Is it Hollywood, or the Audience that is Out of Touch and Entitled?
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- Опубликовано: 20 мар 2020
- #StarWars #StarTrek #DoctorWho
Over the last few years, audiences have witnessed the implosion of fan favorite franchises such as Star Trek, Star Wars, Doctor Who, Ghostbusters and many others. However, the entertainment media complex views the new directions as vast improvements, which reveals a growing gap with audience preferences. For this, audiences are held responsible.
In an article by the BBC, filmmakers were likened to great chefs, while audiences were chastised as being entitled and out of touch for wanting these “great chefs” to make them Bic Mac’s.
On behalf of fans who take issue with that, we have prepared a response to that.
Original video this excerpt was taken from:
• The Collapse of Star W...
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Развлечения
By popular request, here is the "Restaurant" segment of an earlier video, reuploaded in shortened form to facilitate sharing.
Midnight's Edge
Well said. Hollywood needs to go back to serving everybody and making great products that everybody will enjoy. Catering to a small minority of people to serve up political correctness hasn’t been a good business strategy.
Amen!!! Preach it, Preacher!!!
Is it possible to compromise? Sjws aren't just robots. If we had a deep conversation, we could see eye to eye without just plain insulting.
This is s brilliant, well stated and concise deconstruction and rebuttal of that stupid "I'm a master chef, I'm not going to serve the customers a Big Mac" logic. They use poorly worded and simplistic metaphor. ME comes back with the proper counter.
First time I have ever heard you guys sounding actually angry outside of a livestream...
I'm tired of being told as a fan that I'm the one in the wrong for expecting what I asked for
@eapoe6 I have two bookshelves of marvel comics I feel ashamed of owning now because they've turned into the things they hated.
That's why I'm not a fan of anything other than retro video arcade games. They can't touch that. That's safe from them.
I'm sick of people assuming I'm homophobic/ sexist/ racist because I think star wars and dr who are shit now! I'm quite sure my mixed race lesbian daughter would be most surprised to hear that about me! 😂😂
Or that X knows better than me or what I "should have" as if that's any of their business.
@@KaiserMattTygore927 They're nazi's. National socialists. We're a nation and they want to turn this nation into a socialist nation. We don't want that. World War 2 never ended. It was just dormant.
The only thing missing from your analogy is that when the chefs serve us "what's best for us," they are still shoveling bad food onto our plates. This isn't a matter of genius, high-art film producers failing to cater to low-brow audiences. The art is bad. The ideology is obvious and unblended, the politics are formulaic, and the lessons hit audiences over the head with the subtlety of a Chick Tract. They are making BAD ART. If audiences want a Big Mac, Hollywood is forcing them to eat filet-o-fish while calling it foie gras and can't understand why nobody likes it.
The more common occurrence is something along the lines of junk food being put out, audiences eating it up, and cooks defending the junk food because it's "for the fans".
Yes .. couldn't agree with Snowball more.
Bonus points for the Chick Comics tract reference!
@@TJ_Mc you have to admit the Chick tracts are entertaining in a so bad its good sort of way.Like Samson Vs the Vampire women or the wild world of bat woman.
@@PepperKatLancer well kinda of the same way with the industry : as long as it doesn't touch a franchise you care about this is pretty funny to observe. For instance i seldom had bigger laughs than in 2016 with the Ghostbuster disaster. Not because of the movie mind you, the terrible marketing and community management were waaaaaayyy funnier than any "joke" this shitshow could come up with !
So, if our streaming service was free, along with our movie popcorn and overpriced seats, then we would have nothing to say, but since we foot the bill for said services, I think we should get a tasty, memorable product
When it comes to current "Star Trek," I think everyone should get their money back. The true Star Trek fans are definitely not getting what they are paying for.
Haplo Zetetic that’s for sure
@@haplozetetic9519 That's funny. Nobody asked me. I'm enjoying DSC, PIC and LDS for the most part. I keep my CBS (Par+) sub active all year, too. Star Trek costs money to make. I figure the $60.00 a year I paid for it is a good deal. Last Marvel movie I saw was $30.00 admission and $20.00 in snacks....You or I don't get to dictate what a "true fan" is or isn't ....
@@dennycranium Dictate? No, I'm not dictating anything. I've seen the original series so many times I can't count them. I've seen all the others quite a few times as well. I speak from my own experience, as well as talk to, read articles, and watch videos by long time fans.
Many of us can see the errors. Lack of character development, failure to follow cannon because either they don't care or they never did their research. There are gross errors in the "science," and other issues. In one video on YT, someone pointed out over 1 error in continuity, plot, failure to adhere to canon, etc per minute of the entire episode of Picard!
If Discovery had been made with no ties to Star Trek, I could have watched it, groaned at the errors, but enjoyed it for what it was. Instead, it is being passed off as Star Trek. That it is not!
A very large part of a popular franchise succeeding is to appeal to the long time fans because they are a guaranteed audience and many are vocal about telling people they know about a good show to watch. Instead, when fans point out the errors and what they think needs to be done to remedy the problem, the people involved with the show berate the fans, tell them not to watch it, and double down on their approach.
I stand by my criticisms.
You left out the part where the so called gourmet food they try to push is actually made of artificial, borderline rubber, yet vegan friendly ingredients
And feces.
Well, the restaurant... you've been there a time or two before... (like with Star Wars, Star Trek, Ghost-Busters, Terminator, etc...).
You've ordered a specific item each time... a steak, in this example.
Every piece of meat (sequel) is a unique piece, but you expect certain things to be very similar.
Then, you walk into the same restaurant (theater) and order the steak... and the new chef (director, producer, writer, etc) sends you a shit sandwich... but CALLS it a "steak"... and tells you that it's really what you wanted AND needed...
Last time I was this early I could still leave my house.
😂
The audience needs to remember that they are just as capable of crafting wonderful stories and adventures but perhaps at a much smaller and more local scale.
That's what I'm fucking talking about! Tell them again. Lol
Not to mention a more relevant scale.
Technology has already provided budding producers and directors with the tools to make quality movies. One can even crowdfund those projects now.
So true! This is why tabletop RPG have become popular (at least in my area). We create our stories, and our entertainment.
I've read better fanfiction than what was given to us as canon. For many franchisees.
It’s called “the entertainment industry”. The clue is in the title. It’s their job to make us happy and give us what we want.
Funny and true sir, or ma'am
But it doesnt say who to entertain and that is the problem!
Scifi fans are rare, hardcore fans more rare, they want to make money, so they choose the biggest audience, IDIOTS that dont care about legacy!
And I quote Maximus Decimus Meridius from Gladiator, "Are you entertained?? Are you not entertained??"
*throws his sword in disgust
It's not their job to give *us* what we want. It's their job to entertain the masses.
@@LinkMarioSamus The problem is... they are failing at that as well. They are not entertaining the fan nor the general masses... they are entertaining the specific group that doesn't support their product.
Nah, it's definitely Hollywood that's out of touch. I Just saw Rise of Skywalker and yes, it's trash.
It can be a great thing when the chef uses his skill and knowledge to add an unexpected touch to your steak, and thus positively subvert your expectation for the meal. Ignoring your order entirely, however, and throwing a trough of slop in front of you and telling you you'll eat it and like is more an apt description of what Hollywoke is doing these days.
The entertainment industry is going to have a rude awakening once we come out the other side of this global crisis.
ToonamiT0M that’s for damn sure. Empty movie seats and earth confined to their homes with the finger on the streaming button...lovely...
@@geraldthompson4633 Please explain to me why there were 9 billion-dollar hits last year even though most of those movies weren't very good at all?
LinkMarioSamus as the old saying goes, there’s no accounting for taste, or good sense apparently. It seems that the rise of skywalker, for example, was a billion dollars short of best estimates. Somewhere between woke agenda, diehard fans holding their noses, and those sitting on the fence, it was able to exceed a billion. Seems like a recurring theme. The variables change a bit, but the end result is the same.
Gerald Thompson Honestly I am very dissatisfied with the state of movies over the past few years. But wokeness is pretty low on my list of problems.
LinkMarioSamus I personally never gave it a thought, but it seems to be at the core of a lot of bad executive decisions in Hollywood. From my point of view, movies and shows were supposed to offer a diversion, escapism from the ugly grind of reality and political correctness and or shenanigans, now the lines are blurred, writing and some of the acting are substandard, and everybody has some social axe to grind. My message to the world, but what you like on dvd/blue ray and enjoy what you like, when you like before it got jacked.
They're not getting any of my money get woke go broke
They need the customer, we do not need them. The new "Entitlement Industry" had better learn that, or they will be out of a job.
That's at the base of the problem.
The mainstream access media needs it's special place with the studios to make money but to do that it can't always talk truthfully. We the fans know BS when we read it so we have turned to other outlets, i.e. RUclips (fandom menance) and independent content creators to tell it straight. The access media is losing its audience so instead of fixing the problem by getting truthful, they lash out at at customers pushing even more away. Articles like these are the dying whimpers of shill access media no it knowing what to do and stay woke
The food analogy is so perfect and fitting!
I believe many filmmakers don't care that they are part of a "business". They believe they are a sanctioned propaganda machine. They do not believe that we are entitled to our personal opinions. My school teachers drove simple ideas into my head way back in the 20th century. I could worship how I choose, I could vote how I choose and I could speak or write about it. These are basic ideas that help me on a daily basis. Therefore I will skip whatever damned movies I please.
They have forgotten that old adage: He who pays the piper calls the tune.
Or don't bite the hand that feeds you
Saying “the audience is entitled” makes no sense because the point of movies is to generate revenue. So, by default, movies have to cater to whatever the audience wants. It’s like saying “the audience feels entitled to what they want.”
@Paul What?
@Paul Drinking again?
@Paul really? Because I'm seeing the exact opposite of that logic.... even normies and longtime fans of the Supergirl show, are not liking it because of the stuff they're doing now.... and a lot of them were women.
They used the example of filmmakers being great chefs and audiences asking for a big mac. Well, there's the media's problem. The audience didn't go into a fancy restaurant. They went into a MacDonald's and ordered a Big Mac and then the person behind the counter tried to served them some fancy, fru-fru health food.
Filmmakers can be 'great artists' when they're working on original movies, not long-established franchises with wide audience appeal. That doesn't mean they have to slavishly follow the source material when making new entries. You can wiggle a bit with the story just like Burger King makes variants on the Whopper with a different sauce or some new toppings. But, they still need to retain the soul of the franchise.
@@bola5671 'they' think they have a monopoly of entertainment, so they think people will take whatever they put out, and they are using that perceived monopoly as a propaganda outlet to push an agenda.
AMEN! Outstanding video. The CUSTOMER is the HEART of ANY Business! Keep up the great work & thank you!
Film makers, actors and higher ups in Hollywood are in my mind akin to those self righteous artists who show of their work at art galleries and ask the patrons what they think and when they don;t get what they want to hear, they lash out, calling them closed/small minded, they don;t know art and their their works are too sophisticated for the common man to understand and tell them to piss off. They need to understand that this is a symbiotic relationship. You give the people what they like, they in turn give you their money so you can make more are, if you want to do what you personally like on the side, fine, go for it but do not try to substitute what generates mass appeal with your personally preferred work and expect them to simply lap it up.
"The customer is always right". They forgot that!
"I'll have the steak."
"Here's some unwashed lettuice."
"I asked for steak."
"A POC picked that lettuice, do you have a problem with POC?"
"No. I'm hungry and I want steak. A POC can kill, butcher, cook and serve the steak, I just want steak."
"OMG RACIST!"
"I'm cooking from home from now on."
For once I disagree with Midnight's Edge. They are presenting the situation much simpler than it really is. Movie makers have a right to take risks and make art. Not just entertainment that fulfills every expected cliche. We as an audience also have a right to judge their art for themselves. And reject their Emperor's New Clothes trick whenever they go: Only wise people can see the depth of our movies.
@@DanielBMS There's a big difference between taking risks and constantly antagonizing their own audience by slandering, insulting, stalking, harassing, and sending death threats to them, while churning out "entertainment" that reflects this mindset.
That steakhouse analogy was *PERFECT*
To quote Jeffrey Katzenberg, it’s called SHOW BUSINESS! It’s neither just show, or just business.
This is the most clear explanation of what is going on. Someone please send this to Hollywood Directors and actors.
It would also be helpful if characters stood up for the fans and audience by saying I will not reprise my role as X if the directors are going to change their character arch or their characters fundamental qualities. Example: Mark Hamill should have walked away when he saw what was happening to Luke Skywalker (I know it was too late when he saw this happening in TLJ), and the cast that grew up watching Star Wars should have dropped their roles immediately.
WITHOUT RESPECT WE REJECT
Hi Rob. You're 100% on the money.
I have said stuff akin to this so many times. Glad to know I'm not the only one.
You really should've added in "and as you're leaving the restaurant, they demand payment for the food you didn't even eat or want."
I'd say it's like ordering a steak, and receiving a curry.
"It's better for you"
"But it's loaded with fat and salt, how is it better?"
"We're diversifying our menu to include ethnic dishes"
"but... I wanted steak"
accusations ensue
I love this analogy, but I think a better one would be this...
Imagine you're at a store and want to buy soda. There's a bottle of Cola there. You snag it, and while walking out through the parking lot you take a swig and it tastes too chemically... you realize you got "diet" cola by mistake. You go back in the store asking for a refund, but the people at the store say;
"No, you got regular Cola there, NOT diet."
and they point to the label showing it's clearly labeled regular "Cola".
To prove a point you buy another bottle, this time of "diet" Cola to do your own taste test. You swig the diet and it tastes like water. There's not even bubbles in it. It's just water with a few drops of brown food coloring in it.
You go back to the store to complain that the Cola isn't Cola, it's diet, and the diet isn't diet, it's just plain water. The people at the store treat you like you're crazy claiming that's just how things are and that they've always been this way....
This is pretty much how I feel about, not just entertainment, but the world in general nowadays. I'm telling people "no, it wasn't always like this, things have changed" and saying "I'd like something similar to what they use to make but no one does it anymore" and I come off looking crazy because people just go by a label or a poster or advertising.
And this is a great analogy for the Overton window. What's considered "right" nowadays would be considered "left" about a decade or so ago. So what's considered "left" nowadays is some super whack job nonsense that wouldn't have been considered or dreamt of 10years back.
We've all been conditioned to drinking "diet" under the guise of normal soda, while normal soda has been phased out of existence.
Remember in IDIOCRACY when Joe just wanted water but there were only Brawndo fountains ("it's got electrolytes!") and when he asked for one, they responded, "You mean from the toilet?" and laugh.
A solid line of reasoning. I would very much like to hear how the _Paul Feig's_ and _Kathleen Kennedy's_ of the industry would respond to this argument.
They'd probably say, I won't compromise my artistic integrity to make a film that appeals to the unwashed masses, hahaha.
Great content. Thanks for reposting this!
My wife had never seen Young Guns so we watched the other night. This movie was never considered great but, compared to what I've seen the past couple of years with very few exceptions this was head and shoulders over the crap coming out of Hollywood. It caught me of guard. It's time for Hollywood to fail and hopefully others will start making movies. I just don't want to see anything being put out by these people.
That was a good movie, also Killer Clowns From Outerspace was a better film than what we got today.
Hollywood: "Let me entertain you with shit you don't like. "
Me: lol?
/Oblg. ruclips.net/video/BlCQwqj7e18/видео.html
100% spot on. Thank you guys at Midnight's Edge for all the great content.
The waiter says "I wanted to subvert your expectations"
I don’t agree with the food (content) being healthy. To me it feels weird, forced and unnecessary. Like, why do we need a female character with a male name? I can’t see how this would move humanity further in any way.
Hollywood: 'Am I that out of touch...? No. It's the children who are wrong.'
You guys are AWESOME! I loved that restaurant analogy. It's AWESOMELY on point.
Commander Data was always able to mind meld.
If you tell me such a thing while completely serious, I'd slowly walk away from you and try to avoid you.
That is what show runners are doing, they are repulsive solely by their fanciful thoughtless gibberish.
great analogy! you didn't ask for it, you don't want it, yet you're expected to pay for it.....
We don't need them, we can tell our own stories.
That's deep. I agree! People gets so egotistical it's pathetic.
Hollywood's projecting...again.
if i want to try something new and i like it, i'd return.
if your something 'new' is pretentious or catered to the chef's 'exotic' taste (or lack of), you'd NOT have ANY customers.
Also, if you're doing an adaptation of something, you're not making something new. If you don't like the thing being adapted, don't adapt it and create something new instead that can be judged on its own merits. For the restaurant analogy, you're paying for a steak, so you expect a steak. If you want to create a new menu item, create it and name it something new. Nobody likes it when you make a new vegan dish and call it steak.
This is so spot on, it couldn’t have been said any better.
Outstanding! Nailed it! I’m sharing this everywhere! Midnight’s Edge, you should release your IPO! You are the real business & the truth in this modern entertainment industry! I love you 4000!!!
Just perfect. Thank you
OMG, I love you guys so much! GENIUS!
Excellent video ♥️
From Iron Man to End Game --- that's how its done. Can't compare that to a big mac.
STEVE ZOIDBERG Actually that is exactly a Big Mac. It’s the same stuff over and over again and after a day you can’t remember any of it. Still it’s entertaining and you have a good time watching. A good example would have been Arrival.
The analogy would be more fitting if the restaurant only serves poop covered in glitter.
It's very funny that before this video, I had to watch an ad for Bob Iger's masterclass.
Still relevant today and it shows in what is happening to Disney right now.
The best one yet is them wanting my money to go see a movie that treats me like shit... who would do that.
The old saw, "the customer is always right" has been ignored by these people.
Great video. Truth. Plain and simple.
That restuarant analogy is spot on.
Totally agree, it’s like they won’t be happy until the run the treasures into the ground
Excellent analogy. Perfect example. Thanks!
When it came to Star Trek after TNG, the writers of DS9 wanted to make something truly different from the mystery of the week episodic show they had just wrapped. Fans initially hated it and many preferred VOY, seeing it as a return to form for the franchise.
Though DS9 was divisive, it tested the comfortable notions of the Star Trek universe and still holds up to this day while VOY feels like the franchise running out of gas. In the end, the VOY writers moved on to ENT where the franchise as it had been up to then died, it's viewers decamping for DS9's creative successor, BSG.
They key, as the video makes clear, is having writers intimately familiar with the franchises they are handed. That has to be paired with the ability to evolve the franchise in a natural way rather than repeating itself until it becomes creatively bankrupt. Risks should be taken, even if some fans might initially be put off. Subversion of expectations can be effective if it makes sense and be creatively satisfying.
I worry that the fan reactions to Star Wars, Trek, and Doctor Who will push good writers away. They'll see these franchises as too hot to touch and not worth the risk to their reputations. They'll feel like walking a tight rope, unable to deviate from the path zealous fans have late out for them, forcing them to remake the same product or fall into the abyss. The only writers who will take that gamble are those with nothing to lose, people of dubious quality that are content to make the same thing for as long as the money lasts. Some might even want to inspire the ire of fans in order to burnish their credentials with their twitter followers. Either way, we fans lose.
Spot on. Is this so hard to understand?
that escalated quickly lol
This video hit the nail right on the head!
You are absolutely right Bro, the customer is always right, damn it! . . where do these idiots in charge of production houses and or studios get their info about their customers ( meaning ) their future audience . . Blessings Bro, nothing but luv, keep up the good work . .
Well said, couldn't have put it any better 👍
I think they're largely under the impression that woke is what we want because of a very vocal minority. They're disgusted and dumbfounded when the silent majority don't want it
The silent majority has been speaking vary loudly through their wallets since 2016 and they still made these trash movies, that just show how far they are up in their own ass. Sadly even if Hollywood have finally learn their lesson from all the 2019/20 flops, they would have already green lighted whole bunch of these trash movies, so are they smart enough to re-write them while production is on hold? Guess we see how truly out of touch they are once things go back to normal.
If there's a "silent majority" they're simply tired of rehashed franchises ad nauseam (a new Star Wars again, really? Two Marvel movies in three months!?!) Hardcore nerds who care about what is or isn't "REAL (insert franchise here)" are themselves a very vocal minority.
nicely put
That is an excellent analogy! This video should be sent to every Hollyweird producer and director. Take it from James Bond who told Elliot Carver, "You forgot the first rule of mass media--GIVE THE PEOPLE WHAT THEY WANT!"
I’m working on a treatment for a Space:1999 reboot. Only instead of being set on a moon base of a runaway moon, I’m setting it in a Seattle diner featuring four middle aged women complaining about their live. I think it’s going to be a big hit!
You forgot about the new hip crowd feeding the restaurants opinion with cheers and mocks of the disappointed patrons while not coming into the restaurant to eat 🤣🤣🤣
Well said 👏🏼
This video is great!
This is not only a good allegory, but also sounds like a good setup for an episode of Kitchen Nightmares.
Great analogy I couldn't have said it better myself
This is so true
Now..
give me the meal that I paid for
*PLEASE*
One word for this video - AWESOME !!!!!!
Bang on. Totally bang on. Great analogy with the restaurant.
This has to be you all's top 5 best videos. So true
The gourmet dishes that Hollywood believes to make are just spoiled Big Macs.
To quote Chuck D. “burn hollywood burn”
Very nice and concise, great job! Very palatable to the noobish
Excellent analogy!👍🏻
This is one of the best analogies of Hollywood's behavior I've come across! Hollywood seems to be forgetting that people vote with their money.
Well expressed!!! I agree 100%
The best example of what’s happening to the Entertainment industry as a hole. They don’t want to listen, just lecture and insult.
Completely and wholeheartedly agree. Well articulated.
Great analogy with the restaurant & Hollywood!
Anyone who orders a steak medium-well deserves to have their judgement questioned. 😂
So well said. Amen!
I ordered Star Wars but I got Twilight...
Spot on video
Great video! My thoughts exactly.
Once again, on point.
Dude that Steakhouse analogy is dead fucking on
Holy shit! That restaurant analogy is perfect.
Brilliant and VERY TRUE !!
Ah man you missed some details from the last one in this. But I still love this.
I remember back in the day when "entitled fans" were called "customers".
*Hollywood* : "Am I so out of touch? No. It's the audience who's wrong."
Spot on!
I work in the restaurant industry. As somebody who's known a lot of professional chefs, I can tell you their highest priority is giving the customers what they want.