micro nutrients, plants have them too, but they are known to also have anti nutrients compounds that limits the absorption rates even for other products when eaten together, for this reason some ppl tend to never ever eat animal meals and plants in the same sitting
My issue with vegan protein was that it also came with a high carb level. Which is what made me prediabetic too. I think that only soy/ tofu is a low carb high protein option. I now still eat vegetables but consume a lot of animal protein
Another well researched video..the world needs more people who think like Dr. Nick. Only thing I would add..is who is conducting the study..what is their agenda!
Went keto recently becuase of you and man I gotta say, you have a way with conveying so many of these jargony papers with such simplicity, keep it up man!
Funny when he said that "if you eat six eggs and a steak". Some days I'll have fish and eggs, but the main core of my diet is precisely 6 eggs and a steak!
You’re the absolute best at breaking studies down and communicating what the data is saying. You seem to do it in a very unbiased manner too, which I greatly appreciate.
More videos like this in the future? I think that in today's "evidence-based" world, people need to be shown the context of a real example study and discuss their conclusions. Your content is great!
@@nicknorwitzPhD No, it wasn’t dry. It hit just the right balance of logic, facts, dispassionate advocacy and teaching. Not to mention it was an extremely defensible position (when the inevitable push-back comes from the status quo folks). Your content is a rare gem in this space, and is an absolute necessity for helping the masses understand how facts are being manipulated. Thank you for using your talents for the greater good.
Great video. Thanks for highlighting the risk of noise in dietary studies. It’s amazing how carbohydrate are frequently treated as benign elements of our diet especially given the high rate of insulin resistance in our society. What is our metabolism going to do with dietary fat and protein with persistently elevated insulin?
I have often questioned (in my head) doctors who quote statistics. I know even a well conducted study with all the double blind blah, blah, is still not necessarily representative of me. I could be the outlier and have been. Our health is our responsibility. Thank you for helping in our education of N=1
Can't thank you enough for spending hours upon hours dissecting all of the studies on that topic. I, and I assume most people don't have neither the time nor the expertise to look through and scrutinize very complicated literatures. The usefulness of this kind of breakdown content cannot be overstated.
I don't think you can say accurately that most studies are bullshit. I do think that the amount of fraudulent research is increasing. I think that nutrition has become some kind of political or maybe religious war almost.
I once did a paper on medical dietairy supplements and their claims to improve wound healing. I found out the people who did the 8 research papers where patent holders of that product. The 3 studies that where done that proved the product was not as great as the other studies claimed where done independantly. Remember the "It's amazing Mike" videos from tell sell? Well I get those vibes. Research studies and papers is a very DEEP rabbit hole. Most studies that have something to prove have a financial asset they need to protect. That accounts for food, supplements but also medicin.
my favorite debate tactic is when they counter an animal based diet by posting a picture of a McDonald's extra value meal. 95% of the calories in the picture are plant based with little nutrition yet somehow its animal based.
Love your videos, I have seen a lot of similar videos saying "epidemiology bad" but few have gone into this level of detail examining the studies. Unfortunately most people take the conclusions at face value, including youtubers.
Back in the 80s the one vegan lie was you could eat healthy, and cheap on a vegan diet. We were poor, so I left the meat for my husband and baby and I did all the protein combining . Results: Morning body temperature went from 98.6 to 94 Malnutrition Worsening of gut issues. To be fair, I have likely been gluten intolerant since at lease age 5. Diagnosed at 47. Issues besides bloating and pain. Chronic constipation and arthritis in my knees they called growing pains. I am short. So no great growth from the nights of pain. PMS Depression Weight gain Eyebrows started thinning Hair started to thin and recede. Loss of muscle High blood pressure Very low cholesterol. To the point it worried my doctor. And she was comparing it to the already dangerously low standards pushed by big pharma. Very high triglycerides. Unfortunately, I switched to the semi vegan food pyramid when we had more money. Just slowed down the deterioration, but fixed nothing. I reversed all the big issue when I went I went low carb 14 years ago, but admit it yook 10 years to fix the thyroid issues. I have eyebrows again. Normal morning body temperature. Hair thickening in my late 60s. The other main vegan lie was you would lose weight. Many of my friends and relatives tried and failed. They gained instead. They were the very lucky ones as they quit before any damage. Except one. She got the desired vegan German concentration camp look. Finally, when her health hit rock bottom, she left the starvation diet. But some things can not be fixed now. The difference between a few years of starvation compared to over a decade of starvation.
It definitely is a starvation diet. A coworker of mine was vegan for a single year and lost ~91kg (he was ~181kg before that). He told me it was because both the lack of nutrient dense food and because vegan food is just nasty so most days he didn't even eat anything. Now he eats whatever he wants xD
@@kyokoyumi Halfing his obese body is probably not bad in general, but the problem with the vegan approach is, that it generally don't last. He most likely lost lots of muscle, too. If he doesn't find a way to a proper diet, he might end up either obese again or very fragile.
The short term benefits vegans see are from the fasting like qualities since there are almost zero nutrients that humans can use in plants. Also they stop eating processed food from boxes. Yet they don’t get ketones since their diet is mostly carbs. Their insulin is always too high to ever lose weight. High insulin inflames your body and makes pain everywhere - what docs call getting old can be reversed with keto/carnivore.
I find this so fascinating. I was following primal blueprint for 2 years back in 2012. Lost 70 lbs. then gained it mostly all back then some, due to lifestyle changes. Went vegan for 5 years in 2016. Didn’t lose any weight and couldn’t ever get enough protein in my diet compared to what I was doing previously. The way vegan presented their case as to why it’s good and the studies they sited also didn’t feel as in depth as many keto/carnivore followers dive into explaining. It’s wild to know that even if a study shows a specific result, it might be misleading how they got to those conclusions. I’m trying to transition into a more carnivore diet and looking at a more n=1 approach.
Another helpful tool in the decision process is the DIAA score of the protein. As well as the work and recommendations of Dr. Donald Layman and Dr. Stuart Phillips. Both have dedicated years to the study of proteins.
Yes. Actually I made this video on question/request from Gabrielle Lyon (to her credit) who trained under Don. I'm well aware of DIASS scoring, but it wasn't in the scope of his video... have talked about it before, but - again - slightly diff topic.
I would challenge the assumption that nurses are a ”healthy” cohort. Most of the nurses I have been around as a result of doctors appointments and routine test procedures are obese, borderline obese, and likely metabolically challenged. Sorry but that’s the way it is.
Thank you so much for this video Nick. The summary at the end was really great and helped drive everything home. Not to take anything away from this excellent video and your effort but it's sad that all of your statements aren't just common sense among people explore in nutrition as lay people or researchers or influencers.
Thanks for your dissemination. I used to go through the effort, arrived at the same conclusions. I much prefer relying on you. It took me a lot longer to figure out why the conclusions were bs due to lack of training. This is much more enjoyable.
Bravo Nick - love this message. I also find the references to not say what the authors state in their papers. Super frustrating! Most folks don't look at the supplemental data as well. Excellent job with that😊
Nick, you take the art of debunking to a whole new level. This was a Masterclass in how not to conduct science (the authors) and how it should be done. And the solution is simple, just compare real vegans to real carnivores. Both groups zealously stick to their diets, so no questionnaires are needed.
Dear Dr Nick. You are a very informative person. I simple question, Why do you have a GLIBERT rugby ball in your display cabinet? Sorry, I am a South African, and rugby here is kind of a religion. Great informative and professionally presented video. Greeting from South Africa
many studies around dietary intervention are so confusing. when we look at the "supplement" data we can find what you said in this great video. open mind, open eyes, critical thinking and yess curiosity. there will be different study with differet target population and great compliance but... thank you nick! you are able to uncover huge gap magically!
Curiosity for the win! Another masterclass in metabolism ... and maybe even more importantly, the "how" of looking "under the hood" of a study or meta-analysis to see whether the pieces add up. Thanks.
Unfortunately this mismatch in the variable's true definition and the variable's claimed representation is rampant all over psychological literature as well. Keep up the good work Nick!
I would love to see a video with both you and Dr Eric Westman as you both seem to be the most logical keto/carnivore youtubers out there. All of the other carnivore youtubers seem to just spout anecdotal information. (Edit: I didn’t word this very well at all. There’s nothing wrong with anecdotal information.)
@@nicknorwitzPhD I mean there’s nothing wrong with anecdotal information but I appreciate those who do the digging and try to remain as scientific as possible. Whereas some RUclipsrs just like to repeat “proper human diet” over and over again while being all in your face about how right they are. Which doesn’t seem very scientific and objective. Just saying I appreciate you and what you do 😁
Vegetarian here. I have listened. But listening and agreeing are two very different things. I think that any scientifically based vegetarian would acknowledge that for pure protein, it probably doesn't matter the source. I would also push back on how to handle these observational studies. There is more than just the Nurses study that comes to the same conclusion. So just because you have issues with the methodology of one study, doesn't throw out the other studies. And even with those methodological limitations, it doesn't mean the its conclusion is wrong. Just not as strong as some seam to make it appear. A vegetarian may seem not to listen because for MOST vegetarians, they are not vegetarian purely for health reasons. They are not asking themselves what is the HEALTHIEST diet a human can be on. They are asking, IF I can be healthy and not eat meat, then why would I? It is not a science based question. It is science informed, but its basis is not in science but in moral philosophy. Science CLEARLY says that it is indeed possible to live a very healthy life and not eat any animal products. A vegetarian says, well if that is true, then why do we tolerate factory farming? It is not that a vegetarian is not listening to you. You are just not dealing with the question that they are concerned with. I currently understand that a vegan diet has particular health advantages over a diet that includes animals. However, I am not married to that idea. If some new study comes out that CLEARLY shows that one NEEDS meat to be a body builder or run an ultra marathon, or not get some sort of cancer, I would probably still be vegetarian. Because my point is not only based on health outcomes. It is just one of the many pillars that support the vegan decision.
I am an outlier. I hyper absorb cholesterol AND plant sterols. Eating egg yolks for me is a risky endeavor, but also eating too many almonds (high in sterols). I am currently on ezetimibe to lower my absorption rate. Apparently too many plant sterols in the blood is also a bad thing. Fun times.
I think it makes sense for those who were eating low calories but having high BMI. After years of diets I killed my metabolism. Eating less and gaining fat. (Calorie counting for decades with high insulin resistance/low blood sugar/high subcutaneous fat storage. Cutting carbs and extended fasting over years made me lose 150lbs I've been trying to up my calories without adding too much weight over the last 3 years. But I gain fat with very little and my body resists losing it. I have high BMI, small waist and gain weight with higher protein
Yes I experience the same, but I'm a young 20 years old man, I have been dealing with this since I was 18 years old. Thanks to carnivore diet and keto diets i started to perform better and nourish my whole system, back then I was eating 1,200 calories, 20k steps daily plus weight lifting workouts and I wasn't able to lose weight. Now I'm eating 3,000 calories, of course I weigh much more but I don't look fat, I look really strong. I recommend you to see the RUclips channel of Kelly Hogan, she's the perfect teacher on this topic
That is proper analysis of scientific data. I personally experienced a lot of benefits from a low carb - high protein - high veg diet, but was warned off it by nearly every medical 'expert' I encountered. Here in the Netherlands the dietary narrative is still post-wwII. And as the food industry is the most generous supporter of 'scientific' dietary research and dietician's education institutes, we all still get referred to 'light' and otherwise hyper processed foods. I never went there, but did go off the low carb, but have been in limbo ever since. Who to trust? The experts or my own experience? Thanks for your video. That is another strike for my own experience.
Vegetarian protein has more glycine and less methionine than animal muscle meat. Chris Masterjohn has an explanation for why folks with worse methylation genes (there's a lot of us) would need more glycine than others and do poorly on an excess of methionine. Glycine can be had from collagenous foods, but usually meat eaters are just eating muscle meat. Personally, a carnivore diet gives me leg cramps unless I include either some vegetarian protein or regular servings of collagenous foods like skin, tendon, broths
There is so much "gaming" going on in Scientific literature regarding this subject (albeit certainly not exclusively) the book cooking, broad strokes & half-truths are glaring once you look into the details. I've been heavy lifting for over 20 years now and learned early on Soy Protein is pretty terrible for maintaining clean cut muscle mass. "Oh Phytoestrogens aren't estrogenic...blah blah blah; yet certain Plant sterols (Beta sitosterol for example) literally bind up Anabolic receptors and from personal experience? Too much will make you feel weaker and affect aesthetic composition *if that's a personal concern* Plants have all sorts of beneficial chemicals and I definitely include plenty greens, frozen/freeze dried berries etc. I even dabble with Turmeric, Chia, Matcha etc. But for my goals the latter need to be in moderation. And I simply can't imagine feeling healthy without animal proteins in my diet at all.
In my 4 years of whole real food ketogenic eating, and now most of a year of carnivore, I've become acutely aware that studies show "meat eaters", who eat nothing like me, have an elevated risk of some conditions. Interestingly, eating this way has completely reversed some of the conditions we are warned that eating this way will cause!🤔
I'm an ovo vegetarian. I've always been active, but this year re-introduced eggs and egg protein (allergic to dairy, even whey protein isolate, due to casein) Lots of eggs, both egg and veg protein, no sugar, low starchy carbs. Works great, gained 20 lbs of lean mass, I'm 57 and climbed both Aconcagua and Ararat this year.
Well done Nick, excellent. Meta analyses are like MBS’s, their quality is only as good as the quality of its components (the mortgages that compose them). This is similar to what led to the 2008 financial collapse: put bunches of bad loans together into piles of crap and now stamp AAA ratings on those MBS’s and voila. Again, if the components of the whole are no good, the end product isn’t either. I recently saw a doctor on RUclips defending seed oils with a meta analysis. But even the meta analysis he was using as evidence says this: “…the present evidence alone is insufficient to conclude that increasing PUFA in place of any other nutrient will reduce CHD events. Notably, this evidence is similarly insufficient to conclude that decreasing SFA in place of any other nutrient will reduce CHD events.” “Many of the identified randomized trials in our meta-analysis had important design limitations…” “Given these limitations of each individual trial, the quantitative pooled risk estimate should be interpreted with some caution.” When I pointed this out, he deleted my comment.
Yes, when many of these studies compare the benifits of animal based diets with plantbased, they often put processed foods like deep fried french fries, high sugar orange juice and juices in the category of vegetables and fruits, as if people are eating a whole food salad and whole grain bread or other meals. Its like saying people are eating beef, but what thwy are actually being served is a block of tallow, with a sliver of red lean meat in it. This goes both ways.
I like to do fruit/veg/carbs right before a workout. After that I do about 120g of animal protein throughout the rest of my eating window before fasting. Animal protein is necessary to maintain muscle mass and metabolic health is soooo much easier when you have healthy muscle mass. BMI doesn’t really take that into consideration
Nick, winning an argument has its place once in a while, but when it comes to health, it's not about winning an argument or proving so called intellectual superiority regarding studies, it's about doing what makes you healthy, which I'd think you agree on. (steak and eggs vs beans and tofu) Also, the environmental aspects of food, in my mind, should be considered, as that is extremely important for this and future generations. Maybe that's not your thing, but I was surely thinking about it as you spoke in this video.
I hear you. Two thoughts. First, I agree it's about what works best for you. That's my whole deal with N = 1 science. But to make this possible, we need to remove barriers to access... which also means "debunking" where necessarily. Second, I agree on environmental aspects of food. But to have a reasonable discussion on this matter, we should have it as a separate discussion. Otherwise, emotions and arguments bleed into one another and we go nowhere. TBH, I'm mindful on that matter, including referencing regeneratively raised beef, sustainably caught seafood, composting, practicing entomophagy, etc. You're right, it's an important topic. But it was not the topic of this video.
Anything the Government say to eat i just do the opposite. I recommend reading “Health and Beauty Mastery” by Julian Bannett that book is a real eye opener about shocking stuff health industry is doing! I completely changed my habits
The same bs over and over again. Don't buy this book, the OG comment was clearly paid for. They post the same bs on many other videos and then pay for likes to make this lie visible.
Great video. Well done for pointing out 'the game' going on with this. GOOD WORK! "Science" is a thing of the past now (in the medical industry), and with the new 'editing' of history of the internet, things are about to get a lot worse.
The world knew this in the 90s, when Mike Wallace and Jeffrey Wygand exposed the tobacco industry on 60 Minutes. The truth was too hard to handle. Dig deeper - what truths lie below the deceit of the medical journals ... if you dare.
This is exactly why I bought my own Cholesterol meter and I am figuring out how my Lipid system works. It is very interesting but also hard because one needs to keep everything constant and changr only one thing. I may have discovered a positive ”side effect” of statins. My nasal polyps seem to improve when i take them. The other medication that works is cortison orally but rosuvastatins inflamation dampening effect seem to work on the polyps. I noted this in the spring. Then went off the statins for a while. My polyps got worse and the rinsing with bundesonid did not seem to be that effective. I started statins again as a part of figuring out my lipid system and after two weeks my nose internal swelling improved. There are some studies that supports this function of reducing inflation in the upper respiratory tracts.
@@nicknorwitzPhD Eggxciting , I am just 19 years being a weird boy from young age because of having different thinking about the world . But we keep going.
I like this approach. Once you’re getting around .7g-.8g per pound of body weight, source isn’t really important. If you’re struggling to reach that, animal products can be beneficial.
It takes more than double the amount of plant protein for the same anabolic response as something like beef and comes with phytoestrogens and anti-nutrients I'm not excited about either
Fair review, Glad you pointed out final point about burden of proof. My view is not all animal proteins bad at all, only processed like sausages or bacon and those if excess saturated fats causes an issue. Perhaps if all overly BBq and increase carcinogenic, indeed many animal proteins especially oily fish are even beneficial The power of plant protein for me lies in the variety of fiber, which I deem key to good health span and longevity. Yes usual critics will claim fiber not essential which is true for living but anyway, that’s my view after my own deep dive for 2 years in this topic
I would more or less agree with what you said. Fiber is critically important for your gut biome. Plants have it. Meat doesn't. Another thing about carcinogens and meat. Meat typically has to be cooked to be safe for consumption. Cooking, any cooking, increases the carcinogenic free radicals. Meat does not have many anti-oxidants to take care of those free radicals. Plants, on the other hand, do have a plethora of available anti-oxidants to deal with the free radicals formed by cooking. So there is that to consider as well. But in reality, most likely any diet that is whole food and avoids current commercially processed foods is likely to be better than the typical American diet. And if you are conscious of what you are eating, you are probably as healthy as you can be. Any minor adjustments (plant or animal protein, for instance) probably doesn't make that significant of a change. Like, eat a typical american diet and die at 50. Watch what you eat and live till you are 90 or 100. But if a healthy diet with meat gets you to 95 but a vegan diet gets you to 96, what does that really matter? Well, all those animals you killed... but that is not a science question...
@@jordanjtbraun Grass fed meat and dairy have more antioxidants than plants. That's all that's available in my country - we do not have grain fed red meat. Fibre is not essential. Insoluble fibre is useless to us. Herbivores can utilise it as a fat source because they have the ability to digest it. We don't. Herbivores eat a diet that is 60-70% fat because of their ability to ferment plant material and utilise cellulose as fat. Soluble fibre is turned into short chain fatty acids by your gut bacteria and used in the production of ketones. The exact same thing happens when you eat meat via a shorter route. No plant contains B12. They contain B12 analogues which prevent you from absorbing real B12.
@OldRoadFarm-ck3mj dude, I need a reference or it didn't happen. Carleson et al (2010) would say that your claim is wrong. " The total antioxidant content of more than 3100 foods, beverages, spices, herbs and supplements used worldwide."
@OldRoadFarm-ck3mj "Fibre is not essential". Well, the most recent research of the gut microbiome seems to suggest that the optimal gut biome is maintained by varied fiber sources. So it is not for our nutrition directly, but critical for the health of our gut bacteria. Essential? I guess it depends on how you look at it. I think it has tremendous health benefits and I have studies that confirm this.
@OldRoadFarm-ck3mj "No plants contain B12". True. But it is made by microbes, not animals. Even cows need to have a B12 shot. So whether you are giving B12 to your beef before it dies or get it more directly by a pill, either way you are supplementing. (I can provide references if you want).
Exercise offers so many benefits that it's truly worth the effort. Choosing not to train is a major mistake, leading to faster aging and a reduced quality of life.
How do you consider lasagna a meat base ? It has wheat, probably some seeds oil. What is the glycemic load of pasta vs mest ? Empty calories vs essentials calories
Something I learned yesterday on a similar topic. Oleic acid (the fatty acid that is proposed to be why olive oil is healthy, especially heart healthy) content in percentages: Olive oil - 55-80% Bacon - 50% Prosciutto crudo - 50-60% So apparently bacon and prosciutto are about as heart healthy as olive oil, but everybody's been told bacon and such are horrible for heart health and olive oil is amazingly healthy... Do the lies in nutrition have an end?
I think a focus on hyper absorbers of saturated due to APOE 4 should be done. As well as those with genetically of high APa. Vis a vis red meat consumption. Great channel BTW 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
Thank for highlighting dodgy nutrition science. No wonder people are confused with what to eat. I'm just surprised and very concerned that they are allowed to be published and make claims based on this data.
Great video! Could you please make a video on a typical day of eating, including macros and calories (sorry, energy/fuel 😂)? Thank you for your great insightful information!! Greetings from Germany!
Hey, Nick, I'm curious to how would you design a study that will definitely end the plant vs animal protein debate? In my opinion, it's impossible. To many confounders, how ever you frame it.
hey Nick, I wonder if you have any videos where you speak about organ meats, it's an interesting topic for me when trying to discover any difference with muscle meat beyond the nutritional profile
Do we (us humans) have an efficient digestive-metabolic conversion pathway to digest and utilize plant protein compared to those plant-based animals (herbivores)??
I didn’t mean to insinuate that you did. I assumed nurses were involved in the study mentioned especially since BMI is often indicated as a negative factor often ignored in some studies. 🤷♂️
Nick first of all so many thanks for the content your bringing out. 🙏 You probably covered it but I Still I dont know if getting a high ldl while eatings zero to little carbs is bad or not. My friend is a diabetic type 1 and got really emotional when I said Im trying almost zero carbs. As his doctor told him his high ldl is gonna kill even though he was eating zero carbs and felt great. Now he eats carbs again has to shoot alot of insulin and feel more like shit. Also the link between Coronary artery disease and saturated fat is really confusing to me. Any link to a video would be nice aswell! I think I watched one but it was kinda complicated. Im now thinking about doing some university courses on health longevity and metabolism as I really want to understand it.
Nick it’s great that you’re taking a deep dive into this topic. Personally I’d go with what I consider to be the most natural option, carnivore for me!
Im vegan for a decade and very active and never had a problem with my protein and blood work If meat works for you go for it What we have to realize is diet is highly personal and regardless of what your body theoretically can digest, you have to be willing and put intention in what you're having If you give me meat ill prolly throw up but someone else might have eat with pleasure So healthy for me and you are not the same concept
I’m absolutely thriving on steak, eggs, and fish (and salad with olive oil and lemon juice). My main worry is environmental. If everyone ate like this it would be a disaster for climate change, even more so than what is already happening. I hope that our system of food production can be improved. 😢
Now that you understand that "vegetables are better than meat" science is garbage, start digging into the humans are causing climate change science. You will find the same garbage, as I have.
It would be a disaster for the climate change *industry* because it would be shown to be a giant grift, which it is. Government: “pay us more taxes and we’ll fix the weather”. This is the entire basis of the climate ‘change’ myth. Climate has done nothing but change since the beginning of time.
Lets have a study, that has people like myself, that eats only animal based. ZERO carbs. Zero plants. Lets get as many of these people as we can. And... we can have Vegans, eating ZERO ANIMAL products. And lastly.... lets have a third group, sorted by the amount of each plant and animal. Basically the group in the study you showed. Someone who eats a "balanced diet" However they, that person, defines balanced. I think the last group should have far more participants than the Animal or Vegan based. Mainly because they will have the largest range from 1% to 99% of animal or plant.
The most important statement was "you do you and I'll do me". I'm a long term high meat eater with dairy & eggs. Very healthy, 65yrs old, 165lbs & active. I take no notice of anyone other than the studies I look at and I do look at both sides. This thought process served me well in 2020 when an injection came on the market. I asked my GP for written benefits. Nobody could come up with data proving the advantage. So "they did they and I did me!"
same i read the literature and could see a terrible history the investigational products had whilst the media were screaming safe and effective . So they were lying, simple. They had no primary data to base a claim on. They captured the regulators and the media and the rest was simple assuming the sheep like nature of nanny state populations.
Question, after watching a video by Zoë Harcombe on whether fibre is necessary, went reading reviews on Amazon for her books on diet. One of the reviewers said it's out of date due to Keto diets, and another where a follower of her diet said it caused them kidney problems. Why were the majority of followers of the diet perfectly fine with the increased amount of protein, but this other reviewer had problems. What are the differences between Keto and the Zoe Harcombe diet. (I imagine this 2nd question is less likely to be answered as it's a more niche question)
Besides keeping the meat safe from proliferation of harmful bacteria and prevention of foodborne illness there are no health benefits. Avoid all preservatives. The health negatives are well studied and documented. Eat fresh meat or traditional lacto-fermented sausages that don't contain added preservatives.
It is difficult to get good data when you have large groups whose diet isn't monitored well. It is also hard to have people eat consistently over a long period of time. A group of one is easier to collect accurate data.
Nick Norwitz is smartest health guy on youtube
You said it, not me ;)
That would be quite an endorsement except what these kind of statements really mean is you agree with him.
That's plausible; however, at 13:15, Nick says the burden of proof is on you once you've made such a bold claim.
Bart Kay is a lot smarter.
Confidence conveys that impression.
I find that the plant protein is much better when its highly processed, like by a cow or chicken for example.
😂
Ha... I see you...
Probably therefore Barnard claims that meat and eggs are highly processed foods... 🤣
Lol
👍🏻
I was vegetarian for over 35 years.. May 2024 I switched to a meat 🥩 diet… I have better energy.. I think meat is better protein than vegetable protein.. I had low energy with vegetables 🥦. Plus my blood 🩸 sugar is now normal.. I was pre diabetic as a vegetarian.🥗
Glad you found something that works for you.
What most ppl overlook is that it might not be the protein itself, animal protein sources are rich in micro nutrients, plants have them too, but they are known to also have anti nutrients compounds that limits the absorption rates even for other products when eaten together, for this reason some ppl tend to never ever eat animal meals and plants in the same sitting
My issue with vegan protein was that it also came with a high carb level. Which is what made me prediabetic too. I think that only soy/ tofu is a low carb high protein option. I now still eat vegetables but consume a lot of animal protein
@Stefano-o5fyou were carnivore?
What kinds of food did you eat when you were vegetarian? Why do you think you were prediabetic? Was it too many carbs?
Another well researched video..the world needs more people who think like Dr. Nick. Only thing I would add..is who is conducting the study..what is their agenda!
My first thoughts
Went keto recently becuase of you and man I gotta say, you have a way with conveying so many of these jargony papers with such simplicity, keep it up man!
I appreciate that!
Stay curious! Thank you for your service to the world Nick
Cheers Philosophy Geek!
Funny when he said that "if you eat six eggs and a steak". Some days I'll have fish and eggs, but the main core of my diet is precisely 6 eggs and a steak!
I see you ;)
I need to up my egg game, I'm only at 4 and a steak!
Dang pasture raised eggs ain't cheap!
@@markbeiser they are cheap at Aldi. 😉🤫
Bring on the steak and eggs baby!
You know what I like...
@@nicknorwitzPhD eggs and salmon!
It's hard to beat! My lunch was Sardines, avocado and eggs!
@@nicknorwitzPhDI thought you will call for better studies and caution 😅
You’re the absolute best at breaking studies down and communicating what the data is saying. You seem to do it in a very unbiased manner too, which I greatly appreciate.
More videos like this in the future? I think that in today's "evidence-based" world, people need to be shown the context of a real example study and discuss their conclusions. Your content is great!
This one appears to be getting a decent response… I thought it might be a bit dry, but I could do more
@@nicknorwitzPhD No, it wasn’t dry. It hit just the right balance of logic, facts, dispassionate advocacy and teaching. Not to mention it was an extremely defensible position (when the inevitable push-back comes from the status quo folks). Your content is a rare gem in this space, and is an absolute necessity for helping the masses understand how facts are being manipulated. Thank you for using your talents for the greater good.
You , along with Dr Ben Bikman are truly my favorites. I incorporate your videos as references to my coaching clients
Glad you like them!
Great video. Thanks for highlighting the risk of noise in dietary studies. It’s amazing how carbohydrate are frequently treated as benign elements of our diet especially given the high rate of insulin resistance in our society. What is our metabolism going to do with dietary fat and protein with persistently elevated insulin?
I have often questioned (in my head) doctors who quote statistics. I know even a well conducted study with all the double blind blah, blah, is still not necessarily representative of me. I could be the outlier and have been. Our health is our responsibility. Thank you for helping in our education of N=1
Cheers. You may also enjoy this: pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/38128881/
Can't thank you enough for spending hours upon hours dissecting all of the studies on that topic. I, and I assume most people don't have neither the time nor the expertise to look through and scrutinize very complicated literatures. The usefulness of this kind of breakdown content cannot be overstated.
This was more about the abuse/misuse of scientific studies than a plant vs animal protein debate.
TL;DR: Most studies are bullsh■t.
Let's fix that or at least call out the ruminant feces
"Most studies are bullsh■t."
All studies done by veg*ns and paid for by the b*g f**d...
@@nicknorwitzPhD 🤣 (That just caught me completely off-guard!)
I don't think you can say accurately that most studies are bullshit. I do think that the amount of fraudulent research is increasing. I think that nutrition has become some kind of political or maybe religious war almost.
I once did a paper on medical dietairy supplements and their claims to improve wound healing. I found out the people who did the 8 research papers where patent holders of that product. The 3 studies that where done that proved the product was not as great as the other studies claimed where done independantly. Remember the "It's amazing Mike" videos from tell sell? Well I get those vibes. Research studies and papers is a very DEEP rabbit hole. Most studies that have something to prove have a financial asset they need to protect. That accounts for food, supplements but also medicin.
my favorite debate tactic is when they counter an animal based diet by posting a picture of a McDonald's extra value meal. 95% of the calories in the picture are plant based with little nutrition yet somehow its animal based.
I wouldn't eat that diet. I eat ground beef, beef steak, occasional beef franks with ground beef, a bit of cheese , water, salt. Age 73, no meds.
You mean the nat med one? Ya... kinda' crazy formulation
Good job. You’ve found the actual way to heal your body.
Maybe we should coin the phrase "Ultra Processed Studies"
Love your videos, I have seen a lot of similar videos saying "epidemiology bad" but few have gone into this level of detail examining the studies. Unfortunately most people take the conclusions at face value, including youtubers.
You’re very welcome :).
Back in the 80s the one vegan lie was you could eat healthy, and cheap on a vegan diet. We were poor, so I left the meat for my husband and baby and I did all the protein combining .
Results:
Morning body temperature went from 98.6 to 94
Malnutrition
Worsening of gut issues. To be fair, I have likely been gluten intolerant since at lease age 5. Diagnosed at 47. Issues besides bloating and pain. Chronic constipation and arthritis in my knees they called growing pains. I am short. So no great growth from the nights of pain.
PMS
Depression
Weight gain
Eyebrows started thinning
Hair started to thin and recede.
Loss of muscle
High blood pressure
Very low cholesterol. To the point it worried my doctor. And she was comparing it to the already dangerously low standards pushed by big pharma.
Very high triglycerides.
Unfortunately, I switched to the semi vegan food pyramid when we had more money. Just slowed down the deterioration, but fixed nothing.
I reversed all the big issue when I went I went low carb 14 years ago, but admit it yook 10 years to fix the thyroid issues. I have eyebrows again. Normal morning body temperature. Hair thickening in my late 60s.
The other main vegan lie was you would lose weight. Many of my friends and relatives tried and failed. They gained instead. They were the very lucky ones as they quit before any damage.
Except one. She got the desired vegan German concentration camp look. Finally, when her health hit rock bottom, she left the starvation diet. But some things can not be fixed now. The difference between a few years of starvation compared to over a decade of starvation.
Desired vegan german concentration camp look 🤣 I need to remember that, very accurate comparison
It definitely is a starvation diet. A coworker of mine was vegan for a single year and lost ~91kg (he was ~181kg before that). He told me it was because both the lack of nutrient dense food and because vegan food is just nasty so most days he didn't even eat anything. Now he eats whatever he wants xD
@@kyokoyumi Halfing his obese body is probably not bad in general, but the problem with the vegan approach is, that it generally don't last. He most likely lost lots of muscle, too. If he doesn't find a way to a proper diet, he might end up either obese again or very fragile.
The short term benefits vegans see are from the fasting like qualities since there are almost zero nutrients that humans can use in plants. Also they stop eating processed food from boxes. Yet they don’t get ketones since their diet is mostly carbs. Their insulin is always too high to ever lose weight. High insulin inflames your body and makes pain everywhere - what docs call getting old can be reversed with keto/carnivore.
@@kyokoyumi He lost all his muscle mass so he’s likely gained by all his fat and then some like most standard starvation dieters
Always excited to see whats coming next from Nick Norwitz department. Thanks again for your work and your experiments!!!!
NICK NORWITZ #1 🤠
More to come! Thanks!
I find this so fascinating. I was following primal blueprint for 2 years back in 2012. Lost 70 lbs. then gained it mostly all back then some, due to lifestyle changes. Went vegan for 5 years in 2016. Didn’t lose any weight and couldn’t ever get enough protein in my diet compared to what I was doing previously. The way vegan presented their case as to why it’s good and the studies they sited also didn’t feel as in depth as many keto/carnivore followers dive into explaining. It’s wild to know that even if a study shows a specific result, it might be misleading how they got to those conclusions. I’m trying to transition into a more carnivore diet and looking at a more n=1 approach.
Thank you for breaking down these study diets.
My pleasure!
Nick is such an enzymatic doctor.
@@SonnyDarvish I like it... dunno I know what it means... but I like it!
Another helpful tool in the decision process is the DIAA score of the protein. As well as the work and recommendations of Dr. Donald Layman and Dr. Stuart Phillips. Both have dedicated years to the study of proteins.
Yes. Actually I made this video on question/request from Gabrielle Lyon (to her credit) who trained under Don. I'm well aware of DIASS scoring, but it wasn't in the scope of his video... have talked about it before, but - again - slightly diff topic.
@nicknorwitzPhD yes understand, just adding to the conversation and the algorithm to grow the channel 👍 Yes, Don has helped train and mentor many.
I would challenge the assumption that nurses are a ”healthy” cohort. Most of the nurses I have been around as a result of doctors appointments and routine test procedures are obese, borderline obese, and likely metabolically challenged. Sorry but that’s the way it is.
I didn’t comment on the healthfulness of nurses as a population
Thank you so much for this video Nick. The summary at the end was really great and helped drive everything home. Not to take anything away from this excellent video and your effort but it's sad that all of your statements aren't just common sense among people explore in nutrition as lay people or researchers or influencers.
I agree 100%
6:29 - great point. Always an issue.
Thanks for watching Nick. Your opinion is always valued.
Thanks for your dissemination. I used to go through the effort, arrived at the same conclusions. I much prefer relying on you. It took me a lot longer to figure out why the conclusions were bs due to lack of training. This is much more enjoyable.
Bravo Nick - love this message. I also find the references to not say what the authors state in their papers. Super frustrating! Most folks don't look at the supplemental data as well. Excellent job with that😊
This video comes across like one of the "merchants of doubt" that the smoking industry used.
Nick, you take the art of debunking to a whole new level. This was a Masterclass in how not to conduct science (the authors) and how it should be done. And the solution is simple, just compare real vegans to real carnivores. Both groups zealously stick to their diets, so no questionnaires are needed.
Thanks. Very nice of you
Dear Dr Nick. You are a very informative person. I simple question, Why do you have a GLIBERT rugby ball in your display cabinet? Sorry, I am a South African, and rugby here is kind of a religion. Great informative and professionally presented video. Greeting from South Africa
Also SA. Fam from Cape Town.
@@nicknorwitzPhDthey’re EVERYWHERE! Robert Cywes, another example.
many studies around dietary intervention are so confusing. when we look at the "supplement" data we can find what you said in this great video. open mind, open eyes, critical thinking and yess curiosity. there will be different study with differet target population and great compliance but... thank you nick! you are able to uncover huge gap magically!
Well, I am Harry Potter
@@nicknorwitzPhD or maybe Merlino!!!
Curiosity for the win! Another masterclass in metabolism ... and maybe even more importantly, the "how" of looking "under the hood" of a study or meta-analysis to see whether the pieces add up. Thanks.
You got it!
Unfortunately this mismatch in the variable's true definition and the variable's claimed representation is rampant all over psychological literature as well. Keep up the good work Nick!
Cheers
HI Nick, that was a brilliant piece of research. Many thanks. 👍👍👍👍
Very welcome 🤗
I would love to see a video with both you and Dr Eric Westman as you both seem to be the most logical keto/carnivore youtubers out there.
All of the other carnivore youtubers seem to just spout anecdotal information. (Edit: I didn’t word this very well at all. There’s nothing wrong with anecdotal information.)
Given the video I posted this morning this is ironic timing for this comment 😂
@ Looks like I’ll have to watch that video then to see the irony of my own comment 🧐
@@nicknorwitzPhD I mean there’s nothing wrong with anecdotal information but I appreciate those who do the digging and try to remain as scientific as possible. Whereas some RUclipsrs just like to repeat “proper human diet” over and over again while being all in your face about how right they are. Which doesn’t seem very scientific and objective.
Just saying I appreciate you and what you do 😁
Thanks Nick. Good talk.
Would a vegetarian actually listen? I can't get a diabetic to.
I would hope so. I never said anything negative about vegetarianism... other than I prefer fish and steak to tofu in terms of steak.
Vegetarian here. I have listened. But listening and agreeing are two very different things.
I think that any scientifically based vegetarian would acknowledge that for pure protein, it probably doesn't matter the source. I would also push back on how to handle these observational studies. There is more than just the Nurses study that comes to the same conclusion. So just because you have issues with the methodology of one study, doesn't throw out the other studies. And even with those methodological limitations, it doesn't mean the its conclusion is wrong. Just not as strong as some seam to make it appear.
A vegetarian may seem not to listen because for MOST vegetarians, they are not vegetarian purely for health reasons. They are not asking themselves what is the HEALTHIEST diet a human can be on. They are asking, IF I can be healthy and not eat meat, then why would I? It is not a science based question. It is science informed, but its basis is not in science but in moral philosophy. Science CLEARLY says that it is indeed possible to live a very healthy life and not eat any animal products. A vegetarian says, well if that is true, then why do we tolerate factory farming? It is not that a vegetarian is not listening to you. You are just not dealing with the question that they are concerned with.
I currently understand that a vegan diet has particular health advantages over a diet that includes animals. However, I am not married to that idea. If some new study comes out that CLEARLY shows that one NEEDS meat to be a body builder or run an ultra marathon, or not get some sort of cancer, I would probably still be vegetarian. Because my point is not only based on health outcomes. It is just one of the many pillars that support the vegan decision.
You are very good at this.
Lots of nuanced data presented clearly.
Not easy to do.
Cheers :)
You have such a fantastic, amazing way of teaching and explaining things! Thank you for all your wonderful videos!!!
Glad you like them!
I am an outlier. I hyper absorb cholesterol AND plant sterols. Eating egg yolks for me is a risky endeavor, but also eating too many almonds (high in sterols). I am currently on ezetimibe to lower my absorption rate. Apparently too many plant sterols in the blood is also a bad thing. Fun times.
I think it makes sense for those who were eating low calories but having high BMI. After years of diets I killed my metabolism. Eating less and gaining fat. (Calorie counting for decades with high insulin resistance/low blood sugar/high subcutaneous fat storage.
Cutting carbs and extended fasting over years made me lose 150lbs
I've been trying to up my calories without adding too much weight over the last 3 years. But I gain fat with very little and my body resists losing it.
I have high BMI, small waist and gain weight with higher protein
Yes I experience the same, but I'm a young 20 years old man, I have been dealing with this since I was 18 years old.
Thanks to carnivore diet and keto diets i started to perform better and nourish my whole system, back then I was eating 1,200 calories, 20k steps daily plus weight lifting workouts and I wasn't able to lose weight.
Now I'm eating 3,000 calories, of course I weigh much more but I don't look fat, I look really strong. I recommend you to see the RUclips channel of Kelly Hogan, she's the perfect teacher on this topic
you lost a lot of muscle mass. You need go on muscle building regimen.
@@happyarmadillo4523 I did not. my muscle mass is what puts me at a higher BMI.
I never mentioned my fat%
That is proper analysis of scientific data. I personally experienced a lot of benefits from a low carb - high protein - high veg diet, but was warned off it by nearly every medical 'expert' I encountered. Here in the Netherlands the dietary narrative is still post-wwII. And as the food industry is the most generous supporter of 'scientific' dietary research and dietician's education institutes, we all still get referred to 'light' and otherwise hyper processed foods. I never went there, but did go off the low carb, but have been in limbo ever since. Who to trust? The experts or my own experience? Thanks for your video. That is another strike for my own experience.
Thanks for the comment. Glad you've found something that works for you!
Thanks Nick. Always left with the feeling: “Damn I’m glad he is in this world!😉💙
Awe 😍
Vegetarian protein has more glycine and less methionine than animal muscle meat. Chris Masterjohn has an explanation for why folks with worse methylation genes (there's a lot of us) would need more glycine than others and do poorly on an excess of methionine. Glycine can be had from collagenous foods, but usually meat eaters are just eating muscle meat. Personally, a carnivore diet gives me leg cramps unless I include either some vegetarian protein or regular servings of collagenous foods like skin, tendon, broths
There is so much "gaming" going on in Scientific literature regarding this subject (albeit certainly not exclusively) the book cooking, broad strokes & half-truths are glaring once you look into the details.
I've been heavy lifting for over 20 years now and learned early on Soy Protein is pretty terrible for maintaining clean cut muscle mass. "Oh Phytoestrogens aren't estrogenic...blah blah blah; yet certain Plant sterols (Beta sitosterol for example) literally bind up Anabolic receptors and from personal experience? Too much will make you feel weaker and affect aesthetic composition *if that's a personal concern*
Plants have all sorts of beneficial chemicals and I definitely include plenty greens, frozen/freeze dried berries etc. I even dabble with Turmeric, Chia, Matcha etc. But for my goals the latter need to be in moderation. And I simply can't imagine feeling healthy without animal proteins in my diet at all.
Regarding ALL subjects.
So thrilled for real research!! Keep up the good work Nick;)
I will, absolutely!
Outstanding. One of the few on RUclips I trust. I learn so much from these videos. Thank you Nick!!
I appreciate that!
It’s wild how comfortable scientists have gotten with lying. These researchers basically compared a High Carb diet Vs Plant diet
It’s not always about the food, but if the body can adequately nourish itself from it.
Nick your a legend, nice one for pointing this out!
Thank you ak ak
In my 4 years of whole real food ketogenic eating, and now most of a year of carnivore, I've become acutely aware that studies show "meat eaters", who eat nothing like me, have an elevated risk of some conditions.
Interestingly, eating this way has completely reversed some of the conditions we are warned that eating this way will cause!🤔
I'm an ovo vegetarian. I've always been active, but this year re-introduced eggs and egg protein (allergic to dairy, even whey protein isolate, due to casein) Lots of eggs, both egg and veg protein, no sugar, low starchy carbs. Works great, gained 20 lbs of lean mass, I'm 57 and climbed both Aconcagua and Ararat this year.
Well done Nick, excellent.
Meta analyses are like MBS’s, their quality is only as good as the quality of its components (the mortgages that compose them).
This is similar to what led to the 2008 financial collapse: put bunches of bad loans together into piles of crap and now stamp AAA ratings on those MBS’s and voila.
Again, if the components of the whole are no good, the end product isn’t either.
I recently saw a doctor on RUclips defending seed oils with a meta analysis. But even the meta analysis he was using as evidence says this:
“…the present evidence alone is insufficient to conclude that increasing PUFA in place of any other nutrient will reduce CHD events. Notably, this evidence is similarly insufficient to conclude that decreasing SFA in place of any other nutrient will reduce CHD events.”
“Many of the identified randomized trials in our meta-analysis had important design limitations…”
“Given these limitations of each individual trial, the quantitative pooled risk estimate should be interpreted with some caution.”
When I pointed this out, he deleted my comment.
Meta-analyses are often misused and overinterpreted
I love the wait you put it. Thank you!
Glad you like it!
Yes, when many of these studies compare the benifits of animal based diets with plantbased, they often put processed foods like deep fried french fries, high sugar orange juice and juices in the category of vegetables and fruits, as if people are eating a whole food salad and whole grain bread or other meals. Its like saying people are eating beef, but what thwy are actually being served is a block of tallow, with a sliver of red lean meat in it. This goes both ways.
Awesome video, thanks for your work and effort. The “click baity” title was well worth it for giving the spotlight to the important message
I mean... it does feel like a protein war...
I watch your content to feel smarter. My triglycerides are 29, c-peptide 1.9, all beef proteins.
Nice and nice
REALLY clear and so great to be aware of bias all the time! (in all of us).
I like to do fruit/veg/carbs right before a workout. After that I do about 120g of animal protein throughout the rest of my eating window before fasting. Animal protein is necessary to maintain muscle mass and metabolic health is soooo much easier when you have healthy muscle mass. BMI doesn’t really take that into consideration
Nick, winning an argument has its place once in a while, but when it comes to health, it's not about winning an argument or proving so called intellectual superiority regarding studies, it's about doing what makes you healthy, which I'd think you agree on. (steak and eggs vs beans and tofu) Also, the environmental aspects of food, in my mind, should be considered, as that is extremely important for this and future generations. Maybe that's not your thing, but I was surely thinking about it as you spoke in this video.
I hear you. Two thoughts. First, I agree it's about what works best for you. That's my whole deal with N = 1 science. But to make this possible, we need to remove barriers to access... which also means "debunking" where necessarily. Second, I agree on environmental aspects of food. But to have a reasonable discussion on this matter, we should have it as a separate discussion. Otherwise, emotions and arguments bleed into one another and we go nowhere. TBH, I'm mindful on that matter, including referencing regeneratively raised beef, sustainably caught seafood, composting, practicing entomophagy, etc. You're right, it's an important topic. But it was not the topic of this video.
Anything the Government say to eat i just do the opposite. I recommend reading “Health and Beauty Mastery” by Julian Bannett that book is a real eye opener about shocking stuff health industry is doing! I completely changed my habits
truly a good book, unfortunately it's all about profit, nothing more, nothing less
The same bs over and over again. Don't buy this book, the OG comment was clearly paid for. They post the same bs on many other videos and then pay for likes to make this lie visible.
Another excellent video, Nick. Your approach to nutrition is much appreciated. Keep up the good work. 👍
Thanks, will do!
I thought I was punk but this man is on a whole next level! Glad I found u!!!
Cheers man...
Great video. Well done for pointing out 'the game' going on with this. GOOD WORK! "Science" is a thing of the past now (in the medical industry), and with the new 'editing' of history of the internet, things are about to get a lot worse.
Glad you enjoyed it!
The world knew this in the 90s, when Mike Wallace and Jeffrey Wygand exposed the tobacco industry on 60 Minutes. The truth was too hard to handle. Dig deeper - what truths lie below the deceit of the medical journals ... if you dare.
This is exactly why I bought my own Cholesterol meter and I am figuring out how my Lipid system works.
It is very interesting but also hard because one needs to keep everything constant and changr only one thing.
I may have discovered a positive ”side effect” of statins. My nasal polyps seem to improve when i take them.
The other medication that works is cortison orally but rosuvastatins inflamation dampening effect seem to work on the polyps.
I noted this in the spring. Then went off the statins for a while. My polyps got worse and the rinsing with bundesonid did not seem to be that effective.
I started statins again as a part of figuring out my lipid system and after two weeks my nose internal swelling improved.
There are some studies that supports this function of reducing inflation in the upper respiratory tracts.
That's interesting. Thanks for sharing!
Your analysis made me click the subscribe button.
Thanks so much :).
Science for the people. Genius . One day I will do investigation with you, nice scientist.
Nice to 'meat' you ;)
@@nicknorwitzPhD Eggxciting , I am just 19 years being a weird boy from young age because of having different thinking about the world . But we keep going.
I like this approach. Once you’re getting around .7g-.8g per pound of body weight, source isn’t really important. If you’re struggling to reach that, animal products can be beneficial.
Glad you found it helpful/agreed.
It takes more than double the amount of plant protein for the same anabolic response as something like beef and comes with phytoestrogens and anti-nutrients I'm not excited about either
Fair review, Glad you pointed out final point about burden of proof. My view is not all animal proteins bad at all, only processed like sausages or bacon and those if excess saturated fats causes an issue. Perhaps if all overly BBq and increase carcinogenic, indeed many animal proteins especially oily fish are even beneficial
The power of plant protein for me lies in the variety of fiber, which I deem key to good health span and longevity. Yes usual critics will claim fiber not essential which is true for living but anyway, that’s my view after my own deep dive for 2 years in this topic
I would more or less agree with what you said. Fiber is critically important for your gut biome. Plants have it. Meat doesn't. Another thing about carcinogens and meat. Meat typically has to be cooked to be safe for consumption. Cooking, any cooking, increases the carcinogenic free radicals. Meat does not have many anti-oxidants to take care of those free radicals. Plants, on the other hand, do have a plethora of available anti-oxidants to deal with the free radicals formed by cooking. So there is that to consider as well.
But in reality, most likely any diet that is whole food and avoids current commercially processed foods is likely to be better than the typical American diet. And if you are conscious of what you are eating, you are probably as healthy as you can be. Any minor adjustments (plant or animal protein, for instance) probably doesn't make that significant of a change. Like, eat a typical american diet and die at 50. Watch what you eat and live till you are 90 or 100. But if a healthy diet with meat gets you to 95 but a vegan diet gets you to 96, what does that really matter? Well, all those animals you killed... but that is not a science question...
@@jordanjtbraun Grass fed meat and dairy have more antioxidants than plants. That's all that's available in my country - we do not have grain fed red meat.
Fibre is not essential. Insoluble fibre is useless to us. Herbivores can utilise it as a fat source because they have the ability to digest it. We don't. Herbivores eat a diet that is 60-70% fat because of their ability to ferment plant material and utilise cellulose as fat.
Soluble fibre is turned into short chain fatty acids by your gut bacteria and used in the production of ketones. The exact same thing happens when you eat meat via a shorter route. No plant contains B12. They contain B12 analogues which prevent you from absorbing real B12.
@OldRoadFarm-ck3mj dude, I need a reference or it didn't happen.
Carleson et al (2010) would say that your claim is wrong. " The total antioxidant content of more than 3100 foods, beverages, spices, herbs and supplements used worldwide."
@OldRoadFarm-ck3mj "Fibre is not essential". Well, the most recent research of the gut microbiome seems to suggest that the optimal gut biome is maintained by varied fiber sources. So it is not for our nutrition directly, but critical for the health of our gut bacteria.
Essential? I guess it depends on how you look at it. I think it has tremendous health benefits and I have studies that confirm this.
@OldRoadFarm-ck3mj "No plants contain B12". True. But it is made by microbes, not animals. Even cows need to have a B12 shot. So whether you are giving B12 to your beef before it dies or get it more directly by a pill, either way you are supplementing. (I can provide references if you want).
Exercise offers so many benefits that it's truly worth the effort. Choosing not to train is a major mistake, leading to faster aging and a reduced quality of life.
How do you consider lasagna a meat base ? It has wheat, probably some seeds oil. What is the glycemic load of pasta vs mest ? Empty calories vs essentials calories
Something I learned yesterday on a similar topic.
Oleic acid (the fatty acid that is proposed to be why olive oil is healthy, especially heart healthy) content in percentages:
Olive oil - 55-80%
Bacon - 50%
Prosciutto crudo - 50-60%
So apparently bacon and prosciutto are about as heart healthy as olive oil, but everybody's been told bacon and such are horrible for heart health and olive oil is amazingly healthy... Do the lies in nutrition have an end?
Well, I mean there are the carcinogens in the bacon that aren't there in the olive oil... for starters.
Ah yes let's forget that the rest it's pure saturated fat and it's it's filled with potent carcionegic nitrites.
Cherry licking it's called
I think a focus on hyper absorbers of saturated due to APOE 4 should be done. As well as those with genetically of high APa. Vis a vis red meat consumption. Great channel BTW 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
Thank for highlighting dodgy nutrition science. No wonder people are confused with what to eat. I'm just surprised and very concerned that they are allowed to be published and make claims based on this data.
Great video! Could you please make a video on a typical day of eating, including macros and calories (sorry, energy/fuel 😂)? Thank you for your great insightful information!! Greetings from Germany!
Great job, as always. Thanks, Nick!
Thanks :)
Thank you. This is really helpful, teaching us to consider various things and think outside the box.
Hey, Nick, I'm curious to how would you design a study that will definitely end the plant vs animal protein debate? In my opinion, it's impossible. To many confounders, how ever you frame it.
hey Nick, I wonder if you have any videos where you speak about organ meats, it's an interesting topic for me when trying to discover any difference with muscle meat beyond the nutritional profile
I'm a fan... no videos on that specifically... I love heart and liver.
@@nicknorwitzPhD thanks for answering! me too btw
The smarter Potter for the win. Thanks for clear and discerning discussion on your videos. We need more of this.
Do we (us humans) have an efficient digestive-metabolic conversion pathway to digest and utilize plant protein compared to those plant-based animals (herbivores)??
Great advice! I wish I could give you 2 thumbs up.
I appreciate that!
My favorite "claim" about plant protein vs animal is that animal protein is denatured "second hand" protein.
Great video as usual Nick!
I didn’t mean to insinuate that you did. I assumed nurses were involved in the study mentioned especially since BMI is often indicated as a negative factor often ignored in some studies. 🤷♂️
Is beef considered superior (or healthier) than poultry or pork? I am curious about your view on this.
probably depends on the diets of the respective animals, but on the whole, I'd say beef is better
Nick first of all so many thanks for the content your bringing out. 🙏
You probably covered it but I Still I dont know if getting a high ldl while eatings zero to little carbs is bad or not. My friend is a diabetic type 1 and got really emotional when I said Im trying almost zero carbs. As his doctor told him his high ldl is gonna kill even though he was eating zero carbs and felt great. Now he eats carbs again has to shoot alot of insulin and feel more like shit. Also the link between Coronary artery disease and saturated fat is really confusing to me.
Any link to a video would be nice aswell! I think I watched one but it was kinda complicated. Im now thinking about doing some university courses on health longevity and metabolism as I really want to understand it.
Excellent job, glad to have your voice of reason in my confirmation echo chamber!
Cheers :)
Finally a master mind teaching us.
When a brilliant mind , good heart, logical and respectful scientist come together. You are a gift Dr. Norwitz!
So nice of you 😍
I concur!
Nick it’s great that you’re taking a deep dive into this topic. Personally I’d go with what I consider to be the most natural option, carnivore for me!
Im vegan for a decade and very active and never had a problem with my protein and blood work
If meat works for you go for it
What we have to realize is diet is highly personal and regardless of what your body theoretically can digest, you have to be willing and put intention in what you're having
If you give me meat ill prolly throw up but someone else might have eat with pleasure
So healthy for me and you are not the same concept
I’m absolutely thriving on steak, eggs, and fish (and salad with olive oil and lemon juice). My main worry is environmental. If everyone ate like this it would be a disaster for climate change, even more so than what is already happening. I hope that our system of food production can be improved. 😢
I agree… That’s a separate issue
Now that you understand that "vegetables are better than meat" science is garbage, start digging into the humans are causing climate change science. You will find the same garbage, as I have.
It would be a disaster for the climate change *industry* because it would be shown to be a giant grift, which it is. Government: “pay us more taxes and we’ll fix the weather”. This is the entire basis of the climate ‘change’ myth. Climate has done nothing but change since the beginning of time.
Don't worry. Everyone won't. The dogma is real.
Read the great plant based con by Jayne Buxton
Lets have a study, that has people like myself, that eats only animal based. ZERO carbs. Zero plants. Lets get as many of these people as we can.
And... we can have Vegans, eating ZERO ANIMAL products.
And lastly.... lets have a third group, sorted by the amount of each plant and animal. Basically the group in the study you showed. Someone who eats a "balanced diet" However they, that person, defines balanced.
I think the last group should have far more participants than the Animal or Vegan based. Mainly because they will have the largest range from 1% to 99% of animal or plant.
The most important statement was "you do you and I'll do me".
I'm a long term high meat eater with dairy & eggs. Very healthy, 65yrs old, 165lbs & active. I take no notice of anyone other than the studies I look at and I do look at both sides.
This thought process served me well in 2020 when an injection came on the market. I asked my GP for written benefits. Nobody could come up with data proving the advantage. So "they did they and I did me!"
You do you 👍
same i read the literature and could see a terrible history the investigational products had whilst the media were screaming safe and effective . So they were lying, simple. They had no primary data to base a claim on. They captured the regulators and the media and the rest was simple assuming the sheep like nature of nanny state populations.
and four years later im still zenzored for a response to that subject
Question, after watching a video by Zoë Harcombe on whether fibre is necessary, went reading reviews on Amazon for her books on diet. One of the reviewers said it's out of date due to Keto diets, and another where a follower of her diet said it caused them kidney problems.
Why were the majority of followers of the diet perfectly fine with the increased amount of protein, but this other reviewer had problems.
What are the differences between Keto and the Zoe Harcombe diet. (I imagine this 2nd question is less likely to be answered as it's a more niche question)
Nick, any chance of a video talking about health risks/benefits of nitrates/nitrites in cured meats
Besides keeping the meat safe from proliferation of harmful bacteria and prevention of foodborne illness there are no health benefits. Avoid all preservatives. The health negatives are well studied and documented. Eat fresh meat or traditional lacto-fermented sausages that don't contain added preservatives.
It is difficult to get good data when you have large groups whose diet isn't monitored well. It is also hard to have people eat consistently over a long period of time. A group of one is easier to collect accurate data.
N = 1 has its benefits ;)
WOWOW!! what a great video! thanks a lot nick
Glad you liked it!