@nineyearsago-kg8yq It makes perfect sense. It's not grammatically correct but that doesn't mean it doesn't make sense. Try not to be a pratt, okay? This is not a forum for writing perfectly constructed sentences. It's a forum for stating your views, and that often means casting metaphorical stones. The opportunity to throw metaphorical stones is, in fact, one of the most valuable aspects of such comment forums, providing a non-violent outlet for frustrations people feel in today's world. A view expressed in such a forum is not invalid because it is ungrammatical. Perhaps you'd like me to follow you on RUclips to see if your own views are always expressed in perfectly formed sentences; and declare, whenever they don't, that your views are invalid, even though I understand your meaning perfectly?
Ahhh Waleed. Every time he has been challenged that I’ve seen he basically sits there and blinks. I’m sure he doesn’t get challenged often so feels lost when he is.
When you say leftie bubble I heard a good comment on the radio a few weeks ago, they summed up the difference between people on the right and left. They said if someone on the right is a vegetarian they don't eat meat. If someone on the left is a vegetarian they want to force everyone else not to eat meat and want to shut down and cancel anyone who doesn't do as they say.
Waleed was the idiot that protested against plastic bags in supermarkets now I have 300 plastic carrier bags at home 😂 people used to use them as there bin bags but now have to buy there plastic bin bags so where is the plastic problem solved 😂😂😂
Agree. I used to recycle / reuse every plastic bag. Now I have to buy them. Plus buy bags for food. Payday for supermarkets. Again the Greens - helping the rich get richer.
I am old enough to remember my government in Singapore having advertising campaigns to shame people who don’t use plastic bags to dispose rubbish. Now they are doing complete opposite. Because “science” and “environment”.
@@MrMightyytau "its not allowed in EUROPE as it doesn't pass pedestrian safety regs" I've heard that before, but I don't understand what regulation it's violating. The front of a Cybertruck is no more pointed than a Model 3 or other cars. I don't see how being hit by an F-150 would be any better.
Before the CyberDumpster ever got delivered there was a Meme vid that went viral of an Uber driver with a 6 foot long mobile phone on his console, as he punches in the destination the Nav voice responds with a deafening roar; when I saw the first real review of the loltruck's dash; my first thought was "OMG it's that meme become real!"
MGUY Australia. Don't know if you read the comments to see this, but here in America, I just watched one of our Governors from the state of Virginia (east coast) give a news announcement. The state is ENDING the California Mandate for Virginian's who were being forced to own at least 35% EV'S by 2026. Their state legislators canceled that ridiculous mandate, effective December 31, 2024.
@@paulwood5738 ...your welcome, friend. Are you an American? Until today, I wasn't aware of any California mandate. Wonder if 49 more states need to follow Virginia.
That is great! Meanwhile Canada has said zero gas or diesel sales as of 2035 with percentages of EV’s having to be sold by increasing increments over the years prior.
I just wish the government would stay out of it and let the people who want to make and own EVs do their thing. Then, if they fail, it's only hurting them, and not everybody else. If they succeed, we'll all be very happy for them, and they'll make really good money.
Problem is that the politicians are fully "invested". Every time they attended their world economic forums, its just insider trading on steroids. They all agreed to push EV's on us, and the first thing they did was invest their own money into lithium mining shares, so they could make as much money as possible. That's why the governments are freaking out about the EV crash, its their own personal money evaporating.
That 'Fly by Wire' Steering system would NOT PASS a simple Roadworthy Test. It would be called Steering Play hence (usually) replace the Steering Components and remove the 'slop' . 🇦🇺
Had a young guy at home today trying to sell me a battery for my solar system ,$15.000 dollars, all this green energy is a scam ,he kept mentioning there are government rebates ,I told him if they were worthwhile they wouldn't need tax payers money to prop them up .
Brilliant video, as always. Great job, Mguy! It just so happens I'm on an island in Greece these days. Just wanted to say there are moto scooters all over the place. Some of them are 30 years old by the looks of them. And guess what: they are running JUST FINE, no maintenance, no complicated tweaks, no protection in the shade, no worry to fill the tank to 80%, no any of the EV nonsense. And THEY ARE RUNNING FOREVER, and are cheap and everybody LOVES them. I guess that's why they need be tossed in the bin.... right? :)
One can greatly mitigate the risk in a proper deployment of what has come to be known as ‘fly by wire’. for example of basic principle is to have three redundant computers where all three have to agree on their basic state before you can operate the vehicle. This truck does not seem to be that, but it can be a good thing. That said, my power steering has gone out on me several times over the decades, and it was always good to be able to muscle the car where i wanted it to go.
Yeh, I don't know how any countries regulations would allow it. If course aircraft do but that's an entirely different thing in that amongst other things, the costs aren't an issue and a fraction of a second lag (if it ever existed) would probably never run the risk of crashing into another aircraft.
Your comment at 9:05 interested me. A lot of people seem to confuse new with better. Progress has two essential components - change and improvement. Having change without improvement is regression. The former is the smartphone and the latter the EV.
Great work as always MGUY. Waleed is a self righteous pompous that is intelligent and can articulate extremely well however has chosen his path as a basic. I’m being rather generous here BTW.
If there is no physical connection between the steering wheel and road wheels and it relies on electrical power, what happens if the power fails? Progress is supposed to be about making things better!
Similar issue with power steering on an ICE? Well the power assist is gone and you have to be a brute to turn the steering. However that has never happened to me. And if it did you'd still be able to steer it towards the shoulder.
@@DwayneSwanson-w2q It did happen to me: I was at a red light in my Dad's 65 Impala SS, and when I took off from the light, the motor slid back on its mounts, which resulted in the accelerator linkage being yanked, and I felt the accelerator pedal go to the floor from under my foot. The car started peeling out, and at that moment I realized I had also no power steering (the hose had been pulled out when the motor slid back). I put the car in neutral, wrangled it to the side of the road and turned it off. In a Tesla I might have been doing 90 before I could do anything about it.
A bit of clarification based on my experience about the Nokia phones. By the time the Iphone came out in 2007, most people had moved on from the Nokia indestructible phones. I had a razer flip phone like a lot of people then. There was tons of Blackberry's being sold at the time, and in truth, Iphone originally was eating the Blackberry market. So her comment about Nokia phones being replaced by he Iphone is a bit of a fallacy. It's like saying the Ford Mustang replaced the Ford Model A.
The real problem with steer by wire is these trucks will not be new forever. Yes, jets use a type of steer by wire, but they are expertly inspected and maintained/repaired under strict government rules. No jet is ever going to be a 20 year old hooptie with no insurance, fake stickers and a 20 year old operating and responsible for repair/maintenance.
are you sure those jets sold first to asia than to africa are not several decades out of proper maintenance? oh, you do not want to be africa level in the usa? too bad.
The fly by wire systems in aircraft would be about the cost of a couple of Cyber trucks. Even though they are far more advanced they still suffer lag issues regularly, originally dubbed the "JC maneuver", the industry demanded it to be referred to as 'Pilot Induced Oscillation', but that term itself is a lie because it implies pilot error when it is wholly a computer error.
@thorin1045 - Asian aircraft operators, such as Singapore Airlines, Japan Airlines, Malaysia Airlines and Thai Airways International, operate second-hand aircraft with out-of-date maintenance? Are you sure about that?
Regarding the battery charge for an EV on a boat ferry. It has concerned me for a while that condos and apartments with several units in one building, each having a garage could be dangerous. If for any reason one began to burn, the fire would quickly spread to the whole building. In the middle of the night, it would be a massacre. The same problem could arise in a large apartment building with several hundred units and a large basement parking garage. We haven't heard the last of this problem.
My favorite memory is of Christopher Hitchens, showing Waleed Aly exactly where he stands on the totem pole intellectually, morally, ideologically and philosophically on Q&A 15 years back. Never before have I seen a man so reduced to nothing and perhaps I never will again. Rest in peace Christopher
Here's one for you, An alpaca farm in Malvern Uk wants to put in a tea room, the local planning authorities say they have to put in an ev charge point in the car park to get planning permission. This will cost £65K just to run the power cables from the entrance to the car park then they have to get a third party company to supply and manage the charger, if this remains a clause in the planning they will have to close due to the costs. The local supermarkets do not have or require chargers and why should an ev charger be required and not a petrol pump.
For those that down't know aircraft encountered this lag problem. It was initially called the "JC maneuver" due to the pilot's utterance when it occurred. A religious engineer complained and they became "pilot induced osculations." They have crashed many aircraft.
I have worked with electronic servo systems for years. Servo lag and oscillation problems were solved 40 years ago. They just tried to reinvent that wheel and haven't considered what has already been done.
Servo speed depends on the power of the servo. It appears the Cybertruck servo is underpowered, so it can’t turn the wheels as fast as the steering wheel requests. It has to overcome friction and inertia. It may work faster if the vehicle is in motion. In any case, I don’t want it.
@@softwarephil1709 Exactly what I was thinking, that is typical of a underpowered system, I wonder what back up is there in case of servo motor failure which will happen. Don't tell me, the car automatically calls your undertaker, so that's alright then ! 😲😂
Well steering with feedback using a classic steering wheel is done at 1/2 the speed of sound in that medium/metal. That is 2.5km/s or in around 0.0008s... so basically instantly for all intents and purposes. As once one great man said: "future my arse!"
I said it once and I shall say it again: are there algorithms at work, that prevent your excellent and informative channel from ever gaining followers? Subscriptions never seem to make it past 70k. Strange... very strange.🤔🤔🇦🇺
This amazes me. Have the eggheads who wrote that paper EVER driven a car? Have they ever had to manage a potential skid situation? Incredible. That steering issue is really serious. In off roader circles that's referred to as 'death wobble' and typically is caused by excess play in the linkage. At highway speeds it can cause complete loss of control. Personally I DO NOT WANT 'steer by wire'. AT ALL. PERIOD. The traditional hydraulic system works very well and keeps you connected to the steering with even a pump failure or engine shutdown (albeit with much more effort, but it's manageable in emergency) Same thing with brakes.
No, it's not serious. I challenge you to make the wheel go from extreme left turn to extreme right turn with less than 1 revolution of the driving wheel. IT IS A SAFETY FEATURE. I don't know if I'd want to drive a F-B-W car, but this is completely understandable behaviour of the system. And do not confuse that with excess play in the linkage. The latter is dangerous, of course, but it has nothing to do with the way the steering is fransferred fromdirving wheel to the road wheel beyond the simple fact it's a mechanical problem. F-B-W lag is something completely different, ESPECIALLY at any driving speed. If I could do the same in my diesel skoda what the dude on the video did, even at city speed limit, I would flip my car immediately. Think about it and you'll see it, too.
@@gmaacentralfounder The problem is NOT the lock to lock. The problem is the time delay--it's always behind your input. You need to have immediate response to your input. And as as pointed out this can create a serious feedback loop with constant over-correction Not just steering, ANY user process that requires precise control needs zero lag. Imagine, for example, trying to manually focus a camera, or align a laser tool with a lag time,
@@gmaacentralfounder You are confusing fast ratio with time lag. It is possible for steering to be 'too fast', i.e. easy to over respond, but the answer is NOT some gimmicky fast ratio. Years of performance sports car development have established a reasonable balance between too fast and too slow (including sine vert good variable ratios, slower in center fast toward the extremes--it was always possible to build these systems, but automakers realized they would not be good) but these were all tuned to comfortable human response times. Humans have not changed. Time lag, though is absolutely NEVER good under any circumstance that requires fast, accurate and predictable response. The feedback loop is destructive to accuracy and control and will result in toxic overcorrections. When you tweak the wheel, it needs to respond immediately and predictably, not a fraction of a second later.
Don't remember wanting a smartphone. It gradually creeped into our lives and now runs our lives and destroys the brains of our young kids. Not sure if a smartphone is a good idea or a really bad one. There are other major issues with the smartphone and Its value is debatable.
The variable steering rate article does actually come to its rescue. The basics of the concept are that if you are doing a very short throw/"lock to lock" on your steering then you need to have a variety of ranges of wheel angle that "full lock" will actually equate to, based on speed. As you wouldn't want to go full wheel limit while at 100mph for example, you'd grip roll. But if you keep the wheel's rotation rate constant (in terms of degrees per second) which is the approach they have gone for in order to prevent tyre scrubbing this means at low speeds where the wheel limits are large there will be a noticable delay. Or in other words stationary/parking speeds, where the 90 degree throw on the steering wheel might equate to 40 degree throw on the actual wheels if you're locked at 50 degrees a second this means you'll get a delay of .8s to reach full lock. Meanwhile on the highway the wheel limit will likely only be 20 or so degrees, meaning that same full lock time would now be a .4 second delay which is about normal. Every car with steer by wire has this kind of approach as far as I know. Just that the cybertruck is more noticable because they have a low wheel rotation rate on it to save the tyres.. Even basic power steering actually has a delay on it too, because when you use power steering you do not actually rotate the wheel, you apply load to pressure sensors which then themselves turn the wheel. That's why it feels completely different (more than just being heavier) when the power steering is not working or the engine is off..
@@badchefiit’s is amazing that you present an overall step backwards in the use of an EV as a a advancement. The only advancement is in the motive power - the actual refueling is a massive step back and no matter how you dress it up, everyone can see that. Refueling a car in 60 seconds is more advanced that refueling it in 1 hour to 9 hours. End of story.
I have a flip phone. NO internet, NO touchscreen, NO "apps". But I would much rather have a 100% analog phone, like the mid '80s Motorola DynaTAC 8000X.
Hey MGUY, you need to do a piece on the recently released UK SMMT sales figures for May. Your take on the declining EV sales and the rapidly increasing diesel sales would be a wonder to watch. Cheers.😊
Imagine driving your EV around the Greek islands in the middle of summer at 38 degrees C, that’s 100.4 degrees F, and having to drive to the port with the heater going full blast just so you can catch the next ferry.🥵
On my Greek island there is only one charging service at a supermarket. Never saw any car stopped there though. Yesterday the temperature was 42° under shade (and shade is pretty rare here). It's not a good environment for an EV.
Thank you for your program. I love cars. I still have my first car a 1966 Morris Mini Deluxe, Australian built, also a 1976 Leyland Mini Van. A 1965 MG 1100. And also a 2010 Ford Falcon XR6 and a Holden Commodore SV6. And my daily driver is a 2000 Toyota Echo, with nearly 200,000 kilometres on it. It just doesn’t miss a beat. I’ve spent $25.00 dollars on it since my ownership, on gas struts for the rear hatch. I service it myself which is super easy. EV’s. No. I love my internal combustion engine cars. Thank you. Keep up the good work.
Combustion will dominate (again) when new combustion tech makes EVs very obsolete. Combustion will be around for 100s of years as the benefits are many that EVs cannot provide. Happy to discuss it on your channel.
It's been a long time since junior level process controls. However, a delay tends to prevent out of control oscillations. Because you have enough time to react to the control. In general, the result is supposed to be a stable swing. If you look at any well-controlled system, it's normally not flat, but oscillates within a relatively tight range. Extrapolating quite a bit, I'm guessing that's the reason why there is a delay. It's the easiest way to prevent an out-of-control swing
Servo speed depends on the power of the servo. It appears the Cybertruck servo is underpowered, so it can’t turn the wheels as fast as the steering wheel requests. It has to overcome friction and inertia. It may work faster if the vehicle is in motion. In any case, I don’t want it.
That video was Cleetus McFarland at the Freedom Factory testing the cyber truck against the hummer ev to see which was the best one of the two, he noted the delay but when driving it along the road next to the track, he tested the delay and it was pretty responsive.
Ignoring recharging speed, I don't want to have to hunt for a charger when in a real car I can easily find gas stations, and I see a broken gas pump about once every few months (compared with the reliability of chargers). Vacations are meant to be relaxing, not more stressful than staying at work.
Sales of EVs grew by more than 100% in some markets last year. This includes Australia, Thailand, Brazil, Turkey, Malaysia, and Mexico. Meanwhile, India and Japan saw growth of above 50%.
Input delay leads to overcompensation and counter-overcompensation. No Cybertruck reviewers said anything about steering weirdness, so I don't know what this could be about. Might be some issue with just this one.
i'm pretty sure every reviewer i've seen said the steering 'feels weird' and takes getting used to. .125ms isn't going to make much of a difference in a normal drive, but it will feel odd and will be an issue with fast corrections. didn't see any reviewer trying a slalom, it was all putting around town.
Curious if there is any science behind the 40% charge safety requirement on EV's being shipped. I mean the higher the charge the more energy and risk sure, but is reducing the battery to half charge make much of a difference? Should the batteries all be empty?
lithium batteries take damage if kept discharged. Fun thing is: I retrieved my BEV out of warranty service yesterday (an E-Scooter bought in 2022). Guess what, the battery was causing all sort of electric issues and was replaced (for free), after less than 100 hours of operating time. BEV fanboys continue to insist that this couldn't be possible and modern batteries now are guaranteed to last decades. Dudes, chemistry doesn't change overnight because Elon Musk said so.
@@svr5423 In general modern batteries need to be kept at 80% charge as much as possible. Going to low or to high shortens the life span. So yeah forcing people to drain their cars to some low charge just to ride a ferry every day for work would absolutely kill the Ev's battery life for sure.
As EVBoy’s official mentor, I feel compelled to point out that it is time to gently pivot away from the Anti-EV stance. That ship has sailed! I suggest starting with positive posts on the latest PHEV vehicles. That way, you don’t look a complete dork, when even the most rabid EV hater will have to concede defeat.
The cyber truck wouldn't be allowed in Australia since steer by wire isn't legal. For context, I wanted to convert my 4x4 to fully hydraulic steering but wasn't allowed because there is no steering if it fails. The same applies to steer by wire.
Your first article. This is exactly what happens in airplanes. It's common in fly by wire airplanes when they are first tested and the control systems are being tweaked and tested. It's called pilot induced oscillation. Or in the case of a car driver induced... Obviously they didn't test this system enough.
Lag problem in the video shown could be the truck isn't moving. Little know fact that many Power Steering setups have High Caster for the front wheels that's harder to steer for the system at low speed or at idle. Drive by Wire systems on any vehicle maybe can "lag" at idle to protect the steering motor(s) from abuse by drivers for this issue. Otherwise the abuse can cause Steering Failure like Some Aircraft Crashes cause by strip gears in the Ruder etc in decades past.
Australian MSM is mostly complicit in respect all that I've told you. Did you know that on channel 7 said on morning TV the reason the FBI went into Trump and Bidens residence was to acquire documents related to the US Military supplying nuclear weapons to foreign states. One of which was Australia. Did you know P@O cruisers pulled up stumps this week? The ship that rolled into Sydney after COVid delivered nukes to take out Sydney. Warragamba, the Snowy and many other locations were on the list and the same for many other countries.
He's a protected species only because of his religious beliefs. Pure and simple. He's divisive & frankly dangerous. Used by the establishment like a puppet.
I've driven several vehicles like forklifts and other utility vehicles like street sweepers, that had electronic steering or hydraulic steering with much better response.
Waleed Aly is what Murray Rothbard, in his 1976 essay, would qualify as a court jester. Quentin Wilson is another one. "In exchange for their continuing work of apologetics and bamboozlement, the Court Intellectuals win their place as junior partners in the power, prestige and loot extracted by the State apparatus from the deluded public".
The CyberJunk is a textbook example of releasing a beta test project on the public and letting them find all of the bugs. Safety and lives be damned. Repugnant business model.
The point about the variable ratio is valid. As the high ratio will magnify the lag. But that high ratio is only at low speeds where oscillation isn't an issue. It's still an issue but not as extreme as the video makes it seem.
Although I may agree with a lot of what you say, the Nokia 3210 was with doubt 10 times better than any smartphone. I used to charge mine up once a week, whether it needed it or not. Unlike my iPhones which have to be charged every day (sometimes twice).
I have worked on control systems including vehicle steering. I agree with your assessment that variable gain steering and lag are different issues. That said, a poorly designed variable gain steering system is far more likely to introduce lag etc, especially when combined with other non-linearities such as traction control and other interventions. Looks bloody awful.
I have a solution for the Greek ferry problem. Connect the EV car batteries to the EV ferry batteries and discharge until 40% is reached and use the charge up the EV ferry batteries to enable the crossing. Now that is the silliest idea I've had up to now!
8:42 " listening to that comment about the Nokia phones that we were so Keen to hang on to no we weren't we could see the iPhones were a much better product they did more things" It's pretty apt analogy. The OG 3310 had a standby time of 11 days, and not sure how long you could play snake for, but I did a bit :D The original iPhone's battery life was considered mediocre even at the time of its release in 2007. The OG iPhone also didn't do a lot of what it can now at time of launch, there was no app store, web browsing was pretty average, but you could see the path to where we are now and what the future would bring (even if it is still a one day battery life) EVs are very much the same, quiet, smooth, autonomous, low maintenance, all of these things out of the gate are better than old ICE equivalents, while battery range is not a match for all use cases, it's pretty clear the path, technology permitting. When I got my p990 with it's keyboard, stylus and, for the time, great camera, at the time the main driver in the market was for ever smaller phones. I doubt many people dropped $$ on that phone, it was quite expensive if I remember correctly (and that savage depreciation! lol), but models like that predicted what was to come.
I'm all for Net Zero. Lets start with EVs and immigration.....
And politicians......
Good one!!
😂👍🏻
That gold! 👍
Yeah like the two are so connected. You turkey.
Waleed Aly is a pathetic attempt of someone trying to be to act smart.
A wolf in wolves clothing
Not trying to act smart. Rather, pandering to the demographic that they determine watches a show like The Project through focus groups.
He's the joy behar equivalent on the Australian version of The Spew
Has won "Most Hated", "Most Arrogantly Opinionated" and "Most Punchable Face" TV awards 10 years running un-challenged.
@nineyearsago-kg8yq It makes perfect sense. It's not grammatically correct but that doesn't mean it doesn't make sense. Try not to be a pratt, okay? This is not a forum for writing perfectly constructed sentences. It's a forum for stating your views, and that often means casting metaphorical stones. The opportunity to throw metaphorical stones is, in fact, one of the most valuable aspects of such comment forums, providing a non-violent outlet for frustrations people feel in today's world. A view expressed in such a forum is not invalid because it is ungrammatical. Perhaps you'd like me to follow you on RUclips to see if your own views are always expressed in perfectly formed sentences; and declare, whenever they don't, that your views are invalid, even though I understand your meaning perfectly?
Mr. Toad's wild ride at Disneyland has superior steering to the cybertruck.
😂😆
Bonus points for the color LOL
And better styling, too
👍
Even after licking Mr Toad first & be on a trip 😉
Ahhh Waleed. Every time he has been challenged that I’ve seen he basically sits there and blinks. I’m sure he doesn’t get challenged often so feels lost when he is.
Do people actually watch that show?
@@niftynev4779 Nobody that I know watches it. I can't believe it's still on air. It used to be an alright show back in the Charlie Pickering days.
Waleed Aly is a very succesful PRETENDER in our Society.
Always feel 'creepy crawley' everytime he talks. 🇦🇺
The same guy that said terrirism is just part and parcel of living in the modern world
He has a certain 'sneer' to his face I do not trust.
Is he the ex first minister of Scotland's brother? They were certainly stamped out in the same ideological factory.
Cringey Wally is his nickname.
The sad thing is we have too many of those in society especially in high places governing the people in some manner.
When you say leftie bubble I heard a good comment on the radio a few weeks ago, they summed up the difference between people on the right and left.
They said if someone on the right is a vegetarian they don't eat meat.
If someone on the left is a vegetarian they want to force everyone else not to eat meat and want to shut down and cancel anyone who doesn't do as they say.
That's a great comment
When it comes to spending your money there's no difference, 2 sides of the same coin.
Nailed it.
Righties still want control over me & my Private Property
I'm not 'Left' or 'Right' because Politics is for the Inferior sheep
Well it's a two way street bud , there are as many loonies on the right as there are on the left .
Waleed was the idiot that protested against plastic bags in supermarkets now I have 300 plastic carrier bags at home 😂 people used to use them as there bin bags but now have to buy there plastic bin bags so where is the plastic problem solved 😂😂😂
The town I live in it's nearly impossible to find or get a plastic bag only the cheap Chinese throwaway shops have them
Agree. I used to recycle / reuse every plastic bag. Now I have to buy them. Plus buy bags for food. Payday for supermarkets. Again the Greens - helping the rich get richer.
Their.
I currently still use a little nokia phone. I will likely never buy an iPhone.
I am old enough to remember my government in Singapore having advertising campaigns to shame people who don’t use plastic bags to dispose rubbish. Now they are doing complete opposite. Because “science” and “environment”.
The Cybertruck looks like a Hollywood prop for a cheap scifi movie. Except the prop probably would be better.
And, on top of all that, it has to be the ugliest truck on the planet!
The Pontiac Aztec is feeling a little better about itself.
It definitely gives the chevy ssr a run for it's money.
and its not allowed in EUROPE as it doesn't pass pedestrian safety regs
replacing the pontiac aztec.
@@MrMightyytau "its not allowed in EUROPE as it doesn't pass pedestrian safety regs" I've heard that before, but I don't understand what regulation it's violating. The front of a Cybertruck is no more pointed than a Model 3 or other cars. I don't see how being hit by an F-150 would be any better.
So Wiley Coyote's idea of painting a tunnel on a rock to deceive Roadrunner wasn't so balmy after all.
I still say having a huge touchscreen with everything important on it off set where you need to take your eyes off the road to operate is madness.
100% agree!
Worse than a phone
Before the CyberDumpster ever got delivered there was a Meme vid that went viral of an Uber driver with a 6 foot long mobile phone on his console, as he punches in the destination the Nav voice responds with a deafening roar; when I saw the first real review of the loltruck's dash; my first thought was "OMG it's that meme become real!"
And during certain times of day, it can blind you due to no anti-glare protection. Heck it can happen at night too due to streetlights!
There will be a rise in deaths on the road its not just the distractions in the car but also the weight of them.
The pushback is gaining speed !
MGUY Australia. Don't know if you read the comments to see this, but here in America, I just watched one of our Governors from the state of Virginia (east coast) give a news announcement. The state is ENDING the California Mandate for Virginian's who were being forced to own at least 35% EV'S by 2026. Their state legislators canceled that ridiculous mandate, effective December 31, 2024.
Great news, thanks for sharing.
@@paulwood5738 ...your welcome, friend. Are you an American? Until today, I wasn't aware of any California mandate.
Wonder if 49 more states need to follow Virginia.
That is great! Meanwhile Canada has said zero gas or diesel sales as of 2035 with percentages of EV’s having to be sold by increasing increments over the years prior.
@@SandiKlein Just the same as here in UK.
I don't get how california was mandating anything for virginians?
Remember the first time they unveiled this indestructible beast, and put a rock through the bulletproof glass?
Great times
😂😂😂 Infamous incident.
Twice.
Yep failed unveil and continues it's consistent failure.
Self driving companies want safety swept aside so they can make money rather than fix their junky products
I just wish the government would stay out of it and let the people who want to make and own EVs do their thing. Then, if they fail, it's only hurting them, and not everybody else. If they succeed, we'll all be very happy for them, and they'll make really good money.
Problem is that the politicians are fully "invested". Every time they attended their world economic forums, its just insider trading on steroids. They all agreed to push EV's on us, and the first thing they did was invest their own money into lithium mining shares, so they could make as much money as possible. That's why the governments are freaking out about the EV crash, its their own personal money evaporating.
It's all about climate change.
I love these shorts. They're enough to give fanbois nightmares.
That 'Fly by Wire' Steering system would NOT PASS a simple Roadworthy Test. It would be called Steering Play hence (usually) replace the Steering Components and remove the 'slop' . 🇦🇺
Absolutely. I drive truck. They check this at inspections.
Had a young guy at home today trying to sell me a battery for my solar system ,$15.000 dollars, all this green energy is a scam ,he kept mentioning there are government rebates ,I told him if they were worthwhile they wouldn't need tax payers money to prop them up .
Waleed has a face for radio and a voice for print
A popular face choice for dartboards, novelty toilet paper prints and punching bags.
@@wobblyboost
Also for toilet pans-guaranteed cure for constipation but would incur the ire of companies producing laxatives.
if you had that much play in a normal truck you would never get an inspection sticker probably be ban from driving it
Looks like a worn worm & peg system from the beginning of time, but at least it WAS connected.
My understanding is there should be direct mechanical connection from steering wheel to wheels for safety if the power assistance fails
@@garreysellars5525 Elon is a weirdo he thinks he can reinvent the wheel
@@OM617aif your car has cruise control, throttle by wire is what you have
@@brucewoods9377 Older cars had (have?) mechanical cable linkages in cruise control.
Our Ports in Australia are All Full with unwanted E.Vs
Brilliant video, as always. Great job, Mguy!
It just so happens I'm on an island in Greece these days. Just wanted to say there are moto scooters all over the place. Some of them are 30 years old by the looks of them. And guess what: they are running JUST FINE, no maintenance, no complicated tweaks, no protection in the shade, no worry to fill the tank to 80%, no any of the EV nonsense. And THEY ARE RUNNING FOREVER, and are cheap and everybody LOVES them. I guess that's why they need be tossed in the bin.... right? :)
Yassou phile! Which island?
Surely a not positively connected steering mechanism is dangerous?
It's absolutely ridiculous.
One can greatly mitigate the risk in a proper deployment of what has come to be known as ‘fly by wire’. for example of basic principle is to have three redundant computers where all three have to agree on their basic state before you can operate the vehicle. This truck does not seem to be that, but it can be a good thing. That said, my power steering has gone out on me several times over the decades, and it was always good to be able to muscle the car where i wanted it to go.
Extremely!
Yeh, I don't know how any countries regulations would allow it. If course aircraft do but that's an entirely different thing in that amongst other things, the costs aren't an issue and a fraction of a second lag (if it ever existed) would probably never run the risk of crashing into another aircraft.
@@paul756uk2plus they are tested regularly on AC
Your comment at 9:05 interested me. A lot of people seem to confuse new with better. Progress has two essential components - change and improvement. Having change without improvement is regression. The former is the smartphone and the latter the EV.
Great work as always MGUY. Waleed is a self righteous pompous that is intelligent and can articulate extremely well however has chosen his path as a basic. I’m being rather generous here BTW.
Waleed is a lawyer, need I say more?
10 years ago. A fly by wire steering wheel would be laughed at by all auto manufacturers.
Steer-by-wire without the use of a steering column was first offered in a production car with the Infiniti Q50 in 2013.
And ADR COMPLIANCE
AUSTRALIAN
DESIGN
RULES
Today, they still are...
Some of us DONT want a I phone either , no phone at all actually 👍
If there is no physical connection between the steering wheel and road wheels and it relies on electrical power, what happens if the power fails? Progress is supposed to be about making things better!
As my Dad would have said, "Just one more thing to break..."
What if only the steering fails... while going 75mph in traffic on the interstate 😂.
That can’t happen… can’t happe… can’t hap… can’t ha..
Similar issue with power steering on an ICE? Well the power assist is gone and you have to be a brute to turn the steering. However that has never happened to me. And if it did you'd still be able to steer it towards the shoulder.
@@DwayneSwanson-w2q It did happen to me: I was at a red light in my Dad's 65 Impala SS, and when I took off from the light, the motor slid back on its mounts, which resulted in the accelerator linkage being yanked, and I felt the accelerator pedal go to the floor from under my foot. The car started peeling out, and at that moment I realized I had also no power steering (the hose had been pulled out when the motor slid back). I put the car in neutral, wrangled it to the side of the road and turned it off.
In a Tesla I might have been doing 90 before I could do anything about it.
A bit of clarification based on my experience about the Nokia phones. By the time the Iphone came out in 2007, most people had moved on from the Nokia indestructible phones. I had a razer flip phone like a lot of people then. There was tons of Blackberry's being sold at the time, and in truth, Iphone originally was eating the Blackberry market. So her comment about Nokia phones being replaced by he Iphone is a bit of a fallacy. It's like saying the Ford Mustang replaced the Ford Model A.
The Erickson were good for their time as well. Picked one up overseas. Solid little things with a good camera (for the time)
i think you forget the propaganda project show doesn’t hire based on high iq scores,facts confuse them
The real problem with steer by wire is these trucks will not be new forever. Yes, jets use a type of steer by wire, but they are expertly inspected and maintained/repaired under strict government rules. No jet is ever going to be a 20 year old hooptie with no insurance, fake stickers and a 20 year old operating and responsible for repair/maintenance.
are you sure those jets sold first to asia than to africa are not several decades out of proper maintenance? oh, you do not want to be africa level in the usa? too bad.
The idiots who buy these damn things brand new don't think they need maintenance either.
@@thorin1045 Two words.... Spirit Airlines.
The fly by wire systems in aircraft would be about the cost of a couple of Cyber trucks. Even though they are far more advanced they still suffer lag issues regularly, originally dubbed the "JC maneuver", the industry demanded it to be referred to as 'Pilot Induced Oscillation', but that term itself is a lie because it implies pilot error when it is wholly a computer error.
@thorin1045 - Asian aircraft operators, such as Singapore Airlines, Japan Airlines, Malaysia Airlines and Thai Airways International, operate second-hand aircraft with out-of-date maintenance? Are you sure about that?
I wouldn't want to be in a tunnel if an EV catches on fire.
Since Waleed joined The Project I have never met anyone that likes him. I honestly don't know how he is on this show.
Black Rock and Vanguard want him there
Bingo
The idiot is an affirmative action diversity hire , could not be hired for talent or appeal !
What happens when the fuse blows or breaker breaks?
Regarding the battery charge for an EV on a boat ferry. It has concerned me for a while that condos and apartments with several units in one building, each having a garage could be dangerous. If for any reason one began to burn, the fire would quickly spread to the whole building. In the middle of the night, it would be a massacre. The same problem could arise in a large apartment building with several hundred units and a large basement parking garage. We haven't heard the last of this problem.
My favorite memory is of Christopher Hitchens, showing Waleed Aly exactly where he stands on the totem pole intellectually, morally, ideologically and philosophically on Q&A 15 years back. Never before have I seen a man so reduced to nothing and perhaps I never will again. Rest in peace Christopher
Here's one for you, An alpaca farm in Malvern Uk wants to put in a tea room, the local planning authorities say they have to put in an ev charge point in the car park to get planning permission. This will cost £65K just to run the power cables from the entrance to the car park then they have to get a third party company to supply and manage the charger, if this remains a clause in the planning they will have to close due to the costs. The local supermarkets do not have or require chargers and why should an ev charger be required and not a petrol pump.
For those that down't know aircraft encountered this lag problem. It was initially called the "JC maneuver" due to the pilot's utterance when it occurred. A religious engineer complained and they became "pilot induced osculations." They have crashed many aircraft.
*oscillations
Thanks MGUY for the real information.
I have worked with electronic servo systems for years. Servo lag and oscillation problems were solved 40 years ago. They just tried to reinvent that wheel and haven't considered what has already been done.
Servo speed depends on the power of the servo. It appears the Cybertruck servo is underpowered, so it can’t turn the wheels as fast as the steering wheel requests. It has to overcome friction and inertia. It may work faster if the vehicle is in motion. In any case, I don’t want it.
@@softwarephil1709 Exactly what I was thinking, that is typical of a underpowered system, I wonder what back up is there in case of servo motor failure which will happen. Don't tell me, the car automatically calls your undertaker, so that's alright then ! 😲😂
You'd think with all that additional space not taken up by an internal combustion engine that you'd have enough room for a mechanical steering set-up.
All the Greek ferry workers welcoming most cars whilst singing
Hahahaha stayin alive stayin alive.
Well steering with feedback using a classic steering wheel is done at 1/2 the speed of sound in that medium/metal. That is 2.5km/s or in around 0.0008s... so basically instantly for all intents and purposes. As once one great man said: "future my arse!"
This is therapeutic having you defuse my frustrations. I will sleep better now. Thank you.
I said it once and I shall say it again: are there algorithms at work, that prevent your excellent and informative channel from ever gaining followers? Subscriptions never seem to make it past 70k. Strange... very strange.🤔🤔🇦🇺
Same algorithm that buried this comment 30 pages down the comments scroll and made mine entirely invisible. 😁
This amazes me. Have the eggheads who wrote that paper EVER driven a car? Have they ever had to manage a potential skid situation? Incredible.
That steering issue is really serious. In off roader circles that's referred to as 'death wobble' and typically is caused by excess play in the linkage. At highway speeds it can cause complete loss of control.
Personally I DO NOT WANT 'steer by wire'. AT ALL. PERIOD. The traditional hydraulic system works very well and keeps you connected to the steering with even a pump failure or engine shutdown (albeit with much more effort, but it's manageable in emergency)
Same thing with brakes.
No, it's not serious. I challenge you to make the wheel go from extreme left turn to extreme right turn with less than 1 revolution of the driving wheel. IT IS A SAFETY FEATURE. I don't know if I'd want to drive a F-B-W car, but this is completely understandable behaviour of the system. And do not confuse that with excess play in the linkage. The latter is dangerous, of course, but it has nothing to do with the way the steering is fransferred fromdirving wheel to the road wheel beyond the simple fact it's a mechanical problem. F-B-W lag is something completely different, ESPECIALLY at any driving speed. If I could do the same in my diesel skoda what the dude on the video did, even at city speed limit, I would flip my car immediately.
Think about it and you'll see it, too.
@@gmaacentralfounder The problem is NOT the lock to lock. The problem is the time delay--it's always behind your input. You need to have immediate response to your input. And as as pointed out this can create a serious feedback loop with constant over-correction
Not just steering, ANY user process that requires precise control needs zero lag. Imagine, for example, trying to manually focus a camera, or align a laser tool with a lag time,
@@gmaacentralfounder You are confusing fast ratio with time lag. It is possible for steering to be 'too fast', i.e. easy to over respond, but the answer is NOT some gimmicky fast ratio. Years of performance sports car development have established a reasonable balance between too fast and too slow (including sine vert good variable ratios, slower in center fast toward the extremes--it was always possible to build these systems, but automakers realized they would not be good) but these were all tuned to comfortable human response times. Humans have not changed.
Time lag, though is absolutely NEVER good under any circumstance that requires fast, accurate and predictable response. The feedback loop is destructive to accuracy and control and will result in toxic overcorrections. When you tweak the wheel, it needs to respond immediately and predictably, not a fraction of a second later.
The project is the equivalent of the View in USA
Yeah the smartphone was something everyone wanted..! What a nut
And didn't require tax breaks to sell it, either.
Don't remember wanting a smartphone. It gradually creeped into our lives and now runs our lives and destroys the brains of our young kids. Not sure if a smartphone is a good idea or a really bad one. There are other major issues with the smartphone and Its value is debatable.
@@orwellboy1958or the go to fund public charging stations.
The variable steering rate article does actually come to its rescue. The basics of the concept are that if you are doing a very short throw/"lock to lock" on your steering then you need to have a variety of ranges of wheel angle that "full lock" will actually equate to, based on speed. As you wouldn't want to go full wheel limit while at 100mph for example, you'd grip roll. But if you keep the wheel's rotation rate constant (in terms of degrees per second) which is the approach they have gone for in order to prevent tyre scrubbing this means at low speeds where the wheel limits are large there will be a noticable delay.
Or in other words stationary/parking speeds, where the 90 degree throw on the steering wheel might equate to 40 degree throw on the actual wheels if you're locked at 50 degrees a second this means you'll get a delay of .8s to reach full lock. Meanwhile on the highway the wheel limit will likely only be 20 or so degrees, meaning that same full lock time would now be a .4 second delay which is about normal.
Every car with steer by wire has this kind of approach as far as I know. Just that the cybertruck is more noticable because they have a low wheel rotation rate on it to save the tyres..
Even basic power steering actually has a delay on it too, because when you use power steering you do not actually rotate the wheel, you apply load to pressure sensors which then themselves turn the wheel. That's why it feels completely different (more than just being heavier) when the power steering is not working or the engine is off..
EV transition like for like will take 400 years!!!
@@badchefiwell it’s good you compare EVs with horses. You have to stop and water them just like the horses of old - sorry recharge them.
@@badchefiI bet I know more history in my little finger than you. Your pronouncements are a never ending source of amusement.
@@badchefimy car stops. For 5 minutes
@@badchefiit’s is amazing that you present an overall step backwards in the use of an EV as a a advancement. The only advancement is in the motive power - the actual refueling is a massive step back and no matter how you dress it up, everyone can see that. Refueling a car in 60 seconds is more advanced that refueling it in 1 hour to 9 hours. End of story.
@@badchefiyea that old cliche. Meanwhile on planet earth.
I have a flip phone. NO internet, NO touchscreen, NO "apps". But I would much rather have a 100% analog phone, like the mid '80s Motorola DynaTAC 8000X.
I have a Light Phone 2. Love it.
@@helend2790 I need a phone with actual physical buttons.
No charging for you! 😄
Thats great
Hey MGUY, you need to do a piece on the recently released UK SMMT sales figures for May.
Your take on the declining EV sales and the rapidly increasing diesel sales would be a wonder to watch.
Cheers.😊
Imagine driving your EV around the Greek islands in the middle of summer at 38 degrees C, that’s 100.4 degrees F, and having to drive to the port with the heater going full blast just so you can catch the next ferry.🥵
On my Greek island there is only one charging service at a supermarket. Never saw any car stopped there though. Yesterday the temperature was 42° under shade (and shade is pretty rare here). It's not a good environment for an EV.
No way someone seriously owns a cyber truck. I figured 100% of owners were RUclipsrs just messing around for content.
😂😂😂😂😂 “on my way to piss off a d e m o r c r a t 🙌🏻”
Thank you for your program. I love cars. I still have my first car a 1966 Morris Mini Deluxe, Australian built, also a 1976 Leyland Mini Van. A 1965 MG 1100. And also a 2010 Ford Falcon XR6 and a Holden Commodore SV6. And my daily driver is a 2000 Toyota Echo, with nearly 200,000 kilometres on it. It just doesn’t miss a beat. I’ve spent $25.00 dollars on it since my ownership, on gas struts for the rear hatch. I service it myself which is super easy. EV’s. No. I love my internal combustion engine cars. Thank you. Keep up the good work.
Thought half charged lithium in e-bike's had a problem with exploding?
How STUPID to replace the tried and true power steering for steer-by-wire!? STUPID.
Thanks Simon.
Combustion will dominate (again) when new combustion tech makes EVs very obsolete.
Combustion will be around for 100s of years as the benefits are many that EVs cannot provide.
Happy to discuss it on your channel.
Internal-combustion *_does_* currently dominate.
‘Over decades’….well that could mean anything. 140 years is decades..!
It's been a long time since junior level process controls. However, a delay tends to prevent out of control oscillations. Because you have enough time to react to the control. In general, the result is supposed to be a stable swing. If you look at any well-controlled system, it's normally not flat, but oscillates within a relatively tight range. Extrapolating quite a bit, I'm guessing that's the reason why there is a delay. It's the easiest way to prevent an out-of-control swing
"Wild remarks" = Uncomfortable truths.
Is anyone keeping count of Cybertruck deficiencies? We need a spreadsheet or database.
The steering rack is driven by a stepper motor and it can only move so fast before it risks skipping steps. Basically, the motor is undersized.
Agreed.
Servo speed depends on the power of the servo. It appears the Cybertruck servo is underpowered, so it can’t turn the wheels as fast as the steering wheel requests. It has to overcome friction and inertia. It may work faster if the vehicle is in motion. In any case, I don’t want it.
That video was Cleetus McFarland at the Freedom Factory testing the cyber truck against the hummer ev to see which was the best one of the two, he noted the delay but when driving it along the road next to the track, he tested the delay and it was pretty responsive.
When a corporate executive says "commitment", you know they are not being sincere.
In nature, stupidity is fatal. Now it gets you a gig on TV.
Waleed belongs in Wally World in a Chevy Chase movie.
Thanks
Hopefully RUclips won't eventually adopt rules where content creators are no longer allowed to speak against EVs...
Maybe it’s because anti EV people are telling some incorrect information in amongst the truths they state. 🤔
Ignoring recharging speed, I don't want to have to hunt for a charger when in a real car I can easily find gas stations, and I see a broken gas pump about once every few months (compared with the reliability of chargers).
Vacations are meant to be relaxing, not more stressful than staying at work.
Waleed is the ORIGINAL DEI hire
Sales of EVs grew by more than 100% in some markets last year. This includes Australia, Thailand, Brazil, Turkey, Malaysia, and Mexico. Meanwhile, India and Japan saw growth of above 50%.
Thank you
Input delay leads to overcompensation and counter-overcompensation. No Cybertruck reviewers said anything about steering weirdness, so I don't know what this could be about. Might be some issue with just this one.
A classic unstable system!
i'm pretty sure every reviewer i've seen said the steering 'feels weird' and takes getting used to. .125ms isn't going to make much of a difference in a normal drive, but it will feel odd and will be an issue with fast corrections. didn't see any reviewer trying a slalom, it was all putting around town.
Curious if there is any science behind the 40% charge safety requirement on EV's being shipped. I mean the higher the charge the more energy and risk sure, but is reducing the battery to half charge make much of a difference? Should the batteries all be empty?
Bingo!
lithium batteries take damage if kept discharged.
Fun thing is: I retrieved my BEV out of warranty service yesterday (an E-Scooter bought in 2022).
Guess what, the battery was causing all sort of electric issues and was replaced (for free), after less than 100 hours of operating time.
BEV fanboys continue to insist that this couldn't be possible and modern batteries now are guaranteed to last decades.
Dudes, chemistry doesn't change overnight because Elon Musk said so.
@@svr5423 In general modern batteries need to be kept at 80% charge as much as possible. Going to low or to high shortens the life span. So yeah forcing people to drain their cars to some low charge just to ride a ferry every day for work would absolutely kill the Ev's battery life for sure.
As EVBoy’s official mentor, I feel compelled to point out that it is time to gently pivot away from the Anti-EV stance. That ship has sailed! I suggest starting with positive posts on the latest PHEV vehicles. That way, you don’t look a complete dork, when even the most rabid EV hater will have to concede defeat.
Great stuff
The cyber truck wouldn't be allowed in Australia since steer by wire isn't legal. For context, I wanted to convert my 4x4 to fully hydraulic steering but wasn't allowed because there is no steering if it fails. The same applies to steer by wire.
Your first article. This is exactly what happens in airplanes. It's common in fly by wire airplanes when they are first tested and the control systems are being tweaked and tested. It's called pilot induced oscillation. Or in the case of a car driver induced... Obviously they didn't test this system enough.
Lag problem in the video shown could be the truck isn't moving. Little know fact that many Power Steering setups have High Caster for the front wheels that's harder to steer for the system at low speed or at idle. Drive by Wire systems on any vehicle maybe can "lag" at idle to protect the steering motor(s) from abuse by drivers for this issue. Otherwise the abuse can cause Steering Failure like Some Aircraft Crashes cause by strip gears in the Ruder etc in decades past.
Australian MSM is mostly complicit in respect all that I've told you. Did you know that on channel 7 said on morning TV the reason the FBI went into Trump and Bidens residence was to acquire documents related to the US Military supplying nuclear weapons to foreign states. One of which was Australia. Did you know P@O cruisers pulled up stumps this week? The ship that rolled into Sydney after COVid delivered nukes to take out Sydney. Warragamba, the Snowy and many other locations were on the list and the same for many other countries.
This is progress?
Citroen had this variable ratio over 25 years ago. Huge movement at slow speeds. Minimal steering at high speeds. But it wasnt a lag.
I seen my first cybertruck yesterday, and after seeing it in person I was not impressed, in fact I can't believe anyone would even buy one
That is your basic steering system. To upgrade to normal steering you have to pay the subscription fee monthly.
He's a protected species only because of his religious beliefs. Pure and simple. He's divisive & frankly dangerous. Used by the establishment like a puppet.
I suppose it's winter Down Under right now. I like that cardigan, Simon.
I've driven several vehicles like forklifts and other utility vehicles like street sweepers, that had electronic steering or hydraulic steering with much better response.
I don't know how any countries laws and regulations would ever permit a fly by wire steering system.
Waleed Aly is what Murray Rothbard, in his 1976 essay, would qualify as a court jester. Quentin Wilson is another one.
"In exchange for their continuing work of apologetics and bamboozlement, the Court Intellectuals win their place as junior partners in the power, prestige and loot extracted by the State apparatus from the deluded public".
Denial must be the a massive river if so many can be in it at the same time.
Got to get some of those T shirts.
The CyberJunk is a textbook example of releasing a beta test project on the public and letting them find all of the bugs. Safety and lives be damned. Repugnant business model.
CyberJunk is probably the nickname I'll end up using after trying a few, I prefered 'rolling dumpster fire' but it was a little wordy.
The point about the variable ratio is valid.
As the high ratio will magnify the lag.
But that high ratio is only at low speeds where oscillation isn't an issue.
It's still an issue but not as extreme as the video makes it seem.
Although I may agree with a lot of what you say, the Nokia 3210 was with doubt 10 times better than any smartphone. I used to charge mine up once a week, whether it needed it or not. Unlike my iPhones which have to be charged every day (sometimes twice).
I have worked on control systems including vehicle steering. I agree with your assessment that variable gain steering and lag are different issues.
That said, a poorly designed variable gain steering system is far more likely to introduce lag etc, especially when combined with other non-linearities such as traction control and other interventions.
Looks bloody awful.
I have a solution for the Greek ferry problem.
Connect the EV car batteries to the EV ferry batteries and discharge until 40% is reached and use the charge up the EV ferry batteries to enable the crossing.
Now that is the silliest idea I've had up to now!
8:42 " listening to that comment about the Nokia phones that we were so Keen to hang on to no we weren't we could see the iPhones were a much better product they did more things"
It's pretty apt analogy. The OG 3310 had a standby time of 11 days, and not sure how long you could play snake for, but I did a bit :D The original iPhone's battery life was considered mediocre even at the time of its release in 2007.
The OG iPhone also didn't do a lot of what it can now at time of launch, there was no app store, web browsing was pretty average, but you could see the path to where we are now and what the future would bring (even if it is still a one day battery life)
EVs are very much the same, quiet, smooth, autonomous, low maintenance, all of these things out of the gate are better than old ICE equivalents, while battery range is not a match for all use cases, it's pretty clear the path, technology permitting.
When I got my p990 with it's keyboard, stylus and, for the time, great camera, at the time the main driver in the market was for ever smaller phones. I doubt many people dropped $$ on that phone, it was quite expensive if I remember correctly (and that savage depreciation! lol), but models like that predicted what was to come.