Michael Andersen & Brian Bonner - Two Grumpy Old Men Fighting the Disinformation War for Ukraine.
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- Опубликовано: 27 сен 2024
- Today I am speaking with "Two Grumpy Old Men”, Michael Andersen and Brian Bonner who seasoned Ukraine watchers and have teamed up to create a video and Substack blog "Two Grumpy Old Men On Ukraine." They focus on Ukraine, and issues in related parts of thew world since both have lived and worked in many countries. They write, run Q&As, create videos, report on the unfolding war, and resurface content from their collective archive, to help frame current events in a historical context.
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TRUSTED CHARITIES ON THE GROUND:
Save Ukraine
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Superhumans - Hospital for war traumas
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UNBROKEN - Treatment. Prosthesis. Rehabilitation for Ukrainians in Ukraine
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Come Back Alive
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Chefs For Ukraine - World Central Kitchen
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Ukrainian Freedom News
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UNITED24 - An initiative of President Zelenskyy
u24.gov.ua/
Serhiy Prytula Charity Foundation
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NGO “Herojam Slava”
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NOR DOG Animal Rescue
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Did anyone catch the D-Day commemoration? Watching Zelensky and the vet in the wheelchair hugging each other was wonderful!
Agree!! That moment brought tears to my eyes! President Zelenski is a great human being. May God always protect him. Blessings! granny Eleanor in DC.
The old men said You're saving Europe and Zelensky responded No, you saved the world and the man wanted to kiss Zelensky's hand and Zelensky refused and hug him warmly instead, very beautiful moments ✌️👍
Yes I saw it. One of the best interactions of the gathering. Mind blowing that 80 years ago, one man fought for freedom against fascism, while the other 80 years on is fighting against the same form of fascism.
@@footiefan51 They both were and are fighting for freedom; Against the repression of the people of a nation or nations by fascism of another nation. When I say freedom, the freedom to go where you want , when you want and the freedom to choose what occupation
Absolutely the right response from President Zelenskyy. Good man.
Thank you, Jonathan. Slava Ukraini 🇺🇦
Great work guys 😁. Thanks Jonathan ☺️. Stand strong 🔱💪😡
Yeah makes me in the grumpy old women category. Education is vital, why is it not taught!!!!
Again, a brilliant interview and conversation. I learned so much and have much to ponder. Thank you for having such intelligent and eloquent guests.
Thank you, Jonathan, Michael Andersen, and Brian Bonner, for this conversation.
🇺🇦 Перемоги і миру всім українцям! 🇺🇦
Fabulous. Thanks
These gentlemen are a valuable addition to the conversation.
"Their is more chance of peace when russia looses"
I feel this true.
L’embrasse entre Zelenskyy et le vêt sur D DDay anniversaire était très touchante ❤❤
Tout à fait d'accord. Eleanor😂in DC.
These guys are awesome! Thanks for introducing me to them (I'm also a grumpy old man - Swiss/American).
Education is the key! Teach our kids how to *reason* and filter all the BS that life throws at one.
👍👍👍
Destroys the whole russophobia narrative
Thanks Jonathan
Thanks guys for explaining some of the the back story! Invaluable.
Thanks!
Thanks gents
Media and information literacy should be a lynchpin of the British education system (amongst others) but in my experience, working in a higher education institution, all proposals put forward to the senior management team were met by a wall of indifference, using metrics as a get-out stratagem. They couldn't see past "arses on seats".
Did anyone catch the D-Day commemoration? Watching Zelensky and the vet in the wheelchair hugging each other was wonderful!
Very moving indeed!
That was wonderful.
Oh-oh, more places to go and follow for news on Ukraine 🇺🇦 😊I’m only at introductions. 🤭
Merci !
Maiden generation needs to have a conversation with their children about national service, as an ongoing national obligation, over generations. Putin is doing this. When Putin does, it is not a conversation. Generations of Israeli's, Finn's, and South Koreans know this.
I don’t think a frozen conflict is inevitable, especially in Crimea. Ukraine already has most of the capability it needs to cut off Russian re-supply to Crimea with long-range fires AND they have the mandate. When the F-16s go out it will become almost impossible for Russia keep its Crimean forces fed and supplied. They’ve already lost almost all of their large transports and local naval control in the Black Sea. Air supply is suicidal. Once the Kerch bridge and parallel rail lines become inoperable it won’t matter how many mines Russia’s laid unless they’re edible.
Hear hear 😊
Slava Ukraini 1991
I have read many times the Ukrainians saying that the rail line, once it is in, will be very hard to remove because rail lines are easy to rebuild. I wonder what the latest thinking on this is. I haven't read anything different yet from the Ukrainians.
Word ! Crimea is a trap, the window for russia to retreat north is rapidly closing. They are on the verge of losing a lot of irreplaceable military hardware. It's going to be a brutal summer.
@@HarryannaManspreader-qy2vk When Ukraine wins, they should change the gauge of their railway tracks to the same as Europe (the standard gauge of 1,435 mm) or different to Russia (1,520 mm to 1,524 mm).
@@HarryannaManspreader-qy2vk i don't get the 'once it is in', i.e i'd think that no matter how close to completion ru might be with rails, it's always on a continuum of time to completion IF Ukr starts hitting it
Great supporters of Ukraine. Love them. But they kept saying "Russian misinformation" when in reality is "Russian DISINFORMATION."
While you are correct to say that the two guest were talking about russian disinformation for the most part here, I think that it important to keep in mind that russian misinformation (often put out by their shills in the West) takes place at the same time. Russian informational warfare comprises of a variety of elements, not just actual disinformation which in most cases can be countered more easily, but also misinformation that is mainly intended to 'muddy the waters' of public conversations, thus giving the impression that there is no right or wrong in general, so that anything could be true or untrue at the same time. Most of the perpetual 'both sides' arguments that I see cannot really be classified as disinformation, but they always convey misinformation by leaving out relevant or even central pieces of information.
At the 13:00 min mark Mr Andersen mentions terrible journalism with the "map", split into Blue for Western Ukraine and red for "Russian (speaking) Ukraine". I have lived here 10 years, most of that time in Donetska Oblast and that trope about "everyone in the east are Russian speakers" is BS. In fact the large towns like my home town of Pokrovsk, yes most people there spoke Russian, but in the smaller villages all throughout Donetska Oblast, you would hear UKRAINIAN in those villages not Russian. It was far more nuanced than "the east is all Russian speaking". This is what those more-on journos who parachuted in missed totally and they just peddled the ignorant Russian agiprop.
One of my 4 masters is political science
What are the other 3?
@@EvzenKovar-i5p un MBA, EdM EDUCATION, MLS LIBRARY SCIENCE, Ph D MANAGEMENT
Résilience après le Maidan
Nous devons donner sécurité comme nous donnons Israël parce que le mémorandum de Budapest
yes, but not just bcuz of the Memo, but bcuz it both makes sense rationally, but also is the right thing to do, when a ppl are literally blind-sided by a bully who is torturing them literally, maiming and sex-murdering them. Up to half the population of the not small city of Kherson was tortured! That didn't even happen by the 3rd Reich! This is no war, it's pure genocidal sadism and plainly stated as such on Russian TV!
yes but that's no the only reason to provide security to Ukr, it's simply what is defensive, ie to defend a european nation against what is plainly stated genocidal imperialist hyperaggression by a state, Ru, which can only be described as a viking warlord horde. This situation cannot stand! It's clearly in Nato's interest to prepare for war. Ru is so transparent with its ideas bcuz it uses a form of gaslighting chaotic disinformation over time, that its plainly obvious to most nations on earth, over the past decade. Ru has to be contained, or there's no world as we know it, ie the world that brought you hightech, modern nicer life, as well as governance including democracy/human-rights.
👍
👍👍👍
They do that kind of education in some Nordic countries, I heard.
They absolutely do, yes
I have get as finnish reservist couple of quite thorough lessons how russians operate in this kind of situation. OK we finns we have long and complicated relationship with russians so they have hard time fool most of us. We even have verb in our language wich means do it like russian.
Oh Jonathan thats clickbait... 😑
Was awaiting Statler and Waldorf.
🇺🇦🇺🇦✌🇺🇦🇺🇦
Unleash the internet from government and corporate control.
oh really? so that Ru and china can dominate us? no thanks! RU is the only large operator of any type, who can and does manipulate thru internet. We must have guardrails, or we won't survive, literally!
In Ukraine, monuments to Dostoevsky and Pushkin are being demolished. I have nothing more to talk about.
Good. I can go to Russia if I want to see them
So Ukraine can blow the gas pipeline at the end of the year!?!
They don't need to blow it - they can (and definitely will) just close the valve(s) of the pipeline on the incoming side. :-)
@@Framo60 😁 thanks. The war has made me a bit dramatic some times
The Kyiv regimes are not the legal successors of the state of Ukraine (1991-2014), but criminally call themselves "Ukraine".
On February 22, 2014, the Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine carried out a coup d'état, but did not recognize it, and disguised it as a legal norm.
The question arises, on the basis of which law or constitutional article was the removal of the president in 2014?
Violation of the main law, the Constitution of Ukraine, at the state level is a coup d'état. After the coup d'état on February 22, 2014, the Kyiv regime does not have the right to legally call itself "Ukraine". The Kyiv regimes of Turchynov, Poroshenko, and Zelensky are criminals and should be brought to international criminal responsibility for provoking and waging war, as well as for concealing the true causes of the military conflict on the territory of the former state of Ukraine, which led to the deception of the world community.
nice try Russiye-useful-idjit: that is the usual ru/ussr spewed nonsense, trying to gaslight the world. Not gonna work and hasn't since 1950's till today. Your gig is up, i.e done!
Russian bot alert ‼️ 😂😂
Media literacy is priority number uno for sure. Critical thinking, analysis and a respect for learning as much as possible needs to be instilled in humanity forever.
Great to see such relevant thinkers/actors on this channel
Thanks for this. You are The Bomb. I just started listening to a hromadske podcast in English from 2016 after this interview. The podcast is how even as far back as 2016 NATO recognized that Ukraine had more experience with understanding Russian hybrid warfare than anyone else in the world but NATO still didn't support them. I wonder if NATO was afraid of Ukraine itself because it was so infiltrated by Russia at the highest level including Yanukovich and his administration. Anyway, ANOTHER indispensable podcast and I hope you do many more interviews with these fellows. I used to follow Bonner at the beginning of the war and this reminds me to follow him again. 🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼
Thank you for your interesting interviews.
Excellent!
A great discussion, thank you Johnathan for having two "grumpy old men" on your podcast! 🇺🇦🇺🇸🇩🇰
🇺🇦🇺🇸🇺🇦🇺🇸
Great conversation, I'm glad that events in 2014 were covered, this is one area where the western media repeat russian lies, and they need to be exposed! As a curmudgeon myself, I will definitely be checking out their platform. Great content as always Johnathan, slava Ukraine!
For me it's all about the children. Never forget all of the Russians who abused children and their families in Ukraine. From the mass graves (in Izium) to the stolen children. Now if Ukrainian parents don't become Russian citizens and go to flight against their brothers and cousins Russia will take their newborn children at birth.
Speaking of Izium. What did those 414 people see? The Russians thought it was better to murder them and bury them all in a mass grave instead of letting them testify. Whatever they saw must have been truly horrific. At minimum I'm guessing rape and torture.
If Russia want's to sign😅 a treaty they must first prove they will stand by one. If Russia wants to negotiate, start with your original written agreement. Pull back all of their troops back behind their original boarder and then you can start negotiations. If they don't show they will honor the original agreement how can you expect them to honor any further agreements.
It's our war to lose. Russia can NOT win. Unless we choose to not support Ukraine of course. It is on us in the global West to pick the world we want to live in. Choose wisely. Thanks.
Glory to Ukraine. God Bless Ukraine and her people. 🇺🇦🇺🇸
Also Ukrainians in the occupied Ukraine, are denied health care and drivers license unless they get a Russian passport.
@@franceyneireland1633 yeah but that's the extremely least of the abuse! Regular harassment, abuse, rape, and in Kherson, a rather large city, the torture of half the population! This is heart-of-darkness stuff happening against europeans, and we are apparently dropping the ball at THE worst time possible, ie the past two years and right now, this year probably. We must write all the senators and rep's here in the US and the WH, to rapidly prepare for battles.
I think the education of European and American children attending secondary schools is absolutely imperative. From the age of 12 right the way through through to 18 they must be given a good understanding of the threat posed by Russia towards Europe. We need to act immediately in order to combat Russian propaganda and disinformation. We must ensure that Generation Z receive only the truthful facts concerning Ukraine.
Gen Z are key, they are our future!
Slava Ukraine 🇺🇦 God bless the heroes 🇺🇦
🇬🇧❤🇺🇦
Utmost respect for President Zelenskyy for going from TV comedian to President; sizing up the new Pres of USA, DJTrump who assumed Ukraine's new Pres would be a push-over, and Zelenskyy taking Ukraine from corrupt to a mighty force of good - inspiration for all the world! 💙💛
Thank you grumpy men!
One of your very best. Thank you for introducing me to these amazing men and their significant work. Will be following them.
🇺🇦🇺🇦🇺🇦🇪🇺🇪🇺🇪🇺👍👍👍
Thanks again Johnathan and guests for a great informative discussion … 💙💛💙
Great interview!
France doesn't invade Belgium and France because large parts of those countries are French speaking. And French speakers in those countries don't wish to become part of France.
👍👍👍
The Swiss "peace" summit
What does it show?
Russia not "invited"? Negotiations are with your adversary not your allies
Mr Z's presidency (expired) is not respected in much of the world, including the USA.
Are you certain?
I simply adore Two Grumpy Old Men, their channel is stellar. I love the exchange of ideas. This was a fantastic interview, thank you Jonathan. Your channel is so wonderful (Canadian here).❤🤍💙💛