The Rich Man and Lazarus - Chris Sparks
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- Опубликовано: 3 окт 2024
- Do the wicked go to hell immediately after death? Do the righteous go immediately to heaven? Or are both asleep in the grave? What did Jesus mean to teach through the parable of the rich man and Lazarus?
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So grateful to find this channel...it was just in time, really needed this kind of preaching
That's why it's important to study for ourselves to understand God's word so we won't fall for false doctrines. Great lesson breakdown.
I really loved the document you made about heliocentric theory and the scentism. It was very enlightening and connected many dots for me. But in terms of the subject of death, I tend to disagree. Your explanation of the subject seems purely materialistic and very very similar to the explanation of the JW people, who even denied the existence of human souls. If only you could check out Revelation 6 9.
Call it materialistic, but it is the truth confirmed by scripture. The belief that the soul is some kind of ghost that can live outside the body is the foundation of spiritualism. This doctrine of devils has opened the door to the belief that dead people be communicated with, which is nothing less that communion with demon spirits.
It is the position of the Roman Catholic church that the soul can exist outside a body. Whatever Rome teaches in theology is like how the mainstream news reports on world events, the opposite is usually the truth.
Philippians 1:21-24 Why does Paul believe that if he dies he will be with Christ, which is far better?
Also, Jesus tells the thief on the cross “Today you will be with me in paradise”. What did Jesus mean by that?
@@smicah03
Exactly. Totally agreed.
Amen 🙏
According to the Book of Enoch Sheol/Hades has compartments for both the righteous and the unrighteous, so Abraham's bosom would have been also in the Abode of the dead in the heart of the earth. Even from the "Old" Testament you get the idea that the righteous go to Sheol. Agreed that no one goes to Heaven after death, Jesus alone could ascend past the firmament. Blessings and many thanks for your work!
Nice to hear from you sister, even if I do not see things in quite the same way. If the book of Enoch claims that the souls of the dead are somehow conscious in death, this is contrary to many passages of scripture which state they they are utterly unconscious (as were shared in the presentation).
Therefore, I would apply the force of this verse to the book of Enoch:
Isa 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.
@@earthenvesselsministry Consciousness and thoughts are 2 different things… thoughts are of the mind, consciousness the spirit… my thoughts I can alter, not the spirit.
@@supertrn76 While the terms mind and spirit can mean different things in context, they are also synonymous. Noice how in the NT Apostle Paul used the word 'mind' when quoting from Isa 40:13 in place of the word 'spirit' as it is found in the OT.
Isa 40:13 Who hath directed the *Spirit* of the LORD, or being his counsellor hath taught him?
Rom 11:34 For who hath known the *mind* of the Lord? or who hath been his counsellor?
From this we see that God's Spirit can also be called His mind. The difference of these translations comes from the fact that Paul was quoting rom the Septuagint, which he felt was an accurate translation. Notice that God's Spirit can be compared to man's spirit:
1Co 2:11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.
Now we 'know' in our minds, not in some thoughtless state of being. We have just seen mind is synonymous with spirit. The mind is not the brain, but and intangible part of our being. So is the spirit. I do not believe you can make a clear separation between the two using the scripture.
To say that you can have consciousness or be a spirit without thought is not something that you can support with scripture. In chapter 22 of Enoch it says that Abel is accusing Cain from hades. You can't make accusations against someone without being conscious and thinking.
@@earthenvesselsministry ok, I don't disagree, but Genesis says that Abel's blood cried out to God from the ground. Perhaps it's the same idea in Enoch?
@@purpleporcupine3575 Abel's blood crying from the ground is clearly figurative. It is simple and makes no logical sense as blood cannot speak, so its obviously means that vengeance is crying out to be repaid.
But what Enoch says is very detailed and is written as though the writer actually saw the event taking place. The angel "Raphael" even explains the scene to the writer of Enoch as though it is a literal event.
I believe that whoever wrote Enoch used that verse in Genesis as the grounds for their work. They literalised that figurative expression then wrote some elaborate fantasy (with the aid of the devil) to support the Babylonian heresy that the book of Enoch teaches.
That doesn't mean that there aren't true things written in the book of Enoch that line up with the Bible. Of course they had to include truth. If they didn't nobody would swallow it.
I have one more question friends. If there is not eternal torment what is meant in the verse Revelation 20:10? Is it only applicable for Satan and the beast and false prophet and not people? Also, can you please explain all the verses in Mathew regarding the outer darkness and the weeping and gnashing of teeth? Is this the lake of fire also? Is the weeping and gnashing of teeth a quick and temporary agony followed by the death of the soul?
I just watched New Jerusalem, The Flat Earth & the Millennium video and I think it answers my questions. Bless you in Jesus’ name. 🙏
When it says that the wicked shall be tormented 'for ever and ever' in Revelation 20:10 it may sounds like eternal torment. But we cannot use one scripture against another. The Bible says that the wicked shall 'be as though they had not been' and that Satan and all the wicked will be consumed to ashes one day:
“For evildoers shall be cut off; but those that wait upon the Lord, they shall inherit the earth. For yet a little while, and *the wicked shall not be; yea, thou shalt diligently consider his place, and it shall not be.* But the meek shall inherit the earth; and shall delight themselves in the abundance of peace." (Psalm 37:9-11)
“For yet a little while, and the wicked shall perish, and the enemies of the Lord shall be as the fat of lambs; *they shall consume; into smoke shall they consume away.* ” Psalm 37:20.
There are many other verses which state the same thing. We cannot conclude that the scripture contradicts itself so we must find harmony. The verse previous to Revelation 20:10 shows harmony with the verses quoted above:
Rev 20:9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and *devoured* them.
Therefore, the wicked do not suffer eternally in torments, but are eventually 'devoured' by the fire that comes from God. Below is a verse that uses the phrase 'for ever and ever' but cannot be concluded to mean for eternity. It is in context of 'the day of the LORD'S vengeance at the end of the world:
Isa 34:8 For it is the day of the LORD'S vengeance, and the year of recompences for the controversy of Zion.
Isa 34:9 And the streams thereof shall be turned into pitch, and the dust thereof into brimstone, and the land thereof shall become burning pitch.
Isa 34:10 It shall not be quenched night nor day; *the smoke thereof shall go up for ever* : from *generation to generation* it shall lie waste; none shall pass through it *for ever and ever.*
The very next chapter shows that the sentence pronounced over the land above, that was described as 'for ever and ever' will eventually cease.
Isa 35:1 The wilderness and the solitary place shall be glad for them; and the desert shall rejoice, and blossom as the rose.
Isa 35:2 It shall blossom abundantly, and rejoice even with joy and singing: the glory of Lebanon shall be given unto it, the excellency of Carmel and Sharon, they shall see the glory of the LORD, and the excellency of our God.
...
Isa 35:7 And the parched ground shall become a pool, and the thirsty land springs of water: in the habitation of dragons, where each lay, shall be grass with reeds and rushes.
So when we read such phrases concerning the punishment of the wicked, we must realise that what is meant is that there will be a complete destruction; their death will be 'eternal' and there is no return from it. They will burn, but eventually the flames will consume them to ashes. Sodom and Gomorrha are suffering the vengeance of 'eternal fire' but they are not burning today. Those cities are nothing but ashes that we may observe as God's eternal vengeance upon them.
Jud 1:7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering *the vengeance of eternal fire.*
Yes, 'Outer darkness' is another illustration describing the complete obliteration of soul and body that will become of the wicked after the lake of fire devours them. Weeping and gnashing of teeth is a graphic illustration of the inconsolable feeling loss the wicked will experience as they enter their punishment. Keep in mind those phrases are from a parable.
God bless and feel free to email me if you have any more questions
info@earthenvessels.org.au
-Chris
I don't believe condemned sinner burn forever in hell. They are cast into the lake of fire and snuffed out. It's either eternal life or a second death. The weeping and gnashing is a mental turmoil. They know shat is coming. How could the whole conversation between the rich man and Lazarus even taken place about the water on his tongue? I belive it is mental anguish. Also when we get a reply from those that cry out from beneath the throne saying we get robes and are told to wait just a little longer. I feel convicted that the body is dead and our souls are still able to convey thought. Either way we know our destiny. Even Sheol is better than Earth. I will wait on Him and His timing. Praise the most high!!!
It is important however to make sure believers know they do not go directly to Heaven. No matter really one way or another we will wait for that blessed day. Much love,
Does eternal life mean, a period of no life, then awakening to evelasting life? Or does eternal life and God of the living mean just what it says?
@@danielclodfelter2048 The Bible says to be absent from the body, is to be present with the Lord (as long as one believes in Jesus and his death, burial and resurrection.) His blood paid the price for our sins.
The remnant of God is the 144 000 (maybe literal figure or not) who were not defiled with women (Revelation 14:4). Women represent the churches and there are a lot of churches that are following the false doctrines of the papacy in Rome who is the antichrist like changing the Sabbath to Sunday and believing in the trinity. These doctrines are not from God and against His Commandments. God is Only One who created the heaven and the earth and He is the same God who died on the Cross for us. God is Omnipresence, He can be anywhere at once. And not unless you understand how much it cost for Jesus to die on the Cross, you will still live in sin as a lifestyle. If you understand it, you will start to love what He loves and hate what He hates which is sin. If you truly accepted Him in your heart, the Spirit of Truth who is the Spirit of God will live in you and He will write His Law or Commandments in your heart. His Commandments is no longer a burden for you and instead you will delight on it because it is written in your heart. Hallelujah! To God be all the glory! Maranatha!
Thank you friend. We believe that the 144,000 are a literal number. And we agree that God created all things through His Son Jesus Christ (Ephesians 3:9). That same God (The Father) so loved the world that he gave his Only Begotten Son. These two beings are the only divine beings in existence, there is no third divine being mentioned in the scriptures as trinitarians claim.
Rev 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
Yes, Gods remnant, the actual Christians that Jesus came to redeem are the 144,000. This is not a literal number but represents all those Jesus came to save from Adam to the last person saved.
However, no one can accept Jesus. The manmade idea of man needing to and being able to accept Jesus is false and 100% antibible. It is Jesus who does the accepting. Jesus's remnant, his chosen ones, his elect do not accept Jesus, he chooses (accepts) them. We were all 100% spiritually dead, and dead people have no will and can do nothing to change their spiritually dead state.
That false idea is the apostate churches manmade freewill gospel that is another gospel. It is the gospel of the accursed.
@@earthenvesselsministry ,....No, the 144,000 is not a literal number but represents all Gods chosen ones throughout history. Just as the 1,000 years of Revelation is not a literal 1,000 years. That number represents the time from Jesus's ascension into heaven until his return on judgement day.
Also, you are correct that there is no trinity that is another false manmade CONcept. The Bible clearly tells us God is seven spirits and not three. This is why the Menorah that represents God has seven lights and not two or three.
@@shadowbannedforspeakingtru1436 While I agree that Jesus chooses us, this does not mean our will has nothin to do with the matter. Without freewill man would simply be an automaton. Love is born of freewill as we appreciate the character of God and choose to serve Him. Our Father would take no pleasure in service to him that required no choice, as would a man with a woman who who married him without her own choice. Without freewill there can be no love.
To every man is given the choice to serve God or not. God foreknew who would choose life, but that doesn't make us devoid of freewill. Moses' admonition below is to us all. Such an admonition would be mockery if man had no freewill.
Deu 30:19 I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live:
@@earthenvesselsministry ,....Sorry, but you have not understood this correctly. Our will absolutely has nothing to do with our salvation. No man can or will ever choose God, no way. It is simply not possible. The Bible clearly tells us that we are all spiritually dead, and the dead have no freewill and can do nothing to change their spiritually deadness.
Being spiritually dead is the same as being physically dead. Just as the physically dead do not have a will and can do nothing to change their physical deadness, so too the spiritually dead have no will and cannot change their spiritual deadness (make themselves spiritually alive). If we could, then we would have saved ourselves by our wills and our works. However, salvation is not of works but is of the grace of God.
The problem is, no one really understands what salvation is of the grace of God actually means. The apostate church has perverted it to mean what you have explained, and that is 100% incorrect. We absolutely have no choice. God did not foreknow who would choose him as so many have been deceived to believe. This manmade idea is 100% against what the Bible actually teaches. It is a false gospel and is another gospel.
God predestined everyone to come into the world as either one of his few chosen ones or one of his many vessels of wrath. No one has any say in it, it was all predestined for them from before the foundation of the flat stationary earth. Ones salvation is 100% not based on anything a person does, but only on the fact that God predestined them for salvation, meaning at some point in their life God will make them spiritually alive. The individual has nothing whatsoever to do with it.
Deuteronomy 30-19 cannot not be used for the false idea of freewill. Quite the opposite actually. What this is actually showing is that we do not have freewill, and no one can choose God. God saying choose life is the same as him saying repent, or to keep the ten commandments, or to believe on Jesus. The command to obey and do what is right is there, but Israel and the world has shown that not one person was ever able to do it. This is because no one has freewill and can do nothing to make themselves right with God or to save themselves as the 100% false manmade freewill gospel has deceived everyone to believe.
The very fact that Jesus came to the earth is 100% proof that we do not have freewill and can do nothing to save ourselves. Jese had to come to redeem those few that were predestined for salvation. If man had freewill then Jesus would never have had to come, we could have all saved ourselves as the 100% false manmade freewill gospel deceives us to believe.
The bottom line here is, if man had freewill to choose God or not to, then salvation is 100% of man and his will, his intellect, and his works.
The story of the rich man and Lazarus clearly explains that when you die you either go to hell or you go to PARADISE not heaven. Very few are worthy of going to actual heaven. When Jesus was on the cross he said to the thief, today you will be with me in paradise. Then three days later Jesus went to heaven.
Don't get hw you think this one was a parable. EVERY TIME Jesus starts with a parable, He says that it is a parable. I think you are adding to this scripture to fit your bias. I still love you, and am grateful for all that you have done in the name of my Lord, but I think, all be it a secondary issue, you are using Ellen Whites mystic ways to taint your your "definitions" of what the Bible is actually saying.
It is not true that Jesus announces that something is a parable every time. I do not see Jesus announcing that the parables of the unrighteous mammon, the lost coin and the prodigal son are parables before giving them. The parable of the rich man and Lazarus comes after those parables. Does Abraham dipping his toe in water to cool Lazarus' tongue sound literal? Does it seem literal that as the wicked burned in hell they could call to the saints, requesting for help? Besides, there is not one single passage in the entire Bible outside of this parable that depicts deceased people being conscious in heaven or hell (besides people that were specially raised like Moses).
Moreover, if the rich man and Lazarus is not a parable, then you make Jesus contradict a multitude of scriptures that plainly teach that the dead are utterly unconscious. Many of these were sown in this study such as:
Ecc 9:5 For the living know that they shall die: but *the dead know not any thing* , neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.
Ecc 9:6 Also their love, and their hatred, and their envy, is now perished; neither have they any more a portion for ever in any thing that is done under the sun.
Psa 146:4 His breath goeth forth, he returneth to his earth; in that very day *his thoughts perish.*
You can't ask someone to cool your tongue if your thoughts have perished.
Folks have to go to shady sources like the so-called book of Enoch to support the consciousness of the dead. Jesus knew these Jewish fables that are found in Enoch, and no doubt borrowed them for his parable as Paul did from Greek fables when he spoke to the Greeks on Mars hill.
I believe any parable uttered by Jesus is true simply based on his deity. He said himself that I am the way THE TRUTH and the life. So based on that any parable that’s not true is a LIE
Of course parables teach truth but they do so through stories that may not be literally true occurrences but figurative illustrations. I did not say that the parable wasn't true, only that we cannot base an entire doctrine on a single parable as folks do with this one. There are many verses stating that there is no consciousness in death that we can base doctrine on, for example:
Ecc 9:5 For the living know that they shall die: but *the dead know not any thing,* neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.
Ecc 9:6 Also their love, and their hatred, and their envy, is now perished; neither have they any more a portion for ever in any thing that is done under the sun.
Psa 146:4 His breath goeth forth, he returneth to his earth; *in that very day his thoughts perish.*
The dead know not anything. Thoughts perish upon death. How much plainer can it be??
What about the voices that cry out from under the throne to be avenged?
This must be taken a symbolic representation of the demand for justice rather than a literal portrayal. The souls 'crying out' is similar to the blood of Abel that demanded vengeance. God said: '"What hast thou done? *the voice of thy brother's blood crieth unto me from the ground* ." (Genesis 4:10) Even Dr. Adam Clarke deduced that this was symbolic rather than literal, and he did not believe unconsciousness in death as far as I know.
Notice also that they are said to 'rest' rather than be in heaven. Resting happens in the unconscious state of death rather than the conscious bliss of heaven:
And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, *that they should rest yet for a little season* , until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled. (Revelation 6:11)
The altar that they are under represents the altar of sacrifice, as these folks sacrificed their lives for the truth.
The Bible never says that the account of Lazarus and the rich man is a parable. That is a false teaching. Never in a parable is a man’s name given, as is the case with this account, where Jesus provides the name of the man, Lazarus. Dangerous to call something a parable that God does not.
Jesus 3 times warns about hell in Mark Chapter 9. 3 times, so you wouldn’t miss it.
“43 And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
44 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
45 And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
46 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
47 And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: it is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of God with one eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire:
48 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.”
I would caution you to simply believe the word of God. Your KJB. And not defer to the Greek when you don’t like what it says, therein making yourself your own authority, and not the word of God.
From the apostle Paul about our state in death:
“Now he that hath wrought us for the selfsame thing is God, who also hath given unto us the earnest of the Spirit.
6 ¶ Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord:
7 (For we walk by faith, not by sight:)
8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.”
How does the fact that names are used prove that this is not a parable? Where in the Bible does is the rule found that names cannot be used in parables?
There is a reason why the subjects in this particular parable are named. The raising of brother of Mary and Martha (whose name was Lazarus) was Jesus’ crowning miracle after which the Jews plotted his murder. Jesus knew that He was to raise this man from the dead in the near future, and that Jews would still disbelieve that that He was the Messiah 'though one rose from the dead’ as Abraham is portrayed as saying in the parable. (Luke 16:31).
Jesus did not teach that a man burns eternally but not destroyed in hell. He taught that hell destroyed both body and soul:
Matt 10:28 ’But rather fear him which is able to *destroy both soul and body in hell.* ’
With it in mind that the body and soul are *destroyed* in hell, we will look at the verses you mentioned from Mark 9. Jesus is using an illustration that the Jews were very familiar with. The word for hell there is Gehenna (opposed to hades or tartarus as hell is other places translated from), which was the valley of Hinnom, near Jerusalem. This place was used as a rubbish dump. Carcasses of malefactors and animals were taken there to be destroyed. What was not burned of those carcasses by the flames was to be consumed by the worms that infested that place. Their 'worm' does not represent some internal part of a man or his soul or anything like that, nowhere does scripture say that we have a 'worm' for a soul. Fire and worms are both simply agents of destruction that were not to be quenched or die until their consuming work of the carcasses was complete.
In the final destruction of the wicked the fire is 'unquenchable' in the sense that it will not cease until it’s consuming work is done of the bodies and souls of the wicked (as it was for the carcasses dumped at Gehenna). The expressions we see that lend to the idea of eternal torment illustrate the eternal nature of the sentence of the wicked, not that they will burn forever as there are several passages that clearly state that the wicked will cease to exist after flames are done with them. for example:
Oba 1:16 For as ye have drunk upon my holy mountain, so shall all the heathen drink continually, yea, they shall drink, and they shall swallow down, and *they shall be as though they had not been.*
Ezekiel says that Satan himslef will burn to ashes once the fire is done with him:
Eze 28:18 Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick; therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and *I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee.*
Are Sodom and Gomorraha still burning today? The scripture says that they are suffering the vengeance of *eternal fire* again signifying the eternal nature of their sentence.
Jud 1:7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of *eternal fire.*
@@thomasanderson5840 I know that people can use the original languages to deceive, but we don't need to throw the baby out with the bathwater.
@@thomasanderson5840 Paul is not reaching that in death we are conscious without a body. There is no consciousness without a body, that is a pagan belief that new agers and Buddhists believe. He is simply comparing the present body of corruption to the glorified state that all who partake of the 1st resurrection will be raised with:
1Co 15:42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:
We should never fell 'at home' in this fallen body that is subject to temptation and death, but rather long for our glorification:
Rom 8:23 And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, *even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.*
So Paul is simply teaching that we are to 'walk by faith' meaning we ought to 'groan within ourselves' for the heavenly bliss of glorification, rather than feel at home or satisfied with this corrupt body.