MY BIKE IS A CRASH WAITING TO HAPPEN 🥺 dangerous damage!!
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- Опубликовано: 30 сен 2024
- GO CHECK YOURS!!!
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That's why I ride steel
Steel has it uses for bike frames, for heavier 180 lbs who like to smash the crap out of their cranksets steel is still my choice for bike frames. Aluminum bike frames do tend to creak a bit with heavier riders, depending how good the welded bottom bracket area is it's a hit and miss. Old steel still has a massive advantage in certain aspects of cycling due to it's less fatigue issues like Carbon torque values.
I get really nerdy about any rattles or squeaks on any of my bikes as it is always a sign that something is not adjusted correctly or is worn. After 40 plus years of riding, checking and maintenence is my mantra, particularly after rides in harsh or extreme conditions.
That's also a great tip on headset adjustment from the Trek mechanic. Always learning...
Steel for the win!!🤣😂🤣
I make things from carbon for a living and that is worn but its not the "ring of death" or "a crash waiting to happen" (I like your content, but please hold back on the click battiness a bit.)
I would take to someone who repairs carbon frames and ask if they can ultrasound it to see how deep the wear goes. They can then repair it if necessary, but the chances are it'll be fine.
The parts I make to sell are twice the thickness that parts I make for myself and if the parts I use don't fail, customers part definitely won't!
Sounds like that would cost more than just getting a new fork
Yes thicker carbon is great. And if it was impossible to get a fork I might have left if but so easy to get hold of and for £100 not worth the risk for me.
Look at all the snapped fork steerers out there on youtube or google images because they had your mindset hehe.
Better to replace than worry.
For KK's riding style and light weight she 'probably' would be fine especially if correct tension is used in the headset but why not just replace and go from there.
I agree that a small surface defect as shown on her fork is highly unlikely to cause a failure. Forks are made with a significant margin of safety because they are a critical component so a small surface defect should not be an issue. If you were worried you could simply pull hard on the bars (like when sprinting) while stationary and see if it snaps. If it doesn't snap it should be good to ride. Also, the women in the video is not very heavy or strong compared to a big man that would be able to ride the same bike/fork. A bike shop would change the part because they are not paying the money and want zero risk.
a repair most likely would be more expensive than changing the fork; and when the choice is either to spent 100 bucks or going down a steep mountain with 80+ kph and every time worrying wether the fork is fine... IMO it's an easy one
A friend I rode with had a fork failure while riding and sadly suffered life ending injuries. Yes Katie, we must all check our forks and keep them adjusted.
Oh god, that's awful. I'm so sorry.
it's called the ring of death for good reason
Omg how sad
One tip for everyone: please learn to do such basic tasks by yourself! The shops around my place are constantly busy or incompetent. The positive thing is => I can fix nearly everything immediately by myself and even save some money on the way ;)
And thank you Katie for bringing such important technical issues to our attention! 😊
With discs you can still "rock the fork", turn your wheel 90 degrees. Yes there will be a slight give in the tires, but the feeling is different from a loose fork. Or just pump them up harder.
edit: I can't turn the spacers on mine, I have a Giant Defy and the spacers don't have flat bottoms and tops, but are formed to the stem.
Great PSA Katie, I check mine once a year. Also worth checking before you buy a used carbon bike, bring the right tools and pull the fork out. For all his faults, the ring of death is one thing Durianrider has got stuck into my mind.
I think he is the only person I have ever seen talk about this. So good to know for sure!!! Something no-one talks about and it’s so easy to check but so bad if it fails
Exactly, and not to forget any bike with mixed materials! It is way to popular to put full carbon forks on any kind of bike.
Good video
It brings that philosopher, Yogi Berra’s observation (“If you come to a fork in the road, take it”) but with the additional suggestion that you check the nearby bushes for the rest of the bike and the rider.
Alloy and steel for life. I don't want no carbon biscuit bike components.
You do you boo :)
Love steel! Though I did once have the top tube snap and essentially separate from the seat tube. I went round a corner at 30mph (or at least, I tried to) and the bike wanted to continue in a straight line.
Lol
Steel is real.
I am not careful enough with my equipment that I could ever properly store and maintain a carbon bike.
Most alloy bikes have a carbon steerer... How about yours?
Anti-seize compound + torque wrench, easy. This talk of steel is real regard to this issue is idiotic. And knowing to torque down the fork before the stem is basic something anyone who has built a bike should know.
The check of the headset is so easy if you have rim brakes. As the shop mechanic explained, hold the front brake tight, then try to rock the bike fore & aft. You'll feel some rattle/looseness if the headset is loose, but disc brakes can have some confounding 'clunking', if you will, making this technique not so reliable. Regardless, tightening up the headset is a very simple DIY task, and as this video points out, can prevent some serious damage to the steerer tube and risk of injury. I saw a guy in a crit race completely snap the bars off the steerer tube...probably because of the 'ring of death' he was unaware of. No injury (it happened in a tight corner moving slow), but a cycling buddy of mine was riding on a fast descent with a loose headset, lost control. 3 days in the ICU with concussion, cracked pelvis, broken ribs, and a very complex collarbone fracture that required risky surgery. He's OK now, and back to riding well, but learned the hard way about checking for headset integrity.
The disc brake play is a relative issue. If you tighten a bit more the headset and the play doesn't change or go away, it's likely just the brake, right? Then you know it's not a loose fork.
Harley (Durian Rider) talks about this at least once every month, haha
Thanks for the reminder - I will check mine. Just glad I don't have all integrated cables and disk brakes, so removing the fork is simple.
Yes with rim brakes it’s all super simple :)
Yeah, an advantage of rim brakes, rarely mentioned in the rim/disc debates.
Rim brakes are dead. There's about 100 of you left on the planet still clinging to your rim brakes.
Real Cyclist dont ride with play in their headsets….
Looking a second time at the wear pattern, I wonder if in fact the scoring is caused by the bearing itself. I believe it should be an angular contact bearing, in order to support the weight on the bars, as well as the axial forces of the bearing being predominantly loaded from one side. If it was not moving smoothly, I can see how there would be friction between the steerer and the compression ring.
Umm. A £100 fork really isn’t very durable. BTW you can get these repaired to be stronger than new at a number of places. Good vid Katie.
Cost doesn't equal durability.
@@KatieKookaburra yeah. It does. Unless you make it out of steel. Just consider how much of that fork was shipping, paint, mark up. Someone somewhere had their labour and skill exploited to get a fork that cheap.
Probably the most important check before, during and after every ride. I always use torque settings for everything. It's a bit of a messing around when it's a fully integrated cable setup but you need periodic inspections to be certain. It certainly helps if you have the tools and knowledge. I like being in control of the maintenance.
There usually are no torque settings for the headset endcap as you just want to tighten it down enough that there is no play but the bearings can still move freely. That aside I agree that going by the manufacturers specified torque is always best but as most of us do probably not bring a torque wrench when riding it is nice to be able to do roadside repairs and feel confident without having a torque wrench too. Horses for courses I suppose.
how often do you calibrate your torque wrench ?
We hear a lot about the "Ring of death' and it makes sense but I have yet to see anyone I know of, brake his fork because of exactly that issue.
If the headset is kept adjusted correctly without any play there is no issue, it’s down to basic maintenance
Durianrider has been talking about this for years
I put a titanium tube down the inside of mine while I'm waiting for a titanium fork to be made .
I think i will look into that myself, good idea sir.
Ti forks are the most dangerous! There is a reason why the bike industry don't do ti forks lol. They fail bro. Don't learn the hard way.
@@TheRawvoice Interesting comment ,what evidence do you have for that ? Maybe if you just copied a standard design in titanium but a quad / truss system is fine like on Jones bikes .
Steel is real, or at least an Aluminium fork tube, forget carbon
If you value your safety & your life, use steel fork & quill stem that will last you a lifetime or 2 even, & past it down to your children or even your grand children. If your not paid to ride & risk your life & limb, then CFRP(carbon fiber reinforced PLASTIC) bike is just a money grab marketing hype that can kill you without warning.
If you have been removing the handlebars for travelling, then you have been unloading the bearings. If you haven't loaded up properly as shown then you probably caused the issue.
You can see in the video I state I didn’t remove the bars.
@@KatieKookaburra I must have misread the subtitle, I thought it said you removed for travelling. If the bars were not loosened to turn 90 degrees then this is not the issue. My bad.
The simple solution is to avoid carbon. I rather pay a low price for stable steel components instead of a high price for unstable carbon components, that is just a hype anyways,
I'd never have a carbon steerer on any fork
Aluminium suffers a similar fate.
Nice one, well done for passing on the message.
That's why the alloy-steer-tube-carbon-fork still exist.
You got a fork like enchanted weapon.
Crikey, I didn't know that wear was a thing, but it makes total sense. I've only ever ridden steel, but failing components still terrify me. A few years ago my Brompton's titanium seat post snapped while I was bombing it down Deansgate, and if the driver of the double decker bus (that was right on my tail at the time) hadn't had his wits about him, I'd have been road kill. It was as if the frame had split in two. So now I avoid titanium (and carbon), on principle. It doesn't seem worth it (and steel is so comfy). Steel does fail (I had a 531 frame that cracked after 25 years), but it does it slowly, and you get plenty of warning (always investigate creaks, it could be a from a cracked tube).
Thank you so much for that video! Because of your video I directly knew that I had exactly that problem. Will fix it right away ✌🏻
Long (1990) ago a skilled craftsman needed 30-40 hours of diligent filing, brazing, painting to create a beautiful work of art made to fit the owner exactly. The price would be around $2000.
One day a guy from the carbon tennis racket factory decided he could pop these out in four sizes, not even paint them, and convince a new generation of latte-drinking, craft-beer swilling, pierced and tatted hipsters to pay $4K for them.
I've never been on a bike with a carbon fork. My "road bike" that I don't ride seriously was around $250 and weighs somewhere around as much as my full suspension mountain bike. 😅
Fascinating info. Not something I have ever experienced myself and my current bike is full carbon fibre and 10 yo. Always important to learn new things though.
Was spinning my wahoo mount on my bars round when not in use (didn't loosen the bolt) and it's cut through my bars 😅
Stop it 😱
It might just be me, but I’m not hearing about people’s forks snapping.
Riding with play in your forks is a horrible feeling. Keeping your stem bolts and fork tightened properly are pretty straightforward basic home maintenance jobs.
With hydraulic discs though, it's now a whole mess to drop the fork for inspection, unfortunately. New olives and bleeding needed, afaik.
Enough to ban carbon forks. This would never happen with Aluminum or steel.
They should make the forks like MTB ones, they dont get that 👍
Wonderful tip, Katie...would never think to check the forks regularly. Generally, I trust the local shop's tuneup crew, just assuming they'll fix anything that's gone wrong. Which is the wrong way to think.
1. Stem extensions not checking for burs inside the cut out holes inside the extension bars which delaminatea the steerer
2. Torque values 5 Nm for the stem extension bolts
3. Expansion plug installed correctly with the correct length and also the 3 sides are spaced out evenly inside the steerer
4. Correct headset and no lose spacers ( 80 mm expansion plug and 25mm spacers, more and you are increasing torsion flex).
5. Bearing races bottom and top are checked and greased properly.
6. Loose bearings will wear and compromise out the carbon fibre bearing seats.
7. Lithium or other grease to the steerer shaft itself up to the spacers area ( only to first spacer). Smoother motion within bearing ring steerer compression nut spacer.
8. Periodic checking by front brake and holding the other hand around the spacers pushing bike forward to see if headset is loose.
9. Periodically checking the forks themselves for any cracks around the QR areas as that is the most weakest point.
10. Check the paint of the bike and any paint bump rising needs to be properly checked.
11. Removing the top section is harder on integrated cabling but every 6 months remove the steerer and the entire shaft.
Just some basic things to check.
Carbon fork with carbon steerer tube. On a carbon fork with a steel steerer unlikely that will break. Just saying. Thank your for sharing.😊👍👌
Another way to set headset tension: with the stem bolts just tight enough to prevent movement but still loose enough for the stem to slide, hold the stem clamp (from behind) in your right hand. Hold the top tube (where it meets the head tube) in your left. Push - pull the stem clamp back and forth in line with the top tube pushing and pulling your hands away/towards each other. Tighten the stem bolt in very slight increments until the play disappears. Then torque up the stem bolts.
Glad you found that fork steerer wear before anything happened, KB. Let's minimize any further crashing on this channel.
Once was and will always be enough for me
You really only need an allen wrench to make the headset adjustment so you could even do it with a multi tool while on a ride. Don’t forget to loosen the stem bolts before cranking on the top bolt. You just need it tight enough to where the steerer is feeling just a little resistance when you turn the handlebars. Don’t overtighten.
The best advice a single allen key weighs little and means play can be eliminated the minute you're aware of it. Integrated headsets are so easy to adjust on the fly though you can't beat the traditional 1" threaded for reliability imo.
Filming yaself while you're riding is probably more dangerous!
So is drinking from a bottle while riding…. All about riding in your own limits :)
Always do a pre ride check, tighten any loose bolts before riding.
If it got loose on tge ride a multitool would have fixed it.
I don't think anyone checks it with those internal hydraulic hoses. God have mercy.
It's actually not that big of a deal, the spacers come in two halves that lock together so you can remove them without taking the stem fully off, once they are out of the way you can pull the compression ring up and because there has to be enough room for the hoses there is about 8mm between the steerer and the bearing so you can inspect the contact area without removing the fork. If you are slammed (no spacers) you may have to unmount the calipers (leaving the hoses connected) and pull the hoses back into the frame/fork to give you enough slack, but a good mechanic will "hide" enough hose in the frame/head tube/cockpit so you won't need it.
I've never owned or ridden a carbon bike but I'm curious to know - are they SO much better than a quality steel framed bike? I see quite a few videos on either failure or near-failure of carbon bikes and it would make me very wary of buying one.
Never had that problem touch wood. But what happened to me this morning on my ride was a spoke in my rear wheel snapped/ broke. At about 20 km’s from home. I had to walk from where I it happened to get to some suburban roads, then call for help, took me 2.5 hours to get home after the call to go with probably a 30 minute walk, in road cycling shoes. Now in the coming week I will have to swap out wheels( I have a set of cheap alloy wheels) see what can be done and maybe buy some new wheels. But I really hate the alloy wheels because the bike just feels slow and is slow…..
lesson learnt and we can avoid this mistake again~
This is why I am never buying carbon components. Having to take my bike to a professional periodically is not worth it. I can easily maintain my steel and aluminum bikes.
I build my bike so I know when I assembled the headset but yes ppl should check there bike for things that are lose after rides
I recently took delivery of a new mountain bike from a big manufacturer where the headset was so badly adjusted that I had to remove the fork from the carbon frame and re-seat the bearings from scratch before I even rode the bike. One other thing, if you are tightening your headset bearings always do it with the wheels on the ground so there is a slight load through the fork and headset. That way the bearings will pretty much always be centered and bedded in their seats using gravity before you even tighten the star nut. Secondly, after your first ride, check them again as they will often take a little more tightening as shock loadings through the fork will have bedded them in further, so a little more slack can be taken up. 👍
Just say no to disposable Tupperware bikes! When ya gonna learn custom steel is where it's at and no pesky Ring of Death. Plastic bikes are about as interesting as a new Walmart toaster.
With the small amount of torque required this will surely work its way loose again, so you'll have to check it each time you go out...another reason not to buy carbon or a modern bike with this system?
Tthis shows that the modern bike industry produces carbon scrap 🥺
Carbon- chemical bond.
Alum- molecular bond.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Carbon parts are OK for team riders which are pampered by team mechanics. Or be prepared to check your bike yourself unless you are extraordinary lucky to have a decent bike shop around. Everything has a price, eh.
Just bought a new bike with a carbon fork, great info. Thanks
A problem i'll never have. I'd never ride a carbon fork. But good info for a lota ppl.
So why isn't this a recall? Bike manufacturers are taking the p!ss out of us!
Most cyclists with even a modicum of experience would tighten their headset the moment they noticed it was loose.
I think my bike has a carbon fork with an aluminium steerer.... I think that is better
it's a simple check and fix. also alloy. i don't trust carbon
Just need a steel (indestructible)fork carbon (shite)
1. carbon is not the smartest for all rides or riders... still not have a full carbon bike because of this type of damages.
2. hard breaking... either big disc or hard stiff fork... both m,maybe more things BUT then is one thing is in the handling... and the skills...
3. I see that the fork is way to high ... maybe is just me But you should consider a different size of bike or a different rise up solution ... your steem is way high then if any is up to repeat is this damage ... why ? because the same rider skills transfer to the same type of fork... is not like we are preventing the problem we are delaying the problem a few days more.
take care KK
Good luck Katie! Greeting from Russia!
Harley makes a video of the ring of death like every month 😂
Ah, another bike part that sound never be made of carbon fibre!
How aboutt micro cracks on a carbon fiber frame invusible to a naked eye? Monthly x-ray?
Never seen a carbon frame fail from miles and Im the biggest bike geek out there always sniffing around bike shop warranty bins etc.
Micro cracks in carbon = no concern IME as so many layers to the carbon. Ring of death is an issue because it creates a weak spot on a very high stress area.
Who has a carbon fork? Steel baby! Phew.
Please dispose of plastic waste responsibly.
Wow. Didn’t realize that. Thanks. 🙏
I’ve had to replace the forks on my road bike due to this. But I don’t think it was a loose headset, rather just long term use as it had done 55,000km at the time.
People should check for this regularly especially on their gravel bikes where the fork takes a lot of abuse.
Yesss defo on gravel! Good shout :)
Hidden corrosion a risk on rain drenched Plague Island.
Also a risk "hidden away" if not regularly serviced, where the handlebars could come away !
Your safe & in one piece, that's the main thing Katie.
☀️
🐿🐿
Another reason to stay away from carbon.
Thankyou Katie
Just ride with no hands and presto :)
that why i dont run carbon fork.
Carbon fibre is oversold.
Steel is real !
👆 my immediate thought when she described the damage. I'm rolling out on my steel single speed momentarily.
Real heavy.
Ive seen so many steel forks and frames snap.
Steel is worse because people think it is just 'so strong brah'! so they dont check it enough.
@@malcontent_1 the first and only time that i had a fork snap is with a steel fork. It rusted.
@@sepg5084 okay, but I've ridden steel bikes for _several decades_ & have _never_ experienced nor seen anything like that among my bikes nor those of my riding partners. Granted I've also tried to keep my bikes well maintained, which also previously included alloy and carbon frames.
Wtf is helicopter tape😮
Great advice, thank you…
This is one reason why I ride 30 to 40 year old steel bikes. NO CARBON FIBER!!! I never thought it was a good idea. Now they even make carbon fiber rims! What idiocy!
Suggestion: put a 3mm thick 26mm I.D. (1/8"x1") o-ring between your bottom spacer and top bearing, tighten the top cap so the o-ring compresses about 1mm , and tighten the stem to spec torque. This will allow the bearing to flex a bit on rough roads or gravel, while maintaining tension on the headset, preventing wear on the steer-tube. It will make your headset bearings last 10 times as long, and you'll never have to tighten your headset again. Extralight makes their headsets like this, all headset manufacturers should!
On of my rules of (long) rides.. when something comes loose, tighten it back down immediately.
And yes I did notice my headset had some play rocking the bike back and forth whilst waiting for a bridge. And I did only tighten it back down before my next ride (exactly as described in the video.. got that one right at least)... but then again.. It's aluminium, so that's different from carbon
I had the front forks shear off my bike (aluminium) while riding. That was a very quick, painful and expensive end to my ride!
I don't care how new your bike is or how expertly it was assembled, all of it's highly loaded components fasteners should be checked and re torqued after it's first few rides. Even your cars alloy wheel's lugs require re tightening 50 miles or so after they've been reinstalled.
Had a used Japanese bike from the late 80s early 90s that I literally broke that same stem while out riding. It was such a beautiful bike, downtube shifters. Everything was tight, so far as I knew but, fatigue had I believe done damage. All steel. I used to be a seriously hard puller while jamming the pedals, and believe this caused the final meltdown. Fortunately for myself, I was on an old road, slight 2-3% grade and just travelling about 4-5mph. Next thing I know, the handle bars are up in my hands, as I am at or near the brake cable lengths, the fork as it happens, comes out of the frame and over I go. I had areo bars on at the time as well. As I picked myself up, I noticed a car coming probably around 400 Yard away. While gathering my senses, bike as they went by, they never even acknowledged me while going by. Fortunately I had my cell phone and called the wife to come gather my carnage. Straight to the medi center as I had a cut on my right inner thigh I assumed was from the jagged handle bar stem tube. Only 11 stitches but very close to femoral artery.
So, advise is, whether one does their own bike maintenance or takes to a shop. Once it gets to having many miles on the frame, spend the time, money to have it looked at, not just the front but the entire bike. Had another steel frame with aluminum forks. Last year I started getting a bit paranoid about the frame, sent it to the scrap metal bin. Had rebuilt it several times. I am a heavy equipment mechanic, retired, do all of my own fitting, repairs. Knowing when is key to proper bike maintenance. It's easy to get caught up in the "I'll get after it when I get home or forget to put it on a to do list". Be diligent with this, as in a a&p air frame and power plant inspection. Once in the air, one does not want to be interrupted with an OS response of safely landing. In this case, a frame breaking while in the middle of a ride might be just as treacherous or more so than a plane. A plane most likely will be time to figure something out, the bike, well, you're definitely at a moments notice, all hand on deck scenario.
Another option is expert carbon repair. Emphasis on the _expert_ - make sure they are a bicycle repair specialist. But for 100 pounds you made the right call. Carbon repair + paint would probably cost more.
This is a good reason to check every bolt, thru-axle, and QR before the very first ride, no matter where you purchased the bike. Bike mechanics are human and make mistakes or miss something every now and then. Then check everything periodically, especially if you ride rough roads, paths, or singletrack for you mtbers.
that's what scares me the most of carbon bikes, aside from the prices, are those little cracks that can get worse. Even if I had the money to buy a carbon bike I'd rather go with titanium or alloy
Thanks for tye PSA. I think I'll stick with Aluminum & Steel bikes, thanks 😅
Actually never heard of it, ring of death, better check on my wife’s trek since that actually happened to her bike when it was even less than 14days old 😮, my wife didn’t noticed, what is it with you ladies 😂 but when I parked I noticed that right away and tightened it, don’t think she did more than 40-50km so I don’t believe it badly damaged but will check it out 🤓
There is a recall on the Tarmac SL7 for this exact issue. Mine had it. Worn steerer. They issue a new insert and also steerer bung thing which interests past the wear. Had it repaired by carbon repair. New fork costs a fortune in comparison. Same happened on my SL5. Definitely need to make sure headset is compressing correctly. Costly and potentially dangerous mistake. Well reported 👍
if you place your finger around the place where the headtube and headset join (the point where the headset rotates) and rock your bike with the front brake engaged, you can feel for any play regardless of whether you have a disc or rim brake or if there is any looseness elsewhere in the front end. If you feel play where your finger is, the headset needs attention. This is better than just engaging the brake and rocking the bike.
Carbon sucks
Well done, as you can't inspect the issue in a hidden spot like that, the fork could last decades or it could break tomorrow, carbon is fantastic but it's also sneaky, a superficial etching might trigger unpredictable splitting. But it can still be used without probelms on a Zwift-dedicated bike for instance.
How old is the fork that needed to be replaced ? Or how many miles ? Sorry just like a measure when to think about it roughly 😮
As you ride parts settle in and can get loose. With carbon wear beyond a certain point means compromised structural integrity. Better to replace as you did
Thanks for the warning Katie, very glad you found the potential danger before you had a stack.