Composite Master Square Construction
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- Опубликовано: 10 сен 2017
- We take a look at some of the methods and tools used to machine, grind and assemble this master square. This is used as a master right angle reference on the surface plate to inspect right angles. Typically used in conjunction with a comparator to determine and quantify perpendicularity. The square is self checking in that if the two reference sides are parallel you can find dead true square by checking both sides with the comparator. This particular square is made from plain carbon steel and will be pack or gas carburized and finish ground. The flexures at the bottom allow minute adjustments to bring the square into exact truth.
"A machinist can never leave good enough alone." That's the most accurate quote I've ever heard.
Amen
Love to see you making stuff again (on camera for us to watch). Very enjoyable.
Nothing better than to watch the creation of a precision measurement tool to unobtainium specs!
Patience, precision and planning, that's what makes this channel so very interesting. Thanks for sharing young man. Kindest regards. Joe.
Love the feet, super elegant design. The results from the rough grind really goes to show how big a difference good inspection makes. Knowing the calibration on your plate is like night and day levels of confidence.
Extremly interesting precesion construction of your master square. So interesting how pieces from raw steel can be fabricated into such a high precision square. I'm looking forward to the final work after the heat treat.
Tom, Thank you for sharing.
Enjoy seeing your Hermann Schmidt vise in the video. Got mine from the Hermann himself, in late 60's. He used to go door to door to the machine shops in North Jersey selling direct. I was an apprentice at the time and got to pay off in time. Also bought his vise sine plate, blocks, and angle. Still have everything.
Glad to see your smiling face working in your shop again on really neat projects.
Love the new 1 2 3 blocks too. thanks for sharing. Very well done.
For all of the CNC work that I do I still get a ton of enjoyment watching things done by hand like this. Well done, sir. Hope you are doing great!
Tom Z
Additive manufacturing has it's advantages but nothing beats substrative when it comes to viewing pleasure!
Just skived off what i am supposed to be doing to watch this. Time well spent...clearly. Thanks for the film, truly lovely to watch. thanks
You do amazing work! Love the channel.
Love watching the master at work Tom, Carn't wait for part two :) cheers mate
I've watched Tom's videos long before I bought the machinery for my hobby shop.....Tom, thank you! You are like the king of this type of video. The machining footage is hypnotic and acts like a sedative...I must have been a machinist in a former life.....I can fall asleep watching your vids, no offense.....I just like them....Thanks for doing these.
Excellent work, Tom. Many thanks.
Dear Mr. Wizzard I am so GLAD Your Back ! GREAT VID as usual .Greetings From New Mexico.
REALLY cool video. I've been learning from you and adam and mrpete for awhile now, but still a little bit the newb. it took me awhile to figure out your adjustment legs. I eventually figured it out, and allI have to say is BRILLIANT! Very elegant design. Thanks for sharing.
Very nice indeed. Food for thought as a Master Square is quite expensive especially here in Australia. Just to have a nice reference tool like that for the small workshop would be so handy. Thanks for sharing the knowledge.
Beautiful work, thanks for sharing. I love your videos!
Always super interesting Tom, enjoying this series I am!
That's the nicest and cleanest welding table I've ever seen
This is hypnotizing. Thanks for sharing!
I notice your square check indicator. I like how heavy duty it is, using a big dial drop indicator instead of the smaller interapid that I use. I will be making one soon. Thanks for the inspiration!!
Love this video, watched it a few times now.
Good looking project. The welded construction is a huge benefit as making/getting a casting as base for such project is usually beyond the resources of us home gamers.
I'm finally buying my mini lathe tomorrow after many years of wanting it lol. I cannot wait to make some chips!
It is very impressive to see how aggressively those professional machines go through material
Good stuff! I'm really looking forward to the results of heat treat, not enough about that whole field on the net. Thanks, mate!
enjoyed cant wait to see the finished piece
Was good to see you get well grounded in your task at hand...
Outstanding project Tom.
Bill from Seattle.
Very nice video. Congratulations !
I just watched the LB lab tour video with John Saunders this morning, so when I saw 'composite', I was thinking glues, plastics, layers, you know, composites.
When you were working on the lightening holes, I would have swore you were milling a composite material. I began to doubt that, when it 'clunked' on the vise, just a little, as you sat it down.
Sounded like steel, then I started thinking, why would he need to lighten composite, THAT is why they are used, composites are already light.
It was the grinding that confirmed my confusion. When you said composite, you meant multiple part...
Ah well, it's been one of those days. My morning got interrupted for about 3 hours when a dare devil squirrel was immolated by a tranformer, which then exploded, knocking out power.
My day never recovered...
Guess I need to go back, and look at the first milling sequence, to see what I thought I was seeing...
Thanks for sharing... still blown away by where you get to work.
GeoD
really love the choice to use a truss design in there.
Loving the TT sticker! Greetings from the Isle of Man :)
Looks good Tom, will be interesting to see the movement after heat treat.
Классная работа. Почти как у ДМ! Мечики у Вас очень хорошие. Жаль у нас таких не делают. Успехов Вам!!!
Well Tom, just laying here after back surgery, the mind is feeling hungry, and look, Meatloaf! Just what I was hungry for, Yumm! The project is looking good, looking forward to the next installment. Nice trick on the adjustable little feet. Meanwhile, I'm rooting the refrigerator, looking for meatloaf & such I missed, a good way to spend on your back time! Thanks!!
Tom where do you get your heat treatment done ? I have some small iron surface plates I want to have stabilized. Cast local here in California to.
great... always a pleasure to watch
Hey! Yer draggin that file backwards again lol. Thanks for the vid Tom. Im on the lookout for a surface grinder!
Good video, great advice. Note: did not realize that Shasta made a good lubricant, lol. Thank you!
Unusual method of construction. Many variables added to the long term stability equation. I guess the proof will be in the eating
MAN TOM ID VISIT THAT BAND SAW SO MUCH IF I LIVED CLOSE LOVE IT !!!!! thanks for sharing
Forgot about earth clamp, lots of times. I'm wondering what's happening to the printing press? Thanks Tom.
Nice trick with the rubber bands!
Tom Lipton and Stefan Gotteswinter star in: "The World's Most Accurate Fidget Spinner Showdown"! No plans, just mano-a-mano for run-out and rotation time. What a showdown that would be!
Poncho likes bacon With robrenz quietly smiling in the background for some reason…
If Robin wants to join in it's open to all comers. This Old Tony, Mr. Crispin, Joe Pie, let's have a pissing contest!
I envy that bat cave of yours Tom! All those wonderful toys -the surface grinder I would die for mate. Keep the loaf coming buddy.
Good video, Mr. Ox.
You didn't need to flip the vice around to mill those triangles. Simply flip the part in the vice around the spindle axis and those angles are now on the Y axis as they were before.
Looking good so far. I bet you get it to 1 millionth or some other almost unobtainable accuracy. Ahl be baak for the next part. (I am still an Arnold fan).
You got to separate Arnold the man from Arnold the actor, two different people.
Never forgot the ground clamp but have had it jump off a couple of times, frustrating as hell. Nice looking piece of tooling Tom..
GREAT VIDEO !!
Oh! Nice Plexiglas pry-bar. I'm stealing that idea :)
Hah, You spotted that!
Cheers,
Tom
Tom, that master square is looking real good so far, It'l be interesting to see how it fare's after heat treat.
Looking good Tom! Have you considered grinding/turning a very shallow taper on the head of a SHCS for your adjustment screws for better resolution and shock stability instead of the steep flat head angle? Thanks again for all your support!
ATB, Robin
Hey Robin. You are probably right it would be better to have a steeper angle. I built one flexure before hand and tested it to see how well it behaved. It took considerable force to move the foot and seemed controllable so I decided I would trade fastener tension for resolution in this case. The goal is to lap the feet accurately but have an adjustable back door if needed.
All the best,
Tom
robrenz.....sir...the internet isnt the same without constant videos from you..I sure wish youd either stop making videos aLL TOGETHER SO WE SO SIT AND WAIT.,.,OR MAke some videos....youre missed ir!!
Great job !!!
Great project Tom. Matt C.
Can we get the sequel video sir? I would like to see how that finishes :)
a master of chip control.... I love it
cool Project,
Like the Isle of Man sticker on your welding mask
that round cylinder square looks a lot like one of mine that I made on the lathe. pretty handy using a black granite tile I got at home depot was flat' latest sweep not so much. there's still a corner that leads to the middle but hey found my squarest square demonstrate some fleemarket find squares for bet you'll find some old rusty one's that'll blow your mind thanks tom got one of those huntsman mig welders just love that helmet always be my favorite
Man Tom that was a HUGE cut on that one side edge, hell even .003" is deep on my t&p, but i'm grinding dry for the moment, gotta weld up a pvc wier tank for coolant. Got all the stuff, just lack the time.
Ps. Thanks for getting back to the vids!
With small step overs it works fine. You can take even more than that safely. Just think like a centerless grinder.
Cheers,
Tom
Waiting for the heat treatment! Greetings from Finland!
I am likeing Toms Truss Square.
That is a better name than composite. Its a nod to the Pratt Whitney truss design level and snap gages. Look them up as they are pretty cool looking.
Best,
Tom
Tom's Truly True Truss Square?
Enjoyed!
Man, I just started building the 123 block, now you are showing something else?! Great video as always though.
Damn that was impressiv :)
I LOVE this video (and all of yours Tom!) .. I am sorry if I am missing something- is there a follow up video to this, inspecting after getting it back from heat-treat and finish grinding etc? I would love to know what happens from here! Thank you
Hi Tom, will you be able to include any footage of the heat treatment process for this Master Square.
Mark Fryer I second this though. I'd love to see how they treat such a large item.
Can you elaborate on your choice to use 4 flexures instead of three? I know you can get something to sit on four points but it's much easier to use three, no? Also, caught the lexan pinch bar for the mag chuck ... NICE! Thanks for the video.
For squarish bases four points is more stable. The Hermann Schmidt has four lapped feet on it for this reason. Its over constrained but more stable in this situation. Three flexures would have been awkward with this design so I opted for symmetry. Cheers,
Tom
beautiful
You are very clever and deserve a lot of biscuits
спасибо за видео! лайк за труды
I enjoy your videos. A suggestion for a name, Slide Form, or Tap Form, kinda obvious but simple and easy to live with.
Tom, when you surface grind a big piece how does it remain perfectly consistent when the wheel is actually wearing while being used. Are there automatic compensators on the machine? I do realize it is a minute amount of wear, but it IS still wearing.
Bobby W you're only cutting with the outside leading edge, and as it breaks down you still have the rest of the way towards the center, but it will round off vs leaving a nice square edge to cut with as the wheel breaks down.
Hope this makes sense.
The edges of the wheel is what break down first. The diameter actually changes really slowly.
I've been wondering if it would be a good idea to have to wheel at an angle against the travel of the work. Any tiny imperfections on the wheel would be evened out. Of course it has to be perpendicular if you were to make some kind of profile cut on an edge.
Only the "high spot" of the wheel is contacting the surface as it moves along it. Grinding wheels are used to "machine" crankshaft journals and other precision shafts that have sufaces that aren't concentric with the centerline, but in those situations the work is rotating as well and there is a lot of coolant involved and the stone is grinding only a portion of the width of the journal. It's also done post-heat treatment and final polishing is done with emery cloth bands that are like a narrow belt sander against the journal. The other major difference is that crankshaft journals have plain bearings supporting them in the block and supporting the connecting rod and those bearings are made with steel backs but have relatively soft "babbit" surfaces in contact with the journals.
There is oil clearance built into the "joint" so the bearing "floats" on a hydrodynamic '"film" of oil and in theory the shaft never contacts the bearings. And that is pretty much true except for at startup with no oil pressure or high-load situations with insufficient oil pressure. Then there's a slight amount of wear in the first case and very short part life in the second. The bearing and journals are obviously of different materials and "self-lubricate" and are never TRULY "dry" at startup. Really high-quality bearings used in some heavy-duty diesels actually have a "depression" in the middle of the bearing so oil can "puddle" there at shutdown. Surface tension and the fact that the engine begins cooling and the oil thickens immediately after shutdown help keep oil in bearings as well.
I can't say that I've ever seen a flat and straight surface ground for precision and it seems counter-intuitive to me since a grinding stone is going to leave a rougher surface finish and scratches that are small "ditches" with some of the material "dug" out of them sticking up around the edges. I'm not a machinist but I've been turning wrenches for a long time as a professinal diesel mechanic for 25+ years and I've done some "minor" machine work and a lot of fabrication and surface prep and I know a lot of machinists and have pretty extensive experience in every diesel industry except marine. I've also done a lot of automotive work and I'm a "gun nut", so I'm pretty familiar with most things that are machined to precise tolerances.
And I've used a lot of precision instruments and standards and learned "the old fashioned" way how to dress grinding stones, sharpen drill bits, properly use files and hacksaws, etc. I've gotta say to me this looks like one hell of a lot of work and time and material put into something you can't make without having the commercial tools and standards and gauges to make sure its right. The only way to get them is to buy, rent, borrow or steal them. That's the case with all quality tools that "DIY" guys use to make their own "made it myself" tools that are usually made because its "cheaper". Well, it may be "cheaper" but if "cheaper" is in part due to borrowing or renting or stealing a tool from someone else, the only one paying for your tool in its entirety is still you.
And if its a purchase to keep or rental then the owner and everybody "upstream" of you and that owner benefit from the hard work and effort and skill and investment other people put into the tool and they've been compensated in some way. But if its a tool borrowed from someone under the guise of "personal use" to make or fix something to keep and use or to repair or make something for someone else "gratis" and offers to compensate the lender anyway are refused, that's also a "pay it forward" situation.
But buying a tool to use and then returning it for a refund in my book is stealing and stealing is stealing and if its to make a "DIY" tool to then use to produce MORE "commercial" tools for sale or trade, that's stealing and fraud. No matter what nobody is ever a TRUE "DIYer" unless the "project" is "living off the land" and that project is started by leaving all your current commercially manufactured possessions behind and starting out bare-assed naked from scratch.
Like I said, I'm no machinists but I damn sure have used lots of quality tools and I know that you can make any standard really quickly and pretty easily from plain stock if you have quality machine tools and gauges and very basic materials to start with. Standards for checking micrometers 1-2" and larger are just precisely machined and lapped pieces of round stock that aren't going to grow or shrink providing you keep them and use them in the same environment in which you made them and machinist squares and straightedges are typically mild steel stock milled and lapped to be straight and perpendicular and flat. Most parts in even the best and most expensive heavy-duty diesel engines don't have tolerances tighter than .0001" and even then its going to be several ten thousandths on top of a thousandth with a +/- of a few more ten thousandths.
I think the main reason we even seen ten thousandths in machines and areas easily accessible with ordinary tools and where the same fundamentals and processes apply whether its a 5 hp Briggs and Stratton or a 500-hp Caterpillar, is specifically to keep amateurs - mechanics AND machinists AND "remanufacturers - with cheap tools and/or no clue what they're doing from destroying parts and engines and potentially lives by using "good enough" techniques and processes and tools to "repair" or "rebuild" or "remanufacturer" machines where in operation it really DOES matter.
It might seem like anybody who doesn't have the experience and skill and tools to do a job properly and is taking a shot at it anyway to "make" or "save" money doing it for themselves or someone else wouldn't be hesitant to work on an engine or other component or machine where the tolerances and clearances go to .0001" instead of just .001", but that extra decimal point requires vernier-scale micrometer to accurately measure and even though there are el-cheapo micrometers all over these days and "budget" tools aren't something new, vernier micrometers are typically the "too expensive" brands and ELECTRONIC CALIPERS, which are VERY commonly and incorrectly used AS a "micrometer" do NOT go to .0001". Even if they measure to .0005", that's not .0001".
And the thing about DIYers looking to "save" or "make" money is that just like there's always that point where SOMEONE ELSE'S TIME AND EFFORT AND SKILL is "too expensive", there's a point where they realize that their OWN TIME AND EFFORT AND SKILL could get REALLY expensive. Especially if they're "DIY" project is owned by someone else who is ALSO "frugal" and doesn't want to pay professionals for their time and expertise and tools and probably isn't going to want to pay for even a "cheap" job twice. Much less pay for a NEW or REBUILT component or machine or part when the "mechanic" or "machinist" who took on the original job "dropped the ball" and the results was what a service manager I used to work with (RIP Andy) called "fuckage".
Overall, what I see here with all the fancy and unnecessary machine work on what is really just a piece of square tubing with some plate welded onto it when the tubing itself if good enough for the "foundation" could have simply been milled flat and square and true itself as evidenced by the commercially-made example, is someone trying to put a lot of "value" into something that they know they're not going to get back out of and that is costing them a lot of extra time and money to make and that they're also going to end up paying someone else to "manufacturer" at least in part when they have it heat-treated.
I'm not sure WHY you'd want a precision standard that would be very easily broken or chipped if dropped or struck with something harder than it accidentally while being used or when left unattended on a bench or table (the small portable toolboxes a lot of machinists use to store gauges and standards and other delicate, fragile and expensive tools and that are usually Kennedy and brown in color in contrast to red for regular toolboxes so "visitors" don't raid them and thieves overlook them) are small and portable so they go with the tools to the work area or the work is brought to them. And the bench or table they're on is usually on along a wall out of harms way and even then the tools are put back as soon as they're no longer needed.
That's so they don't get left lying around where they're easily "lost" or damaged by some "visitor" seeing a new and unusual and NEAT tool to "inspect". Anything with a DIAL and a PLUNGER to make the needle move is a MAGNET for "visitors" to be drawn to and amuse and distract themselves with while a mechanic or machinist is working and they're "helping" or just "watching". And just like a shiny new toy to play with gets old quickly for a child when it turns out to not do anything that special despite outward appearances and children rarely put "toys" back where they got them, its very easy for a "visitor" to set the new toy aside when he finally has the mechanic's or machinist's attention, OR never notice them at all if he's in "pay attention to me mode" from the get-go and happens to catch the mechanic or machinist when he's "not busy" and knock them over or shove them out of the way with or for his own convenience when he needs a spot to put himself or something he's brought in to have worked on and one or both have to be FRONT AND CENTER and TAKEN CARE OF IMMEDIATELY OR SOONER IF POSSIBLE.
Even then, shit happens and tools and gauges and standards get used and damaged or just plain wear out. GAUGES are very OFTEN hardened and polished on their anvils or contacts or jaws where they frequently contact HARD and possible sharp or gritty parts (that shouldn't happen but again, shit happens) and are moved on the part to get an accurate and precise measurement in one or more locations. But STANDARDS should be "soft" to save wear on the gauges and for toughness.
I'm not sure I'm following you. Could you go into a little more detail? Don't leave anything out.
I have never forgotten the ground clamp 😉
Yeah!!! Me too. Almost never!
When working in an extremely noisy shop years ago, I forgot to turn on the welder. At least it wasn't on video.
15,430 views/witnesses ;o)
O,,,
Ive been welding for 31 years.. holding 5 thou tollerances on stainless..and I forget aLL THE TIME..YOURE EITHER THE BIGGEST LIAR OR THE BEST GROUND GUY TO WALK THE EARTH..BUT i DOUBT EITHER IF YOU NEVER MAke mistakes
And then think, he could have easily edited that out, but he didn’t Says something with just that, does it not?
Thanks for another great video! For those of us without a Squaremaster, do you have any recommendations on a way to sweep a vertical surface to quantify perpendicularity to the surface plate? I just keep thinking there has to be an affordable alternative. Thanks!
Hi Robert,
Qualifying the entire surface is pretty tough. You can do multiple points but you still have to extrapolate between them. That said once you have a good master you can probably easily make a facsimile of a squaremaster with a precision preloaded linear bearing.
As always a great video with lots for me to learn. Thanks. I do have one question, what is the purpose of the cloth hanging on the end of the surface grinder?
Gilberto Diaz Castro i believe it’s a wet cloth to help catch the grinding dust and grit. it keeps some of the mess down that is surface grinding!! fun but messy.
When ever I made weldments, they were always stress relieved first for stability, then Heat Treated for hardness and then drawn back.
When are you gonna finish it, I actually made one myself and wanna see how you go about the finish grinding.
Another great video. What is your clean up after using the NOGA Cool Mist? I have a mill about identical to yours except it says EISON and I am concerned with rust under the vise after using the Cool Mist. Do you dismount your vise to clean after using the mister either on your mill or surface grinder?
Shop vac. The surface under the mag chuck is prepared and protected prior to mounting the chuck. Once you have the mag chuck trued up you generally leave it as long as possible.
oxtoolco how do you prep the surface under the chuck so it won't rust? I just got a surface grinder and am wondering what will I find under there. Not sure if I'll take it off yet, waiting to hook it up and see how flat it is first.
with the grinding wheel, do you notice the wear across a surface like the side of that object?
Was their ever a follow up video of this after the heat treatment or did it not survive the process
Thanks for the video Tom, very informative. What's the fabric hanging on the spark guard of your surface grinder made of?
Its actually a sheet of white paper so I can see the gap between the wheel and the work more easily.
Cheers,
Tom
Thanks Tom, makes a lot of sense. It also seems to take some of the impact of the grindings and drop them into the trough.
How stable is structural tubing for a master square? Or will it be stress relived and normalized in heat treat?
My bet on how much it will have moved after heat treat is .011"
Very nice work Tom.
Something from the woodworking machinery world.... a 1/8NPT thread would allow the use of a headless pipe plug that has a nice shallow taper to it. Would make getting the gnat's hair adjusted out.
How's the square's stability so far? Any measurable changes?
I love it
Tom, you should have age (old) the part after welding. It can be distorted, bent with time. Aging can be speed up by placing in fire, and then slow cool down
Did a follow up video ever get made? The heat treat and final finishing?
Ничего не понял, но выглядит фантастично !!!
why do they use that vertical saw thing. is that like the big guns for milling flatness?
Excellent video Tom! Are you going to share how much it moved around after carburization?
Hi Dan,
Yes there will be anther video showing the finish grinding after heat treat.
Cheers,
Tom
We have a drinking game where we drink every time you say "Uhhhhhhm" Lol
We were drunk 2 minutes in!!!! Hahaha ;)
Could you have made some lighting cuts on the sides of the tube that have the plates added? I see the benefits of grinding those sides flat, but it seems to me that leaving only a few "bars" of material across the face and ribs along the sides for welding would be sufficient and there would be more weight removed. Interesting project anyway.
LoL Yay I'm not the only one who forgets the ground clamp!