@@NukeCaulfield SRM (Stale Reference Manipulation) does involve what looks to be random and arbitrary movement, since you're using your movement and position to cause an outcome that causes the credits to start. (that's not all of it but that's beyond my ability to explain it well just look up an explanation)
@@disquo1686 Daily reminder that Pipkin Pippa has gone from not existing, to existing, getting 100k subscribers, and showing feet, in the time zfg hasn't speedran OoT 100%.
This is the run I've been hoping for for a long time already. Amazing job, PancakeTurtle and Migu, thanks for putting in the effort! The amount of time and work that went into this must be immense.
OH man, I had no idea this was being worked on. Looks like I know what I'll be doing this evening. And to have done it in a year with so much new tech I'd imagine.. What an absolute treat.
@@seifeir6951they're probably talking about the route that was run for this TAS specifically. That's what I gathered from what they were talking about in the beginning. I could be wrong though
Thank you for posting this, I'm sure everyone who appreciates this respects how much work goes into this from just 2 people, and they smash it out in just over a year they said. Love the commentation as well
Amazing video even when rewatching it months later, great commentary and the run itself is a joy to watch if you're a fan of Zelda speedruns. Cheers ZFG, Pancake and Migu.
God I miss this. ZFG you are amazing and you were close to the wr without SRM. While you were grinding 100 percent back then. I’m surprise you are commentating on the original N64 on console. This is satisfying to see.
Great TAS expose! Thanks for sharing this, and all the hard work that went into it. There was so much good discussion in the first twenty minutes. I don’t want to take too much more of your time with this without actually writing a true script out, but I goofed around with a few ideas for the important parts at the beginning. I haven’t put much work into writing and timing everything, but I think it would be useful to lay out the general route getting out of village and into the temple during the intro minutes (ie for noob players). Then maybe enough time to define the CSlide, S-slide/HESS, and 🤞SRM during the village bolder section, or if not just between there and Sara. Then describe the world map, and the (gold star) adult vs child description again. Then describe hovering during chickens and their RNG again. The moat timing prior to entering town. Maybe describe the shops when entering market the first time, because some folks don’t know what the poe can be. The RBA distribution was perfect. Then the temple door skip. There would be time to describe the route for adult 1 during during the cutscene too.
1:33:30 20+ b presses per second is definitely humanly possible. It might be tricky to find a good position on an N64 controller, and a bit easier on GC.
I’ve been watching all the low-pause runs and the low-C run the past month. When they paused and equipped two items after second Dampe I was like “Holy shit, these guys have fucking superpowers, look at ‘em go!”
Ares64 is cycle-accurate to actual N64 hardware. GameCube, Wii, Wii U, NSO, and most emulators are slightly faster at a few areas. GameCube you press B and X together to reset. Master Quest we should TAS the 3DS version.
Random question, but why does duplicating capacity upgrades not count as violating source requirement? Isn't an upgrade an "item," so it must be collected at its intended location? It seems arbitrary that this restriction doesn't apply to capacity upgrades.
With Sticks for example, Link starts with Capacity 10. Then there’s a Scrub that increases capacity by 10 and a Skull Kid that increases capacity by 10. Those two can be collected in any order and function correctly. The 100% source requirement is that you have to end with Capacity 30 and get the final upgrade from either the Skull Kid or the Scrub. So they duplicate the Scrub. It would also work if they manipulated memory to get Capacity 20 and then got the upgrade from the Skull Kid. How they get 20 doesn’t matter, just how they get 30.
For what counts towards 100%, we only require the highest upgrade of tiered items (for example, only golden gauntlets are required as the highest strength upgrade, so you can skip goron bracelet and silver gauntlets), and source requirement was more intended to require each individual item of items that have multiple of them, like bottles or gold skulltulas. Item capacity upgrades are a weird case that falls under both of these conditions, so there was some debate for a while about if each individual upgrade should count for source requirement, or just the highest upgrade, but we eventually decided on only requiring the highest upgrade from source.
So wait. You say that at 1:33:30 you need to mash B every single frame. So how does the game register each B press as separate inputs rather than a single prolonged input? ETA: I saw a couple people in the chat saying that although the game runs at 20 FPS, the system still reads inputs 60 times per second. Is this actually the case? ETA 2: okay, explanation at 1:36:26
Honest question- why is getting seed bag and quiver upgrade from the same vendor allowed despite source requirement? Feels like to me the quiver from Kak and the gerudo archery games are very different instances.
It feels a bit odd, but the rule is that only the last upgrade is required. The idea being that if you were to pause and cycle through the menu at the end of the run you can see every item, skull, medalion, upgrade, etc. This is the same reason boss keys, maps and scarecrow song are not required. So instead of thinking of it as getting the same upgrade twice, think of it as glitching to recieve the intermediate quiver and then receiving the final quiver from the source. It's basically the same idea as if they used RBA to get the intermediate quiver and then did gerudo archery for the "source" final quiver.
If you start with the same seed and do exactly the same thing every time, a game’s RNG will always be the same. When you make a TAS, you’re able to get the exact results you want by ensuring you get a consistent seed (which is usually the same at startup anyway, but some games use outside things like the system clock to seed the RNG) and slightly altering what you do before RNG is called
Wasn't the human theory 100% TAS ZFG did a while back sub 3 hours? I assume I'm missing something and either it was a different category, or the rules of the category have changed?
To all of the C/C++ programmers 15:47 is what happens when you don't validate your handles. Also, isn't RBA technically a form of SRM? [Or, more technically, IRM (invalid reference manipulation)? ]
For non C/C++ programmers handles are the memory address of an opaque typename (kind of like a object but not really; C is not OOP) that is not necessarily known to the end user... And are very commonly used in event driven programming
I actually think IPM (invalid pointer manipulation) would be a name for it; understand how rba works, it's creating an invalid pointer to non-instruction data...
I'm happy to see that 100% No SRM is an official category on the leaderboards. However, the category rules section at the end is confusing "*If code is indirectly modified by some SRM application but it does not benefit the speedrun, it is allowed.". Are there any examples of Non-Carry SRM that prompted this caveat/exception?
It’s probably so that runs don’t get disqualified from the game using stale references naturally, like if your boomerang happens to be carrying something as you walk into a new room
Wrong Warp. Basically the blue warps are messy. If you enter a blue warp and then leave it before it triggers, the next time you enter that warp it will send you somewhere else. Where exactly is complicated, but a TAS can manipulate the available options. So they just warp between boss rooms.
There is but all items need to be gotten from their original source. if they used the glitch to get more they would still have to go and get all of them anyway
@@heralds well I certainly couldn't! but ACE should make it possible to fix the bugs that cause problems with those, at least in a TAS environment. whether someone would go to all that effort is another question
So wait...is a tas run actually controllered by a human playing and being "assisted" but computer inputs? Or is this fully controlled and played by a computer ?
A TAS is speedrun where players use emulator tools and software to achieve the fastest completion time possible by manipulating inputs frame by frame, enabling precise control and execution that would be humanly impossible. So technically, the run that you are watching is being playing by a computer. But every input has been meticulously crafted by humans. Think of it like a music sheet, kindof.
I don't know how accurate emulators are nowadays, but a couple of years ago, the lag frequently caused inputs to be inconsistent while TASing. In essence, inputs that worked perfectly fine during production ended up not working on the played-back version due to lag differences.
![[TAS] Donkey Kong 64 101% TAS by Ballaam (Commentated)](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/mnLO9oPnvls/mqdefault.jpg)
![[TAS] Twilight Princess 100% by TheTasMaster in 5:33:01](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/y5wEkjLxCp0/mqdefault.jpg)
![Noob To Max With DRAGON REWORK In Blox Fruits [FULL MOVIE]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/LnBMOinoOvA/mqdefault.jpg)
Holy shit the message in chat at 4:38 saying SRM = seemingly random movement is so fucking good lmao
Why? I don't get it.
@@NukeCaulfield SRM (Stale Reference Manipulation) does involve what looks to be random and arbitrary movement, since you're using your movement and position to cause an outcome that causes the credits to start. (that's not all of it but that's beyond my ability to explain it well just look up an explanation)
Im so excited for zfg to come to us with another ocarina of time 100% speedrunning video
maybe he shows feet in this one
Holy. Shit.
@@disquo1686 Daily reminder that Pipkin Pippa has gone from not existing, to existing, getting 100k subscribers, and showing feet, in the time zfg hasn't speedran OoT 100%.
@@grafzeppelin4069so you're saying that zfg also has not existed, existed, now has 100k subscribers, so the next inevitable step is show feet?
@@disquo16862:56:53 😂😅.😅
OH SHIT
Random time stamp to mess with analytics 2:07:03
Heading zfg explain wess in the first 5 minutes is so cute it’s like he’s proud of this baby and is showing it to the neighbours
I love when zfg is explaining things
I've been listening to zfg explain things since gdq 2014
So true lmao
Its crazy I remember watching Fg back in 1948. Mans been explaining OOT glitches to us laypeople for over 80 years. Heres to 80 more.
it's too bad he's banned from gdq now
@@LilacMonarch why is he banned
@@TheNecroSodomizerhe was caught smoking weed in the restroom
Oh my god, it's actually happening, oot 100% content is back on the menu
*excited ork sounds*
This is the run I've been hoping for for a long time already. Amazing job, PancakeTurtle and Migu, thanks for putting in the effort! The amount of time and work that went into this must be immense.
When’s your next MM tas lol
Hello grunz. Long time no see
Most important song of the run 1:20:09
what's the song from?
@@dilder95evangelion opening
Real ones are pourin up and watchin this on a Saturday night
Got home from the bar at 3am and you know we getting at least an hour deep
Me rn
me rn
Saw someone in chat say, "TAS is the student of Billy and Todd," and that was hilarious
This is the beautiful content we wait for :D OoT TAS is so fun to watch.
I've waited my whole life for this
OH man, I had no idea this was being worked on. Looks like I know what I'll be doing this evening. And to have done it in a year with so much new tech I'd imagine.. What an absolute treat.
nice to see 100% on this channel again
I've waited my whole life for this.
Sonic woke up and looked at the clock. "7:00," it said, and Sonic screamed.
No way, they actually found a route
TAS is probably a couple years old. remember, making these TAS 100%'s takes a long time.
To be fair I don’t think much route changing has happened to hundo in a long time, I know zfg hasn’t consistently ran hundo for atleast a couple years
@@TheUltimateRarewhile it's definitely an old route, the intro they say it was impressive because they took under a year for a TAS this long
@@OverlyMediocreGamingunder a year? TASers are speedrunning TASes now
@@seifeir6951they're probably talking about the route that was run for this TAS specifically. That's what I gathered from what they were talking about in the beginning. I could be wrong though
Thank you for posting this, I'm sure everyone who appreciates this respects how much work goes into this from just 2 people, and they smash it out in just over a year they said. Love the commentation as well
Aw, I'm missing keeta adding to the infinite list of things to keep in the back of the mind :(
Just a couple more weeks!
Amazing video even when rewatching it months later, great commentary and the run itself is a joy to watch if you're a fan of Zelda speedruns. Cheers ZFG, Pancake and Migu.
God I miss this. ZFG you are amazing and you were close to the wr without SRM. While you were grinding 100 percent back then. I’m surprise you are commentating on the original N64 on console. This is satisfying to see.
Close? He did have the WR.
He held the WR for about six years (took it from sva) and only lost it when dropped hundo for old NSR.
@@Arcessitorfor me ennop and zfg are the kings of zelda 😂
Nice Adam, took me back to nostalgia town for sure.
Went back to watch some of the old Feb21 LOTADs, then watched this!
Forgot how godlike TAS movement can be in this game.
really enjoyed this hope to see more of these reviews :)
damn guess that means ZFG is coming back to this category soon
ZeldaFreakGlitcha back at it with another zelda glitch video!
21:00 - I 100% agree, console verification should be higher in the ladder than rom verification
Nice Evangelion OP on the Ocarina too
Great TAS expose! Thanks for sharing this, and all the hard work that went into it. There was so much good discussion in the first twenty minutes. I don’t want to take too much more of your time with this without actually writing a true script out, but I goofed around with a few ideas for the important parts at the beginning.
I haven’t put much work into writing and timing everything, but I think it would be useful to lay out the general route getting out of village and into the temple during the intro minutes (ie for noob players). Then maybe enough time to define the CSlide, S-slide/HESS, and 🤞SRM during the village bolder section, or if not just between there and Sara. Then describe the world map, and the (gold star) adult vs child description again.
Then describe hovering during chickens and their RNG again. The moat timing prior to entering town.
Maybe describe the shops when entering market the first time, because some folks don’t know what the poe can be. The RBA distribution was perfect.
Then the temple door skip. There would be time to describe the route for adult 1 during during the cutscene too.
i gave you a like for your effort
1:31:16 omg the long shot to the sky had me in tears 😂
I missed it live but its super cool. Well done to the tasers.
100% NO SRM?!?! POG
(Even if it's TAS still a Win)
Amazed at the detail in link's tree rings. I remember being a kid and wondering more about his life. 😅
Very nice TAS :D og fedt at se en dansker involveret i OOT speedruns :D
Can't wait to watch after work
I love your content ZFG. If you ever second guess yourself, I hope this comment gives you comfort. You're awesome.
16:20 jesus that was WAYTOODANK bro
Incredible TAS! Wish I could've seen it live!
Nice to see a new TAS after MoronicTAS & MrGrunz’s spliced one from 2015.
Good to see Kride in the chat widePeepoHappy
1:33:30 20+ b presses per second is definitely humanly possible. It might be tricky to find a good position on an N64 controller, and a bit easier on GC.
What's the video game they are playing at 58:50?
That’s the upcoming Zelda game for the Ultra 64
I’ve been watching all the low-pause runs and the low-C run the past month. When they paused and equipped two items after second Dampe I was like “Holy shit, these guys have fucking superpowers, look at ‘em go!”
1:20:09 Cruel Angel's Thesis on Ocarina
zfg definitely has OOT and timer themed dreams but I wonder how twisted they are
Ares64 is cycle-accurate to actual N64 hardware. GameCube, Wii, Wii U, NSO, and most emulators are slightly faster at a few areas. GameCube you press B and X together to reset. Master Quest we should TAS the 3DS version.
17:45 Sliding into Zelda's DMs
Random question, but why does duplicating capacity upgrades not count as violating source requirement? Isn't an upgrade an "item," so it must be collected at its intended location? It seems arbitrary that this restriction doesn't apply to capacity upgrades.
Source requirement only applies to items required for 100%. For upgrades that means only the highest one needs to be collected from source.
With Sticks for example, Link starts with Capacity 10. Then there’s a Scrub that increases capacity by 10 and a Skull Kid that increases capacity by 10. Those two can be collected in any order and function correctly. The 100% source requirement is that you have to end with Capacity 30 and get the final upgrade from either the Skull Kid or the Scrub. So they duplicate the Scrub. It would also work if they manipulated memory to get Capacity 20 and then got the upgrade from the Skull Kid. How they get 20 doesn’t matter, just how they get 30.
For what counts towards 100%, we only require the highest upgrade of tiered items (for example, only golden gauntlets are required as the highest strength upgrade, so you can skip goron bracelet and silver gauntlets), and source requirement was more intended to require each individual item of items that have multiple of them, like bottles or gold skulltulas. Item capacity upgrades are a weird case that falls under both of these conditions, so there was some debate for a while about if each individual upgrade should count for source requirement, or just the highest upgrade, but we eventually decided on only requiring the highest upgrade from source.
Myriad of pauses, Countless C presses, Doors OPENED and no Sonic High-school. Wth is this!?
@34:06 anyone have a link to the part(s) (or any part) of the code that makes Dampe do this? Could be interesting reading...
Whoa, another 100% TAS run. Love this shit.
I can’t wait for movie night after a long day
1:20:00 my favourite hospital scene
Are we sure holding R at King Zora isn't a leftover debug thing?
Definitely not, it has been looked into and understood, full explanation here though its a bit complicated pastebin.com/N288iBwK
So wait. You say that at 1:33:30 you need to mash B every single frame. So how does the game register each B press as separate inputs rather than a single prolonged input?
ETA: I saw a couple people in the chat saying that although the game runs at 20 FPS, the system still reads inputs 60 times per second. Is this actually the case?
ETA 2: okay, explanation at 1:36:26
Reminds me of the good old days of 100% and Any%. Before ACE destroyed everything
17:50 How to NOT approach a girl.
LMAO
Bro that DoT skip was so damn clean
It's almost like they pre programmed the inputs to happen on sequential frames!
chat losing it because no vibruto lol
Sick TAS for sure
1:17:14 I reeally wanted to see the lag from both of them falling apart at the same time, but alas
Soon in the workbench of TASvideo ?
new TAS category idea, and it's litearlly just timing for the fastest dampe, im watiing for sub 42
Isn't dampe capped by the fact that if you get too fast he bugs out? I vaguely remember something like that being mentioned in a previous TAS.
i think it was specifically if you use fast movement glitches
New route pog
For what is „SRM“ written?
Stale reference manipulation
March already? We're spoiled.
2:46:45 Don't worry, PancakeTurtle, I was listening to your explanation.
That water temple was awesomeness
Honest question- why is getting seed bag and quiver upgrade from the same vendor allowed despite source requirement? Feels like to me the quiver from Kak and the gerudo archery games are very different instances.
It feels a bit odd, but the rule is that only the last upgrade is required. The idea being that if you were to pause and cycle through the menu at the end of the run you can see every item, skull, medalion, upgrade, etc. This is the same reason boss keys, maps and scarecrow song are not required. So instead of thinking of it as getting the same upgrade twice, think of it as glitching to recieve the intermediate quiver and then receiving the final quiver from the source. It's basically the same idea as if they used RBA to get the intermediate quiver and then did gerudo archery for the "source" final quiver.
Ave you feel proud of this? At least you mentioned it was tas and not like others that straight up lie about using tas
I saw fuzziness was making one of these and thought that’s who was being shown but PancakeTurtle makes good TAS too.
This TAS is graceful af fr fr
I thought so too but then I looked closer and they're actually cheating with glitches
@@Wyvernnnn this tas guy is always pulling shit like this, I never trusted him
@@bawbehh Get Karl Jobst on the case.
Sick! Damn good job!
SICKNASTY
Awesome! Now I only wish for a 100% no SRM and no RBA TAS.
Why is Epona not strictly required for 100%?
She's not something visible on the pause screen or hud, I suppose.
do you have to get all the magic beans, or just
How does the TAS-bot deal with RNG in the game? Is there any RNG in OOT?
every game has RNG so yes RNG is in OoT, In a TAS setting you basically can control the whole game down to the RNG seed
If you start with the same seed and do exactly the same thing every time, a game’s RNG will always be the same. When you make a TAS, you’re able to get the exact results you want by ensuring you get a consistent seed (which is usually the same at startup anyway, but some games use outside things like the system clock to seed the RNG) and slightly altering what you do before RNG is called
I'd love to see an input display for these TAS videos
Wasn't the human theory 100% TAS ZFG did a while back sub 3 hours? I assume I'm missing something and either it was a different category, or the rules of the category have changed?
SRM vs No SRM
That used SRM which is a completely different category. Super insane watch though.
Been waiting since the one from 3 years ago
I must have blinked. When did they get ice arrows?
the most impressive part of this whole thing is not messing up "Would you like to hear this again????" *yes* *no*
To all of the C/C++ programmers 15:47 is what happens when you don't validate your handles. Also, isn't RBA technically a form of SRM? [Or, more technically, IRM (invalid reference manipulation)? ]
For non C/C++ programmers handles are the memory address of an opaque typename (kind of like a object but not really; C is not OOP) that is not necessarily known to the end user... And are very commonly used in event driven programming
I actually think IPM (invalid pointer manipulation) would be a name for it; understand how rba works, it's creating an invalid pointer to non-instruction data...
No, RBA and SRM are two different glitches.
@@InfoManiac742 Yes, technically but they both work on referencing stale (or technically invalid in the case of RBA ) data though...
Technically it's just an out of bounds memory write.
I'm happy to see that 100% No SRM is an official category on the leaderboards. However, the category rules section at the end is confusing "*If code is indirectly modified by some SRM application but it does not benefit the speedrun, it is allowed.". Are there any examples of Non-Carry SRM that prompted this caveat/exception?
It’s probably so that runs don’t get disqualified from the game using stale references naturally, like if your boomerang happens to be carrying something as you walk into a new room
Lovely TAS, thanks ZFG and friends
Wow, how do you fight and defeat a boss and immediately go to the next boss fight?
How does that work
Wrong Warp. Basically the blue warps are messy. If you enter a blue warp and then leave it before it triggers, the next time you enter that warp it will send you somewhere else. Where exactly is complicated, but a TAS can manipulate the available options. So they just warp between boss rooms.
Iz dis one of dem "routes" yall been huffing about?
Does anyone know how many hours ZFG has in OOT?
I think he said somewhere in the 5-8k range a few years back
Drakes in the FUCKIN CHAT!
how he got isg bv the Skulltula at 7:20 ?
If something hits your shield in the middle of a crouch stab, you can interrupt the animation with C up and you'll have ISG.
@@ZFG ty for good explaination!
1:20:09 pretty cruel thesis, bro
But it isnt february 27th yet what r they coming up with then?
Does srm stand for swords reindeers and monster trucks?
Wow TAS the runner is so concentrated he didn't speak once glad the commentators were there
Feb 21st is 2 months early
is it possible to have an input display for TAS runs? that'd be rad to see
So when are you running 100% zfg?
Isn’t there a glitch for infinite skelchulas? Why wasn’t that used.
There is but all items need to be gotten from their original source. if they used the glitch to get more they would still have to go and get all of them anyway
@@Gremph Ah I see you. Thanks for answering
hypothetically, could you use SRM/ACE to enable child hookshot on n64?
or adult stick
@@heralds well I certainly couldn't! but ACE should make it possible to fix the bugs that cause problems with those, at least in a TAS environment. whether someone would go to all that effort is another question
So wait...is a tas run actually controllered by a human playing and being "assisted" but computer inputs? Or is this fully controlled and played by a computer ?
A TAS is speedrun where players use emulator tools and software to achieve the fastest completion time possible by manipulating inputs frame by frame, enabling precise control and execution that would be humanly impossible.
So technically, the run that you are watching is being playing by a computer. But every input has been meticulously crafted by humans. Think of it like a music sheet, kindof.
@@DarkLeviathan8 Well said, thank you for that.
i'm wondering with TASes. does lag mess up inputs in any way?
I don't know how accurate emulators are nowadays, but a couple of years ago, the lag frequently caused inputs to be inconsistent while TASing. In essence, inputs that worked perfectly fine during production ended up not working on the played-back version due to lag differences.