Is It Overpowered: Dual Wield
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- Опубликовано: 13 окт 2024
- Share your WRONG opinions in the comments.
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Patrick And Puff's video on compact ammo damage drop off
• Video
BGM:
Lakey Inspired - Chill Day • LAKEY INSPIRED - Chill...
#HuntShowdown #DualWield #Conversion
I should add that I sound dead inside because I recorded the 1st half of the script at night while super tired, and the 2nd half of the script after realizing my video would be late because of the patch. And it was also recorded at night while super tired. I am sleepy.
Personally I still like dual wield now adays where the range of dualies feels balanced and personally use dual silenced nagant with poison rounds and dual conversion pistols
Like rn honestly i think dual wield is in a fine enough place where there in my eyes already wasnt much rng headshots past like 20 to 30m anymore before the most recent nerf and after it, it feels like there really isnt any headshots much of ever which is fine since i always used dualies in medium to close range and basically sticking the guns in my enemies fac eanyways so works out just fine for me
When you get killed by dual pistols: "DAMN IT! SO FUCKING OVERPOWERED!!!"
When you're using dual pistols: "Okay I'm rushing them. ...I missed, I missed, I missed, I missed, I missed, I GOT IM I HIT HIM, I missed, I missed, I missed, I'm out of bullets."
RNG favors me never.
I used the double conversions a lot before special ammo was a thing, and I can say that the headshot accuracy was way too good at times.
1:19 Literally this. I've always seen people bitch and moan about dualies, but don't acknowledge the existance of other dualies than conversions. I've tried unironically playing with dual bornheims, and let me tell you. IT IS PAINFUL. I shit you not, you can literally miss your shots when you and the enemy are 5 meters apart
The borheim is literally the worst dual wielding option.
@@randydandyday It is however a fucking hilarious option.
why would they acknowledge most other dualies?
Borheim's- high recoil, small magazines, low damage, expensive.
Dolch's- high recoil, inconvenient ammo, expensive.
Uppercut's- insane recoil, expensive, slow reload.
Schofield's- slow, high recoil, waste of iron sights.
Pax's- effective, but not outstanding, 4x expensive as conversion.
Lemat's- effective, high ammo, mostly a goofy pick but sometimes surprisingly viable.
nagant's- cheap(but still more expensive than conversion), low damage, ok, meh.
Suppressed nagant's- Cheap, funny, scary, bunch of poison ammo.
Caldwell conversion's- mid/high firerate, high damage at close/mid range, the cheapest.
(Top 5 dps and cheapest)
Chain Conversion's- "Kid, I swear to God if I hear a footstep I will shit 36 fmj bullets."
Still Inexpensive, reload rarely necessary, almost identical stats to conversion.
This is why I don't understand the change being an across the board change rather then a targeted one. For levering and fanning I understand, but seriously just nerfing all the Dual Wield pistols is odd to me.
@@QbertDude Someone discussed the option of holstering one gun as an option and with only one ammo choice the switch ammo button is wasted for dual wielding. I think it would be a decent trade-off to experience this intense mid-range nerf for a new feature like that. (though that would have been completely broken pre-recoil nerf because you could ADS to land one hit and then just spam.)
I think people on reddit got real swept up in screenshots of like 80m headshots with dual chain pistols and because they suck at the game just sorta ran with that being the precedence rather than an anomaly.
Getting killed by someone unloading on me with fanning or dualies is never gonna upset me more than a bush rookie or sniper taking my head off from 100 meters away.
Now that was on point, great vid!
I personally almost never run dual pistols cuz I rarely get good rng and just dont feel like using the spamming nature of paired pistols in hunt. It would be much more convenient if devs would add an option to holster one pistol and leave one in hand for mid range engagements though
The wheel really got to you huh?
Recorded these tired af to sell the despair LMAO
"Share your WRONG opinions in the comments."
If I die to it, it's OP - Some Guy On Reddit
Great video! I agree with your opinion that duals didn't need a nerf, but also my (VERY) limited play time since the patch dropped makes me think dual conversions are still going to do what they did best. However, as some other people have already pointed out, levering fmj is a thing now and probably does the close range fmj spam better than dual pistols while also being a gun you can aim. So overall, I'm rating the nerf a solid "Meh"
I never had a problem with duel wielding, but I think the problem came from how easy there were to use along with them being very effective. They weren’t op, just a very solid loadout, but far too easy to get kills with. I think the recoil changes are perfect because it requires players to aim a bit more and manage recoil better. Also it was sort of frustrating to get randomly headshot at 30m by duelies without the user aiming too well most of the time.
I enjoy this video a lot. The nerf in practice hasn’t been too bad for dualies though, I still run dual Caldwell conversion with the hand cannon and it works great. The only difference is that now you really have to get to medium-close range, but in a compound fight with 2-3 other teams they’re great.
I think they are more effective at lower skill brackets when someone using rng will hit as much as someone actually aiming. They also have more range than shotguns and can single handedly wipe a team in moments which is annoying.
The reason they made this change is obvious, it's the new repeater FMJ ammo. People already run dual conversion FMJ, when that increases the available ammo for their FMJ Winfield? It won't exactly be a new meta, but it'll fuck shit up.
Not gonna lie, when they nerfed Dual Wield but added FMJ Winnie I laughed. It definitely replaces Dual Wield well.
i just like having 4 chain pistols and a derringer for maximum ammo i dont even care about special ammo i use regular.
I haven’t done extensive testing by any means, but I think the days of my dual dualies monke loadout are over now. RIP.
the moment were dualwield gets op is when they are spraying through the walls like maniacs. the ammo on small cal pistols is nearly endless so they keep spraying and spraying and spraying.
3:50
I think you meant to say 140ms not 14ms
Same thing with the 230ms not 23ms
Sometimes, I'm a bit of a moron. Thanks for pointing that out though I literally didn't notice lol.
I thought it was annoying to deal with at compounds but never thought it needed a nerf.. just kinda like a fad that people would play with until sinking back into mosin snipers and dolchs
Thoughtful insight! Thanks Q!
Mmmmm big wavy Qbert brain
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I never thought they were op just frustrating that you're opponent is just gambling in your general direction and occasionally gets a one tap at 20/30ms... Just recently I got one tapped at 30m through a floor and stairs. Another time I got one tapped at 40m by dual bornheims after I tagged them with a mosin. RNG deaths in Hunt are the worst, I was essentially punished for flanking and challenging an opponent with dual pistols at mid range whilst behind cover.. I've never hit a dual wield headshot even at close range.
Yeah this summed up how I felt about them prior to the update. I always just thought they were fun and not that serious a choice. At close range, you'll lose to a good shotgun, at mid range and beyond, every rifle will outperform you. This will not stop me from running quad FMJ lemats to go wallbang fishing though.
Duel wield nerf is somewhat understandable but nerfing fanning and levering as well? why tho?
Bro what time zone you in cause according to my time zone you uploaded this at 2:30am
Yeah I uploaded 2:30AM my time too lmao. Original goal was to get it out yesterday, but had to delay it and just wanted to upload it asap.
Almost every one: dual wield is OP
Me: it's Garbage ( I'll actually would pick Caldwell Rival handcannon over dual pistols)
Am I a real cowboy!?
Of course Paul. Of course you are.
My long ammo meta must be preserved at all cost. KEEP HUNT SHOW DOWN PURE
The recoil change wasn't necessary but I like that they nerfed the ability to easily dome people 50 foot aWay
Alright, so what I'm getting from this video is toe pics soon, copy
Was that a really good Chills impression, a random voice clip, or did you somehow actually get Chills to do a 10 second bit for your video
It was a text to speech! If you look up Chills text to speech itll come up, forgot the website off the top of my head but they have a bunch of different youtubers, celebs e.t.c.
Dude i was looking for this comment lol
People take this game too seriously imo.
Were some dual wielding options too strong? Maybe.
Is running around with 2 pistols going pew pew pew pew pew pew pew really fun? Hell yes.
My favorite aspect of this game is how players can be rewarded for just having fun. RNG deaths can be annoying, but if your reaction to dying to rng is to go on reddit/forums and type multiple paragraphs on how it's dogshit OP and everyone who uses it deserves to be banned or something then you're taking the haha fun cowboy game way too seriously.
Games are supposed to be fun, and the guys that run around with dualies still die to 1 headshot like everyone else. So the dualies player is rewarded for having fun with a viable option, and the guy that one taps the dualies player with an Uppercut is rewarded for being serious and accurate. Video games are supposed to be fun yknow, people need to stop tying their self worth to video games so much
MMMM YES
Gaming
damage drop off doesnt mean jack when you're getting a 1 tap from just controlling your shots at 80m and conversions are easily the most accurate dualies in the game
It still comes down to RNG though. Unless you're sitting crouched in a spot to ambush a team, in which case you can argue pretty easily that you could do the same with just about any gun.
Before patch 1.7.2 be very good after is hmmm... Weak, I play before 1.7.2 all month 4xconversial with FMJesus ammo but now I don't play this.
This summary is very good and well thought out, however my main issue with DW, is not that they are op, but that they are a gun that requires extremely low skill or accuracy to play, in a game where it is advertised as a hardcore and skill based shooter. The drawbacks they have are honestly not that bad. To cover your own points, the first 2 shots have increased accuracy comparativly to spamming, so most of the time, the first or second shot will hit without any real aim skill. Your second point is the damage drop off, which yes while drastic, is no different to single wielded pistols, therefore is not really a factor in dual wielding versus single wield. The 3rd point you made was fmj muzzle velocity, which only applies to the caldwell conversion line, however given that fmj is compact, you are not limited to only the ccp. You can bring pax, which has a much higher velocity, or nagants with HV ammo. So the fmj velocity isnt a nerf to dual wielding, just requires more leading. And the last point you made about the medium slot is a valid one. I feel that the size is one of the only limiting factors for DW. and given than most medium slot weapons are better at close range, it makes sense. Again, only my own opinion, and not bashing you or others for their thoughts. But i definitly think there is more to the dual wielding pros and cons that could be touched on. Such as doubled cost, but only requiring 1 purchase of special ammo. Or how the DW pistols often (especially the caldwell line) are more spammy than almost any other loadout (not including fanning/levering/dolch). Im open for any disscusion or questions anyone might have. I have a little over 1200 hours in hunt. But again just my own opinion.
I think you hit dead on with the biggest issue of DW, which is how spammable they are. I honestly am just indifferent to it being nerfed, because while I liked to use them for dirt cheap rushing builds, I never used them outside of that. You bring up some very good counter points here, and I think I'll be referencing them in a follow up video ( I don't disagree with any of these counterpoints. You've made some solid points I didn't even think of while working on this video. ).
@@QbertDude hey! glad i could help! i love informational videos like this because it really helps for newer players or even veterans to learn some new stuff as well as a new perspective! love the work man! keep it up!
So with the recent nerf, I'm forced to run dual conversion FMJ or dual spitfire. If I want to dual wield that is.
The already pretty weak dual pistols are even weaker now with the recent patch. Oh well, reddit wins again.
rip akimbo suppressed nagant memes. They were already kinda bad :(
My problem with dual wield pistols is not that they overperform but rather that they rely so much on RNG
It just feel bad to have such a skill-based game be ruined by a weapon that can miss 10 shots at close range or instantly headshot you at 30m randomly and independently of player skill
They should imo get an accuracy buff on their first bullet (like, a major one) but a super big spread increase if you fire back to back. I envision the end result being max accuracy only if you fire as fast as the single pistol would shoot, any faster and it will struggle to hit the wide side of a barn
I 100% understand this. This is, imo, the real issue with dual wield. Not that they're overpowered, but that people feel cheated when they're killed by it. A lot of the arguments I've heard against Dual Wield fall into the same domain of fanning arguments. I do feel like you should be punished for spamming vs taking your time with your shots as well, but Crytek already made up their minds with the patch.
hip firing dual wielding is faster
cool lol
:)
lol
I dont think anyone's really arguing that dual wielding is op? Most people just argue that its a shitty crutch for bad players that dont actually want to get better at the game. Which yknow... is true? They're cheap as shit, effective and require no aim on the behalf of the user
I totally get this as well. But to be fair, I've seen a decent amount of discussion around if they're OP or not (Ractha's community post, his video, and some typical reddit threads). My takeaway from this video and the comments was that it was very annoying to die to a weapon that is super spammy and doesn't require much skill. I still wouldn't go as far as to call them a crutch though, but like I said in the video I'm pretty indifferent to the nerf or Dual Wield as a whole.
@@QbertDude well the issue there is you browse reddit
@@bigsmoke8816 Only when I want to feel pain!
As someone who has real dubious aim I’d like to contest the notion you can use these with no aim. That’s false advertising and I want my money back.
Jokes aside, I found that using them was less often “no aim required” and more often “no amount of aim will help”. They’re only reliable like a little further past than what you would trust your romero with.
@@FilthyNobeard actually
I did manage to get quite a few 40-50m headshots with the thighs by pacing my shots since the first bullet is always somewhere in the center of your crosshair. So there is SOME skill to duelies
But the thing is, you can get by by just spamming the things and allowing rng to lend you kills, its what makes the things so annoying to fight
let’s look over how consistently i get wins with dual dual conversion fmj in six star lobbies then lmao. it feels like you’re forgetting that you can set the terms of battle which is also why shotguns are also technically op. if you play right with dualies you cannot lose even after the nerf- they are too strong and needed a rpm nerf not a boost to the rngness. id be happier having them perfectly accurate but slightly faster than the stock variant instead of this rng blink and you shoot twice mess
Now this is based. I play a wide variety of guns (except long ammo snipers) in 5/6 star lobbies and it is by far easiest to set the tone of battle for a win with shotguns and especially dual wielding with quartermaster. Although they are admittedly worse when u have to use an9ther medium slot weapon they're still very viable as they can easily be used up to 50m and are rly good for shooting ppl behind cover.
I think part of what makes Dual Wield strong is just how confident you can be because of the dirt cheap investment. I could go full monke and just run at people with these while flinging bullets around. But for me personally, I found that trying to set the tone of the fight became the all too familiar tug of war that happens in Hunt. One team pushes, the other falls back. This goes on until one team gives up and extracts lmao. This could also be a Duos thing since that's where I play primarily. This may be more easy to work around with a team of 3.
This guy mentioned every down side to the duel wielding without touching it good sides even his down sides are so weak and they are not followed up with real facts and testing. like man said its not effective at 100m rage as a down side like are we playing the same game u are not holding a long ammo rifle here u said it ur self u play dual wielding to be on ppl faces even at 50m they are more dan good then he show a clip of his friends spamming at him oh i will hit u at one point u cant tell me that’s how u use them duel wielding when there is this distance between u and them u dont spam ur guns like dat u line ur shot and u dont spam it like that then u go like it takes a medium slot that’s a down side in ur eyes I don’t know if its tbh cuz u don’t really need anything else with it u can go double duel wielding and still do so good with them then we go to the fmj ammo that’s the best ammo in the game for it dirt cheap price and he goes like oh it has a low velocity i wanna know how this is effecting duel wielding when u are 30m to 50m max from a hunter it don’t understand your point there then he goes like after the nerf Iam going back to my old cheap loadout like man pls this nerf is not taking them anywhere near balanced it a step forward but they still op easy to use dirt cheap and i dont see where is the fun at when u get spammed by them or getting hs from a good range
I'm gonna try and address the points I could make out and remember because that was the longest run on sentence I've ever seen. 1) Yeah they're good in a compound/short range but that's it. If you're using any long ammo rifle ( which, let's be real, everyone's using a long ammo rifle ) you can easily play at a distance where Dual Wield becomes ineffective. 50M< you really have to crouch to line up your shots with Dual Wield which puts you in the vulnerable and not very mobile position of a squat. 2) I brought up the 100M distance for damage and because of the effective headshot range with Dual Wield conversions. It's a very common complaint that they're too accurate at range, which I wanted to address in the video. My point is that an occasional lucky headshot at long distances is possible, but not nearly as consistent as people make it out to be. 3) Yes, the Dual Wielding nerf has put these in a balanced state. My take is that they were really good before the nerf, but with 1.7.2 they've become a slightly more controllable fanning alternative. They more heavily lean into being a secondary rather then an effective weapon on their own.
women scare me
@@MomJeans1738 english aint my first language and iam happy with what i wrote there and i think it’s understandable for someone with two brain cells
>cowboy game
>nerf dual pistols
???????? I don't care if they're the best option in the game. They fucking should be. Use them. Why would the devs listen to these people?
Decent at best, lackluster at worst when you don't even know how to fire the sequentially correctly. Nice b8 m8
Enlighten me on which Dual Wield pistols are as good if not better then the Conversion Pistols. I'd love to hear it.
@@QbertDude Has nothing to do with what I said, maybe try reading the comment before u respond to it with some dumbass shit
Also deadass you cannot aim, nor fire the dualies correctly. You also said it was nearly improbable for dualies to hit heads at thirty meters, yet you don't know how to fire them fast enough or accurately enough to actually hit them more than once in the body at thirty meters
@@AlphaRaven101It's crazy because I never said Dualies headshot at 30m was improbable. I said at close range they destroy, medium range your odds are more of a gamble, and long range you're meming. I'm assuming you mean that I wasn't tap firing and crouching to maximize the odds of a headshot, which is footage I don't have a lot of because I'm within 10-15m of the people I'm fighting in nearly every clip. It would have been awesome if I could get the ambush or perfect positioning to do that, but in nearly all my clips I wasn't. I'm sure though if I adopt your special methods of using Dual Wielded pistols and apply your tactics to my own gameplay, I would definitely 100% be a better player.
@@QbertDude How is 30m not medium range? Also that comment is proof you do not read the comments you reply to. because I said you do not have the aim nor rythm required to shoot the dualies properly or get any kills. The fact that you think dualies are only super strong in close range engagements shows how little experience you have using the dualies. Try learning the proper rythm to get the fastest fire rate on dualies and stop shooting one bullet at an enemy when you have 11 others that could also be going down range at your target. Get more hours with the dualies and you'll see what I mean. For now I'm done with this argument as it is pointless trying to explain it in a youtube comment section, good day to you sir
does a shit accuracy test of a dude standing and spamming then at 4:00 youre crouched and sniped a guy at 30 yards. But yeah not op at all
Then at 4:50 you literally one tap the guy from across the road it’s a fucking joke lmao
LMAO if you can't tell that the bit with a Chills Text-To-Speech was a bit and think its a legit test idk what to tell you, crayon muncher. And by " sniped " u mean finally hit the moving guy after missing 5 rounds. And the guy I one shot legit took a body shot bc he was already been downed 2 times prior. But yeah, huff some copium because you get out RNG'd by Dualies, nerd.
Out of all the things you could grab to claim " OP " you chose the most plausible clips. L + Ratio + Youngboy Better.
@@QbertDude missing 5 shots doesn’t matter when your mag sized is doubled, fire rate almost doubled, recoil is removed, and you no longer have to try to aim. Love your content I just did my yearly internet nerd rage sorry to bring it on y ou lol
@@BearierThanYou it's cool lmao I'm just gonna return the energy.
Dual wielding conversion pistols with dumdum ammo seems like cheating 😂 (not the chain pistol , the normal ones) even post nerf it’s still insanely accurate
My favorite load out when using that is quartermaster , with a full sized mosin as my long range