SUBSCRIBING is the best way to support the channel if you want to see more like this. Business Inquiries- michael.j.fabian.bus@gmail.com www.patreon.com/michael_j_fabian instagram.com/michael_j_fabian
James Hoffmann - and also Tim Wendelboe - do not attract argument because of the way they present and communicate. They're diplomatic. They do not pontificate like a consultant out to get business like, well, some coffee consultants. They don't force an opinion on others. Neither person's livelihood depends on convincing others that they are 'right' - so there are no opposing 'wrong' people getting their backs up.
@@coffeecoffee1225 I wasn't thinking of Scott Rao at all. It does seem that some of the things that he has written have been taken way out of context, but that's not on him.
A lot of discourse on the Internet is not discourse at all, but rather an effort to get eyeballs and clicks. So that leads to controversy for controversy's sake. James to me, appears more like a teacher presenting information for people absorb and use as they wish. Perhaps by design he chooses not stir the pot unnecessarily and yet still gets eyeballs and clicks. Interesting.
I think he just leaves no/or a really small attack surface open. He states facts when he has measured things and clearly states opinions when it's about his preferences. About the facts there is nothing to argue. The interpretation is still open to everyone. And for his opinions, it's different. You can agree or disagree but this is how a constructive discussion can evolve. So i think there is no lack of opposing tastes/theories, I just think that he encourages discussions in a constructive manner.
@@subi7o I don't think he intended the guide to be all inclusive. It is a simple guide for the layman coffee drinker that wants to try v60. If you want more, try this resource: www.scottrao.com/the-physics-of-filter-coffee
@@subi7o Do you really think he wasn't aware of all those factors? Lol do you want the V60 guide video to be 2-3 hrs lecture or sth?Haha You are just pretentious dumb guy man.
I think because James always frames his analysis as his opinion, he never comes across as snobbish, even outside of specialty coffee. Scott Rao and Matt Perger present their findings as “this is better” and factual, rather than opinion most of the time. It’s not what his opinions are, it’s how he presents and represents them as a person.
Michael, bravo my friend. This is a topic I’ve been wanting to talk about but just couldn’t really find the words. This has been a source of frustration for me, and I’m sure other coffee folks here and else where, and like you said this isn’t on James. He’s been extremely polite and helpful to me both privately and publicly. It’s essentially Stan culture, and it’s a problem in every genre and topic. I don’t have a way to solve it, and even though James frames his opinions as opinions they are widely considered fact among a large swath of people. I think that is just the byproduct of having the largest audience in a particular topic. Even though I envy James’ video quality, sub count, views, hair and accent I don’t envy that level of influence. Being able to essentially destroy a business in one video is something that would weigh heavy on me for negative reviews. Anyway, regardless. Great topic, well said, you’ve earned a subscriber.
First of all, I do see debates and disagreement with his position on reddit and home-barista. Maybe you should spend more time reading the forums. Second, what exactly he should be critiqued for? Can you give some good example when he made very controversial point and auditory didn't react adequately? So far your point sounds more like people should disagree with him because they could.
James Hoffmann probably disagrees with himself more than anyone else. I have “The Best of Jimseven” and it’s a remarkable time capsule, because you can see how his thinking on different matters changed between 2004 and 2015. But I think that has a lot to do with just why he’s so authoritative and widely disagreeable - he has spent the past 15+ years relentlessly experimenting, and being unafraid to admit when he was wrong about something. That said, I can’t say that I’ve seen any significant pushback against Scott Rao. After all, we have him to thank for EKspresso and the Allongé, amongst other broadly accepted trends and recipes. The most significant pushback I’ve seen against Perger has to do with his racism. As for Schomer, he’s done a lot of good, but his idea of what espresso should taste like is rooted in the idea that the Northern Italians perfected the craft long ago, and innovations in roasting are somehow undesirable for espresso. By all accounts, Vivace makes some of the best espresso in Seattle, but he’s still fundamentally a traditionalist. Hoffmann is the most public face of continual experimentation, learning, evolution of thought, and even applying scientific principles to arrive at better results.
The funny thing about it is that James himself distances himself from any sort of position of 'absolute truth'. This phenomenon is probably due to a mix of various things, instead of any single one. I don't have an answer, but I agree with the statement; a lot of what he says is taken as gospel. Healthy debate should be an option for any opinion (opinion, not fact).
I think people do argue and don't agree with him on everything. Examples, there are millions of fans of the Aeropress Go, and James did not like that gadget. There are millions of people who prefer another V60 technique over James's. The point is that Hoffmann does not generate hatred. His videos have almost no dislikes. He is a nice, polite and classy guy, at heart, a Barista who has never lost sight of the fact that attention and service to the (public) customer is the most important thing. Internet trolls are loud, and they amplify the noise they generate. When someone doesn't have trolls attacking them, it generates that impression of condescension from people.
james hoffman is the only youtube coffee guy i’ve ever seen to make short videos dedicated to apologising for a small mistake (usually due to over-critique). i think everyone appreciates this sort of behaviour and manner, which is why people are willing to have a more constructive discussion and get less heated when opinions differ :))
My speculation as I follow a number of Coffee “influencers”: James has over the years learned how to “talk”… One day he cleaned this channel with the videos where he was trashing products and he explained why. In learning to “talk” he did not make “opinions” unless these opinions were subjective to his taste (instead of say - flats are always better than conical). As of the last couple of years, the way he communicates tries to be impartial, and that is important. There is a difference between having opinions and to be opinionated… it is a thin line when we talk, but easy to see once on video. Most influencers communicate more than they should… this is better than that, opinion on products not released, etc… even when James hits something he dislikes (i.e. 9 bar presets on his espresso machine video) he tells you that he does not like it, scuffs at it… wonders why that is the case, asks people to tell him why that may be the case… James has GROWN to speak in public - that was not always the case and the followers you see is a consequence of that… its not that people fear contradict him (I don’t agree with his choice of hand grinder for example) but that unlike 98% of all RUclipsrs/IG James has found a way to be inclusive… by means of the way he speaks… He does not have 900,000 followers because he is controversial, it is because even when you disagree, he kinda explained his way out of your disagreement. He uses fun equipment that most people do not have access to… but unlike say Lance Hedrick who claims “no burrs unless they are flat” with a Niche in the background, I find that James will play to a wide range of audience… a cheap grinder, what makes a cheap grinder… should you start with a cheap grinder?… that sort of thing… I like Hedrick BTW… (if he only could keep himself from repeating something 87 times in a row)… but James will instead try to steer away from making people feel like they made the wrong choice. Example: (and this is not an attach, this is more constructive criticism)…Telling people they bought a KEY to be in architecture digest while having low value/$ ratio compared to a Niche - may not really hit well with many and in truth, it is not even fair (as the Niche - if you can find it, costs 1800 delivered to many countries, including Canada). That may not be the words James would had used… he would go: “This looks nice to me… to my taste, it looks and it feels right… it is a pleasure to use…. this one, not, really…. Maybe this style appeals to you, but my preference is this one, this one gives me joy to use…. This one is more expensive, but I can see where the money went into, it feels solid, time and energy went into the design… it is ridicusly expensive, but yes, I can see where the money went into”… If you watch his episode comparing grinders, you’ll recognize some of these phrases… So not fear… I think James has, over the course of many years, trial and error, perhaps coaching/self learning… grown to moderate how he addresses the work that people put into products and to respect the choices that people has made… while informing others in the various subjects he addresses… not fear… I think it is a bit of respect :)
First off; kudos for spelling his name correctly. I don't know why it's a pet peeve of mine when I see his name misspelled so often. But more importantly, I think you bring up a great talking point. No doubt, pretty much all of the specialty coffee drinking world loves James Hoffmann, and for good reason; he's articulate, friendly and not snobby He gets a message across that the vast majority of the coffee consuming public would appreciate or at least take lesson from. I adore James. That being said, folks on this side of the specialty coffee world shouldn't be surprised to see a "famous coffee person" like James, who've racked up just shy of a million followers on RUclips in a few short years, being the fence-riding-non offensive persona that he is. There's plenty of highly opinionated, quickly agreed with coffee professionals in this industry. I think James Hoffmann had the foresight to know in order to build his brand and following, that it was better to be a passive commentator on most coffee topics. Most research into RUclips algorithms will show that for the most part, people subscribe and rarely unsubscribe, so the number of subscribers doesn't correlate to the actual static audience at any one given time. I think James has earned his place in coffee culture in his form of outreach, but I don't think he believes himself to be immune from criticism or counter-talking points.
This video feels like the coffee RUclipsr equivalent of a young upstart rapper releasing a diss track challenging the G.O.A.T in order to clout chase. :-) At least that’s better than the James follow-on videos that copy something he did without acknowledging it. That phenomenon happens across creator subcultures in RUclips. I believe this phenomenon more than a lack of criticism increases James’ standing without a counterpoint. I agree that people follow James in an unquestioning way, but I think he also encourages experimentation and regularly admits when he’s wrong, when he has a theory, what the results of his experiments show, and how he might be wrong given all of the above. We need more authentic voices and differentiated content, not necessarily more criticism.
I have noticed the pattern you mention, especially on Reddit among beginners looking for brewing advice or gear recommendations. Many people seem to take his “Ultimate _____ Guide” and gear reviews as gospel, without forming their own opinions or testing anything themselves. But that’s a problem lying in every online forum, at least from what I’ve seen in musical equipment, kitchen knives, and liquor discussions. That said, I have seen a fair amount of pushback re: his Clever and French Press brewing guides. I don’t see James really trying to “push coffee forward” in the same way as someone like Scott Rao or Jonathan Gagne, for instance. No slight to James at all, but even in his more informative videos (Weird Coffee Science, mostly), he’s basically just citing research papers or things he’s read online and testing the ideas himself. He just occupies a different space in the field. So in that sense, I think part of the reason he doesn’t get any blow back is that he’s mostly presenting other people’s ideas. Again, no slight to James. I love his stuff. I think he’s very good about crediting people, being impartial in his tests, and clarifying that what he’s saying isn’t the end all. The problem is with the user. Imo.
His content is phenomenal, some of the best in the specialty coffee realm. It’s extremely simple and very well taught. And as others mention, he rarely says “this is the BEST.” He says “this is the best, for me.” Which, everyone should think that way on most things in life. He’s taught me a very important thing: People drink what they enjoy. Meaning I can’t be out here saying “you don’t like light roast? You’re an idiot!” And this is how all arguments work.. people who blanket statement are the easiest to argue with. “This is better.” “No, it is not.” Vs “this is better for me” few people have the folly to respond with “no James, that is not actually better for you. Because I know you better than you.”
I’m sure James is also aware of and often frustrated with this issue. He has to essentially discontinue his more critical product reviews of his early channel, because some of his more loyal fans bullied the companies. It’s also interesting how once he covers a topic, there’s an overnight change in discussion in favor of whatever he states. When prior to him covering a topic, you can actually have quality discussion. You can see it with product reviews, or with tips like “stir, don’t swirl”, etc. Love James, but the god status people have given him ultimately hurts his ability to be a critical voice who can share his opinions free of concern of what his audience will do with that info.
He's deeply knowledgeable, he's charming, he's self-effacing, he's got sense of humor, his vids look classy and are beautifully edited...and in every episode he asks viewers if they agree or disagree, and to comment if they do things differently. All that probably takes the air out of a lot of angry balloons.
From my observation, it seems like people are very quick to promote him without also presenting other's work/opinions. It doesn't seem to me to be as much of a problem of people thinking that dissenting opinions are bad, but it seems like it's just something where people have the attitude of "why look any further when Hoffman already has developed the ultimate method?". My most upvoted comment on Reddit is from the Aeropress Reddit or somebody asked what people thought of the Hoffman Ultimate Aeropress technique and I basically just said I thought it was "just another Aeropress recipe". This tells me that there's quite a few people who would agree that he's being put on maybe a bit too high of a pedestal than any person should have. It's something that likely sucks for him because he has a responsibility to use his voice carefully. What I am trying to do now is to intentionally follow, support and promote other voices in the specialty coffee world. Like you said, there's nothing wrong with James himself, but there just needs to be a variety of voices out there. I am encouraged that I see a number of creators that are not only building their own content but are encouraging and promoting each other. Some of the channels I've been catching up on are: Coffee with Carl, Kyle Rowsell, Lance Hendrick, The Coffee Chronicler, The Real Sprometheus and Xris. Subscribing to you now too!
Old video but still very relevant. It got me thinking. I think the reason is that, unlike a truly mammoth hobby industry like video games, gourmet coffee hobbyist is a small industry, and almost everyone involved with the industry feels, in some way, that they personally have an interest in James Hoffman being successful, because of how important he is to this burgeoning industry. It's in no one's self interest to shit on him. So it leads to a form of self policing. That and the fact he is a genuinely wholesome and well loved, nice seeming guy.
I think this is a valid observation. The analogy I have is something in martial arts termed “Sensei compliance” It’s basically when a student or pupil follows the moves of the teacher or sensei so that the sequence has the desired effect. Eg a punch is thrown in a certain way, and deflected with a block in a certain way, with perhaps a counterstrike in a certain way. In the training arena it always works because the pupil follows the teacher’s exact moves and instruction, its almost expected - so the teacher isn’t made to look bad! But out in the real world fights do not follow sequence. This is the same thing with James’ content. It’s excellent but the pupils all follow it to the letter without thinking beyond the words, not wanting to resist or make the teacher look bad! James of course is very eloquent and charismatic- which adds to his believability.
Hoffman’s reviews and comments are most often prefaced with disclaimers and sprinkled with self-effacement. When he opines on anything, he carefully explains that he is in a subjective arena and encourages viewers to research the subject matter themselves. His reasoning is carefully explained and the basis for his conclusions are outlined in detail, nothing dogmatic outside of his personal thoughts and feelings which are his to own and broadcast. There’s never a “you must do this or buy that” but rather the suggestion that, based on his research and nearly unmatched body of experience, one could own, achieve, and/ or experience whatever he covered in his video. He ends every video asking viewers to share their comments ... because of all this he attracts an intelligent audience who generally are looking for well researched and informed opinion, they aren’t looking for an argument.
I remember Hoffman once said that he sometimes pre-grinds his coffee before he goes to bed so that he can put one of his machines on a timer and wake up to already brewed coffee. Now, *that* is a hot take I'm pretty sure people disagreed with.
I think a good example of why James doesn’t generate a lot of push back is his ultimate series. It’s obviously only called that for the algorithm but he never picks a winner. He always presents his findings and says I think I like this better but this might work for someone who does things differently than me or has a different taste than me. I don’t think his opinion is taken as the word of god because he doesn’t present it as such. He says here’s what I like tell me what you liked.
The largest portion of his fans are intermediate level coffee enthusiasts. They are not the ones going to home barista to argue the fine details of RO water vs distilled.
I think maybe partly because James often shoot his own foot and still share the incident anyway; he made a strong opinion of a particular topic, later he proves it wrong by himself. The "Spoon - My Nemesis" episode is an hilarious example to watch.
I think that you don’t see a lot of disagreement because James Hoffman has done a great job of reaching non coffee geek audience. In his comment section you often see things like, “I don’t even drink coffee but I love this guy!” I think he’s a great in into the world of specialty coffee, and I think he’s all the in a lot of folks need. You follow his advice, you get tasty results. Maybe not the tastiest, maybe not the most interesting, but always good. That’s all a lot of people want.
Love James and agree with 90% of what he says. I Kno people who feel his word is god and I feel food is subjective and what one prefers, another may disagree. I've found this with some things he's said such as doses with dark/light. Others may disagree with James as well when he says he prefers flat burrs to conical and that's ok. We should all just join in the conversation but don't make things defacto
But I understand the whole, having-coffee-convos, and people say “well Hoffman says…” and the truest of coffee scientists get triggered and say “Hoffman isn’t the only voice you know.” And there can be healthy discussion there. But if he’s incorrect on things, or certain opinions (as a video like this suggests… obv if this guy agrees with everything James says he wouldn’t make a video like this), then the people who ARE correct need to make better content. Cause currently James’ content is some of the best. It’s ease of use too. Starbucks has thousands of locations and solve the problem of people wanting tasty caffeine. James is a similar thing content-wise, stirring and answering people’s “is there more?” curiosities.
Interesting take Michael. The only recent of someone “opposing” publicly James’ opinion was following his review of the D64 grinder: I found the Portakeeper video on his channel interesting as it offered a different view based on experience. I think that as any other kind of media, it is healthy to have a broad variety of sources with different views, so you can form your own opinions. That being said, I love James’ videos (and hair!) and I have to thank him for introducing me to the world of specialty coffee!
The antidote is the same as it is for all cults of personality. People need to remember that these guys are just humans with a single palate - their own. They can give you some good rules of thumb, but at the end of the day, it's about what *you* taste in the cup, so brew it the way you like it.
James does make incredibly detailed content that is quite often very close to airtight, however, with any sort of opinion (let's call it a hypothesis) there needs to be some sort of pushback in order for the growth and betterment of the hypothesis. There is a reason that scientific articles need to be peer-reviewed. With the recent growth seen in the coffee community, alot of new entrants have taken the word of James to be that of god, since he was how they discovered and fell in love with coffee. I think this is just a phase of the online community that is struggling with only having one superstar.
It's funny how most of the backlash I've seen from James has been people within the specialty coffee itself instead of fans! Like the one controversy he had with the Elixir coffee people, or his removal of "comically negative" reviews from his channel because he was "punching low". One thing I've been a bit curious about is how a lot of specialty coffee people seem to get weirdly ... pissy? About Hoffmann's usage of the word "ultimate" to describe his recipe/technique videos. The guy is unfailingly polite and always reminds people that these are *his* ultimate techniques, that others exist and should be tried, but other specialty coffee channels always seem to make it a point to start their similar videos taking a jab at him (or maybe at his audience?) by starting with a variation of "There's no such thing as an ultimate technique", or "I don't like using superlatives when I talk about my recipes, like super, or ultra hahaha!" and it just comes across as weirdly petty. Or at least it did, until I watched this video. It must be frustrating as hell to try and come up with different ideas and legitimize other points of view when so many people take his word as gospel, despite that obviously not being his intent. Still, it sucks that he's kind of becoming "an institution", because I remember him saying in a video somewhere that this is something he's explicitly trying to avoid, citing the example of... some guy from the wine world (whose name i can't recall -- I'm not a wine person at all!) whose reviews end up meaning the rise and fall of different wines, and this being the reason why he explicitly avoids reviewing actual coffees.
There are comments that I see which disagree with James to some level - as do I on certain fronts (not that my views as an average home espresso enthusiast hold any real weight) I think your theory about the function of size seems likely. If the online coffee community get their info from multiple sources - there is inherently discussion and debate as every individual will have looked at different source. When one particular, and very credible, source dominates, that source's views thus become more dominant and more widely agreed upon in the community. This thus leads to wider agreement and less debate than when people's info comes from multiple sources.
Also, as other comments here have said, I think James does a pretty good job of explaining that his views are just his opinions and encouraging people to see what works for themselves.
What's going on can be dangerous to both his followers and himself. When he becomes too influential. He himself once admitted that he somewhat destroyed a sincere business just because he said he hated it. And he immediately took down that video after knowing it. He might not know it, but his followers take his word like gospel. However, he kept showing the mistake he made in blind tasting. But people just don't get it. it reminds me the similarity of a religion or a cult.
I feel like I see plenty of "dissent", sometimes not on content but on his approach or standard of judgment. Just have to look for places where people are thinking critically and discussing, not places where people just want answers. Often it's hard to disagree with most of his particular points. More often, it's style and his standard for me - for example, I didn't like that he mentioned the g-iota is very good if you tinker with it, but dropped the issue at that. The grinder gained immense attention in no small part *because* it is a good platform for the tinkering. Problems can be fixed and good burrs can be well aligned for cheap, no wait. But he reviewed it as an out of box option. Understandable, but maybe misses the pt
My least watched video is one where I openly challenged his idea of the "ultimate pumpkin spice latte". Coincidence I think not lol. You should go read the description in that video. I also think James does get his fair share of (mainly undeserved) hate for his sheer popularity as the Oprah Winfrey of coffee, and is openly memed and mocked amongst a certain percentage of coffee people. Check r/coffeecirclejerk on Reddit. Overall, I think as others have said, he does a good job of hedging his bets rather than preaching some kind of coffee gospel, which keeps him pretty bullet proof and likeable compared to the other coffee elites. For a lot of people, he might be the only coffee channel they watch on YT and so I agree that there is a risk of his opinions becoming confused with fact. Like his hate of the Fellow Ode or his other general ergonomics preferences which people may not realize are pretty specific to his own personal preferences
@@andrewcramer7214 I agree with his holistic view of the df64. It's way too 'aliexpress'. The fact that it's sold as different brands in different places is very concerning to me from a customer care point of view.
@@ahpadt That's not really true, they just allowed their distributors the ability to rebrand it. That's incredibly common in every industry. There is one 1 distributor per country, this makes sense for a small company just starting out, to outsource distribution and work solely on the product. The us distributor does a great job of taking care of any issues that pop up, if you think about it from a customer service perspective it's a benefit in most cases. I've had my grinder since they first hit the us, it's been perfect so far. It's not the niche killer because a conical Burr with a plastic gearbox can't touch it. It's really just an ugly lagom p64. Static is no worse than the lagom anyway lol.
Thank you for posting this. For those that have missed the message of the video, Michael is touching on something very real and annoying in the coffee world. My speculation is that people who go to James channel are very new to coffee and seem to take his pontifications as if it’s the agreed upon truth. Internalize that thought process while you make your journey through the coffee world and you’re going to have a very distorted view of the world. Thanks for sharing!
I think it's because his content is generally delivered in a way that's non confrontational and expressed in no absolute terms. It's hard to disagree with much of what he says when it is almost always paired with the cop out "for me". To be honest, I think his content has gotten lazy. The latest video on water for example. Ok he compared 4 brands of coffee water additives. So what. He only gave subjective feedback on unknown water recipes. Who learned what from that video. Good content would be trying out different coffee recipes himself and then comparing them to the commercial ones. With some objective measures such as extraction alongside his subjective taste.
My theory is that its just the style of his delivery that squelches dissent. It's a well entrenched mechanism of psychology. Dale Carnegie-esque. Watch his content again, he never really takes a stance his audience would find particularly controversial. He's the vanilla bean of the coffee bean community. He presents things more-or-less matter of factly and then pulls the audience in with his "tell me where I missed something" pitch at the end. As a result, there's never really something to "attack." At the end of the day, he's just good at this well-known style of delivery. The Ryan Seacrest of the coffee genre if you will.
Hoffmann is likeable, entertaining and has good comedic timing for not being a comedian, but I do not find much of what he does to be highly informative. To me, his content is too wishy-washy with no right or wrong answer - its whatever you like. Perhaps on the subject, coffee, that usually boils down to taste, that is absolutely the right attitude but again, I do not find it highly informative. Now he has presented some subjects that lent themselves to more objective presentations and for me, those were his best videos. Another related view I have: Rao, as an example you used, is not as likeable, nor as personable to many I suspect - his personality is not as friendly and he seems more introverted. Many might question him more simply because they do not like him as much but I find his stuff more objective with a more decisive presentation, and would prefer his style when I am trying to learn something new or receive instructions on do something I had not done before since it is cut and dry with no lose ends. His information is more detailed and objective in my view and I value that more than likeability. Basically, if I really wanted to learn something new with ongoing discourse, I would want Rao to be my teacher not Hoffmann, but if I wanted a general summary about a subject that I was going to explore more on my own, I would probably want Hoffmann to give that introduction.
I have definitely noticed this phenomenon. It is similar to how Joe Rogan’s audience will defend him at all costs. James did go on a podcast, and show his vulnerability with someone that was negatively effected by his review of their product. Worth a watch, if you haven’t seen it already. ruclips.net/video/pjbLWJxElIc/видео.html
I think this is a nothing burger. It’s an uLara niche observation, for an ultra niche cohort of ultra niche specialty coffee commentary. I enjoy James videos. He doesn’t spread gospel. He’s nuanced and diplomatic. I don’t agree with him all the time. I also am not compelled to tear him up because of that. In my brutally honest opinion, this video kinda makes you look petty and jealous of his following. Ronaldo has 320M followers on Instagram. Most other football players don’t. Get over it and go play football and enjoy.
I have disagreed with him in a video where he talks about waste and that take away cups are only a small % of total waste and I commented if all the industries look out for their waste as we should with single use cups etc etc....
@@144avery I don't know if it is so much his fault as how dedicated his fans are. I've seen a similar attitude from fans of Scott Rao and Lance Hedrick both to a lesser extent.
Oh no! That's no good. I'm sorry to see my name brought up. Do you have steps forward I could take to lessen the issue? I only just started 3 months ago, so I want to nip this on the bud! Appreciate the feedback
@@LanceHedrick I don't think you are doing anything wrong on your side. The issue for me is how prevalent stan culture is in the coffee community (think how obsessive Hoffman fans can be, etc), the incestuous nature of marketing and influencers. Again I don't think you are doing anything wrong, it's just frustrating when overnight many unquestioningly parrot their favorite coffee person's opinions thinking it is fact.
Understood! I was much more explicit in the two videos I shot today that what I say is what I believe based off my interpretation of data at hand. A lot of that was based in part off this video. I want to ensure I stave away that sort of unquestioning status. I want people to know I'm fallible, James is fallible, Rao and Gagne are fallible, etc. Appreciate it!
SUBSCRIBING is the best way to support the channel if you want to see more like this.
Business Inquiries- michael.j.fabian.bus@gmail.com
www.patreon.com/michael_j_fabian
instagram.com/michael_j_fabian
James Hoffmann - and also Tim Wendelboe - do not attract argument because of the way they present and communicate. They're diplomatic. They do not pontificate like a consultant out to get business like, well, some coffee consultants. They don't force an opinion on others. Neither person's livelihood depends on convincing others that they are 'right' - so there are no opposing 'wrong' people getting their backs up.
I feel like we're talking about Scott Rao without talking about Scott Rao.
@@coffeecoffee1225 I wasn't thinking of Scott Rao at all. It does seem that some of the things that he has written have been taken way out of context, but that's not on him.
100% agree on this.
A lot of discourse on the Internet is not discourse at all, but rather an effort to get eyeballs and clicks. So that leads to controversy for controversy's sake. James to me, appears more like a teacher presenting information for people absorb and use as they wish. Perhaps by design he chooses not stir the pot unnecessarily and yet still gets eyeballs and clicks. Interesting.
I think he just leaves no/or a really small attack surface open. He states facts when he has measured things and clearly states opinions when it's about his preferences. About the facts there is nothing to argue. The interpretation is still open to everyone. And for his opinions, it's different. You can agree or disagree but this is how a constructive discussion can evolve. So i think there is no lack of opposing tastes/theories, I just think that he encourages discussions in a constructive manner.
Right on!
@@subi7o Out of interest - what are the missing steps you are referring to?
@@subi7o you need to get out more
@@subi7o I don't think he intended the guide to be all inclusive. It is a simple guide for the layman coffee drinker that wants to try v60. If you want more, try this resource: www.scottrao.com/the-physics-of-filter-coffee
@@subi7o Do you really think he wasn't aware of all those factors? Lol do you want the V60 guide video to be 2-3 hrs lecture or sth?Haha You are just pretentious dumb guy man.
I think because James always frames his analysis as his opinion, he never comes across as snobbish, even outside of specialty coffee. Scott Rao and Matt Perger present their findings as “this is better” and factual, rather than opinion most of the time.
It’s not what his opinions are, it’s how he presents and represents them as a person.
Michael, bravo my friend. This is a topic I’ve been wanting to talk about but just couldn’t really find the words.
This has been a source of frustration for me, and I’m sure other coffee folks here and else where, and like you said this isn’t on James. He’s been extremely polite and helpful to me both privately and publicly. It’s essentially Stan culture, and it’s a problem in every genre and topic.
I don’t have a way to solve it, and even though James frames his opinions as opinions they are widely considered fact among a large swath of people. I think that is just the byproduct of having the largest audience in a particular topic.
Even though I envy James’ video quality, sub count, views, hair and accent I don’t envy that level of influence. Being able to essentially destroy a business in one video is something that would weigh heavy on me for negative reviews.
Anyway, regardless. Great topic, well said, you’ve earned a subscriber.
Yeah... Undoubtedly, his hair...
You can tell he's self conscious about having that kind of power, though. He's a lot more hesitant to give frank remarks, these days.
First of all, I do see debates and disagreement with his position on reddit and home-barista. Maybe you should spend more time reading the forums. Second, what exactly he should be critiqued for? Can you give some good example when he made very controversial point and auditory didn't react adequately? So far your point sounds more like people should disagree with him because they could.
James Hoffmann probably disagrees with himself more than anyone else. I have “The Best of Jimseven” and it’s a remarkable time capsule, because you can see how his thinking on different matters changed between 2004 and 2015. But I think that has a lot to do with just why he’s so authoritative and widely disagreeable - he has spent the past 15+ years relentlessly experimenting, and being unafraid to admit when he was wrong about something. That said, I can’t say that I’ve seen any significant pushback against Scott Rao. After all, we have him to thank for EKspresso and the Allongé, amongst other broadly accepted trends and recipes. The most significant pushback I’ve seen against Perger has to do with his racism. As for Schomer, he’s done a lot of good, but his idea of what espresso should taste like is rooted in the idea that the Northern Italians perfected the craft long ago, and innovations in roasting are somehow undesirable for espresso. By all accounts, Vivace makes some of the best espresso in Seattle, but he’s still fundamentally a traditionalist. Hoffmann is the most public face of continual experimentation, learning, evolution of thought, and even applying scientific principles to arrive at better results.
The funny thing about it is that James himself distances himself from any sort of position of 'absolute truth'. This phenomenon is probably due to a mix of various things, instead of any single one. I don't have an answer, but I agree with the statement; a lot of what he says is taken as gospel. Healthy debate should be an option for any opinion (opinion, not fact).
I think people do argue and don't agree with him on everything. Examples, there are millions of fans of the Aeropress Go, and James did not like that gadget. There are millions of people who prefer another V60 technique over James's. The point is that Hoffmann does not generate hatred. His videos have almost no dislikes. He is a nice, polite and classy guy, at heart, a Barista who has never lost sight of the fact that attention and service to the (public) customer is the most important thing. Internet trolls are loud, and they amplify the noise they generate. When someone doesn't have trolls attacking them, it generates that impression of condescension from people.
james hoffman is the only youtube coffee guy i’ve ever seen to make short videos dedicated to apologising for a small mistake (usually due to over-critique). i think everyone appreciates this sort of behaviour and manner, which is why people are willing to have a more constructive discussion and get less heated when opinions differ :))
The time has come. We must ALL mix metric and imperial in all of our recipes, in protest. ONLY grams of coffee to ounces of water moving forward!
My speculation as I follow a number of Coffee “influencers”: James has over the years learned how to “talk”… One day he cleaned this channel with the videos where he was trashing products and he explained why. In learning to “talk” he did not make “opinions” unless these opinions were subjective to his taste (instead of say - flats are always better than conical). As of the last couple of years, the way he communicates tries to be impartial, and that is important. There is a difference between having opinions and to be opinionated… it is a thin line when we talk, but easy to see once on video.
Most influencers communicate more than they should… this is better than that, opinion on products not released, etc… even when James hits something he dislikes (i.e. 9 bar presets on his espresso machine video) he tells you that he does not like it, scuffs at it… wonders why that is the case, asks people to tell him why that may be the case…
James has GROWN to speak in public - that was not always the case and the followers you see is a consequence of that… its not that people fear contradict him (I don’t agree with his choice of hand grinder for example) but that unlike 98% of all RUclipsrs/IG James has found a way to be inclusive… by means of the way he speaks… He does not have 900,000 followers because he is controversial, it is because even when you disagree, he kinda explained his way out of your disagreement.
He uses fun equipment that most people do not have access to… but unlike say Lance Hedrick who claims “no burrs unless they are flat” with a Niche in the background, I find that James will play to a wide range of audience… a cheap grinder, what makes a cheap grinder… should you start with a cheap grinder?… that sort of thing… I like Hedrick BTW… (if he only could keep himself from repeating something 87 times in a row)… but James will instead try to steer away from making people feel like they made the wrong choice.
Example: (and this is not an attach, this is more constructive criticism)…Telling people they bought a KEY to be in architecture digest while having low value/$ ratio compared to a Niche - may not really hit well with many and in truth, it is not even fair (as the Niche - if you can find it, costs 1800 delivered to many countries, including Canada). That may not be the words James would had used… he would go: “This looks nice to me… to my taste, it looks and it feels right… it is a pleasure to use…. this one, not, really…. Maybe this style appeals to you, but my preference is this one, this one gives me joy to use…. This one is more expensive, but I can see where the money went into, it feels solid, time and energy went into the design… it is ridicusly expensive, but yes, I can see where the money went into”… If you watch his episode comparing grinders, you’ll recognize some of these phrases…
So not fear… I think James has, over the course of many years, trial and error, perhaps coaching/self learning… grown to moderate how he addresses the work that people put into products and to respect the choices that people has made… while informing others in the various subjects he addresses… not fear… I think it is a bit of respect :)
Just saw this comment. I think you have grossly misrepresented me. But no worries! Cheers
First off; kudos for spelling his name correctly. I don't know why it's a pet peeve of mine when I see his name misspelled so often. But more importantly, I think you bring up a great talking point. No doubt, pretty much all of the specialty coffee drinking world loves James Hoffmann, and for good reason; he's articulate, friendly and not snobby He gets a message across that the vast majority of the coffee consuming public would appreciate or at least take lesson from. I adore James. That being said, folks on this side of the specialty coffee world shouldn't be surprised to see a "famous coffee person" like James, who've racked up just shy of a million followers on RUclips in a few short years, being the fence-riding-non offensive persona that he is.
There's plenty of highly opinionated, quickly agreed with coffee professionals in this industry. I think James Hoffmann had the foresight to know in order to build his brand and following, that it was better to be a passive commentator on most coffee topics. Most research into RUclips algorithms will show that for the most part, people subscribe and rarely unsubscribe, so the number of subscribers doesn't correlate to the actual static audience at any one given time.
I think James has earned his place in coffee culture in his form of outreach, but I don't think he believes himself to be immune from criticism or counter-talking points.
This video feels like the coffee RUclipsr equivalent of a young upstart rapper releasing a diss track challenging the G.O.A.T in order to clout chase. :-) At least that’s better than the James follow-on videos that copy something he did without acknowledging it. That phenomenon happens across creator subcultures in RUclips. I believe this phenomenon more than a lack of criticism increases James’ standing without a counterpoint. I agree that people follow James in an unquestioning way, but I think he also encourages experimentation and regularly admits when he’s wrong, when he has a theory, what the results of his experiments show, and how he might be wrong given all of the above. We need more authentic voices and differentiated content, not necessarily more criticism.
He always get it wrong when it comes to blind tasting. And he admit it.
I have noticed the pattern you mention, especially on Reddit among beginners looking for brewing advice or gear recommendations. Many people seem to take his “Ultimate _____ Guide” and gear reviews as gospel, without forming their own opinions or testing anything themselves. But that’s a problem lying in every online forum, at least from what I’ve seen in musical equipment, kitchen knives, and liquor discussions.
That said, I have seen a fair amount of pushback re: his Clever and French Press brewing guides.
I don’t see James really trying to “push coffee forward” in the same way as someone like Scott Rao or Jonathan Gagne, for instance. No slight to James at all, but even in his more informative videos (Weird Coffee Science, mostly), he’s basically just citing research papers or things he’s read online and testing the ideas himself. He just occupies a different space in the field. So in that sense, I think part of the reason he doesn’t get any blow back is that he’s mostly presenting other people’s ideas.
Again, no slight to James. I love his stuff. I think he’s very good about crediting people, being impartial in his tests, and clarifying that what he’s saying isn’t the end all. The problem is with the user. Imo.
His content is phenomenal, some of the best in the specialty coffee realm. It’s extremely simple and very well taught. And as others mention, he rarely says “this is the BEST.” He says “this is the best, for me.” Which, everyone should think that way on most things in life. He’s taught me a very important thing: People drink what they enjoy. Meaning I can’t be out here saying “you don’t like light roast? You’re an idiot!”
And this is how all arguments work.. people who blanket statement are the easiest to argue with. “This is better.” “No, it is not.”
Vs “this is better for me” few people have the folly to respond with “no James, that is not actually better for you. Because I know you better than you.”
I’m sure James is also aware of and often frustrated with this issue. He has to essentially discontinue his more critical product reviews of his early channel, because some of his more loyal fans bullied the companies.
It’s also interesting how once he covers a topic, there’s an overnight change in discussion in favor of whatever he states. When prior to him covering a topic, you can actually have quality discussion. You can see it with product reviews, or with tips like “stir, don’t swirl”, etc.
Love James, but the god status people have given him ultimately hurts his ability to be a critical voice who can share his opinions free of concern of what his audience will do with that info.
He's deeply knowledgeable, he's charming, he's self-effacing, he's got sense of humor, his vids look classy and are beautifully edited...and in every episode he asks viewers if they agree or disagree, and to comment if they do things differently. All that probably takes the air out of a lot of angry balloons.
From my observation, it seems like people are very quick to promote him without also presenting other's work/opinions. It doesn't seem to me to be as much of a problem of people thinking that dissenting opinions are bad, but it seems like it's just something where people have the attitude of "why look any further when Hoffman already has developed the ultimate method?".
My most upvoted comment on Reddit is from the Aeropress Reddit or somebody asked what people thought of the Hoffman Ultimate Aeropress technique and I basically just said I thought it was "just another Aeropress recipe". This tells me that there's quite a few people who would agree that he's being put on maybe a bit too high of a pedestal than any person should have. It's something that likely sucks for him because he has a responsibility to use his voice carefully.
What I am trying to do now is to intentionally follow, support and promote other voices in the specialty coffee world. Like you said, there's nothing wrong with James himself, but there just needs to be a variety of voices out there. I am encouraged that I see a number of creators that are not only building their own content but are encouraging and promoting each other.
Some of the channels I've been catching up on are: Coffee with Carl, Kyle Rowsell, Lance Hendrick, The Coffee Chronicler, The Real Sprometheus and Xris. Subscribing to you now too!
Michael, can you give a few examples where you strongly disagree with Hoffmann? If not, then maybe you can simply look inwards to find the answer...
Old video but still very relevant. It got me thinking. I think the reason is that, unlike a truly mammoth hobby industry like video games, gourmet coffee hobbyist is a small industry, and almost everyone involved with the industry feels, in some way, that they personally have an interest in James Hoffman being successful, because of how important he is to this burgeoning industry. It's in no one's self interest to shit on him. So it leads to a form of self policing. That and the fact he is a genuinely wholesome and well loved, nice seeming guy.
I think this is a valid observation.
The analogy I have is something in martial arts termed “Sensei compliance”
It’s basically when a student or pupil follows the moves of the teacher or sensei so that the sequence has the desired effect. Eg a punch is thrown in a certain way, and deflected with a block in a certain way, with perhaps a counterstrike in a certain way. In the training arena it always works because the pupil follows the teacher’s exact moves and instruction, its almost expected - so the teacher isn’t made to look bad! But out in the real world fights do not follow sequence.
This is the same thing with James’ content. It’s excellent but the pupils all follow it to the letter without thinking beyond the words, not wanting to resist or make the teacher look bad!
James of course is very eloquent and charismatic- which adds to his believability.
Hoffman’s reviews and comments are most often prefaced with disclaimers and sprinkled with self-effacement. When he opines on anything, he carefully explains that he is in a subjective arena and encourages viewers to research the subject matter themselves. His reasoning is carefully explained and the basis for his conclusions are outlined in detail, nothing dogmatic outside of his personal thoughts and feelings which are his to own and broadcast. There’s never a “you must do this or buy that” but rather the suggestion that, based on his research and nearly unmatched body of experience, one could own, achieve, and/ or experience whatever he covered in his video. He ends every video asking viewers to share their comments ... because of all this he attracts an intelligent audience who generally are looking for well researched and informed opinion, they aren’t looking for an argument.
I remember Hoffman once said that he sometimes pre-grinds his coffee before he goes to bed so that he can put one of his machines on a timer and wake up to already brewed coffee. Now, *that* is a hot take I'm pretty sure people disagreed with.
Because he communicates better than most of other coffee channels here.
Others merely adapted to coffee, The Hoff was born in it.
I think a good example of why James doesn’t generate a lot of push back is his ultimate series. It’s obviously only called that for the algorithm but he never picks a winner. He always presents his findings and says I think I like this better but this might work for someone who does things differently than me or has a different taste than me. I don’t think his opinion is taken as the word of god because he doesn’t present it as such. He says here’s what I like tell me what you liked.
It's actually ridiculous how everyone did a whole 180 on the inverted method of the Aeropress after his video released…
I see what you did there...
Thank you Michael! People need to here this
The largest portion of his fans are intermediate level coffee enthusiasts. They are not the ones going to home barista to argue the fine details of RO water vs distilled.
Spot on! Glad to see you back. Still haven’t tasted Cola Coffee though ;)
I think maybe partly because James often shoot his own foot and still share the incident anyway; he made a strong opinion of a particular topic, later he proves it wrong by himself. The "Spoon - My Nemesis" episode is an hilarious example to watch.
I think that you don’t see a lot of disagreement because James Hoffman has done a great job of reaching non coffee geek audience. In his comment section you often see things like, “I don’t even drink coffee but I love this guy!”
I think he’s a great in into the world of specialty coffee, and I think he’s all the in a lot of folks need. You follow his advice, you get tasty results. Maybe not the tastiest, maybe not the most interesting, but always good. That’s all a lot of people want.
Love James and agree with 90% of what he says. I Kno people who feel his word is god and I feel food is subjective and what one prefers, another may disagree. I've found this with some things he's said such as doses with dark/light. Others may disagree with James as well when he says he prefers flat burrs to conical and that's ok. We should all just join in the conversation but don't make things defacto
But I understand the whole, having-coffee-convos, and people say “well Hoffman says…” and the truest of coffee scientists get triggered and say “Hoffman isn’t the only voice you know.” And there can be healthy discussion there. But if he’s incorrect on things, or certain opinions (as a video like this suggests… obv if this guy agrees with everything James says he wouldn’t make a video like this), then the people who ARE correct need to make better content. Cause currently James’ content is some of the best.
It’s ease of use too. Starbucks has thousands of locations and solve the problem of people wanting tasty caffeine. James is a similar thing content-wise, stirring and answering people’s “is there more?” curiosities.
He does not have strong opinions about a lot of things, hence there's no need to argue.
I'd be welcoming someone in coffee that fills this void
Interesting take Michael. The only recent of someone “opposing” publicly James’ opinion was following his review of the D64 grinder: I found the Portakeeper video on his channel interesting as it offered a different view based on experience. I think that as any other kind of media, it is healthy to have a broad variety of sources with different views, so you can form your own opinions. That being said, I love James’ videos (and hair!) and I have to thank him for introducing me to the world of specialty coffee!
i don't think james would like this video, you surely opened a door that most of us didn't think of.
The antidote is the same as it is for all cults of personality. People need to remember that these guys are just humans with a single palate - their own. They can give you some good rules of thumb, but at the end of the day, it's about what *you* taste in the cup, so brew it the way you like it.
James does make incredibly detailed content that is quite often very close to airtight, however, with any sort of opinion (let's call it a hypothesis) there needs to be some sort of pushback in order for the growth and betterment of the hypothesis. There is a reason that scientific articles need to be peer-reviewed.
With the recent growth seen in the coffee community, alot of new entrants have taken the word of James to be that of god, since he was how they discovered and fell in love with coffee. I think this is just a phase of the online community that is struggling with only having one superstar.
It's funny how most of the backlash I've seen from James has been people within the specialty coffee itself instead of fans! Like the one controversy he had with the Elixir coffee people, or his removal of "comically negative" reviews from his channel because he was "punching low".
One thing I've been a bit curious about is how a lot of specialty coffee people seem to get weirdly ... pissy? About Hoffmann's usage of the word "ultimate" to describe his recipe/technique videos. The guy is unfailingly polite and always reminds people that these are *his* ultimate techniques, that others exist and should be tried, but other specialty coffee channels always seem to make it a point to start their similar videos taking a jab at him (or maybe at his audience?) by starting with a variation of "There's no such thing as an ultimate technique", or "I don't like using superlatives when I talk about my recipes, like super, or ultra hahaha!" and it just comes across as weirdly petty. Or at least it did, until I watched this video. It must be frustrating as hell to try and come up with different ideas and legitimize other points of view when so many people take his word as gospel, despite that obviously not being his intent.
Still, it sucks that he's kind of becoming "an institution", because I remember him saying in a video somewhere that this is something he's explicitly trying to avoid, citing the example of... some guy from the wine world (whose name i can't recall -- I'm not a wine person at all!) whose reviews end up meaning the rise and fall of different wines, and this being the reason why he explicitly avoids reviewing actual coffees.
Robert Parker
There are comments that I see which disagree with James to some level - as do I on certain fronts (not that my views as an average home espresso enthusiast hold any real weight)
I think your theory about the function of size seems likely.
If the online coffee community get their info from multiple sources - there is inherently discussion and debate as every individual will have looked at different source.
When one particular, and very credible, source dominates, that source's views thus become more dominant and more widely agreed upon in the community. This thus leads to wider agreement and less debate than when people's info comes from multiple sources.
Also, as other comments here have said, I think James does a pretty good job of explaining that his views are just his opinions and encouraging people to see what works for themselves.
What's going on can be dangerous to both his followers and himself. When he becomes too influential. He himself once admitted that he somewhat destroyed a sincere business just because he said he hated it. And he immediately took down that video after knowing it.
He might not know it, but his followers take his word like gospel. However, he kept showing the mistake he made in blind tasting. But people just don't get it.
it reminds me the similarity of a religion or a cult.
I feel like I see plenty of "dissent", sometimes not on content but on his approach or standard of judgment. Just have to look for places where people are thinking critically and discussing, not places where people just want answers. Often it's hard to disagree with most of his particular points. More often, it's style and his standard for me - for example, I didn't like that he mentioned the g-iota is very good if you tinker with it, but dropped the issue at that. The grinder gained immense attention in no small part *because* it is a good platform for the tinkering. Problems can be fixed and good burrs can be well aligned for cheap, no wait. But he reviewed it as an out of box option. Understandable, but maybe misses the pt
Because James is a wicked nice guy!
Yes, the videos are just filled with idolizing comments (with quotes )
My least watched video is one where I openly challenged his idea of the "ultimate pumpkin spice latte". Coincidence I think not lol. You should go read the description in that video. I also think James does get his fair share of (mainly undeserved) hate for his sheer popularity as the Oprah Winfrey of coffee, and is openly memed and mocked amongst a certain percentage of coffee people. Check r/coffeecirclejerk on Reddit. Overall, I think as others have said, he does a good job of hedging his bets rather than preaching some kind of coffee gospel, which keeps him pretty bullet proof and likeable compared to the other coffee elites. For a lot of people, he might be the only coffee channel they watch on YT and so I agree that there is a risk of his opinions becoming confused with fact. Like his hate of the Fellow Ode or his other general ergonomics preferences which people may not realize are pretty specific to his own personal preferences
Or his dislike of the df64. Which is the only true heir to the niche throne.
@@andrewcramer7214 I agree with his holistic view of the df64. It's way too 'aliexpress'. The fact that it's sold as different brands in different places is very concerning to me from a customer care point of view.
@@ahpadt That's not really true, they just allowed their distributors the ability to rebrand it. That's incredibly common in every industry.
There is one 1 distributor per country, this makes sense for a small company just starting out, to outsource distribution and work solely on the product.
The us distributor does a great job of taking care of any issues that pop up, if you think about it from a customer service perspective it's a benefit in most cases.
I've had my grinder since they first hit the us, it's been perfect so far.
It's not the niche killer because a conical Burr with a plastic gearbox can't touch it. It's really just an ugly lagom p64. Static is no worse than the lagom anyway lol.
Thank you for posting this. For those that have missed the message of the video, Michael is touching on something very real and annoying in the coffee world.
My speculation is that people who go to James channel are very new to coffee and seem to take his pontifications as if it’s the agreed upon truth. Internalize that thought process while you make your journey through the coffee world and you’re going to have a very distorted view of the world.
Thanks for sharing!
You make an excellent point here. Well made video. It's healthy to question authority, and I say that as a fan of Mr. Hoffman.
No one disagrees with Hoffmann? What are you talking about? People on coffee forums disagree with him all the time.
I think it's because his content is generally delivered in a way that's non confrontational and expressed in no absolute terms. It's hard to disagree with much of what he says when it is almost always paired with the cop out "for me".
To be honest, I think his content has gotten lazy. The latest video on water for example. Ok he compared 4 brands of coffee water additives. So what. He only gave subjective feedback on unknown water recipes. Who learned what from that video.
Good content would be trying out different coffee recipes himself and then comparing them to the commercial ones. With some objective measures such as extraction alongside his subjective taste.
bro... it's that british accent =]
My theory is that its just the style of his delivery that squelches dissent. It's a well entrenched mechanism of psychology. Dale Carnegie-esque. Watch his content again, he never really takes a stance his audience would find particularly controversial. He's the vanilla bean of the coffee bean community. He presents things more-or-less matter of factly and then pulls the audience in with his "tell me where I missed something" pitch at the end. As a result, there's never really something to "attack." At the end of the day, he's just good at this well-known style of delivery. The Ryan Seacrest of the coffee genre if you will.
Hoffmann is likeable, entertaining and has good comedic timing for not being a comedian, but I do not find much of what he does to be highly informative. To me, his content is too wishy-washy with no right or wrong answer - its whatever you like. Perhaps on the subject, coffee, that usually boils down to taste, that is absolutely the right attitude but again, I do not find it highly informative. Now he has presented some subjects that lent themselves to more objective presentations and for me, those were his best videos.
Another related view I have: Rao, as an example you used, is not as likeable, nor as personable to many I suspect - his personality is not as friendly and he seems more introverted. Many might question him more simply because they do not like him as much but I find his stuff more objective with a more decisive presentation, and would prefer his style when I am trying to learn something new or receive instructions on do something I had not done before since it is cut and dry with no lose ends. His information is more detailed and objective in my view and I value that more than likeability.
Basically, if I really wanted to learn something new with ongoing discourse, I would want Rao to be my teacher not Hoffmann, but if I wanted a general summary about a subject that I was going to explore more on my own, I would probably want Hoffmann to give that introduction.
Was that a public statement of intent? James i am coming for you. My name is Michael Fabian and I shall be your first!
What’s the purpose of this video! It doesn’t add any value to the coffee community 🤷🏻♂️
Nothing he says does. He's also immeasurably dull and I think this is a failed attempt at creating a viral video.
cant disagree with GOD now can you
I have definitely noticed this phenomenon. It is similar to how Joe Rogan’s audience will defend him at all costs. James did go on a podcast, and show his vulnerability with someone that was negatively effected by his review of their product. Worth a watch, if you haven’t seen it already.
ruclips.net/video/pjbLWJxElIc/видео.html
I think this is a nothing burger. It’s an uLara niche observation, for an ultra niche cohort of ultra niche specialty coffee commentary. I enjoy James videos. He doesn’t spread gospel. He’s nuanced and diplomatic. I don’t agree with him all the time. I also am not compelled to tear him up because of that. In my brutally honest opinion, this video kinda makes you look petty and jealous of his following. Ronaldo has 320M followers on Instagram. Most other football players don’t. Get over it and go play football and enjoy.
I have disagreed with him in a video where he talks about waste and that take away cups are only a small % of total waste and I commented if all the industries look out for their waste as we should with single use cups etc etc....
I enjoy some of his content, but how fanatical his fans are really sours my perception of him and the greater coffee community.
That's fair. Maybe he could learn from Anthony Fantano in encouraging a little dissent.
@@144avery I don't know if it is so much his fault as how dedicated his fans are. I've seen a similar attitude from fans of Scott Rao and Lance Hedrick both to a lesser extent.
Oh no! That's no good. I'm sorry to see my name brought up. Do you have steps forward I could take to lessen the issue? I only just started 3 months ago, so I want to nip this on the bud! Appreciate the feedback
@@LanceHedrick I don't think you are doing anything wrong on your side. The issue for me is how prevalent stan culture is in the coffee community (think how obsessive Hoffman fans can be, etc), the incestuous nature of marketing and influencers.
Again I don't think you are doing anything wrong, it's just frustrating when overnight many unquestioningly parrot their favorite coffee person's opinions thinking it is fact.
Understood! I was much more explicit in the two videos I shot today that what I say is what I believe based off my interpretation of data at hand. A lot of that was based in part off this video. I want to ensure I stave away that sort of unquestioning status. I want people to know I'm fallible, James is fallible, Rao and Gagne are fallible, etc.
Appreciate it!
I do not agree with him about the quality and roast level of beans. Also his grinder review of the EK was irritating.