Taper Talk
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- Опубликовано: 13 сен 2024
- A video about the differences between different tapers: ISO/NT DIN 2080, MAS 403 BT, DIN 69871 and ANSI/CAT. I also show the Deckel-style taper with S20x2 thread and some threaded morse tapers.
The book I mention in the video is available here:
www.engineersbl...
Very nice and professional video Mattias. It was very informative on the different types of tapers out there for machine tools.
ABOM 大神 I GOT YOU
Highly recommended for a concise overview on tapers.
Good work, much appreciated.
Thank you very much for taking the time to explain tapers, especially the difference between the 40 tapers. Like another commenter, I also recently purchased a mill and was confused by the different 40 taper standards that are available. Your explanation was very helpful! Thanks again!
This is an excellent informative video I use to show all my apprentices for many years now. I wish you still made good videos😊
Hi. I am about buying a second hand old milling machine and had no idea about all the complex tooling nomenclatures, so thank you for that. It's a great video that sorted me out.
The only thing I miss is to know the differences between the different ER (32/40/50) cones types you mentioned
Please feel free to contact me if you need collet and holders. My Email:zhengyu03@sdzhengyu.com
Perfect! I have exactly the same problem getting through to an understanding of the standards that abound. I am so pleased with your descriptions, and now know better what to order. My tapers have 40-27 stamped in them and the threads are M16. I will be making a new drawbar with 5/8" threads to also be able to use holders from the States. I've checked out the Swedish company you recommended and because I read Danish, I was able to navigate the web site without problem. Thanks! I may send you a list of what I need in case you find a used item you yourself don't need. Great and useful video. Again, you are quite good at teaching. Much appreciated. I have watched each of your videos twice!
Hmm.. the 27 might be the diameter of the mill you put on the arbor. The common metric diameters are 16, 22, 27, 32, 40 and 60 mm.
Look here:
shop.otdtools.se/hallande-verktyg/iso40-din2080-/planfrasdornar/717
Thanks Mattias. I have now figured out how to communicate using Google+ and then won't have to load up your comments page with my "stuff". I'm American, been living in Greenland for the last 36 years. My father's mother was Swedish, so I am too in part. Really thankful for you videos. Enjoy your work!
Just stepped into milling as a hobby...your video was a great help for me to understand how tapers work. Thank you!
Just got a milling machine and was very confused, why the collet chuck i bought didn´t fit (draw bar not setting). Now you brought a lot of light into this issue! Thanks for that comprehensive explanation!
I'm new to engineering, and your video solved a lot of my questions about tapers.
My Hurco mill uses BT30 tapers I believe ( bought it recently )
Thanks for your great video
Thank you for the very well done and informative video. I've seen other videos with 40 taper, 50 taper, etc holders, but this is the first that discussed them in an organized and detailed manner. Good job.
In software there is a saying, "the best thing about standards is that there are so many of them." In case it isn't clear to anyone, it is meant sarcastically.
I, like you, am going to have to move to a different house if I want a nice shop. Maybe in a couple of years.
-- Mike
Thanks! Tapers had me confused for a while, ordering the wrong stuff and so on.
I just tried to make the kind of video that would have helped me when I first started out.
Fantastic explanation, I have been trying to make sense of the taper saga for a while now and your explanation was just what I needed to see. I have recently purchased a used Mill and am a rank novice and the operators manual states it is a NT30/R8 Taper so that threw me first up and then it came with 3 new BT30 tools which further made me confused and then I found an ISO30 tool in the mill so that was the final straw so have been researching heaps and came to some conclusions which your video validated, so again, many thanks, regards, Gordon
+Gordon Agent I was quite puzzled myself, until I figured it out. Great that my video helped you! Good luck with your mill!
Mattias, Thank you very much, you have solved a great mystery for me, did lot of search on google for the differences between different holders. Finally you have answered to all my questions. Great Video and very informative. Cheers !
If you cant use the the din69871 because of the shortened slot. Atleast it works pretty great to scratch you machinebed.
Just my way of saying thanks for the effort of sfaring your workshop experiences to keep us from making mistakes. And I actually learned some stuff.
This is exactly the video I was looking for. Thank you.
Wonderful information , I knew most but leant so stuff too.
I've had to do similiar analysis of lathe chuck tapers to make too to fit customer machines that are all similiar but different!
Thank you Warren
thanks for making this video. very helpful.
Thank you for this great video. I was just really confused about all these tapers and tool holders. Now I have some idea of the differences. Thanks
Better late than never. Wonderful video making quite simple a topic which can confound even the smartest newbie machinist. Many thanks sir!
Thank you for the video. Very clear and informative. All the best from Scotland
Excellent information. Thanks Mattias.
I wonder, is there something obviously wrong with making taper tooling from mild or unhardened steel, they mostly seem to be hardened and ground. But if one wanted to make some custom tooling, any reason unhardened steel wouldn't work, aside from being more damage prone and requiring more careful handling?
10/10 for the arbor jig. Top idea. But for the drawbar thread, I found ISO, INT, NT and NMTB40 arbors the same. Useful if one is searching ebay for bargain.
Thanks,
Tom Australia
Well, yes and no. ISO 40 tapers can also have a 5/8 UNC. Do pause the video at the taper drawings and have a look at the tables!
Thanks for showing this. I have only used the morse and R8 tapers.
Good video. I'm building a small machine and have been confused with all the spindles with different taper and tooling types. This clears some of it up.
BTW, I think those rings are just called 'dog rings' in english.
Quite helpful, thanks for taking the time to edit this.
Phenomenal Mattias. Great info
Great set of information, very well presented, thanks. I've just ordered a floor standing mill with ISO40 and was wondering how feasible it would be to use some of the MT2 tooling I already have for my minimill, looks like an ER32 holder will be my first purchase (and I'll fabricate a jig like yours for tightening it up).
thanks for the video brother
I would only add that you are the most elegant miller in the world........
good
Well done! Very informative. I may be able to apply some of the methods to my machine. Thanks for sharing.
mattias excellent video it helped me A LOT! I'm building a mill from scratch and is the first one for me so I did not know shit about this until now! haha thank you and regards from Buenos Aires!
Hello Mattias. The asymetric thread on the Deckel tooling would usually be described as a buttress form. You mostly see it on vices, but it makes sense for a drawbar (except that in that application a convention thread is strong enough and easier to cut). I mostly use an autolock style chuck for endmills as seen in my video here; ruclips.net/video/nX9GRGKIrNw/видео.html which cannot slip. The cutters also go in to a fixed depth. The screwed shank cutters are common in the UK, but almost unheard of in the US, don't know about your part of the world.
So that's called a buttress thread in english. Good to know! The germans call it "sägegewinde", that's why I thought it would be called a sawtooth thread in english. That chuck for endmills seems clever. I have some second hand endmills that have threads on them, but I didn't know why until I watched your video. Thanks for posting!
Mattias Kristiansson
I think I've still got a 40 taper Clarkson Autolock chuck somewhere if you're interested.
The tool holder for the vise is a nice idea.
Excellent video and very clear.Enjoyed it
A very good explanation regarding some of the various tapers.
Thanks....13
Excellent video
This is very helpful. thank you. I have subscribed for updates
Thanks, Very well done.
Mattias, just a warning about using collets to hold end mills. I have seen many a piece scrapped using that method because the end mill migrated downward due to no mechanical lock. I dream of having a shop like yours.
There's a risk, especially with the collets that go directly into the Deckel 40 taper. (I show them in the Fresnel Adapter video). I think I even had it happening once. I think the risk with the ER-32 system is small, since I can hold it well in my home-made holder and tighten it hard with a long wrench. So far I haven't had any endmill slip in the ER-32 collets.
Very usefull. There is not enough light in this dark world of tapers mania....Around here, there is some machine still using Jarno (?) or Brown and Sharpe tapers...
This australian book you showed is very well made, every machinist should have one. It is a kind of "little Machinist Handbook"...
Thank you for making me less stupid....
worthless. the exact tapers are well known and a person should be using the math and the exact angles never refer to a book
Thanks for your video! So ISO/NT 40 is the same dimensions according to the book. So, we can use ISO40 cones on NT40 machines or the inverse (NT40 cones on ISO40 machines) if we have the corresponding drawbar threads since I suppose NT means Imperial threads and ISO means Metric thread ?
Good one. And well presented, thank you.
Thank you very much Mattias, learned something. I have a Deckel FP2 I am trying to get some ISO 40 in, do you have a link to ebay where I can find the rings and threaded pieces you mention?
Thanks for sharing. I use R8 tapers, but have wanted to learn about others.
Well explained, thank you.
When you screw tightening the morse taper(have back internal thread hole),why the taper fitting not rotating itself,I mean why you can tighten down the morse tool.
Hi Mattias , i have a BT spindle on my homemade milling machine, and the tools also BT30 , my question is if the SK30 working on a BT30 spindle ?
Very informative video! Thanks for posting.. I have a rather large Swiss lathe, that was probably made in the late 1800s, to early 1900s based on the headstock bearings. I need help in identifying the type of taper in the spindle and tailstock. I am familiar with Morse tapers, and I know that it is not that type. Any help in identifying the taper would be greatly appreciated, as I need to acquire some tooling for the lathe.. Thanks again..
Very clear explanation , thanhs!
The tool holder you made to put in your vice is so simple, yet this is the first time I have seen one. Brilliant. I thought what I have of mill holders are called NMTB. You didn't mention that acronym in your video. The first tool holder you sho as ISO 40 taper looks like what came with my machine when I purchased it. Is that what you call a 40 taper or are all the types you show 40 tapers with small variations? The end mill ER32 holder has a blue ring on the tool holder. Is it the same as taper ISO40?
I think the NMTB is sort of like the name for the taper itself. As you can see in the video, and tell from the drawings i clipped in, the actual taper is the same. Do pause the video at the drawings and have a closer look!
The ER32 holder is ISO40. The other tapers don't have the part that protrudes from the short end of the taper, as shown at 1:49.
Good explanation clear understanding. What about showing examples of milling and helpful hints.
+Gill V Check out my video "Jaws". There's plenty of milling on the Abene.
Hallå! Bra video!
Vet du om det går eller hur man byter kona på fräsverktyg? alltså jag har en planfräs med en helt rak kona (vad man nu ska ha en helt rak kona till..), kan jag plocka av den här raka konan och sätta på en B40 eller BT40 kona så jag får på den på fräsen?
Is the whole in your jig tapered to match the tooling?
thanks for the video
I bought a nice boring head with MT2 taper that was mounted into the exact MT2 adapter as shown at 08:59.. My mill has an MT2 spindle and I need to separate the two components. I removed the "draw bolt" but for the life of me I cannot get them apart and are worried to ruin a >$500 boring head. Any Ideas?
Hej from Kopparberg!
Nice job!
Today I take off mill head from my ALG200 mill and i've seen it is some difrent between vertical and horizontal spindle for example in vertical can be fixed ISO40 but in horizontal must be BT40 it's strange for me .... Schould be the same i guess ...
A very very useful video thank you Mattias. I wonder if you could add some links to Ebay suppliers for Deckel adaptors that you mentioned?
The ebay seller is franz240455. That's actually a company, Franz Singer Werkzeugmaschinen Reparaturen, in Geretsried, close to Munich, Germany. (www.singer-werkzeugmaschinen.de/) They do complete overhaul on Deckel and accessories, you can buy stuff in used condition or completely overhauled. Franz Singer is a bit expensive though.
If you need Deckel stuff, check german ebay, (ebay.de). There's usually lots and lots there. You will obviously have to pay extra to have it shipped to Australia, but apart from that, Deckel accessories are readily available.
much appreciated Mattias
have you ever used or had experiences with the BT20 spindle?
very nice 👍👍
Could you please say what the Machine name you showed in this video.
thank you i learned something new.
great tutorial.
Great video, researching high-speed shaft design, this is very helpful, does anyone know of an online supplier that stocks those rings used to secure the taper in the slots?
Thank you friend. That's what I searched
Good video explaine a lot to me for my oerlikon italiana M3UL dont have any paper or info on it easier to order cat 40 where i am
thanks for the knowledge
Wonderful ! thank you ! very nice vid
thanks very much it was really useful
9:32 What bolt does that tangless morse taper use? Length, thread size etc. Thanks!
I don't remember, but it depends on if it is Morse 1 or 2 taper, and if is metric or imperial size endmill.
When using the Deckel drive rings. Do you have any spindle runout? Thanks
the drive rings are just that-they are clearance they do not locate the taper. They are drive dogs
I read below and I see we have that buttress thread thing cleared up. :>)
bravo 👏
thank you!🤩
Hello thanks
it's very good video!!!
Do you have a video about ur Deckel FP1?
+Wei Wang My Deckel is an FP2. I haven't done any video on it.
this is nice video
I thought the 40s would be 40mm.
Oh you are konigseggs brother super car maker.
Nice video except for the abuse of that table. Put a wood board over it!
None of your business or is it your table?
Abuse ???
Mujoko jov degha meleg