Adapting Wakanda: MCU vs. Marvel Animation
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- Опубликовано: 13 июн 2024
- (This video is mostly spoiler-free for Black Panther: Wakanda Forever, with the exception of a clearly-marked section toward the video's end)
Watching the new Black Panther film got me thinking about the various ways Marvel projects adapting T'Challa and Wakanda had used the character and his homeland in their narratives. In this video, we're taking a look at all the major adaptations of Black Panther from comic-book to screen, and determining just what it is about the MCU's take on this corner of the Marvel Universe that works so well. (Hint: the answer is in the thumbnail!)
P.S. I missed out the 2010 motion comic series because it isn't so much an original adaptation of the character as it is a direct visualisation of a then-recent limited comic-book series.
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Some reading around Wakanda's worldbuilding:
www.highsnobiety.com/p/black-...
• The World-building of ...
#marvel #mcu #wakandaforever
Timestamps:
0:00 Introduction
1:16 Fantastic Four, Wakanda's origins, and the 90's animated universe
6:38 Ultimate Black Panther(s)
12:01 Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes
21:19 The MCU
28:30 WAKANDA FOREVER SPOILERS!
31:28 Conclusion, and the content paradox
In Black Panther: Wakanda Forever, Queen Ramonda, Shuri, M'Baku, Okoye and the Dora Milaje fight to protect their nation from intervening world powers in the wake of King T'Challa's death. As the Wakandans strive to embrace their next chapter, the heroes must band together with Nakia and Everett Ross to forge a new path for their beloved kingdom. Black Panther: Wakanda Forever is a 2022 American superhero film based on the Marvel Comics character Black Panther. Produced by Marvel Studios and distributed by Walt Disney Studios Motion Pictures, it is the sequel to Black Panther (2018) and the 30th film in the Marvel Cinematic Universe (MCU). Directed by Ryan Coogler, who co-wrote the screenplay with Joe Robert Cole, the film stars Letitia Wright, Lupita Nyong'o, Danai Gurira, Winston Duke, Florence Kasumba, Dominique Thorne, Michaela Coel, Tenoch Huerta, Martin Freeman, Julia Louis-Dreyfus, and Angela Bassett. In the film, the leaders of Wakanda fight to protect their nation in the wake of King T'Challa's death. 
Развлечения
A few people are commenting about the BET series back in 2010 starring Djimon Hounsou. I am aware of this! It's just (as I noted in the description) I didn't mention that because as far as I can tell it’s a direct adaptation of a comic run - so not really fitting in with the more original adaptations we discuss here!
It was not an adaptation of a comic run. You should watch it. It speaks to all the issues you have with the pre MCU adaptations of wakanda and in my opinion MCU's Wakanda owes much of its depiction to the BET wakanda.
That’s fair as it’s not an adaptation but a literal translation.
@@clementmckenzie7041 yes it is. It’s a storyline directly from Volume 4 of Black Panther from what I’m gathering. Although I’mma dive deeper and see if I can get more info
@@wesstewart2677 i think, its more an amalgamation of several runs
Also as a few have mentioned that there was a whole season of effectively a Black Panther Cartoon as the fifth season of the Avengers Assemble series. It's available of Disney+. It's an enjoyable watch and written by Geoffrey Thorne who has written one of the better solo issue of Black Panther in recent years.
God, I love Earth's Mightiest Heroes, especially how T'challa shows up.
Comes in directly to avengers mansion.
Kicks all their asses.
Then requests for their help.
Owns their systems since he has been studying them inside and out.
Wins the final battle against M'baku in his own, with little aid from Cap.
Kinda sad you didn't talk about the 2008 BET Black Panther cartoon, I think its depiction of Wakanda was pretty great, and unlike the other shows Wakanda isn't shown from the perspective of outsiders, or in needing the help of outsiders to defend itself
Why. That has nothing to do with this video
@@charlesbranscomb8493 the creator is saying that the MCU did Wakanda but isn’t acknowledging the other times Wakanda has been correctly portrayed.
What I like about that one is it subverts all the other tropes. The U.S. tries to mask their attempts at a full scale invasion by pretenting they were sending in military assistance to stop the full scale invasion that BP had just thwarted from Klaue and friends. The King sees RIGHT through this and sends the U.S zombie marine army (yes... zombie marines) home empty handed. It was a great adaptation.
I was wondering this as well.
@@charlesbranscomb8493 yes. this comment about how wakanda is represented in marvel media has nothing to do with this video about how wakanda is represented in marvel media.
I honestly loved what they did with Namor in this movie , despite not being comic accurate.
Yep, I was totally into it.
Namor actually ended up my favorite character, due to his specific and thought out motivations. Also he’s crazy hot
I actually prefer Movie Namor to Comic Namor
Same. The idea of having him and his people being mesoamerican helps to create similarites between his kingdom with Wakanda, as both civilizations (in this case africans and mesoamerican) if they weren't victims of colonialism.
Yeah comic namor always felt a bit shallow to me compared to this one
I know saying this will paint a target on my back, but I agree that the MCU did succeed in giving Wakanda more agency
they also succeded in completely shitting on asgard, the us government (which is good) the inhuman city, and atlantis. well done
same
"Wakanda solves Wakanda's problem."
That right there is how you do a black panther story. Wakanda is the story of celebrating black power, beauty, and ingenuity. It has so much more impact when it's characters have agency
Also racists to mutants and others.
@@mayotango1317 ???
@@legendswarble2845 Yes, they are just anoying snobs.
@@mayotango1317 How????? Also, what does that have to do with my comment about the benefit of portraying black power? Supporting black people isn't anti white.
@@legendswarble2845 Even they had a cage for Storm in Doomwar.
That Talocan scene was just amazing, I was blown away but how beautifully crafted it was. Especially that music. This is what I love most about the MCU. It's not just copy pasting stories, but forging their own, and using the comics as inspiration.
I remember that in one of your early EMH videos, you had set up the idea that Wakanda in the show had it's problems. It's a very interesting topic and it opens many discussions about inclusion in cartoons.
With wakanda basically getting it's own show in the form of the midnight angel show that marvel is making my hope is that this agency you are referring to is not sacrificed and is instead built upon
You did a pretty good job addressing and analyzing my issues I've had with portrayals of Wakanda in various media.
1st significant Wakanda MCU appearance (reference) was Age of Ultron where Claw invaded Wakanda and stole some vibranium. Aside from the neck-brand there was no sign of Wakandan retribution. One could argue that's a bit of a passive introduction.
Thank you for clarifying that the 90’s Marvel shows **attempted** a shared universe. I’ve seen two many people think all the shows are one universe when they aren’t.
@@caitlyncarvalho7637 oof
@@caitlyncarvalho7637 oof to Wakanda. They gone done dirty
Excellent video, thank you! I know F. d. Signifier (specifically his "B sides" channel) pointed out that the speech at the UN in Wakanda Forever feels like a different stance than the end of the first Black Panther ("we'll share our resources" vs. "it's ours and we don't trust you) and honestly this is the most interested I've been in geopolitics in the MCU. I wish they'd commit and just have more advanced phones in the MCU due to the distribution of knowledge- though how much of the tech is completely reliant on vibranium would impact how well other countries could try to compete as well
Haven’t seen F.D.‘s take on BP2 just yet, thanks for reminding me! No idea if this is something he touches on, but my initial reaction is that difference in stance might not be so much an ideological inconsistency between films as it is a reflection of the difference between T’challa’s vision for Wakanda and Ramonda’s?
@@PillarofGarbage I could see that! She definitely seems more cautious after the death of her son, which could also be part of it.
@@PillarofGarbage Thank you for explaining it. USA is NOT a friend of Africa. That is the general sentiment yet people are STILL pushing that "hero" or "savior" narrative that nobody believes. Africans favour China more than any Western nation because they bring BUSINESS.
They said no vibranium. They are not giving up the good stuff.
this video really highlights how important it is to have people of color tell/portray their own stories. i love earth's mightiest heroes to death and i respect how it remains faithful to the comics' themes with a more sensitive touch, but the difference between it and the MCU's black panther movie is staggering
I was hoping for a mention of the 6-part miniseries Marvel Knights Black Panther featuring the voice talent of Djimon Hounsou, an absolute banger of an opening theme, and notable cameos from iconic Marvel characters like Storm and Captain America.
Didn’t mention that because as far as I can tell it’s a direct adaptation of a comic run - so not really fitting in with the more original adaptations we discuss here!
@@PillarofGarbageOh ok, I see. Great video btw.
This video has manifested a topic I've been personally thinking for many years following the character and afro futurism in pop culture. Well done.
The idea that an African country would need a rare resource to rise to wealth and power is the opposite of the truth: A lot of African countries *are* indeed rich in natural resources. But much like a lot of Arab states, most places with lots of natural resources turn into dictatorships, or oligarchies at best. Why?
Because you only need comparatively few people to extract these resources, without the rest of the population profiting from it. This is known as the “Dutch disease”. The only positive example I am aware of, with a country using its natural resources for the benefit of the entire public, is Norway. They protected their offshore oil fields against the grasp of the US, and used the revenue to finance their welfare state.
Yes, showing Wakanda as a nation with agency is important to break the mindset of learned helplessness that you find in a lot of oligarchies - such as Russia. But the idea that Wakanda would first need this unique resource to get there is self-defeating in that pursuit. Because not only does that base this agency on something fictional (i.e., wish fulfilment), but also, it would incentivise African viewers to wish for what might just be exactly the wrong thing.
Look at Israel. One of the few places in the desert without any natural resources. How did they create any wealth? By building a massive service sector and startup culture. How’s that for demonstrating agency? 🤔
Yes but all of this is in the context of the sci-fi superhero genre.
Simply put, the idea of vibranium and this sci-fi technology is just cool. And doing a complex dive into how they are financially successful just isn’t that cool for most people.
I also feel like the majority of these natural resource rich countries were already in a bad place before the technology that would allow them to take advantage of it existed. No?
I’m no economist or geopolitical expert, but surely there’s a very big difference between a nation that is super rich in natural resources and a nation who had laser guns in the Medieval Times.
I hope they do latveria right in the MCU.
Make doctor doom romani too and do some like flamenco music for his theme
Knowing their track record, they'll just make Latveria a stand-in for Russia.
So funny enough, my introductions to Black Panther was in the ultimate avengers movie. I really liked the character and I thought his powers were cool, to which one I played ultimate alliance I had Black Panther on my team because I really thought he was awesome. As years past, he became one of my favorite comic heroes and when I saw he was going to have his big cinematic reveal in civil War, I freaked out with excitement!
I think an easy way to look at Wakanda's agency is in the past adaptations, they were featured in someone else's story vs the MCU where they took a more central role
Not going to lie, but T’Challa really was the MVP in Earth’s Mightiest Heroes.
I love how well Wakanda is depicted, its an amazingly vibrant and powerful state that anyone can look at in awe. However what I never really got, is other than for story/cool reasons, is how such an advanced and developed country like Wakanda, is politically a tribal confederation kingdom where its leaders are elected by a martial duel as well as having its head of state/king be its martial champion that does missions, instead of running the country. That just seem when real life logic applied to as being really primitive and stupid, as people like Killmonger can just take over and attempt to conquer the world. Additionally, while Wakanda is without doubt the most technologically advanced country in the world, I wouldn't say its the most powerful as its population is very small, and as Namor showed, you can basically bring the nation to its knees by damaging the capital city.
As for your comment about acknowledging the BET cartoon and the comic. There are minor changes in the comics and the cartoon like adding more XMEN in the cartoon and replacing the Rhino with Jaggernaut. I recommend reading the comic and watching the cartoon and doing a video on it.
Thanks for the info - I’ll have to check it out properly
Wakanda Forever!
I was not really very interested in these Movies, but when my best friends dragged me to the cinema yesterday for my birthday to watch BP:WF, I gotta admit I was put on the edge of my seat in a lot of the scenes and I love the Wakandan side of the world with their aesthetics and music. As the both of them told me when we got outta the theatre: "Wow, that was actually kinda good"
I feel like the main thing those adaptations you dislike have in common is that they're not stories ABOUT Wakanda. If an Avengers story features Wakanda, then of course the Avengers are going to play an important role in saving the day, they're not always going to play second fiddle to Black Panther.
I get wanting Wakanda to have agency and not just being a "country in distress" waiting to be saved by outsiders, but you sometimes make it sound like you want Wakanda to always be in control of the situation, making every single decision, even if it's not their story.
I’m gonna go ahead and give this a medium-strength disagree
Civil War was a Cap/Avengers story which managed this fine, EMH was an Avengers show which mostly got things right after some teething pains, and the original FF comic appearance did things better than most of the stuff in this vid.
Really fun video despite me not knowing the source material except the mcu
Glad you enjoyed!
Excellent video breakdown content explanation
No love for Reginald Hudlin's adaptation?? That was easily the best Wakanda and T'Challa.
Wakanda still needs their Black Panther.
They still need their t’challa
Shuri just doesn't hold up compared to T'Challa , sadly.
@@naiveparsley2917 She's alright. I just wished they hadn't retread the same character journey as her brother.
@@thembanitheoneher character journey kinda fits the theme of not following the mistakes of her predecessors, t'challa did that to but kilmongerer couldn't be reedmed at that point , while namor and his people could be
@@fullmetal2455 I meant with Zemo in Civil War
Great video, although I expected the motion comic to appear because I was interested in your point of view about it, as for some reason it is regarded as a Black Panther animated miniseries.
Didn’t mention that because as far as I can tell it’s a direct adaptation of a comic run - so not really fitting in with the more original adaptations we discuss here!
@@PillarofGarbage I understand and thank you for answering, amazing video as usual.
Yay! I was hoping you'd do a video about W F
"just another nation-state with bloody hands. But Wakanda Forever sees them win without stooping to this level" something tells me this is going to age badly in the future similar to Killmonger character
As usual with the MCU. Anything that seems groundbreaking now, Sokovia Accords, Thanos Snap consequences and such, ultimately will lose it's luster the longer it goes on because that's just the nature of the medium. Got to move on to the next big thing and I'm sure the charms of Wakanda will be no exception.
@@motherplayerthat's kinda like comics though, also it makes sense the sokovia accords aren't emplimented anymore due to the snap
Also check out Black Panther by BET, it's an adaptation of the Christopher Priest run where he goes up against the US government
Can you make a video on Namor and compare both the comic book and MCU versions
A big task! Maybe one day!
Must this blessing shield you from the wrath of the Holy Ones & Zeros.
I am an overall fan of EMH but I really did not like T'Challa being like hey help me stage a coup in my own country and fight off my own people cause they need to get with the times. Even Cap straight up says "uh hey you are asking us to invade a foreign country to fight it's people to enforce a ruler on them they did not choose?" and then T'Challa just says "but this guy is dangerous" and the Avengers are just "alright it's chill then, we'll never mention it again."
Did like their advanced tech, and the overall design was mid. Liked T'Challa's loyalty and sense of responsibility. They did a much better job with him as an individual character than they did with the country though.
I thought that was great. It showed deeply hubristic flaw in the Wakandan monarchal government that T'Challa in his EMH journey then seeks to overcome.
There is a Black Panther series that wasn't brought up, I can't remember what it's called but I watched it on RUclips. Basically it's Black Panther having to deal with him recently being crowned king, and having to go up against Claw and some goons he hired (Juggernaut, the Algerian guy that was also in Captain America 2 (forgot his name) and one other guy I forgot), and there's a subplot about Americans trying to force themselves to "help" so they can abuse Wakanda for Vibranium. Black Panther not only wins without much help if any from the Americans, and even kicks them out with a cold stone threat. One of my favorite non MCU shows
Also want to point out, it's been years since I've seen it, so I'm probably wrong on some parts
Thought the villains hired by America still manage to infiltrate wakanda
@@TheEnigmaticBM39 The villains were Zombie soldiers, and they got into the country, but we're deterred easily if I remember correctly
Lore of Adapting Wakanda: MCU vs. Marvel Animation momentum 100
I would like to see the Avengers assemble version as well as the black Panthers quest versions broken down and reviewed by you. I know the series is fairly divisive, however Panthers Quest is quite enjoyable.
Yep agreed.
Great essay! I've often noticed these aspects watching (that which they made apparent) cartoons featuring T'Challa as a character. I would hope they fix this in future animated series. Furthermore, the video games have done similar encasements of Wakanda. It's usually a backdrop of a more larger scheme.
I feel the property as a whole should be expressed with more consideration and in a larger capacity than its given. There should be more projects about T'Challa and Wakanda. #Wakandaverse
I really liked this movie, it made me cry twice which I hardly do for movies.
I loved the music, the action, the politics of the movie and the characters. I had a feeling that this movie was going to be the best of phase 4 along Shang Chi. NWH was fun but very very flawed. Phase 4 movies have been underwhelming but they had poor execution, not poor concepts or acting.
I can't wait to see what Ant-Man does for phase 5.
Hope you are doing well pillar.
Really enjoyed this adaptation of wakanda in the mcu.
I had forgotten Marvel animated movies existence.
Intresting
I actually feel that the original comic book version was the best as T'challa had plenty of agency and the story was realistic as a country in isolation can never progress in real life. Just look at what happened to China when they isolated themselves.
No mention of Black Panther guest episodes in Iron Man Armored Adventures? Aw...
Also I can't wait for the What If episode based on Wakandan Forever. Can see it having Talocan making the Warcraft Bloodlust noise.
Didnt T'Challa appear in armored aventures?
Knew there’d be something I’d miss :(
Oh well, maybe that’s a followup video!
Nice
4:34 Octavia Butler is considered the founder of Afro Futurism
Oi! What happened to the Wakanda from the BET Black Panther mini-series?
From the description:
‘P.S. I missed out the 2010 motion comic series because it isn't so much an original adaptation of the character as it is a direct visualisation of a then-recent limited comic-book series.’
@PillarofGarbage The BET Black Panther cartoon was amazing compared to those other shows. I think you can find a trash copy on Daily Motion. The whole thing is like less than 10 episodes. But memory of that alone had me hyped for the movie to come out. It was the only BP content I'd ever seen.
You forgot to add the 2010 black panther animated series that aired on bet.
Mcu wakanda is heavily inspired by this interpretation of black panther.
YES! The BET Black Panther cartoon was amazing compared to those other shows. I think you can find a trash copy on Daily Motion. The whole thing is like less than 10 episodes. But memory of that alone had me hyped for the movie to come out.
@@alanar8046 I don't waste my time with daily motion, I have other sites where I have been watching my cartoons & animes.
@@bashengatheblackmanta7003 If you have a site that has the BET Black Panther series, let me know. Daily Motion is truly useless.
@@alanar8046 watch cartoon
I actually really dislike Wakanda and it’s residents, at least in the MCU and EMH. (I don’t know much about it from the comics) They are supposedly super advanced but still use basic spears and thatch roofs. The part where the ruler is decided by trial by combat is especially egregious to me.
They also pretend like they are superior to other countries. When John Walker (the true Captain America) tells The Dora milaje that they don’t have jurisdiction in madripoor they say they have jurisdiction wherever they want. They call other countries colonizers when that’s exactly what they did to the other surrounding clans when the vibranium meteor fell. They won’t share their resources because the other countries will use it irresponsibly to make weapons when in the first BP movie they were going to follow killmonger into a war with the entire world. They have access to incredible medical technology that they refuse to share with the rest of the world such as healing a BROKEN SPINE! But they won’t even help Rhodey. It’s no wonder why the rest of the world is desperate for vibranium.
With the new movie Wakanda has gone back on Tachalla’s promise to help other countries and share their resources when they have now had 8-10+ years to help out. Even with the blip they should have helped somewhat.
Did you not see how advanced the spears are like they are also contain shields I'm pretty sure some can fire weapons also not counting Dore Milaje. Also what's wrong with Thatch roof.
Just like they were confident in Civil War am I right? Fits well with Wakanda believing they are superior to everyone else. Would seem strange for them to be scared.
Don't see what's wrong with that since Wakanda were in a 5 way war before discovering vibranium. They all bowed down to the ruler there after. They don't hide that their history before Wakanda was formed was bloody.
That was T'Challa who wanted to share resources but the Queen mother doesn't. She is fine with sharing some of the technology not resources.
Also why should Wakanda share their vibranium? It's like USA sharing their Nukes that doesn't make sense
Dude you’re completely right well said man
In the comics Wakanda wasn't always highly advanced. In many ways they were behind everybody else because of their closed borders. Like Wakanda didn't have a city until T'Challa opened the border for cultural exchange. In the comics they didn't have black wire used for stitches.
They weren't even portrayed as a perfect society either. Like many of the other tribes in Wakanda dislike Black Panther and his tribe because they worship the Panther god Bast and they it's considered the main religion of wakanda.
Heck in 1991 Panther's Prey had a story about drugs coming into Wakanda because T'Challa opened the borders a little. The comic showed that Wakanda improved in many ways by being more open but brought in many problems too.
Heck they weren't even portrayed as a civilazation that take on the world and win if they wanted too. They weren't invincible like how the movies show them. Heck many Wakandans are so pro isolantionism that they would give 1500's japan a run for their money
It's only the modern comics that portray them as perfect and thats because of the movies.
@@TheMatthardyv1 lol no that what how wakanda was originally but here is the thing just like comics Wakanda developed to what it is today. I bet vibranium didnt even exist at all originally. In 1996 wakanda was portrayed as advanced in the fantastic 4 tv series compared to how they were in 1966
In the comics those people still exist who are against the black panther.
Wakanda doesn't even seem perfect all
@@maadtee6281 I know in the last 20 - 30 years they have been potrayed as an advanced society. I was clarifying that when they were introduced to the comics they weren't as advanced as the MCU presented them.
It's better story telling and gives off a better message that a isolationist society by opening uo their borders a little for cultural exchange and help their society.
Edit: A quick google search would show you vibranium appeared in the same issue Black Panther appeared in.
What about Ironman armor adventures?
I feel like EMH was a better Wakanda personally
Awesome video, basically just commenting to boost, thank you for sharing!
Much appreciated, glad you liked it!
I enjoyed the video, but you missed black panthers appearance in iron man armored adventures
Knew something would have slipped through, F
If people like this video maybe I’ll make a followup including stuff like this
@@PillarofGarbage yeah that be pretty cool, I was intrigued what your take of that version was gonna be
Interesting video.
Even though this film looked beautiful and sounded great, it didn't make me care enough about the characters for the main ark to have any pay off. Part of me wonders whether on some level as a white man, I'm less likely to get emotionaly invested in a story that's primarily about black women, but equally I thought it really missed Serkis and Jordan.
Shuri didn't really seem to have the gravitas or charisma to fit the main role and Riri was just a copy and paste child genius, without any fleshing out of her character.
I would've rather watched a film that focused on Namor.
It seems to be mostly the Right Wing Social & Political Extremists (Chuds) that hate this movie. Anybody outside this community seemed to enjoy the film, myself included. I thought it was a great sequel that had to deal with an unfortunate situation, yet handled it beautifully.
I am neither and- well, I think its meh at best and kinda BAD at worst, though I realize this doesn't count as hate. But my opinion on it, whether I like it or dislike it more may change (talking specifically about the new black panther movie)
Nah it's not only right wingers. The conversation is far more nuanced than that
@@kenshix7902 exactly
@@kenshix7902 correct
It was ok. People overhype it and People overly crap on it. Theres a lot of GLARING Plot issues leveled off by AMAZING Visuals, Acting and Music
Yo they planned a Serpent Society movie? I knew about the Inhumans. Ultimately a good thing they went with Civil War instead. I do not think the MCU was in a place to effectively use the serpent society. I could see it the MCU we are building today however
An important note about the end of Civil War: You have multiple high profile "criminals" given shelter by Wakanda, and the US doesn't get them back despite the value such an action would bring to the relevant agency. The CIA would undoubtedly have loved to get their hands on the Winter Soldier, for example. Or the outlaw Cap. it would be a big deal. Cap even points out that they will come for them.
And yet, they fail. Wakanda can just ignore the will of either the US or the UN without becoming an international pariah, which is no small feat.
You missed some like marvel rising and avengers assemble you know if ur gonna mention the portrayals of wakanda mcu vs animation you could at least acknowledged ALL of them
@madnessarcade7447
Those shows weren't very good imao. Marvel Rising while decent/ok was soo series inconsistent with its release schedule that it was eventually canceled and never had a proper conclusion.
Avengers Assembled - is terrible follow after the far superior Earth's mightiest heroes. Too much comedy.
Too much filler. Subpar to mediocre voice acting. terrible storylines & adaptations of popular Avengers storylines from the comics.
No build-up whatsoever to the Thanos and the infinity storyline.
No build-up to Ultron.
A lot of the villains in AA have little to no buildup and are very underdeveloped.
@madnessarcade7447
The action and animation is stiff and lifeless with terrible backgrounds. Animation overall is a huge step down from the cartoony comic book the art style of EMH.
No memorable music. EMH has perhaps the best Marvel intro of all-time. All AA has mediocre music that tries and fails to copy the MCU.
Character development is non-existent especially when it comes to the New Avengers in S4. Ant-Man and Wasp were very underdeveloped. CM was very annoying, arrogant and obnoxious and unlikable.
The only ones that were good were Ms. Marvel, Vision and Black Panther.
Jane Foster should have been in more episodes and should have been the scientist for the New Avengers team.
@madnessarcade7447
Terribly adapting the Thunderbolts storyline which should have been longer.
Songbird not being apart of the New Avengers team.
I am glad the mcu did wakanda justice
Unfortunately some American black men don't see it that way. They're too blinded by gender wars. And this is Africa, not America. We don't think the same.
@@suezcontours6653 i know that
If only we got to see MORE of it. Theres BARELY any wakanda to talk about besides Visuals
@@no.1spidey-fan182 true
@@suezcontours6653 let me remind you that this is Africa thrue the eye of America since Americans made this movie.
But I agree with you, we black people from Africa and the carribean & south America, we have a different way of living compared to black Americans, we are more open and joyfull
Hm yes lore of Wakandan agency momentum 100
Ethnostates with strong borders are based.
Shouldn’t that be how not why?
So are we just not going to discuss Avengers Assemble Wakanda? The entire fifth season is mostly just Wakanda and Black Panther
That's what I was thinking, that's a major appearance that's just not mentioned
Agreed but this season came out after black panther movie, black panther qu'est wast mostly modeled after mcu but it improve wakanda better.
What they left out is the black panther animated series that aired on bet in 2010, this show protrayed a advance black panther and they stopped a invasion force without the help of outsiders.
I felt wanka was an interruption of the Zulu nation as a super power since the 50 60s I forget when he came to be
More like Ethiopia, especially with the whole "never colonised" angle and being closer to it, Kenya & Uganda than South Africa.
Is T'Challa wearing a sweatband on his head in the Fantastic Four one? And bright blue shorts for real you couldn't even give him black? Looking more like Namor's costume
It was the 90s, where every hero needed to sport a bright red Liu Kang headband for some reason
UA2 was so bad but I definitely loved it because Black Panther was just in it. Now it's hard to watch I kinda prefer the Next Avengers because they aren't bastardizing wakanda in it
"World War II baddies whose names RUclips won't let me say" 💀💀💀
Could you do a nwh video I know I know I keep asking but I have been looking at reviews and I have see how people are saying Spider-Man nwh was only good because of fan service and nostalgia but the writing/story is amazing in my opinion and I think truthfully it’s better than wakanda forever and Shang chi and into the spider verse and the Batman stories but what do you think pillar of garbage
Writing is decent, but unspectacular.
Should be a NWH video coming in the next few weeks!
Awesome
26:45 When you added No Way Home in here, this sounds like you mainly like to play the intellectual contrarian: Defending those MCU movies that the internet fan consensus deems as trash, going after the movies that the RUclips Marvel fans appreciated.
For me, the MCU already lost its plot somewhere in phase 2. Captain America: Civil War gets overanalysed by a lot of people - but I remember that, while watching it, it just felt like a live-action version of the old VS System trading card game (or playing Top Trumps): The filmmakers wanted to show superheroes going up against each other and testing their powers, and needed an excuse of a plot to justify that. Civil War already featured such an overload of characters that it felt like a full-blown Avengers movie, and I thought you couldn’t possibly include more heroes in one movie (especially when they also brought in Spider-Man, whose comic link to the Avengers has been unstable at best).
Then they came along with Infinity War (a.k.a. “Kitchen Sink: The Movie”), and tossed even more characters into that one, now including the Guardians of the Galaxy. Yet, naturally, as I expected, this left them little opportunity to flesh out any of the heroes’ internal conflicts. The only thing memorable in that movie were the things Thanos did. And even for him, I only remember for one of the Infinity Stones how he got it - because that’s the one that required a personal sacrifice from him.
No Way Home may have been fan service, no doubt about that. But after a lot of movies and video games have gone out of their way to use active fan disservice, where what’s now known as “fan baiting” by insulting them has become a new marketing tactic, a little more fan service to set the balance straight again doesn’t hurt. This is essentially what Disney was forced to do with The Rise of Skywalker: It’s essentially just one big apology and retcon for The Last Jedi.
And also, since No Way Home only had three heroes (three Spider-Men) to deal with, it actually had plenty of time to flesh them all out and make them deal with their individual struggles. Much like in Sam Raimi’s Spider-Man 3, it was the villains who remained a little underdeveloped. Because guess what: Throwing too many villains into the same movie will have a similar effect on them as having too many heroes in Civil War, Infinity War, and Endgame.
I mean personally I'd wait to factor a No Way Home video into such a sweeping and inaccurate generalisation at least until the video itself is out
but you do you king
@@PillarofGarbage I only said what it *sounds like* at the moment. I‘m happy to be proven wrong once the video comes out.
It lost the plot with Winter Soldier since with all honesty after that point MCU been really hit and miss. Then they should have done an truly evil Thanos and not the "hmm this makes sense angle" Thanos wanted to kill half of existence because he was gaslit since he was a child by THE concept of death in the Marvel universe to do it. Sometimes the best thing is to let EVIL be EVIL do not redeem them let them be the monster that they are. That's one of MCU's biggest problems.
@@ExeErdna See, I think they could have done the opposite with Thanos: They could have gone full “benevolent world ender” with him - have him aspire to wipe out all sentient life to permanently end all suffering. Especially if he was “gaslit by the concept of death” in the comics. As it stands, Thanos from the movies is literally a half-a**ed villain, no matter from which side you look at him 😂.
What about Marvel Knight Wakanda ? ruclips.net/video/ry8e5ldzLDQ/видео.html&ab_channel=MarvelEntertainment
RUclips Recommended
I have to say, while I personally don't agree with everything here, or dislike, in fact in some stories I may even prefer a more passive or primitive Wakanda (So long as it makes narrative sense and isn't don't for the sake of a white savior plot). I do wish many of those style of adaptations put more care into creating a believable place, where real people live that isn't eternally larping as the Zulu about to learn what a stagard firing line is.
Seeing Wakanda as an actual place, with people living there, with a culture (as generic as the MCUs still was) with a degree of respect of African people as actual intelligent actors that understand the value of modern western technology and ideals, and adopt those that work while maintaining the parts of their own culture where ours wouldn't work, was all a great part of the MCU's version of the state I rather enjoyed.
I just wish depections of Africa were actually more respectful overall. Becuase so many today are A rewriting history to make a poor Africa the whitemen hurt them narrative where it just doesn't exist. Or it will just completely misrepresent African culture as this hemogenus generic thing where they all live in primitive villages yet don't seem to suffer any of the ill effects that actual africans suffer from.
TLDR. MCU's Wakanda is pretty good, not great. A passive Wakanda isn't bad so long as it narratively works. And I wish more works would treat African people as smart soverign actors in their own story, and not as stereotypes larping as Zulus.
You skipped the whole six episode TV series back in 2010. It was a BET series. You discussed the adaptations of Black Panther being and shows not about him and that's why wakanda didn't have agency, but there was a whole TV show strictly about the Black Panther.
From this video’s description:
‘P.S. I missed out the 2010 motion comic series because it isn't so much an original adaptation of the character as it is a direct visualisation of a then-recent limited comic-book series.’
I think people, including you, are missing a big part of why early Marvel made Black Panther and Wakanda in a much more genuinely black way than the blaxploitation that followed, and that's due to the positive accord between Jewish and African Americans, and the fact that this was more of an attempt to make a positive black character instead of a corporate attempt to make a character to sell to African Americans pushed onto the writers
Thank you! The first movie I can forgive, this one I cannot. The fact they outright killed off T'Challa because of something Chadwich Boseman had in the first movie isn't fair. How they exploited his death to sell the movie is why I'm glad it didn't make the money the first one did.
@@ExeErdnarecasting him would've also been exploitative of his death, this movie was a memento to him as a person 🙄
I talked to a guy once who sure had a whole lot of shade for the MCU Black Panther film; should also be noted that he spouted a lot of un-subtle anti-Black prejudice generally (like way more than the baseline level).
I think it was really important to him that he have seemingly legitimate reasons to not like the movie, and I think a lot of people have that feeling. He *wanted* to say "I don't like it because it's a Black movie about Blackness and Black people," but he knew that wouldn't sell as a criticism to be taken seriously, so he had to grasp at straws to sound like he had non racist reasons.
To be clear, there are non-racist criticisms you could make of MCU Black Panther, he just didn't happen to have any good ones.
Honestly th bigget realim you could make th economics and politics make no ense , which , yeah mcu makes no sene in a lot of places i you expect realism. Who did hold tony accountable for his crim, no one. its not that realistic, dah.
Wakanda Forever did everything right except include the Black Man. It's just really sad to hear diversity, only to have it not apply to the Black male comic book fans. On top of that the disrespect towards Chadwick Boseman is horrible. People act like he had one movie role, and T'Challa is so sacred that he can't be seen by any other actor. Just kill the title character off and deal with it.
What do you mean? The black men were in this movie. Fighting, leading, supporting, providing shelter to disaster victims and counsel to their female monarch as she wallowed in negative emotions that nearly started an eternal amphibious war. Did we watch the same movie?
@@thembanitheone He's most likely one that read the comics, T'challa stopped Namor and did right by him as a hero which lead to him being abandoned by other black panthers including his father. That character should have never died that was exploitation by Disney and you know it.
@@ExeErdna Yes, I do know all that I'm a Black Panther reader. But I also don't cry over spilt milk. The MCU is under no obligation to adapt the source material faithfully. Were you upset about Nakia and M'Baku being allies to T'Challa in his movie?
@@thembanitheone Yeah because all aspects of Wakanda are done. Outside of asspulls and the kid in god knows when maybe 2032 if they think this shit show is gonna last that long with how they're just burning through content production at an inhuman rate. All the BP villains are done, Wakanda has no point anymore.
Cappppp
Hey, you’re gonna be losing subscribers no doubt😂😂😂😂
Terrible coverage of potentially great stuff. The problem with most of your points tend to be that you take a line and extrapolate it to connect it to a certain meaning. The context is ignored. You don't care why they would have been written. This is the most deceptive art analysis I've ever seen.
Wakanda has always been considered a powerful country in all the adaptations. The problem was with their lack of an artisitc vision as to how it should look.
Also you're undermining the actual themes because they aren't what you would have wanted. For Earth's Mightiest Heroes in particular, the storyline was about not adhering to tradition for it's own sake and that those traditions should serve the people living today.
Due to them abiding to their old traditions they have given their country over to a regressive with no respect for Wakanda's might and ready to sell it off for momentary gain.
lmao It's funny when people call you a Marvel stan because it's obvious they don't check what else you made on your channel.
But yeah, the MCU may be heavily flawed but Wakanda in this version is really amazing.
Wakanda needs to be revamped, badly. How is Wakanda the most advanced civilization on earth, yet they're still using spears and having trials by combat.
It's not like most Black Panther stories aren't about Wakanda as a nation being stuck on certain traditions.
Heck, look at some real-life countries. For a nation all about "freedom" America really shouldn't be forcing kids to swear their loyalty to the flag every day at school.
I mean those spears are OP as fuck 😅
From somebody that read the comics Wakanda was always a shitty concept. MCU really help it, it was spectical sure people that loved it won't take it away from them. Honestly, I can't! Yet for me as I black man I never saw myself in Black Panther. Yet Wakanda you really can't do it right without that whole aspect of them existing so well yet the world around them went to shit.
The MCU version is the worst and most insulting version of Wakanda I've ever seen. Both BP movies are shit and I'm guessing so will the third one also be shit
Definitely respect your opinion but they definitely got it wrong
How did the MCU get wakanda wrong? Please enlighten us
@@exilestudios9546 read the comics
@@htownboss6422 Well they can't match everything in the comics.
@@exilestudios9546 You know what I'll give you what you want this is supposedly the most tech Advanced country in the world yet they have no defenses inside of wakanda how the f*** are we supposed to believe this is the most tech Advanced country when they have no defenses. Also the wakandans are f****** stupid in the MCU they're still running around using Spears as their most powerful weapons for the ground troops against people that are vastly more powerful than them. Also the fact that they open theirselves to the world that is something that's inaccurate and it has never happened and never will. Also let's not talk about how s***** their military force is in the MCU these are all things that are s*** compared to the comics they got it wrong. And to end it off they got the main character f****** wrong T'challa he's nothing like the Comic version. Wakanda is shit in the mcu.
@@htownboss6422 That's not an argument.
Lore of Adapting Wakanda: MCU vs. Marvel Animation momentum 100