Greetings from Taiwan! So according to fellas in local stove group here, they said the designer wanted the new version to have a higher heat capacity. And he suggested that with that cap it has to be primed twice before firing up. However I don’t have a no12 nor the cap, can’t verify though. Always enjoy your video, stay safe and keep up the good work!
@Chang JJ Thanks for your note, and for watching my videos. I’ve got to say it’s disappointing to hear the false information the Taiwan stove group is disseminating. I thought they were both more honest and more skilled than that. 🤔☹️ The facts: The BM #12 cap seller told me directly in eBay email that the outer silent cap for the original unit was no longer available. I take that to mean, no longer made. The seller said they went to the smaller replacement outer cap when they could no longer obtain the original larger outer cap. It’s just that simple. As I show and describe in the video the smaller new outer cap has too few holes and is too small in internal diameter to pair with the machined brass inner. I brought this problem up with the seller and he acknowledged that people were having problems with the new version. He said that the problems (what I clearly have demonstrated as reduced power of the cap and the inability of the cap to function on the #12 in its new configuration) is was why they are giving, free of charge, a smaller orifice jet bundled with each cap purchased. But, as those with knowledge of how stoves actually work well know, requiring the use of a smaller orifice jet on the #12 (just to make the new version of the cap work properly) means that the #12 stove has been reduced in power to allow for the poor design of the new cap. The power of a stove is directly based on the size of the jet opening. How can anyone imagine that having less fuel vapor coming out of a smaller opening will make a bigger flame? That’s a silly notion. So if, as you report the designer claims, he wanted the cap to have higher “heat capacity”, then he has failed miserably. It makes no sense to me to buy an expensive and powerful BM#12 and then reduce the power of the stove with a smaller jet because of poor aftermarket cap design. I’m sure you are aware that I’m well-skilled at proper aftermarket silent cap design for modern and vintage stoves, having started the whole industry back in 2009. So, I’m well qualified to make this accurate and truthful analysis. “Double Priming” No stove in my possession, and I have most all the ones that are fancied by stove fans/collectors, requires a “double prime”. "Double priming" is a mythical necessity promoted by users who are not very skilled in the out of doors or at using stoves. “Double priming” is Swedish for “rookie stove user”. (
Hey BD. The problem with the owner not having the clearance is the fact that all NO12's are not all created equal. They range from 90 - 95mm (In over 20 + stoves I have personally inspected) from the bottom of case to the bottom of the pot rack. So with your personal stove you may have more clearance. For the owner of this stove the fix is to bend the ends of the pot rack to increase the height.
@SMSIndustries Yup. I'm well aware that the British Military #12 stoves are built haphazardly and with little attention to specs. (They installed the fuel pickup upside down for instance - only drew air). But, we're talking in excess of the 5mm difference (as you suggest) from mine to the owner in the UK. So, far more likely a bad build or just really crummy handwork there in the UK factory. They look pretty cool and are really rugged, but BM12s shouldn't likely be considered by anyone who is not comfortable doing a lot of handwork and crafting to get them to run right. BD
Thanks Cam! 👍 I appreciate your kind well-wishes. I hope that the concept of changing cap hole sizes to better tune caps to stoves made it across in my video. I have a lot of footage that covers this topic in more detail that may become a stand-alone video down the pike. Happy camping/stoving! BD
@@BernieDawgCinema The concept of larger holes to fine tune a cap makes perfect sense to me , why would you choke up a stoves power/ performance, but at the same time you need to simmer so there must be a fine line somewhere, would love to see this issue tackled....Cam
@Cameron Lewington Thanks, Cam. I still have the other Taiwan cap to work on yet, the one with 208 holes in the outer. I’d planned on one video to do both versions, but it got way too long. I’m much better at working on stoves and caps than making videos. Lots of pressure being exerted from RUclips to be “professional” these days and shooting video yourself while working on a stove/cap is a pain. I need a camera operator! Or, minions! 😄 Anyway, since most of the concepts for fixing the #12 Taiwan cap are presented in the first video, I was sort of hoping that I could branch out and talk about the clearances and shapes in caps, including holes, hole sizes and hole quantities, in a second part video about the other version Taiwan cap. Sort of a “how-to-design-a-cap” video. All these factors can greatly influence the carburetion of fuel vapor and air in a silent cap stove. Stay tuned. 👍 BD
@Tusky Holliday My webpage has links to a slew of parts providers for many different stoves including the BM#12. If you need a link or have more questions about caps, just email me at bd@berniedawg.com . Cheers! BD
Thanks Gary, I may modify my Taiwanese burner but I think I'd rather just invest in yours, Sadly I'm probably going to get hit for import now we're out of the EU.
@RAR Knives and Leatherwork As you wish, but... if the Taiwan cap doesn't work for you now, then you have nothing to lose by modifying it. Take a risk and go for it! Don't be a timid stovie. Do some fearless fettling! Fixing what you have seems like a smarter way to go now that the UK has (I am told by Brits) royally screwed itself with Brexit. I'm hearing nothing but complaints from cap-buyers in the UK these days about import duties since Brexit (finally) happened. It's not a problem I made, it's the laws you guys voted for, and it gets tiresome to hear folks complain about the results of their vote. While I express my condolences for all those negative outcomes, it was pretty clear to everyone not in the UK what was going to happen. Sad. But, good luck! Keep calm and carry on, and all that! 👍 Pip pip! 😉 BD
Yes sadly we have to live with it. Just irksome for the 48% of us that didn't vote for it and could predict the outcomes all too easily. Yes you're quite right I should just get on with modifying it.
@RAR Knives and Leatherwork Amen, brother. Maybe in a few more years as the consequences truly sink in, ya'll can take another vote and see if the EU (like a jilted girlfriend) will maybe take you back. Good luck to that! Check your cap hole count before you get started to see if you have 216 or 208 holes. Instructions in the video for the 216. For the 208 hole caps, make *both* lower rows of holes #57 drill size, the others #56. Good luck to that, too! 👍 BD
@Victory First As it says in the video title and video description, it's a British Military #12, so... British eBay? Here's one now: www.ebay.co.uk/itm/204236563944 Good luck on your search for a surplus British Military stove. BD
@@BernieDawgCinema Thank you BernieDawg for letting me know something that is just obvious and I missed it. Being human sometimes has its down side. One thing, would buying a surplus unit claiming it is new be a good thing ??? Peace fella. vf
@Victory First The one I linked you to says it's used. Two more I took a look at say "used". I guess if you are seeing a seller say it's new, then maybe you should ask them how that is possible. ??? By the way, they don't run on "diesel", certainly not USA #2 diesel, if that's what you'd hoped. They run on kerosene (1-K) and were designed to burn NATO JP-8. BD
@Victory First Wow! This is going downhill fast. I didn’t say it was a “lie” that someone claims a #12 as “new”. You are putting words in my mouth. That’s not nice. What I said was you should ask the seller to explain how that could be. I’m not in the #12 stove selling business. It’s not my job or responsibility to be a middleman between you and the seller. You need to work out your own deal on your own. A “fair price” on any eBay, anywhere in the world, is what the buyer is willing to pay for an item. If you have to have a “fair price” it should be the price you feel the item is worth to you. What anyone else may think about what you are willing to pay is absolutely no one else's business. There is no “right price”, just what the buyer is willing to pay for an item on any given day. If you disagree, then buying old stoves on eBay is probably not for you. Maybe find some other hobby or pastime. Good luck! BD
@BigArch6564 Yo dude, thanks! If you want to replace the graphite on a Brit military #12, get the solid packings from Base-Camp in England or from KiteLamp in Taiwan. www.berniedawg.com/stove-part-supplier-links/ Solid packings are what were in there originally. They work better, and give a more professional result. No reason to be monkeying around with graphite tape when the right parts are still available. But... if you gotta use tape, wrap it around the shaft of the spindle as tight as you can, then smoosh it inside the spindle housing using the spindle nut. Might have to try it several times until you can get enough of the tape in there to seal it. (Yuck.) Eventually it might work. Good luck! BD
@KB3UKTKB3ULN There’s no need for any of my caps on a Coleman Peak 1 single burner stove as it runs silently right out of the box. Coleman has completely different technology and burner design from this British Military #12 stove. BD
@Young_of_the_mill Lol! Remember... you have the option of 111T and 111C stoves. Plus, if you develop your own solution to the 111 or 111B, you could be a billionaire!! Good luck with that. Let me know if you find a solution - I'd wanna buy a bunch of them. BD
Greetings from Taiwan! So according to fellas in local stove group here, they said the designer wanted the new version to have a higher heat capacity. And he suggested that with that cap it has to be primed twice before firing up. However I don’t have a no12 nor the cap, can’t verify though.
Always enjoy your video, stay safe and keep up the good work!
@Chang JJ Thanks for your note, and for watching my videos.
I’ve got to say it’s disappointing to hear the false information the Taiwan stove group is disseminating. I thought they were both more honest and more skilled than that. 🤔☹️
The facts: The BM #12 cap seller told me directly in eBay email that the outer silent cap for the original unit was no longer available. I take that to mean, no longer made. The seller said they went to the smaller replacement outer cap when they could no longer obtain the original larger outer cap. It’s just that simple. As I show and describe in the video the smaller new outer cap has too few holes and is too small in internal diameter to pair with the machined brass inner. I brought this problem up with the seller and he acknowledged that people were having problems with the new version. He said that the problems (what I clearly have demonstrated as reduced power of the cap and the inability of the cap to function on the #12 in its new configuration) is was why they are giving, free of charge, a smaller orifice jet bundled with each cap purchased. But, as those with knowledge of how stoves actually work well know, requiring the use of a smaller orifice jet on the #12 (just to make the new version of the cap work properly) means that the #12 stove has been reduced in power to allow for the poor design of the new cap. The power of a stove is directly based on the size of the jet opening. How can anyone imagine that having less fuel vapor coming out of a smaller opening will make a bigger flame? That’s a silly notion. So if, as you report the designer claims, he wanted the cap to have higher “heat capacity”, then he has failed miserably. It makes no sense to me to buy an expensive and powerful BM#12 and then reduce the power of the stove with a smaller jet because of poor aftermarket cap design. I’m sure you are aware that I’m well-skilled at proper aftermarket silent cap design for modern and vintage stoves, having started the whole industry back in 2009. So, I’m well qualified to make this accurate and truthful analysis.
“Double Priming”
No stove in my possession, and I have most all the ones that are fancied by stove fans/collectors, requires a “double prime”. "Double priming" is a mythical necessity promoted by users who are not very skilled in the out of doors or at using stoves. “Double priming” is Swedish for “rookie stove user”. (
@@BernieDawgCinema The New new Taiwan cap is even worse. It does not even have the same base platern and the outer cap just sits on there loose!
You can tell when someone is passionate about what they do. It shows in his work and his production. What a great video.
Great information. Nice work BD. Stay safe and warm my friend.
Thanks, you too! BD
Hey BD. The problem with the owner not having the clearance is the fact that all NO12's are not all created equal. They range from 90 - 95mm (In over 20 + stoves I have personally inspected) from the bottom of case to the bottom of the pot rack. So with your personal stove you may have more clearance. For the owner of this stove the fix is to bend the ends of the pot rack to increase the height.
@SMSIndustries Yup. I'm well aware that the British Military #12 stoves are built haphazardly and with little attention to specs. (They installed the fuel pickup upside down for instance - only drew air). But, we're talking in excess of the 5mm difference (as you suggest) from mine to the owner in the UK. So, far more likely a bad build or just really crummy handwork there in the UK factory. They look pretty cool and are really rugged, but BM12s shouldn't likely be considered by anyone who is not comfortable doing a lot of handwork and crafting to get them to run right. BD
Cool old stove.
Great job on the fix.
God bless
@BluegrassBushcraft Thanks! But, this stove is not very old at all. Mine is marked with a birth date of 2006. So, fairly recent I should think. 👍 BD
Great work Gary, best wishes from England! Cam
Thanks Cam! 👍 I appreciate your kind well-wishes. I hope that the concept of changing cap hole sizes to better tune caps to stoves made it across in my video. I have a lot of footage that covers this topic in more detail that may become a stand-alone video down the pike. Happy camping/stoving! BD
@@BernieDawgCinema The concept of larger holes to fine tune a cap makes perfect sense to me , why would you choke up a stoves power/ performance, but at the same time you need to simmer so there must be a fine line somewhere, would love to see this issue tackled....Cam
@Cameron Lewington Thanks, Cam. I still have the other Taiwan cap to work on yet, the one with 208 holes in the outer. I’d planned on one video to do both versions, but it got way too long. I’m much better at working on stoves and caps than making videos. Lots of pressure being exerted from RUclips to be “professional” these days and shooting video yourself while working on a stove/cap is a pain. I need a camera operator! Or, minions! 😄 Anyway, since most of the concepts for fixing the #12 Taiwan cap are presented in the first video, I was sort of hoping that I could branch out and talk about the clearances and shapes in caps, including holes, hole sizes and hole quantities, in a second part video about the other version Taiwan cap. Sort of a “how-to-design-a-cap” video. All these factors can greatly influence the carburetion of fuel vapor and air in a silent cap stove. Stay tuned. 👍 BD
I’m looking for replacement parts unfortunately I don’t know where to look but now seeing this I’d like to purchase one of your caps 😍😍
@Tusky Holliday My webpage has links to a slew of parts providers for many different stoves including the BM#12. If you need a link or have more questions about caps, just email me at bd@berniedawg.com . Cheers! BD
Thanks Gary, I may modify my Taiwanese burner but I think I'd rather just invest in yours, Sadly I'm probably going to get hit for import now we're out of the EU.
@RAR Knives and Leatherwork As you wish, but... if the Taiwan cap doesn't work for you now, then you have nothing to lose by modifying it. Take a risk and go for it! Don't be a timid stovie. Do some fearless fettling! Fixing what you have seems like a smarter way to go now that the UK has (I am told by Brits) royally screwed itself with Brexit. I'm hearing nothing but complaints from cap-buyers in the UK these days about import duties since Brexit (finally) happened. It's not a problem I made, it's the laws you guys voted for, and it gets tiresome to hear folks complain about the results of their vote. While I express my condolences for all those negative outcomes, it was pretty clear to everyone not in the UK what was going to happen. Sad. But, good luck! Keep calm and carry on, and all that! 👍 Pip pip! 😉 BD
Yes sadly we have to live with it. Just irksome for the 48% of us that didn't vote for it and could predict the outcomes all too easily. Yes you're quite right I should just get on with modifying it.
@RAR Knives and Leatherwork Amen, brother. Maybe in a few more years as the consequences truly sink in, ya'll can take another vote and see if the EU (like a jilted girlfriend) will maybe take you back. Good luck to that! Check your cap hole count before you get started to see if you have 216 or 208 holes. Instructions in the video for the 216. For the 208 hole caps, make *both* lower rows of holes #57 drill size, the others #56. Good luck to that, too! 👍 BD
Thanks for that information Gary, best get counting.
Where can I get the stainless stove you are showing on the video Sir ??? Thanks
@Victory First As it says in the video title and video description, it's a British Military #12, so... British eBay? Here's one now: www.ebay.co.uk/itm/204236563944 Good luck on your search for a surplus British Military stove. BD
@@BernieDawgCinema Thank you BernieDawg for letting me know something that is just obvious and I missed it. Being human sometimes has its down side. One thing, would buying a surplus unit claiming it is new be a good thing ??? Peace fella. vf
@Victory First The one I linked you to says it's used. Two more I took a look at say "used". I guess if you are seeing a seller say it's new, then maybe you should ask them how that is possible. ??? By the way, they don't run on "diesel", certainly not USA #2 diesel, if that's what you'd hoped. They run on kerosene (1-K) and were designed to burn NATO JP-8. BD
@@BernieDawgCinema So the comment of used once or twice is just a lie. What would be a fair price Sir ?? Thanks
@Victory First Wow! This is going downhill fast.
I didn’t say it was a “lie” that someone claims a #12 as “new”. You are putting words in my mouth. That’s not nice.
What I said was you should ask the seller to explain how that could be. I’m not in the #12 stove selling business. It’s not my job or responsibility to be a middleman between you and the seller. You need to work out your own deal on your own.
A “fair price” on any eBay, anywhere in the world, is what the buyer is willing to pay for an item. If you have to have a “fair price” it should be the price you feel the item is worth to you. What anyone else may think about what you are willing to pay is absolutely no one else's business. There is no “right price”, just what the buyer is willing to pay for an item on any given day. If you disagree, then buying old stoves on eBay is probably not for you. Maybe find some other hobby or pastime. Good luck! BD
Hey buddy, great vlog and thanks for sharing. I've a question for you. How do I apply Graphite Tape - to renew packing in control valve stuffing box?
@BigArch6564 Yo dude, thanks! If you want to replace the graphite on a Brit military #12, get the solid packings from Base-Camp in England or from KiteLamp in Taiwan. www.berniedawg.com/stove-part-supplier-links/ Solid packings are what were in there originally. They work better, and give a more professional result. No reason to be monkeying around with graphite tape when the right parts are still available. But... if you gotta use tape, wrap it around the shaft of the spindle as tight as you can, then smoosh it inside the spindle housing using the spindle nut. Might have to try it several times until you can get enough of the tape in there to seal it. (Yuck.) Eventually it might work. Good luck! BD
@@BernieDawgCinema that's great and thank you for the best advice!
@BigArch6564 10-4 good buddy! 👍 BD
Can I use your cap on my Coleman Peak 1 single burner ?
@KB3UKTKB3ULN There’s no need for any of my caps on a Coleman Peak 1 single burner stove as it runs silently right out of the box. Coleman has completely different technology and burner design from this British Military #12 stove. BD
Thanks for the information. Enjoy all your videos,thank you again so much.
God Bless
Do you have a cap for a Optimus 111b?
@Young_of_the_mill www.berniedawg.com/silent-cap-for-111b/ BD
@@BernieDawgCinema awe shucks…
@Young_of_the_mill Lol! Remember... you have the option of 111T and 111C stoves. Plus, if you develop your own solution to the 111 or 111B, you could be a billionaire!! Good luck with that. Let me know if you find a solution - I'd wanna buy a bunch of them. BD
... здравствуйте!-, дайте пожалуйста ссылку, где можно приобрести такую-же плитку для себя 🔥🇷🇺👈🤓👍!!!
www.ebay.co.uk/itm/165484899683