Should Charter Schools Be Allowed to Push Out Difficult Kids?
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- Опубликовано: 8 июн 2024
- Do charter schools-publicly funded schools that are freed from many state-and-local regulations-routinely push out difficult kids? Does this undermine their overall mission and purpose? Or is it a legitimate way to ensure a better education for more students?
In October, The New York Times broke the story that a principal at Success Academy, which is New York City's largest and most successful charter network, targeted a group of students to be pushed out of his school, maintaining a so-called Got-to-Go list. Success Academy's founder and CEO, Eva Moskowitz, responded that the episode was a one-time mistake. As soon as the Got-to-Go list came to her attention, Moskowitz says, she put a stop to the practice and disciplined the principal.
Last week, a group of parents filed a civil rights complaint with the U.S. Department of Education, accusing the school of edging out students with disabilities and denying them accommodations. Moskowitz disputed the charges, stating that Success only suspends students when they engage in violent behavior.
But let's say the allegations are broadly true-that the Success network does suspend kids with the intention of getting the most difficult or hard-to-serve to go back to the traditional public school system. What's wrong with this practice?
"I have no problem at all with charters functioning as a poor man's private school," says Robert Pondiscio, who's a vice president at the education think tank the Thomas B. Fordham Institute, who adds that private schools boot kids all the time. "Are we saying that if you're a poor black or brown kid, it's a problem that you should have a disruption-free, studious, high-quality school? Why is that unfair?"
For more on Pondiscio's take on the Got-to-Go controversy, read his November 6 story in U.S. News & World Report, "Uncomfortable Questions."
For the past several years, Reason has been a media sponsor of National School Choice Week, which seeks to raise public awareness about the need to give kids and parents more options when it comes to K-12 education. National School Choice Week 2016, which is held from January 24-30, features over 16,000 events in all 50 states. Click here to read more.
Produced, shot, and edited by Jim Epstein. Interview by Nick Gillespie. Additional camera by Joshua Swain.
About 9:30 long.
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I broadly agree that kids that are disruptive should not be allowed to impact the learning environment of others. If they can't get along, get 'em out.
I also think that brighter students shouldn't have to put up with a depressed learning environment catering to the lowest common denominator.
Plus sociologists did experiments and putting good and bad kids together won't result in bad kids learning to behave, it results in bad kids corrupting the good ones.
But they skew the data of just how "successful" they are. The kids that are expelled are still entitled to an education so they are sent to a public school and lower the public school scores. And they get to keep the funding for the student they are kicking out for the whole year.
magottyk yes ! But what about great behavior and below leveled because of disabilities ?
magottyk and if the brighter student matter more they should divide the special education ! And it should just be A GIFTED AND TALENTED SCHOOL ! Every kid deservesssss ! A good education
Homeschooled children's parents should not have to pay tax for other peoples children to be schooled.
I just worked as a teacher in a charter school where kids weren't kick out or even punished by the admin. As a result kids did not allow learning for everyone else. Many teachers quit mid year. The issue is that the whole class is sacrificed for 7 kids that won't and don't want to learn anyways.
All kids want to learn. But school isn’t about obtaining knowledge. It’s about training the next generation of compliant labor.
If you do not educate a puppy to relieve himself where he should, in the end you have a dog that soils the whole house with his feces, the same with children, education implies discipline, and that means rewarding his good behavior and punishing bad behavior, not punishing bad behavior simply signals to children that there is no real discipline. For the record, I am 49 years old and when I was in elementary school the teachers had complete authority to punish rioters on the spot in whatever way they saw fit.
@@FirstNameLastName-wt5to no, and yes.
@@FirstNameLastName-wt5to You have no idea what you are talking about. Of course some kids don't want to learn. Just like adults.
@@glennwatson3313 Children are programmed to learn. Human beings are born with almost no instinctual knowledge. We learn everything from other humans. Children naturally desire to learn. When children are disruptive in school, it’s because their needs aren’t being met. Schools are a one size fits all situation that fails to recognize human diversity.
Disruptive children were expelled from public school when I went to school 30 years ago. Teach the ones who want to learn.
As a teacher it is impossible to suspend a violent and vulgar child.
You were not leagally required to go to school 30 years ago, now they are obligated take in all of them even the ones who don't want to be there.
Abandoning young children because their parents failed them would disrupt the social fabric of society and create a worse situation of incapable bums who leech off the government than we already have. The answer isn’t “leave behind those who struggle to keep up.” The answer is to identify the reasons they are struggling to keep up and work on fixing them so that they can be functioning members of society as opposed to what uneducated, unskilled members tend towards which is crime and government benefits.
@@agonicole yet, there's still plenty of good students getting suspended / expelled for doing something minor because of 0 tolerance policies.
@@Matt1Mahoney if that where true we would have imploded when it was easy to expel kids. The social fabric has been disrupted and is currently being turned into tatters by forced schooling, alienation of parent/child relationships via the government schools and society being encouraged to shun the nuclear family, not to mention social engineering that promotes a moral-less society.
Simple math below:
Option 1 : 1 student gets disproportionately more attention taking time away from 19
Option 2: 19 students all get 1/20 attention equally while the 1 disruptive student (who needs more attention) goes elsewhere where they can receive the behavior and special needs addressed
US Army solution: Overactive Basic and AIT students gets corrective PT while other students proceed normally. Naturally violent and disruptive recruits are recognized for their unique individualism and desirable talents and provided with a helpful fast-track into an exciting career as 11B frontline infantry.
@@DrCruel to be fair, a good chunk of the time in basic, it’s gonna be the whole group or a good chunk of it getting some corrective PT for one guy’s screw up. But otherwise, your logic is sound.
@@bellowingsilence Basic is a beatdown. If there's a disruptive tool who wants to take the blame for it, all the better.
At the beginning of my AIT, they had a sign-in sheet for those who didn't think they had what it takes to be a computer technician. It was for combat infantry AIT. The instructors told us not to worry about passing the computer tech program, because if we didn't make it they had plenty of open slots for combat infantry school, and that we were going to fulfill the time on our contracts no matter what.
Regardless of if it is a public, private, or charter school. If a student is disruptive then they should be subject to being expelled. Parents should be held more accountable for how their children behave out of the house.
I agree.
+Kyle P
Absolutely right.
+Kyle P Statist Logic 101: Every student should be forced to accommodate and participate at the same level as the least performing kid so that he/she doesn't feel sad.
Most children who engage in disruptive behavior today no more fear their parents than the Man on the Moon. They all have Social Services' CPS hotline number on speed dial in their phones.
The school probably fears a loss of funds, even though they can certainly find a more grateful, cooperative replacement. See? It's public school all over again.
Kids who do not care about learning hold everyone back.
If they do not want to be there, the parents should be the one to discipline them to make them behave before they come back.
*****
I did.
+TickedOff Very true, except we have no real tool to hold parents accountable. Teachers make great scapegoats.
+Emily Pepin I teach many of them.
Emily, the ones who have sense? Even if they don't want to go to school, that's no excuse for being disruptive.
Disruption is a symptom as much as it is a problem
Go to a public school and see the result of neither expelling disruptive students or holding no financial incentive to help them. To put it mildly, I've had entire days of school lost in public school because of that one disruptive kid. Some kids don't feel safe at schools because of the amount of fighting and drug use around school.
I personally dont mind the drugs and vapes
Home school co op or Sudbury schools
Difficult kids should have their own school.
They do.vice did a story on one. The kids are animals and truly one step away from prison
@@Maria.9094 wow! Do you remember what video it was I would love to see it.
@@Maria.9094 And most likely grew up in a single parent household. I would like to see the stats for that.
public schools must go... Charter schools should be the new public schools. It turns out when you let schools compete for state dollars, they'll want to educate their kids better
The government needs to completely get out of the school business.
If the government were in charge of making cars, there would be a single model of a single color that would cost its weight in gold, would consume 1 gallon of gasoline per kilometer, and would be decomposed 6 days out of 7, at the same time the government would prohibit the sale of imported cars. The bureaucratic mentality does not understand anything about productivity, efficiency or improvement, the bureaucrat is hired to be a cog in the machinery, the cogs are not supposed to think, they are there to take a place in the machinery regardless of whether the machinery works for him. purpose for him was made or if he does it well.
I'm a Bernie voter and completely I agree. Leftist ideology is great for climate change, etc., but it hasn't worked in the public schools. Education is a place where typically the Right, the "Old School" knows what to do, not leftists.
I grew up in poor Jamaica and in our poor public schools kids were not allowed to be rude and disruptive. Even in our public schools disruptive kids that didn't want to learn were expelled.
when I was in school (not the US) there where two types of classes, the learners and the troublemakers, the learners were given a quite class that they could study in and the troublemakers were given more help. that way both get the best education for their condition.
Well, I am from Venezuela, my father was a teacher for almost 40 years, more than once he proceeded to advise beginning teachers, he always told them to maintain discipline in class and if any of the students showed rebellion, they would first speak directly with him. If he persisted in his behavior then disciplinary measures should be applied on the spot, I am the first of a brood of 6 children, my father knew how to impose discipline and the times I played the rebellious child he put me in my place, I hated him back then, but over time I realize he did the right thing to correct the spoiled brat that I was.
I find it funny how they talk about the 'difficult' kids who are kicked out and say its wrong. But never ask why they were kicked out.
At the charter school where I worked, my colleague would single out one kid in his class to expel at the beginning of each year to "scare" the other students into good behavior. It worked, he won Teacher of the Year. We would expel a handful of kids every year for various violations, fighting and drugs mostly. It worked. The school won awards for academic excellence. In fact, we didn't really have a Special Ed program, just one Ed Specialist for hundreds of students.
my local public high school moved two of my friends from 10th grade to twelfth to get them out of there, even though they both had shit grades.
Lol
How many times did they fail? Were they 18 at the time they moved them up to 12th grade?
If a student is disruptive, regardless of age; they should be suspended to expelled permanently.
+hag12100 haha :) the idea of compulsory education has turned out to be compulsory TEACHING for teachers.
Where do they go? What is their place in society? Who supports them? Will they just go to a quiet corner and curl up and die? Of course not. In expelling them, the consequence to society is greater than finding productive methods of teaching them.
yes, disruptions is one thing that retards the whole classroom. No, if it is merely a way to get rid of lower performing non-cream kids. Doesn't sound like this is actually happening.
They have alternative charter schools for children with behavioral problems in DC. These school have therapists and specialized learning plans and teachers to accommodate them. Let kids who want to behave learn in peace.
Disruptive and difficult kids are usually a result of bad parenting. They should be kicked out to send a message to the parents.
While I agree some parents just don't fucking get it. They'll just go somewhere else change nothing untill they run out of places that will accept their shithead child.
YES, next.
There is a difference between hard to teach and impossible to teach, and schools need to be allowed to throw out the impossible to teach children because they WILL harm their peer's ability to learn.
What metric determines “impossible to teach?” Who decides? How does one differentiate between poor teaching, poor home life, and “impossible to teach” children? Are mentally challenged people “impossible to teach?” What happens to those people? Where do they go? What is there future place in society?
@@Matt1Mahoney Unfortunately, there is no simple metric, it is a complex phenomenon. The best people to decide are those closest to the problem, so the student's teaches and the staff at the school, not state or federal level bureaucrats who only care about the number of students graduated. You don't differentiate because they are all contributing factors. A school with poor teachers isn't improved by trying to teach children it isn't equipped to handle. Better to turn out a few students that can go somewhere in life than allow a handful of extreme delinquents to prevent ANYONE from succeeding. Mentally challenged people are not impossible to teach, but they do require special attention and a different curriculum. They need to be sent to schools that have the staff and facilities to give them the skills they need to achieve the highest quality of life possible. The best way to pay for such things is debatable. As far as people who are actually impossible to teach, some of them might find a way to turn their lives around, but the sad truth of the universe is, you can't save everybody.
@@OmegaTou I agree that approaching the problem on an school by school, student by student basis is a productive solution. I think the issue is less about students and their “teachability” and more about the lack of meritocracy within the U.S. Public School system. Tenure can disincentivize great teaching and pay based on seniority rather than performance is foolish. We can’t save everyone, however trying is better than shunning. Shunning those deemed “unteachable” without exploring unconventional teaching methods that may better fit their needs is foolish and the economic burden on society will be worse in the long run if we simply kick them to the curb. I’m a proponent of separate classes for these students depending on the severity of their behavioral issues among other issues, that is what my high school had and some students were able to be integrated back into normal classes and those who weren’t were still better off. Also to simply weed out bad apples creates an unrealistic expectation in students’ minds of the real world. They will have to learn to deal with shitty, disruptive people in life. To avoid this truth in the formative years only leaves them ill equipped to face it in the real world.
When I went to school (40+ year ago) there were 600 schools for problem students. They went to school , small classrooms and it kept them from failing out or making regular classrooms a problem for kids that didn’t disrupt the whole class. But now everything is to mainline kids regardless of the problems a kid has, this hurts everyone. Why can’t there be special schools for these kids. The schools get plenty of money even though all you hear from the unions is we need more money.
Imagine taking a test and cutting out all the questions that give you trouble then having the gall to tell everyone you're not incompetent at what you do.
problem kids are in the minority, so if they are disruptive then they should go
me where I go to school it has been nothing but peace limited fights less drug incidents we basically kicked out all of the students who ruin education for others and progressive discipline has been a success we decided not to allow them in any school
Yes. My daughter taught in a charter school in Gary, IN. She had just started and after a couple of months a couple of the kids got into it, one of them unzipped and urinated in her garbage can, the other smashed the door into her head. She sent them in for discipline, they told her they couldn't do anything g to them that they had to do 10 step program before they got rid of the kids, so none of the troublemakers were ever kicked out. Their answer to her was to take a couple of mental health days. She was afraid for her safety and never went back. Yes 2 chances and kick them out.
I have no kids how about letting me opt out paying taxes tied to schools? But yes nuisance kids should be sent back to public schools.
+AKlover
You can opt out of paying for taxes tied to schools if everyone else can opt out paying for taxes that pay police that would investigate a crime committed against you. And you aren't allowed to drive on highways. And firefighters wouldn't come to your house if your house is on fire. And you don't get to eat food that has been inspected. And you can drink water that comes from the Flint River.
AKlover
I like some libertarianism since they are against war and don't take sides in this farce of republicans vs democrats. But this channel's position on education is archaic. It wants to return education to the 1800s, where poor children don't go to school and the rich receive private tutors.
I think I understand your utopia: 'If you have money, you are fine. If you don't, go fuck yourself.' If you want to live under a government let by Pinochet, go for it. But don't pretend you have an ethical bone in your body.
+dahlberg31 So you want a thug with a gun to redistribute someone else's money and production to subsidize you? The system as it is is completely broken. Not all of us want to subsidize glorified daycare and future felon warehousing. Same way we do not want to fund those who feed at the public trough be they teachers, non-profit leeches, defense contractors, welfare rats, or cops.
And you want the rich to have the guns and force people to become slaves in factories in order to make them even wealthier.
And the system is not "completely broken." Go to Iraq. Go to Syria. Those places are completely broken. If you want to go live in a place with low taxes and no regulations, go to China at an Apple factory. That's the future that you are advocating.
People who say that the system is broken are completely unaware of human history. We are living in a small slice of civilization that has had more freedom and security than at any other time. It'll dissipate soon enough. Entropy always wins in the end.
Abba Okoro
Wow, you'd be the first that thought China had too high of wages and labor rights. Seriously. I'm impressed. I think you'd be too villainous to be allowed even in a Dickens novel.
And you're right. How could I forget Saddam Hussein and his health care for all Iraqis, all workers work a 35 hour work week, with 6 weeks guaranteed paid vacation, students were free to speak out against their government's foreign policy, oil production was heavily taxed in order to provide free primary and secondary education for all children, women had complete legal equality with their male counterparts. Thanks for correcting me on that error. I always forget Saddam Hussein had the same outlook as Bernie Sanders.
Thank god for brilliant minds like you calling bull shit on us idiots. It's apparent you know the world extremely well.
*It's complicated = yes!!!!*
Just Me he not denying that
Yes. 1. It puts pressure on lazy parents to be responsible parents towards their child’s behavior (1/2 of naughty behavior causes). It also puts pressure on the older child to see, “O maybe I do have to behave to go to a nice school). *Most behavior can be self-controlled no matter it’s origin. Self-control is a learned behavior. Lack of consequences is a lack of teaching self-control.
2. Charter schools are limited in resources so behavior standards are more strict.
3. Charter schools have higher behavior standards (usually) than public school, which is the draw for most families.
4. Charter school is an option. Not an entitlement.
Signed,
Mom of 5 kids who had kids in both types of school systems and both types of kids behavior wise.
Moskowitz's book makes pretty clear what happened, and she shared it all with the journalists who broke this story, but they totally ignored it all. There were some real hatchet journalists in NYC who were just determined to attack charters, and specifically Success and Moskowitz. A lot of them are totally cringeworthy. No matter what statistics you show these people and the unions, they just continue their attack.
I went to public school near the Elyton Projects in B'ham. I wish that school had a "got to go" list....lol. Some kids don't want to be educated. Let their moms deal with it.
Unfortunately it's the only way to give the majority of children the best education possible. These same kids are usually the ones "bullying" the other kids when the adults arent around. Once again time for more vocational schools and "bootcamps" for the kids who refuse to behave. Im also in favor of giving any teenager who doesnt like here a plane ticket and some cash in exchange for his/her citizenship.
Is it fair for 20 high achieving children be held back by 1 problem child?
They don't weed too many out after they have been accepted - those kids for the most part do not get in. Any teacher or school can have success if they can choose their students. What is unfair is that public schools and charter / private schools are in competition but yet they operate under a different set of rules.
entry is via lottery, the do not choose kids. Their entrance process cherry picks parents not the kids
This is not about Income , this is about Kids with the same focus being grouped together , a violent youth with extreme social issues does not need to be allowed to damage the education of another child !
Also, get rid of inclusion. No regular education student should have special education students in the classroom. This takes away from kids who are ready and capable of learning. If your kid needs special academic (learning/behaviorally) not disability services (wheelchair/braille) they need a different setting. Putting them with regular ed students only increases resentment/bullying because the entire class has to wait on the slower kid. Or because they are constantly being interrupted by the screaming kid with autism.
America's public school system needs to be fixed.
When I was in school, the disruptive kids would invariably meet “the board of education”, and if that didn’t solve the problem, THEN they were expelled. Maybe we need to re-instate corporal punishment to maintain order.
Kids who are not learning can fix their issues between guardians and learning facilitator and be learning in their home, online or send them to military school. In public schools, kids gotten kick out for not complying.
Untaught children become very angry adults, still affect the social system in too many ways. Every child has, even the ‘gifted,’ so many fears and anxieties that we as educators gloss over. Class size, curricular mandates, even social norms affect our teacher efficacy. Why are schools still so large?
Just like a hotel, shop and any other private enterprise can decide which customers they serve, charter schools should get to choose who they decide to serve.
Forcing a charter school to school a certain kid is as much as a attack on their freedom as much as forcing any person to make friends with people they dislike.
You have two choices. Spend resources on the best or spend resources on the worst. The real question is which is best for society as a whole?
Yes because they're impeding efficiency. I wouldn't want my child's class to be dragged behind by one or two non-performers. Like every parent, I want the best future for my child. So if it's impeded in the name of political correctness, the whole future of my child, I'd dump that correctness and make sure he has the best chance to succeed and compete against sharks out there.
It's no wonder public schools don't like charters. Charters absorb the local high achievers, and public schools have to take everyone else.
If a kid is disrupting class then obviously that's not the right school for him!
I grew up in private school with children coming from different social groups and always wonder why US public schools separate children that they think won't be successful from those potentially seen as highly achievers. Children don't go to school because they are smart; they go because they need to learn.
Children do not only learn from the teachers; they also learn from one another.
Some children were passing with high scores on June, others needed to repeat their exams on July and some were even re-taking the finals on August. At the end, most people were passing to the next grade by the exception of one or two. Those who did not passed at the end, were so embarrassed that they would put their best effort on doing better.
I also heard that Devois is very concerned about sexual abuse, teachings that do not help to grow moral character, besides under-performance and violence. She seems to see no hope on public education the way it's going.
The only problem I see is that she has no real solutions for public education. Her solution sounds more like a migration. This worries me.
In a class, the problem is not slow learners but the troublemakers. A couple of troublemakers can heavily affect all others. How can you sacrifice the future of a whole class of students for just keeping a few in the same room?
Where the troublemakers go? Special school with military displine.
Your private school also separated kids. They were presorted based on the ability to pay.
If parents have not taught their child to respect teachers and the educational setting then let the parents educate the child and have the State set-up an online learning program for the child. If the child cannot complete the online work, at least they are not disturbing the children in schools whose families have taught respect for academics.
Reminds me of John Amos Comenius, "the father of modern education".
He proposed to divide pupils into six categories (he lived 1592 - 1670).
1. Smart and willing to work
2. Smart and lazy
3. Smart and defiant
4. "not-smart" and willing to work
5. "not-smart" and lazy
6. "not-smart" and defiant
Given our obsession with status, even dividing them by "study attitude" would be considered problematic -_-
Many charter schools do not take special ed, ESL, homeless students or students with home life issues.
if we are talking about kids that have trouble learning then its a problem. if we are talking about kids that are violent or break rules all the time, tag the building, deal drugs in the school ect. then kicking them out makes perfect sense. You can not allow children in your school that endanger others or make it harder for good kids to learn.
It sounds hard but that place the disrupting kid is taking, could be taken by a kid that really wants to learn
There should be an alternative for low income families with these kind of kids tough, they need more specialized education
Yes. Parents who haven't done the work of disciplining their children should not be aloud to push them off on the school system
They don’t push out difficult kids, they push out badly behaving kids.
The state should offer these children funds for family counseling, neurofeedback, tutoring etc so that charter and private schools don't have to absorb the extra costs of dealing with problem students. If the interventions don't help, then the child could be moved to special education.
Definitely if students who persist in antisocial behavior and disinterest in studying should be expelled, not doing so harms all the other students, when I was students there were always some classmates who definitely should not attend school because they were unable to relate civilly With others, the few times that I had problems at school, my parents let me know clearly and forcefully that they would not tolerate bad behavior on my part inside or outside the home, much less at school.
A refreshingly clear-eyed and balanced view of the subject, or indeed any subject!
The issue comes when a charter does push a kid out, that kid goes to public school and it is now the public schools problem. The issue is if a kid is expelled from a public school. the kid goes to another public school. If you have bad parents, you have bad kids.
In a free market economy there is a place for everyone. For example, I have seen homeschool co-ops in our area blossom around neurodivergent children. This is a good thing since some children are not wired to have the ability to sit and focus for many hours at a time. The real issue is to educate parents to what options will work best for their children and to also prioritize education and family values. We also need a state that supports parental freedom to do as they see fit for their kids.
"If you put one good apple in a barrel full of rotten, stinking, worm-infested apples, all the bad apples will turn good. That's just how it works,..... we presuppose."
---- Typical Public Education Administrator
My answer is yes!!! Schools should also be able to discipline children. Parents should be sending children to school with the foresight that they will be disciplined and their values reinforced. If you can't discipline you're own child, what makes you think school staff will be able to do that.
Disruptive kids should not be able to interfere with the other students education, deprive them of it because they don't want to behave, and lets facet it, no one can make them behave these days, at home or at school.
Not just about choice but also competition.
and behavior.
Nobody talking about how the parents should raise their kids better not the states or the schools...
The chronically disruptive students should all be put in seperate alternative schools (or at minimum seperate classes) specially made just for them. Assuming that free will exists,if they choose to behave for half a year, they can get promoted back to the regular classes. If it doesn't and they're predestined to act up no matter what, then too bad I guess.
No one should spent time on a few students who can’t keep ip
Those who want to learn cannot be sacrificed because some children cause education havoc.
The public schools will gladly accept these problem students
For the record, Success Charter Schools also works with IEPs and many do well.
Yes, if it's a behavior problem.
this guy seems all over the place like he doesn't want to give just one answer. I went to charter school and we did have a handful of kids who were expelled for breaking the rules and being disruptive. it wasn't the best school academic wise but compared to the nearby public school that had gangs and stabbings it was a lot safer. students who were disruptive but not so much to warrant expulsion were sent to the "dumb classes" the work was easier just to pass the kids through high school.
Public schools do this all the time, so they have no place to talk. Maybe bring them back to the school after some counseling. No kid has to deal with another's bullshit.
It's the boy who always suffer from this.
Depends on the offence. If one could be expelled in a public school then they can be expelled in a charter school.
If the charter school wasn't publicly funded then no doubt they could pick and choose who stays and who goes
Simple answer: yes, for repeated and severe behavioral problems, on one condition... normal public schools can do the same.
I substituted at Whitney Elementary School in Memphis, TN. It was a very bad experience; not because of the precious children but the staff. All the staff including the prinicipal and assistant principlal screams at the children. In my opinion there is no teaching and nurturing going on. There is bullying, screaming, hostility, and creating fear, rage and failures.
The simple answer is “yes, chuck them out”. The way to punish incompetent parents is to rescind their free daycare and force them to homeschool. If the parents cannot homeschool for whatever reason then assign these rotten kids to the county school for disturbed kids like they have here in Cuyahoga County [Cleveland, OH] known as PEP. Kids in this county get sent to PEP for getting caught with guns in school, for stabbing other kids with sharpened pencils, and for general spasticity and disruptive behavior, especially in the suburbs where they won’t put up with that crap. It is in the inner city general high schools used as dumping grounds for the depraved that it really gets out of hand because the administrators get so blaze that they can’t even be bothered to refer the real assholes to PEP. They just check where they currently live to see if they’ve been apartment hopping to dodge out on the rent and then transfer them to another building if they no longer live in that school’s geographical zone. I’ve also had homicide cops show up to check my attendance records to see if one of my animal boys looks good for an unsolved murder in the projects or wherever.
That last bit where Robert says "I could have gotten more down if I didn't have to cater to those 3-4 kids..." means you kind of lied about the desire to push disruptive kids.
Better question is, should kids be allowed to have a good/focused education.
You know the rules beforehand so you can't blame the system if you can't behave. If you can't follow rules in school, good luck with life. It's better you learn discipline now than in prison.
I went to Charter School. After I was kicked out of private school. When I enrolled I signed a document stating that I chose to be there and would follow the rules. I made it two years and was then kicked out. However, best damn choice I ever made was going to a Charter School. I would never have gone to college, end of story.
There needs to be a secondary step. Have a charity or something that does mentoring for children. if they can’t straighten up or improve in a certain time frame. Then send them to regular public school.
Well, we just experienced what happens when you reward terrible behavior in school. A six year old shoots his teacher after dozens of red flags go up for months and even on the day of the shooting. Now every child in that classroom will be diagnosed with PTSD as some point. Many will turn to drugs and alcohol to deal with what they experienced that day as they grow older. Some may commit suicide to deal with it. All because the administrators bought into rewarding bad behavior thinking it would change children's behavior. Yes, the disruptive students need to be removed from the classroom, period.
He admits in so many words at the very end that Success manages those students who don't sync with the school tone well. How do they do that? Well that's a great question.
break it down and switch it to a similar situation in a different location. Let's say you decide to go out for a meal to a nice restaurant. You are paying for the nice atmosphere, food and service. If halfway through your meal another table gets loud and boisterous and starts throwing their food all over the place is it wrong for the restaurant staff to kick that table out?
if a "Government Controlled Public School" can kick a kid out of school then why cant Charter schools? Teach your kids School is there Job, work your ass off to do better than everyone else and if the kid thinks school is for play and not work then boot his or her ass out.
It' not a kid's fault if they have autism or ADHD, or any of the behavioral disorders. Byt if they're failing to thrive at this type of school, then they need a different type of school. I did horribly in public school but became a straight A student in a small private school with more individual attention and teachers who were skilled at teaching kids like me. My little cousins are going through that right now. We need to make it easier for people to choose their school, and to homeschool.
Even if they are - why should kids that have the drive and ability to succeed be held to the lowest denominator?
This is nice in principle but the problem is that with taxes, all parents ( and non parents) pay tax money for these schools, even with a vouture program there is other people's money at play
Everyone pays for paving of streets even if they don’t drive on them. Everyone plays for upkeep of public parks even if they don’t use them. What’s your point?
Public schools could improve themselves overnight if they set several schools aside as discipline schools for students with behavioral problems. This would improve the regular schools for the good kids. The primary purpose of the discipline schools should be to rehabilitate the students until they are safe to return to the regular schools.
Of course, you need push out bad kids. Every child should have the opportunity to learn. Disruptive children should be placed in alternative programs/virtual programs to ensure that students who want to learn can and teachers can actually teach.
Should Charter Schools Be Allowed to Push Out Difficult Kids? YES
Some people believe in choice until it butts up against their ideology 🤔
Start at 5:04. Dianne Rather said that "Public schools are suppose to work for all kids." Why is it fair to disrupt a whole class because one kid is disruptive? It is not. Because of people like Ms. Rather, public schools are not working for any kids...one man's opinion.
If you are a SJW and think black lives matter, provide better schools for minorities. Check out RUclipss on Success Charter Schools. I recently read that the average SAT score for one class was 2400...average. She said the lowest was 1100. They are teaching a lot of kids who would live in poverty if not for Dr. Eva.
Yes they should be expelled, this is one way to teach someone to take reasonability for their actions. Beside isn't this what colleges and universities do. They just do more of it it upfront.
this is an insult to the Ivy leage that provers poor kids can get good grades with good teachers. if kids don't like school to begin with why go to a charter school the idea is to give more opportunity to children who like school or at least take it seriously.
"the vast unwashed" hahahaha
How about schools should only ppl who pay. No welfare kids . Responsible parents are sick of their taxes going up while these ppl never pay. I know it's not the kids fault but it's not the responsible ppls fault either
at my school where I go to progressive discipline has worked for most people it has to be run by the correct administrators and teachers contracts need to be adopted and consequences for misbehavior
they get to select students to let in, they should only get one bite at the selection apple. if a child is acting out they should have to deal with it just like a public school, if that means expulsion suspension etc then so be it.
A. 2:26 - 3:41 , 4:35 - 5:05 , 8:44 - 9:20
B. 5:21 - 5:27 , 6:26 - 6:35
I'm a little confused aren't charter schools required to accommodate for IEP students since they categorize as a type of public school?
Yes but if a kid is a danger to the other students. It isnt reasonable to keep them. Because other child's safety shouldn't be jeopardized for one child.
More choice and more free markets mean more different solutions for "difficult" kids and their parents in achieving educational and/or occupational success. Furthermore veers away from the current statist induced notion that you need at least an Univeristy degree to flip burgers at McDonalds.