Let's Hope The Southern Baptist Convention Doesn't Go Down This Road
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- Опубликовано: 29 авг 2024
- Wretched TV and Radio are hosted by Todd Friel. On the show, you will see and hear live witnessing encounters, discussions of tough theological issues, and christian commentary on current events. We might even make you laugh.
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As a woman, I could choose to be offended by this verse or I can choose to trust in God's sovereignty and his reasoning for not having women pastors. God doesn't expect believers to like or agree with His word all the time. We are simply called to obey. And if we find a verse that doesn't "agree with us" we are the ones that need to change our opinion on it. Not change the doctrine to make us feel better. God's Word never changes.
Amen sister? I am right there with you.
*Sister!
Wow amazing thought
Chapeau to you sister!!!!!
If it was reversed as a man it would not bother me or be offended if I was not allowed to be an elder or pastor. I'd simply rejoice and trust in the LORD pride is a terrible sin. Such rebellion is witchcraft and it's not a small difference
You are so right!! I have been saying this about His whole Word to my family. We can't just pick and choose what we like. We need to humble ourselves.
Never take your ideas to the Scripture, let the Scripture form your understanding
Amen
You just nailed the problem with almost all of Rick Warren's teachings.
Exegesis, not eisegesis.
And context.....
Amen to that. I needed to hear this. Thanks, Brother!
Pastor Voddie said it best - the gospel doesn't need the SBC.
Love Voodie
....and it doesn't need Voddie either.
Voddie is the man.
Or Robin Culler
Amen!
When the pastor wants to be loved by the people more than being obedient to the Word.
👍🏻
Yep, that’s Saddleback Church. After 26 years we left. It’s a woke church!
@@triciaportugal6081 most unfortunate.
@@triciaportugal6081 The "pandemic" blew off all these pastors' cover. Let us NEVER... EVER forget. Abortion clients stayed open. Churches? Closed! 'Nuff said.
@@triciaportugal6081 i would like to connect to you to know more becuz Warren's book is very big in my town even if was agsinst it . People probbly don't like me for not wanting it. I still do not need it to know scripture well. I get approved by hard study of bible myself in God.
As a woman I'm offended that we want to flat out ignore scripture.
As a Christian, I'm offended that you began your objection with "as a woman."
@@TheWriterWalker As a Christian Woman...
Is that better?
@@nightskyshowers Lol. Nice reply. But my point is this: Your gender is irrelevant. As a Christian, the only thing relevant is what the Bible says our role is.
Don't you think God knew there would be women on the planet who could stand before an audience and teach? Of course He did. And, yet, He still revealed His congregational order through Paul, and while it allows women to prophesy and even to teach other women, it NEVER gives her the role of pastor.
It's the same thing with God's order for the family. The head of that arrangement is the husband and father...no matter who doesn't like it.
Your love and respect for God's arrangement, your willingness to allow humility to defeat whatever pride the Devil's world tells us we "should" have in our womanhood, should compel you to humbly accept what the minister explains in this video.
@@TheWriterWalker I am saying I agree with this video. Woman are not called to be Pastor's. People assume because I am a woman, I'll take their side. The Bible is our ultimate authority, some people don't seem to think that's the case.
@@nightskyshowers I AM SO SORRY. Please accept my apology! I thought you were defending the opposite stance, my sister.
I’m thankful God provided roles and boundaries to us. I fully embrace and enjoy my role as a woman of God.
Indoctrinated groomed & now a servant to the gop
And i fully respect you as well ❤🇿🇦from southafrica
Amen!
I dont think it was God....I think it was Paul the Orthodox Jewish misogynist and his 1st Century ideas
Last Days!! The Church is a mess! If we can’t even follow the Word of God accurately, how will the Church STAND?!
I’m a 77 year old woman that has been raised in a southern Baptist church all my life. The word of God has been the “mainstay” of my life and the truths proclaimed in it unchangeable.Rick needs to come out of the SBC and be independent if he’s ordaining women pastors. I personally don’t want to sit under a woman pastor and I’m sure my husband would not. I love the way our church flows with the women serving in many areas that fit their skills as God created us.
...but Rick will get a wider audience for his modern innovations in the SBC?
I'm not Baptist, but I would not want to set under a woman pastor, neither would my husband. We attend a church that believes in women preachers and pastors. We are not members, and the pastor is a man.
You cannot use one verse to cancel another. You have to find out how they work together. That is, if you value the veracity of the Scripture over your own inclinations. THAT is the root issue, and it is not secondary. Thanks, Todd, for standing, rather than "going with the flow."
Agree 100%!!
So let's balance these verses like you say... obviously God doesn't have an issue with a woman leading, He has allowed it in the bible...so the issue lies in the changing for words in 2 Tim. Modern translations say "have authority" but the literal Greek says "USURP authority." So we have to ask, why was he even writing this letter to Timothy? Well, the context of the letter is about false doctrine. Women were teaching the false doctrines of the Artemis cult in Ephesus and because of their cult beliefs that woman is greater than man, they were trying to usurp authority...and this is what he was correcting.
Galatians 3:28 refers to our spirit existence in Heaven
@@Warfeist Do we not have a spiritual existence on earth as well.....??? And isnt the spirit what we are most concerned about?
It seems to me that one reason Rick Warren has been so "successful" as measured by the size and influence of his "church" is that he offers a very weak and ungodly culture his blessing when they want something. The whole church growth movement appeals to a secular worldview and that is a magnet to people who find a place where they and their aberrant theology will be received and accepted. Serve coffee in the entry foyer and ice cream in the pulpit and you can get a crowd to show up. Is that "success"?
I wonder if it would even make a difference to Rick Warren's church if they knew he works with Noah Harari and is a member of The World Economic Forum (WEF), where Harari literally said "God is dead. They just haven't claimed his body yet." And then he and his "friends" laughed. The group he works for and with behind the scenes are against our God is all they say and do.
Arepa, I will have to remember that line.. coffee in the foyer, and ice cream in the pulpit, (but donuts have to go somewhere?) lol. Well said. There is no such thing as a "secondary issue". Concerning the scriptures we are obligated to do them all.. It may not be a salvation point but it isn't a secondary issue.
Rick Warren is apart of the seeker sensitive movement which frankly means he caters to what people want. Get butts in the seats and make it worthwhile for them to come back. That is huge part of his success and unfortunately is not why Christ instituted the church. Lots of churches are trying that and they will be judged for that when Christ returns.
Sadly, very sadly he is the man of the moment...for those who want someone to tell them exactly what their itching ears WANT TO HEAR and RW is happy to go along with it as it is self serving.
Christ-lam multifaith --- he's a false teacher --- his ideas on evangelism are extra biblical
God Bless you, sir. Keep standing firm. I am a woman and I can see how for over a 100 years the further we get from God's plan the worse things get. People need to wake up and start paying attention to God and his word.
if we would follow the bible in regards to the status of women in today’s society...
Women , daughter and wives would still be treated as men’s property
sincere question do you believe a pastor has authority over the flock.
@@protruth1
Nope...
That was a second century tradition initiated by greco roman apostolic fathers who hijacked the christian faith from the earliest ebionite / judeo christians,..
establishing church monarchical authorities and creeds
@@protruth1 so long as what he says doesn't contradict the bible.
@@jhake67
agreed, so then, As far as authority goes there would not be an issue for a woman to Pastor a flock.
Obeying scripture isnt a secondary issue.
💥 truth
I think it’s logical. As women, we have a very nurturing spirit. We are emotional, and that can affect our decisions. If a woman is the Pastor, how are the men in the church being ministered to? The Church needs to follow the correct order of God. I’m actually insulted, is my role as wife & mother diminished in comparison?? Why are we questioning God anyway??? Smh 🤦🏻♀️
Well, now we live in a culture where they can't even define a woman anymore, it's no wonder it's leaking into the church. 🙁
You dont think men ever make emotional decisions? Read through history for your answer.
Lisa Tagliabue, sei italiana?
If men are the sole ministers in the church, how are the men in the church being ministered to? Your own logic there.....and what makes you think men are not extremely emotional beings as well?
Christians who live and obey the Bible are not of denominations but of CHRIST, who is bigger than denomination!! Thank you Lord
Exactly!
Well said!
Well Jesus did create a church…. So technically there is a “denomination”. Catholic means universal and Jesus placed Peter at the head of the church. And regardless of sin within the individuals that make up the church, “the gates of hell shall not prevail against it”.
I am grateful for this presentation. This issue has always been so clear to me. God has given women a supportive serving position and I, as a woman, view it as a great honor. I Believe women are the main undergirders giving support to the Body Of Christ. Wake up Church, especially women, Jesus came as a servant!. Refuse to be a part of satan's strategy to cause chaos and division by weaponizing this issue against us. Remember NO weapon formed against us shall prosper, use scriptural truth and the Precious Blood of Jesus to destroy the wicked schemes of our adversary. God's Word is not supposed to make us happy, but if we LOVE and OBEY the TRUTH it WILL make us Holy.
That's so pathetic of Warren to say it is a secondary issue when it is a Biblical command that he's breaking. How convenient.
Todd, there are so few people who can explain these issues as coherently as you. Thank you, as always, for laying out straghtly this bag of tangled snakes!!! I don't understand what about Scripture is SO UNCLEAR to people. It's NOT ABOUT male or female, it's about God's having given us different roles.
I would say the main issue lies in privately interpreting scripture and rather than test your interpretation against someone who is just as knowledgeable about scripture or more, they choose to listen to their own voice and understanding and go from there. And when a person listens to to him/herself, very rarely, if ever, will they come to disagreement with themselves.
@@Surfermario Okay! I don't know what it has to do with my comment. I think you meant to add a comment, not reply to mine? (Love the user name!!!)
dont lift up man - its dangerous; vanity brings a fall idol-gurus is what happens to lifted up/praised leaders....leading to cults; save the praise for GOD
@@Surfermario only issue is if u lived in a whole town out in the sticks that very rarely has sheep who know scripture well. Many are illiterate and pastors here allow for. Is why i all the more studied my bible as thorough as I can according to scripture and I stand out like fat thumb there. But often ignored or unknown even if i go some place . I take advantage where I can speak up well. When i share something solid . I do have a reputation for bible knowledge in the heart too. Just giving a picture of that situation. I know how Elijah felt under Ahab .
I a church i attended they had a bible survey class ,not SBC , And almost all the people saved for years didn't know what Genesis even was or Exodus or Abraham or David ! These were supposedly season believers or they thought. The town allows this environment though . Many are discouraged from reading a bible well . You are told in bible TO study to show yourself approved . Is a blessing as you do it or try to too.
@@pjo2386 so many overlook that and so much persons in my town alone for long while .
A professor told me that if I was looking to the calling as an avenue to revenue then my calling was not genuine and dangerous. He was a voice of God.
In Belgium and Holland the evangelical Youth During evangelical convention came on stage with a rainbow flag and they said. God loves everybody…… Love is Love….. please pray for us
We'll surely pray!
I see in these modern liberal minded denominations that people often reverse the two most important commandments moving God into second place. I also see what is considered to be 'love' as being distorted. The bible says to love the other person as you love yourself. It's not loving one's self to embrace sin's deception, and let the flesh have it's way. Bottom line, they're not getting anything right regarding God's commands. I suppose that's why Jesus called them workers of 'lawlessness' and interestingly He states, 'I never knew you'. (Matt 7:23). Humans in their fallen rebellious state want the role of God for themselves and as such will create their own sense of morality pushing God's aside. Jesus told us to pray for our enemies, those that would abuse us personally, but I don't see these people as MY adversaries, I see them as adversaries of God Himself. Those of them, if any, are Elect, God will be spanking them and bringing them in line. If they are tares and of the sort that Jesus mentioned in Matt 7, prayer won't fix that. They don't need our prayers, they need our rebuke as Todd rightly does in the video.
Wow...end times being fulfilled worldwide
i hope you called them out on this!! this is part of 2 thess 2....the great falling away...
Praying for you 🙏🏽
I can’t believe we’ve reached the point where this is an issue. It CLEARLY says it’s wrong in the Bible
That’s the problem. People get confused because they hear “it says this”, but it doesn’t.
Todd even does it here. He keeps misquoting scripture with preaching for teaching, and pastor for elder.
I’m complimentarian, but I also know and am willing to admit the weaknesses of the side.
@@amrosh791 - Todd is not misplacing teacher and preacher. He's saying they're similar. Deacons and Pastors are required to teach well. Teaching well does not make you a deacon or preacher however. A president must be a citizen of that country. Being a citizen does not make you president. Having the requirements does not give you the authority or office.
Preaching is closed. Teaching is open and welcomes questions and answers.
@@redfaux74 He twice quoted scripture verses replacing the word speak, and teach, with preach. so yes, he is literally misplacing them.
@@redfaux74 the idea of preaching not being open to questions is literally just your thoughts.
It is also a book written by men so perhaps the 1000000’s of versions of God throughout the last millennia means we r being used in some ways - I’m stepping away after this latest abuse I’m tired to make excuses for immoral men bcuz God made him my boss. This has gotten cult like & since I no longer trust the message I will likely need to speak my truth publicly
I was raised Southern Baptist and still prefer Baptists (but I also like Apologists). I was always taught that women should never be preaching at the pulpit. And I will not go to a church with a woman at the pulpit. I believe God calls you to preaching. I do not believe God calls women to preach. I think we have other roles that God wants us to do. We are to support the family, and that includes the church family. That is an important role. I had a moment a few months back where my heart ached remembering the church elders from my childhood, especially the women. And they left a lasting impact on me. A fondness I still feel in my heart for those women. We are divinely created and loved by God in equal measure with the men. We just have different roles to play. I'm tired of Western society trying to turn women into men. You see it in Hollywood all the time. They strip away everything special about being a woman and try to make us into men. Look at Marvel right now. They're actively replacing all the male superheroes with female versions that have no weaknesses. That's just wrong. It's patronizing. I think this is patronizing. It's saying women aren't strong enough to handle what God ordained, so let's change God's word so women are more comfortable. No. You don't have to do that. Women who want to preach can go to one of those other denominations that choose to ignore those Bible verses.
It does feel like a belittling of femininity to force the masculine roles. As if to be a strong woman, you have to wield authority in a pantsuit. Nevermind the mom of 6 who cares diligently for her home and family and is a helpmeet to her husband, whose family is fed, clothed, nurtured, loved, prayed over, and admonished in the Gospel, whose self-sacrifice goes unseen or unnoticed because of her gentle and quiet spirit. Is she not a strong woman? That's the kind of woman I aspire to be.
@@edenelston7668 Exactly.
Can’t believe the Hypocrisy of Rick Warren - he claims “let’s keep the main thing the main thing,” and the promptly goes back to NEVER preaching the Gospel
Women can’t be pastors that is a main thing Rick warren ……………!!!Amen marcus
Ol Ricky is making a lot of money not preaching the gospel. Why stop now?
I think calling it a secondary issue is manipulative. It makes people feel petty for objecting.
Look up ‘theological triage.’ He’s not saying it’s not an important issue just not salvific.
Agreed!!!!!
@@brandonmccallon5160 okay but at what point do you put your foot down on 'enough is enough' ? How many secondary issues should be allowed to fly without confrontation? Paul gave us a model for church discipline, and it wasn't to ignore stuff. It really shouldn't be any different on a congregational basis as it is on an individual basis.
Because divisiveness over supposed secondary issues has become the seeker-sensitive church's unpardonable sin.
I always enjoy how plainly you lay out your presentations. Very well documented. Thanx for posting 👍🙂🐻
I worked for the Assemblies of God in the 90’s. They ordained women at that time, but RARELY did they fulfill the role of pastor in the church. They would often have some other kind of church job, such as pastoring (or teaching) in children’s ministries or women’s ministries. Sometimes a wife was like an associate pastor to her husband, but she’s not “the pastor.” She’s a helpmate.
What these progressive women fail to understand in thier equalaritain views is not ALL men can be pastors. Some are excluded because of behavior but even more because they dont have that gift.
If these woman would be as passionate about teaching children as they are being head of the church they could serve Rightly.
Good point. Feminism has taught us that the only way to be equally important to men is to lead men. Who is one of, if not the most, influential people in life? A mother. A mother who is climbing the corporate ladder or preaching is failing to notice that she is giving up the opportunity to train human beings in the most direct, personal, quantitative, and qualitative ways as a mother. By the same token, a children's church teacher is not merely a babysitter, but someone who can build passion for and basic understanding of God's Word while they are young and "captive." I still remember the name of my favorite Sunday School teacher who has long since gone into her reward. I cannot remember the name of the pastor of the church at that time. Feminists discount raising up children as lesser work, yet our Lord said "of such are the Kingdom of Heaven."
What if the women do indeed have the gift?
Plus, a man must be a husband of one wife to be a pastor and his children believers- it actually says the qualifications of a pastor in the Bible.
But what if women do have the gift and the intellect? Again I see no spiritual difference between women and men......only a matter of anatomy....and that should not count for anything in the Kingdom of God...
The editor deserves a raise
Why?
@@drpaddypepper good edits
@@jongee4336 i agree there
Preach
NAMB --> Queues CCR 😂
This is why I watch Todd Videos. :)
I heard it put this way in church once: "Where women lead, men leave."
I do NOT and will NEVER allow any woman to have authority over me. Never......
@@joncooksey1 LOLOLOLOLOL!!!!!
A simple look at divorce rates in the church should reveal that quickly.
Steven Jordan If more women were leaders I suspect not only men would leave but MURDER, RAPE, ROBBERY, CORRUPTION, PEDOPHILIA, WARMONGERING, ADULTERY, DOMESTIC VIOLENCE, DESPOTISM, DRUG RUNNING, SLAVERY, OPPRESSION, INJUSTICE and other such manly led activities would also 'leave' in a major way as well.
Why i left out of a foursquare church over years ago and still exists sadly I becuz there is nothing good in it mostly anymore. It long ago welcomed certain heresies and false doctrines that it never repented of. Not sure of that denomination itself but i do not care for them much now. I don't care to make tongues speaking a big pursuit and long avoided it . I cannot stand abberate charismatic groups . Becuz i seen the big errors of . I even am moving out of some calvary chapels since they compromised in odd ways now as surprising as it is . There probbly are still solid ones but one in southern CA have warped some.
Just prayed for you, Mr. Friel; stay standing firm in God's Truth. You have a heart of caring yet not compromising.
Great ability/connection to adultery “if we said women could commit adultery but not men…” So true
Loving the new Wretched RUclips direction.
Hey everyone! I just wanted to share some good news with you all. Let's just put it this way, the Ten Commandments are called the Moral Law. Ask yourself this. How many lies have you told? Have you ever stolen anything? Have you ever used God's name in vein? Have you ever hated someone or ever looked with lust? This is for you to judge yourself, but chances are that you are a lying, thieving, blasphemous, fornicating, adulterer at heart and you HAVE to face God on judgement day. Now ask yourself this. If God judges you on judgement day by these Commandments, will you be innocent or guilty? Of course you'll be guilty because we've all done these things. The truth is that none of us are good people and we NESD God's grace to make it to heaven. We judt simply cannot do it on our own. These Commandments arecalled the Moral Law. You and I broke the law, Jesus payed the fine. So now what we must do to be saved is to repent of our sins and trust alone in Jesus Christ! To repent doesn't mean to just say I'm sorry, but to turn from our sins and let Him truly be our Lord continually. He said that many will say to Him, Lord, Lord I have done all of these things for you. And He will say I never knew you. Depart from Me, ye who work iniquity! And those will be cast into outer darkness and raging hellfire and loneliness for all of eternity!!! Because we broke His law, He is very, very just to send us to hell. If someone had murdered 4 people and said to the judge, I've done nice things too and have tried to treat people nice but it was just one time, the judge would then say, okay but you're going to jail. And the judge is very just to do that. One last thing, if you were 10,000 feet in the air and you had to jump, you wouldn't jump out and flap your arms and try to save yourself. That's ridiculous! You would put on the parachute. It is the same with Jesus. You must trust Him as you trust the parachute. We are not good and we cannot save ourselves with our own goodness. We must trust alone in Him to save us. In just a moment of time you can pass from death to life. Jesus said, "Verily, verily I say unto you, you must be born again." That is how we enter heaven. Through the blood and grace of Jesus Christ!!!!✝️If you ask someone how to enter Heaven, they will most likely say, "Be a good person." Well the Bible says that none is good, no not one. We like to compare ourselves to guys like Hitler and say, "Hey, I'm a pretty good guy compared to him." But when we compare ourselves to God's standard, we realize that the Bible speaks truth when it says that we all sinned and fallen short of the Glory of God!!! When we see this ( our sin in its TRUE light), we see how much trouble we are in and we say, "Well then there's nothing I can do. I'm going to hell for sure then." It's true that there is nothing that WE can do, but there is something that has already been done for you! God sent His One and Only Son to die on a cross as a sacrifice for our sins! So to recieve that eternal sweet sweet forgiveness, all we must do is repent of our sins (meaning to continually turn from them and confess them) and trust alone in Christ as you trust a parachute. If I was to push you out of an airplane, you'd want the parachute for sure! Don't try to flap your arms and save yourself, trust in the parachute!! His finished work on the Cross IS ENOUGH!! He is the only way to Heaven, He said it Himself!! These other religions teach that we must he good and do good things and then maybe if we've been good enough, we will enter Heaven. But if that is true then we are all doomed to eternal hell because none of us are good. That's why this makes sense. Look at the Ten Commandments, they are written on your heart right now!! I promise that you have violated them. And you might still be doing that today.. Therefore God is just to poor out His wrath on us because we deserve it! But Christ died for us so that we can spend eternity in Heaven with Him!! Turn to Him today, and He and only He will save your soul!! "Verily, verily I say unto you, you must be born again ( to go to Heaven)."✝️
What is a pastor? SBC: We're not theologians.
Point made! The devil also gave some truth when deceiving humanity; however, if the Word becomes mixed with lies, it's no longer the unadulterated Word of the living God. Therefore, the twisting of God's Word is an example of what these fallen Churches have done, deceiving many to believe the lie.
Nevertheless, let us pray for their hearts to be softened and opened to the truth of God's holy Word.
It's all lies. I do not believe there is a god or a devil. I have not been duped by the ludicrous belief in fairy tales and myths.
@@desmodus5635 The only one believing in a fairy tale and a myth is you. When the universe was made, the Gravitational Constant was so precise that if it had been slightly different by 1 in 10 to the 60th power, we wouldn't be here? This fact alone makes Atheism unbelievable, but let us go a few steps further; Genesis 1:1 "In the beginning, God created the heaven and the earth." The Theory Modern Evolutionism begins with elementary particles of matter evolving out of nothing in a "big bang" and then developing through natural forces into complex systems. Genesis 1:1 records the creation of space ("the heaven"), of time, ("in the beginning"), and of matter, ("the earth"), the tri-universe, the space/time/matter universe which constitutes our physical environment. The Creator of this tri-universe is the triune God, Elohim, the tri-plural Old Testament name for the Divine "Godhead," a name which is plural in form (with its Hebrew "im" ending) but commonly singular in meaning. The existence of a transcendent Creator and the necessity of a primeval special creation of the universe is confirmed by the most basic principles of nature discovered by scientists:
(1) The law of causality, that no effect can be greater than its cause, is basic in all scientific investigation and human experience. A universe comprising an array of intelligible and complex effects, including living systems and conscious personalities, is itself proof of an intelligent, complex, living, conscious Person as its Cause.
(2) The laws of thermodynamics are the most universal and best-proved generalizations of science, applicable to every process and system of any kind, the First Law stating that no matter or energy is now being created or destroyed, and the Second Law stating that all existing matter and energy is proceeding irreversibly toward ultimate equilibrium and cessation of all processes. Since this eventual death of the universe has not yet occurred and since it will occur in time, if these processes continue, the Second Law proves that time (and, therefore, the space/time/matter universe) had a beginning. The universe must have been created, but the First Law precludes the possibility of its self-creation. The only resolution of the dilemma posed by the First and Second Laws is that "in the beginning God created the heaven and the earth." The so-called big bang theory of the origin of the cosmos, postulating a primeval explosion of the space/mass/time continuum at the start, beginning with a state of nothingness and then rapidly expanding into the present complex universe, contradicts both these basic laws as much as it contradicts scripture. As such, when considering real science, the special Creation of the Universe is objectively scientific.
@@desmodus5635 History and science has proven nearly everything in the Bible. You have been duped by the religion of Naturalism.
@@RideWithChrist3-7 What?? Sorry, you are the one who has been duped. JFC, I don't believe this! I guess religion = ignorance.
@@RideWithChrist3-7 You mean common sense??
Thanks for adding more light to this issue. I was almost confused, but now I have a clear understanding. God bless you
I am a woman. If the men in a fellowship have not run the race well and allowed the women to know the Bible more thoroughly than they did, wouldn’t the men have given the women authority over them and wouldn’t they have suffered the women to teach by virtue of their biblical ignorance? I would suggest that the responsibility here is on the men to study The Word and show themselves workmen which need not be ashamed. There is extreme laziness and sin on the part of some men in this generation and many male leaders in the corporate church. The fault isn’t necessarily on the women and they likely didn’t strong-arm their way into leadership positions. It would be the natural result of a situation where men didn’t step up (mirrored in society at large).
Tanya Ernst your comment only one that makes sense
Tanya I believe this is exactly why we have so many female Pastors today. Because so many of them will swear they were called and will tell you with such believable, undeniable conviction. I liken it to when Deborah was judge. Truly last days type stuff. I do believe women can pastor other women and children 17 and under. Mike Winger has an amazing series on RUclips about it and supports it by rightly dividing scripture. I would love to see a debate/discussion with him and Todd!!!
They claim to be "called" by God, but God you never tell you to do something that violates His Word.
I’m so sick of hearing these men at every SBC meeting talking about keeping the “main issue!” Acknowledge sin snd repent! The SBC is one of today’s greatest distractions and distortions from the Gospel Satan is using.
Mr Todd Friel: Thank you!!
Apostasy is slowly but constantly getting inside the church. It is written. Protect the Gospel, defend the Word of God!
I sent my daughter to a private Christian college and she came home on break believing it’s Gods Will for Women to Pastor. WHAT?!? This is an Assemblies of God College! Great!!!
Protestantism as a whole is Theologically Liberal.
Every man a Pope was a mistake.
Try a reformed theology based school. You can find a list but you'll still have to use some biblical discernment to make sure no worldly theories have infiltrated the school.
AOG people will believe anything that they think "God" spoke to them directly.
The comment in 1Tim 2:12 is clarified in 1 Cor 14:34-35 which starts (NKJV) "Let your women keep silent in the churches" and ends with "for it is shameful for women to speak in church." This is strengthened in 1 Cor 14:37 where Paul writes "If anyone thinks himself to be a prophet or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things which I write to you are the commandments of the Lord."
In 2 Peter 3:14-16Peter states Paul's epistles were written "according to the wisdom given to him" (wisdom can only be given by God) and equates them to "the rest of the Scriptures." (NKJV) That doesn't leave any room for alternate interpretations.
In Timothy, Paul goes back to the Garden of Eden. Woman was deceived, Man was willfully disobedient and was standing right there. It’s very clear. Women shouldn’t be pastors, period.
I still can't wrap my mind around Wretched allowing comments haha.
Yes! Exactly what caused this anomaly?
It's fantastic
Thank you, Todd, for your clear thinking. Yes, this is a secondary issue, but it is based on a primary issue. The language of sola scriptura is frequently used by many. However, in practice, sola scriptura has been replaced with sola “my subjective interpretation “. The abandonment of objective truth can only lead to hopeless subjectivity. Who or what is the final authority? Did God really say? Yes. Yes. Yes He did. We repeatedly must learn to not go beyond scripture. 1 Corinthians 4:6 (ESV)
[6] I have applied all these things to myself and Apollos for your benefit, brothers, that you may learn by us not to go beyond what is written, that none of you may be puffed up in favor of one against another.
I am a woman who is a Christian mental health therapist. For the sake of argument I would like to look at women's ordination from a slightly different point of view. I have provided mental health counseling over the past 30 years to Christians and non-Christians with the aid of Bible passages that help bring God's plan for our lives into focus. Here is something I have learned during that time. God's reasons for what He says in the Bible are not always spelled out but we can often still see why He gave certain instructions to His church in ages past. .
Let's suppose God comes to a group of women and says "Ladies I want you to raise your children by teaching them about me, instructing them to follow the 10 Commandments, and to be kind and loving toward others. I also want you to teach your children how to pray and read the Bible so that they learn about me every day!" If God were to tell a group of Christian women this, they would look at each other with surprise and say "Yes Lord! We know that you want us to do these things for and with our children and we're already doing it!" The truth is that most Christian women are already trying to teach and lead their children in Godly ways at home...
Now let's suppose God comes to a group of men and says "Men, I want you to raise your children by teaching them about me, instructing them to follow the 10 Commandments, and to be kind and loving toward others. I also want you to teach your children how to pray and read the Bible so that they learn about me every day!" Some Christian men may be doing these things with their families but I think many Christian men would look at each other with surprise and think "Is this really my job? I thought my wife was supposed to mostly take care of these kinds of things while I am doing other work..." To be honest, from my perspective as a Christian therapist, it appears harder for men to grasp and understand their role as spiritual leaders in their families. I think this is why God gives instruction to men in the Bible to be the head of the house and priests of the family. It seems that God needed to give them a "title" (priest of the family, head-of-the-house) to solidify their role as spiritual leaders with their wives and children. Men seem to need positions and titles spelled out to them so that they feel comfortable in their roles.
Now lets turn to the issue of women's ordination. Doesn't the same situation apply? God gave men a special calling (pastor or evangelist) and really wants men to take on this mantle whole-heartedly. Can women do these jobs? Yes, women could fulfill the duties of these positions but what happens when women rush in and become pastors and evangelists? Men for some reason stop entering these positions and in certain denominations where women's ordination has been around for a long time (Methodist Church being one example), there are many women pastors but fewer and fewer men pastors. Also the leadership of the church then becomes top-heavy with women leaders in general and Christian men seem to become less and less engaged in the leadership of the church over time. Men somehow need to feel special and important in a specific spiritual calling with a title and all the prestige that comes with that. Let them have it I say! Women are already doing many of the leadership roles that are needed within the church whether we have a title or not. If God calls you to be a specific spiritual leader within your church then do it. But let the men who need positions and titles have those things too! In this way we all grow spiritually stronger as we learn through teaching and leading others to Christ (whether we teach children or adults, no matter what area we serve in).
This was an awesome message.
The Church of my youth here in Oklahoma has a female pastor. I don't attend the church, which I dont like because I need that push. I fall quite often away from God, I have like 7 RUclips channels that preach the Gospel this being one of them but I get so caught up in other things I dont watch and fall away even more. Asking for prayers 🤗
Find a faithful gathering of local believers. Ask the Lord to lead you to them. Do not delay. I love online teaching, too, but it doesn’t replace brothers and sisters in the same room!
You need to just do it, it is within your control. Find a church, stop finding excuses.
Attention seeking comment. Creepy
Is this a Methodist Church?
Find a Bible preaching and believing church and go to it. Stop trying to make us feel sorry for you. You need to be born again and be in a physical gathering of believers so you can grow in the faith.
I don't agree with the "secondary issue" statement. Since The Word of god is indeed THE WORD OF GOD, it is all truth and our standard for truth and life. If a person or church is in clear violation of the TRUTH, this is a primary issue, since the violation of truth is what condemned mankind in the first place (see Gen. 1). I will not be in the long line of people who tell God that something in His Word is less important or could be winked at and ignored. the pastoring of women is as much a sin as abortion, homosexuality, murder, etc.
So how come there are so many different versions of 'the word of God'?
@@kevinkelly2162 you are aware that the Bible comes in every language as well, how do you reconcile that?! God protects His word.
@@kevinkelly2162 There are different translations using the same 6000 or so manuscripts. Usually so that an organization can print their own Bible without having to pay royalties to an already established translation. The content is the same as the same source manuscripts are used whether it's ESV, NASB, NIV, CSB.
The reason for distinguishing between essential and secondary issues is because, essential issues are non negotiable like salvation. If someone has a false understanding of the gospel and is spreading that, then you must separate.
Secondary issues we don't separate, like will Jesus return in 1 year or 10 years. Since non of know and it doesn't affect our salvation, we can disagree as brothers.
We are warned of false prophets - It is God’s will that they exist.
Lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil. 🙏
Loved you using adultery as an example! I'll have to use thst next time. Thanks for all you do, Todd, and for allowing the Spirit to work through you!
Then you would have trouble getting around David, and Solomon and most of the other Kings of Israel and Judah.....
Wow great editing on this clip! Plus... I'm really glad Wretched always gives a good Orthodox perspective on things.
There are so many Churches that are without shepards anymore, When I was saved 50 yrs. ago and read the Bible that was it, I still can't flip it I can just believe it or not I choose the former.
As a man, it's hard enough for me to listen to these soft whispering pastors, that are men. So I would never have a woman as a pastor. At the same time I would never attend a church where a male pastor taught evolution as a secondary doctrine.
I’m shocked my church has adopted another religious ideology
I don’t even know how to write it….
@@jarod144 Look it up. Study it. Talk to others in your church who agree with you. Talk to others who don't agree. Study a game plan, put together some talking points and present them to your pastor. Don't be disrespectful, don't get to emotional but don't pull punches. So much of these are false identities, not false gospels. So taking them back to the Gospel may not be effective. Grace and peace and the light of Christ be with you.
Gave. Up onthis group .was one all my life but they are in trouble
@@jarod144 Really? You're Shocked By This? I'm More Shocked The Church Covered Up Sexual Assault And Gaslit Sexual Assault Victims Than I Am About Female Pastors
Rick warren message was about Rick Warren. I’ve had some problems with Elmore lately but I thank God for what he said. Thanks m a member of a solid SBC church and I wish we would leave. I’m starting to see why some are independent fundamentalist.
Plus it’s easy to see that most of these women probably all that wanna preach have serious Doctor No issues. I believe so does Rick Warren
Excellent ecclesiology! You nailed it!
I've never really had a problem with it until recently when I've noticed the last few years lots of women getting ordained once they reach middle age and their children have left the nest or about to. Now I'm not so sure, I now am questioning it, it's a calling not something you do as a Christian for the next stage of your life, which is what it seems is going on. To me it feels better and I feel more comfortable with a man leading
Well, Christianity and the Word is not about how we feel. It is the Word of God and must be obeyed, even when we disagree or don't like it or it rubs our pride the wrong way. We either believe God knows what is best for us, and the church at large, or we don't. We either bow the knee and obey Him or we follow ourselves and our way....just like at the Tower of Babel. You feel more comfortable with a man leading because that is what God ordained.
7 But refuse profane and old wives' fables, and exercise thyself rather unto godliness
1 Timothy 4
King James Bible
Rick Warren is wolf in sheep’s clothing PURE and SIMPLE!!!!!!!!!!!!
I was saved through the ministry’s at Saddleback. My faith is real.
Good for you. I have listened to Rick and he DOES have some good, solid teaching.
God bless, thank you.
Yay thank you for opening up the comment section!!!
That they actually have to have these debates shows that is already lost....
This is how satan is trying to tear down the church. Jesus stated the gates of hell would not prevail; He didn’t say they wouldn’t try.
And coming against the church like an army with battering rams would cause solidification. But coming in like water, in a cold, dead church freezes into ice and expands cracks; dividing one side from another.
And a divided house cannot stand. How can we hold up the standard of the Gospel if we’ve been knocked down?
Souls being saved from hell is not a secondary issue.
My understanding growing up has always been that a woman can teach other women and children, but never lead the church, or be a pastor of a church, always in submission of the male leaders of the church...
This isn’t a matter of first thing, second thing or hundredth thing. This is man’s attempt to put themselves above the Lord God Almighty. We are sinful, fallen creatures, FIRST and FOREMOST! This isn’t Paul’s word; it’s GODS! They aren’t going against the Bible per se, but the One who wrote it! This, unfortunately, is par for the times we are in; the end times. Paul wrote to Timothy about the things people would do in the end times. Not just the ‘unsaved’, but the so called ‘saved’ ones. These folks fit right in!
Good bye SBC .... garnering the praises if men rather than God. Keep them seats filled for itching ears. Ra Ra
This is the best satire I think I have ever heard. I’ve been listening to Todd via other you-tubers, who were getting so mad at him. I think the atheists miss the great satire of Wretched Radio. Great stuff!
I have heard all 3 of these "arguments" since the time I entered seminary in 1980. All 3 arguments are based not in scripture OR the Church's history and teaching. I have been done with the SBC and all Baptist denominations since that time. I knew immediately that any organization that allows "arguments" from the secular world and prioritizing them over the clear teaching of the Bible AND the plain teaching of the church fathers is not the church.
If the Bible is so clear how come there are so many different kinds of christians?
@@kevinkelly2162 people can interpret things in any way they want. The Bible is clear and people choose whether to call it "cultural for a certain time" or take it as it says. Most of time people will want it to tickle their eyes and throw away whatever they don't agree with.
@@kevinkelly2162 because people still want to do what they want
Not all Baptist churches agree with this confusion. That's why many of us are independent. Doug Stoliker
I want to know how anyone decides what is the right interpretation of scripture. Because it appears to me that every single preacher of every single denomination believes that theirs is the correct interpretation of scripture. It is actually insane!
Only men should be pastors.
It isn’t a sexist thing.
It is The Bible.
Gods word.
God creates roles, those roles should be followed.
We do not know what God knows.
Let God decide. Not us.
Love this.
It should be the same way with the president as well.
9:30 you know what else you don't see in the Bible... youth groups, men's groups, women's prayer breakfasts, radio hosts, RUclips personalities, promotion of calling out anybody publicly before making a private appeal... yet here we are.
Historically the Church had a Episcopate to appeal to. But Protestantism decided that "Wasn't Biblical".
Amen! Yes! Please Brother Todd, let’s highlight this commenters post!
djhu306 INDEED!!!
I want to a sbc seminary in costa rica and was offered full support, rejected it because of leaders going against what the Bible teaches. This was in 2010.
Independent now. No support just trusting in God
This “secondary issue” is a sin. So if that’s the case,it’s not ordained by God. It’s disobedience, how is this so hard to understand?
Just because something isn’t the gospel does that mean it’s a freebie? We look to see what scripture says about it and in this case it’s more than clear.
This issue seems to go back to Genesis 3 and the tug of war about who gets to rule. Good job Todd🙏
AMEN! Anything that goes against the Word of GOD is no secondary issue. It is HIS Word!
Psalms 138:2
“I will worship toward thy holy temple, and praise thy name for thy lovingkindness and for thy truth: for thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name.”
We quit fellowshipping with Southern Baptist way way way back. I'm thinking it was the early 1900's
That depends upon what is being classified as a secondary issue. I agree with the biblical arguments presented, but eschatology is often considered another secondary issue. Is it sin to believe pre-millennialism as taught by John MacArthur as opposed to a more a- millennial framework taught by Voddie? There are secondary issues that aren't sin, but the gender roles in the church are pretty explicit.
Um if this is a sin then so is women not having a head covering.
@@rachelm9350 In the context of ancient Corinthian culture, a woman who had her head uncovered in a religious context was actually identifying as a temple prostitute. Paul says elsewhere that some of the church had formerly been involved. So yes, for them it would have been sinful within their culture because of what it signified. Obviously we're not in the same situation, but a more modern adaptation would be dress modestly. People have different ideas about what that looks like, but having one's head uncovered simply doesn't carry the same implications as it did in Corinth, which is why it's not important or sinful today. It was for the Corinthians of that time.
The incident, in the garden of Eden, is the best evidence., for women not to have word of god authority over men. A woman can preach, as long as it is to other women only.
Thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee. Therefore the woman will try to exert authority over men, we call this feminism.
Then why are there no matriarchal societies?
Um no. Adam stood right by while Eve ate the fruit from the tree. Adam needed someone else he begged for Eve.
@@vanessaloy1049 Except there ARE some matriarchal societies. Get real.
@@rachelm9350 Which ones?
@@vanessaloy1049 hello queen of England?
I like the new multimedia format but I also think it needs to be tempered a bit because these intellectual discussions require thought and consecutive, logical thought "trains" which can be difficult if jarring moments of levity are introduced.
Still, the editor needs a raise because this was well put together!
I agree - if you want to have fun and meme something, do it wholeheartedly - but if you want to be taken seriously, perhaps save the cutaway jokes for another video
Thank you!
Before I was ever even born again, I had been a drug addict for over 20 years and and I went to this Christian character building program they're building program called shining light ministries And when we 1st started taking classes there, the new director new director had all of us men and women start reading purpose driven life written by Rick Warren. I wasn't even born again yet and yet and didn't know a whole lot about the New Testament, more the Old Testament because my dad always Taught that you can't understand The Bible without 1st understanding the Old Testament and now that I'm born again and have started chewing meat, I have come to realize that my dad was a 100% correct. It's impossible to understand the New Testament without the Old Testament because the Old Testament tells us what Jesus is going to do I'm gonna do and the New Testament tells us how Jesus did it.
Anyway, I got off track there…………………I knew Rick ward was just using multiple different Versions of The Bible instead of just sticking to 1 or 2 raven 3 versions to write his book, he uses pretty much every Common Bible theory is out there. What I said, even though I was under Christian, I knew that what I was reading wasn't the truth.. It seems like he was just sighing saying something and then tobacco what he just said Hey would use a version of a Bible that was closest to what he said and then he would reference that scripture. Then when you would go in to like the king James or the NASB or AMP, you would see the What that scripture says has nothing to do with what hes talking about and it was that way through the whole book. So. So I pretty much stop reading it immediately
There’s a lot of literature out there that rips verses out of context (usually from paraphrase versions) to attempt to back up the author’s point, sadly
You have comprehended something that many haven't. The mixing and matching of bibles to promote a particular doctrine. I hope you haven't given up on reading the Bible because if you read the real Bible it's a fantastic book. I believe the real Bible, as opposed to the fake ones, is the infallible Word of God. The King James Version defensible as being infallible and the NASB, the AMP and many others contradict themselves and have various other errors.
That shows wisdom in my opinion. I had a copy of Warren’s APDL and binned it a few years ago when he seriously started going off path!
@@martinlohne5128 I pretty much only read the Bible.... what's the point in going to someone else when I can just read the actual word of God
Glory to God, His Spirit leads His people into all Truth.
we have the same testimony
Pastor Stanley has always been a preacher of the word. Love him, TX him.
The SBC : 'What is a Pastor ?'
Also SBC : 'We aren't Theologians'
Everything I hear Anglican I think of t had exact clip in my head. So funny! I love the channel! Support Brother! Keep up the fight
This might have already been brought up, but my understanding from someone who was there is this: they didn’t want to disfellowship Saddleback Church in their home state, so they formed a committee to review the issue and vote on it next year. In short, Saddleback will likely be disfellowshipped at next year’s convention. I understand giving them “space to repent”, but it seems like they should be out right away for being in direct violation of the Scriptures. This is sad, and I genuinely hope some will repent, even if their leadership doesn’t, and find solid teaching somewhere else.
Warren is a nice guy. But through the years... when push came to shove... he ALWAYS punted. And boy... this time he really punted. His tendency to "please" finally caught up with him... and unfortunately... Saddleback Church.
Tickling ears, and heaping up for the last day
I am ordained into the Christian Church...non-denominational. As a woman with over 55 years of research, school, and studies, I believe I am most comfortable and called to teach women and children. There is a huge ministry there already and lots of work to do.
By the same token, the men better step up, speak up and start teaching all the Scripture, not just the ones that "tickle the ears" of your congregations. There is the prophesied Falling Away of the Church, and you men will be held accountable for every soul you did not warn! There is something severely wrong in the Church when the women have to jump in because the men are lacking in so many areas, that the enemy is taking over while the Church is silent on sin!
WARN THE PEOPLE!
Ezekiel 33:7-9 “So you, son of man: I have made you a watchman for the house of Israel; therefore you shall hear a word from My mouth and warn them for Me. When I say to the wicked, ‘O wicked man, you shall surely die!’ and you do not speak to warn the wicked from his way, that wicked man shall die in his iniquity; but his blood I will require at your hand. Nevertheless if you warn the wicked to turn from his way, and he does not turn from his way, he shall die in his iniquity; but you have delivered your soul."📖🙏
📖📖🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏📖📖
1 Corinthians 6:3 Judge angels
"Do you not know that we will judge angels? How much more matters of this life?"
📖📖📖📖📖📖📖📖📖🙏🙏🙏🙏
"What fellowship can light have with darkness?" So, if a church is choosing to live in sin and is leading people into error, how can that be considered a secondary issue? If an individual in the congregation was living in sin, the church would exercise church discipline; if they did not listen to their brothers or the church, then they are excommunicated. Why not the same with Saddleback? With others who are seeking to introduce sin into the SBC?
I may not completely understand or pretend to know why the The Lord doesn’t allow for women pastors, but as a woman who has watched some of these women “pastors,” I can say I’m glad He doesn’t. They crazy.
Hey y'all, this is directed at the editor. I know you were probably given cover footage for Todd's commentary, but positioning a woman being baptized at the moment Todd says, "That church is living in sin." is a bad placement for that clip at 8:20. It seems at that moment the video is telling the audience that woman shouldn't be baptized, which is ridiculous; but there are tons of people who don't separate commentator from editor, so they'll think Wretched as a whole thinks woman shouldn't be baptized.
The movie clips are a nice touch, except the Vietnam cutaway distracts from the message. I get that this is one of your creative outlets, but when the things of God are being discussed is not the time to be goofy.
I have nothing to say about your skill as an editor, I think you're good, just have a more serious tone.
well stated
Very well said
LOVE the edits! Hilarious and helped break up the video to further drive home the point
Jesis doesn’t need the SBC or any other denomination or church to preach the gospel to the world. In fact, Jesus Himself will fulfill that before He comes by sending a strong angel to preach it to the entire world per Revelation. What we need is to be faithful to the Word, not blown about by every new (or old) wind of false doctrine...
thanks Todd Friel, useful video, informative, not watered-down
Blessed is he who reads, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things that are written there in: for the Time is at hand. " REVELATION 1:3_ ...22: 20-21.
Two thoughts to share:
1) In Lutheran seminary (way back in the 70s) a professor gave us a clever little escape clause to use whenever something in the Bible conflicted with what we thought was right or just wanted. We could say that the Bible passage or concept was "historically contingent," meaning it was right for their time given their circumstances, but not for our time and circumstances. That is an argument Rick Warren could be using now to defend his ordaining women. (By the way, isn't it rich hearing him council against bickering about secondary issues AFTER he had imposed his ordination of women on the SBC. I love it.)
2) Inasmuch as the liberal mainline denominations will be following along with the "negation of gender" agenda (they always follow secular culture...just a little slow on the uptake) there will no longer be an issue of women's equality or women's rights to deal with. Finally, for the first time in my lifetime, I won't have to listen to incessant, female whining and bitching about how they are abused by men. Why, there's no such thing as women.
The Lord is near, the season is now! Amen. God is merciful. He always forgives. Never be ashamed to take your failures to him. He is for you, not against you! God is with you in the storm. He knows your troubles, he hears you! He is for you, on your side, always! It may feel silent at times, but he’s holding you close! May the Lord return soon! We are drawing closer. He is coming! Believe and trust in the Lord, you will be saved. Period. May the Lord bless you all! Hang in there family. Stay strong. It is not easy following the Lord. We are scoffed at. We give up our earthly dreams, our fleshly desires. What the enemy offers is short lived, but heaven is forever! Life may seem or be unfair, but God is with you! Always remember that. Things may get better or worse for you, but a kingdom awaits you! Finish the race! Repent daily and carry your cross. This world is fading fast. Your troubles are temporary! New channel here, I’d appreciate any kind of support. Don’t give up! God loves you so much! So do I. The Lord bless you!!
No offence, but your theology is questionable. HE does not ALWAYS forgive. Blaspheme holy spirit? not so much. Arrogant defiance and continued sinning? Forgiveness without repentance? Maybe, but with. consequences. Jesus was NOT a hippy.
I gave a godly advice to a pastor, the same night, I heard a scripture 3 times " I do not allow a woman to have authority over the man." I was oppressed by the spirit of Jezebel.( Have authority over a man) And the spirit of confusion is working strongly at some Baptist churches, I had to get deliverance from the counterfeit Holy spirit.
Stay in God's word( the truth). For rebellion is as the sin of witchcraft, and stubbornness is as iniquity and idolatry. 1 Samuel 15:23
I truly believe in the biblical teaching we are taking about here, but I do have a question at the same time. My home church in China has a senior female pastor for more than a decade, and female pastors and preachers are bit more common than the western churches due to the much more strict oppression for Christian churches in the country, so that not only there’s few pastors but any people who ever comes to serve the gospel of lord is quite encouraged to see. And I personally heard gospel and built up my faithful foundations from my home church.
My question is that I totally believe that gospel is the work of God and bcuz of Jesus I can confidently say that I’m saved by his mercy and God is my father in heaven, but at the same time, through years I just can’t deny the work of the female pastor at my home church has been working through lord, she has been a true sister in Christ helped and shepherd tons of people who turned into God and chose to come to church, she has been faithful preaching the gospel in her life, and you know all those things are difficult in China. She has suffered for Christ and even been to jail for hosting underground church in the history.
So how should we as the Christians to treat this kind of extraordinary situation? And I can’t deny that God truly used her and her family for the sake of gospel in the years of her serving. Is it simply a sin or a command that Paul and bible don’t universally suggest to the followers?
The situation is definitely not similar to those mega churches in US today, the believers who heard the gospel in China mainly were stuck in an environment that lacks of biblical resources and facing realistic dangers, not many “females” would risk their lives to preach and serve as a pastor to fulfil their hobby or humanly desires, and many of them lack systematic knowledges regards the command either female can or cannot be a pastor, even though later then they found it out, it might already happens after hosting a church with many attendees, should they just resign and let people leave? Their intentions and works have done through God can be so different than the context we are addressing nowadays in a developed country. How do we justify those kinds situations from a biblical and realistic perspective regards the sovereignty of God and the need of gospel.
Simple answer: God will turn around evil for good. God will use even the wicked for the glory of His name. The sovereign God will still use those who twist His scripture. The evil is not therefore justified, but rather frustrated, and all acts of evil, despite being made frustrated, will still be judged by God
@@nathans8178 Amen
@@nathans8178 yes and if you read my comment carefully you will know that I wasn’t trying to compromise the scripture at all, but indeed you can’t deny the situation happens in the other side of the world, even US has so many churches and believers being the sheep that you can’t simply just categorise them into “sinful, evil, unelected” and it’s not helpful at all. I’m talking about the places that gospel is hard to be heard and people suffer for going to church or call them Christians. You were basically say an evil one has been leading a church that the fruits of Holy Spirit have definitely been seen bearing, or you saying that the whole thing and people there were being nothing but evil. I can tell you that it’s not the heart of gospel and the churches are not running as simple as you imagine.
@@kristenmarie8655 sis it’s not like “brave, reformed answer” it’s simply misunderstanding and useless …
@@nathans8178 brother not mean to be harsh, but I do believe the bible covers everything we need to know no matter what kind of situation it will be, and there's more than just condemning certain people or situation
Thanks Todd
Seriously! Calling this a secondary issue is the finger behind which people are hiding behind to get a pass on ordaining female pastors!?! I came out a church that was ordaining women.. and was hypercharasmatic with new revelations bursting forth every other week. I asked my youth pastor the justification for women pastors. Was told there is neither Jew nor Greek, male nor female. At the time i accepted it. 13yrs later (a long time for sure) i read that verse and remember that conversation and i shake my head. Its not that i didnt read e bible then. It was that i didn't know how to read it. No one took the time to teach how to read the bible. But we were encouraged to read it. My conclusion: Congregants remain deceived when they literally feed from the hands of church leaders and have no basic hermeneutic skills to interpret scripture themselves. Secondly false teachers are themselves blind to the truth or deliberately deceive leading sheep astray.
Amen!
Yeah exactly, secondary issues are not unimportant issues. It's not about salvation, but certainly about how we serve the God who saved us. That's very important also, so to contrast primary and secondary issues is very much to miss the point.
Rick Warren is a false teacher. He should have been kicked out of the SBC a long time ago, along with many others. I’m disgusted by all of this. I stick to God’s Word. Many in the SBC have accepted CRT, sexual abuse, which is criminal, not just a church issue. I love Voddie Baucham and Tom Ascol. They should be in charge. The SBC is now a political body.
I know a woman pastor whose husband is a lay believer. I honestly have no idea who is the spiritual leader in that household.
There is nothing secondary about this issue. Going against the word of God is the only Issue. If you don't stick to the main thing which is to stand on the word of God,
"Luk 4:4 And Jesus answered him, saying, It is written, That man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word of God. "
then you are building your house on sand and it will come crumbling down.
Jesus is come for his bride soon and a lot of Christians are going to be wondering why they are left behind, and the truth will be because they pastors did not get them ready and preach the sound word of God and they became luke warm or they were false converts. Which is sad to say about 90 percent of professing Christians.
You’re correct, and unfortunately all southern baptists deny the baptism in the Holy Spirit and that signs wonders and healing still happens today, stay ready our King is coming
@@johnotto4931 that’s dumb, no we don’t!
@@thomassellers3813 you don’t what ?
@@johnotto4931 what you said.
@@thomassellers3813 I don’t know about EVERY Baptist denomination but people like Charles Stanley (who runs/ran one of the largest baptist churches completely deny the baptism in the Holy Spirit, speaking in tongues and healings,
This is a serious compromise of scripture.
I just left an SBC church in Jan 2022 over that AND its refusal to preach about sin in the pulpit. "Those are political issues. Someone might be offended. We have men in this church who are struggling with homosexuality." What about porn?!? 😳 Abortion? Women wearing mini skirts on the stage up to their privates leading in song?!?
God will spue these churches out of His mouth!
Rick Warren went off the rails long ago…..
He's got a successor now.
Yes, a husband and wife team. I’m not encouraged
I love this argument. Thank you, Wretched Radio.