If you found this interesting or informative, I would highly recommend Small Arms Solutions' video on the 1913 rail or "Picatinny" rail. Some interesting info there on its' origins and then some. It's definitely an interesting video, and goes more in-depth into something a lot of us get a lot of utility out of, but probably don't really think a whole lot about.
My experience with the "Picatinny rail". Many years ago, probably back in the early 1970s, I lived not far from the Picatinny Arsenal in northern New Jersey. I was fortunate to have taken flying lessons in 1968 at 16 years old and eventually got my pilot's license in 1969. One day, I was flying solo returning from Blairstown airport headed towards my home base at Caldwell Airport (KCDW) in a small two-seater Cessna 150. There are no restricted areas over Picatinny Arsenal and there are were no warnings when the army was about to do an explosion test. I was flying at a pretty low altitude, about 2,000 MSL (mean sea level) which meant I was probably about 1,500 ft above the ground over the Picatinny range. I'm not sure what kind of testing they were doing at the time, but suddenly I heard the loudest explosion ever. The shock wave was so intense the airplane actually buffeted from the shock. I guess they were testing a tank round, but I have no clue what it was really from. We didn't have noise-suppressing headsets back in the day. I wore earplugs when other pilots laughed at me. Now I can hear better than they can, but still not so great. Anyway, that's my experience with the Picatinny "rail".
You should've also mentioned that the Slots on a Picatinny rail are at a set spacing and will be consistent so you can move a scope or accessory from one picatinny rail to another. The slots on a Weaver rail or base could be any spacing and are usually put where weaver thinks they most suit the intended firearm. So moving a scope with weaver rings from one rifle to the next may not always fit without sliding at least one of the rings to fit the new platform.
@@macdaddy9344 He mentioned it in the context of tolerances, which usually implies there is variation but they will be relatively small.. But in reality the Weaver rail just defines a cross-section and the recoil slots can be spaced very widely, even inches apart if desired.
What Picatinny did in order to not become the target of copy right infringement was to leave the material between the mounting lugs and refine it's over-all tolerances. That's basically how they can make a near Weaver clone without paying royalties. Its just different enough to make a difference in the eyes of the patent laws.
You do realize that intellectual property rights do have an expiration date? And by the time Picatinny was developed, whatever Weaver had, already expired?
The name is misleading... they explained the Picatinny name but not the number. I assumed it was a year as well just because using years is so common... 1913 rail on a 1911 gun.
I dated two girls in College Brittany Picatinny (sweet Italian girl) and Mary Weaver . The differences between these girls was just as He described the differences on these to mounts..Weird Sweet girls both of them
@@millieatr third grade was awesome ... your award will look great on the mantle of the fireplace... or the toilet tank in the bathroom... can’t go wrong either way.
Hmmmm after all these years i never knew there was a difference. Guess i need to do more than iron sights and maybe get ar15 😉 thanks for simple but very informative video.
Yes lower sights. You'll get way way better accuracy at different ranges and especially at close range with smaller height gap from the scope to the barrel
I just got a Savage AXIS XP BA .308 w/ the Weaver scope 3x9. Going to put on a rail mount, might as well be the Picatinny. Can you tell me which rail "model" I need please? Does the mount come with the appropriate screws? BTW: changing scopes too. Ed/77563/USMC66'-
Savage Axis .270 and Tradition Pursuit muzzleloader. Would you suggest Picatinny or Weaver. I use a tactacam 6.0, thinking Picatinny is the best match for the under scope mount from Tactacam. Thanks
I'd like to know what standard the top rail on the Desert Eagle XIX is, it sure as shootin' isn't a Picatinny, and it sure don't look like Caleb's Weaver. So what is it?
If it has the same profile as a picatinny when you look down it from the front or back, it could be either picatinny or weaver. If it doesn't have the standardized lug spacing from the side, it's weaver. If it is weird as all hell, it's still weaver. Weaver is any mount with that basic profile that doesn't have standardized lug spacing. You can make whatever you want and call it "weaver".
I have a Husqvarna model 1600 , in 30 06, a great shooter, factory drilled and tapped for weaver bases, but I can not find the bases. Any help would be very much appreciated ?
I have a hatsan 135 air rifle that has one of those rails i just got a FFP air rifle scope with a 44mm objective lens what medium 1inch scope rings fit
I have a weaver rail on my 22 lever gun. I have a bad, cheap, old 2x red dot on it that I don't like. I want to put a modern prismatic on it, but cannot because it's a stupid weaver mount. They don't make piccatiny mounts for it. Sucks.
I got the big oval washers for my picatinny rails they dony fit in my m lok? How the hell you ger these things started and mounted? I was told these work with my 1913 rail??? I thought i coukd start them then set rail on hanguard then they would spin in but the oval style washer or locking nut is to big for the Mlock slot on my rail? Im stumped here unless these are keymod style washers..I dont own any keymode rails so im not sure wat is going on here other then a big pain in the ass!!
I love the picatinny rail..it looks cool....im not too fond of the looks of the m-lock. The m-lock ar15 rails always look too skinny like you are pointing a broomstick at something....the picatinny looks alot cooler. Im sure the m-lok ismore comfortable....but looking cool is more important than comfort lol.
@@claytonatkinson865 I've been looking for adaptors to the Picatinny rail for all my optics and to make the Picatinny my universal optic mount system on all my guns and optics.
I have a rock island arms rifle with what i thought was a picatinny rail machined into the upper. I tried to mount a vortex scope with one piece base that im sure is a picatinny base is a no go space between slots is not the same and being a one piece can't be adjusted with out filing back of cross bars on base of scope . Chose not to and sold rifle
This video needs to go deeper into the differences. I want to watch the video and not have to waste an hour calling a tech line. Also, what kind of rail is on top of the Ruger 10/22? The strait one that came with the rifle that doesn't have cross slots.
If you have a Weaver rail what you need is a rail replacement. I've been shooting for decades and only recently heard about Weaver rails. Pause at 1:40 for the visual difference. The Weaver rail is on top and has the slot, groove, or channel down the middle. Picatinny rails are composed of solid mounting bars horizontal to the barrel. This is the first I'm hearing that Weaver rails are "loosey-goosey" on measurements too, yet another reason to scrap it. Common sense would dictate that if your grandpas rifle has a Weaver rail with a scope already mounted it is not necessary to replace everything unless he wants scope interchangeability or an upgrade, but if it ain't broke.. give it time.
Weaver rails aren't simply like those. There is a bunch of different kinds of Weaver rails and bases. Picantinny rails are universal on the other hand. Picantinny rails are the melting pot. Weaver rails and bases are the salad bowl.
This doesn't answer anything. So what is the difference? HOW are the slots different? What width? Are the rails the same height? What about overall rail width? Useless video.
davidgcalderone I believe Stan Sudol at Picatinny was communicating with Swan at the time, but I am not aware of any contracts to Swan. By creating MIL-STD-1913, Gary Houtsma/the Government created something everyone could use and everyone could agree on. If the MIL-STD had not been created, rails would not be ubiquitous as they are today. Weaver and Swan deserve much of the credit, too.
Great information! I knew a bit of that, but not where the Picatinny name came from or when it came into existence. I do have a question though. I’ve heard from some that calling it a Picatinny rail is incorrect and that it should only be called a “M1913 mil spec” rail. Would someone in the know mind commenting on that?
NEWSFLAH There is no such things as a Picatinny rail. Dick Swan invented the rail and the Picatinny Arsenal had nothing to do with it. Please fact check me on this.
Why do they still make weavers? It was the first attempt and didn’t quite do it. Picatinny rails fixed the problem with scope creep. Let the weaver die.
@@ride0RgetR0DE0n I didn't say you didn't understand what the difference was. But I bet if I showed you 1 rail you couldn't tell me if it wss pic, or weaver.. that's the point I made
@@joejr9653 that's true. But that wasn't said in the video. I'm a gunsmith and can tell the difference. I just don't think that did a good job at explaining how to tell the difference in between the 2..
Government stole Weaver’s design. Plain and simple! But they are the government. Are you surprised? Slots on top are the main difference like you said. Government uses a different way to measure their rail, but except for slots, both are basically the same. No credit given to Weaver at all.
"They made the picatinny so it would be universal and every gun manufacturer could make accessories for them". And then weaver came along stole the idea and said fuck all that universal BS, if i change it juuuust slightly ill be rich!
Thanks. I didn't know there was an actual difference. I thought the two were synonymous. Now I know better!
Epic poggers my dude
@@Jankovek What's a poggers?
I learned this difference when I tried to mount m1913 rings to Weaver base. No bueno.
I've heard so many different explanations it's great to hear a simple but concise one without all the fluff and bs
I always wondered, but never really got a straight answer until now.
If you found this interesting or informative, I would highly recommend Small Arms Solutions' video on the 1913 rail or "Picatinny" rail. Some interesting info there on its' origins and then some. It's definitely an interesting video, and goes more in-depth into something a lot of us get a lot of utility out of, but probably don't really think a whole lot about.
"And now you know."
"And knowing is half the battle."
"The other half is violence."
@@riflemanm16a2 G.I. JOE!
@@bobshisuncle He's the real American hero
GI JOE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I learned something firearm-related and not one watermelon had to die.
Its so sad.... I know! 😢
🚫🍉⏰️
My experience with the "Picatinny rail". Many years ago, probably back in the early 1970s, I lived not far from the Picatinny Arsenal in northern New Jersey. I was fortunate to have taken flying lessons in 1968 at 16 years old and eventually got my pilot's license in 1969. One day, I was flying solo returning from Blairstown airport headed towards my home base at Caldwell Airport (KCDW) in a small two-seater Cessna 150. There are no restricted areas over Picatinny Arsenal and there are were no warnings when the army was about to do an explosion test. I was flying at a pretty low altitude, about 2,000 MSL (mean sea level) which meant I was probably about 1,500 ft above the ground over the Picatinny range. I'm not sure what kind of testing they were doing at the time, but suddenly I heard the loudest explosion ever. The shock wave was so intense the airplane actually buffeted from the shock. I guess they were testing a tank round, but I have no clue what it was really from. We didn't have noise-suppressing headsets back in the day. I wore earplugs when other pilots laughed at me. Now I can hear better than they can, but still not so great. Anyway, that's my experience with the Picatinny "rail".
cool, i liv n wrkd up there n B town too
@@RocksNRuts4 Howdy neighbor.
@@daffidavit small world. so ur into guns n liv in nj? lol
@@RocksNRuts4 Lived in N.J. my whole life until I recently moved to Texas.
@@daffidavit haha good man! how u like over all n painless to buy n own guns? lookn there too
Class - Excellent presentation ! ! !
You should've also mentioned that the Slots on a Picatinny rail are at a set spacing and will be consistent so you can move a scope or accessory from one picatinny rail to another.
The slots on a Weaver rail or base could be any spacing and are usually put where weaver thinks they most suit the intended firearm. So moving a scope with weaver rings from one rifle to the next may not always fit without sliding at least one of the rings to fit the new platform.
Didn’t he literally address this issue within the video? No standards on the weaver whereas the picatinny has very tight tolerances?
@@macdaddy9344 I am not sure, I was busy reading the comments.
@@macdaddy9344 He mentioned it in the context of tolerances, which usually implies there is variation but they will be relatively small.. But in reality the Weaver rail just defines a cross-section and the recoil slots can be spaced very widely, even inches apart if desired.
No
I love this channel. Why did it take so long to stumble upon it?
What Picatinny did in order to not become the target of copy right infringement was to leave the material between the mounting lugs and refine it's over-all tolerances. That's basically how they can make a near Weaver clone without paying royalties. Its just different enough to make a difference in the eyes of the patent laws.
U do know picatinny came first?
@@DirtyDickMurdoc kalob said weaver......
@@DirtyDickMurdoc Picatinny rails were first designed in the late 1980s to replace weaver mounts. weaver came first by decades.
You do realize that intellectual property rights do have an expiration date? And by the time Picatinny was developed, whatever Weaver had, already expired?
@@randomnobodovsky3692 well there is the rule of law, and then there is the rule of lawyers in attempting to make money.
That's nice of Brownells to offer that consulting number for people to call. Can anyone just call them with technical questions at any time?
I was today years old when I learned the differences. Thanks!
I once had a guy genuinely ask me why the 1913 picatinny rail was never found on ww1 guns, it was a good laugh.
I have definitely wondered if the picatinny rail was invented in 1913.
I mean, the name is a bit misleading being an actual year that happened.
@@schneir5 Yeah same until a few years ago and I've been into guns for over a decade now lmao
The name is misleading... they explained the Picatinny name but not the number. I assumed it was a year as well just because using years is so common... 1913 rail on a 1911 gun.
@@macdaddy9344 mil-std-1913. 1913 is the document number that has the standard specifications for the rail and interfaces.
I dated two girls in College Brittany Picatinny (sweet Italian girl) and Mary Weaver . The differences between these girls was just as He described the differences on these to mounts..Weird
Sweet girls both of them
@Gormm umm cough cough uh LOL
@Gormm under appreciated comment!
And we have a winner... congratulations for comment of the day... lol
@@macdaddy9344 Awesome thank you , id like to thank my parents and my third grade school teacher
@@millieatr third grade was awesome ... your award will look great on the mantle of the fireplace... or the toilet tank in the bathroom... can’t go wrong either way.
Hey Caleb,
They also make great coffee stirrers!
Hmmmm after all these years i never knew there was a difference. Guess i need to do more than iron sights and maybe get ar15 😉 thanks for simple but very informative video.
I bet you can mount more rigidly and securely to that hair than to the picatinny rail
now that's posting
Boom!
I wish I had that much thick hair
Quite a pompadour he has there!!!
If the receiver has a dovetail, is there an advantage of mounting rings directly on the receiver dovetail? Thanks.
Yes lower sights. You'll get way way better accuracy at different ranges and especially at close range with smaller height gap from the scope to the barrel
I just got a Savage AXIS XP BA .308 w/ the Weaver scope 3x9. Going to put on a rail mount, might as well be the Picatinny. Can you tell me which rail "model" I need please? Does the mount come with the appropriate screws? BTW: changing scopes too.
Ed/77563/USMC66'-
Savage Axis .270 and Tradition Pursuit muzzleloader. Would you suggest Picatinny or Weaver. I use a tactacam 6.0, thinking Picatinny is the best match for the under scope mount from Tactacam. Thanks
Thank you for this information I had no idea... I'm new to firearms.
Awesome hair dew brother! Very Nostalgic
So they are similar but different. Thanks for explaining that. Geez.
How do I measure my rail to determine if it is 9mm, 11mm or 3/8"?
Calipers, you fool! Lol.
Are there adapters to mount a device with weaver mount to a rifel with picatinny rail
I’m having a difficult time taking you seriously after the Christmas video seeing you dressed as Santa 🤪
Hahahaha
I'd like to know what standard the top rail on the Desert Eagle XIX is, it sure as shootin' isn't a Picatinny, and it sure don't look like Caleb's Weaver. So what is it?
If it has the same profile as a picatinny when you look down it from the front or back, it could be either picatinny or weaver. If it doesn't have the standardized lug spacing from the side, it's weaver. If it is weird as all hell, it's still weaver. Weaver is any mount with that basic profile that doesn't have standardized lug spacing. You can make whatever you want and call it "weaver".
All Deagle’s have a picatinny rail on top of the barrel.
Thank you for a succinct and useful video.
I could get any tips on what laser beam to get for this mossberg 715P I have one and want a laser on it just don’t know which one would fit
I have a Husqvarna model 1600 , in 30 06, a great shooter, factory drilled and tapped for weaver bases, but I can not find the bases. Any help would be very much appreciated ?
Got a sears model 101.53521 in 30-30 need to know what weaver mount I need to put a scope on it
I have a hatsan 135 air rifle that has one of those rails i just got a FFP air rifle scope with a 44mm objective lens what medium 1inch scope rings fit
I have a weaver rail on my 22 lever gun. I have a bad, cheap, old 2x red dot on it that I don't like. I want to put a modern prismatic on it, but cannot because it's a stupid weaver mount. They don't make piccatiny mounts for it. Sucks.
Vortex crossfire will fit.
Do you know witch rail i would need for my Dickinson XX2-S 12gage?
I got the big oval washers for my picatinny rails they dony fit in my m lok? How the hell you ger these things started and mounted? I was told these work with my 1913 rail??? I thought i coukd start them then set rail on hanguard then they would spin in but the oval style washer or locking nut is to big for the Mlock slot on my rail? Im stumped here unless these are keymod style washers..I dont own any keymode rails so im not sure wat is going on here other then a big pain in the ass!!
I love the picatinny rail..it looks cool....im not too fond of the looks of the m-lock. The m-lock ar15 rails always look too skinny like you are pointing a broomstick at something....the picatinny looks alot cooler. Im sure the m-lok ismore comfortable....but looking cool is more important than comfort lol.
Thank You for the info.
Background music not required. An informative video.
How do I mount scopes, red dot sights, and lasers on a picatinny rail if they don't fit? Are there adapters?
Need different set of scope rings or some optics have a removable base that can be swapped out for what you meed
@@claytonatkinson865 I've been looking for adaptors to the Picatinny rail for all my optics and to make the Picatinny my universal optic mount system on all my guns and optics.
I have a rock island arms rifle with what i thought was a picatinny rail machined into the upper. I tried to mount a vortex scope with one piece base that im sure is a picatinny base is a no go space between slots is not the same and being a one piece can't be adjusted with out filing back of cross bars on base of scope . Chose not to and sold rifle
Thats some slick hair my guy
Heh Heh... yeah, but looks good, though. At 65, I'm just glad to have about 75% of mine left. ;-)
@@beargunn7820 youre 65??? You win. I had no clue.
Ok ,how do you know about the Vista Cruiser?
My midwest industries side mount for my ak has t marks, does that make it a 1913 pic rail?
Which one fits for Benelli Argo E rifle?
what kind of gun oil do you use on your hair ⁉️🙂. its perfectly in place🤷
This video needs to go deeper into the differences. I want to watch the video and not have to waste an hour calling a tech line. Also, what kind of rail is on top of the Ruger 10/22? The strait one that came with the rifle that doesn't have cross slots.
If you have a Weaver rail what you need is a rail replacement.
I've been shooting for decades and only recently heard about Weaver rails. Pause at 1:40 for the visual difference. The Weaver rail is on top and has the slot, groove, or channel down the middle. Picatinny rails are composed of solid mounting bars horizontal to the barrel. This is the first I'm hearing that Weaver rails are "loosey-goosey" on measurements too, yet another reason to scrap it.
Common sense would dictate that if your grandpas rifle has a Weaver rail with a scope already mounted it is not necessary to replace everything unless he wants scope interchangeability or an upgrade, but if it ain't broke.. give it time.
Not all weavers have that groove.
I always thoughg i had weaver
But i just have cut out picatinny
Its the exact same size in everey angle
Weaver rails aren't simply like those. There is a bunch of different kinds of Weaver rails and bases. Picantinny rails are universal on the other hand.
Picantinny rails are the melting pot. Weaver rails and bases are the salad bowl.
I always wondered where the heck they came up with that goofy name. Now where does the 1913 come from?
They made 1912 prototypes that didn't work...
Could I use a afg1 on a weaver rail? Mlok
Yes. I have one mounted, very securely, on my PCC...weaver rail, picatinny afg.
@@Ando2k10 thx, I got my to fit as well.
Picatinnay is the incorrect nomenclature. It's a mil STD 1913 rail.
D K Picatinny Rail is the nickname for the MIL-STD-1913 Rail. MIL-STD-1913 was created at Picatinny, thus the nickname.
I thought it was called 1913 rail?
source-Chris Bartocci
OK, so what's the difference? What should I measure with my calipers to see which is which?
1913 will be .206 across each slot, and Weaver is about .180
1913 is also noticeably deeper to just your naked eye.
A schematic here- www.brownells.com/guntech/picatinny-rails-weaver-rails-what-8217-s-the-difference-/detail.htm?lid=10724
@@animalmother556x45 Weaver spacing is whatever the manufacturer wanted it to be. Picatinny is the same on every mount.
This doesn't answer anything. So what is the difference? HOW are the slots different? What width? Are the rails the same height? What about overall rail width? Useless video.
Hi there!
I just dropped my mk-180 crossbow and snapped the 11mm fixed dovetail that came with it? Can this be repaired?
Regards Jason
your hair is elite!
But you didn't even tell what the measurement differences are.
Would have been incredible if you would have given us some DIMENSIONS so we could tell what we have sitting in front of us!!
Picatiny was a hairstyle in the ww1 days . it was the advent of "Three Flowers and Pomade"
Caleb needs to cut back on the energy drinks before making these videos. 😁
Those dang cappuccinos!
@@CalebSavant Don't ever change. It's good to see a RUclips person that isn't all in my face and full of themselves.
Nice hair cut dude
The army neither designed the M1913 rail, nor did it originate at the Picatinny Arsenal.
davidgcalderone Gary Houtsma at Picatinny created MIL-STD-1913.
@@frankdindl790 No, it was Richard Swan of A.R.M.S. Picatinny was the contracting office.
davidgcalderone I believe Stan Sudol at Picatinny was communicating with Swan at the time, but I am not aware of any contracts to Swan. By creating MIL-STD-1913, Gary Houtsma/the Government created something everyone could use and everyone could agree on. If the MIL-STD had not been created, rails would not be ubiquitous as they are today. Weaver and Swan deserve much of the credit, too.
Close up on the hair again please 😂
Dont get crazy!
@@CalebSavant you're a clean cut dude my man. I dig it though 😂
I don't get it...
The reason they are different is because they are different. Have a nice day, and don't forget to buy from our overpriced inventory.
LOL. I know. This video is worthless. It shouldn't have any likes.
Caleb is Mr. Rate in his younger days😁
i thought the weaver was just picatinny with less weight
Great information! I knew a bit of that, but not where the Picatinny name came from or when it came into existence.
I do have a question though. I’ve heard from some that calling it a Picatinny rail is incorrect and that it should only be called a “M1913 mil spec” rail. Would someone in the know mind commenting on that?
Tomato, tomAto. The proper nomenclature may be “M1913 mil spec” but fact is that society has already coined it "Picatinny rail".
Indeed, neither is wrong. It is commonly referred to as both.
I prefer calling it the shortest, fewest syllables term I can, thus "picatinny rail."
It’s MIL-STD-1913 that defines the Picatinny Rail. MIL-STD -1913 was created by Gary Houtsma at Picatinny Arsenal.
Now, with that being said...
How much do i owe you now Brownells for watching your video 239.99$ + i get a weaver rail?
Like always, we educate the masses for FREEEEEE!
NEWSFLAH There is no such things as a Picatinny rail. Dick Swan invented the rail and the Picatinny Arsenal had nothing to do with it. Please fact check me on this.
Why do they still make weavers? It was the first attempt and didn’t quite do it. Picatinny rails fixed the problem with scope creep. Let the weaver die.
Kwa mp9 is weird
Woah wut. I thought that was like a synonym.
And after this video, anyone who couldn't tell them apart, still can't..
Fail..
What do you mean I didn’t know the difference and now it seems pretty clear.
@@ride0RgetR0DE0n I didn't say you didn't understand what the difference was. But I bet if I showed you 1 rail you couldn't tell me if it wss pic, or weaver.. that's the point I made
Pause it at 108. You can tell the difference in the appearance. Pic rail on left is flat across top. Weaver on right is notched down center.
@@joejr9653 that's true. But that wasn't said in the video. I'm a gunsmith and can tell the difference. I just don't think that did a good job at explaining how to tell the difference in between the 2..
@@kygunrunner I agree it wasn't stated in video. Definitely could have done a better job.
tas bem penteadinho...lol
Government stole Weaver’s design. Plain and simple! But they are the government. Are you surprised? Slots on top are the main difference like you said. Government uses a different way to measure their rail, but except for slots, both are basically the same. No credit given to Weaver at all.
Wow. That was useless. I still don’t know how to tell them apart.
the weaver spacing is a little closer together
"They made the picatinny so it would be universal and every gun manufacturer could make accessories for them".
And then weaver came along stole the idea and said fuck all that universal BS, if i change it juuuust slightly ill be rich!