They're also boring. Like if I'm doing extra turns, it's either gonna be unfair bullshit like Savor the Moment and Timesifter, or something funny like Temporal Mastery and Bird Tribal Epiphany.
@pat1989ize I agree. I play to win. There are times where it is fun to try wacky stuff together at the table but most games its play to win. If someone has an expensive high powered deck then they becomes the main target. That is how you solve the issue and not by telling others how to build their decks imo
I played it once and no one wanted to play along so they didn't pick anything and I just overpaid for a reclamation sage. I've since taken it out, looking for a deck to put it back in though
@@nicholasbritton8840 Sure, but my point is that enchantments and artifacts having hexproof/shroud is fairly rare and not something you'd come across in most games.
I've been playing commander for YEARS and somehow this is the first time I've ever even heard of Tragic Arrogance. Like, how have I never seen this card before?! Literally ordering some right now!
You play single combat in voltron so you're not forced to sac your board full of artifacts and auras. The secondary effect is also relevant as it allows you to get multiple hits in without dealing with too many blockers.
This. I play it over Tragic Arrogance in voltron for this very reason. Now, outside of that niche, I would never recommend it over the Tragic Arrogance.
I run Ophiomancer in my Meren deck and it does some serious work, it's amazing and when I have decided to include it I was surprised not many people did run it. I used to have Druid of purification in my Meren deck too but ultimately with the last updates I had to cut it but I really love the card it is absolutely incredible value only reason I run Reclamation sage over it in my Meren deck is because rec sage is skullclampable, if druid had 1 thoughness It would be absolutely in there.
I put it into my satoru ninjutsu deck. No one wants to lose a creature to a 1/1 that will be replaced next upkeep. It's always a benefit whether or not it's blocked!
Most mono white decks I would want to play are either heavily invested in artifacts or enchantments. I don't want to sac all but one of my equipment or all but one of my auras just to get rid of my opponents stuff. Probably why Tragic Arrogance isn't highly played. Also means sacrificing all your mana rocks which is white's main source of ramp so your opponents will rebuild faster than you will if they've land ramped.
Tragic Arrogance is absolute dogshit. Every time I see it resolve it's just... not good enough. It's the type of card that's high value in super durdly battlecruiser metas, in which this card would hit the player who is casting it just as much. I would rather play Austere Command in that slot for just 1 more mana and be able to bend my strategy around it.
i don't agree with a lot of their takes on white cards. they seem to either way over value or undervalue a card that i'm of the opposite opinion of. i think tragic arrogance sucks, but then again i kind of hate all board wipes.
I view tragic as a strong card, I get that yes in the few decks that focus on a permanent type, yes don't run it. But they're meaning overall, not talking about the white enchantress or equipment decks. Tragic arrogance is honestly strong in any power level that isn't cedh, I've played it in any mono white and multicolored deck with white that didn't focus on enchantments or artifacts, I've even thrown it in decks that focused on creatures, which I'd argue is more of a detriment, in the lower power combat only metas I'd say it's at its weakest as you remove your main source of advantage. But when you're playing from like 5 power and up its strongggg
Tragic Arrogance is a good card, but it's also a white card that destroys whatever white wants to do as a colour. Trying to ramp? You'll lose your ramp artifacts. Trying to go wide? You'll lose your board. It's probably insane in some kind of two or three coloured deck that aims to spellsling, like Jeskai or something. Basically, decks that don't fight on the board
This comment seems obvious to me. It hurts my brain to try and think of a reason they would be so high on it. I don’t want to be destroying my permanents. Ever. I hate it! I’d rather play gearhulk.
I knew one of you guys would come around on ghostly prison as soon as you started playing more combat centric decks. It’s three mana, triggers enchantresses, and says no one can go wide on you.
And you get so many instances of "Attack for 7 in the air." "You gonna pay the 4 for that?" "Nevermind." Even better if they attack someone else, but either way.
Great video y'all! I'm gonna try and make the case for Divine Reckoning over Tragic Arrogance: Voltron! I'm currently working on a Light-Paws list (mono w voltron) and divine reckoning let's me keep my big voltron commander and all the auras on it as opposed to TA which will make me choose one (1) aura and sac the rest. Outside of that I don't see a reason for why you'd pick DR over TA
That's kind of where I'm at with Single Combat too. In a voltron deck, I don't really care about keeping more than one creature alive and having two chances to swing at a mostly empty board should decide the game before the tempo loss from being the last to replay creatures matters.
@@prometheus4257 in that case I'd recommend you also take a look at Slash The Ranks, gets rid of all creatures other than commanders so in my opinion it's even better than Single Combat cause if someone's commander isn't out it sweeps everything they have and if the commander was a core piece to their strategy they'd pick it with single combat anyways
Make sure you have Lier in the blue deck you use those extra turns spells for extra brutality. For those who don't know, he gives every spell in the yard Flashback 😬
I feel the reason ophiomancer isn't in more Decks is because for a long time it only had one printing and it was expensive, heck the market price for the original still in the teens but the commander black versions about eight bucks so I would look for it to proliferate a little longer and it'll come around to being close to a staple I think
Ok, so I have some opinions on these cards. Tragic Arrogance is good. It is one of the best sweepers in the format. It is underplayed, but that is likely due to it not exactly doing what the decks playing it would want. A Voltron deck doesn't want it because they end up losing most of their enchantments or artifacts. A deck that goes big likely wouldn't run it unless they had a threat so strong that it would just win. Oh, and if you're in Mardu, you can just play Mythos of Snapdax and save a mana. This sweeper is conditional enough that tuned, refined decks likely won't touch it in most scenarios. You wonder why Divine Reckoning and Single Combat are played over this? They don't ruin a Voltron strategy. Austere Command saves more of your stuff. Token decks would much rather play Hour of Reckoning over Tragic Arrogance. Specifically good is better than genetically good in many cases. Still underplayed, but not the 2nd best sweeper. Temporal Manipulation is what, $20? Time Warp is $10. Time Warp is strictly worse, but the price is the deciding factor. Some groups also despise extra turn spells, even though these cards are amazing. I'd mostly agree with you, however. Combat Celebrant is decent, but it's on a flimsy creature. Unless you're in Humans, Warriors, or infinite combats, it's just a generically good card that isn't as good as something with synergy. Emrakul is good if you can fuel Delirium or if you play big spells, but this is just Battle cruiser magic. Many games end before she hits nowadays. Strong effect, but 13, or even 9-10 is too much for it. Also the price is crazy. Rallier is decent, but you need targets for it. I'd say that it is appropriately played because of how niche it is. Thanks for bringing it up and reminding me of it. Secure the Wastes is a one time thing, and most token decks would rather use March of the Multitudes because they're mostly in Selesnya+. You should only run one per deck, and unless you're in a White, non-Green deck, you have few reasons to run it. I don't run it in my tokens, because I have March. Again, Calligrapher is meh. It's good, but you would only run this in a political or token deck. Adeline does the same for tokens, but it doesn't give your opponents tokens. Maybe if should see more play, but meh. Druid is strictly better than Reclamation sage, and I would agree that Druid needs to see more play. However, many decks would rather play Foundation Breaker for the evoke. I agree with this being an excellent card that needs more play. It's good with reanimator, blink, Humans, and so on. And everyone loves it. I don't play it, but that's because there are some synergies that I play that make this slightly worse. Snuff Out is just a budget Deadly Rollick. I'd rather play a regular removal spell honestly. Infernal Grasp, Go for the Throat, Heartless Act... there's better cards. The removal slot is tight and Deadly Rollick and some generic removal spells will beat this every time. Good in very budget black decks, but I'd honestly only play this over Doom Blade. Ophiomancer is good, mostly in sacrifice decks. Sometimes token decks, especially with Divine Visitation. Pretty niche otherwise, so I'd say appropriately played. This list assumes that synergy is not as strong if not stronger than raw power. It's not.
I only play Time Warp in my Brago deck. Mainly because getting infinite extra turns is my backup win con and I have some trouble finding what to cut for the second copy. I am sure I could find something to swap out to fit the Temporal Manipulation in. However I never really seen the need. If my Altar of the Brood combo gets bricked I have enough card draw or tutors to find the other combo.
YES! And thank you on tragic arrogance. I’m not even gonna try to convince my playgroup; I’ll just be running the best board wipes and they…won’t. I’ll just scoop up a dozen copies and trade them when peeps wake up on the card. Now (May 2022) Temporal manipulation is a solid ~$10 more than Time warp (recently bought the latter and not the former. Keep up the great work on the videos, we love you!
The extra turn spells I play are Stitch in Time, Karn's Temporal Sundering and Walk the Eons. They're in a deck that wants to copy instants and sorceries, so multiple extra turns can happen. However, Stitch in Time does so by coin flip, so the extra copies are just to ensure a god coin flip. Karn's Temporal Sundering and Walk the Eons both let me target a player for an extra turn. Should I have 3 extra turns to give away thanks to copies, my preferred method is to skip on the one player who is ahead in the game (after me) and give all other players an extra turn in turn order. That way, it's more like I forced the player who's ahead to skip a turn and less like I took all the turns away from everybody.
The problem I have when building decks isn't that I don't find the good cards or the underplayed cards. No, the problem I have is that a deck is only 100 cards... Not.. Uh, 600 cards. 😂 I dig out everything that is good with a commander and I end up with a desk full of cards that I then have to cut away from. Tear by tear I cry for each card I delete hehe.
Some token makers you forgot along the lines of Secure the Wastes, are White Sun's Zenith, and March of the Multitudes, wich also are in 2% of decks and are instant speed. Yes WSZ asks you two extra white mana but it gives two twos and that is quite the difference, and March asks for GWW but has convoke and gives lifelinking one ones. I play all of them in my Emmara, Soul of the Accord deck, where I try hard to make my creatures to be able to tap for mana, and then I dump it all in token makers, untap, overrun effect and win.
I've run both in conjunction with Secure The Wastes, and those extra mana in the cost of WSZ make a huuuuuge difference. For the price of 1 2/2, you could get 3 1/1s, and usually in a token deck you want as many bodies as you can make, because you're often using them in various ways (The biggest being mana production with Song of Freyalise, Jian Yanggu, or Cryptolith Rite). March, on the other hand, is insane and overperforms for me most of the time. Secure is better at helping you come back from behind, as well. 2W gets you 2 tokens with Secure, while you get nothing with WSZ or March if you have no board (after a wipe, for instance, or if you've been mana screwed).
Tragic Arrogance is my go to White board wipe. I love that you can select the same item for multiple things, which hoses artifact creature ore enchantment creature decks (have this Thopter and nothing else). Single Combat is not as terrible as you make it out to be, especially in Voltron decks or decks you want to keep your artifacts/enchantments. Sure, they get to pick their favorite thing, but it still ends up devastating numerous strategies (I resolved it against a deck that was turning lands into creatures left and right. They scooped). That said, outside Voltron or Gishath, I prefer Tragic Arrogance.
@@NitpickingNerds Like I said, in Voltron, it is a go to. Tragic Arrogance and Vanquish the Horde will actively ruin my strategy (TA by removing my equipment/auras, VtH by killing my Voltron'd creature). Outside Voltron and a few other cases, it is bad. But hosing my opponents more than I am hosing myself is absolutely the point of that card. I wish the caster got to choose what creature/Planeswalker their opponents keep though.
Before watching the video, some cards I find VERY underplayed: Soothsaying, for decks that want to control the top of their deck, this is a must include. Into the Core: For any non green or white deck, this is a way to exile two artifacts, this is at four mana, and instant speed!
Tried Snuff Out a few weeks ago. 100% endorse using it. Most black decks have some form of life gain anyway...like the best-etb-almost-honorable-mention-Gary.
I'll throw out that I do play Divine Reckoning and Single Combat in my Wyleth, Soul of Steel deck. The downside of Tragic Arrogance in that deck is forcing me to cut down to 2 equipments and/or auras, vs the first two allow me to keep Wyleth's full modification stack and still remove all but one blocker (which is usually a non-issue due to his inherent trample).
Secure the Wastes needs an Oracle text revision. If it were Human Warriors (like Call the Coppercoats is Human Soldiers), it would be so much easier to slot into Human tribal decks. And Renegade Rallier probably would benefit from a reprint in a Commander-focused product. As an uncommon from a set I didn't play much of, I wasn't familiar with the card.
I'm not playing several of these because of budget concerns. I might upgrade into them, eventually, but the monetary cost is noteworthy for them going into an initial draft. But I will note Tragic Arrogance and Renegade Rallier as good budget options going forward.
Tragic Arrogance definitely an old card I ran in budget decks, definitely an underrated card for sure. Haven't ran it in recent times due to white not being overly present in any decks but so pretty good.
Martyr's Cause is the #1 card I stan for in the "combat metagame". It's so useful to be able to just say "No", untargettably, to any damage, on a free sac outlet. Completely bricks Hexproof Voltron guys against you without destroying them so they get sent at your opponents. Plays politics for saving opponents and their good stuff/Stax pieces that are keeping your other opponents in check. Saves half your board from Blasphemous Act. Keeps Narset/Kaalia type creatures attacking safely. Is it as all encompassing as Teferi's Protection? No. Can you set it and pass without having to hold up 3 mana every turn? Yes. Does it require tokens or value creatures? Yes. Is it for every deck? No. But for any deck that makes 1/1's and thus can't easily deal with X/X Tramplers, it shines. Make a 'Play These Instead of Ghostly Prison' video and include it, please. Maybe it will finally get a reprint- not that the art of bad, but I'd love to see what a modern day painter could make.
Just used your affiliate link to buy a Kamigawa bundle, hope y'all see a cut of that action! As for me, I just wanna crack those packs and then gaze into that totally sick splatter galaxy spindown d20!
As the proud owner of an Emrakul, the Promsied End deck, I humbly request the unbanning of Emrakul, the Aeons Torn because I agree in a multiplayer setting, the former is often as or more impactful than the latter for less mana.
Annihilator is one of the worst most feel bad mechanics they ever made. I prefer a very very limited ban list but even I see the reasoning on that one.
@@starmanda88 I am sympathetic to the argument that it becomes the best thing to cheat into play to get an attack trigger, because it does have protection from almost all instant speed interaction. From a power level perspective I have a hard time feeling like it is a justified banning. I can see what you are saying about Annihilator being a very "feel bad" mechanic though. I play in a variety of metas, one in which MLD is quite common. So I probably am in a bit of a bubble. In most circumstances where you aren't hard casting EtAT, the player gets 1 trigger out of an attack at most, I can imagine. Sure, this is backbreaking for the opponent taking the hit. You could argue there are niche circumstances where you can reanimate EtAT as well. It's just hard for me to imagine the card being so egregious at the 7-9 power level I'm used to playing at. I have played my deck once under rule 0 with EtAT as the commander and I admit it was quite strong and won me the game, but I did spend 15 mana on that, which could be getting you a Time Stretch and a follow up.
My arguments for some of the other boardwipes you mention as worse than Tragic arrogance: Divine reckoning is pretty decent in Voltron though. You're usually obviously just focused on 1 creature anyway. Fumigate obviously has a place in lifegain Love your content!.
The answer to why a lot of these cards arent in more decks is fairly obvious, price. Either much more than equivalent effects or just flat out expensive e.g. Emrakul is the price of a full budget deck
Surprised the convoke version of secure the wastes wasnt mentioned. Cost two more, but your token deck can tap tokens to pay for it (also it's tokens gain lifelink). Love doubling up. Make 22 tokens at end step, then tap them to make 19 more. My favorite thing to do in magic is 2 for 1 myself lol 😂😂
Druid is hilarious. Every time I play it I have to remind them it cant hit my stuff after the table is done doing their touchdown dances and then they cry.
I run both in different decks, single combat is interesting because of the no cast creature clause and i prefer to run it in lower power pods, tragic arrogance is such a dlam dunk it should be in every single voltron deck even those running lots of artifacts/enchantments, single combat is a fine card but in power its not close to tragic aggorance.
I wish channels like this would talk about Viridian Revel. Almost every single game I play, I'll draw at least 15 cards if not more. It's completely insane and in my opinion, way better than Rhystic Study
@@NitpickingNerds have you ever stuck it in a deck? If not I would highly recommend you try it. There are some games where you maybe only 2 or 3 cards, but those are extremely rare games. Even in attack Meta's it can be good. I would say on average I probably draw 7 cards per game. And that's on the low end. There are many, many times where you draw 15 or more in a game. It also acts as a deterrent in matches where someone is playing lots of artifacts or are generating a bunch of Treasures because they don't want to sac 7 treasures to cast a spell. Or let's say someone plays a Ruinous Ultimatum or an Hour of Revelation. If your opponents have any artifacts at all, which is very likely, it will see all of those triggers before being destroyed. It's just a silly card. I could rant about how good it actually is in commander for hours.
Due to my reputation in my playgroups, no one will ever work with me if I have any chance of being ahead when I cast Druid of Purification. I've only ever gotten 1 permanent with it. I am off the card now. lol
My first modern deck was boros land destruction. When you destroy all the lands all the time prison becomes pretty great. Then again, thats not really a scenario you see alot in edh.
my playgroup specifically will only pick the same targets I pick when playing cards like druid of purification. So I haven't been able to use these to the maximum effect
Single combat and Divine reckoning are pretty good in voltron decks. It’s basically one sided and if you have a bunch of equipment and auras you don’t want to choose one. I have both of those cards in my Light-Paws build
Also, sidenote* At $0.90 Maelstrom Pulse is a token wipe at instant which can also deal with anything non-land. I see it on a same plane as generous gift/beast Within due to the fact lands are 99% never chosen for those spells
Secure the Wastes does go up to 36% when you filter by token decks, which is probably about right as frequently the creature type and/or the token quality also matters in token decks, and 1/1 warrior tokens are pretty bland, and have limited synergies.
I dropped Druid once and only blew up one thing despite there being a fair number of possible targets. I also sometimes run into problems with Will of the Council where they only vote for what I voted for even if there is other threats we could spread out on with some talking. Sometimes pods just kinda get so 'friendly' about not taking advantage of the mass removal that they just kinda come off as dicks for refusing to help clear problems any.
I feel like black removal that cannot target black creatures to be useless. Just look at the top 12 commanders on ehdrec. Only 3 of them dont have black pips. My local meta is heavy on black as well. Also recently precons seem to be black more than half of the time as well.
I personally think ‘Hallow’ is criminally underrated and here’s why: Its 1 white mana Its instant speed You gain life for “ALL” the damage prevented from a target “spell” Spells are “ANYTHING” besides lands when cast or on the stack Hallow can target “ANYTHING” being cast or on the stack. besides lands. Big scary creatures with haste that you know are going to swing. “hallow” Big scary damage spell that’s going to hit everyone for 10 damage. “hallow” You need to think outside the box. A spammy goblin deck is setting up something suspicious and goes to cast Impact Tremors and you’re scared of nuclear token spam and high damage. “hallow” To the same degree, an insane graveyard recursion deck is setting up a graveyard play and casts Burning Vengeance. “hallow” Someone casts a planeswalker in a proliferate deck and your scared they’re going to Ultimate them for damage the turn they come in. (ex: a Chandra etc) “hallow” Someone goes to cast “Earthquake for X=10” there’s 10+ creatures on the battlefield “hallow” then smile and wave boys, smile and wave, as you gain 100+ life… oh and stop your board from getting wiped… oh and you happen to have Sanguine Bond down and kill someone. Someone casts Blasphemous Act on a 3 creature board like a weirdo. “hallow” You laugh and gain 39 life for 1 mana… Wait you were dreaming and they actually cast it on a board with 15 creatures….. Someone with a scary big creature’s deck is setting up something, and next turn plays Warstorm Surge. “hallow” … either completely negates their turn at the worst and buys you time. Or they still play creatures and you gain life. Someone has a Purphoros the Bronze Blooded deck and pays 3 to cast Bloodfire Colossus. “hallow” Then watch them be sad because you ruined their cool play. (True story) Someone is Playing Bruse Tarl and goes to play their finisher with Haste/Flying late game, you’re dead… but then “hallow” pick a different creature sorry. Someone goes to play that sick Malignus / Chandra’s Ignition / (any damage doubler in the game) combo to kill everyone… “hallow” :D Someone goes to play ANY CARD that is a threat of dealing immediate damage to you or ANYONE ELSE. “hallow” Worst case scenario is casting it on a lightning bolt or a 3-damage haste dork and gaining 3 life, but also stopping the damage in the process and possibly triggering life gain abilities. On average in most decks, you might only get a chance to cast it to gain anywhere between 3-6 life and stop some damage at the WORST. But at the BEST it’s a 1 mana spell to completely ruin someone’s end game turn or even better GAIN AN INSANE AMOUNT OF LIFE and stop that board wipe and ruin someone’s end game plan. What about someone playing mono black with a Vorpal Sword down and they go to play their sneaky Vengeful Reaper and… sorry not today Satan. “hallow” Someone is playing a Niv-Mizzet Parun deck, you’ve already killed him once and they cast him again and you’re certain they have an infinite draw / damage combo in their hand and you can’t counter it… “hallow” What if they wanted to draw cards still? Well now that’s 1 life to you for each one and you live another turn. Okay that’s getting REAL specific but you get my point. Even if it’s just to buy yourself some time at the worst that’s not too bad, especially deep into late game. It can be used in a lot of decks as filler or even replace a card in the right deck. It’s a super budget friendly card that frankly I think a lot of budget players (usually more casual players) don’t even know this card exists and should add it to their collection. I think the card should see more play and 0% of decks on EDHREC is criminal in my opinion. How are you not including this in some life gain decks? On that note, YES THERE ARE BETTER CARDS. The post is about under rated cards and I believe “Hallow” definitely fits that description. P.s. Its in my Licia lifegain deck and it wins games. P.s.s. maybe there is a reason Wizards has only printed it once Hmmmmm…
The problem with hallow is what it doesnt hit. Doesnt hit torment of hailfire, since its tecnically not damage, doesnt hit mill/thassa's oracle, hits aristocrats.. a little, maybe. Opponent makes 2545837 scute swarm tokens? you gain one life, and take 2545836 damage, this applies to every token/go wide strategy btw, specially with craterhoof. It also doesnt hit storm. It basically only does something against big dumb red spells, blasphemous act, and voltron, the rest of the time, which is most of the time depending on your meta, its a 1 mana gain 6-8 life, maybe save a creature from a bolt or smth, which is not a playable card, even in lifegain decks there are better ways to do it. If it was a cantrip it would be nice tho, specially in mono white, your cards need to do more than your opponents cards, because you most likely will have less cards to play with than them because of low card draw.
Since seeing you two chat about Tragic Arrogance a while ago and seeing the meta game at the LGS warp to creature/artifact heavy decks, I've since slotted it into every one of my decks that has plains in it. That and Hallowed Burial! Puts in the work and lets you politick the table to make allies against someone filling their board or exact revenge. Hoping it doesn't catch on quickly in the shop meta 😅
@@joshholmes1372 yeah I guess that qualifies. But I was thinking more like cards they’ve shifted opinions on, like they weren’t “wrong” about maze of ith or ghostly prison per say, but they played it and maybe see it differently. I guess it’s kind of similar
Snuff Out needs to go in every Vial Smasher deck. How is it not in there already? It’s basically a doom blade that costs “Phyrexian Phyrexian”, but with vial smasher it also deals 4 damage lol so the life swing is less of a big deal.
Wait, there are playgroups that *don’t* live in fear of someone activating Tragic Arrogance? That card is one of the biggest threats in my group’s meta.
I put snuff out in all my black decks. Even above 3 colors. I dont play with budget in consideration, so maybe thats why, but i put fetches, duals and shocks in all my decks so if i play a black spell, i have a swamp. It doesnt say basic so there is no drawback if you dont take budget in consideration
You know what is crazy? I'm sat in my lgs watching this video with headphones in and on the TV in the shop that doesn't have sound it's that same 14 year old spongebob episode 👀
Sphere of safety I think is better in an enchantress deck than ghostly prison. Its more mana but it makes your opponent have to tap out to attack you with a single creature.
Isn’t the problem with combat calligrapher that your opponents are also making a bunch of free 2/1 that can eventually attack you (once the bird dies) seems like a trap, but I’ve also not played the card.
If tragic arrogance was for only opponents, I would be much higher on it. Sure, you get a bit of an edge in some way, but you oftentimes sacrifice a lot more than you would like while allowing your opponents to keep some useful things at times of clogged boards. Edit: Okay, yeah, people should not be playing Cleansing Nova over Tragic Arrogance lol.
[Builds a Kelsien deck just to run Mythos of Snapdax] Tragic Arrogance: Exists "OH, OKAY." Although I'm very happy with Kelsien, and the one mana savings is nice.
@@NitpickingNerds Yeah, I either got a copy for the deck or it was on my list, but I just straight up didn't know about it until I got the Silverquill precon.
I think Hour of Revelation is underplayed. WWW for a nonland board wipe is criminally easy to rebuild and most importantly the guy with a million treasures and enchantments can be set back. A true catch-up card.
I wish you guys had a Cardkingdom link. I hate waiting on 12-15 days shipping times from TCG. I order spicey singles from them, but my bulk and deck-building orders all come from CK because they come in quickly and all together in one shipment. I always feel guilty though when I do it. The voice in my head's always like "but the Nerds!"
@@aydjent They may come before the 12-15, but I don't ever even want to take a chance on it being that long. If it's even possible to have a two-week wait, I'd rather just not. It's also important to me that everything I order come in one delivery, which is hit or miss with TCG. If there were any option to pay for expedited shipping with TCG, I'd overlook the multiple packages, but even the possibility of a 15 day delivery window is pretty much a non-starter for me, especially CK and my LGS can get me what I need so much more quickly. I do support the Nerds in my own way, though.
I just will say one thing: Thise video should be calles "you should play this card is you are in North america .... ", as a south american, Chilean to be exact, yeah we would love to have access to all those cards, but many of us that love commander we dont have a chance to many of those cards, bc we are not a major market so places like tgcplayer dont ship cards to us, and im gonna guess that happenes to many other places too. And yeah i mean i will guess the mayority of viewers are NA/EU, so most of them can get those cards, yada yada, but yeah we want many of those "no one plays those cards but we want to use them" but for mater of we dont have that many supply we cant. Just a rant, still love your content and you give me ideas for my decks, but all those "good cards" many times i cant get them, even if are less than 50 cents, i can get them and i feel little envy.
Hour of Revelation is better than Tragic Arrogance imo, because it’s 3 mana. It’s the best board wipe in my playgroup, period. We play it even in 3 colors and it always overperform. It became way better now that creatures are played less and there are tons of permanents on the board all the time.
Just used your affiliate link to order a few of these. 😎 Wondering if you have any thoughts on Thaumatic Compass which is ramp in any color and then turns into a Maze of Ith that creates mana. Seems really good, especially for a $2 card.
Light-Paws (Mono-White) does not like Tragic Arrogance, need Divine Reckoning and Winds of Rath instead. This is that instance where you always take DR over Tragic Arrogance and don't even consider it in the 99.
What about night soil it has 0% only 2000 decks. In my opinion it is one of the best graveyard hate cards out there main reason the removal is the cost of the card so it can't be interacted with when you activate it but can be used to interact with any other card since cost has to be paid first.
If you play 3(Mardu) colors or more, would you say that Mythos of Snapdax is better than Tragic Arrogance? I want to play a 5-Color deck an struggle to decide if I want to include MoS or TA.
You guys act like you've never read the bottom text of Single Combat. If you can find any of the super easy ways of playing the spell every turn, it's basically like taking infinite turns but not really so nobody can actually get too salty. They can still play the game, just not by casting creatures or planeswalkers.
Love snuff out but a lot of the multicolour or splash black decks probably don't run it incase they can't turn on the free mode. My dimir zombies only has 4 cards with the swamp type as an example due to field of the dead. I'd play it in mono black not tergrid though.
I've had my day ruined by a Purification Druid and the whole table recognizing that maybe my Necropotence, Aetherflux, and Venser's Journal were a sign of trouble to come.
Another excellent video! Thanks guys! Combat Celebrant seems like a useful extra combat card in Ghired. Currently running Aurelia and Godo with Helm of the Host, 3 mana just seems to good to not pass up on!
I don’t like tragic arrogance in my white decks because my lists tend to be very high on artifacts and especially enchantments. I want to be killing creatures because I am breaking parity with those effects, but I am often hurting myself by balancing enchantments and artifacts
You forgot to include Farewell when comparing it to tragic arrogance.
I played tragic arrogance before but since we have farewell, I don't use tragic arrogance anymore.
I think extra turn spells can be considered "unfun" in more casual metas might be why Temporal Manipulation doesn't seem to end up in more decks.
They're also boring. Like if I'm doing extra turns, it's either gonna be unfair bullshit like Savor the Moment and Timesifter, or something funny like Temporal Mastery and Bird Tribal Epiphany.
also its double the price
Casual meta = play to lose or play what the biggest sissy at the table wants you to play
@pat1989ize I agree. I play to win. There are times where it is fun to try wacky stuff together at the table but most games its play to win. If someone has an expensive high powered deck then they becomes the main target. That is how you solve the issue and not by telling others how to build their decks imo
But their argument isnt put temporal manipulation in more deck, its put it in the same decks you already have time warp in?
You guys make a bad day good and a good day better. Thank you for that.
Druid gets around hexproof which makes it god tier. It has never disappointed on a single use. Its an auto include for me in all green decks.
What artefacts and enchantments with hexproof are you seeing all the time? It’s not that common in my experience
@@julianvickers any time you play a sythis enchantress deck
@@nicholasbritton8840 yep. Enchantress decks making all their stuff hexproof. Its a great answer that isnt a full board wipe.
I played it once and no one wanted to play along so they didn't pick anything and I just overpaid for a reclamation sage. I've since taken it out, looking for a deck to put it back in though
@@nicholasbritton8840 Sure, but my point is that enchantments and artifacts having hexproof/shroud is fairly rare and not something you'd come across in most games.
I've been playing commander for YEARS and somehow this is the first time I've ever even heard of Tragic Arrogance. Like, how have I never seen this card before?! Literally ordering some right now!
Seen it before, just tend to forget it exists... Probably because noone plays it yeah xD
You play single combat in voltron so you're not forced to sac your board full of artifacts and auras. The secondary effect is also relevant as it allows you to get multiple hits in without dealing with too many blockers.
This. I play it over Tragic Arrogance in voltron for this very reason. Now, outside of that niche, I would never recommend it over the Tragic Arrogance.
I run Ophiomancer in my Meren deck and it does some serious work, it's amazing and when I have decided to include it I was surprised not many people did run it. I used to have Druid of purification in my Meren deck too but ultimately with the last updates I had to cut it but I really love the card it is absolutely incredible value only reason I run Reclamation sage over it in my Meren deck is because rec sage is skullclampable, if druid had 1 thoughness It would be absolutely in there.
I put it into my satoru ninjutsu deck. No one wants to lose a creature to a 1/1 that will be replaced next upkeep. It's always a benefit whether or not it's blocked!
Most mono white decks I would want to play are either heavily invested in artifacts or enchantments. I don't want to sac all but one of my equipment or all but one of my auras just to get rid of my opponents stuff. Probably why Tragic Arrogance isn't highly played. Also means sacrificing all your mana rocks which is white's main source of ramp so your opponents will rebuild faster than you will if they've land ramped.
Tragic Arrogance is absolute dogshit. Every time I see it resolve it's just... not good enough.
It's the type of card that's high value in super durdly battlecruiser metas, in which this card would hit the player who is casting it just as much. I would rather play Austere Command in that slot for just 1 more mana and be able to bend my strategy around it.
i don't agree with a lot of their takes on white cards. they seem to either way over value or undervalue a card that i'm of the opposite opinion of. i think tragic arrogance sucks, but then again i kind of hate all board wipes.
I view tragic as a strong card, I get that yes in the few decks that focus on a permanent type, yes don't run it. But they're meaning overall, not talking about the white enchantress or equipment decks. Tragic arrogance is honestly strong in any power level that isn't cedh, I've played it in any mono white and multicolored deck with white that didn't focus on enchantments or artifacts, I've even thrown it in decks that focused on creatures, which I'd argue is more of a detriment, in the lower power combat only metas I'd say it's at its weakest as you remove your main source of advantage. But when you're playing from like 5 power and up its strongggg
Tragic Arrogance is a good card, but it's also a white card that destroys whatever white wants to do as a colour. Trying to ramp? You'll lose your ramp artifacts. Trying to go wide? You'll lose your board.
It's probably insane in some kind of two or three coloured deck that aims to spellsling, like Jeskai or something. Basically, decks that don't fight on the board
This comment seems obvious to me. It hurts my brain to try and think of a reason they would be so high on it. I don’t want to be destroying my permanents. Ever. I hate it! I’d rather play gearhulk.
I knew one of you guys would come around on ghostly prison as soon as you started playing more combat centric decks. It’s three mana, triggers enchantresses, and says no one can go wide on you.
And you get so many instances of "Attack for 7 in the air."
"You gonna pay the 4 for that?"
"Nevermind."
Even better if they attack someone else, but either way.
snuff out should be an auto include in every vial smasher deck
Great video y'all!
I'm gonna try and make the case for Divine Reckoning over Tragic Arrogance: Voltron!
I'm currently working on a Light-Paws list (mono w voltron) and divine reckoning let's me keep my big voltron commander and all the auras on it as opposed to TA which will make me choose one (1) aura and sac the rest.
Outside of that I don't see a reason for why you'd pick DR over TA
That's kind of where I'm at with Single Combat too. In a voltron deck, I don't really care about keeping more than one creature alive and having two chances to swing at a mostly empty board should decide the game before the tempo loss from being the last to replay creatures matters.
@@prometheus4257 in that case I'd recommend you also take a look at Slash The Ranks, gets rid of all creatures other than commanders so in my opinion it's even better than Single Combat cause if someone's commander isn't out it sweeps everything they have and if the commander was a core piece to their strategy they'd pick it with single combat anyways
winds of rath is the best one then I´d say
@Nitpicking Nerds, I recommend including a list of the cards spoken about in the show notes for easy purchasing. If feasible, with the affiliate link!
It is something we have been meaning to do
Make sure you have Lier in the blue deck you use those extra turns spells for extra brutality. For those who don't know, he gives every spell in the yard Flashback 😬
It’s funny how many times I’ve gone “hey, this combos with combat celebrant!”
At the risk of sounding dramatic, I don’t know what I’d do without you guys
I feel the reason ophiomancer isn't in more Decks is because for a long time it only had one printing and it was expensive, heck the market price for the original still in the teens but the commander black versions about eight bucks so I would look for it to proliferate a little longer and it'll come around to being close to a staple I think
Ok, so I have some opinions on these cards.
Tragic Arrogance is good. It is one of the best sweepers in the format. It is underplayed, but that is likely due to it not exactly doing what the decks playing it would want. A Voltron deck doesn't want it because they end up losing most of their enchantments or artifacts. A deck that goes big likely wouldn't run it unless they had a threat so strong that it would just win. Oh, and if you're in Mardu, you can just play Mythos of Snapdax and save a mana. This sweeper is conditional enough that tuned, refined decks likely won't touch it in most scenarios. You wonder why Divine Reckoning and Single Combat are played over this? They don't ruin a Voltron strategy. Austere Command saves more of your stuff. Token decks would much rather play Hour of Reckoning over Tragic Arrogance. Specifically good is better than genetically good in many cases. Still underplayed, but not the 2nd best sweeper.
Temporal Manipulation is what, $20? Time Warp is $10. Time Warp is strictly worse, but the price is the deciding factor. Some groups also despise extra turn spells, even though these cards are amazing. I'd mostly agree with you, however.
Combat Celebrant is decent, but it's on a flimsy creature. Unless you're in Humans, Warriors, or infinite combats, it's just a generically good card that isn't as good as something with synergy.
Emrakul is good if you can fuel Delirium or if you play big spells, but this is just Battle cruiser magic. Many games end before she hits nowadays. Strong effect, but 13, or even 9-10 is too much for it. Also the price is crazy.
Rallier is decent, but you need targets for it. I'd say that it is appropriately played because of how niche it is. Thanks for bringing it up and reminding me of it.
Secure the Wastes is a one time thing, and most token decks would rather use March of the Multitudes because they're mostly in Selesnya+. You should only run one per deck, and unless you're in a White, non-Green deck, you have few reasons to run it. I don't run it in my tokens, because I have March.
Again, Calligrapher is meh. It's good, but you would only run this in a political or token deck. Adeline does the same for tokens, but it doesn't give your opponents tokens. Maybe if should see more play, but meh.
Druid is strictly better than Reclamation sage, and I would agree that Druid needs to see more play. However, many decks would rather play Foundation Breaker for the evoke. I agree with this being an excellent card that needs more play. It's good with reanimator, blink, Humans, and so on. And everyone loves it. I don't play it, but that's because there are some synergies that I play that make this slightly worse.
Snuff Out is just a budget Deadly Rollick. I'd rather play a regular removal spell honestly. Infernal Grasp, Go for the Throat, Heartless Act... there's better cards. The removal slot is tight and Deadly Rollick and some generic removal spells will beat this every time. Good in very budget black decks, but I'd honestly only play this over Doom Blade.
Ophiomancer is good, mostly in sacrifice decks. Sometimes token decks, especially with Divine Visitation. Pretty niche otherwise, so I'd say appropriately played.
This list assumes that synergy is not as strong if not stronger than raw power. It's not.
Yall are my favorites, thanks for all you do!
People do not like Extra turn spells in EDH that is why Temporal manipulation. I do need to put both in my Brago deck
Ugh my husband took like 5 extra turns the last time we played 😩 archenemy number 1 after all that. He plays brago too and man do I hate that deck 😂
@@starmanda88 youd HATE my jhoira deck
3 extra turns all just to storm you out on the third with 69420 grapeshots
I have a colorless deck with Emrakul as my commander and that card ends games easily.
Ophiomancer + Divine Visitation is my jam.
I only play Time Warp in my Brago deck. Mainly because getting infinite extra turns is my backup win con and I have some trouble finding what to cut for the second copy. I am sure I could find something to swap out to fit the Temporal Manipulation in. However I never really seen the need. If my Altar of the Brood combo gets bricked I have enough card draw or tutors to find the other combo.
Ophiomancer is a lot of fun with Divine Visitation, too (:
YES! And thank you on tragic arrogance. I’m not even gonna try to convince my playgroup; I’ll just be running the best board wipes and they…won’t. I’ll just scoop up a dozen copies and trade them when peeps wake up on the card.
Now (May 2022) Temporal manipulation is a solid ~$10 more than Time warp (recently bought the latter and not the former. Keep up the great work on the videos, we love you!
Not as recurrable, but Pir’s Whim should fall within the same conversation as Druid of Purification.
My addition is Fathom Fleet Swordjack. With the # of artifact tokens floating around now, this card can end games.
The extra turn spells I play are Stitch in Time, Karn's Temporal Sundering and Walk the Eons. They're in a deck that wants to copy instants and sorceries, so multiple extra turns can happen. However, Stitch in Time does so by coin flip, so the extra copies are just to ensure a god coin flip. Karn's Temporal Sundering and Walk the Eons both let me target a player for an extra turn. Should I have 3 extra turns to give away thanks to copies, my preferred method is to skip on the one player who is ahead in the game (after me) and give all other players an extra turn in turn order. That way, it's more like I forced the player who's ahead to skip a turn and less like I took all the turns away from everybody.
The problem I have when building decks isn't that I don't find the good cards or the underplayed cards. No, the problem I have is that a deck is only 100 cards... Not.. Uh, 600 cards. 😂 I dig out everything that is good with a commander and I end up with a desk full of cards that I then have to cut away from. Tear by tear I cry for each card I delete hehe.
Some token makers you forgot along the lines of Secure the Wastes, are White Sun's Zenith, and March of the Multitudes, wich also are in 2% of decks and are instant speed. Yes WSZ asks you two extra white mana but it gives two twos and that is quite the difference, and March asks for GWW but has convoke and gives lifelinking one ones. I play all of them in my Emmara, Soul of the Accord deck, where I try hard to make my creatures to be able to tap for mana, and then I dump it all in token makers, untap, overrun effect and win.
I've run both in conjunction with Secure The Wastes, and those extra mana in the cost of WSZ make a huuuuuge difference. For the price of 1 2/2, you could get 3 1/1s, and usually in a token deck you want as many bodies as you can make, because you're often using them in various ways (The biggest being mana production with Song of Freyalise, Jian Yanggu, or Cryptolith Rite). March, on the other hand, is insane and overperforms for me most of the time. Secure is better at helping you come back from behind, as well. 2W gets you 2 tokens with Secure, while you get nothing with WSZ or March if you have no board (after a wipe, for instance, or if you've been mana screwed).
Tragic Arrogance is my go to White board wipe. I love that you can select the same item for multiple things, which hoses artifact creature ore enchantment creature decks (have this Thopter and nothing else). Single Combat is not as terrible as you make it out to be, especially in Voltron decks or decks you want to keep your artifacts/enchantments. Sure, they get to pick their favorite thing, but it still ends up devastating numerous strategies (I resolved it against a deck that was turning lands into creatures left and right. They scooped). That said, outside Voltron or Gishath, I prefer Tragic Arrogance.
Single Combat is just so bad IMO. I can't see ever wanting off a budget
@@NitpickingNerds Like I said, in Voltron, it is a go to. Tragic Arrogance and Vanquish the Horde will actively ruin my strategy (TA by removing my equipment/auras, VtH by killing my Voltron'd creature). Outside Voltron and a few other cases, it is bad. But hosing my opponents more than I am hosing myself is absolutely the point of that card. I wish the caster got to choose what creature/Planeswalker their opponents keep though.
Before watching the video, some cards I find VERY underplayed:
Soothsaying, for decks that want to control the top of their deck, this is a must include.
Into the Core: For any non green or white deck, this is a way to exile two artifacts, this is at four mana, and instant speed!
Ooo I’ve never seen into the core before. That’s going in borborygmos for sure.
Tried Snuff Out a few weeks ago.
100% endorse using it. Most black decks have some form of life gain anyway...like the best-etb-almost-honorable-mention-Gary.
I'll throw out that I do play Divine Reckoning and Single Combat in my Wyleth, Soul of Steel deck. The downside of Tragic Arrogance in that deck is forcing me to cut down to 2 equipments and/or auras, vs the first two allow me to keep Wyleth's full modification stack and still remove all but one blocker (which is usually a non-issue due to his inherent trample).
Secure the Wastes needs an Oracle text revision. If it were Human Warriors (like Call the Coppercoats is Human Soldiers), it would be so much easier to slot into Human tribal decks. And Renegade Rallier probably would benefit from a reprint in a Commander-focused product. As an uncommon from a set I didn't play much of, I wasn't familiar with the card.
I'm not playing several of these because of budget concerns. I might upgrade into them, eventually, but the monetary cost is noteworthy for them going into an initial draft. But I will note Tragic Arrogance and Renegade Rallier as good budget options going forward.
Tragic Arrogance definitely an old card I ran in budget decks, definitely an underrated card for sure. Haven't ran it in recent times due to white not being overly present in any decks but so pretty good.
It is a card we still back even not on a budget
clarified decks of all time = past 2 yrs --- good stats got my like and subscribe good sir
Martyr's Cause is the #1 card I stan for in the "combat metagame". It's so useful to be able to just say "No", untargettably, to any damage, on a free sac outlet. Completely bricks Hexproof Voltron guys against you without destroying them so they get sent at your opponents. Plays politics for saving opponents and their good stuff/Stax pieces that are keeping your other opponents in check. Saves half your board from Blasphemous Act. Keeps Narset/Kaalia type creatures attacking safely.
Is it as all encompassing as Teferi's Protection? No. Can you set it and pass without having to hold up 3 mana every turn? Yes. Does it require tokens or value creatures? Yes. Is it for every deck? No. But for any deck that makes 1/1's and thus can't easily deal with X/X Tramplers, it shines. Make a 'Play These Instead of Ghostly Prison' video and include it, please. Maybe it will finally get a reprint- not that the art of bad, but I'd love to see what a modern day painter could make.
Nice tech. I’ve never seen nor heard of that card and that is really useful.
Just used your affiliate link to buy a Kamigawa bundle, hope y'all see a cut of that action! As for me, I just wanna crack those packs and then gaze into that totally sick splatter galaxy spindown d20!
content factory in full swing cranking out bangers
As the proud owner of an Emrakul, the Promsied End deck, I humbly request the unbanning of Emrakul, the Aeons Torn because I agree in a multiplayer setting, the former is often as or more impactful than the latter for less mana.
If you hardcast it, but if you cheat it in, Annihilator 6 is backbreaking, whereas 13 Flample damage is an admittedly threatening annoyance.
Annihilator is one of the worst most feel bad mechanics they ever made. I prefer a very very limited ban list but even I see the reasoning on that one.
@@starmanda88 I am sympathetic to the argument that it becomes the best thing to cheat into play to get an attack trigger, because it does have protection from almost all instant speed interaction.
From a power level perspective I have a hard time feeling like it is a justified banning. I can see what you are saying about Annihilator being a very "feel bad" mechanic though. I play in a variety of metas, one in which MLD is quite common. So I probably am in a bit of a bubble.
In most circumstances where you aren't hard casting EtAT, the player gets 1 trigger out of an attack at most, I can imagine. Sure, this is backbreaking for the opponent taking the hit. You could argue there are niche circumstances where you can reanimate EtAT as well. It's just hard for me to imagine the card being so egregious at the 7-9 power level I'm used to playing at. I have played my deck once under rule 0 with EtAT as the commander and I admit it was quite strong and won me the game, but I did spend 15 mana on that, which could be getting you a Time Stretch and a follow up.
@@XxTimesAreChangingxX i mean at an 8+ promised end isn't that great either since every deck running black starts to run ad nauseum
My arguments for some of the other boardwipes you mention as worse than Tragic arrogance:
Divine reckoning is pretty decent in Voltron though. You're usually obviously just focused on 1 creature anyway.
Fumigate obviously has a place in lifegain
Love your content!.
The answer to why a lot of these cards arent in more decks is fairly obvious, price. Either much more than equivalent effects or just flat out expensive e.g. Emrakul is the price of a full budget deck
Surprised the convoke version of secure the wastes wasnt mentioned. Cost two more, but your token deck can tap tokens to pay for it (also it's tokens gain lifelink). Love doubling up. Make 22 tokens at end step, then tap them to make 19 more.
My favorite thing to do in magic is 2 for 1 myself lol 😂😂
Druid is hilarious. Every time I play it I have to remind them it cant hit my stuff after the table is done doing their touchdown dances and then they cry.
Single Combat is amazing for voltron decks, as you keep your commander AND prevent new creatures from being cast for 4 turns.
I run both in different decks, single combat is interesting because of the no cast creature clause and i prefer to run it in lower power pods, tragic arrogance is such a dlam dunk it should be in every single voltron deck even those running lots of artifacts/enchantments, single combat is a fine card but in power its not close to tragic aggorance.
I wish channels like this would talk about Viridian Revel. Almost every single game I play, I'll draw at least 15 cards if not more. It's completely insane and in my opinion, way better than Rhystic Study
I think that card is very much a meta card. It is good but can be pretty dead in a lot of match ups
@@NitpickingNerds have you ever stuck it in a deck? If not I would highly recommend you try it. There are some games where you maybe only 2 or 3 cards, but those are extremely rare games. Even in attack Meta's it can be good. I would say on average I probably draw 7 cards per game. And that's on the low end. There are many, many times where you draw 15 or more in a game. It also acts as a deterrent in matches where someone is playing lots of artifacts or are generating a bunch of Treasures because they don't want to sac 7 treasures to cast a spell. Or let's say someone plays a Ruinous Ultimatum or an Hour of Revelation. If your opponents have any artifacts at all, which is very likely, it will see all of those triggers before being destroyed. It's just a silly card. I could rant about how good it actually is in commander for hours.
Coincidentally, I picked up Ophiomancer today! Will be a lot of fun in Juri!
I've cast Druid of Purification once ... and it only destroyed one person's permanent due to politics. Just saying, it happens ;)
Due to my reputation in my playgroups, no one will ever work with me if I have any chance of being ahead when I cast Druid of Purification. I've only ever gotten 1 permanent with it. I am off the card now. lol
My first modern deck was boros land destruction. When you destroy all the lands all the time prison becomes pretty great. Then again, thats not really a scenario you see alot in edh.
my playgroup specifically will only pick the same targets I pick when playing cards like druid of purification. So I haven't been able to use these to the maximum effect
How do I explain that I can't use Command Zone for my learning about edh content because y'all are simply more fun?
Single combat and Divine reckoning are pretty good in voltron decks. It’s basically one sided and if you have a bunch of equipment and auras you don’t want to choose one.
I have both of those cards in my Light-Paws build
Also, sidenote*
At $0.90 Maelstrom Pulse is a token wipe at instant which can also deal with anything non-land. I see it on a same plane as generous gift/beast Within due to the fact lands are 99% never chosen for those spells
It’s a sorcery not an instant, that’s why people tend to not like it too much
@@jetcell4517 OH shoot, you right. For some reason I thought it was instant. Which would make it an auto include
Secure the Wastes does go up to 36% when you filter by token decks, which is probably about right as frequently the creature type and/or the token quality also matters in token decks, and 1/1 warrior tokens are pretty bland, and have limited synergies.
I dropped Druid once and only blew up one thing despite there being a fair number of possible targets. I also sometimes run into problems with Will of the Council where they only vote for what I voted for even if there is other threats we could spread out on with some talking. Sometimes pods just kinda get so 'friendly' about not taking advantage of the mass removal that they just kinda come off as dicks for refusing to help clear problems any.
It is just strange to me how people turn down free removal
I feel like black removal that cannot target black creatures to be useless. Just look at the top 12 commanders on ehdrec. Only 3 of them dont have black pips. My local meta is heavy on black as well. Also recently precons seem to be black more than half of the time as well.
I totally agree with this, but coincidentally I'm the player who uses black more than anyone in my group. So cards like that totally work for me lol.
@@adamcappella8088 Yeah if your group is low on black then its fine but for me its at least 2 black decks every single damn time.
I personally think ‘Hallow’ is criminally underrated and here’s why:
Its 1 white mana
Its instant speed
You gain life for “ALL” the damage prevented from a target “spell”
Spells are “ANYTHING” besides lands when cast or on the stack
Hallow can target “ANYTHING” being cast or on the stack. besides lands.
Big scary creatures with haste that you know are going to swing. “hallow”
Big scary damage spell that’s going to hit everyone for 10 damage. “hallow”
You need to think outside the box.
A spammy goblin deck is setting up something suspicious and goes to cast Impact Tremors and you’re scared of nuclear token spam and high damage. “hallow”
To the same degree, an insane graveyard recursion deck is setting up a graveyard play and casts Burning Vengeance. “hallow”
Someone casts a planeswalker in a proliferate deck and your scared they’re going to Ultimate them for damage the turn they come in. (ex: a Chandra etc) “hallow”
Someone goes to cast “Earthquake for X=10” there’s 10+ creatures on the battlefield “hallow” then smile and wave boys, smile and wave, as you gain 100+ life… oh and stop your board from getting wiped… oh and you happen to have Sanguine Bond down and kill someone.
Someone casts Blasphemous Act on a 3 creature board like a weirdo. “hallow” You laugh and gain 39 life for 1 mana… Wait you were dreaming and they actually cast it on a board with 15 creatures…..
Someone with a scary big creature’s deck is setting up something, and next turn plays Warstorm Surge. “hallow” … either completely negates their turn at the worst and buys you time. Or they still play creatures and you gain life.
Someone has a Purphoros the Bronze Blooded deck and pays 3 to cast Bloodfire Colossus. “hallow” Then watch them be sad because you ruined their cool play. (True story)
Someone is Playing Bruse Tarl and goes to play their finisher with Haste/Flying late game, you’re dead… but then “hallow” pick a different creature sorry.
Someone goes to play that sick Malignus / Chandra’s Ignition / (any damage doubler in the game) combo to kill everyone… “hallow” :D
Someone goes to play ANY CARD that is a threat of dealing immediate damage to you or ANYONE ELSE. “hallow”
Worst case scenario is casting it on a lightning bolt or a 3-damage haste dork and gaining 3 life, but also stopping the damage in the process and possibly triggering life gain abilities.
On average in most decks, you might only get a chance to cast it to gain anywhere between 3-6 life and stop some damage at the WORST. But at the BEST it’s a 1 mana spell to completely ruin someone’s end game turn or even better GAIN AN INSANE AMOUNT OF LIFE and stop that board wipe and ruin someone’s end game plan.
What about someone playing mono black with a Vorpal Sword down and they go to play their sneaky Vengeful Reaper and… sorry not today Satan. “hallow”
Someone is playing a Niv-Mizzet Parun deck, you’ve already killed him once and they cast him again and you’re certain they have an infinite draw / damage combo in their hand and you can’t counter it… “hallow” What if they wanted to draw cards still? Well now that’s 1 life to you for each one and you live another turn.
Okay that’s getting REAL specific but you get my point. Even if it’s just to buy yourself some time at the worst that’s not too bad, especially deep into late game. It can be used in a lot of decks as filler or even replace a card in the right deck. It’s a super budget friendly card that frankly I think a lot of budget players (usually more casual players) don’t even know this card exists and should add it to their collection.
I think the card should see more play and 0% of decks on EDHREC is criminal in my opinion. How are you not including this in some life gain decks? On that note, YES THERE ARE BETTER CARDS. The post is about under rated cards and I believe “Hallow” definitely fits that description.
P.s. Its in my Licia lifegain deck and it wins games. P.s.s. maybe there is a reason Wizards has only printed it once Hmmmmm…
The problem with hallow is what it doesnt hit. Doesnt hit torment of hailfire, since its tecnically not damage, doesnt hit mill/thassa's oracle, hits aristocrats.. a little, maybe. Opponent makes 2545837 scute swarm tokens? you gain one life, and take 2545836 damage, this applies to every token/go wide strategy btw, specially with craterhoof. It also doesnt hit storm. It basically only does something against big dumb red spells, blasphemous act, and voltron, the rest of the time, which is most of the time depending on your meta, its a 1 mana gain 6-8 life, maybe save a creature from a bolt or smth, which is not a playable card, even in lifegain decks there are better ways to do it. If it was a cantrip it would be nice tho, specially in mono white, your cards need to do more than your opponents cards, because you most likely will have less cards to play with than them because of low card draw.
Since seeing you two chat about Tragic Arrogance a while ago and seeing the meta game at the LGS warp to creature/artifact heavy decks, I've since slotted it into every one of my decks that has plains in it. That and Hallowed Burial! Puts in the work and lets you politick the table to make allies against someone filling their board or exact revenge. Hoping it doesn't catch on quickly in the shop meta 😅
Between Ghostly Prison and Maze of Ith, a video about cards you’ve changed opinions on would be interesting
I think they recently did "cards we got wrong"
@@joshholmes1372 yeah I guess that qualifies. But I was thinking more like cards they’ve shifted opinions on, like they weren’t “wrong” about maze of ith or ghostly prison per say, but they played it and maybe see it differently. I guess it’s kind of similar
Although niche, I like Dusk//Dawn. Pretty good card advantage in white, good build around, great for hatebears decks.
Calligrapher seems super good so I was thinking 'Damn what if it's like 6 dollars?' but it turned out it's 40cent
I did not know renegade rallier existed. Love the card. Need it for my Karador deck.
It’s super useful in Karador!
Love the video guys. In regards to combat calligrapher, I have the red version in my jund goad deck. Rite of the Raging Storm is fantastic imho
I will always and forever advocate for Sadistic Sacrament in EDH. That card is lovely and I never see it played!
Snuff Out needs to go in every Vial Smasher deck. How is it not in there already? It’s basically a doom blade that costs “Phyrexian Phyrexian”, but with vial smasher it also deals 4 damage lol so the life swing is less of a big deal.
Wait, there are playgroups that *don’t* live in fear of someone activating Tragic Arrogance? That card is one of the biggest threats in my group’s meta.
I put snuff out in all my black decks. Even above 3 colors. I dont play with budget in consideration, so maybe thats why, but i put fetches, duals and shocks in all my decks so if i play a black spell, i have a swamp. It doesnt say basic so there is no drawback if you dont take budget in consideration
NEW NITPICKING NERDS VIDEO!
Err Day
Surprised to not see Wash Away on this 😉
The main problem with Druid of Purification is its a human not an elf.
Combat celebrant is an all star in Rionya fire dancer because only the hasty tokens attack and each new combat step creates a new one
Emrakul is most likely at a low percentage because its just not fun to play against and I assume it gets rule 0'd out of a lot of groups.
Tragic Arrogance is an absolute unit in my Zabaz modular tribal. Put tons of counters on Zabaz and fly over the 1/1 token I left you.
You know what is crazy? I'm sat in my lgs watching this video with headphones in and on the TV in the shop that doesn't have sound it's that same 14 year old spongebob episode 👀
Sphere of safety I think is better in an enchantress deck than ghostly prison. Its more mana but it makes your opponent have to tap out to attack you with a single creature.
Isn’t the problem with combat calligrapher that your opponents are also making a bunch of free 2/1 that can eventually attack you (once the bird dies) seems like a trap, but I’ve also not played the card.
If tragic arrogance was for only opponents, I would be much higher on it. Sure, you get a bit of an edge in some way, but you oftentimes sacrifice a lot more than you would like while allowing your opponents to keep some useful things at times of clogged boards.
Edit: Okay, yeah, people should not be playing Cleansing Nova over Tragic Arrogance lol.
Secure the Wastes is nuts in Winota decks.
[Builds a Kelsien deck just to run Mythos of Snapdax]
Tragic Arrogance: Exists
"OH, OKAY."
Although I'm very happy with Kelsien, and the one mana savings is nice.
Why not both!
@@NitpickingNerds Yeah, I either got a copy for the deck or it was on my list, but I just straight up didn't know about it until I got the Silverquill precon.
Combine ophiomancer with divine visitation. 4/4 flying vigillance angel every turn!
I think Hour of Revelation is underplayed. WWW for a nonland board wipe is criminally easy to rebuild and most importantly the guy with a million treasures and enchantments can be set back. A true catch-up card.
I wish you guys had a Cardkingdom link. I hate waiting on 12-15 days shipping times from TCG. I order spicey singles from them, but my bulk and deck-building orders all come from CK because they come in quickly and all together in one shipment. I always feel guilty though when I do it. The voice in my head's always like "but the Nerds!"
do you actually end up waiting 12-15 days? my tcgplayer singles usually arrive within 5 business days, and on rare occasion it takes 7/8
@@aydjent At least 10 to 12, yeah.
@@aydjent They may come before the 12-15, but I don't ever even want to take a chance on it being that long. If it's even possible to have a two-week wait, I'd rather just not. It's also important to me that everything I order come in one delivery, which is hit or miss with TCG. If there were any option to pay for expedited shipping with TCG, I'd overlook the multiple packages, but even the possibility of a 15 day delivery window is pretty much a non-starter for me, especially CK and my LGS can get me what I need so much more quickly. I do support the Nerds in my own way, though.
Can't wait to drop Night of Souls Betrayal against decks with Combat Celebrant combo lmao
Too bad they already went infinite before you could
I just will say one thing: Thise video should be calles "you should play this card is you are in North america .... ", as a south american, Chilean to be exact, yeah we would love to have access to all those cards, but many of us that love commander we dont have a chance to many of those cards, bc we are not a major market so places like tgcplayer dont ship cards to us, and im gonna guess that happenes to many other places too. And yeah i mean i will guess the mayority of viewers are NA/EU, so most of them can get those cards, yada yada, but yeah we want many of those "no one plays those cards but we want to use them" but for mater of we dont have that many supply we cant.
Just a rant, still love your content and you give me ideas for my decks, but all those "good cards" many times i cant get them, even if are less than 50 cents, i can get them and i feel little envy.
Don't hate on Ghostly Prison, in the right meta of people doing bad descisions based on loss aversion it is the strongest card ever.
Hour of Revelation is better than Tragic Arrogance imo, because it’s 3 mana. It’s the best board wipe in my playgroup, period. We play it even in 3 colors and it always overperform. It became way better now that creatures are played less and there are tons of permanents on the board all the time.
Hour is very good but I like TA more
Just used your affiliate link to order a few of these. 😎 Wondering if you have any thoughts on Thaumatic Compass which is ramp in any color and then turns into a Maze of Ith that creates mana. Seems really good, especially for a $2 card.
I think they mentioned it a few times, along with Treasure Map, as pretty good cards you should play more.
Light-Paws (Mono-White) does not like Tragic Arrogance, need Divine Reckoning and Winds of Rath instead. This is that instance where you always take DR over Tragic Arrogance and don't even consider it in the 99.
Tragic arragance is a sac outlet, jk but blood artist loves it lol.
What about night soil it has 0% only 2000 decks. In my opinion it is one of the best graveyard hate cards out there main reason the removal is the cost of the card so it can't be interacted with when you activate it but can be used to interact with any other card since cost has to be paid first.
If you play 3(Mardu) colors or more, would you say that Mythos of Snapdax is better than Tragic Arrogance? I want to play a 5-Color deck an struggle to decide if I want to include MoS or TA.
People keep dissing ophiomancer and I don't understand it. Ghostly prison is a fine card, but you have to have the right deck.
You guys act like you've never read the bottom text of Single Combat. If you can find any of the super easy ways of playing the spell every turn, it's basically like taking infinite turns but not really so nobody can actually get too salty. They can still play the game, just not by casting creatures or planeswalkers.
Love snuff out but a lot of the multicolour or splash black decks probably don't run it incase they can't turn on the free mode. My dimir zombies only has 4 cards with the swamp type as an example due to field of the dead.
I'd play it in mono black not tergrid though.
so glad i got here within the hour
Tragic arrogance is 5 mana to potentially leave your opponent with a board hardly powered down. It's an expensive, highly conditional wipe.
I've had my day ruined by a Purification Druid and the whole table recognizing that maybe my Necropotence, Aetherflux, and Venser's Journal were a sign of trouble to come.
Another excellent video! Thanks guys!
Combat Celebrant seems like a useful extra combat card in Ghired. Currently running Aurelia and Godo with Helm of the Host, 3 mana just seems to good to not pass up on!
I don’t like tragic arrogance in my white decks because my lists tend to be very high on artifacts and especially enchantments. I want to be killing creatures because I am breaking parity with those effects, but I am often hurting myself by balancing enchantments and artifacts