If you suck with a Brass Eagle Talon then you will suck with a DM14. If you rock it with a Talon and are handed a DM14 then everyone else might as well quit.
Mike definitely explains the differences better than I do. It probably took me nearly an hour to explain it the first time to a friend... Poppets FTW! I love my Borg =).
I have been told multiple times from different people from different fields that a poppet valves are more efficient......... not much more but they are... I have personally done an efficiency test between the two and it is true that they are more efficient... so actually they are not exactly the same. I love your videos mike
Thanks for the video im glad you made one cause i was not sure what the diff was and it was annoying hearing people say that spool or poppet was better.
I currently don't own a geo anymore. I have to say, those spool valve markers by planet eclipse are some of the smoothest, quiet shooting, extremely reliable markers i have ever shot. -Nael
hey ydna thanks for the post, your website is awesome In my opinion, if it's not very good, then it doesnt exist. Thats like Ford saying "Yea the car comes with seat belts TECHNICALLY, but they are made out tissue paper and will do little in an accident" If it doesn't work for the consumer, it doesn't exist. Every shocker I own with the stock nerve board, I have to unscrew the barrel, shoot three times, then put the barrel back on. Its just a dogshit board
dude this video is the best!!! i went to the animation site thing, and i saw the omen and i thought... OMG I CAN SO DO THIS WITH MY TIPPMANN! i might try that, but i might not because the detent wont work while the bolt is closed and i use alot of different sized paint. i guess ill do that when i get really good at paintball and start getting paid! :D
effeciency is extremely important for woodsball, before i got a 70 45 tank i only used to get 3 pods and a hopper and that is disgusting. but i understand the opinion if its aimed towards speedball and in that case, yes it really doesnt matter but when your playing for an hour at a time then effeciency is a bonus.
The boost-forward technology is on the Proto rails. The PM7s, PM8s, and all the DMs use the FUSE bolt technology. The FUSE bolts are much softer on paint and much easier to take apart and clean.
hey mike i noticed that you said the lube on a poppet will spray on the back of the paint. Idk about other guns but most of the lube will be pushed out through the qev. If you dont have a qev it vents into the noid.
depends.....on a blow back poppet or a normal high end one. a "blow back" the force from the valve opening pushes it back, examples are tippmans. on a higher end marker, there are air chambers near the rammer/ram/hammer. once the celenoid opens air is transfered from the front of the rammer/ram/hammer to the rear, pushing it forward. once done the celenoid closes and pushes it back
I've an EGO and love it. I've a Dye NT and love it too. The NT is quieter and has less kick. The EGO is lighter and has more kick. I like more the EGO trigger and overall feel and balance. I like more the way the Dye NT shoots, it's very "straight". Anyway, a matter of taste.
actually spoolies tend to have less shots than poppets. the etek 2 is an great gun, but if your really looking for long lasting air, go with the bob long protege. it gets about 2100 shots off a 68 45. i also recommend the etek 2. i have one and its amazing overall.
the first shot drop off compensation on those guns will not effect the chrono of the gun that much. It increases dwell which puts more air into the bolt but not nearly enough to cause a velocity spike.
Awesome! I'll tear into the gun tomorrow after work. Maybe that's the whole problem. I never did get that far into the bolt to lube that up. Just did the outter ones.
DM's and PM's are almost stacked tube.. They have an LPR in the lower tube. Whereas most Poppets have an LPR sticking out the front. Marqs are the same, LPR in bottom tube, engine in top. I've always considered those a 1 1/2 tube.
@paintballa2195 not always because the invert mini is a poppet valve but almost always a closed bolt will be a spool valve but all open bolts guaranteed are poppet valve.
what are you talking about? all you have to do is lube up the bolt after each day, then every once and a while lube up the reg.... so there are a few more o-rings, oh god. they are extremely easy to maintain, as long as you dont over lube. poppets are actually a bit more complex, there is more that can go wrong. all you have to do with a spool is replace bolt o-rings. what spoolies have you owned? any high ends?
very good and much respect for the time an d effort gone into this vid. you have made my minde up im going with a spool because i am keen too look after my gun and take care with it cheers
thank you mike i bought an ion and i thought wow this is gona take alot of money to get it to shoot the way i want it to, so im gona save up sell my ion and get the 2009 pmr
Ok.. So I saw all the animations and I assume that the Invert Mini is a Poppet Valve gun. But there's no hammer so is it considered to be a poppet? I have a small air leak out the feed neck after I cleaned it and someone said I need a new poppet. I dunno.. I might do a whole new ring change out and just change the poppet also. Thanks
probably the best poppet valve gun (efficency wise in my opinion) is the 07 MacDev Cyborg. It gets me about a case a tank all stock.. as for spool valves.. its between the DM8 and the driod stock
Poppet valve guns seem like they would be easier to take apart and do maintenance on, would a spool valve be any harder or not is what I want to know, they seem really complicated though. I do see now how they work.
Poppet valve guns= Ego 05, 06+ and eteks for example. Spool valve guns= Dm's, Rails, and Nt's (Geo's) for example. Poppe valve= More efficient, Slight and noticeable kick, loud, takes less time to maintain. Spool valve= Less efficient, Almost no kick, very quiet, takes more time to maintain.
Nooby question, how do you classify markers that have enclosed bolts such as dye, ions, proto, marq, shocker, luxe, etc. and how do you classify markers that have external bolts that have a rammer, such as ego, timmy, vice, etc.
@XSVPUNKk Some poppets have LPRs, just like some spoolies have LPRs. DMs have LPRs, and FXs don't have LPRs. Whether it's a spool or poppet doesn't dictate whether it has an LPR.
i just got my bob long vice and is it normal that at the starting it will have alot of kick? do i just have to use it more and there will be less kick?
Closed bolt is inherently inferior for feed rate and performance. The bolt will always spend most of its time in its default state. With an open bolt gun, this is in the open state which allows for a new shot to feed. On a closed bolt gun, this is in the closed state, where it cannot feed. It is much harder to get a high-performance closed bolt without it becoming a blender simply because you have to keep the bolt open long enough for most loaders to reliably feed.
i would say either a 09 PMR or the G3 spec R. you'll have enough cash for a nice dye roter. or maybe a pinko. or buy the 10 PMR or etek 3. get that invert too hopper. i hear it's "okay" it only feeds like 20 BPS though
What I meant was whether the body covered the bolt or not...for example the mini is a poppet but the bolt is enclosed by the body unlike many poppets(Egos, Timmys, etc)...So is there a term for a non-external bolt. I have never heard any one use a term for this. Does one exist?
other then the Mini are there any other poppit markers in the same price range I have seen lots of mini players siting at the bench fixing there markers and am a bit turned off by the possibility of having a finicky marker and when I used to have an Ion I remember the hassle of lube in the barrel. I want a poppit marker because the field we play at douse not have an air compressor so we fill up in town and use what we have then game over. If I did go with a spool marker I would pick up a g3/g.
If you suck with a Brass Eagle Talon then you will suck with a DM14. If you rock it with a Talon and are handed a DM14 then everyone else might as well quit.
🙂😒🙄😑😐
Mike definitely explains the differences better than I do. It probably took me nearly an hour to explain it the first time to a friend...
Poppets FTW! I love my Borg =).
This is one of the best shows. I work on all my teams guns and this is a great help!
This video helped me a whole lot! Never truely understood the difference till now!
I have been told multiple times from different people from different fields that a poppet valves are more efficient......... not much more but they are... I have personally done an efficiency test between the two and it is true that they are more efficient... so actually they are not exactly the same. I love your videos mike
It is an Inline Poppet. It has the efficiancy of a poppet-valve, but the smoothness and quietness of a spool-valve. Hope this helps!!
great video very helpfull. but in your opinion what is the best marker out there right now?
Thanks for the video im glad you made one cause i was not sure what the diff was and it was annoying hearing people say that spool or poppet was better.
I currently don't own a geo anymore. I have to say, those spool valve markers by planet eclipse are some of the smoothest, quiet shooting, extremely reliable markers i have ever shot.
-Nael
This is a very clear/well made video.
Thanks Mike!
Oh, and I can't wait for your website.
hey ydna thanks for the post, your website is awesome
In my opinion, if it's not very good, then it doesnt exist. Thats like Ford saying "Yea the car comes with seat belts TECHNICALLY, but they are made out tissue paper and will do little in an accident"
If it doesn't work for the consumer, it doesn't exist. Every shocker I own with the stock nerve board, I have to unscrew the barrel, shoot three times, then put the barrel back on.
Its just a dogshit board
Yeah, he's basically the only source online that I trust for reviews
Awesome pick for the last song Mike.
once again, thanks alot mike. I recently bought a defiance 2.0 and now i understand the gun
it has been bought by a company called GoG paintball. And GoG is now making 3 solid intermediate markers for around 220 us dollars.
TECHPB YOU ARE A FUCKING GENIUS WHEN IT COMES TO PAINTBALL
Mike for President. Doesnt studder and knows his shit.
i love when i do a google search it comes up with one of mikes videos
@XSVPUNKk Gotcha. I'm sort of the same way, which is why I like the Marqs so much. Best of both worlds
both-it's a stacked tube poppet. There are also inline poppets like in the BL guns and tippmanns
dude this video is the best!!! i went to the animation site thing, and i saw the omen and i thought... OMG I CAN SO DO THIS WITH MY TIPPMANN! i might try that, but i might not because the detent wont work while the bolt is closed and i use alot of different sized paint.
i guess ill do that when i get really good at paintball and start getting paid! :D
effeciency is extremely important for woodsball, before i got a 70 45 tank i only used to get 3 pods and a hopper and that is disgusting. but i understand the opinion if its aimed towards speedball and in that case, yes it really doesnt matter but when your playing for an hour at a time then effeciency is a bonus.
The Mini is an Inline Poppet. If you have ever taken your bolt assembly out to clean, That brass looking thing inside the bolt guide is the poppet.
The boost-forward technology is on the Proto rails. The PM7s, PM8s, and all the DMs use the FUSE bolt technology. The FUSE bolts are much softer on paint and much easier to take apart and clean.
hey mike i noticed that you said the lube on a poppet will spray on the back of the paint. Idk about other guns but most of the lube will be pushed out through the qev. If you dont have a qev it vents into the noid.
depends.....on a blow back poppet or a normal high end one. a "blow back" the force from the valve opening pushes it back, examples are tippmans. on a higher end marker, there are air chambers near the rammer/ram/hammer. once the celenoid opens air is transfered from the front of the rammer/ram/hammer to the rear, pushing it forward. once done the celenoid closes and pushes it back
I've an EGO and love it.
I've a Dye NT and love it too.
The NT is quieter and has less kick.
The EGO is lighter and has more kick.
I like more the EGO trigger and overall feel and balance.
I like more the way the Dye NT shoots, it's very "straight".
Anyway, a matter of taste.
which one is easier to clean and which is easiest to maintain.. in your opinion
Great job Mike I learned alot. Keep it up and can't wait for the website.
actually spoolies tend to have less shots than poppets. the etek 2 is an great gun, but if your really looking for long lasting air, go with the bob long protege. it gets about 2100 shots off a 68 45. i also recommend the etek 2. i have one and its amazing overall.
so I have to ask, out of every gun you have ever used do you have a favorite?
if you can't pick how about a top 3?
the first shot drop off compensation on those guns will not effect the chrono of the gun that much. It increases dwell which puts more air into the bolt but not nearly enough to cause a velocity spike.
Another great show explained a lot
spool, works very similar to a shocker
yep, my PM6 has that little LPR hiddin all nice under my barrel. I kinda like it that way over Poppet.
Awesome! I'll tear into the gun tomorrow after work. Maybe that's the whole problem. I never did get that far into the bolt to lube that up. Just did the outter ones.
DM's and PM's are almost stacked tube.. They have an LPR in the lower tube. Whereas most Poppets have an LPR sticking out the front. Marqs are the same, LPR in bottom tube, engine in top. I've always considered those a 1 1/2 tube.
i have never saw tyhis video and i thought ive seen almost all techpb videos
great video, explained a lot. and high five for Master of Puppets!
what i wouldnt give to play paintball with this guy.....hes friggin awsome
@paintballa2195 not always because the invert mini is a poppet valve but almost always a closed bolt will be a spool valve but all open bolts guaranteed are poppet valve.
@McxBeats Will this be your first gun? Sorry I am not Mike,
what are you talking about? all you have to do is lube up the bolt after each day, then every once and a while lube up the reg.... so there are a few more o-rings, oh god. they are extremely easy to maintain, as long as you dont over lube. poppets are actually a bit more complex, there is more that can go wrong. all you have to do with a spool is replace bolt o-rings. what spoolies have you owned? any high ends?
very good and much respect for the time an d effort gone into this vid. you have made my minde up im going with a spool because i am keen too look after my gun and take care with it cheers
thank you mike i bought an ion and i thought wow this is gona take alot of money to get it to shoot the way i want it to, so im gona save up sell my ion and get the 2009 pmr
what gun is beter JT ER2 pump paintball gun or a KT Kingmang for beginers? please tell me sending me a mesage i love your videos
thanks do you know when its coming out ?
Ok.. So I saw all the animations and I assume that the Invert Mini is a Poppet Valve gun. But there's no hammer so is it considered to be a poppet? I have a small air leak out the feed neck after I cleaned it and someone said I need a new poppet. I dunno.. I might do a whole new ring change out and just change the poppet also. Thanks
@jinfang10 actually the mini is a poppet valve gun if you listen in between 2:35 and 2:50 he says the mini is a poppet
hey im kindof new to this whole thing and i wanted to know if the ego 09 is a good gun?thanks
Which one takes less maintenance because I'm new and I don't know everything about maintenance yet
@N2p2g poppets usually take less maintenance, but you should always do maintenance on any gun.
Great vid mike. I think a video about open bolt vs closed bolt would be helpfull too though?
can someone tell me how the milsig/TPX Pistol/Tiberius guns work internally?
A tpx is just a smaller 98 costum put in a pistol or at least that's what I was told
there all poppets
@TrentOWNZ
it helps them pay the bills, and have money to do more of these videos. be thankful that ads let them do more paintball man!
basically now the mini is the only poppet valve. the other ones mike said were poppet are basically rammers like the ego8. correct me if im wrong.
probably the best poppet valve gun (efficency wise in my opinion) is the 07 MacDev Cyborg. It gets me about a case a tank all stock..
as for spool valves.. its between the DM8 and the driod stock
mike is the mini a poppet valve or spool valve
Poppet valve guns seem like they would be easier to take apart and do maintenance on, would a spool valve be any harder or not is what I want to know, they seem really complicated though. I do see now how they work.
@KnightsoftheChing It's a penalty when a ref pulls out 2 players when one player is shot out.
is a tippmann 98 a spool valve gun or is it just a cheap blowback?
Poppet valve guns= Ego 05, 06+ and eteks for example.
Spool valve guns= Dm's, Rails, and Nt's (Geo's) for example.
Poppe valve= More efficient, Slight and noticeable kick, loud, takes less time to maintain.
Spool valve= Less efficient, Almost no kick, very quiet, takes more time to maintain.
ok thanks a lot. My friend has a spyder and its a blowback but it looks like a poppet and mine looks like a spool from the images on the website.
Nooby question, how do you classify markers that have enclosed bolts such as dye, ions, proto, marq, shocker, luxe, etc. and how do you classify markers that have external bolts that have a rammer, such as ego, timmy, vice, etc.
great vid, Mike..should have including the Viking :P
im sure you can find websites that sell the stuff. also contact gog they probably still have left over parts if anything breaks.
is the vice a poppet or spool valve??
Hey guys are poppets really that prone for getting dirt in the bolt area when playing snake?
After using a spool valve gun do you have to clean it very time you are done playing
Cameron Garza Yes, you should clean both spool and poppets.
i would say its similar to a poppet but it uses a weight and spring to slam open the valve which is shaped like your air tank valve
is it true that spoolies are easier on air.cuz im lookin at an etek 2 for a new gun. 1700 shots on a 68 4500. how much difference is spoolies on air??
ydna rocks
his CAD section is really cool too.
@Antabalistic
Yup, there's poppets and spools all over the price range.
@XSVPUNKk Some poppets have LPRs, just like some spoolies have LPRs. DMs have LPRs, and FXs don't have LPRs. Whether it's a spool or poppet doesn't dictate whether it has an LPR.
Eclipse typically has been a poppet gun, but with the release of the geo spooly gun I have to wonder, how long before dye makes q poppet?
i just got my bob long vice and is it normal that at the starting it will have alot of kick? do i just have to use it more and there will be less kick?
So what was the point of having the mini up there...? Just wondering.
@teh3yo
do you need a hopper to load faster then that?. i have a invert too and it works fine for me.
does spool valve guns also have more range?
@r7ben94 if you planning on getting a starter gun go with an get a Proto SLG, around $250. you could then use it for woodsball and speedball.
GOOD CALL ON LINKIN zds, Andy rocks
So would Tippmanns be Poppets? i know they are Mech guns but its the same idea. A bolt hitting a golf T like metal shaft.
3 different catagories
spool:dm,pm,smart parts
poppet:ego,bob long, angel
sear tripper:tippmann,spyder,pirahna
@T3Kjosey all guns are vave guns. the eXTCy is a spool valve
@ushlichao Technically a spool. It operates a little differently than other spool valves though.
ooo u filmed this on my birthday!!!
Closed bolt is inherently inferior for feed rate and performance. The bolt will always spend most of its time in its default state. With an open bolt gun, this is in the open state which allows for a new shot to feed. On a closed bolt gun, this is in the closed state, where it cannot feed. It is much harder to get a high-performance closed bolt without it becoming a blender simply because you have to keep the bolt open long enough for most loaders to reliably feed.
i would say either a 09 PMR or the G3 spec R. you'll have enough cash for a nice dye roter. or maybe a pinko. or buy the 10 PMR or etek 3. get that invert too hopper. i hear it's "okay" it only feeds like 20 BPS though
ego 11 vs Dm12? Which is better?
The Marq series of markers are poppet valves.
what is the mini? i know it has the pressure controlled poppet.
What I meant was whether the body covered the bolt or not...for example the mini is a poppet but the bolt is enclosed by the body unlike many poppets(Egos, Timmys, etc)...So is there a term for a non-external bolt. I have never heard any one use a term for this. Does one exist?
I love using old guns, and teaching people that their Ego don't matter worth shit against me! :)
what gun should i get a invert mini or g4
an i still buy parts in-case anything breaks?
other then the Mini are there any other poppit markers in the same price range I have seen lots of mini players siting at the bench fixing there markers and am a bit turned off by the possibility of having a finicky marker and when I used to have an Ion I remember the hassle of lube in the barrel. I want a poppit marker because the field we play at douse not have an air compressor so we fill up in town and use what we have then game over. If I did go with a spool marker I would pick up a g3/g.
what kind of lube should i use on my g3?
is there a better way to lube my pmr then? can i increase the pressure and not lube it as much to prevent it from gettin lub in my breach and barrel
spool is the 2 strokes of paintball and poppet is the 4 stroke- thats how my friend explained it to me
i rock my 06 ego and my pm8. Does that make me a titan?