@@frogmouth There are definitely fads of using less or more vibrato, but using a wobbly or caprino vibrato have never been standard practice that we know of!
It's a pity that the great art of singing has sadly mostly vanished. Nowadays people think that the more of a wobble a voice has the more dramatic it is. Its just a tragedy. Without microphones those voices dont carry at all.
@EllyLyn_operasinger " You don't hear the great operas like Dinaorah any more. There just arent singers who can do them. The art of singing is in rapid decline. ' from a old book from the early 1900's . They were saying the same things then ( and at all other times. Reports of the demise.of opera have been slightly exaggerated. )
Ma io credo. Che. Il Bel canto non. Morirà mai ❤ io l amo. Mi piace cantare. Ma ormai è tardi per me.Ho. Cantato. In Chiesa. Per 3 anni. Sono passati 8 anni.😂. Buona serata
In the early days of modern music, vibrato was considered to be just another ornament, both for the voice and on the violin. It was therefore only applied to certain notes for expressive purposes. Later, it went from being intentional to systematic and, for some singers, beyond their vocal control. I will always appreciate more musicians who are able to control and vary this ornament according to the expressiveness of the music, than those who apply vibrato in automatic mode.
Muscularly, it is considered semi-reflexive if trained properly. It is like blinking which happens automatically, but you can also control when and how fast you do it.
But if you slow down Nilsson's vibrato of course it will sound wider because it is slower. I don't see how that makes any point. That is part of the problem the vibrato can slow down with age. Or some singers creates an artificial vibrato by vibrating the mouth and tongue, where they can do all types of stange things. Part of the reason why "dramatic sopranos and tenors" these days often have wide and slow vibratos is because they over push their middle voices to sound more dramatic, because they are not real dramatic singers with big voices.
Thanks for your comment! The point of slowing down the vibrato is that when you listen to Birgit Nilsson at face value, her vibrato doesn't sound wide. This makes it easy to assume that vibrato SHOULDN'T be wide, when in fact, vibrato should be VERY wide. It just shouldn't SOUND wide. And it is true that singing the wrong rep, or pushing your voice can exacerbate vibrato issues. But most people don't realize that the vibrato issues already existed for most singers long before they started pushing the wrong rep. Just because the vibrato issues are small when a singer is young, doesn't mean that they have a healthy vibrato. Vibrato slows down with age NOT because a singer is getting older, but because they have been singing with a faulty vibrato for a longer amount of time. If you sing with a healthy vibrato, the vibrato won't slow down when you age! You just have to keep training it effectively. I hope this helps!
........and it's a problem of our time that you mustn't get older! We stay all healthy, energetic etc. and sing like young best singers up to the age of 150!......... of course it is NOT only the wrong technique, when voices change.
@@milaschneider9128 🤣That would be lovely, wouldn't it?! Someone told me this week that voices decline by the early 30's. I think that is the issue. We obviously won't make it to 150, but I'd like to keep singing well into my 60's! That's what a healthy technique can do 🤩
Why should a vibrato become "wider" when slowed down? Slowed-down you hear the actual extent better when your ears aren't trained well and you cannot catch it at normal speed. That seems to be the case with you. Slow vibrato is musically useless, because music moves in rapid angular steps from one note to another, and the contrast between a held note, a stepwise change, and a trill or other ornament must be brought over clearly. Only a very fast,very narrow vibrato is acceptable, none at all is better. The only "advantage" of a wide vibrato is that at some point, nobody will notice when you sing flat or sharp, because it sounds unmusical and jarring all the time.
@@truesoundchris Thanks for the comment! It doesn't "become" wider. Like you said, it just sounds wider because you can hear it differently. I'm curious if you think that Birgit Nilsson's vibrato is acceptable to your standards? Thanks!
Thanks for this. It is overdue. Terrible vibrato is my constant complaint, especially against today's singers. Whether the vibrato is too wide and slow or too fast and veering sharp, the tone does not zero in on the pitch. It is bad enough when one is aware of what the note should be, but, in unfamiliar music, the ear is baffled by too much noise around the pitch. It constitutes musical failure, and, along with other elements of poor tone production, hammy acting, inappropriate casting, and way too much post-modern staging, it is killing opera.
Thanks for watching and for adding your comment! I'm so glad you're here. The breath is a HUGE part, but there is much more to it than that. There are a dozen different tensions that can slow down and disrupt the vibrato, and if the correct action isn't taught from the beginning, it doesn't matter what you do with your breathing, the vibrato can still end up accenting in the wrong place, or getting inverted. There are also the registration muscles which, if left underdeveloped can also hinder the proper vibrato action.
Yes, true true true. Every single time that Joan Sutherland was asked in interview, how do you do it? She said EXACTLY THE SAME! But people don't listen. And a singing teacher who doesn't/can't teach basics of breathing is like a junior school teacher who doesn't/can't teach students how to read.
Good singing has no consciously perceptible vibrato, just the quick fluttering that indeed happens naturally with the proper amount of tension on the vocal apparatus. Like a trill but less wide, well within the same note rather than alternating two notes. Any vibrato you can modify by conscious bodily action is not a vibrato but a tremolo. But whatever you call it, its beat must be twice as fast as the shortest note you plan to sing. That means, six vibrations per second is the rock-bottom lower limit. 8 to 10 sound better. And the width must not exceed a semitone, ideally stay well inside that limit, or the vibrato will sound as a "chronic trill" (like the great tenor Leo Slezak put it). As a rule of thumb, the straighter and less contaminated by vibrato your tone, the more musical the effect.
I like to say that a great vibrato doesn't call attention to itself. So true! Have you ever listened to Leo Slezak's vibrato slowed down? You might be surprised that even his vibrato sounds wider than you might suppose! But you are correct about speed and width of about a semi-tone. But that width does change as you go higher and lower in the range. The same thing happens with a violinist, it gets wider on higher notes, and less wide on lower notes so that is matches the frequencies of the overtones. Thanks for watching!
I would love to hear more about how vibrato can be taught. I was told that it's a byproduct of good vocal function and will just happen when everything else falls into place. It never did.
I am so sorry that was your experience, but it is honestly most singer's experience with vibrato. Thanks for your comment, and I'll definitely share some more details about how to work the vibrato! I hope you get the help that you need ❤
The last singer is Anne Roselle. She and Bianca Scacciati are my two favorite Turandots. Both actually sound like young, beautiful women. They both truly sing the this part, which we have now become used to hearing screamed instead. I like Nilsson and Dimitrova too, but neither sounds like a young beautiful princess to my ears the way Roselle and Scacciati did. Another singer who did a superb, youthful, and silvery Turnadot was Maria Cebotari. She too sang it in German.
Yes! That is the problem with so many dramatic voices. They think they need to sound a certain way, and they distort their voice to make it happen. The vowels should be clear and released and then they will sound more natural! Thanks for your comment!
I think the speed and wideness of my vibrato is usually just right, but I've always had the tendency to go a little bit flat sometimes. I feel like it's my vibrato dragging the pitch down. It doesn't happen all the time, but it's enough that it's bothersome. I think it's less of a problem with the vibrato action and more than I need to think "let it spin upwards" more consistently. Thoughts anyone?
That is VERY common when the vibrato is accenting on the bottom of the vibrato action instead of the top. This is caused by tension that can definitely be fixed! Let me know if you'd like to work on your vibrato sometime. It is such a fun thing to develop!
@@evan-dunn I am currently in school for voice, so all these things are being worked on. My tension problems were crazy out of control when I was younger. They're better now, but very much still a work in progress.
For an example of using vibrato as an expressive tool, varying the speed is Lawrence Tibbett. Genius. Vibrato can be controlled to some extent. And it's an indicator of vocal health
Tibbett's vibrato, excessive at all times, varied in speed because of his lack of vocal control and self-control. He was drunk most of the time, and an abusive brute like all drunkards.
In some of thees the difference isn't width or speed at all but the direction of the vibrato. Direction of the vibrato is what calls the attention to it. Moreover some of these singers retract their tongue too much which makes the issue more noticeable on the upper end.
Thanks for commenting! You are correct that there are several different things that detract from a healthy vibrato. However, tongue retraction isn't bad for the vibrato/voice, unless it is done in a tense way. There are many examples of the best singers in history where you can see the tip of the tongue pulling back an inch or more from the bottom teeth. The fact is, that the tongue can be swallowed or depress the larynx, but it can also be pulled too far forward which is almost more common now. The tongue needs to move from the deeper muscles and do it so the surface of the tongue can be relaxed! Hope that helps ❤
That is what I was told! And then when singers develop vibrato issues, teachers blame it on the repertoire, because most don't know how to fix it. Luckily for me, I found a teacher who helped me fix my issues! I wish more singers were as lucky!
Like the majority of singing teachers*, I do not have a sucessful singing career behind me, but I love the old saying: "Those who can, do. Those who can't do, teach!" 😂. But with a lot of listening experience it seems to me that there is vibrato and vibrato. The first kind is a deliberate & practised vocal technique that a singer can use for effect and depends on solid breathing and vocal training. It goes in and out of fashion, too , so that an '80s singer sounds very different from now, 40 years later. Even before...try Conchita Superviva 😉. The second kind of vibrato is an involuntary unsteadiness in the voice which develops with time, or in an overworked singer, or simply with age with weakened control over the singing apparatus including the lungs and vocal chords which inevitably comes with time. *ps i confess to a prejudice against 'most singing teachers'. The idea of setting up oneself as an authority with dogmatic and rigid ideas about how to do something that one can't do oneself seems ridiculous to me. Watch an E Schwartzkopf masterclass, for example, or Marylyn Horne teaching etc etc or any successful singer, you will never hear her blaming the repertoire for poor vocal technique. LOL ....
@@theon9575 Thanks for your comment! The thing about the typical pedagogy, is we tend to blame myriad sources for vibrato issues and forget that vibrato is a technique that can be trained. Age itself doesn't cause vibrato issues. Singing for a long time with insecure technique causes vibrato issues. So I wouldn't say it is "inevitable." It's all about technique which for me is the VERY BEST NEWS! That way it can be fixed ❤
That can definitely happen! But I would hazard a guess that 98% of people of glitches in their vibrato. Most of those people, the glitches are small enough that only a skilled teacher could tell that they have a glitch. Then, if singers continue to work with glitches in their voices, over-time the glitches grow stronger. If a singer is lucky enough to be in the 2% that don't ever need much help with vibrato, that is great! However, most singers need better training than they are receiving.
Sadly, the Marton clip was from her earlier years when she sounded lovely. The last singer is Anne Rosell, I think... the first German Turandot from 1927
I tend to call Squillo, "core." Not because the term squillo is bad or anything. It is just the term I use. Most techniques in singing are more connected than we think. And they ALL have to do with the balance of the larynx. Core (squillo) is achieved by properly developed registers, breath support, and laryngeal positions. It CANNOT be achieved through tension like how most singers try to do it. Registers, breath, and laryngeal position also happen to be the same things that determine the health of the vibrato. So a healthy vibrato helps to release more core, and more core helps to release healthier vibrato. They are definitely connected! I'm not sure if that was the context of your question 🤣so hopefully I'm not rambling. Thanks for being here and commenting!
I am wondering if it's considered good or a hindrance to be basically unable to "uncouple" the speed of one's vibrato from the tempo of the song. Is that perhaps the case for most people? When I sing my vibrato automatically adjusts to the tempo of the song. Sometimes that can be in a position where I have to kind of choose between an oscillation that's too fast or one that's too slow to feel natural. (For example when the 16ths are too fast and 8ths too slow). Then I wish I could just let go and do what's natural. If I do manage to uncouple it, I lose my bearing tempo-wise.
That is such a great question! Vibrato is a semi-reflexive action in the voice. That means it is like blinking in that you can choose to blink, not blink, blink fast, or blink slowly AND your body can blink without you thinking about it. The same is true for vibrato. A vibrato can just happen on its own. However, for most people that means that the speed isn't controlled and there can be glitches in the vibrato action. If you have a fully developed vibrato, you can speed it up, slow it down, and use it to release the tension in your voice. Keep working on it! Do you have a teacher who helps you with your vibrato work? I hope you are finding joy in your singing!
If you listen to it slowed down, you can hear that it is a similar width to Nilsson's. Perhaps a little wider, but similar. The main issue is the accent of the vibrato.
Thanks for your comment! I'm so glad you are here and watched my video. I don't think there is any confusion, but it is tru that the more core (squillo) a voice has, the easier it is to vibrato! However, most singers confuse squillo with nasality or a knödel and that makes vibrato harder because of the constrictive tensions. Squillo is created when the voice is free of constriction, the breath is released, and the registers are properly developed. Then the vibrato has all the right conditions to help free the voice even more!
@@evan-dunn como experiencia y cantante de opera que soy, entre más lirico y voz pesada tengas, es más frecuente que tu vibrato presente alteraciones, es NORMAL, pues tu voz es sumamente grande! es dramatica! imagina la cantidad de armónicos. Lo que se debe hacer es trabajar muchísimo en el apoyo y en el aire. Siempre hay que estarse monitoreando y escuchando. Otra cosa, las grabaciones de esa época se grababan a más revoluciones, asi que siempre sonaban con vibratos muy rápidos... ademas de que las sopranos cantaban más ligerito, así era la tecnica de ese entonces. Escucha a Renee Fleming, ella es una lirico, voz oscura y gordita con un vibrato correcto. Sería un mejor ejemplo. Saludos.! Desde una cantante de opera y maestra de canto, con experiencia.
I think one of the most beautiful vibratos was had by Elisabeth Grummer... here in Tannhauser (ruclips.net/video/3vnIeZLurKo/видео.html)....the voice is always controlled and beautiful.
The worst wobble I've ever heard in a soprano is from Maria Callas, when singing loud at the top of her voice. BTW, a vibrato is the natural pulsating of the voice on the same note. If it wobbles from note to note, it isn't a vibrato, it's a tremolo.
Thanks for the comment! Different pedagogues often use the same term to describe different things, or different terms to describe the same thing. In this case tremolo and wobble are two different technical issues. Tremolo is like a tremolo on a violin where the violinist plays the pitch repeatedly and quickly with the bow, but the pitch doesn't change. So a tremolo vibrato (or caprino) is where the the vibrato pitch isn't changing enough. A wobble is where there is plenty of width in the pitch (or too much width), often a wobble is too slow, but the main aspect of a wobble is that the accent is in the wrong place, and that makes the vibrato harder and harder so it continues to slow down and get wider. Hope that helps!
Thanks for your feedback! Just so I understand, do you mean that you would like to hear the singers speaking about their singing? I appreciate you being here!
@@evan-dunn Sorry, what I meant is that when possible/existing a video can support clearly your explanation. Even if not everything is visible from a technical point of view, you yet wrote that "you can't see it here, but her tongue squeezes ...". That's the kind of thing interesting to see. I look forward to others videos.
Excelente vídeo. E realmente vibrato precisa ser estuado e dá muito trabalho, não é algo simples que se resolve de uma vez. Por mais que você deixe a voz fluir como dizem os que estudam vibrato a frequência e tom nunca ficam uniformes por completo. Fica exatamente como o primeiro exemplo. Tive a sorte de encontram um bom professor com um bom ouvido que tem me ajudado a consertar esses erros herdados do meu antigo professor.
Exatamente! Eu estou muito feliz que voce encontrou um novo professor e que tudo esta dando certo! Muito obrigado por ter visto meu youtube filme. Faz muito tempo que eu pratico meu Portuguese! Estou feliz por ter voce aqui!
@@evan-dunn Que legal! Eu sempre acabo escrevendo em inglês e hoje decidi escrever em português e fiquei muito por você ter respondido no mesmo idioma. Continue postando seus vídeos pois são excelentes. Precisamos desmitificar esses mitos sobre o canto que essa pedagogia moderna criou para destruir vozes.
@@evan-dunn Без правильного дыхания невозможно правильное пение! Это самое главное. Когда я только приступала к занятиям вокалом, меня в первую очередь учили правильно дышать.
This is a very interesting video. I am not sure I agree with everything you wrote, but the basic idea is a good one. I personally never thought much about vibrato until I got a bit older and realized how it can get out of control if not checked
Thanks for watching and commenting! Many singers are taught NOT to think about their vibrato. Then as they get older, they start developing some "out of control" vibrato issues and they think it is because of age. In reality, most people have small vibrato issues from the start and if they had learned to hone the technique through the decades, they would avoid the issues that plague many older singers. Thanks again for watching!
I am not sure “ slowing it down” has any value because by definition is not real. Besides, Nilsson’s voice was known for being essentially “ vibratoless” or as close to that concept as ever heard. How she managed that is another question.
Thanks for your comment! The value of slowing down the vibrato is to show that there is more to Nilsson's vibrato than meets the eye. You are exactly right . . . she had a vibrato-less feeling to her voice. But that can be deceiving for singers who try to imitate a vibrato-less feeling in their own voices. When in reality, the healthiest vibratos are very wide, like Nilssons! It is just that if you aren't trained to hear it, then you won't know that what is happening. Hope this helps and I hope you have a lovely day! Keep singing!
Thanks for the comment! That is what most teachers teach. Unfortunately, with this pedagogy, most singers end up with glitches in their vibratos. That is why it is so important to learn it correctly from the beginning! ❤
Great video! Apart from vibrato, I don't know why conservatories insist on removing the natural tone of voice of sopranos and replacing it with a standardized tone of voice that must be that of some fat old Italian lady from the 18th century. All sopranos have the same tone of voice, as if they were aged clones. I find it so frustrating to hear young sopranos singing in this absolutely artificial way, IMHO. They lose not only their identity, but also the energy of a young voice. But there are powerful sopranos who have refused to lose their authentic, natural timbre. The flattering comments on RUclips are all about the authentic tone of voice. And they are extremely popular. And there's nothing wrong with being authentic and popular, especially when it helps to popularize classical singing without adulterating it. Here's a suggestion for a future video.
I hope you don’t mind hearing from somebody who isn’t an opera singer, but who loves to listen to it if there are young Sopranos out there who don’t have that great technique I don’t blame them. I blame the teachers I mean, maybe I’m wrong and doing that I don’t know.
@@Leamichellefan2244 Yeah, I suggest listening to super soprano Amira Willighagen, 20 years old and who has been singing since the age of 9, when she signed a contract with Sony Masterworks. She has over a billion views on RUclips and has several channels. I also suggest soprano Patricia Janečková, who sadly passed away last year at the age of 25 from breast cancer.
@@draganvidic2039 she still sounded good until 2014 or so. Her performance of vissi darte for grace bumbery was iconic (too me). Shes older now so her voice isnt as fresh
@@jasonhurd4379 GGP didn’t have the best vibrato function because almost a caprino on the high notes and you’re totally wrong about Nilsson. (It can be your taste though)
@@evan-dunn. Grummer had two voices, which excitingly merged when the score demanded. Her soft singing was renowned and unique in its tension. Schwarzkopf commented on her head voice. It was not ‘flat’ as is so often the case. When it became louder its timbre changed into a glittering shine. with a wide pulsating vibrato, which re-enforced its essential purity. She kept her register throughout her career. Hers was an instrument and she knew how to exploit it - in the footsteps of her husband.
It is not fair to compare Stemme in the late state of her career (aged 53 by the time of her Met-broadcast of Turandot) to Dimitrova and Marton at their peak. I heard both live singing Turandot relatively late in their careers. Dimitrova was by that time skipping all the C's and had a quick tremolo (which you can hear in your recording as well) due to too much pressure on her voice (that caused her to pause for almost a year in the early eighties (around age 40) due to voice issues and vocal cord surgery). Marton had a huge, slow tremolo throughout the last twenty years of her career, and sang constantly too low. You can her early signs of this in her Met -"Turandot" (1987, at age 44), and more so in her second "Turandot"- studio recording (at age 48). ruclips.net/video/4wgvV71ybUM/видео.html. In her return to the Met 97, she could no longer sustain the high notes properly. The tiring of a voice, due to the constant demands of this heavy repertoire is a completely normal process. Listen to Leider, Tebaldi, Varnay, Callas, Scotto, Lindholm, Behrens, Marc, Linda Watson, Herlitzius, Voigt, Merbeth ....to be continued. Nilsson, of course, was a unique exception of a truly dramatic voice, starting her career relatively late and blessed with an incredible technique plus very strong vocal chords. There is an interesting remark by Christa Ludwig, who had vocal issues throughout her whole, long, career, whose phoniater compared her slim, sensible vocal cords to that of Nilsoon. He pointed out, that Nilsson's vocal chords were exceptionally and uniquely strong and thick.
Thanks for your comment! There are obviously many variables in the voice as you mentioned. I can't address each one in each video. I'm just providing snap shots! Thanks for watching.
And yet Eva Marton started out strong - singing definitive Toscas and Turandots, but she developed a horrible warble and lost the qualities that originally made one believe she was the heir apparent to Nilsson - which , naturally no one is because Nilsson’s voice and artistry as a Dramatic Soprano was a gift and is unparalleled - never to be equalled or surpassed…… We thought perhaps Nina Stemme, but no.
Thanks for your comment and for watching my video! My experience is very different than yours. When I developed vibrato issues in my 20's, I was so lucky to find a teacher who worked and helped me to fix every bit of the vibrato action. That obviously hasn't been your experience, but that teacher saved my career! Thanks again for being here. I hope you have a lovely day! ❤
@arcadiosrakopoulos Thanks for your comment! Operatic technique can be so hard to learn and it takes years of training. But I also think it can be joyful work!
@@jamesbingham4220 Precisely. And, better still, find a teacher who can do it themselves, and has themselves had success singing as a profession. Would anyone go to learn surgery from someone who has never performed a successful surgical operation? Or learn how to be a defence lawyer in Court from an old lawyer with no successful experience in court?
I also am struggling with the idea that singers should somehow learn a technique to make the vibrato happen. My understanding had been if the larynx is fully relaxed then it will come its own vibrato. This is my vibrato at the moment ruclips.net/video/4I_Av6-jsdQ/видео.htmlsi=3pWYn5Y7edccnQ_D. It's not quite right yet because I have not yet learned to let the larynx do it's own thing. But I wouldn't want to force the vibrato to be different.
@@richard_perry I completely understand! I also didn't believe it until I had a teacher who taught me how to do it. Thanks for sharing your video! Here is a before/after video that you might find interesting. ruclips.net/video/Bx6dlF_3dHE/видео.html Let me know what you think!
Was painful to hear some of these extremely wide vibratos; how did they ever become successful???? Others were quite good... Thank you for sharing. 🙂🙂🙂🙂
A lot of singers have beautiful voices and gain fame. But they have hidden technical issues that become more prominent as they continue to sing. If the voice isn't lined up from the beginning, it is almost impossible to keep the voice strong for a whole career!
I was taught NOT TO WOBBLE. Its lack of control and pitch and the glory of the tune, the music is lost. Even in an opera like Turandot, dramatic as it is, wobble is is not nice to listen to. Callas wobbled badly in her last years and it was tragic.
Thanks for your comment! I think most people are taught not to wobble, but that just shows that we have issues with the pedagogy of vibrato. Everyone knows not to wobble, but it is still such a common issue. And there are even more issues with vibrato than just a wobble. I'm glad you were able to weather the storm in your own singing! Keep it up!
I have to say that I agree with you. Did you happen to finish the video? By the end, you see that it isn't about the "amount" of vibrato, but rather there are other conditions that need to be met for a vibrato to not sound like "too much". But yes, if it sounds like too much, it probably is too much. Thanks for watching and commenting!
@@evan-dunn Yes! I always thought that singers did it deliberately to sound more 'operatic'. Personally I like a pure clear tone with some vibrato at the end of the note that broadens it out and that gives me goosebumps.! Like the channel. Like Sabine PERFECTION!ruclips.net/video/ppAUohisvG8/видео.htmlsi=7yhLCNmSaxCs3hWN
@@JohnSmith-lk8cy Yes, most singers add distortions to their voice because they are trying to imitate an operatic sound, but it is obviously harder to do than it sounds. So they try to sing dark and it gets woofy, or they try to sing bright and it gets nasal. It is very HARD to do! But the most developed voices are clear and PLAIN.
Agreed. The best technicians weren’t always the biggest names. If you ask me, James king and lando bartolini (who just passed, rip) were exemplary technicians and always had a balanced sound.
Goerke is disgusting. She used to be halfway decent. 2010/2011 onwards, she's hired simply because of reputation and name, doesn't matter how she sounds apparently.
@@smurf902 Thanks for your comment! I understand your frustration. I definitely wouldn't say she is disgusting. She is a lovely person, with amazing leadership skills and a passionate artist. She has her vocal struggles, but I'm really glad that she performs despite any technical issues. That takes a lot of bravery too!
Thanks for watching! You're not the only one who says that. I find the same thing with Titta Ruffo. I love his voice, but the vibrato (although technically fine) isn't my favorite.
I thought caprino was tremolo or bleat, meaning the vibrato action is too fast for most people's liking. For instance, Lauri-Volpi had caprino, despite having great high notes.
I'm not sure what you are asking. Are you asking if the terms caprino, tremolo, and bleat can be used interchangeably? If so then, yes, that is how I used them in this video. Tremolo refers to a technique used on string instruments where the instrumentalist repeats the same pitch with quick bow changes. It is fast, but the main issue for singers is the lack of width. There are many singers with quick vibratos who also keep it wide: ie Titta Ruffo.
@@evan-dunn sorry, I was not clear. Until your video, I thought the three terms only referred to a vibrato action that is too fast, making it unpleasant to most listeners, not that the width of the vibrato not being wide or big enough.
I know, singing terms are the worst. Why did we start using color terminology for an aural art-form, and chest/head voice when none of the singing happens in the chest or the head??? I like that, Full!
@@evan-dunn.....I do like the chest middle and head terms because when you teach that's where the singer feels the vibrations. Damn terms! I also prefer the term attack to onset.... ugh. In music we have different attacks, not onsets! I HATE that one. The people changed the terms and now everything is confusing and I think it is to make the people who know less to sound like they know more. Ugh.... don't get me commencing! Lol
@@vitabella6481 Thanks again for your response. You might not like it, but I wouldn't say "disturbing." Let's not forget that there are actual disturbing things happening in this world, and vocal technique is a very small thing to worry about!
@@vitabella6481 I COMPLETELY understand. As a student and teacher of singing, it is really important to me that we curate our language about technique. I don't really believe in "bad," "ugly," or "horrible." That is a way to say, "I don't like it, but I don't know why." It is more helpful for us as learners to say, the voice isn't balanced, the vibrato is too narrow, the breath isn't released. Then we can really discuss what is going on. Thanks again for watching and sharing!
Lawd, what is that horrid sound at the very beginning? Yikes.. Thought I was going to hear Birgit or Ghena but instead it was you-know-who... She should have stayed away from that repertoire..
Thanks for watching! The first singer is not actually "you-know-who." This singer is very well accepted in the dramatic repertoire. It just goes to show that even though rep choice is important, developing a solid technique is even MORE important to longevity.
CG needs a good year or 2 to completely rework her voice and someone who is brutally honest with her. And not sing ANYWHERE until that pitch is fixed. But of course she won't.
Thanks for the comment! Tremolo and wobble are two different technical issues. Tremolo is like a tremolo on a violin where the violinist plays the pitch repeatedly and quickly with the bow, but the pitch doesn't change. So a tremolo vibrato (or caprino) is where the the vibrato pitch isn't changing enough. A wobble is where there is plenty of width in the pitch (or too much width), often a wobble is too slow, but the main aspect of a wobble is that the accent is in the wrong place, and that makes the vibrato harder and harder so it continues to slow down and get wider. Hope that helps!
@@evan-dunn You clearly don't know music. Tremolo in the voice is a vocal problem IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE VIOLIN WHEN DISCUSSUNG VOCAL PEDAGOGY. Next you'll tell us portamento on the piano and portamento in singing are the same. Read Lilli Lehmann's MEINE GESANGSKUNST! Oh, sorry, Einsprachler könnten mit Deutsch nie und nimm er klarkommen! Vous n'en savez rien.
@@der_Allsehende_Seher It is pretty common for different pedagogues to use the same term differently or use different terms to describe the same thing. And not that this has anything to do with the the topic, but I speak three languages including German.
@@evan-dunn Ich wett, auf Deutsch könntest DU es in tausend Jahren mit mir nie aufnehmen. Geh und LERNE etwas Gescheites, bevor du anderen falsche Information weitergibst.
Thanks for your comment! Sorry it wasn't very helpful for you. Understanding vibrato in depth has been a crucial part of my vocal development, and the development for my students. Hope you have a lovely day and keep finding joy in your singing!
Thanks for your comment! Learning this turned my voice around and it helps my students everyday. Sorry it wasn't to your liking! I hope you find joy on your singing journey ❤
Hello! Thanks for your comment. I'm not sure if you are saying that you like Supervía and Olivero as singers. I love them! 😍 Regardless I hope you have a great day.
The whole field of teaching singers is full of cow manure Haha because hardly any of it is based on clear scientific evidence (except the importance of breath control). I agree with you about Superviva. I used to think her vibrato was hilarious. Until I realised that IN HER DAY it was the height of fashion. Check out Marion Anderson, one of the finest singers ever to come out of the US and strictly taught in Germany .... she could turn on her vibrato with a switch and used it to great emotional effect. Then to hear the OPPOSITE fashion, try if you can bear it, to listen to recently remastered recordings of Nellie Melba, around 1905 to 1915 in Covent Garden. Almost zero vibrato. 😱 Every note strong and steady (and boring) as a rock, and so she was internationally regarded as one of the world's top singers, etc etc. It was high fashion then, but for me almost unlistenable. The singing teachers can pontificate all they like.
![Seungmin "그렇게, 천천히, 우리(As we are)" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/kAzmhLHePqU/mqdefault.jpg)
Excelente video. Por favor sube mas contenido acerca del vibrato y como entrenarlo de manera correcta!
Thank you for watching! I'm glad you found it helpful. I will definitely plan on doing some more videos about vibrato!
Singing many opera arias without vibrato just sounds wrong. Like a choirboy ! But wobbly is horrid!
@@frogmouth There are definitely fads of using less or more vibrato, but using a wobbly or caprino vibrato have never been standard practice that we know of!
@@evan-dunn Better study first💋
@@der_Allsehende_Seher A joyful part of my daily studies! I hope you are enjoying your studies as well ❤
It's a pity that the great art of singing has sadly mostly vanished. Nowadays people think that the more of a wobble a voice has the more dramatic it is. Its just a tragedy. Without microphones those voices dont carry at all.
😭Let us strive to keep it alive!!! Nice to meet you here. Thanks for watching!
@EllyLyn_operasinger " You don't hear the great operas like Dinaorah any more. There just arent singers who can do them. The art of singing is in rapid decline. ' from a old book from the early 1900's . They were saying the same things then ( and at all other times. Reports of the demise.of opera have been slightly exaggerated. )
@@jefolson6989 Isn't that interesting how that is ALWAYS an argument going around?
Ma io credo. Che. Il Bel canto non. Morirà mai ❤ io l amo. Mi piace cantare. Ma ormai è tardi per me.Ho. Cantato. In Chiesa. Per 3 anni. Sono passati 8 anni.😂. Buona serata
The first one sounds like Anna Netrebko on a good day.
🤷♂😄
😂👍🏻
@@theon9575 Thanks for watching! ❤
Superb comment!! :))
@@mikaelb7735 It is so hard to hear a lovely voice that doesn't have the technique to match 😭
Nilsson is the gold standard in this repertoire.
👏😍
If the recording is slowed, the pitch will drop.
@@BryanThomas-eq4gl The top and bottom of the pitch will drop, but it still shows that the vibrato is wider than you'd think! Thanks for watching!
In the early days of modern music, vibrato was considered to be just another ornament, both for the voice and on the violin. It was therefore only applied to certain notes for expressive purposes. Later, it went from being intentional to systematic and, for some singers, beyond their vocal control. I will always appreciate more musicians who are able to control and vary this ornament according to the expressiveness of the music, than those who apply vibrato in automatic mode.
Muscularly, it is considered semi-reflexive if trained properly. It is like blinking which happens automatically, but you can also control when and how fast you do it.
But if you slow down Nilsson's vibrato of course it will sound wider because it is slower. I don't see how that makes any point. That is part of the problem the vibrato can slow down with age. Or some singers creates an artificial vibrato by vibrating the mouth and tongue, where they can do all types of stange things. Part of the reason why "dramatic sopranos and tenors" these days often have wide and slow vibratos is because they over push their middle voices to sound more dramatic, because they are not real dramatic singers with big voices.
Thanks for your comment! The point of slowing down the vibrato is that when you listen to Birgit Nilsson at face value, her vibrato doesn't sound wide. This makes it easy to assume that vibrato SHOULDN'T be wide, when in fact, vibrato should be VERY wide. It just shouldn't SOUND wide.
And it is true that singing the wrong rep, or pushing your voice can exacerbate vibrato issues. But most people don't realize that the vibrato issues already existed for most singers long before they started pushing the wrong rep. Just because the vibrato issues are small when a singer is young, doesn't mean that they have a healthy vibrato. Vibrato slows down with age NOT because a singer is getting older, but because they have been singing with a faulty vibrato for a longer amount of time. If you sing with a healthy vibrato, the vibrato won't slow down when you age! You just have to keep training it effectively.
I hope this helps!
........and it's a problem of our time that you mustn't get older! We stay all healthy, energetic etc. and sing like young best singers up to the age of 150!......... of course it is NOT only the wrong technique, when voices change.
@@milaschneider9128 🤣That would be lovely, wouldn't it?! Someone told me this week that voices decline by the early 30's. I think that is the issue. We obviously won't make it to 150, but I'd like to keep singing well into my 60's! That's what a healthy technique can do 🤩
Why should a vibrato become "wider" when slowed down? Slowed-down you hear the actual extent better when your ears aren't trained well and you cannot catch it at normal speed. That seems to be the case with you. Slow vibrato is musically useless, because music moves in rapid angular steps from one note to another, and the contrast between a held note, a stepwise change, and a trill or other ornament must be brought over clearly. Only a very fast,very narrow vibrato is acceptable, none at all is better. The only "advantage" of a wide vibrato is that at some point, nobody will notice when you sing flat or sharp, because it sounds unmusical and jarring all the time.
@@truesoundchris Thanks for the comment! It doesn't "become" wider. Like you said, it just sounds wider because you can hear it differently. I'm curious if you think that Birgit Nilsson's vibrato is acceptable to your standards? Thanks!
The last singer is Anne Roselle! Glad to see she’s getting more love on youtube ❤️
Isn't she amazing!?! Thanks for listening.
The first example is absolutely appalling - unlistenable 😮😂
@@paullewis2413 I know, it is devastating to hear a voice with so much talent deteriorate with technical difficulties! 😭
I don't think I have ever heard her before. I shall certainly seek out her recordings now. Beautiful tone.
@@paullewis2413 and painful.
Thank you again for this demonstrative and helpful video.
Of course! So glad to have you here 😍
Thanks for this. It is overdue. Terrible vibrato is my constant complaint, especially against today's singers. Whether the vibrato is too wide and slow or too fast and veering sharp, the tone does not zero in on the pitch. It is bad enough when one is aware of what the note should be, but, in unfamiliar music, the ear is baffled by too much noise around the pitch. It constitutes musical failure, and, along with other elements of poor tone production, hammy acting, inappropriate casting, and way too much post-modern staging, it is killing opera.
It's a hard thing to learn, especially if you aren't taught how to do it! Thanks for your comment!
The difference is made by the correct breathing support and appoggio
Thanks for watching and for adding your comment! I'm so glad you're here. The breath is a HUGE part, but there is much more to it than that. There are a dozen different tensions that can slow down and disrupt the vibrato, and if the correct action isn't taught from the beginning, it doesn't matter what you do with your breathing, the vibrato can still end up accenting in the wrong place, or getting inverted. There are also the registration muscles which, if left underdeveloped can also hinder the proper vibrato action.
Yes, true true true. Every single time that Joan Sutherland was asked in interview, how do you do it? She said EXACTLY THE SAME! But people don't listen.
And a singing teacher who doesn't/can't teach basics of breathing is like a junior school teacher who doesn't/can't teach students how to read.
@@theon9575 THE BREATH! 👏
Good singing has no consciously perceptible vibrato, just the quick fluttering that indeed happens naturally with the proper amount of tension on the vocal apparatus. Like a trill but less wide, well within the same note rather than alternating two notes. Any vibrato you can modify by conscious bodily action is not a vibrato but a tremolo. But whatever you call it, its beat must be twice as fast as the shortest note you plan to sing. That means, six vibrations per second is the rock-bottom lower limit. 8 to 10 sound better. And the width must not exceed a semitone, ideally stay well inside that limit, or the vibrato will sound as a "chronic trill" (like the great tenor Leo Slezak put it). As a rule of thumb, the straighter and less contaminated by vibrato your tone, the more musical the effect.
I like to say that a great vibrato doesn't call attention to itself. So true! Have you ever listened to Leo Slezak's vibrato slowed down? You might be surprised that even his vibrato sounds wider than you might suppose! But you are correct about speed and width of about a semi-tone. But that width does change as you go higher and lower in the range. The same thing happens with a violinist, it gets wider on higher notes, and less wide on lower notes so that is matches the frequencies of the overtones. Thanks for watching!
Thank you I learned something
I'm so glad! Thanks for watching!
I would love to hear more about how vibrato can be taught. I was told that it's a byproduct of good vocal function and will just happen when everything else falls into place. It never did.
I am so sorry that was your experience, but it is honestly most singer's experience with vibrato. Thanks for your comment, and I'll definitely share some more details about how to work the vibrato! I hope you get the help that you need ❤
You are not alone. The same has happened to me.
@@sashaprince5177 This is SOOOOOO common. I hope things are going well for your voice now!
Vibrato can definitelly be taught. Some people can do it naturally but that is not the most common thing.
@@Ignasimp For sure!
The last singer is Anne Roselle. She and Bianca Scacciati are my two favorite Turandots. Both actually sound like young, beautiful women. They both truly sing the this part, which we have now become used to hearing screamed instead. I like Nilsson and Dimitrova too, but neither sounds like a young beautiful princess to my ears the way Roselle and Scacciati did. Another singer who did a superb, youthful, and silvery Turnadot was Maria Cebotari. She too sang it in German.
Yes! That is the problem with so many dramatic voices. They think they need to sound a certain way, and they distort their voice to make it happen. The vowels should be clear and released and then they will sound more natural! Thanks for your comment!
@@Shahrdad
But role is written for a dramatic soprano (girlish or not) and there should be a difference to the voice of Liu.
@@draganvidic2039 does it say dramatic soprano on the score??
@@draganvidic2039 The first Turandot, Rosa Raisa, had a large, silvery voice. She certainly didn't sound like a gorgon.
I think the speed and wideness of my vibrato is usually just right, but I've always had the tendency to go a little bit flat sometimes. I feel like it's my vibrato dragging the pitch down. It doesn't happen all the time, but it's enough that it's bothersome. I think it's less of a problem with the vibrato action and more than I need to think "let it spin upwards" more consistently. Thoughts anyone?
That is VERY common when the vibrato is accenting on the bottom of the vibrato action instead of the top. This is caused by tension that can definitely be fixed! Let me know if you'd like to work on your vibrato sometime. It is such a fun thing to develop!
@@evan-dunn I am currently in school for voice, so all these things are being worked on. My tension problems were crazy out of control when I was younger. They're better now, but very much still a work in progress.
@@JackieLanceTenor Keep up the good work!
For an example of using vibrato as an expressive tool, varying the speed is Lawrence Tibbett. Genius. Vibrato can be controlled to some extent. And it's an indicator of vocal health
HUGE fan!
Tibbett's vibrato, excessive at all times, varied in speed because of his lack of vocal control and self-control. He was drunk most of the time, and an abusive brute like all drunkards.
@@truesoundchris Poor guy. He really must have had a sad existence if he was struggling that much. Regardless, he did some really amazing things!
In some of thees the difference isn't width or speed at all but the direction of the vibrato. Direction of the vibrato is what calls the attention to it. Moreover some of these singers retract their tongue too much which makes the issue more noticeable on the upper end.
Thanks for commenting! You are correct that there are several different things that detract from a healthy vibrato. However, tongue retraction isn't bad for the vibrato/voice, unless it is done in a tense way. There are many examples of the best singers in history where you can see the tip of the tongue pulling back an inch or more from the bottom teeth. The fact is, that the tongue can be swallowed or depress the larynx, but it can also be pulled too far forward which is almost more common now. The tongue needs to move from the deeper muscles and do it so the surface of the tongue can be relaxed! Hope that helps ❤
What do you think of Eileen Farrell? I think that she was stupendous. I heard her once live, very late in her career. Voice was flawless.
She was incredible! I would give a lot to hear a voice like that live 😍
Agreed! She is phenomenal.
@@EmilyGloeggler7984 Eileen Farrell is not phenomenal , she shrills on top
Thanks for this video. Was the last German singer Frida Leib?
Thanks for watching! It was Anne Roselle ❤
Very Interesting, becuse many singing teachers say, that vibrato comes with time, and do not train it properly.
That is what I was told! And then when singers develop vibrato issues, teachers blame it on the repertoire, because most don't know how to fix it. Luckily for me, I found a teacher who helped me fix my issues! I wish more singers were as lucky!
Like the majority of singing teachers*, I do not have a sucessful singing career behind me, but I love the old saying:
"Those who can, do. Those who can't do, teach!" 😂. But with a lot of listening experience it seems to me that there is vibrato and vibrato.
The first kind is a deliberate & practised vocal technique that a singer can use for effect and depends on solid breathing and vocal training. It goes in and out of fashion, too , so that an '80s singer sounds very different from now, 40 years later. Even before...try Conchita Superviva 😉.
The second kind of vibrato is an involuntary unsteadiness in the voice which develops with time, or in an overworked singer, or simply with age with weakened control over the singing apparatus including the lungs and vocal chords which inevitably comes with time.
*ps i confess to a prejudice against 'most singing teachers'. The idea of setting up oneself as an authority with dogmatic and rigid ideas about how to do something that one can't do oneself seems ridiculous to me.
Watch an E Schwartzkopf masterclass, for example, or Marylyn Horne teaching etc etc or any successful singer, you will never hear her blaming the repertoire for poor vocal technique. LOL ....
@@theon9575 I agree completely
@@theon9575 Thanks for your comment! The thing about the typical pedagogy, is we tend to blame myriad sources for vibrato issues and forget that vibrato is a technique that can be trained. Age itself doesn't cause vibrato issues. Singing for a long time with insecure technique causes vibrato issues. So I wouldn't say it is "inevitable." It's all about technique which for me is the VERY BEST NEWS! That way it can be fixed ❤
@arcadiosrakopoulos Very cool way to think about it! Thanks for sharing!
Rosell and Nilsson the only ones that gave justice to this aria!!!
They are amazing, aren't they?!?!
Dont forget Eva Turner. :)
@@EllyLyn_operasinger I adore her 🤩
@@evan-dunnme too. Fantastic singer.
@@EllyLyn_operasinger You are so right!!
I guess every singer is different: my vibrato got more stable when I improved my technique and stopped thinking about it!
That can definitely happen! But I would hazard a guess that 98% of people of glitches in their vibrato. Most of those people, the glitches are small enough that only a skilled teacher could tell that they have a glitch.
Then, if singers continue to work with glitches in their voices, over-time the glitches grow stronger.
If a singer is lucky enough to be in the 2% that don't ever need much help with vibrato, that is great! However, most singers need better training than they are receiving.
Sadly, the Marton clip was from her earlier years when she sounded lovely. The last singer is Anne Rosell, I think... the first German Turandot from 1927
Yes on both counts! Thanks for watching 🤩
That with Marton was when?
After 1983 she didn’t sound like this.
How might the concept of "squillo" (Sp?) become part of this discussion of "vibrato"?
I tend to call Squillo, "core." Not because the term squillo is bad or anything. It is just the term I use.
Most techniques in singing are more connected than we think. And they ALL have to do with the balance of the larynx. Core (squillo) is achieved by properly developed registers, breath support, and laryngeal positions. It CANNOT be achieved through tension like how most singers try to do it. Registers, breath, and laryngeal position also happen to be the same things that determine the health of the vibrato. So a healthy vibrato helps to release more core, and more core helps to release healthier vibrato. They are definitely connected!
I'm not sure if that was the context of your question 🤣so hopefully I'm not rambling. Thanks for being here and commenting!
@@evan-dunn
Squillo is what you get when you sing with core to the voice.
@@draganvidic2039 Yep! Core=squillo
It's Anne Roselle (thanks someone in the comments!) and Nilsson for me. Great singing.
❤❤❤
I am wondering if it's considered good or a hindrance to be basically unable to "uncouple" the speed of one's vibrato from the tempo of the song. Is that perhaps the case for most people? When I sing my vibrato automatically adjusts to the tempo of the song. Sometimes that can be in a position where I have to kind of choose between an oscillation that's too fast or one that's too slow to feel natural. (For example when the 16ths are too fast and 8ths too slow). Then I wish I could just let go and do what's natural. If I do manage to uncouple it, I lose my bearing tempo-wise.
That is such a great question! Vibrato is a semi-reflexive action in the voice. That means it is like blinking in that you can choose to blink, not blink, blink fast, or blink slowly AND your body can blink without you thinking about it.
The same is true for vibrato. A vibrato can just happen on its own. However, for most people that means that the speed isn't controlled and there can be glitches in the vibrato action. If you have a fully developed vibrato, you can speed it up, slow it down, and use it to release the tension in your voice. Keep working on it! Do you have a teacher who helps you with your vibrato work? I hope you are finding joy in your singing!
" she has a wide vibrato and that gown makes it seem even wider"
I love a wild gown, personally LOL!
@evan-dunn I like gowns that are wide and loose, and fast.
Is the first singer's vibrato slow and too wide?
If you listen to it slowed down, you can hear that it is a similar width to Nilsson's. Perhaps a little wider, but similar. The main issue is the accent of the vibrato.
@@evan-dunn is the accent inverted, i.e., inverted vibrato?
@@danielhanson3200 Yes! That is a fair characterization.
It’s a wobble more than an inverted one
@@draganvidic2039 Thanks for your comment!
I also think that Martina Arroyo sang a wonderful Turandot..I like her power, and the voice itself is inherently beautiful!
I've never heard her do it! Thanks for being here and sharing your favorites!
I think that there is some confusion here about vibrato versus squillo.
Thanks for your comment! I'm so glad you are here and watched my video. I don't think there is any confusion, but it is tru that the more core (squillo) a voice has, the easier it is to vibrato! However, most singers confuse squillo with nasality or a knödel and that makes vibrato harder because of the constrictive tensions. Squillo is created when the voice is free of constriction, the breath is released, and the registers are properly developed. Then the vibrato has all the right conditions to help free the voice even more!
Entonces todas deberíamos sonar a sopranos ligeras, haciendo repertorio de dramáticas? jejej es lo que entendí...
🤣 Definitely not! But we should sound like ourselves! 😍
@@evan-dunn como experiencia y cantante de opera que soy, entre más lirico y voz pesada tengas, es más frecuente que tu vibrato presente alteraciones, es NORMAL, pues tu voz es sumamente grande! es dramatica! imagina la cantidad de armónicos. Lo que se debe hacer es trabajar muchísimo en el apoyo y en el aire. Siempre hay que estarse monitoreando y escuchando. Otra cosa, las grabaciones de esa época se grababan a más revoluciones, asi que siempre sonaban con vibratos muy rápidos... ademas de que las sopranos cantaban más ligerito, así era la tecnica de ese entonces. Escucha a Renee Fleming, ella es una lirico, voz oscura y gordita con un vibrato correcto. Sería un mejor ejemplo. Saludos.! Desde una cantante de opera y maestra de canto, con experiencia.
Dimitrova und Nulson grandios
Right!?!?
I think one of the most beautiful vibratos was had by Elisabeth Grummer... here in Tannhauser (ruclips.net/video/3vnIeZLurKo/видео.html)....the voice is always controlled and beautiful.
Thanks for the recommendation!
The worst wobble I've ever heard in a soprano is from Maria Callas, when singing loud at the top of her voice.
BTW, a vibrato is the natural pulsating of the voice on the same note. If it wobbles from note to note, it isn't a vibrato, it's a tremolo.
Thanks for the comment! Different pedagogues often use the same term to describe different things, or different terms to describe the same thing. In this case tremolo and wobble are two different technical issues. Tremolo is like a tremolo on a violin where the violinist plays the pitch repeatedly and quickly with the bow, but the pitch doesn't change. So a tremolo vibrato (or caprino) is where the the vibrato pitch isn't changing enough. A wobble is where there is plenty of width in the pitch (or too much width), often a wobble is too slow, but the main aspect of a wobble is that the accent is in the wrong place, and that makes the vibrato harder and harder so it continues to slow down and get wider. Hope that helps!
But as Callas' high notes wobble, Callas' fans dictatorially imposed that wobble is not a technical defect, as Callas had it, it becomes a virtue.
Very concise and informative.Maybe a few video excerpts from the artists can even be more "speaking".
Thanks for your feedback! Just so I understand, do you mean that you would like to hear the singers speaking about their singing? I appreciate you being here!
@@evan-dunn Sorry, what I meant is that when possible/existing a video can support clearly your explanation. Even if not everything is visible from a technical point of view, you yet wrote that "you can't see it here, but her tongue squeezes ...". That's the kind of thing interesting to see. I look forward to others videos.
@@redlab3488 Yes, I understand! Thanks again for your feedback!
Excelente vídeo. E realmente vibrato precisa ser estuado e dá muito trabalho, não é algo simples que se resolve de uma vez. Por mais que você deixe a voz fluir como dizem os que estudam vibrato a frequência e tom nunca ficam uniformes por completo. Fica exatamente como o primeiro exemplo. Tive a sorte de encontram um bom professor com um bom ouvido que tem me ajudado a consertar esses erros herdados do meu antigo professor.
Exatamente! Eu estou muito feliz que voce encontrou um novo professor e que tudo esta dando certo! Muito obrigado por ter visto meu youtube filme. Faz muito tempo que eu pratico meu Portuguese! Estou feliz por ter voce aqui!
@@evan-dunn Que legal! Eu sempre acabo escrevendo em inglês e hoje decidi escrever em português e fiquei muito por você ter respondido no mesmo idioma. Continue postando seus vídeos pois são excelentes. Precisamos desmitificar esses mitos sobre o canto que essa pedagogia moderna criou para destruir vozes.
@@seduardorosales81 Obrigado! Eu concordo contigo!
Vibrato is the result of a good or bad technique and also of a good or bad treatment of the voice itself!-I am singer and I know!!
Definitely!
Nilsson ran rings around all of them. Dimitrovna, huge but not clear like Nilsson. Interesting! The use of breath controls the vibrato!
Breath is so crucial, isn't it?!
@@evan-dunn It’s number 1.
@@4444marla Kristine Ciesinski used to say, "the mastery of the voice is the breath."
@@evan-dunn Без правильного дыхания невозможно правильное пение! Это самое главное. Когда я только приступала к занятиям вокалом, меня в первую очередь учили правильно дышать.
@@ЕвгенияМалышева-г7в So true! I'm glad you had a good experience in your vocal studies. Thanks for your comment!
German singer is Anne Roselle, my favorite Turandot 🙇
😍🤩
This is a very interesting video. I am not sure I agree with everything you wrote, but the basic idea is a good one. I personally never thought much about vibrato until I got a bit older and realized how it can get out of control if not checked
Thanks for watching and commenting! Many singers are taught NOT to think about their vibrato. Then as they get older, they start developing some "out of control" vibrato issues and they think it is because of age. In reality, most people have small vibrato issues from the start and if they had learned to hone the technique through the decades, they would avoid the issues that plague many older singers. Thanks again for watching!
Per favore, mettete i sottotitoli anche in italiano! Grazie 🙏!
Grazie! I don't know how yet, but I will see if I can learn how to do it!
I am not sure “ slowing it down” has any value because by definition is not real. Besides, Nilsson’s voice was known for being essentially “ vibratoless” or as close to that concept as ever heard. How she managed that is another question.
Thanks for your comment! The value of slowing down the vibrato is to show that there is more to Nilsson's vibrato than meets the eye. You are exactly right . . . she had a vibrato-less feeling to her voice. But that can be deceiving for singers who try to imitate a vibrato-less feeling in their own voices. When in reality, the healthiest vibratos are very wide, like Nilssons! It is just that if you aren't trained to hear it, then you won't know that what is happening. Hope this helps and I hope you have a lovely day! Keep singing!
@@evan-dunn understood. Thank you for your reply.
@@jjlungdoc7472 No problem!
Muchas veces el vibrato sale de forma natural. No debes estudiar para tenerlo. simplemente tu voz vibra sola en ciertas notas.
Thanks for the comment! That is what most teachers teach. Unfortunately, with this pedagogy, most singers end up with glitches in their vibratos. That is why it is so important to learn it correctly from the beginning! ❤
At her peak Eva Marton was untouchable
😍 amazing
Just wondering when that was because you never hear her sounding this good in her recordings.
Before 1984 maybe?
Great video! Apart from vibrato, I don't know why conservatories insist on removing the natural tone of voice of sopranos and replacing it with a standardized tone of voice that must be that of some fat old Italian lady from the 18th century. All sopranos have the same tone of voice, as if they were aged clones. I find it so frustrating to hear young sopranos singing in this absolutely artificial way, IMHO. They lose not only their identity, but also the energy of a young voice. But there are powerful sopranos who have refused to lose their authentic, natural timbre. The flattering comments on RUclips are all about the authentic tone of voice. And they are extremely popular. And there's nothing wrong with being authentic and popular, especially when it helps to popularize classical singing without adulterating it. Here's a suggestion for a future video.
Yes! Distorted voices start to sound the same, but natural voices are more unique! Thanks for the comment!❤
I hope you don’t mind hearing from somebody who isn’t an opera singer, but who loves to listen to it if there are young Sopranos out there who don’t have that great technique I don’t blame them. I blame the teachers I mean, maybe I’m wrong and doing that I don’t know.
@@Leamichellefan2244 I agree.
@@jorgechavesfilho thank you and who is the first one that we hear I feel like I know who it is, but I’m not sure. Do you know?
@@Leamichellefan2244 Yeah, I suggest listening to super soprano Amira Willighagen, 20 years old and who has been singing since the age of 9, when she signed a contract with Sony Masterworks. She has over a billion views on RUclips and has several channels. I also suggest soprano Patricia Janečková, who sadly passed away last year at the age of 25 from breast cancer.
I would never use Dimitrova to as an example of a well-balanced vibrato.
Thanks for your comment! Who are some singers that you really love their vibrato?
Caballe and Gheorghiu have a lovely vibrato
@@mugrad25
Plz very early Gheorgiu in that case
@@draganvidic2039 she still sounded good until 2014 or so. Her performance of vissi darte for grace bumbery was iconic (too me). Shes older now so her voice isnt as fresh
@@ksionc100 I'd be interested to hear whom you would name, seriously 🧐.
I am sorry you didn't include Gertrud Grob-Prandl. Her vibrato was so well-controlled it made Nilsson sound wobbly.
🤣She is FANTASTIC!!!! Thanks for your comment!
@omarsomehow69 Thanks for the comment.
@@jasonhurd4379
GGP didn’t have the best vibrato function because almost a caprino on the high notes and you’re totally wrong about Nilsson.
(It can be your taste though)
@@evan-dunn. Grummer had two voices, which excitingly merged when the score demanded. Her soft singing was renowned and unique in its tension. Schwarzkopf commented on her head voice. It was not ‘flat’ as is so often the case. When it became louder its timbre changed into a glittering shine. with a wide pulsating vibrato, which re-enforced its essential purity. She kept her register throughout her career. Hers was an instrument and she knew how to exploit it - in the footsteps of her husband.
@@draganvidic2039 I have to agree with you here! No comparison
It is not fair to compare Stemme in the late state of her career (aged 53 by the time of her Met-broadcast of Turandot) to Dimitrova and Marton at their peak. I heard both live singing Turandot relatively late in their careers. Dimitrova was by that time skipping all the C's and had a quick tremolo (which you can hear in your recording as well) due to too much pressure on her voice (that caused her to pause for almost a year in the early eighties (around age 40) due to voice issues and vocal cord surgery). Marton had a huge, slow tremolo throughout the last twenty years of her career, and sang constantly too low. You can her early signs of this in her Met -"Turandot" (1987, at age 44), and more so in her second "Turandot"- studio recording (at age 48). ruclips.net/video/4wgvV71ybUM/видео.html. In her return to the Met 97, she could no longer sustain the high notes properly.
The tiring of a voice, due to the constant demands of this heavy repertoire is a completely normal process.
Listen to Leider, Tebaldi, Varnay, Callas, Scotto, Lindholm, Behrens, Marc, Linda Watson, Herlitzius, Voigt, Merbeth ....to be continued.
Nilsson, of course, was a unique exception of a truly dramatic voice, starting her career relatively late and blessed with an incredible technique plus very strong vocal chords. There is an interesting remark by Christa Ludwig, who had vocal issues throughout her whole, long, career, whose phoniater compared her slim, sensible vocal cords to that of Nilsoon. He pointed out, that Nilsson's vocal chords were exceptionally and uniquely strong and thick.
Thanks for your comment! There are obviously many variables in the voice as you mentioned. I can't address each one in each video. I'm just providing snap shots! Thanks for watching.
And yet Eva Marton started out strong - singing definitive Toscas and Turandots, but she developed a horrible warble and lost the qualities that originally made one believe she was the heir apparent to Nilsson - which , naturally no one is because Nilsson’s voice and artistry as a Dramatic Soprano was a gift and is unparalleled - never to be equalled or surpassed…… We thought perhaps Nina Stemme, but no.
It takes a lot of work to keep a solid technique for a whole career!
If a teacher claims to “teach” vibrato find another teacher.
Thanks for your comment and for watching my video! My experience is very different than yours. When I developed vibrato issues in my 20's, I was so lucky to find a teacher who worked and helped me to fix every bit of the vibrato action. That obviously hasn't been your experience, but that teacher saved my career! Thanks again for being here. I hope you have a lovely day! ❤
@arcadiosrakopoulos Thanks for your comment! Operatic technique can be so hard to learn and it takes years of training. But I also think it can be joyful work!
@@jamesbingham4220 Precisely. And, better still, find a teacher who can do it themselves, and has themselves had success singing as a profession.
Would anyone go to learn surgery from someone who has never performed a successful surgical operation? Or learn how to be a defence lawyer in Court from an old lawyer with no successful experience in court?
I also am struggling with the idea that singers should somehow learn a technique to make the vibrato happen. My understanding had been if the larynx is fully relaxed then it will come its own vibrato. This is my vibrato at the moment ruclips.net/video/4I_Av6-jsdQ/видео.htmlsi=3pWYn5Y7edccnQ_D. It's not quite right yet because I have not yet learned to let the larynx do it's own thing. But I wouldn't want to force the vibrato to be different.
@@richard_perry I completely understand! I also didn't believe it until I had a teacher who taught me how to do it. Thanks for sharing your video! Here is a before/after video that you might find interesting. ruclips.net/video/Bx6dlF_3dHE/видео.html Let me know what you think!
Was painful to hear some of these extremely wide vibratos; how did they ever become successful???? Others were quite good... Thank you for sharing. 🙂🙂🙂🙂
A lot of singers have beautiful voices and gain fame. But they have hidden technical issues that become more prominent as they continue to sing. If the voice isn't lined up from the beginning, it is almost impossible to keep the voice strong for a whole career!
I was taught NOT TO WOBBLE. Its lack of control and pitch and the glory of the tune, the music is lost. Even in an opera like Turandot, dramatic as it is, wobble is is not nice to listen to. Callas wobbled badly in her last years and it was tragic.
Thanks for your comment! I think most people are taught not to wobble, but that just shows that we have issues with the pedagogy of vibrato. Everyone knows not to wobble, but it is still such a common issue. And there are even more issues with vibrato than just a wobble. I'm glad you were able to weather the storm in your own singing! Keep it up!
I hate hate hate too much vibrato. I think it is why people dislike opera. I would leave the performance if it sounded like the first singer!
I have to say that I agree with you. Did you happen to finish the video? By the end, you see that it isn't about the "amount" of vibrato, but rather there are other conditions that need to be met for a vibrato to not sound like "too much". But yes, if it sounds like too much, it probably is too much. Thanks for watching and commenting!
@@evan-dunn Yes! I always thought that singers did it deliberately to sound more 'operatic'. Personally I like a pure clear tone with some vibrato at the end of the note that broadens it out and that gives me goosebumps.! Like the channel. Like Sabine PERFECTION!ruclips.net/video/ppAUohisvG8/видео.htmlsi=7yhLCNmSaxCs3hWN
@@JohnSmith-lk8cy Yes, most singers add distortions to their voice because they are trying to imitate an operatic sound, but it is obviously harder to do than it sounds. So they try to sing dark and it gets woofy, or they try to sing bright and it gets nasal. It is very HARD to do! But the most developed voices are clear and PLAIN.
Agreed. The best technicians weren’t always the biggest names. If you ask me, James king and lando bartolini (who just passed, rip) were exemplary technicians and always had a balanced sound.
@@somerandomguy84 Thanks for sharing your recommendations, I will have to look them up!
A little wide, but not as bad as I've heard in the past
Thanks for watching! Which singer in particular are you thinking of?
Stemme and Goerke. My goodness. I think Elena Pankratova is the best Turandot the Mets had in a while
It is a challenging role, but it becomes impossible if the technique is struggling!
Goerke is disgusting. She used to be halfway decent. 2010/2011 onwards, she's hired simply because of reputation and name, doesn't matter how she sounds apparently.
@@smurf902 Thanks for your comment! I understand your frustration. I definitely wouldn't say she is disgusting. She is a lovely person, with amazing leadership skills and a passionate artist. She has her vocal struggles, but I'm really glad that she performs despite any technical issues. That takes a lot of bravery too!
@omarsomehow69 But I gotta support a brave singer who gets up to perform! 😍
@@beauburkhalter6602
Pankratova is not good, she’s just not a total mess as so many else.
Ghena Dimitrova's vibrato is not beautiful at all, it's unpleasant
Thanks for watching! You're not the only one who says that. I find the same thing with Titta Ruffo. I love his voice, but the vibrato (although technically fine) isn't my favorite.
And again : quot capita, tot sententiae
It's a beautiful thing, isn't it?! Thanks for watching! ❤
I thought caprino was tremolo or bleat, meaning the vibrato action is too fast for most people's liking. For instance, Lauri-Volpi had caprino, despite having great high notes.
I'm not sure what you are asking. Are you asking if the terms caprino, tremolo, and bleat can be used interchangeably? If so then, yes, that is how I used them in this video. Tremolo refers to a technique used on string instruments where the instrumentalist repeats the same pitch with quick bow changes. It is fast, but the main issue for singers is the lack of width. There are many singers with quick vibratos who also keep it wide: ie Titta Ruffo.
@@evan-dunn tremolo is used in piano playing as well, often with octaves.
@@evan-dunn sorry, I was not clear. Until your video, I thought the three terms only referred to a vibrato action that is too fast, making it unpleasant to most listeners, not that the width of the vibrato not being wide or big enough.
@@danielhanson3200 That makes sense. Thanks as always for joining in the conversation. I appreciate you.
You fail to mention that that one soprano with vibrato issues is singing extremely flat.
Rather than the term dark i would use FULL.
I know, singing terms are the worst. Why did we start using color terminology for an aural art-form, and chest/head voice when none of the singing happens in the chest or the head??? I like that, Full!
@@evan-dunn.....I do like the chest middle and head terms because when you teach that's where the singer feels the vibrations. Damn terms! I also prefer the term attack to onset.... ugh. In music we have different attacks, not onsets! I HATE that one. The people changed the terms and now everything is confusing and I think it is to make the people who know less to sound like they know more. Ugh.... don't get me commencing! Lol
@@jimbuxton2187 🤣sound like they know more! 😆
Dimitrovas Vibrato is horrible on the high notes!
Thanks for watching? What do you not like about her vibrato?
@@evan-dunn we hear clearly a big second, both notes. Like a trill. Very unpleasant.
@@vitabella6481 Thanks again for your response. You might not like it, but I wouldn't say "disturbing." Let's not forget that there are actual disturbing things happening in this world, and vocal technique is a very small thing to worry about!
@@evan-dunn my vocabulary is not as rich in English as it could be. If you prefer Id say ugly for my trained ears.
@@vitabella6481 I COMPLETELY understand. As a student and teacher of singing, it is really important to me that we curate our language about technique. I don't really believe in "bad," "ugly," or "horrible." That is a way to say, "I don't like it, but I don't know why."
It is more helpful for us as learners to say, the voice isn't balanced, the vibrato is too narrow, the breath isn't released. Then we can really discuss what is going on.
Thanks again for watching and sharing!
Lawd, what is that horrid sound at the very beginning? Yikes.. Thought I was going to hear Birgit or Ghena but instead it was you-know-who... She should have stayed away from that repertoire..
Thanks for watching! The first singer is not actually "you-know-who." This singer is very well accepted in the dramatic repertoire. It just goes to show that even though rep choice is important, developing a solid technique is even MORE important to longevity.
She did rather quickly.
But has sung Isolde for 20 years.
Christine Goerke 🤦🏻♂️
Vibrato is so hard! Especially if you aren't lucky enough to get really good training 😭
@@evan-dunn
She later on got an inverted vibrato and sings more flat than ever, a truly horrific voice nowadays.
@@draganvidic2039 😭
Your hating ass gets on my damn nerves 🖕🏻
CG needs a good year or 2 to completely rework her voice and someone who is brutally honest with her. And not sing ANYWHERE until that pitch is fixed. But of course she won't.
wobble is not a technical term. TREMOLO is the term.
Thanks for the comment! Tremolo and wobble are two different technical issues. Tremolo is like a tremolo on a violin where the violinist plays the pitch repeatedly and quickly with the bow, but the pitch doesn't change. So a tremolo vibrato (or caprino) is where the the vibrato pitch isn't changing enough. A wobble is where there is plenty of width in the pitch (or too much width), often a wobble is too slow, but the main aspect of a wobble is that the accent is in the wrong place, and that makes the vibrato harder and harder so it continues to slow down and get wider. Hope that helps!
@@evan-dunn You clearly don't know music. Tremolo in the voice is a vocal problem
IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE VIOLIN WHEN DISCUSSUNG VOCAL PEDAGOGY.
Next you'll tell us portamento on the piano and portamento in singing are the same.
Read Lilli Lehmann's MEINE GESANGSKUNST!
Oh, sorry, Einsprachler könnten mit Deutsch nie und nimm
er klarkommen! Vous n'en savez rien.
@@der_Allsehende_Seher It is pretty common for different pedagogues to use the same term differently or use different terms to describe the same thing. And not that this has anything to do with the the topic, but I speak three languages including German.
@@evan-dunn Ich wett, auf Deutsch könntest DU es in tausend Jahren mit mir nie aufnehmen. Geh und LERNE etwas Gescheites, bevor du anderen falsche Information weitergibst.
@@der_Allsehende_Seher 😆You're probably right. I'll probably never be able to compete with you in German! 🤣
Que tonteria
Thanks for your comment! Sorry it wasn't very helpful for you. Understanding vibrato in depth has been a crucial part of my vocal development, and the development for my students. Hope you have a lovely day and keep finding joy in your singing!
This is quite stupid, amateur analysis.
Thanks for your comment! Learning this turned my voice around and it helps my students everyday. Sorry it wasn't to your liking! I hope you find joy on your singing journey ❤
Cut all 'this' b'shit. It's the end result that counts! How about Supervia? People would BOO her today. And , Olivero etc It is what it is. GOT IT??
Hello! Thanks for your comment. I'm not sure if you are saying that you like Supervía and Olivero as singers. I love them! 😍 Regardless I hope you have a great day.
No one gets booed today, so that would not happen. Any type of bad singing is only cheered on today.
@@ZENOBlAmusic Yet another reason that training our ears is so crucial!
The whole field of teaching singers is full of cow manure Haha because hardly any of it is based on clear scientific evidence (except the importance of breath control).
I agree with you about Superviva. I used to think her vibrato was hilarious. Until I realised that IN HER DAY it was the height of fashion. Check out Marion Anderson, one of the finest singers ever to come out of the US and strictly taught in Germany .... she could turn on her vibrato with a switch and used it to great emotional effect.
Then to hear the OPPOSITE fashion, try if you can bear it, to listen to recently remastered recordings of Nellie Melba, around 1905 to 1915 in Covent Garden. Almost zero vibrato. 😱 Every note strong and steady (and boring) as a rock, and so she was internationally regarded as one of the world's top singers, etc etc. It was high fashion then, but for me almost unlistenable.
The singing teachers can pontificate all they like.
@@theon9575 Thanks for your comment! Hope you enjoyed the video!