Michael Heiser - Why Does Jesus ask God “Why Have You Forsaken Me?”
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- Опубликовано: 23 янв 2018
- And about the ninth hour Jesus cried out with a loud voice, saying, “Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?” that is, “My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?” (Matthew 27:46)
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Jesus is telling the Jews to read Psalm 22. I was taught during Jesus’ time the Jews didn’t have the Tora numbered in chapters/verses, instead everyone memorized the first line of each chapter. The first line of psalm 22 is “My God, my God, why have you forsaken me..” The Jews would have known exactly what Jesus was quoting and would not have taken his words as his own but rather pointing them to read that passage which prophesied his crucifixion.
Beautiful.
I didn't know this. Thank you.
Oh just heartbreaking to know this pure, gentle Lamb of God, in excruciating agony, paying for all the sins of us idiots, crying out to His Father, feeling utterly alone and abandoned as God literally turned His Face away from the act of sacrifice.......His only Son, ravaged in layers and layers of all the sin of the world........just leaves me undone.......Jesus, there are no human words that do any justice at all in thanking you for Your Grace and Your bravery..... for our salvation......it's a gift of such magnitude it short circuits me.....all praises and peace to You, Jesus...glory, glory, glory Halleluyah
ikr, and the thing that gets me, is that the physical pain must have been nothing at all compared to the pain from everyones sin all at once. have you read the book of adam and eve? theres more insight in there about what was going on with Jesus, among a great many other things. there are also videos here on youtube with a person reading the book, if youre interested.
That's true his son had to suffer for our sins
❤️😢❤️😢❤️
@@Charles.Wright It must have felt that way for Jesus. He knew His/our Father can't be in the direct presence of sin. I also believe that God was overcome with grieve. All that darkness of sin and the pain of everybody's sickness Jesus experienced at the same time, causing Jesus' heart to melt like wax, the loss of blood, lack of oxygen to His brain and organs because of officiation and his shoulders being out of joint and his skin torn to shreds - that kind of pain is unbearable. Hence the 3hours darkness, earth quake and the tearing of the veil from top to bottom at the very moment Jesus exhaled his final breath - that I believed was the way God showed His grieve and anger.
@@hannetjiedebeer9480 quoting Psalm 22 plain and simple never understood why so many people like to go off in the weeds on this one
Also, Psalm 22, where these words come from, is a victory song describing what Jesus is going through. The crowd would have known the words and ending of the psalm. "Because he didn’t despise or detest the suffering of the one who suffered- he didn’t hide his face from me. No, he listened when I cried out to him for help."
Psalms 22:24 CEB
Well said, sir!
Why does Heiser who portrays himself as a pastor and an Old testament expert NOT know this? What else does he not know?
Jesus experiencing abandonment on the cross and the weight of bearing the penalty for all our sins (spiritual), was far far worse than any torturous pain of the cross (physical). Something none of us can imagine.
I think Jesus was teaching even in his last moments before he passed... i wouldn’t be surprised if he even quoted all of Psalms 22. God didn’t forsake Jesus and Jesus hasn’t forsaken us. He is God with us.
[God] didn't forsake jesus
And (jesus )hasn't forsaken us
( the above comment made sense until you said ( he is God with us)????
Jesus became sin for us. God did forsake him as He descended into Hell. The sacrifice of Jesus is far bigger than mere mortal understanding.
@@henrylafromboise4581 Jesus is called Immanuel which means God with us In Mat 1:23 quoting Isaiah 7:14. The 22 Psalm not only describes the crucifixtion in v.12-18 but David also declares that God has indeed not forsaken him in verses 22-31. You have to read it all and not just take the obvious meaning out of context. We should know the 22 psalm as well as we know the 23. Both are comforting. Jesus quoted the first verse of despair knowing the comfort was there too and overwhelming despair. Heiser should know better.
My view of this prayer by Jesus to the Father is that Jesus experienced a God forsaken moment to have my God forsaken moments covered! Hallelujah! Only God could do that for me!
Well that is beautiful but wrong. Read all of the 22nd Psalm which Jesus was quoting. Neither Jesus, nor David, nor us were ever forsaken by God.
Wow. I don’t even want to imagine that. Spot on.
Why couldn't he have simply been quoting psalm 22 to fulfill the prophecy?
Anyone who has ever experienced a disease that robs you of all of your strength- physical, mental, emotional- knows that in the final moments of life, it becomes very difficult to feel anything that is good. It feels like you are in a very dark and empty world, all alone, without anyone to help you. Everything appears to be meaningless. At that moment, it feels like God is very far away. Yet, deep in your soul you know that only God can save you.
going through it now
@@arphaksad01 I'm sorry to hear that. Would you be willing to share your story. I also am going through a difficult trial.
arphaksad01 + 80’s nostalgic guy The Father turned His face away from His only begotten Son, who became cursed. The Father in that moment put all sin upon Christ, and when Christ proclaimed, “it is finished,” The curse of sin, the penalty had been paid by His blood, and by His death. Look at the verses just before John 3:16.
John 3:13-16
13 “And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.
14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up:
15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.”
Jesus is our Passover Lamb. When we face the Father at judgement, we are “passed over” by that blood of the Lamb. Though our sins be as scarlet, though they be red as crimson, we are washed whiter than snow!
Galatians 3:11-14; 26-29
11 “But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.
12 And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them.
13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:
14 That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.”
26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.”
arphaksad01 + ‘80’s nostalgic guy We are guaranteed trials and tribulations as followers of Jesus Christ.
Hebrews 12:7-11
7 If you endure chastening, God deals with you as with sons; for what son is there whom a father does not chasten?
8 But if you are without chastening, of which all have become partakers, then you are illegitimate and not sons. 9 Furthermore, we have had human fathers who corrected us, and we paid them respect. Shall we not much more readily be in subjection to the Father of spirits and live?
10 For they indeed for a few days chastened us as seemed best to them, but He for our profit, that we may be partakers of His holiness.
11 Now no chastening seems to be joyful for the present, but painful; nevertheless, afterward it yields the peaceable fruit of righteousness to those who have been trained by it.”
2 Corinthians 4:8-18
8 “We are troubled on every side, yet not distressed; we are perplexed, but not in despair;
9 Persecuted, but not forsaken; cast down, but not destroyed;
10 Always bearing about in the body the dying of the Lord Jesus, that the life also of Jesus might be made manifest in our body.
11 For we which live are always delivered unto death for Jesus' sake, that the life also of Jesus might be made manifest in our mortal flesh.
12 So then death worketh in us, but life in you.
13 We having the same spirit of faith, according as it is written, I believed, and therefore have I spoken; we also believe, and therefore speak;
14 Knowing that he which raised up the Lord Jesus shall raise up us also by Jesus, and shall present us with you.
15 For all things are for your sakes, that the abundant grace might through the thanksgiving of many redound to the glory of God.
16 For which cause we faint not; but though our outward man perish, yet the inward man is renewed day by day.
17 For our light affliction, which is but for a moment, worketh for us a far more exceeding and eternal weight of glory;
18 While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.”
Isaiah 53:3-12
3 “He is despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief: and we hid as it were our faces from him; he was despised, and we esteemed him not.
4 Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted.
5 But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed.
6 All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the Lord hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.
7 He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he opened not his mouth: he is brought as a lamb to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is dumb, so he openeth not his mouth.
8 He was taken from prison and from judgment: and who shall declare his generation? for he was cut off out of the land of the living: for the transgression of my people was he stricken.
9 And he made his grave with the wicked, and with the rich in his death; because he had done no violence, neither was any deceit in his mouth.
10 Yet it pleased the Lord to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the Lord shall prosper in his hand.
11 He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities.
12 Therefore will I divide him a portion with the great, and he shall divide the spoil with the strong; because he hath poured out his soul unto death: and he was numbered with the transgressors; and he bare the sin of many, and made intercession for the transgressors.”
This was what led me back to Christ, the realization that God himself needed to experience full humanity
Unmistaken voice of our dearest, late Dr. Michael S. Heiser...
Just makes me more humble to the Price He Paid for me on the cross.....like Chuck Missler once said...we have no capacity knowing what Jesus struggle was, how much He suffered and what a victory He achieved. Thank You Jesus.
I think about an innocent child experiencing something evil for the first time. Jesus had never experienced any sin before, then it all piled on Him at once -- the horrors of all kinds of evil. The pain of that in addition to separation from the Father for the first time. All for love. Such love.
The cross was not the first time Jesus experienced sin. He had lived as a man for 30+ years. And there is the whole history of mankind, which He witnessed before his incarnation.
@@str.77 but he never committed sin.
@@slatskatya True but not really relevant as the above was about "experiencing sin", not committing it.
Daffy the point is that Jesus was not in despair. He was quoting verbatim the 22 nd Psalm. This Psalm describes his crucifixtion in verses 12-18 and ends stating that God had not forsaken him. E=Read the whole Psalm. Jesus was telling us of comfort in God's grace. Taking a verse out of context is dangerous and that is not what Jesus was doing.
Hey do you know roddy dill ?
Jesus is quoting first line of Psalms 22 which prophetically describes his death and many of the details surrounding it. It's like saying the first line of a song everyone knows. Especially the religious leaders witnessing his death would or at least should have recognized it. Jesus was giving them one more chance to realize who He was and is before He died. Verse 24 says "He (God) has not despised the affliction of the afflicted, neither has He hid his face from him; but when he cried into Him, He heard. God didn't forsake his Son and he will not forsake you.
Aramaic version of this phrase fits scripture so much better. A cry of triumph
This prayer of Jesus aligns so closely with the introductory verses of Psalm 22, which Psalm also speaks of the mockery, scorn, humiliation and his being encompassed by the Bulls of Bashan. All his bones being out of joint, dried up strength, his hands being pierced, the parting of garments, casting lots for his garments. Later in the chapter there is praise to God for deliverance and a declaration of God’s name to his brethren, yet that he would fulfill his vows, etc.
It seems to me that by Jesus letting out the first two verses of this Psalm, he was telling the nation of Israel and all her onlookers, that this Psalm was in the process of being fulfilled. That they were all witnessing it. He was inevitably telling them who he was, and that as the promised Messiah, he was fulfilling this prophecy about himself.
A perfect explanation, no more embellishment needed.
It also spares us of that moment when we leave this earth as His children that we won’t be alone. Jesus paid that price too. Oh what a Savior!!
Jesus was quoting Psalms 22 (as @Blood- Bought pointed out). Jesus was telling the very people who mocking Him that He is the Messiah. It was common for teachers to quote only the first line of a passage of Scripture to make point. Jesus does it many times in the Gospels. That is what He was doing here. Read Psalms 22 in it's entirety. It is AMAZING how that Psalm describes what is going on. That psalm was recognized as a messianic psalm by rabbis and teachers of that day. They knew that passage.
Here's Psalm 22:14-18
14 I am poured out like water, and all my bones are out of joint; my heart is like wax; it is melted within my breast;
15 my strength is dried up like a potsherd, and my tongue sticks to my jaws; you lay me in the dust of death.
16 For dogs encompass me; a company of evildoers encircles me; they have pierced my hands and feet;
17 I can count all my bones-they stare and gloat over me;
18 they divide my garments among them, and for my clothing they cast lots.
Remember that this was written by David, himself a messianic figure, almost 1,500 years before Christ!
I love that Psalm, it also shows that The Father never turned away, never forsook The Son. Even with the sin of the world upon him, because he is righteous.
I will tell of your name to my brothers; in the midst of the congregation I will praise you: You who fear the LORD, praise him! All you offspring of Jacob, glorify him, and stand in awe of him, all you offspring of Israel! For He has not despised or abhorred the affliction of the afflicted, and he has not hidden his face from him, but has heard, when he cried to him.
Yes, as if to say, "Psalm 22 is about _me_ !" Every Jew within ear shot would have known which Psalm He was referencing.
The final thing God had to do in order to make Christ's atonement complete was to withdraw His Spirit momentarily from Jesus leaving him completely alone. Man, how hard would that have been for the Father to withdraw or separate from Jesus at his sons greatest moment of need?
My question is how hard was it for Jesus that the Father had to withdraw from Him?!
In Isaiah 53 it states it pleased God. If Jesus became sin, God would be glad to punish it. It's His nature to delight at the punishment of sin.
That being said, I'm sure the Father was delighted when it was over..
binmyrtmind, I already believed what you described...but as I read your comment...I felt it pierce right through my heart & my eyes welled up. So sad, but Thank The Lord He did it!
@@allme2547 I believe even Christ himself was astonished at the totally complete heartbreak of separation from the Father. It serves me well to think this and have a deeper gratitude for the Lord's sacrifice made not only for myself, but for all of us.
Jesus was allowed to have the need for faith and he did have faith. He prayed all the time.
it wasnt that he was *allowed*, he was human. he needed faith.
The gentleman scholar that I have studied with felt that Jesus was preaching from the cross repeating the words that David used in Psalm 22. The one thing for sure is that as much as rejoice when a new baby is born, we know that life on earth is fraught with difficulty and pain. I feel it's very much worse without knowing our Father.
I think it was in part at the very least, a reference to Psalm 22. It beautifully parallels the very passion of Christ.
He was showing us he was human, he felt pain, it was not easy.
It's not easy, dude. lol. Quite so.
Jesus always looked upon the Father. Father God does not look upon sin, and at the moment Jesus had all sin upon Himself, Father God turned away... This is why Jesus cried out those words.
Jesus Christ was fulfilling prophecy in psalm 22 verse 1
Absolutely!!
Psalm 22, it is a song, praising All mighty GOD. It begins, by describing his torture, and ends in His exclamation of His Fathers infinite perfect Love for all of us. It is why even the romans recognized his Divinity. In spite of all He suffered, He did not weaken, He did not lose faith, He, in his human form remained faithful!
He cried out to full fill The Scriptures, True.
He recited the first line, which in that time directed everyone to The entirety of Psalm 22, not just the first line, those present automatically knew, what He was saying, and that is what astounded them all. While being tortured to death, he forgave his torturers, and praised GOD!
"Truly, this Man was The Son of God."
Usually Heiser gets a lot right but not this time. It's from the Psalm and it's amazing.
Bingo. Any knowledgeable Jew who heard Jesus say this on the cross would immediately know He was quoting Psalms.
All he had to do if he was a real scholar is consult primary sources. Instead his ego rambles on spiritualizing, eisegesis not exegesis. Rambles of an egoist.
I love the way Michael explains things in a way that forces you to think about his answer in such a way you actually learn more. I have learned so much from this man in the past month I am actually excited to re-learn the familiar again that reveals deeper meanings !!
He took in the sins of the world. God cannot accept sin around him. Therefore, for the first time in eternity he must go it totally alone. He is welcomed into the father's arms at death. But for the few moments he is in darkness without the light of God. How amazing that Jesus was willing to do that for us. How loving is the Father to be separated from his son for us. Praise them both.
You nailed it. Jesus, the Second Person of the Trinity, had never been separated from His Father before. At the moment when he took on the sins of the world, he became God's enemy, and he suffered the full weight of God's wrath for sin. God is Life. Nearness to God is life. The abundant life of which Jesus spoke in John is closeness to God, and the ultimate fulfillment of that is heaven, in which we are intimate with God eternally. On the contrary, hell is separation from God, separation from life. So when Jesus experienced God's wrath, it came in the form of complete separation from his Father, which he had never experienced in his eternal experience. What a shock to be cut off from God at the moment of his greatest need.
Love Michael Heiser another great spiritual warrior of God blessed by God... Thank you Michael Heiser and Houseform Apologetics Thank you! God's favor, grace, protection and blessings saturate your life, lives amen
shalom aleichem
That was yet another insightful take by Dr. Michael Heiser in conjunction with his referencing with other scholarly works. This portion of the Gospels where Jesus cried out to the Father was more than just a passing remark by Christ out of any human frailty. His exclamation of His agony on the cross signified two great lessons for all Christians to reflect upon:
1) His agony gives proof of His evident humanity. This is helpful in foresight of possible accusations against Christ that He was not truly human as some Early Church heretics would say, i.e. that He was just a phantasm/an incorporeal Being. All the more, it expresses how He felt the burden of human pain on our behalf. The atonement would not have been genuine for Him in His love for humanity if it wasnʼt bore by Him, as the Suffering Servant, without the agonizing weight of Divine Justice imputed upon Him.
2) As Messiah, He ought to fulfill/He is the fulfillment of the Psalm passages that reflect what He said on the cross to solidify His identity in the eyes of men that He really was who the prophets said He was: the Christ of the Living God. That in itself seals the deal for Him to proclaim throughout all of history that truly, the Messiah has come for all of mankind.
Thank you so much for this, Houseform Apologetics! This was a powerful take on the significance of Jesusʼs suffering. It sheds greater light on how the passages in the Letter to the Hebrews truly give comfort for all people that Jesus can understand our pain and suffering so that He can intercede for us genuinely before the Throne of God.
Why am I crying
Very common in 2nd Temple times to quote the first verse of a well known psalm and allude to the entire thing, not just the words you say alone.
We do this today with Amazing Grace and many other songs.
There are dozens of Psalms that were used like this. I would be afraid to interpret Jesus' words as just themselves alone... and forget vs. like Psalm 22:24,
"For he has not despised or scorned
the suffering of the afflicted one;
he has not hidden his face from him
but has listened to his cry for help."
I am not denying a "separation" or a felt "ripple" in relationship among the Godhead (whatever, however, this suffering happened in a spiritual sense).
Jesus could very well, most likely actually, is inviting everyone to understand the entire Psalm/Song that he is quoting.
Spot on!
This is an excellent exposition of Jesus’ words. So many have tried to allegorize what He said, but here in a plain literal explanation, is Truth.
Nicely said. I also see it as a parable that we might find ourselves feeling forsaken, since the Son of God himself felt and verbalized while at his worst. We will all feel forsaken and be ready to be born again in our lives.
One of the few times I don't agree with Heiser, the much more logical explanation is that Jesus is quoting Psalm 22 and the reaction of the crowd clearly shows that they understood that He was quoting that Psalm.
PS 22:15 My strength is dried up like a potsherd; and my tongue cleaveth to my jaws; and thou hast brought me into the dust of death.
Mark 15:35 And some of them that stood by, when they heard it, said, Behold, he calleth Elias.
36 And one ran and filled a spunge full of vinegar, and put it on a reed, and gave him to drink, saying, Let alone; let us see whether Elias will come to take him down.
This Psalm was originally thought to be addressing Elijah and in this Psalm it shows that Jesus is speaking of needing a drink. The crowd clearly understood what Jesus was saying, however most of them were still thinking that it was a call to Elijah
Except as Heiser mentions the one man that put it all together and declared truly this man was the Son of God.
I can understand the desire to see the Humanity of Christ in the passage, I get it, but I don't think it's the truly correct thing to focus on. I also disagree with Heiser linking this to the garden as I don't believe Jesus was actually asking for God to stop the Crucifixion from happening.
Neither of those things bear out the previous actions of Christ, who knew with zero doubt that He was going to the cross.
Why would Jesus call Peter Satan when he tried to defend Jesus from going to the cross, and then pray that God spares Him from the cross?
The answer that closer aligns with Christ being God is that He is asking that this be the final offering, that ALL THE SIN be fully poured out upon Him, that He can drink it to the dregs and that the cup when passed is empty.
Look up the customs of drinking wine in that time, you passed the cup once the entire thing was drank, that is the intended picture of Christ passing the cup, and moreover harmonizes Christ in the garden with His entire life prior and afterwards...
Of course, Jesus was quoting Psalms. When Mike goes full fledged fundamentalist, he misses a lot of nuance. It is like someone trying to read Emily Dickenson's poems literally.
“For a small moment have I forsaken thee; but with great mercies will I gather thee. In a little wrath I hid my face from thee for a moment; but with everlasting kindness will I have mercy on thee, saith the LORD thy Redeemer. For this is as the waters of Noah unto me: for as I have sworn that the waters of Noah should no more go over the earth; so have I sworn that I would not be wroth with thee, nor rebuke thee. For the mountains shall depart, and the hills be removed; but my kindness shall not depart from thee, neither shall the covenant of my peace be removed, saith the LORD that hath mercy on thee.”
Isaiah
Well explained, thank God for Michael Heiser.
so grateful for this channel; thank you
shalom aleichem
+Daryle Ballad John 1:11-13 New King James Version (NKJV)
11 He came to His own,[a] and His own[b] did not receive Him. 12 But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name: 13 who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
Romans 1:16 New King James Version (NKJV)
The Just Live by Faith
16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ,[a] for it is the power of God to salvation for everyone who believes, for the Jew first and also for the Greek.
Sin separates us from God, when Christ bore the sin of the world, in that moment, he was separated from the Father.
It was a rabbinical teaching technique. When a rabbi wanted his listeners to recall a passage of scripture, he would repeat the first phrase of the passage, in this case, a Psalm. Jesus is simply saying "Remember this Psalm? This is like that Psalm."
In the beginning of the Psalm, it appears as if God has forsaken the author, but in the end, the author is vindicated by God.
LOVE IT
Thank you for this amazing video 🙏🏽🙏🏽🙏🏽
Beautiful and God-honoring explanation in light of other revealed truths about His attributes. Thanks so much.
Can u imagine? He doesnt want to be tortured and ask His Father if He can get Out of it but His Father says you have to. Heartbreaking , devastating! All those centuries and history have come to this moment.
4:40 “He is questioning the silence of the One He has called ‘My God’”; great quote
Jesus was on the cross reciting psalms 22. All though only the first verse and the last verse is mentioned in the gospels. It is clear this psalms was his mission on the death of the cross. It is finished is the last words ofpsalms 22.
To the chief Musician upon Aijeleth Shahar, A Psalm of David.
My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?
why art thou so far from helping me, and from the words of my roaring?
Psalm 22:1
Micheal, this is on of the most profound commentaries you have ever given speaking to several topics but particularly to the condition of humanity. With sincerest regards. Thank you
Thank you for being humble enough to read so much of another’s work. Who would have known what was on page one thousand and whatever of that book had you not brought it to us? Probably no one, thank you!
Before The Bible was put together as we know it today, it was much different than what we use today. It was The Scriptures, the were not in a book, they did not have chapters and titles. In that time period a Jewish boy would have memorized the scriptures by the age of 12. Remember our Lord in the temple at that age. Yes I said memorize. So, if someone wanted to refer to a particular Psalm, it wouldn't have a title, so that person would recite the first line of the Psalm he wanted to express, and everyone would know what he meant. Also our Lord, was dieing, his lungs were pierced, and so He cried out, "Father why have You forsaken me?" Now, find that Psalm, read the whole thing, and you will know what our Lord was saying. and you will Love Him even more when you realize what has been hidden from you.
Spot on with Psalm 22 My God, my God, why have You forsaken me? Far from my help are the words of my groaning.
However, He had already said, "It is finished." when they pierced him.
"(Also our Lord, was dieing, his lungs were pierced, and so He cried out, "Father why have You forsaken me?" )"
@@mm2239 I stand corrected. Thank You.
@@petergambino2129 Blessed be you Peter
He may have been expressing his human anguish, but he was more so being obedient unto death. Jesus was invoking Psalm 22, by reciting the first line of the Psalm. In that time it was common to quote the first line of a passage to describe an entire segment. Read it entirely, and put it into context with what he was going through. He was fulfilling the prophecy in Psalm 22.
YES!
AMEN!
Hoe does Heiser miss that? He even knew it was from the 22nd
@@johnbreitmeier3268 That’s what I’m saying! Christ’s invocation of Psalm 22 on the cross is one of the most powerful things I’ve ever discovered in my faith journey.
@@ArduousPun Gerald, something is not right with his teaching. He has the degrees or claims to and claims to know great hidden doctrine, but he is constantly missing on very basic theology. This is not good. I first heard the right explanation of '"My Gof, my God why have you forsaken me?", And the 22 Psalm, 50 years ago from a Lutheran pastor at a Good Friday service and never forgot it. It is profound. If Heiser is who he claims to be, how did he live this long without encountering it?
Good explanation -- Thank you
Wonderfully inspiring explanation.
This passage makes my cry.
I think He was quoting Psalms because He felt it happening in real time. And Jesus had the final word when He died. I see it as the strongest and most powerful thing He could have said. And yes, it was His humanity.
I have an overflowing amount of respect for Dr. Heiser and his knowledge. However, he was mortal. And even the wisest of all mortals have limits to the catalogues of their understandings. I feel this question surpassed the vast range of Dr. Heiser’s knowledge-at least the recallable knowledge he possessed at the time of its asking. When Jesus said, “Eli, Eli, lema sabachthabi?” (“Lord, Lord, why have you forsaken me?”) Jesus was quoting Psalm 22. Back in Jesus’s time, it was common for people to quote one line of a psalm and everyone who heard would understand that the speaker was trying to convey the message of the entire psalm, but since it would take a lot of time to quote the whole thing, people just quoted one line and let everyone else remember the rest. It is hard to put into a modern context, but it would be as if someone insulted me and I said something like, “Sticks and stones…” Everyone would understand that I am not randomly describing things lying on the ground, but quoting part of something to allude to that entire something’s message. That was the basic premise except a lot longer. Another example would be if I said something like, “Slow and steady…” Most people would understand that this is an allusion to “The Tortoise & the Hare” as well as its lesson. So, know that Jesus was alluding to Psalm 22, which is about a servant of God who gets mocked and beaten (in summary, going through trials and tribulations) but keeps their chin up because they see their hardships as an incredible valley before an incredible peak. Soli Deo Gloria!
Very insightful! The bible teaches the bible!
One thing I respect Dr. Heiser for is that he doesn't assert views on subjects without backing them up with a bread trail of footnotes and sources so that his listeners and readers can track for themselves the sources. I see a lot of asserting going on in these comments without people backing up their views and showing how they came to their conclusions. Dr. Heiser's books and podcasts are thoroughly backed up by other scholars, they are not his views. People need to learn from his example in that.
If you believe Jesus thought God was forsaking him / separated from him on the cross, then you also have to believe that Jesus didn't understand Psalm 22. Spend any amount of time studying Psalm 22 and you will understand that Jesus knew he wasn't separated from God and that he was keeping his eyes fixed on the joy set before him (Hebrews 12:2). Psalm 22 was happening all around him, by quoting it I believe he's trying to help the wicked people around him to wake up and realise that they are the ones described as being against God in this Psalm, and willing them to see that the scriptures testified to who Jesus is. Psalm 22 states in verse 24 (after the crucifixion scene described from verses 1-21):
For he (the Father) has not despised or abhorred
the affliction of the afflicted (The Son),
and he (the Father) has not hidden his (the Father's) face from him (the Son),
but has heard, when he (the Son) cried to him (the Father).
Categorically, the Psalm shows that the Father did not forsake the Son, and Jesus knew this was the case when he quoted the first line at the hour of prayer (when psalms would be sung / recited). Verses 27-31 show what Jesus' death would accomplish regarding reconciliation of God and the nations, in obvious language that Christ would have understood for years before this event:
"All the ends of the earth shall remember
and turn to the Lord,
and all the families of the nations
shall worship before you.
For kingship belongs to the Lord,
and he rules over the nations.
All the prosperous of the earth eat and worship;
before him shall bow all who go down to the dust,
even the one who could not keep himself alive.
Posterity shall serve him;
it shall be told of the Lord to the coming generation;
they shall come and proclaim his righteousness to a people yet unborn,
that he has done it."
Blessed art thou, for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven. Thank you so much Scott.
I've always been taught that God cannot look upon sin, maybe from Habakkuk 1:13. Therefore, I think when Jesus is on the cross and takes upon Himself our sin ~ God the Father must look away. Would this not be the first time the Trinity is not complete? God having to look away from Jesus who has just taken upon Himself every sin on Earth from that time until eternity. I am not a Biblical scholar, nor do I hold a doctorate of theology. This is just my feeling upon this passage, and I just always thought it fit.
It was mentioned how even Christ would not know the day or the hour of His return, only the Father. We have to remember that Jesus is Jewish, and His disciples were Galilean. When Jesus said this, His followers knew what He was referring to. This is ancient Jewish (Galilean) wedding talk. The bride would prepare herself to be married, while the bridegroom would go to his father’s house to prepare a place for them. Only the father of the bridegroom would know when the bridegroom would be ready to go and get his bride. This is the same thing here when Christ said, ““But about that day or hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but the Father alone.”
Mark 13:32 NASB2020
Jesus also said, ““Watch out, stay alert; for you do not know when the appointed time is.”
Mark 13:33 NASB2020
The bride was to prepare herself for his return. She was to keep watch and always be ready. The “appointed time” is the key in this text. The “feasts of the Lord” were also known as “appointed times”. On that appointment Christ, the Bridegroom will come down from heaven to receive His bride (the body of Christ).
We see more ancient Jewish (Galilean) wedding talk in the “upper room” discourse; ““Do not let your heart be troubled; believe in God, believe also in Me. In My Father’s house are many rooms; if that were not so, I would have told you, because I am going there to prepare a place for you. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I am coming again and will take you to Myself, so that where I am, there you also will be.”
John 14:1-3 NASB2020
He’s offering us a wedding covenant. He has left to the Father’s house to prepare a place for us. At the appointed time the Father will tell His Son Jesus to go get His bride! What appointed time? The Feast of Trumpets! The next feast to be prophetically fulfilled is the Feast of Trumpets. Not knowing the day or the hour is a Jewish idiom for the Feast of Trumpets. It’s a two day festival, when the new moon was spotted by two witnesses, they would blow the shofars! In the Jewish wedding, the bridegroom would leave his father’s house with his groomsmen to go and get the bride. We see this in Paul’s first epistle to the Thessalonians chapter four; “For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive, who remain, will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we will always be with the Lord.”
1 Thessalonians 4:16-17 NASB2020
Come Lord Jesus! The Spirit and the bride say come! HalleluYah!
Amen! Thanks for sharing! Were did you learn this?
God becomes fully human in Jesus and he walks in our shoes in the body of Jesus. Jesus like a typical human does not know heaven, although he has a connection to the Father but not full knowledge at this time. Then at the chosen hour because time in reality is not linear; Jesus takes on all human sin and pain from all time during the crucifixion,. Jesus chooses to suffer and die for us and he forgives us our sins and this sacrifice of God made Man is our Salvation. Praise be to God, in Jesus Name!
I believe it may be two fold. Part of becoming the sacrificial lamb for our sin may have been to become forsaken by God for us. Also Jesus is quoting Psalm 22. Basically bringing to everyone there and all of us that this moment was described in scripture long ago. If you read Psalm 22 it describes the crucifixion and is about trusting God.
I think I've read that verse too and noticed it ends on trusting God as well. But I just now realized while reading your comment that hadn't hit me before. Jesus used this instance to reflect his human nature BUT once again, doing so in a perfect way, and showing us the right way to deal with that kind of situation. He revealed that he was hurting that he felt alone but ultimately decided to keep trusting in God instead. Which is really cool bc you don't really understand that unless you go back and read the verse. From the outside, it looks like he is genuinely giving up (well, for modern readers at least. They might have understood what he had references during his time.)
It was to fulfill scripture. God can't abandon himself.
THANK YOU
This guy knows more about the bible than anyone I’ve heard
Ok
Man they just making opinion.
i suspect it was His human side crying out from all the pain and suffering He must have felt.
The best answer i’ve heard besides the prophecy was since the goal for christ was to become sin and die for man, when he felt God left him he knew that he had become sin and so the goal was complete and he could die.
Christ saying "My God, My God why have you forsaken me?, lets us know that He also felt what we sometimes feel, when we are sick and we feel like God has forgotten us in our suffering. I'm speaking from my own experience, after a major surgery, and it was such a traumatic time for me. I begged God, everyday for a week, to show me He was still with me. I felt like the Holy Spirit had completely abandoned me. I was so accustomed to feeling His presence and then not feeling it at all. Finally, finally, He answered me and the Spirit once again fell on me so strong there was no way I could deny it. I often wondered why David, a man after God's own heart would feel this way. and It reminded me of David crying out to God, Cast me not away from thy presence; and take not thy holy Spirit from me. Restore unto me the joy of thy salvation; and uphold me with thy free Spirit.” Psalm 5: 10-12 Maybe I was getting too complacent about the security I felt so often and God was reminding me why I felt this security and love. It was a lesson I will never forget.
Dr Heiser once again puts it all into perspective.
Again, our good Dr Michael has given us an exceptional insight into one of the mysteries concerning our GOD and SAVIOUR, Yeshua-JESUS. The point of Christ's Declaration is not to show HIS Humanity. The entire Good News is that YESHUA -- "Yeshua Saves"-- is GOD-WITH-US -- FULLY GOD, FULLY MAN, nothing less! When THE SON cries out to THE TRINITY that humanity is lost and frightened and defenceless when removed from GOD's PRESENCE, THE LORD AND GOD OF THE UNIVERSE will put aside all considerations and Reverse our SEPERATED state. This is GOD's LOVE STORY HE is telling all HIS FAMILY . "NOTHING IS GOING TO KEEP ME AWAY FROM MY LOVE...🎼" A 1 foot thick curtain separating the Holies from the People is ripped apart, Heaven (Sky darkened)and Earth (Earthquakes) will be moved to achieve GOD's purpose, fully Human fully GOD, YESHUA appeals to the TRINITY to reconsider the seperated state of Humanity. How could THE SON be refused, Who would dare object? The scene is thus a happy one, despite the CHAOS and WILDERNESS, Man can now see GOD. GOD breaks open the bonds that separate us from HIM, just as HE opened up the Heavens to lay HIS BABY into our hands for John's Baptism, now HE breaks opens the HEAVENS and all barriers to let us through, HIS BABY's Family, HIS FAMILY. The Gentiles Profess what only the blind and recalcitrant refuse to see, GOD, THE TRINITY LOVES US , WITH HIS LIFE. TRULY YESHUA, JESUS, IS GOD THE SON!
Is he a Christian? Or is he just Bible researcher? I never heard him saying that he believes in Christ.
God did not abandon Jesus.
Jesus was quoting Psalm 22, which begins by asking why God abandoned the poet, but ends with the statement that Yahweh NEVER abandons His Anointed One (His Christ)
This is about the fact that Jesus had never before EXPERIENCED a separation from the Father and that he was simply voicing this estrangement and loss of communication with the spirit of God... it's that simple.
The most horrendous thing for Jesus is being separated from His Father. The Father and I are one. All of the pain and torture he endured was nothing compared to being separated from Father because of our sins laid upon him. Remember Jesus never sins so the desolation of having sin place a barrier between them. This was not a fault in Jesus. This was our fault.
That seems profound and ignorant preachers have taught that and I once believed that. BUT Jesus was never separated from God nor need we be. Jesus was quoting Psalm 22. Mike Heiser is blind as usual. the 22nd Psalm is just as comforting as the 23rd. Read it and see the cross predicted in verses 12-18 followed by triumph.
I think he is saying I understand how alone it can feel. Relating to David’s pain and ultimately humanity as well. He’s also showing his love for us by quoting this psalm, he’s like hey I understand what pain is look what I am going through for you to have eternal life.
My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me? why art thou so far from helping me, and from the words of my roaring?
2 O my God, I cry in the day time, but thou hearest not; and in the night season, and am not silent.
3 But thou art holy, O thou that inhabitest the praises of Israel.
4 Our fathers trusted in thee: they trusted, and thou didst deliver them.
5 They cried unto thee, and were delivered: they trusted in thee, and were not confounded.
6 But I am a worm, and no man; a reproach of men, and despised of the people.
7 All they that see me laugh me to scorn: they shoot out the lip, they shake the head, saying,
8 He trusted on the Lord that he would deliver him: let him deliver him, seeing he delighted in him.
9 But thou art he that took me out of the womb: thou didst make me hope when I was upon my mother's breasts.
10 I was cast upon thee from the womb: thou art my God from my mother's belly.
11 Be not far from me; for trouble is near; for there is none to help.
12 Many bulls have compassed me: strong bulls of Bashan have beset me round.
13 They gaped upon me with their mouths, as a ravening and a roaring lion.
14 I am poured out like water, and all my bones are out of joint: my heart is like wax; it is melted in the midst of my bowels.
15 My strength is dried up like a potsherd; and my tongue cleaveth to my jaws; and thou hast brought me into the dust of death.
16 For dogs have compassed me: the assembly of the wicked have inclosed me: they pierced my hands and my feet.
17 I may tell all my bones: they look and stare upon me.
18 They part my garments among them, and cast lots upon my vesture.
19 But be not thou far from me, O Lord: O my strength, haste thee to help me.
20 Deliver my soul from the sword; my darling from the power of the dog.
21 Save me from the lion's mouth: for thou hast heard me from the horns of the unicorns.
22 I will declare thy name unto my brethren: in the midst of the congregation will I praise thee.
23 Ye that fear the Lord, praise him; all ye the seed of Jacob, glorify him; and fear him, all ye the seed of Israel.
24 For he hath not despised nor abhorred the affliction of the afflicted; neither hath he hid his face from him; but when he cried unto him, he heard.
25 My praise shall be of thee in the great congregation: I will pay my vows before them that fear him.
26 The meek shall eat and be satisfied: they shall praise the Lord that seek him: your heart shall live for ever.
27 All the ends of the world shall remember and turn unto the Lord: and all the kindreds of the nations shall worship before thee.
28 For the kingdom is the Lord's: and he is the governor among the nations.
29 All they that be fat upon earth shall eat and worship: all they that go down to the dust shall bow before him: and none can keep alive his own soul.
30 A seed shall serve him; it shall be accounted to the Lord for a generation.
31 They shall come, and shall declare his righteousness unto a people that shall be born, that he hath done this.
By the Grace of God
Jesus felt his fathers spirit leave his body
Very good
Jesus also quotes Psalms 31:5 in the Luke account.
Psalm 31:5 (NRSV): Into your hand I commit my spirit;
you have redeemed me, O Lord, faithful God.
Luke 23:46 (NRSV): 46 Then Jesus, crying with a loud voice, said, “Father, into your hands I commend my spirit.”
Yeshua (Jesus) is quoting Psalm chapter 22. To bring the people attention to the prophecy of the Psalm.
He is actually praying the entire Psalm 22 (not chapter). Of the 7 words of Christ on the cross, three come from or allude to that Psalm. Jesus's "I'm thirsty" might refer to verse 16. The quotation of verse 1 is obvious but the Psalm's last verse might also be Jesus's last word in the Gospel of John: "It is finished."
SOJOURNER: Good for you! Apparently you are awake and paying attention!
I always thought that "My God, My God...." was Jesus way of telling them/us, "Go look at that Psalm that starts with My God, My God"! I don't know that they used the reference numbers that we now use for the Psalms; so, it might have been silly for him to call out, "Psalm 22, Psalm 22!". I'm sure it means all that Dr. Heiser is saying, but I always wondered if it was simply a reference for those listening and historically recording his desire for them to recognize the fulfillment of Psalm 22!
Totally. I don't get why people feel the need to speculate endlessly about Jesus' statement rather than pointing to Psalm 22.
Bingo
Jesus, for His entire life, was a man, but never ceasing to be God. That's why He could walk on water and perform all kinds of miracles, including raising the dead as He did with Lazarus, but at the same time he felt the same pain and suffering any of us mere mortals would have felt had we been scourged and crucified. The duality of Jesus, when He walked on this earth, is one of the most difficult things (at least for me) to comprehend, but it's obviously the case and that verse: "My God, why has thou forsaken me?", points out, more than any other, that Jesus, while God, was fully human and at that moment he was more fully human than ever, because the Father had to fully abandon Him at the moment of His crucifixion in order for the Father to separate Himself from sin, the sin of the world Jesus was in the process of taking upon Himself at that moment, and God the Father had to let Jesus die fully human. So not only was Jesus dying an excruciatingly painful death, but the earth turned dark (at daylight) because God the Father, for the first time in Jesus life, had to fully abandon Jesus, and Jesus, who lived His whole life as both God and man, for the first time felt the presence of God depart from Him as He was near death on the cross. So it was natural for Jesus to feel forsaken by God at that moment. I believe "forsaken" is Biblically translated from "abandoned", as in "Why has thou abandoned me." Again, it's the first time in His human life that Jesus feels completely separated from, or abandoned from God the Father. IMHO
example of self emitting oneself of.and or control......peace
God the Father did not forsake His Only Begotten Son Jesus, but He stepped back so that His presence was no longer felt by Jesus. He left Jesus to accomplish the Atonement on His own. In that way no one could say to/of Jesus "But you had help. I could have done what you did if God the Father helped me like He helped you." In this way all the glory of this act, the Atonement, went to the Son.
At that point. The sins of the entire world was placed on Christ. So at that point he was separated from God and he felt that separation. A separation he never felt before. At this point God had to separate from him..... the full price of our sin At this point was paid for.
Christ was never separate from His Father or Holy Spirit. Separation in the Trinity is impossible. And it’s the lie of religion that we are separated.
to wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.
2 Corinthians 5:19
I think perhaps like a lamb to the slaughter, “he opened not his mouth” in spite of the scourging, abuse, nailing him on the cross...not a sound. Yet when God the Father poured out the sins of the world into Jesus...my sin, he did not just say rather he screamed in absolute anguish, horror and pain. He knew no sin in his life and yet in those few hours....unspeakable agony.
He poured out the sins of the world into Jesus? Where are you getting that from?
@@onehappydawg 2 Corinthians 5:21 ESV
For our sake he made him to be sin who knew no sin, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God.
Romans 5:8-9 ESV /
But God shows his love for us in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us. Since, therefore, we have now been justified by his blood, much more shall we be saved by him from the wrath of God.
Romans 2:5 ESV /
But because of your hard and impenitent heart you are storing up wrath for yourself on the day of wrath when God's righteous judgment will be revealed.
Romans 3:25 ESV /
Whom God put forward as a propitiation by his blood, to be received by faith.
--
In Theology, this is known as the doctrine of propitiation. I.e., In Romans 3:25 and Hebrews 9:5 the Greek word hilasterion is used. It is the word employed by the LXX. translators in Exodus 25:17 and elsewhere as the equivalent for the Hebrew kapporeth, which means "covering," and is used of the lid of the ark of the covenant (Exodus 25:21; Exodus 30:6). This Greek word (hilasterion) came to denote not only the mercy-seat or lid of the ark but also propitiation or reconciliation by blood. On the great day of atonement the high priest carried the blood of the sacrifice, he offered for all the people within the veil and sprinkled with it the "mercy-seat," and so made propitiation.
In 1 John 2:2; John 4:10, Christ is called the "propitiation for our sins." Here a different Greek word is used (hilasmos). Christ is "the propitiation," because by his becoming our substitute and assuming our obligations he expiated our guilt, covered it, by the vicarious punishment which he endured.
@@g.alistar7798 Jesus did not become sin nor was sin poured into him.
He became our sin offering.
Just like John the Baptist said, “Behold the lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world.”
The Passover lamb was a foreshadowing of what Jesus would do. The Passover lame did not “become sin” or have “sin poured in to it”
It was an innocent that was sacrificed for the guilty.
@@onehappydawg 2 Corinthians 5:21, I think we are in violent agreement? Happy Easter, He is risen and May God bless you.
@@Charles.Wright I suppose you think Jesus also went to hell for three days too, where the devil and his demons had a good time with Him till God said “enough” and raised Him from the dead.
In addition to this, it is very possible that Yeshua, by saying Eloi Eloi Lama Sabachtani was drawing the listener to Psalm 22. Any listener who knew the Tehillim (Psalms) would have know the first sentence of it and then read or considered the rest of the Psalm. The conclusion would have been to associate Yeshua’s death on the cross to the psalmist’s description of suffering as prophetic messaging of the Messiah’s death, being the son of David.
Michael ~ OH! l've heard this explanation before too, and l agree with you! lt makes total sense! lt just goes to show that just a few words spoken by Jesus reveals more than just one thing! That is AMAZING, ...and it is how we can KNOW that Jesus was really God, and that God is trustworthy, and true! :D
At that moment he was alone for the first time in his life. He had perfect communion with the Father throughout his life. At that moment God the Father turned away because of the sin Jesus bore for us. In the garden Jesus knew this was coming and it horrified him.
d jazz This is a common misconception. The Father does not turn away from Jesus because He bears our sin anymore than He turned away from Adam & Eve in the Garden when they sinned, but rather pursued them when they hid! Jesus was quoting Psalm 22-read the whole thing (see esp. verses 21 & 24). It is a Messianic Psalm. In His human suffering, Jesus may indeed have felt abandoned. It would be surprising if He did not, considering all He had to endure on the Cross, but never was He abandoned by His Father, since the Persons of the Holy Trinity eternally mutually indwell one another (see John 14:10-11).
@@lornadoone8887 Your wrong, he did turn away from Adam and Eve. They could no longer be in his presence, with the stain of sin on them. That is why they had to leave the garden. On the cross he was fully man and fully God. If he bore out sin the Father had to turn away, he ( Jesus)was now sin, and could no longer fellowship with the farther. That is the terror he felt in the garden, he knew it was coming.
Was he not alone whilst enduring temptations?
Cause anybody could resist the devil if the father was one with him as in ,father son one ness and when you think about it jesus s earthly body must of been brand new cause obviously Satan will know the son better than any other angel in the spiritual realm , as he was head of all angels so therefore probably the first thing jesus created and Satan didn't recognise him cause if he did recognise jesus that says that's he's entrusted with a task by the father that jesus isn't aware of which In essence I would say puts him at a level either equal to or above jesus which isn't true
Wow..1000+ pages and this video to explain a simple thing. The Incarnation requires Jesus to experience ALL aspects of humanity. Although sinless, he bears the sins of the world and feels their effects on the cross when they are laid on him. Sin creates separation from God. The effect of that separation is why Jesus feels forsaken. Jesus was with the Father always and now feels the effects of sin just as we do...the separation from God
That's certainly one half of the truth.
I do not believe that The Lord ever felt forsaken, He knew all that was to happen to Him, before hand, and said so through out The Gospels. His prayers in the garden point to this. He was a perfect example of remaining faithful. Again, Psalm 22, in its entirety, is not summed up in its first line. You must read the entire Psalm to know what Our Lord was saying.
@@petergambino2129 Amen. Little children seek proof texts. Adults seek context. Comfort, not despair was implied.
don't overthink. just know that even jesus felt like he was forsaken and he's the son of god. at the end he resurrected and gave us confirmation of eternal life. with that said, we should keep faith and bear the obstacles in life.
Jesus was pointing to Psalm 22. It's not complicated at all.
In the context of Matthew, Jesus has always been consistent in the approach of Remember The Scripture. The by standing Jews reacted to what Jesus had said was consistent in their understanding of Ps 22.
Jesus was not the only one in despair over the Cross. The Father and the Spirit were also. They had done everything together and even the pain of the Cross was felt by All.
Of course, those people who knew Christ were in despair also. They were overwhelmed with feelings of inadequacy, fear and hopelessness. But through all eternity the Godhead had never be driven to so much pain. They all held back to give us a way of escape so we could more than endure, rather we can die to our selfish love, our narcissism. To be reborn to salvation. Hallelujah.
Since sin separates us from God. "Why have you forsaken me" means he was taking the sins of the world.
Bingo.
Jesus felt The Father look away from Him because He cannot look upon sin,and ALL the sins of the world were placed upon Him.
Jesus never had a moment in his life where He was out of the full loving gaze of the father. I imagine the only way He could survive everything He went through all the way to the cross, was because God the father was looking full into Jesus’s face encouraging Him and loving Him telling Him “I’m here son, daddy’s got you, it’s almost over...I love you, hold on son” and when Jesus became sin and the father HAD to look away ...in Jesus’s humanity we see in that moment our own torment of being out of the full gaze and fellowship of the father. He still says “ into thy hands I commit my spirit” when He dies....I understand being out of fellowship with the father because of my own sin and it’s torment and lonely ....Jesus died out of the full gaze of the father so WE don’t have to!!! When He became my sin and everyone else’s, THATS the true heartbreak of the passion ..it wasn’t the torture, humiliation, or pain, it was that moment of separation and sacrifice and He went through it so WE don’t have to die out of fellowship and we don’t have to be separated from the father after our death.
It showed me that I’m not a Christian because I’m afraid of death or hell...I’m a Christian because I love Jesus and I know I don’t want to be separated from Him for eternity.
I posted something similar before reading this, almost identical, only you said it far more eloquently and movingly.
@@2GunRock it’s just what’s on my heart, brother ..we all feel the Holy Spirit moving and flooding into us. He’s calling all who can hear Him to come out of our sin and draw closer to our 1st love ..which is the love of Jesus, our bridegroom ...because he’s coming for His bride
Whoa, well said. I couldn't put that down so clearly. Good job, Karen.
What a coïncidence t'hat thé Sme quote is in psalsm 22. Too much coïncidence but yes nothing else to argué. Heiser is awesome
No coincidence at all. Jesus was praying that Psalm.
I don't see it as despair , but more as a statement of innocence in a court
It is a direct quote from Psalm 22, a prophetic Psalm about the suffering servant of God.
He is calling out to his GOD.
@JIM LUNN : Read the Psalm.
Correct, He didn';t.
AKA “oh papa this hurts, I feel alone, where are you”!? Vulnerability. Emotions. Feelings.
The will of the Father is the will of the Son...The Son's love of the Father and His Love for us compelled Him to fulfill the scriptures and redeem us by His shed blood...When He became SIN for us the Father turned His face from Jesus and the Lord instantly sensed that separation and loss of fellowship He had from eternity past..Though He could have called ten thousand angels, He died alone for you and me... Praise His Holy Name...Shalom and Maranatha!!
Biblical spot on!
"I and the Father are one" - Jesus (Jn. 10:30, Jn. 17)
Prior to his death he spoke to the disciples and informed them they would be scattered and leave him alone.. he says "Yet I am not alone; for the Father is with me" Jn. 16
God cannot forsake himself friend. He was quoting ps. 22; prophecy fulfilled to a T at that very moment... as a witness to those who were there.
Imagine the astonishment of those who heard. Talk about a light bulb going off!
It was to show the law was powerless to save, in that Grace towards the sinners who punished Him was greater than the belief men hold that God would punish sinful men. Especially on this occasion when a sinless man pleads his case of justice(refer to job) surrounded by the sinful.
Instead, God loves us so much, while we all consider God our enemy, He gave up His son(Himself) for us, so that in this we may know God and come to Him and be reconcilled with Him who loves us with such great love.
And God in this great display to win our trust approves His son with great love in that Jesus is willing to lay down his life, and raise it up again for our benefit.i
Jesus was quoting Psalm 22:1
Someone else already said it but yes Jesus was teaching from the cross. And fulfilling prophecy.
I agree with the previous comment. I once heard a pastor put it in that way. That once the sin of the world was placed on him . That God the father being completely Holy, had to turn away from christ . Because he's so Holy that he couldn't look upon him. And Jesus felt the disconnect when the father turned away.
Christ died,he had to die(the wages of sin is death) to be resurrected. From death to life. Death could not hold him,the grave had no power over him. I agree with your pastor.
Simply not true. Jesus was quoting the 22nd Psalm. That Psalm teacnes that God does NOT forsake us even when we think He has. Please read the whole Psalm. It describes Jesus' crucifixion. God looks on our sin all the time. Jesus was not forsaken and we are not forsaken.
@@johnbreitmeier3268 Don't get me wrong . I'm not saying he forsook anyone. I'm saying at that moment when he was made to be sin. The very nature of God the father could not gaze upon it . But both knew it needed to be as it was. Just because he could not look upon the sin. Didn't mean he had forsaken him. You must remember. From the time that Adam & Eve sinned until Jesus died on the cross . God and man were separated Jesus very literally reconciled God to man in every way . Until Jesus,man could only atone for sin by sacrifice. And it had to be done through the high priest and even he had to go through a cleansing process before he could approach the ark. God was finished with man cursed the very ground they stood upon. And only a select few did God come to after that. If it hadn't been for Noah finding Grace in The eyes of God none of us would even be here. Because until Noah God was troubled that he even created man at all. Which of course is by his chosing to find grace in Noah. But even so until Jesus there was a veil between Man & God. Jesus told the people that God honors the promise he made to Israel and reconciles himself to man. And still I am not saying that God has forsaken anyone. It's man who has forsaken God. Man was the reason the veil was there. And yet he still makes provision for us. And when it's time. those who believe in Christ have the protection of his riteousness. And those who have forsaken him will be separated and God's wrath will be poured out on them in full measure and all will be made new again. This time through freewill we have chosen to love God. And in so doing will receive a new body that is incorruptible. And there will be no more sin. No more separation of man & God. God will live among us we will be his people a he our God and all will be as it should. It's totally impossible for us to even comprehend. But try to unferds.
@@aland4092 The Father and the Son are of the same. Nature. Both look at sin all the time when they look at us.
@@johnbreitmeier3268 ok I guess your missing the point. . But anyway we are brothers and no sense arguing over something we actually agree upon. God bless us all .
This question is simple,this is what you and I would have said but He took it for us.
Great point! God forsook Jesus because of our sin so that God wouldn’t have to forsake us.