ER Collet Essentials. Do You Know? - Haas Automation Tip of the Day
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- Опубликовано: 29 сен 2024
- Whether you’re a beginning or advanced machinist, you’ve probably wondered more than once if you’re using the correct collet. With so many to choose from - and often confusing sizes on the collets - it’s hard to know if you’re using the right one. In this valuable Tip of the Day, Mark looks at each type of collet, and explains how and when to use each one.
ER Toolholder Torque Specs. Post your torque-spec links in the comment section!
HaasTooling.com
www.haascnc.co...
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Wow, learned more in 20 minutes here than in hours in the classroom. Great job guys!
Kent VanderVelden
You said it. Very interesting and useful video.
Very well said!!! I agree!
Kent VanderVelden idk my teacher breaks it down well I need a physical teacher hands on he breaks the video down
The best video what i see ever
perhaps pay attention in class once
Thanks for this. What a great video explaining all the collets. RUclips needs more great videos like this.
GREAT VIDEO! Please do more of these educational videos, good to learn from real experts!
All i want to know is how you survived getting run over by that forklift at 7:10 ?
It was his third clone
@@NeilAbalone Hahahah, good one :)
Interesting even that the forklifts and pedestrians share the same path - would never be allowed where I work.
He called for it to take him back to the machine room. Used the forkLyft app on his phone.
@@Phantomthecat lol my dude u union?
Just getting into machining, learned a lot from this video. Thanks
You missed one type of ER-32 in your list. They also make ones with an integral button for the flat on Weldon shanks.
excellent video... thank you
My shop we use rustx that stuff is kinda crazy and works well in preventing rust. We use to use it on parts untill the platers and welders complained that they cant get rustx off the parts.
Mark, what kind of cat 40 tool tightening fixture do you have mounted on your cart or bench? I haven't seen that type before. Was it fabricated in house? If so, do you have a print to share?
Shoutout to the guy who sneezed in the background at 2:33.
So what can I use to keep steel from rusting? Something generic would be nice.
Max Maker I’m a year late, but use a thin coat of oil on bare metal
Please explain the H7, g6 tolerance...
Thank you so much.
Viziunea mea este asta in italia.
Președinte domnul Mattarella iar prim ministru domnul Sgarbi!
dang...i learned a lot and I only have old R8s
Any idea why I have nuts freezing to the tool holder? 18,000 rpm spindle cutting melamine or plastic laminates. I put them together by hand, so they aren't cross threaded. Obvious galling on both threads. No problems for months, then last week I had 3 nuts gall and freeze when disassembling.
I don't even have any machines.. but i'm still watching it lol
;inej tdbiu dty ldi. Dts nmo hnuou!
Tanks.very good
Definitely a lot of very useful and educational material here. However, being the "anal" grammar hound I am, there is a major error at 1:44 in this video. One word...'dampen'. The accepted meaning of the word dampen is to make moist or wet. The elimination of vibration is by "damping" which means (in it's root form - damp) to suppress or lessen.
Have a nice day! Even those who hold George Carlin in high regard, by having other plans!
Keep up the good works!
Well, according to Merriam-Webster:
Definition of DAMPEN
dampened; dampening \ˈdamp-niŋ, ˈdam-pə-\
transitive verb
1 : to check or diminish the activity or vigor of : deaden - the heat dampened our spirits
6:25 ahhh! Sure hope that vending machine has a padded collection tray. We understand machine parts are tool steel harden but the brain doesn’t like seeing anything precision DROPED! 🤪. 12:46 🙁
Just the tip, mind. And only for a second.
That fork truck made me nervous.
Isn't ER short for Erickson? The original maker? You say Rego-Fix came up with ER?
J P
It's an E type collet modified by Regofix.
Indeed. Long answer:
Fritz Weber, a toolmaker from Switzerland, had founded Rego-Fix in 1950.
In 1972 he created and patented the ER collet, by modifying Schaublin's existing double-taper type E collet.
A ridge on the clamping nut he developed clipped into a groove on the collet, so it would self-extract from the toolholder taper when the nut was reversed off.
Weber came up with the “ER” collet designation, with the “R” standing for Rego-Fix.
Haasautomation is correct. Rego-Fix came up with ER. Originally, there was a "E' collet, which was the same as ER, but without the groove. Fritz Weber, the founder of Rego-Fix, carried the design one step further and filed a patent in 1972 for his design as "ER". E for 'E' style collet, 'R' for Reigoldswil, Switzerland, where the company was founded in 1950. Rego-Fix voluntarily gave up their international patent in 1992 to allow the design to become a DIN standard, which they wrote. Rego-Fix is the inventor of most major ER developments since, with the exception of ER25, which was Parlec's idea,.and comes with a some problems....coolant disks, mini-nut," friction-bearing" nut, integral eccentric ring in nut for collet retention, secure grip......
2:31 Bless you
This was very informative, Thanks ! but the only thing I don't like is mugshot videos, better to have more images etc... after all this isn't to promo your looks, is it ?
11:09 *Ａ ＧＯＯＤ ＮＵＴ*
Mark has done it again! So much GREAT information. Thanks Mark.
I prefer to put 3.175mm into a 3-2 collet! I disagree with matching all the sizes.
I think I agree with your experience. We used to run tons of small 1/8" single lip cutters, and I often ran them in 3mm (2-3) collets. 4mm collets (3-4) just felt loose, and left almost no gap. I know that theoretically that would put the cutter on the edges of the collet lands, instead of in the middle of the lands, but I never had any problem, and with tiny cutters if we had problems the tool life would tell us. I still think that using an on-size collet is best, and in general that you never want to run tools that are too big for the collets (squeezing the tool in), but I hear you, there is something about 1/8" (3.175mm) tools where I don't always stick to the rules. Thanks for the comment.
I have no idea how I found my way to this particular corner of the internet but man, this is how educational videos on youtube should be done! Even if I have no use for the information in it that doesn't detract from the face it's fantastically presented and clear as glass. Top job!
Just admit it you’ve put a 12.1mm drill in a 12mm collet when you can’t find a 13mm collet
Good reason to get the inch sized collets also, they provide nice in-between values, like 12.7 mm.
Always makes me feel bad
Thank you. Centering tools with ultimate holding power. Satisfying machinist ocd.
This is an amazing service you guys provide with passion.
Not everyone gets to hang out with old school machinists. Thanks again
Ultimate holding power sure won’t come from ER collets.
@Maciej Jan Długosz Not true; standard shrink fit holders are much stronger than ER collets, but are absolutely not the option with the strongest gripping force. Heavy-wall shrink holders are a big step up, but for “ultimate holding power,” there needs to be a mechanical connection like a “Safe Lock” groove in a shrink holder or a Weldon shank. Even a milling chuck can offer more grip force than standard profile shrink fit holders.
Not a darn thing wrong with ER collet chucks; every shop should have some in my opinion, but they’re not the best option for any one thing.
@Maciej Jan Długosz collets can achieve more clamping than shrink fit.
Shrink fit only allows for a few thousands.
Thus limiting actual holding force.
Collets use a screw and wedge combination to achieve ultimate clamping force, do the math.
@Maciej Jan Długosz actually.
If you couple shrink fit tool holders with loctite 680, no amount of physical force will move the tool providing the tool shank doesn't exceed 450 degrees Fahrenheit to release the adhesive.
Thank you, I'm now an expert in Haas tooling assemblies. 🤜
(No, but seriously: thank you for the course. I need to fix the new Haas machine at my company (buying tools etc) and I didn't know jack shit about it.
So much to learn... I'll have to watch this several times.
Oh wow. Metric in an American made video - maybe there is still hope...
TubbyTimmy: Both systems have their advantages and disadvantages and will always co-exists. There's no reason for bias to favor one over the other. Get used to it.
there is no reason to use imperial. Metric is much simpler because you can say 1mm instead of 0,0393701 inch
@@ipadize By the same token, it's easier to say 4 inches rather than 101.6mm. Your argument is invalid.
@@maxselna5193 dang it... thought nobody would notice :P
but for real, imperial is just too wierd for me
@@ellieprice363 i don't agree with you. the whole imperial system just makes no sense. 1mm is 1/1000 of a m, is 1/1000 of a km. 1/1000 of a mm is a µm.. and so one. it's just convenient and the right way to do things. so these are the advantages of the metric system. it's not a huge deal but it gets huge if it's used on a daily basis by millions of people. what are the advantages of the imperial system? I really can't tell. maybe you can.
b kinda careful when cleaning threads.. i threaded my thumb with some apparently stripped threads years n years ago
I love this channel. Thanks for all the wonderful, useful information. Merry Christmas.
This is precisely the kind of content we love from you guys. Very well done and useful information.
i used collets for a looong time but I learned a lot in a few minutes, its like a deaf person hearing music for the first time, thanks a lot.
Good explanation.
Really easy to understand what you are speaking (good and clear English).
Many thanks for sharing.
yes! I'm studying English and Haas's videos helping me with it
REALLY well done, so many little tricks to saving your tooling and making it run more accurately. I can't say how many times I have seen folks at the machining school i went to break all those rules and then some... makes me cringe thinking about it!
when you don't have the right collet, use a smaller one and a tap with the --hammer-- screwdriver on the end of the tool will do, right?
I am going to make this required viewing for each of the operators here at my shop. Great information. You even taught me a thing or two!
Joseph Elwell - Thanks for comment. We loved making this video! It was fun, with all the props. It went longer than we’d have liked, but what can you do, there was a ton of things to talk about. Thanks again. - Mark, Haas Tip-of-the-day
damn impressive Haas.. love your videos.. to the point and relevant and in a mannor i can comprihend from a non CNC owner.
and it was a huge joy to follow Haas in 2018 in F1.. great team, and Gunther Steiner for prez in Denmark.
I would love to know how they make those collets. How the hell do they hang on to them to cut the slots?
I have alway wonder that but im geasing holding them bottom and top using a bar in the middl
Collets are made by a multi processing with CNC lathe and slots is grooved by electroerosion process with wolfram-tungsten electrodes or simmilar resistive material.
Sure wish I had one of those tool dispensers in my garage! :)
Airgas had those in a shipyard I worked at filled with small welding consumables and PPE.
Haas got 2 Marks!? Is the second Mark mk2 :D
niin.. jospa se on sen velipoika.
Great video, thank you! I absolutely love your thoughtful, no compromise approach, how you consider every small detail.👍❤️
new into cnc you answered every single question i had thank you!
What the full form of ER
Good comprehensive video. The only thing he maybe should have mentioned was regarding the collet nut thread fit.
This has to be close fitting for good accuracy. Worn or loose thread fit is a no no.
Thank you so much HAAS for those great infos. I learned alot. Maybe one day I will have my own from you guys :)
I have decided this was the best video in the history of the universe. HOW DID YOU DO THAT THING LIKE IDENTICAL TWINS AT 8 MINUTES??!
Thanks Jeff. I sent your comment on to the Editor who produced this video, Tyler. He said that next time there would be 4 Marks, and would say nothing further. Thanks for the comment! - Mark, Haas Tip-of-the-day
this is nuts...great job mark 🤪
Best info on collets Could title this one "Collets for Dummies "
I’ve been machining for 8 years now. Never ran a Haas, but man…I absolutely love your videos. Such high quality, and taught very well. Please keep up the good work!
Do you guys have a holder suitable for watchmaking-like tools?
I know I'm getting old. I'm reading comments on here which make the film maker to be God. All his advice is good. But it's all obvious! Clean setting of tools, concentricity is crucial. Minimal tool length for rigidity.
But I will always scan RUclips. I love cutting metal. And always, somebody will give a method we never thought of. So...👍
Fantastic video, great explanation and also some very hands-on shop advise, like rusted collets!
Also for me it had a great balance between some jokes to keep it light and interesting, without overdoing it.
My dad was a machinist for yrs he taught me alot But I drove a truck for a living so ya tend to forget a little
What are backup screws for???
awsome video. im just learning and this the best video ive seen.
My rust preventative for er collets is coolant I didn't completely blow off of them lol
@haas automation. What is the force limit on the vise included with the convenience package. I Can't find that spec anywhere. Can you use it to put the full 100lbs on the collet nut
G'Day I am just starting in using a lathe and a milling machine can you help me by letting me know what would be the best for my lathe and milling machine . Here is the machine specks so you can help me
MODELTU-2506V-16M
KIT IncludesTU-2506V & BF-16AV
Lathe Specifications LATHE SPECIFICATIONS
(Tool Height To Suit (mm) 12
Distance Between Centres (mm) 550
Swing Over Bed (mm) 250
Swing Over Cross Slide (mm) 150
Centre Height (mm)125
Spindle Bore (mm) 26
Spindle Nose Type Fixed
Bed Width (mm) 135
Headstock Taper (MT)4
Tailstock Taper (MT)2
Cross Slide Travel (mm)110
Compound Slide Travel (mm)70
Leadscrew Metric
Longitudinal Feed (Z-Axis) (mm/rev) 0.07 - 0.4
Metric Thread Range (mm) 0.2 - 3.5
(Imperial Thread Range (TPI) 8 - 56
Three Jaw Chuck Size (mm) 125
Spindle Speeds (No. / rpm) Variable (150 - 2500)
Mill Specifications MILL SPECIFICATIONS
(MT)Spindle Taper (MT) 3
Column Type Dovetail
Swivel Head (Left ~ Right) (± Deg) ±90
Vertical Travel (Z-Axis) (mm) 210
Drilling Capacity (mm) 16
End Milling Capacity (mm) 20
Face Milling Capacity (mm) 63
Spindle Speeds Vertical (No. / rpm) Variable (100-3000)
I am only using the Lathe mill machine for home use I am hoping you can tell me what things are best for the speeds that the machine can do
Sincerely
Thanks
This is an outstanding video. I'm only a "hobbyist" but I feel a lot more knowledgeable than I did twenty minutes ago and I've already watched four other videos supposedly about this topic!
PS. I love the vending machine, brilliant.
3:00 taking video making tips from This old Tony?
Marty Johanson I didn’t catch that, but on rewind I literally laughed out loud!
Thanks Mark for such an usefull piece of information !!!!! KEEP POSTING SUCH VIDEOS
GREAT JOB Guyzz
Great Job Mark and Haas on this video! I’d like to point out one thing you didn’t touch on, that I’ve found employees do in the past, especially when using these collets for holding endmills. Although you mentioned it is important to have clean surfaces on the holder and collets, you did not touch on the importance of breaking down the collet setup when switching out tools in the holders when tools become dull or time to replace. Chips, coolant residue, and debris gather in the collet slots during machining operations. And in changing out a tool when you loosen the collet, this residue can work its way from the slots to in between the collet and holder surfaces. Now when you clamp down on the new tool, you are smashing all of that residue BETWEEN those two surfaces, along with the suraces of the collet and cap itself where those two surfaces come in contact. I know it may seem simple common sense to always break down the collet from the cap and remove it from the holder, and clean all surfaces when changing out a tool. However you’d be surprised how often this happens if employees are not instructed in the importance of doing so.Thanks so much for these videos. They are a great teaching tool.
Donnie
Donnie - Great point. Thanks for commenting. - Mark, Haas Tip-of-the-day
We use chip chasers to clean out the veins of collets. Works well. The chaser is spring steel, about the thickness of metal banding, maybe a tad thinner.
Use the 6" steel rule in your overalls pocket. I always have 0-1 mic, needle file & marker pen in breast pocket. Then use airline and corner of overalls to clean. 👍
Sorry but the vending machine tells me even your own employer doesn't trust you.
But based on your knowledge base it might just be that corporate is overpaid and has way too much time on their hands.
Its a way of saving money on a crib guy and still keep track of tooling costs. Its an important metric. Doesn't matter if you clear 10 million in contracts if you spend 10.1 million making the parts.
Mark, thanks for schooling me. Extremely valuable and appreciated with your (and your T2 cyborg unit) classic style.
Love those video from Haas, valuable videos for all machinist.
I didn't know about the seal caps. I've got to get some of those! Not as much for the TSC, but to stop the cast iron building up and setting up where it becomes a pain to clean out.
Great video, very informative! The part with the PIN cracked me up. :D
top secret :-)
Awesome .... Thanks for the explanation and it's wonderful
Whats the point when they want to pay skilled trades like this 40k a year and pay unskilled ups drivers 170,000k
Great information presented exceptional well, thank you very much.
Great video. I don’t have a HAAS but this video will help out any machinist.
Wow thank you so much. I definitely didn't know anything about ER collets as I thought I knew. Great work!!
These videos are superb. Well done and thank you.
Hi I am a newbie at 72 what is the type collet holder for a Bridgeport I use R - 8 collet now
I've never seen a CNC irl, but I watched this entire video because it's so well done and interesting.
3:42 I see online that some special "oversize" DIN 6499 collets exist which extend the maximum standard diameter, e.g. ER25 up to 20 mm. Would you recommend such extended collets to adapt CNC grooving blades (shank ⌀ 20 mm) to an ER25 spindle in order to be able to cut deep grooves in hard wood (not metal)?
Very interesting and learn lots of skills thank you so much sir..
Where can you buy those ER torque wrenches. Only ever normal ER spanner’s
I really appreciate you guys naming the products that you're using
Thank you so much Haas Automation, I am a general helper in a machine shop and all your videos are helping me learn and understand what machining is. I am totally a beginner but hope to be a real machinist one day. I graduated from a certificate program at the local community college and jumped into a new field to better support my family. I am not handy so all of your videos are helping me become familiar and more comfortable with tooling, machines, etc. Do you have any solid advice for a novice like me. My goal is to work up to a machine operator position in a year.
Ghost dog777 - Getting into a shop is a great first step. I’d try and get on a machine as soon as possible. Ask for a chance at your work, or apply at another local shop. As an operator you will be asked to measure parts accurately. Get friendly with the Quality Inspector at your workplace, asking them and other machinists for measuring tips. ruclips.net/video/1tpyf5o9H20/видео.html The other side of being an operator, besides metrology (measurement) skills, is simply taking care with every part. No dents, no scratches, and getting good (being careful) with deburring. Best of luck! - Mark, Haas Tip-of-the-day
@@haasautomation thank you so much with the response
Now all you need is better Machines 😂😂
Mark, this was an outstandingly informative and well-produced video. Good job!
I can find lots of places saying that you should not expand ER collets, but no information and the technicalities of why it is bad. Can anyone share more data on this?
This really needs a graphic, doesn't it. The inside diameter of the collet is ground to that maximum size (12mm on an 11-12 collet). If we use a larger diameter tool it puts all of the pressure on the thin inside corners of the collet instead of the thick center part. These corners will deform, putting pressure in strange places which will weaken our grip and damage our collets and holders.
Awesome to see the video! We were lucky enough to meet Mark and see him working on this video when we did the HAAS factory tour recently. Keep up the great work!
Gavin Bath exactly what I wanted to say
Mark, you are brilliant!! I wish I had you as a mentor.
Great, great video..great information...tks..! :)
Then you got the guy that's beating the Spanner wrench with a hammer....THIS IS WHY WE CAN'T HAVE NICE THINGS! buy them Hydraulic rigid cat 40 holders then they strip those out using the wrong size Allen lol
Great video! Thanks. Just one comment: in some parts of the video it shows an assembly device or tool holder locker/vise (don't know the name of it). I understand that the vise holds the tool holder properly while you perform the assembling/disassembling like collet changes. Could you please inform where to buy them for HSK-A63 fits? Thanks!!
To who may concern, I am a newbie in this CNC machine, and I have thought or question regarding the ways of using this machine and also the operation.
-I wonder what will be the impact on the workpiece if the clamping force on the part is too high in the CNC machining process.
-What's the consequence if the workpiece is held by hand instead of using the fixture while performing CNC drilling.
-Predict the impact when an improper drill is used to drill a hole in CNC Machining.
-What are the possible reasons that caused chipping to occur?
What’s the best place to get the collet torque wretch adapters ? And what’s the technical name for them. Thanks
Rob Wyllie. I believe they're welded into regular sockets
Hi Rob - We’ve given some links to wrenches, and adapters, in the Description section. If you find a great resource, be sure to post what you find also! - Mark, Haas Tip-of-the-day.
Haas Automation, Inc. Hi I wonder how to enable- disable PROBE ACTION on VF4 mill ??? Thank you !
Wow I've got two of those torque wrenches but didn't what they were for till now.
Thank you for the video. I'm new to milling and I didn't even know these existed. I have a ER40 setup for my milling machine and I will be ordering a bearing style nut for my R8-ER40 adapter.
Haha torque wrench for tightening -i knew a guy that would use peace of scrap and hammer with 3-4 strong blows to tighten nuts.Perfect same torque every time :)
Collets were ancient,definetly not wiped with alcohol-and nobody sang lullaby to them for good night at the end of shift.
Great when you have 500k-1mil brand new cnc machine-that makes that much in a month-but lets face it 80% of guys that are watching will go and buy chinese ones for 20$ for a set.
In my country golden rule is use and abuse your tool who cares how much it lasts as long as it pays for itself and makes enough profit to buy a new one and a "new" mercedes-benz made in 1997.
i want fully knowledge of cutting tools and vmc programning
this shit ain't free, bro
Great video, very informative, more like this is needed, Thank you
Good video, but many of the links you posted are no longer good, and at least one of them redirects to 'robotcaptcha6 dot info' malware (wrote out "dot" so it wasn't made an actual hyperlink by youtube)..