Ah yes. I remember my engineering tutor telling us this idea, and LOVING this 'mysterious' technique literally on day 1 of my apprenticeship. Regards Mark in the UK
Hi Thanks, my patience was pushed a bit especially after a couple of 10 hour stints, my back felt like it had broken. it’s worth it in the end. regards
Gosh! I thought this might be boring, but I couldn’t believe 18 minutes had flown by as you began your final remarks for the video. What an effort!! Well done. And gulp at the cost of professional repair, as my old ML7 needs some similar sorts of love, and this stuff is beyond me. Les PS. Leave your wife’s NEW sewing machine alone!
Very impressive from a man in his shed 😉...that's a serious amount of patience shown there, great job.. I also remember tutors back in 1973, talking about making surface plates they'd made, using this method
Micrometer Brand Engineers Blue, I think it's the first time I've heard it mentioned on You Tube? I still have a tin of it I picked up about 40+ years ago. As soon as you look at it, it gets 'everywhere', the more you try and clean it up, the further it goes 😁 I very rarely need to use it and when I do, as you said, use some 3 in 1 to thin it out a little. I have mostly used a Sharpie/felt tip pen for general layout for as long as I can remember but Sharpie has a noticeable 'thickness' when used for checking mating surfaces plus dries out so doesn't transfer well
excellent video sir. every machine shop should have a surface plate, the bigest one they can afford and have space for. your solution for the lack of such is informative, inspiring, and entertaining. thank you so much for sharing :)
Hi Paul. Just found your channel via this video and I've subscribed. Very interesting method of making the straight edge. I need to work the bed on my 80 year old colchester master before long and found the price of a straight edge or regrind very prohibitive as you did. I'll be very interested on your approach to mapping the lathe bed and will follow this closely. My little workshop and channel is still evolving as I delve into machining as a hobby from a career in heavy engineering and maintenance. Finding people like yourself who can provide good content and concise descriptions of what you are doing is a must. Thanks for the video Cheers Neil
Hi, I wish you all the luck in the world with your new channel. Mapping the bed ways are going to be done and shown in a short video soon. For your information…. I don’t have any special camera equipment, I have… 1 Aldi motorcycle camera, 1 very cheap amazon video camera supported on a wooden d.i.y. tripod, 1 very low budget clip on mic dangling off some sellotape from a bamboo cane. . The whole lot cost about £73, so what I am saying is, let nothing deter you, then try improve on the previous video with what you’ve got, most important of all, listen to your subscribers and you’ll soon be finding the whole adventure a pleasure. regards.
@@Thesheddweller ha ha, brilliant! My set up is an old smart phone mostly mounted on the remains of an angle poise lamp😁 I have loads of enthusiasm, no money and back that that fails after 20 minutes of standing up, but we plod on. Just made a butt prop which is great, I can treble my standing time now which means I make even more mistakes😊 Looking forward to your next upload, cheer Neil
Great work Paul, an it makes my budget approval as well . Lots of work and time, but it does come nice after time. I used to do a considerable amount of journal bearings like this, but flats are pretty impressive to work on. Enjoyed the video, cheers and thanks!
Great video; very infornative, thank you. I came across this whilst searching for advice on fixing a straight edge for a recently purchased fret ruler. (If I'd tried using it out of the packet, it was so far off that I could have seriously damaged some guitars!) Also, love how you've repurposed the old file as a scraper!
I am looking into making a set of these and a surface in order to make sure a surface plate I have is flat....mostly because I want to make it as flat as possible not that I need it to be and I do have the time available so I appreciate your video. Thankyou for sharing
You are a patient man. When I was looking for a 1 metre straight edge som years ago I was advised by the dealership that a length of 4 “ bandsaw blade was quite accurate. Mounted it to a backing wooden board for handling purposes. He did say it was accurate to about 1 thou.
@@Thesheddweller Yes I did this, was about $40 from distant memory. Mainly use for checking and setting woodwork machines. The blade doesn't have teeth, the firm I bought it from manufactures blades, and also sells straightedges, but one of these at 1 metre was in the several hundred dollars.
It shows how humanity achieved precision through comparison and lots of patient work. Great demonstration. Today one might use a laser. But to make a laser …. You know.
Enjoyed very much indeed. Inspiratjonal. I will have to watch a few times to fully appreciate it all. I can remember doing a similar technique during my engineering training but using draw filing.
@@Thesheddweller Yes. I was an aircraft technician in the Royal Air Force. In the first part of the practical side of my engineering training, they showed me what I had to make. A rectangular block, squared up, with various tapped holes in it. All hand work with files at that stage. So they showed us this nice flat, rectangular block with all sides mutually orthogonal, then gave us a piece of black bar that was practically round. Cue lots and lots of filing.
@@carlwilson1772 I had the same task at college, with round, stock but had to square it up using four different machines to get it somewhere near, then draw file to 2” square, mine ended up in the bin. If I remember rightly the tutor threw all of them in the bin, he was strict but we all learned from it...
Excellent video I will need to watch it over (a few times maybe) to understand six step process. I get your dilemma on the cost of professionally regrinding the bed. The solution is swapping professional cost with your labour (time) at home. If I were in the same situation I would offer the professionals off the books free labour around their factory/workshop for the regrinding job. At the cost of labour these days your time even with a healthy excess margin maybe comparable to the time spent at home doing the best you could. Enjoyment doing it yourself at home verse enjoying working in a modern workshop. It could be a win win solution?
Hi, thanks, thats a great idea. It might be worth a try if they have manual machines. However, they would probably work the same probationary process that the company I worked for used. As a charge hand, I knew that 'new employees' cost the company a lot of money until they had completed the probationary period. This includes huge amounts of time with health and safety, induction courses, fire drills, overalls, thats before the machine familiarity and assigning another operator to oversee ’the new guy’. this is because of the size and cost of machines and the cost of materials is so high. Oooo… I just found myself reading the riot act again .. I think I’ll just do it myself. regards
Sir, your work was very didactic for me. I´m trying to do something similar. Regarding the engineers blue, there are several tricks around, in my case, due to the lack of good suppliers in my area, I prepare mine using powder prussian blue into vaseline. it works fine for me. I could get flatness of 5 microns in 1.2 meters.
Sorry to appear so patronising but, I do try to aim for middle ground in my explanations. I have pointed out before that, I only show how I did what I did and hopefully I won’t be telling anyone how to do anything, because there are literally dozens of ways to do any engineering task, as with your powder and petroleum jelly to replace engineers blue. I do however, understand your supply issues. regards
I think I'd have been tempted to machine at least one of the straight edges into a sort of a flat topped inverted V so as to get around the problem of windage. I've seen a video of this normalizing process before. Yours is way better. That other fella used abrasives. Did you look into the cost to have the edge ground to some stated tolerance?
Hi Raul. No, i didn’t look into the cost of getting the edges straightened because, the cost of getting stuff done here in the UK is prohibitively expensive. For instance getting a tooth refitted to the back gear wheel is in excess of £500, then I’ve got to re-profile it afterwards. I’ve used these straight edges quite a lot lately and they still confirm true against each other. After Ive finished the lathe I’ll probably use the material from these straight edges on some project. regards.
0:58 - "I can't afford one, but can I make one?, No..., Can I make three?... Lets find out." (The answer is obviously, yes). I heard a precision machinists once said he can't afford what he makes for which he sells lol 😂
You could have done all of this bed leveling and checking twist using a plumb bub 🙌🙏 I just made a video on how to make a metal rod that goes 3 ft. Up and attaches to the tool post cross slide and it hangs a plumble down. 100% accurate if done correctly
Before you pay someone else always try to do it yourself. Mr Green would of charged about £90 quid to machine them flat. Very well done look forward to the next video. Trevor - UK
ATTENTION!!!! you have to see this Robin Renzetti tutorial ( ruclips.net/video/Va4TGDnQqDs/видео.htmlsi=P74MlJmjrZNAXL3w ) about how flatness can be achived. Whitworth 3 plate method can be done ONLY BY square and round surfaces. The main condition is, when you lap or scrape the surfaces you have to turn them 90 degrees and do the lap/scrape again. Robin shows very clear why. But it is more then perfect for a hobbyst project. I.ll follow myself
@@Thesheddweller It's a punny compliment. Happened upon your channel yesterday and I wondered if people realize the gift sharing knowledge is... and I watched the entire video while my subconscious was resting then somebody woke up with a comment on mind. Crazy? Yeah probably, but quite harmless. If people are strange are strangers stranger? Damn, got a song stuck in my head now... a good one this time. Cheers from BC Canada
‘JCB’ here and in quite a few places around the world is a tractor 🚜 with a shovel on the front and a digger on the back, for its size it is powerful and universal a sort of small CAT earth mover. In this case, to be a ‘veritable JCB’ implies to shove material off at a good rate
Ah yes. I remember my engineering tutor telling us this idea, and LOVING this 'mysterious' technique literally on day 1 of my apprenticeship.
Regards Mark in the UK
Hi. thank you, It’s surreal really, because you can spend lots of time trying to get what you’re after then suddenly all three plates agree. regards
Great job Paul! It's hard to find guys that will take the time to do it right nowadays. Patience is a virtue and always pays off! Great video!
Hi Thanks, my patience was pushed a bit especially after a couple of 10 hour stints, my back felt like it had broken. it’s worth it in the end. regards
Gosh! I thought this might be boring, but I couldn’t believe 18 minutes had flown by as you began your final remarks for the video. What an effort!! Well done. And gulp at the cost of professional repair, as my old ML7 needs some similar sorts of love, and this stuff is beyond me. Les PS. Leave your wife’s NEW sewing machine alone!
Hi, thanks for your comments.
But, sewing machines are fascinating little gadgets. :) regards
Very nice work sir. Good video
I really enjoy your videos Paul, and look forward to the next each time I finish. Just thought I'd let you know.
Hi, Matt. Thanks for your very kind comments, cheers.
Very impressive from a man in his shed 😉...that's a serious amount of patience shown there, great job..
I also remember tutors back in 1973, talking about making surface plates they'd made, using this method
Hi, I have made a set of plates but I didn’t go the whole nine yards to get it to a decent quality. I do use it for marking out though. regards
your patience knows no bounds, but a master's job
Hi thanks, my back aches a bit…. well a lot really but its worth it. regards
Micrometer Brand Engineers Blue, I think it's the first time I've heard it mentioned on You Tube?
I still have a tin of it I picked up about 40+ years ago.
As soon as you look at it, it gets 'everywhere', the more you try and clean it up, the further it goes 😁
I very rarely need to use it and when I do, as you said, use some 3 in 1 to thin it out a little.
I have mostly used a Sharpie/felt tip pen for general layout for as long as I can remember but Sharpie has a noticeable 'thickness' when used for checking mating surfaces plus dries out so doesn't transfer well
excellent video sir.
every machine shop should have a surface plate, the bigest one they can afford and have space for.
your solution for the lack of such is informative, inspiring, and entertaining. thank you so much for sharing :)
Thank you, glad you enjoyed. regards
Hi Paul.
Just found your channel via this video and I've subscribed.
Very interesting method of making the straight edge. I need to work the bed on my 80 year old colchester master before long and found the price of a straight edge or regrind very prohibitive as you did.
I'll be very interested on your approach to mapping the lathe bed and will follow this closely.
My little workshop and channel is still evolving as I delve into machining as a hobby from a career in heavy engineering and maintenance. Finding people like yourself who can provide good content and concise descriptions of what you are doing is a must.
Thanks for the video
Cheers Neil
Hi, I wish you all the luck in the world with your new channel. Mapping the bed ways are going to be done and shown in a short video soon.
For your information…. I don’t have any special camera equipment, I have… 1 Aldi motorcycle camera, 1 very cheap amazon video camera supported on a wooden d.i.y. tripod, 1 very low budget clip on mic dangling off some sellotape from a bamboo cane. .
The whole lot cost about £73, so what I am saying is, let nothing deter you, then try improve on the previous video with what you’ve got, most important of all, listen to your subscribers and you’ll soon be finding the whole adventure a pleasure.
regards.
@@Thesheddweller ha ha, brilliant! My set up is an old smart phone mostly mounted on the remains of an angle poise lamp😁
I have loads of enthusiasm, no money and back that that fails after 20 minutes of standing up, but we plod on. Just made a butt prop which is great, I can treble my standing time now which means I make even more mistakes😊
Looking forward to your next upload, cheer Neil
@@NellsMechanicalManCave :)
nice job mr hopewell, keep them coming.
greetings from the netherlands, ben.
Hi thank you, plenty more to come. regards
Exceptionally interesting and educational. Thank you for taking the time to share. 👏👏👍Andrew
Hi, thanks. you’re very welcome. cheers
love the way you are approaching this
Hi, Cheers.
Hello Paul,
Great stuff... I really enjoyed this video, thank you....
Take care.
Paul,,
Hi, Cheers.
Great work Paul, an it makes my budget approval as well . Lots of work and time, but it does come nice after time. I used to do a considerable amount of journal bearings like this, but flats are pretty impressive to work on. Enjoyed the video, cheers and thanks!
Hi thanks, glad you enjoyed the video, the next might just fry my minuscule brain cell. we’ll see. regards.
Paul, this is spectacular. Am looking forward to the next part! If you need more lipstick ...
Hi, Errr.. don’t mention lip stick. regards.
Great video; very infornative, thank you.
I came across this whilst searching for advice on fixing a straight edge for a recently purchased fret ruler. (If I'd tried using it out of the packet, it was so far off that I could have seriously damaged some guitars!)
Also, love how you've repurposed the old file as a scraper!
Hi, thanks, Im' glad you enjoyed the video.cheers
Well done video, thankyou from Canada.
Hi, sorry i didn't reply, I missed your comment. Thank you. Cheers
Thanks for that ,good to see how you have made honey out of flat plate and skill not money.Dwayne New Zealand.
Hi thanks, I miss New Zealand it a wonderful country, I have traveled all over on bikes and in Maggots (campers). More Videos to come.
I am looking into making a set of these and a surface in order to make sure a surface plate I have is flat....mostly because I want to make it as flat as possible not that I need it to be and I do have the time available so I appreciate your video.
Thankyou for sharing
Hi, thank you, I'm glad you enjoyed the video.
8:57 You can use a U-shaped aluminum stock to prevent tilting. Use glue to attach sand paper to it
Hi, maybe,… maybe but, I needed some rigid straight edges. cheers
You are a patient man. When I was looking for a 1 metre straight edge som years ago I was advised by the dealership that a length of 4 “ bandsaw blade was quite accurate. Mounted it to a backing wooden board for handling purposes. He did say it was accurate to about 1 thou.
Hi, did you ever get one?
@@Thesheddweller Yes I did this, was about $40 from distant memory. Mainly use for checking and setting woodwork machines. The blade doesn't have teeth, the firm I bought it from manufactures blades, and also sells straightedges, but one of these at 1 metre was in the several hundred dollars.
@@stanstevens3783 A great idea and a good tool, especially if you still use it. sometimes the old ones still rate as the best. cheers
Rustinox sent me! Great work, love your humor! (note the spelling)
Hi,thanks for the comments. Cheers
It shows how humanity achieved precision through comparison and lots of patient work. Great demonstration.
Today one might use a laser. But to make a laser …. You know.
Hi, yep know.. :-)
Why you dont use carbo grid powder for grinding a>b b>c a>c a
Hi, thanks I'll try to remember that. cheers.
Excellent work brother as usual.you never fail to impress.
Hi thanks, I try with what i’ve got and if it don’t work, I try again. cheers
Enjoyed very much indeed. Inspiratjonal. I will have to watch a few times to fully appreciate it all. I can remember doing a similar technique during my engineering training but using draw filing.
Draw filing must have seen off a few files, mind you they could have been used as scrapers. :-) regards
@@Thesheddweller Yes. I was an aircraft technician in the Royal Air Force. In the first part of the practical side of my engineering training, they showed me what I had to make. A rectangular block, squared up, with various tapped holes in it. All hand work with files at that stage. So they showed us this nice flat, rectangular block with all sides mutually orthogonal, then gave us a piece of black bar that was practically round. Cue lots and lots of filing.
@@carlwilson1772 Round bar…!. that was cruel.
@@Thesheddweller Perhaps it was but it worked.
@@carlwilson1772 I had the same task at college, with round, stock but had to square it up using four different machines to get it somewhere near, then draw file to 2” square, mine ended up in the bin. If I remember rightly the tutor threw all of them in the bin, he was strict but we all learned from it...
Excellent video I will need to watch it over (a few times maybe) to understand six step process.
I get your dilemma on the cost of professionally regrinding the bed. The solution is swapping professional cost with your labour (time) at home. If I were in the same situation I would offer the professionals off the books free labour around their factory/workshop for the regrinding job. At the cost of labour these days your time even with a healthy excess margin maybe comparable to the time spent at home doing the best you could. Enjoyment doing it yourself at home verse enjoying working in a modern workshop. It could be a win win solution?
Hi, thanks, thats a great idea. It might be worth a try if they have manual machines.
However, they would probably work the same probationary process that the company I worked for used. As a charge hand, I knew that 'new employees' cost the company a lot of money until they had completed the probationary period.
This includes huge amounts of time with health and safety, induction courses, fire drills, overalls, thats before the machine familiarity and assigning another operator to oversee ’the new guy’. this is because of the size and cost of machines and the cost of materials is so high.
Oooo… I just found myself reading the riot act again .. I think I’ll just do it myself. regards
Great VIDEO SIR ... GREETS FROM DENMARK EAST to DANELAND West.
Wellcome Pagan from another Pagan, nice to hear from a distant brother. 🤭
Incredible patience!
Hi thanks, there were times…….. well you know.. regards.
Nursing my left eye! 😂 brilliant!
you're the fist to remark on that one.👍
Sir, your work was very didactic for me. I´m trying to do something similar. Regarding the engineers blue, there are several tricks around, in my case, due to the lack of good suppliers in my area, I prepare mine using powder prussian blue into vaseline. it works fine for me. I could get flatness of 5 microns in 1.2 meters.
Sorry to appear so patronising but, I do try to aim for middle ground in my explanations. I have pointed out before that, I only show how I did what I did and hopefully I won’t be telling anyone how to do anything, because there are literally dozens of ways to do any engineering task, as with your powder and petroleum jelly to replace engineers blue. I do however, understand your supply issues.
regards
Muito bem explicado e de faceio entendimento estou feliz Luiz Carlos !!!
Olá, obrigado por seus comentários, fico feliz que você tenha entendido. Saudações
I think I'd have been tempted to machine at least one of the straight edges into a sort of a flat topped inverted V so as to get around the problem of windage. I've seen a video of this normalizing process before. Yours is way better. That other fella used abrasives.
Did you look into the cost to have the edge ground to some stated tolerance?
Hi Raul. No, i didn’t look into the cost of getting the edges straightened because, the cost of getting stuff done here in the UK is prohibitively expensive. For instance getting a tooth refitted to the back gear wheel is in excess of £500, then I’ve got to re-profile it afterwards. I’ve used these straight edges quite a lot lately and they still confirm true against each other. After Ive finished the lathe I’ll probably use the material from these straight edges on some project.
regards.
0:58 - "I can't afford one, but can I make one?, No..., Can I make three?... Lets find out." (The answer is obviously, yes). I heard a precision machinists once said he can't afford what he makes for which he sells lol 😂
very good job
Hi thanks, regards
A lot of young people could learn a lot from your attitude alone sir
Hi, thanks, much appreciated. Cheers
I'm still not sure: are the high spots where the blue is, or where it's not ? ;)
Hi, the blue spots are where both edges touch each other. cheers.
You could have done all of this bed leveling and checking twist using a plumb bub 🙌🙏 I just made a video on how to make a metal rod that goes 3 ft. Up and attaches to the tool post cross slide and it hangs a plumble down. 100% accurate if done correctly
Before you pay someone else always try to do it yourself. Mr Green would of charged about £90 quid to machine them flat. Very well done look forward to the next video. Trevor - UK
Hi Trevor, thanks for your comment.. it probably cost me £90 in electricity through lighting alone :-) ,.. who is Mr Green?
Whitworth method!
Hi, that is correct. cheers
ATTENTION!!!!
you have to see this Robin Renzetti tutorial ( ruclips.net/video/Va4TGDnQqDs/видео.htmlsi=P74MlJmjrZNAXL3w ) about how flatness can be achived. Whitworth 3 plate method can be done ONLY BY square and round surfaces. The main condition is, when you lap or scrape the surfaces you have to turn them 90 degrees and do the lap/scrape again. Robin shows very clear why.
But it is more then perfect for a hobbyst project. I.ll follow myself
You've Shed some right on getting our ABC's straight but it looks like you're only scraping the surface.
Hi, not quite sure what you mean here, but all I needed to do is one edge of all three work pieces to get a straight edge.
regards
@@Thesheddweller It's a punny compliment. Happened upon your channel yesterday and I wondered if people realize the gift sharing knowledge is... and I watched the entire video while my subconscious was resting then somebody woke up with a comment on mind.
Crazy? Yeah probably, but quite harmless. If people are strange are strangers stranger? Damn, got a song stuck in my head now... a good one this time.
Cheers from BC Canada
Ah yes the "3 plate method" you are the genius.
Hi, thank you for your comment..
I don’t think I'm a genius there are more practical people out there than me. cheers
👍👍👍
Hi, sorry i didn't reply, I missed your comment. Thanks. Cheers
If plate A were drug behind car B? Think about that for awhile....
I like people who aren't afraid of work.
Well, you may not be able to run all that well but you sure can think :)
Hi Ken, thanks, regards
Thanks. Now I have a headache.
Hi, I hope I haven’t caused you any undo stress after watching this. regards
@@Thesheddweller - I was just trying to be funny. Maybe I need more practice.. I think I’ll hang around as I suspect I’ll learn a lot from you.
So was I, hey the written word can always be mi- interpreted. cheers
Too bad you didn’t mention Joseph Whitworth even once in a long video about using Whitworth method.
Just wondering….. you're not in someway related to him are you?… 😁
I've lost my fingerprints three times in three years on this job🤣
Great fun, init.😁
"veritable JCB" ... does not compute.
‘JCB’ here and in quite a few places around the world is a tractor 🚜 with a shovel on the front and a digger on the back, for its size it is powerful and universal a sort of small CAT earth mover. In this case, to be a ‘veritable JCB’ implies to shove material off at a good rate