Repertoire: The BEST Ives--Three Places in New England
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- Опубликовано: 7 июн 2020
- No one plays Charles Ives unless they truly believe in the cause--the music is just too crazy and difficult to encourage slackers, so there are no bad versions of the Three Places in New England; but you may want to choose between couplings or one of the work's two legitimate versions.
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The Tilson Thomas disc of Ives, Piston and Ruggles is one of my favourite CDs, period. Nice to see it get a mention!
His earlier recordings are really much better than the recent stuff he's done. There are some exceptions.
I never cared for Ives when I was growing up as a musician, but now in my 50's he has made a huge impact on me.
It happens when it happens, if it happens!
I was fortunate to hear Dohnanyi/CO perform this piece in Boston, an unforgettable experience. You're absolutely right, this recording partnership got short shrift at the time, the victim of a failing business model.
Mr. Hurwitz, first of all, thank you for doing these reviews, which are entertaining in the way they show your enthusiasms for music and recordings. I admit that, while I found some of your opinions combative on the Usenet group to which we both contributed, mine were at least as much so, a fault which I hope I have now outgrown in old age. Your RUclips reviews remind me of the days when I could visit my local Tower Records, or Virgin Megastore, or Wherehouse (or, for us Angelenos with long memories, Vogue Records), and chat away a Saturday afternoon with fellow classical music recording nerds.
I'm particularly pleased when I find my opinions overlap with yours. I attended an early performance in San Francisco (it may even have been a premiere) of James Sinclair's restored version of the "Three Places," and, like you, I find both Ormandy recordings essential, and Dohnányi's nothing short of superb. I thank you for once again calling out Decca on their shameful treatment of the Cleveland Orchestra back in the early 1990s. It is one of many sins of the classical recording industry, another of which is the apparent lack of research before issuing an edition of something (a composer's works, or a performer's recordings) that is claimed to be "complete."
I will continue to watch these with great interest, and I look forward to the day when you cover particular interests of mine, such as the Berlioz Grande Messe des morts (Requiem), or perhaps the Brahms Piano Quartet #1 orchestrated by Schoenberg.
Hey Matthew, it is I, Olin. Fancy running into you here! And I second everything you say -- came here to make the same comment. Great minds and all that!
Thanks Matthew. It's good to meet you again under more pleasant circumstances! I'm glad to see you're still a Berlioz mavem. I'll be sure to cover the Requiem and duck when I post it.
Ahah -- another Connecticut Ivesian! I grew up in Ridgefield, and first heard about Ives from, where else, one of Bernstein's "Young People's Concerts." The MTT/BSO LP blew me away in the day, and is still my nostalgic favorite. But the others are great, too. Thanks!
My pleasure.
Great to hear you present this work. The Housatonic movement is a masterpiece on its own. I remember being first intrigued by it from an episode of Yehudi Menuhin's old late 1970's series "The Music of Man". It was a must have recording from that point (I picked up the Tilson Thomas record soon after) and a piece I always play to acquaintances who are unfamiliar with Ives' wayward & unique brilliance.
Thanks for the Sinclair on Naxos! I've got his recording and is wonderful...the first time I heard an Ives recording was with Morton Gould and CSO for BMG: Symphony no. 1, Orchestral Set No. 2, Robert Browning Overture and The Ununswered Question...really a shocker! But I don't know if Gould recorded also Three Places in New England...
A really excellent review of this great piece and the recordings. I just listened to the Tilson Thomas BSO version again (which I own) and agree that it is absolutely first rate. Thanks for mentioning Slatkin's as well, and for your praise of Ives's brilliant Second Orchestral Set, a masterpiece if there ever was one. - W. McClelland
Glad you enjoyed it!
Just found this vinyl copy at Goodwill. Really enjoyed the listen. Thankyou for your wonderful post
What you are doing is AMAZING! Thank you.
I recently purchased the Decca Double 👍
Dear Mr. Hurwitz: you have been consistently endorsing all of my collection!! The Ives'
versions I own: Ormandy, Tilson Thomas and....Dohnányi, of course!! Thanks again!
Excellent!
I've been fascinated by Ives, the man and the musician, for a long time. It's great to hear of your multiple points of connection with him! The Tilson-Thomas Three Places was the first Ives recording I ever heard. All three movements of the work are marvelous, but to me the first movement is probably the best thing Ives ever wrote
Thanks for the awesome Ives video! I would love to see an IDEAL Ives symphony cycle video someday. I’m curious about your top choice for Symphony No. 2 (mine is the last Bernstein).
We all know and love classicstoday.com Dave! For years ! Please go back to your fantastic shirts!
Awww, that's so nice of you. You'll have to put up with T-Shirts for a while. I just had 'em made and dammit, I'm going to wear them! But the shirts will be back, now and then. Promise.
Thank you for your wonderful channel Mr. Hurwitz - my most watched channel now. I’m glad for hearing your thoughts and background regarding Ives and this piece. I look forward to hearing your thoughts on the best 4th symphony or other Ives works hopefully!
They will be coming. I'd like to do the 4th but MTT and SFSO just released a new disc of 3 and 4 that I need to hear and review first, so I can include it in the survey.
Just bought the Dohnanyi on your recommendation. Thanks!
Thanks for this! I adored this piece in my teens and was revisiting it recently.
I’ve been thinking about something else recently - how do Discs get funded these days. Im a Cellist and was considering the fact that Jamie Walton, Christian Poltera, and Paul Watkins have made a huge number of cello concerto recordings recently. They are all excellent cellists to be sure, but they are hardly stars like Yo-Yo Ma or Steven Isserlis. How is it then that record companies are affording to pay orchestras for these recordings, mostly of works that have already been recorded? Lots of them are off the beaten track, but nevertheless, excellent recordings have already been made of the pieces sometimes already on the same label! Considering the financials of the industry at the moment, do they have private funding - fans of these particular cellists who want to hear them play everything? Or what is it? I can’t imagine the sales can have been high for any of them.
Artists and orchestras have to find funding sources. The labels get paid to distribute the result, often as not.
@@DavesClassicalGuide Ok interesting. Sad, but interesting.
J’ai cherché pendant des années des versions différentes de l’Inachevée de Schubert. J’ai écouté des dizaines d’interprétations différentes parmi les plus grands chefs et je n’en ai jamais été satisfait. Mais maintenant, je sais pourquoi grace à vous M. Hurwitz : c’est parce que la première version que j’ai entendue et que j’ai toujours gardé en tête est celle de... Jochum avec l’orchestre de Boston ! 😆
Donc, 100% d’accord avec vous : cette version est d’une perfection inégalée !
Merci!
Sorry, I made a stupid mistake because I wanted to write this comment on your review about the best Schubert’s 8th. But i’m sure you understood it ! 😅
I own the Slatkin, Ormandy (Sony & RCA), Dohnányi, MTT (DG & Sony & RCA), Morlot, Davis, Orpheus, John Adams (Concertgebouw), Sinclair (Naxos & Koch Schwann), Metzmacher, Swierczewski and finally Hanson. Maybe I forgot one.
Another CD with the Three Places with Tilson Thomas and the SFSO that I like has the Housatonic at Stockbridge in its choral version. So I guess there are actually three versions of the work. That disc is especially nice because it contains a variety of short pieces and songs delightfully sung by Thomas Hampson. I also really like the Sinclair performance of the chamber version on Naxos that contains some other great Ives music not normally played.
I'm trying to find a copy of the Ormandy RCA...looks out of print. There is 1 used copy on Amazon.UK, but I don't want that. Hopefully a new copy will turn up on ebay.
What’s your opinion of the Howard Hanson version on Mercury? It’s been my favorite alongside the MTT.
Nothing wrong with it but it's been superceded by later versions, I think.
@David Hurwitz Have you received the new MTT recording of Ives' Symphony No. 4 by now? if not, I can send you a (digital retail) copy. I can't wait for your review of this magnificent masterpiece! :-)
It's in my pile. Hang in there!
4 discs for 3 Places! What's not to like.
It makes it well fish.
"Charles Ives is a glorious American original who composed a few successful works. Overall, however, his compositions do not succeed because of their crude, haphazard forms and undistinguished materials." (William Schuman) Maybe karma that Schuman's violin concerto was left off that Tilson Thomas reissue? Also, I wonder if we care to have a comparative review of recordings of Schuman's New England Triptych?
I don't see a need for that...
@@DavesClassicalGuide Probably isn't any need...
How long were you in Wilmington?
I was born there and then we moved to CT when I was small, but my mother's family is from Wilmington. I have many relatives there and have been there regularly all my life.
David Hurwitz Nice. I’ve been here over 50 years.
@@DavesClassicalGuide Cool, didn’t know the Delaware connection! I grew up there, and still have my folks and brother there so spend lots of time there. Was in north Wilmington....great jumping off point for so many places yet a nice quiet corner of the world. Kind of wish I could get back to the area!