Hey Kevin, am retired shop teacher here in Alberta and a guitar builder earning $10’s of dollars! sure appreciate your fresh approach and your sharing your experience. Very interesting, valuable and informative! Like the subtle humour too. Please keep up the good work! Thank you! Royce T
Thanks for this video. I have watched some of your other videos and enjoyed them also. It is always interesting for me to watch someone who is skilled at what they do. You certainly are very skilled and knowledgeable.
Thank you Kevin for sharing you experience with us. I’m retiring soon and am looking forward to learning how to build guitars. I’ve been waiting to have the time since I was in my 20’s. Can’t wait!
@@thepragmaticluthier I’ve been building solid bodies and doing all kinds of repairs for over 20 years. But I’m now building my first two acoustic guitars. Much of what you post is very useful. Like you I’ve built most of my jigs and fixtures as needed. I never thought about building my own body shape for acoustic although I’ve done it times with solid bodies.
I certainly appreciate your compliment, but my wife says comments like this have made me impossible to live with, even more than I was before. What's a man to do?
I have done a video (many years ago) on making a radiused dish. It and others on RUclips may be helpful. I will probably do one on main a mold late this summer. Thank you for your suggestion.
Thanks for this video Kevin. I’m just in the process of doing this exact method for my next project. A half sized 21inch scale Parlour for my 7 year old. Would be very interested to see your video on bracing layout. I don’t think I could handle the detailed maths but have a feeling you would articulate it perfectly to assist the hobby builder.
I just published a video on brace placement. It is intended to encourage an intuitive approach, building a mental database of experience as you go. I hope you find it useful.
Been thinking of doing just that - great to know others have also done it. I would use all metric scales, just to make it simpler for me. Being in a metric using country, I find measuring in peculiar imperial sizes like 25 and 15/32 inches very strange. If I use a close metric scale rounded up to tge nearest ten mm (eg 650mm), makes it much easier to get my head around, and I can easily work out the scale lengths using a calculator.
Execellent information. I built a custom banjo for myself. When determining the scale length I held a tape measure in the playing position and extended the tape until I felt that familiar and uncomfortable ache in my left shoulder. I then shortened the tape measurement until the pain went away and that became my scale length. This worked perfectly. I can now play clawhammer banjo for hours without shoulder pain. This brings me to my question. Why are standard string lengths in fractions of an inch? 25.4” for example. why not 25”, or 24” so forth. This never made any sense to me.
That's an interesting idea to design your own. I do think staying with a standard scale makes sense. I may use some standard sizes to get started, but I really agree it's interesting and cool to have a design that's all your own. So I'm getting there and hopefully will be doing some building soon.
You're quite right. Starting with a known instrument can be a useful springboard to being your own pursuits, but alas; Mom told me to keep my eyes on my own test paper and Dad said nothing about coloring within the lines. It's my nature to begin with a blank page, but I can see that my learning curve would have been easier to navigate had I started with known beginnings. On the other hand, there is an ownership of knowledge and understanding that comes taking one's own path that I find very rewarding.
@@thepragmaticluthier I would definitely like to end with my own design. Another thought I had later was I do want it closer enough for a standard case to fit, unless I intend to build those.
I like your approach. If you're confident with doing the numbers, you might try the (free!) "G" Thang Acoustic Guitar Design Tool by Liutaio Mottola. We've been using it for years to develop our instrument body shapes. I usually start with a small pencil sketch, to get the idea figured out, and then use the G-Thang tool to create the corresponding body shape..
I have an objection to making ANY known model; not that anyone else should follow suit. Mom taught to never copy anyone's homework and Dad said "color inside the lines? What lines."
I was wondering ! Knowing you were a Teacher & listening to your thoughts ! I'm sure that there's millions of thoughts ! But I watched, Like a 3 part, 6 hr total video once on the Birth of the Stradavarius ! To make a long story short , is there a Formula or a " Sweetspot " , That you know of To sound projection ! Like a total equivalent,, ? Is there a equation , that if you want a 23" total length guitar , And 16" at the lower bout ? That the total thickness/ Depthof the instrument , should be X Y Z ,,, The upper Bout should be A B C ? How do you determine what size the sound hole & where ? I have several " Dreads" & 1 Grand Auditorium , and I love a Gibson Jumbo, But not so much the J-200 ! But I really liked the Looks & Shape of the Guitar , you used today for Illustration ! OR ,,, is there even a answer to all this Babbiling I've Asked ?
You have asked a question, an answer to which, many instrument makers can only wish they had. Alas, to my knowledge, there is no formula, bu there is great progress in scientific analysis and understanding of the many variables in making that perfect instrument.
Thanks Kevin for encouraging us to be creative. I imagine that in designing your own body size you have to keep in mind what sort of case you would need to buy for the guitar to fit in it. I am looking forward to experimenting with some V bracing on various sized guitars. Do you have any advice on varying body hole sizes?
I will admit that sometimes, fitting a case to my guitars can be challenging, but I NEVER let that be a design limitation. Worst "case" scenario, I'll have a case custom made.
Are there any parameters regarding body length, upper and lower bout shapes that you want to stay within in terms of sound, tone, sustain and the like? - not sure I worded this well, but wondering if there’s a reason for the recognizable O, OO, OM, Dread and perhaps other shapes. Thanks as always!
My experience has been that body shape and size must be thought of almost separately. As the size of a top increases, one can expect more volume, more pronounced lower frequencies. Consider a Jumbo compared to parlor. at the same time, I doubt that body shape has much affect on volume and or tone until the shape begins to rob the body of vibrating area. what come to mind here is the waist, where the area of the top can be quickly reduced without easily seeing it. It come down to big guitar, big sound, enhanced low frequency moving toward balance , then toward enhanced high frequency as the body gets smaller. Bracing and top thickness can finesse those things to a limited extent. I would encourage anyone to begin with a vision of a body size and style and develop that because the first instrument is the springboard to alll of the improved iterations that can follow.
@@thepragmaticluthier So that is what I'm doing wrong. Off to get a proper luthier's insert for my mechanical pencil. Should I also order the luthier's ink for marking up the label?
Before I begin an instrument, I know the body depth at the heel and tail blocks. I sand the required dome one each side of the rim set at the appropriate time during construction.
Great Video! I'm looking to build a 12 fret dreadnought next. i just finished my first guitar (14 fret Dread) and it came out great. Can i use the same scale length for a 12 fret as i did for my 14? also, do i need to lengthen the lower bout to account for the bridge location? Thanks
Astute question! You can certainly use the same scale length for a twelve fret instrument. You could lengthen the body at the lower bout or the upper, or both. Getting the bridge located at or very close the center of the vibrating area of the top is key. May I suggest that you look at the old Martin Dreadnaught "S" series. they were twelve fret instruments with a slopped shoulder in the upper bout and may have been lengthened below the bridge as well. The specific models were the D18S, D28S, D35S . There were also 12-string models built on that same body and all of those guitars also had a slotted head piece. Good luck with your pursuit. I'd love to see the results.
I'm thinking of some sort of dreadnought modification to find that sweet spot for the bridge . May be some math involved ugh. Well, this should be fun.
I'm a bit confused about this video title and a comment you made regarding OM guitar body templates in your shop. Should I apologize or stand up, if I apologize will I come off as weak or maybe something else. I've decided I'm standing up for OM guitars, OK not all just the kit I'm building which is an OM. Flamed Maple sides and back, spruce top, mahogany neck, rosewood fret board that I'm replacing with maple and a few other modifications. Yes it's a diy kit and so far I'm happy with it but won't mention the seller. I'd volunteer to hold the camera and edit. Thank you for this education
I favor and promote individual thought and action in guitar making and I promote doing anything you can (within your comfort zone ) to avoid buying as much as you can, from suppliers. That's what I advocate, not what i demand or even expect. No one should feel hangdog or apologetic for their decisions and methods. The thrust of my comment was, and still is, to punctuate my decision to avoid most of what might be considered, "coloring within the lines" and to encourage those who might me so inclined, to invent their own wheel. My sincere apologies if you tool offense.
@@thepragmaticluthier I've had fun watching your videos and have learned from you, thank you. I was being a bit sarcastic with my comments and hoped that it came across that way. I learned more from the 3 videos by you than I did from the retailer video on building the entire kit.
Once again the best guitar building videos available. Thank you.
Thanks. That's quite a compliment. There are so many other excellent videos out there. I'm honored.
Hey Kevin, am retired shop teacher here in Alberta and a guitar builder earning $10’s of dollars! sure appreciate your fresh approach and your sharing your experience. Very interesting, valuable and informative!
Like the subtle humour too.
Please keep up the good work!
Thank you!
Royce T
Thanks so much. Keep looking for more videos, some humor and som occasional feather ruffling.
Thank you so much for sharing your knowledge!!!!!
You're very welcome. Thanks for your positive comment. Would you like to suggest a future topic?
Kevin, I love your humor. 😂
Thanks for this video. I have watched some of your other videos and enjoyed them also. It is always interesting for me to watch someone who is skilled at what they do. You certainly are very skilled and knowledgeable.
Nice presentation, Kevin.
Thank you. Your positive comment motivates me to more and better.
Thank you Kevin for sharing you experience with us. I’m retiring soon and am looking forward to learning how to build guitars. I’ve been waiting to have the time since I was in my 20’s.
Can’t wait!
Congratulations on your upcoming retirement. Enjoy it and enjoy building guitars.
Thanks Kevin!
I hope you found this useful or at least entertaining.
@@thepragmaticluthier I’ve been building solid bodies and doing all kinds of repairs for over 20 years. But I’m now building my first two acoustic guitars. Much of what you post is very useful. Like you I’ve built most of my jigs and fixtures as needed. I never thought about building my own body shape for acoustic although I’ve done it times with solid bodies.
you're awesome man, thanks
I certainly appreciate your compliment, but my wife says comments like this have made me impossible to live with, even more than I was before. What's a man to do?
Thanks for some great tips Kevin, I'll definitely try making my own patterns and templates rather than use pre made templates which I have been using.
I hold dearly to the belief in designing your own guitar bodies. It makes your work unique and truly your own. Great good luck with your building.
Eventually, could you show how to make a guitar body mold and a radius dish? I really like the style of yours
I have done a video (many years ago) on making a radiused dish. It and others on RUclips may be helpful. I will probably do one on main a mold late this summer. Thank you for your suggestion.
@thepragmaticluthier I didn't see that one but I'll take a look. Thanks!
Thanks for this video Kevin. I’m just in the process of doing this exact method for my next project. A half sized 21inch scale Parlour for my 7 year old. Would be very interested to see your video on bracing layout. I don’t think I could handle the detailed maths but have a feeling you would articulate it perfectly to assist the hobby builder.
I just published a video on brace placement. It is intended to encourage an intuitive approach, building a mental database of experience as you go. I hope you find it useful.
Been thinking of doing just that - great to know others have also done it. I would use all metric scales, just to make it simpler for me. Being in a metric using country, I find measuring in peculiar imperial sizes like 25 and 15/32 inches very strange. If I use a close metric scale rounded up to tge nearest ten mm (eg 650mm), makes it much easier to get my head around, and I can easily work out the scale lengths using a calculator.
You can also get any scale length you want calculated in metric. there are several sources online.
Execellent information. I built a custom banjo for myself. When determining the scale length I held a tape measure in the playing position and extended the tape until I felt that familiar and uncomfortable ache in my left shoulder. I then shortened the tape measurement until the pain went away and that became my scale length. This worked perfectly. I can now play clawhammer banjo for hours without shoulder pain.
This brings me to my question. Why are standard string lengths in fractions of an inch? 25.4” for example. why not 25”, or 24” so forth. This never made any sense to me.
If you ever find a "real" answer to that question, please let me know. I like that way arrived at a useful scale length for your banjo. Smart!
That's an interesting idea to design your own. I do think staying with a standard scale makes sense. I may use some standard sizes to get started, but I really agree it's interesting and cool to have a design that's all your own.
So I'm getting there and hopefully will be doing some building soon.
You're quite right. Starting with a known instrument can be a useful springboard to being your own pursuits, but alas; Mom told me to keep my eyes on my own test paper and Dad said nothing about coloring within the lines. It's my nature to begin with a blank page, but I can see that my learning curve would have been easier to navigate had I started with known beginnings. On the other hand, there is an ownership of knowledge and understanding that comes taking one's own path that I find very rewarding.
@@thepragmaticluthier I would definitely like to end with my own design. Another thought I had later was I do want it closer enough for a standard case to fit, unless I intend to build those.
I like your approach. If you're confident with doing the numbers, you might try the (free!) "G" Thang Acoustic Guitar Design Tool by Liutaio Mottola. We've been using it for years to develop our instrument body shapes. I usually start with a small pencil sketch, to get the idea figured out, and then use the G-Thang tool to create the corresponding body shape..
I looks very interesting. Unfortunately, it runs on PC's only. As a Mac user, it puts me out of business.
Thank you again for sharing your wisdom and experience. It’s very helpful. I’m curious why you have an objection to making the OM model.
I have an objection to making ANY known model; not that anyone else should follow suit. Mom taught to never copy anyone's homework and Dad said "color inside the lines? What lines."
I was wondering ! Knowing you were a Teacher & listening to your thoughts ! I'm sure that there's millions of thoughts ! But I watched, Like a 3 part, 6 hr total video once on the Birth of the Stradavarius ! To make a long story short , is there a Formula or a " Sweetspot " , That you know of To sound projection ! Like a total equivalent,, ? Is there a equation , that if you want a 23" total length guitar , And 16" at the lower bout ? That the total thickness/ Depthof the instrument , should be X Y Z ,,, The upper Bout should be A B C ? How do you determine what size the sound hole & where ? I have several " Dreads" & 1 Grand Auditorium , and I love a Gibson Jumbo, But not so much the J-200 ! But I really liked the Looks & Shape of the Guitar , you used today for Illustration ! OR ,,, is there even a answer to all this Babbiling I've Asked ?
You have asked a question, an answer to which, many instrument makers can only wish they had. Alas, to my knowledge, there is no formula, bu there is great progress in scientific analysis and understanding of the many variables in making that perfect instrument.
Thanks Kevin for encouraging us to be creative. I imagine that in designing your own body size you have to keep in mind what sort of case you would need to buy for the guitar to fit in it. I am looking forward to experimenting with some V bracing on various sized guitars. Do you have any advice on varying body hole sizes?
I will admit that sometimes, fitting a case to my guitars can be challenging, but I NEVER let that be a design limitation. Worst "case" scenario, I'll have a case custom made.
Are there any parameters regarding body length, upper and lower bout shapes that you want to stay within in terms of sound, tone, sustain and the like? - not sure I worded this well, but wondering if there’s a reason for the recognizable O, OO, OM, Dread and perhaps other shapes. Thanks as always!
My experience has been that body shape and size must be thought of almost separately. As the size of a top increases, one can expect more volume, more pronounced lower frequencies. Consider a Jumbo compared to parlor. at the same time, I doubt that body shape has much affect on volume and or tone until the shape begins to rob the body of vibrating area. what come to mind here is the waist, where the area of the top can be quickly reduced without easily seeing it. It come down to big guitar, big sound, enhanced low frequency moving toward balance , then toward enhanced high frequency as the body gets smaller. Bracing and top thickness can finesse those things to a limited extent. I would encourage anyone to begin with a vision of a body size and style and develop that because the first instrument is the springboard to alll of the improved iterations that can follow.
That helps. Thank you!
i like 13 fretters!!...
Look closely and you’ll notice that this guitar is deceptively joined at the 14th fret 🎶
The difference between a "Luther's compass" and any other compass is the Luther's compass points to "True Stupid". (LOL)
My luthier's compass doesn't draw accurate circles because I failed to put a luthier's pencil in it. Woe is me.
@@thepragmaticluthier So that is what I'm doing wrong. Off to get a proper luthier's insert for my mechanical pencil. Should I also order the luthier's ink for marking up the label?
Do you also make side patterns to understand the body geometry?
Before I begin an instrument, I know the body depth at the heel and tail blocks. I sand the required dome one each side of the rim set at the appropriate time during construction.
Great Video! I'm looking to build a 12 fret dreadnought next. i just finished my first guitar (14 fret Dread) and it came out great. Can i use the same scale length for a 12 fret as i did for my 14? also, do i need to lengthen the lower bout to account for the bridge location? Thanks
Astute question! You can certainly use the same scale length for a twelve fret instrument. You could lengthen the body at the lower bout or the upper, or both. Getting the bridge located at or very close the center of the vibrating area of the top is key. May I suggest that you look at the old Martin Dreadnaught "S" series. they were twelve fret instruments with a slopped shoulder in the upper bout and may have been lengthened below the bridge as well. The specific models were the D18S, D28S, D35S . There were also 12-string models built on that same body and all of those guitars also had a slotted head piece. Good luck with your pursuit. I'd love to see the results.
I'm thinking of some sort of dreadnought modification to find that sweet spot for the bridge . May be some math involved ugh. Well, this should be fun.
I'm a bit confused about this video title and a comment you made regarding OM guitar body templates in your shop. Should I apologize or stand up, if I apologize will I come off as weak or maybe something else. I've decided I'm standing up for OM guitars, OK not all just the kit I'm building which is an OM. Flamed Maple sides and back, spruce top, mahogany neck, rosewood fret board that I'm replacing with maple and a few other modifications. Yes it's a diy kit and so far I'm happy with it but won't mention the seller. I'd volunteer to hold the camera and edit. Thank you for this education
I favor and promote individual thought and action in guitar making and I promote doing anything you can (within your comfort zone ) to avoid buying as much as you can, from suppliers. That's what I advocate, not what i demand or even expect. No one should feel hangdog or apologetic for their decisions and methods. The thrust of my comment was, and still is, to punctuate my decision to avoid most of what might be considered, "coloring within the lines" and to encourage those who might me so inclined, to invent their own wheel. My sincere apologies if you tool offense.
@@thepragmaticluthier I've had fun watching your videos and have learned from you, thank you. I was being a bit sarcastic with my comments and hoped that it came across that way. I learned more from the 3 videos by you than I did from the retailer video on building the entire kit.
Why the dots at frets 10, 13 and 16?!
Misplaced dots. That's why it's the "shop guitar":)