Does Romans 2:6-7 Teach Works Righteousness?
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- Опубликовано: 10 сен 2024
- A popular Roman Catholic Apologist gave this verse to a caller to refute faith alone and defend works based righteousness. Let's take a look at it and figure out what Paul is saying here. Is our salvation works dependent, or are we saved by faith alone?
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Thank you!! I appreciate you really diving into these verses, instead of picking and choosing what you want to hear! I have seen a lot of people on RUclips teach a twisted works based gospel…
"He who PRACTICES RIGHTEOUSNESS is Righteous"
Book of First John.
So should we (those reading) understand your point of view is that on THE RIGHTEOUS can be righteous? That’s what it sounds like. Which kinda leaves all of us out right?
2;7 may refers to those who lived in ancient time
It is clear command! You can't rewrite Gospel !
First John 2:4
If anyone says I have come to know Him but does not keep His Commandments is a liar and the truth is not in him".
So you admitted the truth is Not in you.
Are you reading that verse IN LIGHT of the Gospel?
Romans 2:13 (Paul said by Works) For it is not the hearers of the law who are righteous in God’s sight, but the doers of the law who will be justified.✅
You did read the whole chapter?
Ho would explain when Paul states the doers of the law that will be justified 🤔❓
Keep reading friend. Are there any who are true ”doers”. Also did you watch the whole video?
I sure do appreciate your teaching. Was filling up at an old mountain stream thinking about some catholics that moved into this little hollow. I feel for then just cuz'n everyone is baptists out here & baptist churches down every road. I'm going to share this with them, many thanks
Glad it’s helpful! I”m passionate about the truth and sadly…there are lots out there who have been convinced by “the church” they are good but sadly…are not In Christ. Soli Deo Gloria
@@ClaimingChristianity you do not care about the truth. when confronted with errors in your Greek NT bible you run away.
Ad maiorem Dei gloriam
Unfortunately, saying that there are “ errors “ in the Bible is untrue. Our God is a loving God and wants people of all languages to come to him…
NO VERSE says "by faith alone" !!!
Hmmmm….that’s really just a display of someone who’s never really spent any real time in scripture my friend. Look again. Also…the Bible also doesn’t say “trinity” anywhere. So by your logic hear…we should all assume you don’t believe in the trinity? Correct?
I loosen God his promise for myself, my friends, family, colleagues, neighbours, acquintances, opponents and the body of Christ each will be rewarded according to one's deeds, while loosening myself of every unequal yoke and common share with those who receive wrath and fury, in agreement with romans 2:6-8, 2 corinthians 6:14-15, matthew 6:24, 1 john 3:10 and this whole message in the name and blood of Jesus Christ, amen and hallelujah!
rewarded? for what? being a pagan idolater who does not obey god's 10 commandments?
Great video
Thank you. Soli Deo Gloria
Great video.
Thank you!! Soli Deo Gloria
I believe your faith drives you to good works (or good fruit). There is no doubt that you will be judged by your works. Even Jesus claims this in Matthew 24:36-51. If you don't have good works with your faith, your faith is dead. Is that a saving faith? (James 2:14-17)
As we are all aware, any earthly gifts we receive from another person (Christmas gifts, birthday gifts, wedding gifts etc.) are never earned/merited under any circumstances whatsoever. They are given by the giver out of love for the receiver.
The good news of Jesus Christ is that eternal life is a gift of God. The Apostle Paul wrote, *'For the wages of sin is death, but the GIFT of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.'* (Romans 6:23) Jesus said, *"I am telling you the truth, whoever believes in me has eternal life."* (John 6:47)
We are all sinful and unfit to stand before a righteous and Holy God and therefore deserving of eternal damnation. But God provided a way of escape for us. He graciously provided a Savior, Jesus Christ, to pay the penalty for our sins!
Hallelujah that is worth rejoicing about! Jesus said, *"The time has come, the kingdom of God has come near. Repent and believe the good news!”* (Mark 1:15) Expounding on what is the "good news" that Jesus referred to: The moment you repent of sin and believe in the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of sins you are immediately cleansed of *ALL* your sins by the shed blood of Jesus Christ, which instantly gives you eternal life. *'But if we walk in the light, as He is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanseth us from all sin.'* (1John 1:7) That is a promise from God. At this moment of faith and conversion the Holy Spirit comes to dwell inside you empowering you to do good works unto the Lord. All these works done in faith will contribute to added rewards in heaven for you.
So to summarize: Jesus Christ earned our salvation from sin and eternal life through his finished work on the cross and resurrection from the dead. His sacrifice *purchased* eternal life for us and he offers it to us as a *gift.*
When someone gives you a Christmas gift you receive it by faith. You *KNOW* it is a gift and you don't have to pay the giver for it or work for it. Likewise, a true follower of Christ *KNOWS* that eternal life is a gift from God Almighty and it was worked for and paid for by Jesus Christ himself! He paid for the gift and we receive it by faith!
yes. tell us how the born again christian abortion doctor is going to go to heaven
@@narcissistinjurygiver2932 if you believe that he can not enter heaven you the same can not, even the thief on the cross entered heaven without doing an ounce of good works, you are self righteous and deluded to believe that you on your own are capable of righteousness, the bible states over and over again that righteousness is got by faith.
@@mwe8414 yea, tell me how you do not have to keep the 10 commandments
@@narcissistinjurygiver2932 Galatians 2:16, also if you want to say that you need both faith and works, Romans 11:6, if you need proof of this look at the thief on the cross who couldn't keep the commandments "And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise."
Luke 23:43 KJV
, there are other benefits from following the law as sin is the cause of all pain and suffering in the world, but you can not be justified by keeping the law as all have sinned and all have fallen short of the glory of God, righteousness is a delicate thing to get on your own, to get righteousness via works you would need to be Jesus himself, not like him but literally Jesus. However God gave his son to live the life we couldn't live and die the death we should've died so his wrath may be quenched, place your faith that Jesus's finished work on the cross was enough and the only thing capable of atoning for all of your sins past present and future and you will be saved, Romans 10 9,
@@mwe8414 you are quoting the false apostle paul who taught the opposite of Jesus because you do not believe Jesus. if You believed Jesus then you would never believe Paul's lie about seeing him and being an apostle. If you are not keeping the 10 it proves you never repented.. by your belief the born again christian abortion dr can continue killing babies and it would not be a salvation issue.
You go through a great deal to talk around that verse. OR is it possible that the words just mean exactly what they say? And that the works of the law Paul later refers to are mosaic ceremonial laws like circumcision? And maybe he's saying that the Jewish ceremonial laws won't get you Heaven? But that you still have to strive to be the hands and feet of Jesus…not because you don't want to break the rules but because you love Jesus? Have you tried to read it like that? Doesn't it all just fit together so much better...in a non-contradictory way? That's what the Catholic Church teaches.
You should also look what the early Church taught before 200 AD such as Ignatius of Antioch, Justin Martyr, Tatian the Syrian, Athenagoras of Athens, Theophilus of Antioch, Irenaeus of Lyons, and Tertullian of Carthage. I think you'll find they all agree.
You seemed to ask a bunch of questions that aren’t really questions. I don’t want to make any assumptions and respond to a claim you don’t seem to be making. So that being said…
What is your claim here?
Sorry, I could have written that better. Catholic Answers does a better job of explaining:
"Clearly, there is a sense in which Paul envisions eternal life as a reward for good works. The Greek for “in well-doing” is ergou agathou, which literally translates, “in work good.” The works that Paul has in mind are those of a moral character, since he contrasts it with factious activity and disobedience to the truth, which Paul says is rewarded with “wrath and fury” (v.8). Notice the contrast: eternal life is the reward for good works, wrath and fury are the reward for bad works. Consequently, one may reasonably conclude with the Catholic Church that works play a role in receiving our final salvation at the end of life."
You can read the full article here. www.catholic.com/magazine/online-edition/works-mattered-to-st-paul
Side note, I really do recommend reading a book about the Church Fathers. And also checking out Scott Hahn's conversion story on RUclips.
@@ClaimingChristianity also, I feel like you are trying to find a way to make this statement work for your ideology instead of letting the text state what the most probably explanation, that moral works do play a part in salvation at the end of our lives.
Faith is a gift of grace that moves us toward God. It leads to justification because it leads to Baptism. Faith manifests itself in the lives of believers through obedience, love, and good works.
Thanks for the clarification. Believe it or not I am a student of Roman Catholic theology and church history. So I’ve spent hours and years studying what Rome teaches. One of the biggest trouble with spending to much time with Catholic Apologists such as Scott Hahn, Jimmy Akin, Staples, Horn. Etc is that theologically their hands are tied.
According to Rome and Dogma (not doctrine) they are literally prevented from ever truly reading and studying scripture on their own and interpreting it. So at the end of they day all they can do is repeat what the magisterium has already said you must believe..de fide…by faith.
If they don’t…there excommunicated. So you gotta spend more time in the Papal Bulls encyclicals and church councils to really know the beliefs of Rome.
I appreciate what you say here and almost every conversation with a well meaning Roman Catholic has this same flavor. They say I’m doing “theological gymnastics” while i …likewise say they are doing the same thing.
So round and round we usually go. The difference is that the Basis for my understanding and interpretation of scripture comes from Scripture itself. (Which we both claim is the infallible inerrant word of God). But the basis for Romes claims on scripture is Rome. Not scripture. Which Rome called Sacred Tradition. And although Rome doesn’t admit it…for Rome…tradition and the magisterium are always superior to plain ole scripture.
I truly appreciate your willingness to comment though.
And about your last statement. If I were reading just those verses you’d be right. But we interpret the parts in light of the whole. So keep reading. Paul is extremely clear here who actually has or does ANYTHING good. and the whole of scripture is also abundantly clear about any a”good works” we think we’re performing. (Stained, dirty rags, etc).
I heard a preacher once ask…(if you believe you can loose your salvation…what makes you think you haven’t….how arrogant is that. )
think about that sometime my friend while you contemplate this.
Although there is no official list of mortal and venial sins(which isn’t in the Bible by the way) certainly the greatest commandment would be considered mortal. Because if it is literally the greatest commandment in the Bible breaking it would be a mortal sin. And there have been no humans throughout all eternity that for one minute of their life have ever fully loved the Lord our God with all their heart soul mind and strength. Everything they had. Which essentially put you and I both in a constant state of mortal sin according to Rome. that’s something that may be worth your time to consider.
the problem you christians/catholic face is that you can not claim that your NT bible is inerrant. It is full of errors proving it is not from god. Ad maiorem Dei gloriam
All supposed errors are brought forth by the misunderstanding of man, just because I misunderstood something does not mean it has contradictions
Sorry Steve, while you are correct in that a) All have sinned, and b) we are saved by grace, you are forgetting the Jesus Christ himself stated that actions do matter, even for those who confess Jesus. See Matthew 7:13-27. Words and belief are necessary, but not sufficient. Your fruits, your acts, must be making the effort. Our efforts will not be enough, and our efforts do not save, but without them, we will not merit salvation.
I guess that's where you and I disagree. I don't believe salvation is "meritable". By any means other then the Grace of God through the word of Jesus Christ. It's jot something you merit or earn but something that you that is freely given to you.
@@ClaimingChristianity I'm specifically referencing verses 21-27 "Not everyone who psays to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will qenter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who rdoes the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22 sOn that day tmany will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not uprophesy in your name, and cast out demons vin your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’ 23 tAnd then will I declare to them, ‘I wnever knew you; xdepart from me, yyou workers of lawlessness.’"
This indicates that claiming Christ alone is insufficient, you must follow his teachings.
He then further illustrates his point: "24 z“Everyone then who hears these words of mine and does them will be like aa wise man who built his house on the rock. 25 And the rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew and beat on that house, but it did not fall, because it had been founded on the rock. 26 And everyone who hears these words of mine and does not do them will be like aa foolish man who built his house on the sand. 27 And the rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew and beat against that house, and it fell, and great was the fall of it.”
Christ also says that baptism is required: John 3:5
The resurrection is a free gift to all mankind (1Corinthians 15:20-22), but Salvation requires more. If accepting Christ was alone sufficient, why would he have given the higher law? While none are without sin, not all sins are equal, and neither are all sinners.
James 2 is an excellent discourse over the necessity of actions being required.
You bring up some great responses/questions that deserve a better answer then I can type out here in the comments. So I will do my best to answer some of the in future videos and as for James, there should be an explanation on this passage later this week. This one gets misunderstood A LOT so well try to clear some of that up.
@@ClaimingChristianity Maybe it is misunderstood a lot because it really simply means what it says, as what early Christians understand it to mean before the reformation came. To work out one's salvation simply means obedience to God. One cannot believe and have true faith and not obey.
@@ClaimingChristianity I agree with you that the Bible teaches us that His grace is a gift 🎁 that CAN be freely received through faith. I do not agree that faith is a gift that He only gives to some and not others. I believe He calls all to believe in Him and with the help of the Spirit’s prompting/calling/wooing/drawing..ANYONE CAN come to Him if they obey His “Voice of Truth.” People resist the Holy Spirit. However,we both agree that grace is a gift that is not earned but is attained by belief/faith in the “finished work” of Christ. Amen.
Great video! What denomination do you belong to?
Thanks for watching!! Soli Deo Gloria! I belong to a F.I.R.E. church. (fellowship of reformed evangelicals).
Steve Van Keulen is love to see a Reformed Baptist church in north Texas. It’s all Southern Baptist here.
saved by faith , saved from what ? from the darkness .. saved by the light of the gospel
after being saved from the darkness of satan , we must save from judgment day by doing good works prescribed by God ..
So is it God doing the saving (the work of Christ on the Cross) or are you saying we must save ourselves?
@@ClaimingChristianity do what God prescribes you to do ..
@@luffyjoyboy1534 excellent! The Gospel. That’s exactly what this channel is about.
Placing our trust fully and wholly in the work of a Christ KNOWING that NOTHING we can ever so will in any way add to or subtract from our own salvation.
The “works” are very much secondary and can in no way effect our salvation. For Salvation is OF CHRIST.. amd He will never fail and will always be sufficient 😀. Isn’t that good news.
I’m glad we got that out there. Thanks for the comments.
here is how you refute faith alone."But if you want to enter into life, keep the commandments" (Matthew 19:17)."Now as He was going out on the road, one came running, knelt before Him, and asked Him, 'Good Teacher, what shall I do that I may inherit eternal life?' So Jesus said to him..."You know the commandments" (Mark 10:17,19) and then He listed half of the ten commandments (also in Luke 18:19-20).
you can't just quote a single verse to "refute" anything. You gotta do the work. So if you're gonna proof text with those verses...you need to explain a few things. Such as, author, who the author was, why they were writing, who they were writing to, the context of the passage, what came before and what comes after. Then if your single verse still stands up we can kinda discuss further. But really, if someone is just gonna use single verses to prove their point...they can literally prove any point the human brain can think of . It's an abuse of the text.
@@ClaimingChristianity your whole argument is that you do not have to repent and keep the 10 commandments to enter heaven. so yea I can and did refute your whole lawless religion. Most of you christians can not even list what the 10 commandments are because you don't keep them due to your pagan religion.
@@narcissistinjurygiver2932 was that my whole argument? Actually was that my argument at all? 🤔 It seems to me like you dont understand and my argument (or just didn't really pay attention) , so you made up your own argument and then defeated that.
@@ClaimingChristianity if you kept the 10 you could not be a christian. non compliant religion
@@narcissistinjurygiver2932 what is it that you believe Mr. Hienn? (I ask honestly)
Amen.
Halleluja 🙌
Great Video
Thank you for watching!! Soli Deo Gloria