I love how when cuffee kills him she says "Jim was faster", it gives the audience a bittersweet satisfaction knowing Jim was the better man, he just let his ego get in the way
@@comedianhaze1619 🤣😂🤣 It gets better a day at a time homie ,It’s crazy tho cause it was hard not to like his character up until this happened ;He even offered Jim the chance to leave lol
"Why do they always have to count so slow?" Says the man who counted slow on the train trying to get to the soldiers. This tells the audience, that no matter how slow or fast the count was was irrelevant; Cherokee Bill would've cheated regardless.
Yeah bro your definitely right. His character is a scumbag and he also acted as if he’d fight the guy who stood up to him on the train. But instead he pulled a knife and sliced his legs up. Jus confirming lol
I get where you coming from but…..him being on the train threatening to kill the son of a man in a room he’s trying to get into with a slow countdown is totally different from a gun fight where the countdown shouldn’t be as slow as Jim was doing it arrogantly…now he did cheat and I hated that he killed Jim but at the same time 5 seconds passed 40 seconds ago from this stand off💯
Cherokee told the young bull what it was... Dead men tell no tales. Doesn't matter who is faster, what matters is who is left to tell the story. You know why Cherokee is the best quick draw around ? Because none of his opponents are around to tell otherwise.
I’m not going to lie, I still think beckworth would’ve laid Bill down if he didn’t cheat the count… or he would’ve at least got a good hit and still managed to die afterwards.. we need a spin-off for real, for real
I was hurt when this went down. 😅 Cuffey got em together though. I was really rooting for both guys - that’s wild! Speaks to the script and the acting - they all killed it.
Same. I was in love with Lakeith Stanfield as Cherokee Bill and Regina as Trudy. I wanted them to be heros and not people were suppose to be rooting against because they were so dope
I saw it coming the whole movie. Everyone warning him, his Ahab obsession, bill being such a pragmatist, Jim never having actually seen Bill duel. Infact Bill never even agrees to a contest, just tells jim to count. Beware the older man in a business where men die young for he's done something right to make it that far....
That boy is stupid. 1st the stories he heard was about people "getting shot before they can even turn around". Then he was told to his face by Cherokee he cheats. And he just saw him about to shoot Nat in the back. He caught a cheater cheating and said "Care for a fair game, sir?"
Imagine a Pickett/Beckworth spin off movie or series that takes place before they met Nat Love. Both seemed to have good chemistry. Could be like a “buddy cop comedy style” movie
To be honest, I think both gangs should have their own sequel.. hell each character can have their own show if you think about. We didn't get any back stories of the characters.. just snippets
I love this character but loved even more that it’s slowly revealed that Cherokee Bill isn’t as fast as people say but more so wins by any means necessary (Shooting Jim at 3, Almost shooting Nat in the back, and actually shooting Pickett in the back). Broke my heart when cuffee says Jim was faster then her who actually beat him.
Jim was that dude but he was feeling himself and didn’t take the moment for what it was ,Cherokee Bill wasn’t getting no count from me he would’ve got smoked soon as he drew down on Nat cause he had no plans on conducting an honorable square off
Gotta think about it this way, whole reason kid was there was so he could get his chance with Cherokee bill, not to make sure nat don’t die. He was trying to create his moment
@@juc3eoncs32 True and outside of that I guess it was viewed as honorable to not shoot a worthy adversary in the back ;However at the least he should’ve respected the stakes at hand ,what he’d heard about the guy ,What the guy said to him in their first stand off enough to keep his eyes on Bill every second of countdown and hold off on the theatrics until his opp was no longer a threat.Then he really would’ve had a moment worthy of the validation he sought
@@RichesOvaBxtches This is facts. I thought he was taking it seriously then he started playing and it got him killed. All that build up the whole movie….I feel robbed
@@dretheloner It actually was a great scene. Cautionary tale on being too fancy would get you killed in the Wild West. It was called WILD for a reason, survival of the fittest.
Cherokee Bill knew Jim was faster and didn’t wanna risk it, so he cheated. Probably always cheated based off him saying “It doesn’t matter who is faster, it matters who is alive or dead” And Jim should have known that counting down himself and feeling himself and being slow about it was a problem, but his ego got in the way. Another thing: Never take your eye off your opponent during a quick draw for this damn reason alone… a split second of looking away and a cheater could strike and it’s over… damn I loved this scene, but I’d be lying if I said I didn’t wanna see them actually quick draw honorably and both of them got killed because they were evenly skilled. I feel like that’s a nice end to the debate. But still!! Awesome scene!
I mean it’s “realistic” in the sense hed cheat to Win out of fear lol. A count is rarely used in quick draw stand offs, unless asked for. When asked for its basically a “respect the count”. Bills the one who asked for the count and then manipulated it to win. Jim never asked for a count during their first encounter
@@stanleecarlton2237 Bill said he was going to shoot a man in the mouth who talked too much. That’s exactly what he did. You got to admit, the man told the truth there. 😂😂 It’s the westerns, those counts were stupid. if you want a man dead, just kill’em.
My boy Rj( the dude who plays Jim) he’s a really good actor, good to see someone you grew up with make it in these big films, not gonna lie I was rooting for him and when he died I was like oh shiii😭👀
That was me, man.. just on the strength of his acting in other movies I was rooting for Jim hard af.. but seeing how much shit he was talking I was like uh oh. I told my wife right away, “It’s classic western shit for cocky gunslingers to bite it, I hope he survives but it ain’t lookin good..” I actually wish that they had him survive that shot to the cheek or something, anything just to shrug off that cliche. Like can we just get one cocky gunslinger who survives? Was holdin out hope cause it was RJ Cyler but nope.. 😞
The thing I like about lakeith the most is how he started acting...he took no classes n basically jus walked up to auditioning and look at him now! Every movie he played in is really good!!
I don't see how this was ever a thing... If this is how it really went down in those times, they were more reckless than we are by a long shot lol. ☠ Pun unintended! Boom 💥 b×tch! Nice 😎
Sad as it is, he really brought it on himself, he knew dude was cheat, dude flat out told him he shot people for talking too much, and then...he actually puts himself in a position where he can't just fire his gun. Too much ego, too much pride. Had he had his gun in his holster at the ready, he could have taken dude's head off the second he flinched with his gun; Cuffie knew Beckworth was faster than her, and she outdrew Bill with ease. You could actually see he wasn't that fast when he went for his gun, never even cleared his holster. He wasn't fast, he was ruthless, and that built his legend
Cuffee might have been faster than Jim though. Her statement only asserts Jim was faster than Bill, not necesarily faster than her. Plus, she already told hin she was faster herself.
It's dumb seeing people complain about Bill "cheating" in the draw. Not everyone wants to play with their lives. Jim took his eyes off of his opponent as if this were a friendly game with nerf guns. His naivety killed him before Bill did.
Watching people defend cheating is just as funny. So why agree to the f**king count down? Should've just said nothing and just start shooting but it's cause he knew in a real count down he would've gotten out drawn. It's obvious, which is why it's obvious why he had to cheat. It what it character does, " I heard you quick....at putting two in peoples backs". Jim to Cherokee The kid knew, he just want bragging rights and that got him killed. Simple.
@@Leviathan_Art that boy was taking forever to count, and he was so full of himself, and dumb for taking his eyes off his opponent in a fast draw battle? Wtf lol
@@Leviathan_Art Bill did cheat, but it was partially Jim's fault he got owned there. He should have taken shit more seriously. You have to expect opponents to fight dirty if their lives are on the line, so you have to be alert at all times.
@@Leviathan_Art There is no “cheating” when it comes to life and death. You ever heard of “history is written by the victors”? Cherokee Bill is better than Jim in every way. He was alive and Jim was dead. People who go into dangerous professions with notions of “honor”, die pretty quick. Hope you grow up one day, little buddy ❤️
Everyone defending Bill in these comments has never heard of the word honor and it shows. You don’t agree to a showdown and then CHEAT the count. He CHEATED. Beckworth may have been arrogant yes but it doesn’t change the fact that he was slightest and unfairly beaten.
I mean the fact that bill withdrew his holstered gun and shot Jim without him even reacting shows he was pretty fast. Anyway this isn’t a game. Jim was treating this not like life and death.
Exactly, he was probably not faster than Jim, but definitely fast enough to exploit a secobd of distraction to kill him. Jim was too cocky and paid dearly for it.
Honestly the counting itself is already a trap. All he has to do is predict when he’s about to say one and draw his gun just a half second faster. He should have lit a fire cracker or threw a stone into the air.
@@wesleywallace4426 people like you miss the point … He was never going to wait for anything throwing a stone in the air (while you’re waiting for it to land he would have shot) . Fire cracker (whilst you’re waiting for it to crackle he would have shot ). Bill does what he has to, to stay alive … later on the tales will say he is the fastest because he stayed alive and dead men can’t tell their side of the story … Bill himself didn’t care about who is the fastest , but because he’s killed countless imbeciles who fancied that nonsense (and some were surely faster than him) … it was assumed he was the fastest … It’s life or death … and during the whole movie Bill didn’t strike anyone as someone who would play games with his own life …
The baritone of Lakeith's voice, his calm smoldering demeanor, and facial expressions all really made him a perfect nonchalant but deeply focused character💜. He never let on if he felt panicked or worried in any situation. There's always like a slight sadness behind his eyes no matter what character he plays. Maybe it's just me! But I recognize it. He has the look of a wounded boy in an old man's body and soul.
That is a perfect description of his character. He always has this tortured look in his eyes like he’s been through something serious. And it’s like he never really raises his voice for most of his characters
Two type of people who live in this world ,those who come through the door(fair fight) and those who come through the Windows (guess who always stay alive?) -Ugly Tuco
@@luffylength I think that's his best acting role tbh idk why but I was like "whos that guy " he felt so real, like a dude you know lmao. I think hell do great if he did more movies where they morph hes appearance slightly or was in a superhero/villian movie having some cosmetic or mask on sometimes . I think that way he can get more praise by his acting like how Collin Farrel is getting praised for his penguin character
After reading the comments, I guess he really did set himself up for this. The audience wanted a fair fight but the MOVIE knew that this takes place in its own realistic universe which means that ‘fair square’ shxt ain’t happening. Jim had multiple warnings in this movie to take this more seriously and he didn’t. I was really hoping to see just how fast he was but damnit, the movie had other plans
Yea Jim was dope asf but the movie basically tells you every time he’s on screen that he’s gonna get himself killed. Literally everyone tells him. Plus the fact that there’s not one point in the movie where anyone in Rufus’ crew fights fair. It’s clearly shown that they give no fucks about honor at all. Bill in the train car acted like he was gonna square up with the one random guy and then just slashes both his legs. Rufus acts like he’s gonna box with Willie and then just pistol whips the shit out of him. So if there was any hope left that Jim was gonna live it was gone once you realize he’s taking so much time to count down and expecting Bill to wait.
Nah. The man counted slow on the train trying to get to the soldiers. This tells the audience that no matter how slow or fast the count was, it was irrelevant; Cherokee Bill would've cheated regardless.
Jim - All comes down to who fast and who ain’t, right Cherokee - No it’s come down to who’s alive and dead Jim’s death reminds me of how Oberyn martell died against the mountain In GOT ego and pride got in the way Great movie though
@@prettyboijames2522 The last two seasons of Game of Thrones was one of the biggest fumbles in the history of television. Never before have I seen such a popular series implode like that. It's almost like two completely different shows. To build such a fan base and just let them down like that was just wrong. It still hurts....
_Cuffee_ warned him also...and most *PROPHETICALLY* : Cuffee: *_"I RATHER RIDE INTO A GUN BATTLE ON A DARK HORSE,_* _over a golden stallion."_ Beckwourth: _"Fuck that mean?"_ Cuffee: *_"SHINY SHIT GET SHOT."_* 😳🎯🚷
@@Eyesunmoonstars He cheated as he said a countdown from 5 implying they would draw at 1 but he always knew he was planning to cheat and draw early. He knew from experience that Jim was faster so he used is self preservation to stay alive, still cowardly and cheating, but it was also Jims's own fault, he should have stopped playing around with his gun and not taken his eyes off Bill as he must have known he was capable of such a stunt and not an honourable man
Yes, a prequel, if played by Lakeith. He played CB so well in this movie, he really just drew you in and you loved him even though he was a snake. Calm, cool, articulate, mild-mannered, smart, attractive - all wrapped up in a seriously dangerous package. Most women will understand 😉. To borrow a comment from another post - “smooth water and a crocodile”
@@GeorgiaPeachAYEEE no not confirmed but lakeith has said he is down. And the director wants to do it and has said they are working up a script. So fingers 🤞
I just realized while watching that Cherokee Bill was a big middle finger to all western death tropes! I guess that makes him the scariest gunman in the film
Damn, I like this movie! They all did their part. Soundtrack slapped too! If I was going to be any one of them, Im Cherokee Bill haha.. Lakeith Stanfield been on jab for a few years now! On point and killing it 😄
This scene represents young people this days. Being arrogant, careless and not listening to their elders. Also people arguing what Cherokee Bill has done. It just in real life, if you play by the rules and wait in the line, other people will just devour you alive.
Cherokee Bill stole every scene he was in. Best written and performed. A deadly cowboy who was both honorable and a filthy cheat. I loved that he had both sides to him. I was honestly sad to see him die just because I would have watched a whole movie about him.
To each side arguing whether Bill Cheated or not, you both are RIGHT. This was well intended from Jeymes Samuel who in an interview while filming this stated that Nat Love’s Autiobiography was a game changer for him as he only learned from “White Man’s Cinema and their rules” and he had a chance to play around with the Nat’s concepts in a short Western Film (They Die By Dawn) that also included an All Star Cast. By film rules, he cheated. By the actual rules that Nat Love recalled, he didn’t. He wanted to get people talking by incorporating both in this scene to challenge everything we’ve learned by cinematic history in creating an authentic Western film. By all means, he succeeded in a quality film as this.
Bill was so cold with that draw because after Beckworth said 3 he looked at Bill smiling and soon as he took his eye off him he was shot. You know how fast of a movement that has to be to take your gun out, aim and shoot?
No lie. This scene messed me up. All that build up...I was low key upset, until I realized THIS was how he was the fastest gun. He shoots while you're still counting....
@@GeorgiaPeachAYEEE Very true. What makes it even better is they mention his name and that he's the fastest draw, before you even see his face. So they kind of built up his character prior to actually seeing him. Then you actually see how ruthless he is when he cuts the guys legs on the train.
@@queyoung6597 yes! I definitely think they should make this into a series.. I need to know more about the characters and how they all came together. I think that would be a dope series and something different
To be fair, he DID try and give him an out and let him leave. You could see the "sigh, alrighty then, I really didn't want to" look in his eyes and ever so slight nodding when he realized J wasnt going to leave and wanted all the smoke. Now I got to go throw the movie on in the background and watch it again for the 15th or so time 🔫😁👍
In my humble opinion, this is probably one of the best modern westerns to date. Deconstructs the mythology of the Western genre while at the same time paying homage to it. The cast is great and full of memorable performances.
When cuffee said she’s seen faster in the mirror to jim I knew bill would “win” the duel and cuffee would be the one to kill bill. Since the duel had been foreshadowed so heavily already by that point
Bill was a bad ass , not about to lie. But I did really want to see them go head to head. This was such a good movie , I’ve seen it three times now and I’ll have to watch it again today lol.
1:51 His range of facial expressions in that split second is AMAZING Focused to Over-confident to recoiled shock, to life-lessness. It really helped to sell the reality of what could have otherwise been a predictable scene
To me what happened later with Bill and Cuffee made no sense after this scene. The fact that Cherokee Bill sensed that Jim was faster and therefore "cheated" by drawing before count was over and Jim was not even looking, shows that Bill is a seasoned gunfighter who will do anything to survive. Yet just 15 mins later when he has the drop on Cuffee he doesn't shoot but actually engages in a fair fight. Now that is something Jim would have done but it made so sense for Bill to do this, as we had just scene how calculating he was. It just seemed completely out of character for such a cold blooded killer who does anything to survive.
I think this is one of the best duel I seen and it is originally great. Cherokee Bill hints Jim already but Jim is so arrogant, careless and stubborn too.
I like how he is a villain and he is willing to cheat to live but he gave him the chance to leave without being killed and told him early on that he didn't care about being quickest just about being alive. Man wasn't in it for the glory, it was just his way of life
Bill's character spoke so much of the was such a view into the content of the time. Living in a world were nothing was fair,no equality,none between men,men and women, none even between women amongst themselve. Why on earth would he be fair to anyone dumb enough to play with what they had more precious(their lives) Great stuff.
It was either an Army TAC or Drill Sergeant who once said anyone who is stupid enough to agree to fair fight is fighting a losing battle. Real fights aren't fair. You want a fair fight take up sports.
I know people love Jim in this comment section, but I still hate the fact that Bill didn't kill Cuffee while she was reloading the same way he did to Jim here. It's out of character for Bill to wait until she's ready.
That's what I didn't understand either. I think the writers were trying to make his methods out to be based in cowardness after spending much of the film showing him out to be wise. Based on the character we got the whole movie it makes 0 sense that he would accept a quickdraw with Cuffe. Easily the dumbest part of the movie for me
She was literally reloading while she was talking to him and he got shot then turned around and talk to Bill and got shot again. During that whole thing she had already finished reloading she didn’t stand in shock waiting
Fuck man, such a good scene. All the hype around the duel to end it like this huuuurt but made for such a fucking bittersweet moment when cuffie says "beckworth was faster," pure adrenaline
This movie was awesome. The man who created this script was right on point. Picked the right people for the parts. I liked him because he was quick and funny. I hate he had to die. I also hate Cherokee bill had to die because he was mesmerizing.
To be fair cherokee tried to warned him, its not about who faster,its about who lives or dies, cherokee was never a fastest shooter,he's just the one who walk out of the duels alive
While I ain't defending what he did, alot of people are saying he agreed to a duel then cheated. But he didn't agree to a dual, he just asked "Countdown from 5?". And while most would assume that's him agreeing, that's him letting them assume. And we all know about assuming. If he really wanted to cheat cheat he would've shot him as soon as he emptied the cylinder.
Just watched this movie for the 3rd time, and will likely watch it again this weekend. Gotta say this is a classic as those 2 hours and 19 mins went by quick!
I'm reminded of pirates of the carribean "you didn't beat me, you ignores the rules of engagement, in a fair fight I'd kill you " "Well that's not much incentive for me to fight fair then is it?"
No when you ask for a count and literally tell the person to count it's to the opposition count. Yes it gives your opponent the advantage but when you feel like your faster thats what you do🤦🏾♂️ he did cheat and he knew he was a dead man walking since he first met jim
I have never seen this kind of film before, and I just randomly started it on Netflix, I was high as fuck btw. Didn’t know what to expect. But, just 2 minutes into it, I was fully grasped by the movie. Hands down I think this is one of the best movies I’ve ever seen.
I love how when cuffee kills him she says "Jim was faster", it gives the audience a bittersweet satisfaction knowing Jim was the better man, he just let his ego get in the way
that was one of my favorite scenes
His ego wasn't what got in his way though. It was his cheating opponent.
@@MyAkachi he took his eyes off him
Also it might even open up the debate that she was even faster than Jim. Because she did state she was. All she said was he was faster than that guy.
I think what it was is that she used his tactic against him, since she saw he was a cheater
This was one of those “oh s***” moments. I was both shocked and pissed. Such a great scene.
Facts I was heated !!
@@RichesOvaBxtches im STILL MAD! FIRST FRED HAMPTON AND NOW JIM?!? LAKEITH AINT SHYT!!🤦🏾♂️🤦🏾♂️🤦🏾♂️😡😡🤬🤬🤬🤣🤣🤣🤦🏾♂️🤦🏾♂️
I was hoping Jim beat him
@@comedianhaze1619 😂😂😂😂
@@comedianhaze1619 🤣😂🤣 It gets better a day at a time homie ,It’s crazy tho cause it was hard not to like his character up until this happened ;He even offered Jim the chance to leave lol
"Why do they always have to count so slow?" Says the man who counted slow on the train trying to get to the soldiers. This tells the audience, that no matter how slow or fast the count was was irrelevant; Cherokee Bill would've cheated regardless.
Oh shit maybe ur right. The way he says "why do they always gotta count so...slow"
Yeah bro your definitely right. His character is a scumbag and he also acted as if he’d fight the guy who stood up to him on the train. But instead he pulled a knife and sliced his legs up. Jus confirming lol
Tbf Jim was counting way slower. By a lot
@@docta4078 I mean technically he did still fight the guy with the knife
I get where you coming from but…..him being on the train threatening to kill the son of a man in a room he’s trying to get into with a slow countdown is totally different from a gun fight where the countdown shouldn’t be as slow as Jim was doing it arrogantly…now he did cheat and I hated that he killed Jim but at the same time 5 seconds passed 40 seconds ago from this stand off💯
Cherokee told the young bull what it was...
Dead men tell no tales.
Doesn't matter who is faster, what matters is who is left to tell the story.
You know why Cherokee is the best quick draw around ? Because none of his opponents are around to tell otherwise.
Zactly!!
I’m not going to lie, I still think beckworth would’ve laid Bill down if he didn’t cheat the count… or he would’ve at least got a good hit and still managed to die afterwards.. we need a spin-off for real, for real
@@jae3559 they agreed on 5 seconds , bill gave him 14
💯
@@sabado391 The agreed on a 5 count not 5 seconds smh 🤦
Cherokee bill was one of my fav characters I don’t know why lol
Sinister, unpredictable, and poetically articulate
Same here lol
ON BRO
I’m saying…
Its bc of the realism of the character. Its that "oh shit Omar is comin." No games no bullshit. Just smooth water and a crocodile.
I was hurt when this went down. 😅 Cuffey got em together though. I was really rooting for both guys - that’s wild! Speaks to the script and the acting - they all killed it.
I agree. The script, directing, and acting all came together
“Beckwourth was faster..”
Me too
Same. I was in love with Lakeith Stanfield as Cherokee Bill and Regina as Trudy. I wanted them to be heros and not people were suppose to be rooting against because they were so dope
Yeah l liked them all lol I kinda wish a few of them didn’t die and they just rode off on some random horse
I saw it coming the whole movie. Everyone warning him, his Ahab obsession, bill being such a pragmatist, Jim never having actually seen Bill duel. Infact Bill never even agrees to a contest, just tells jim to count. Beware the older man in a business where men die young for he's done something right to make it that far....
Yeah, they telegraphed a ton in this movie. It was well acted and stuff though so it was still fun to watch.
This entirely. Jim let Bill feed his ego by buttering him up and he paid the price for it.
Jim was still faster
@@MRX-rr5xf says Cuffee
@@jdm6613 yep
That boy is stupid. 1st the stories he heard was about people "getting shot before they can even turn around". Then he was told to his face by Cherokee he cheats. And he just saw him about to shoot Nat in the back.
He caught a cheater cheating and said
"Care for a fair game, sir?"
😂
Exactly
This is exactly it. People on here talking about he cheated....
HE TOLD HIS STUPID ASS WHAT HE WAS ABOUT the first time they met !
Broo I laughed too hard at this!!!!
But he was funny ash 😂
Imagine a Pickett/Beckworth spin off movie or series that takes place before they met Nat Love. Both seemed to have good chemistry. Could be like a “buddy cop comedy style” movie
I needa beckworth movie bad bro
The whole movie all I could think of is how beckworth needs a damn spin off
To be honest, I think both gangs should have their own sequel.. hell each character can have their own show if you think about. We didn't get any back stories of the characters.. just snippets
💯whole THTF universe like Marvel/DC. Rufus gave me Thanos and Cheerokee gave me Joker.
*buddy marshal comedy style
I love this character but loved even more that it’s slowly revealed that Cherokee Bill isn’t as fast as people say but more so wins by any means necessary (Shooting Jim at 3, Almost shooting Nat in the back, and actually shooting Pickett in the back). Broke my heart when cuffee says Jim was faster then her who actually beat him.
Bruh he said it, they always count slow. The guy said 5 and 4 and then waited a whole other five seconds before saying three when counting
@@demetriusgivans7253 Still was dirty of him to shoot him before the count ended.
@@tj8002 But his point stands: at the end it doesn't matter if you are fast, slow, clean or dirty, but alive.
It is a hard read there. That statement definitely implied Jim was faster than Bill, but not necesarily that Jim was faster than her.
@@rodrigoodonsalcedocisneros9266 But He was faster than her tho🥷🏾
Jim was that dude but he was feeling himself and didn’t take the moment for what it was ,Cherokee Bill wasn’t getting no count from me he would’ve got smoked soon as he drew down on Nat cause he had no plans on conducting an honorable square off
👏🏾
Gotta think about it this way, whole reason kid was there was so he could get his chance with Cherokee bill, not to make sure nat don’t die. He was trying to create his moment
@@juc3eoncs32 True and outside of that I guess it was viewed as honorable to not shoot a worthy adversary in the back ;However at the least he should’ve respected the stakes at hand ,what he’d heard about the guy ,What the guy said to him in their first stand off enough to keep his eyes on Bill every second of countdown and hold off on the theatrics until his opp was no longer a threat.Then he really would’ve had a moment worthy of the validation he sought
@@RichesOvaBxtches This is facts. I thought he was taking it seriously then he started playing and it got him killed. All that build up the whole movie….I feel robbed
@@dretheloner It actually was a great scene. Cautionary tale on being too fancy would get you killed in the Wild West. It was called WILD for a reason, survival of the fittest.
Cherokee Bill knew Jim was faster and didn’t wanna risk it, so he cheated. Probably always cheated based off him saying “It doesn’t matter who is faster, it matters who is alive or dead” And Jim should have known that counting down himself and feeling himself and being slow about it was a problem, but his ego got in the way. Another thing: Never take your eye off your opponent during a quick draw for this damn reason alone… a split second of looking away and a cheater could strike and it’s over… damn I loved this scene, but I’d be lying if I said I didn’t wanna see them actually quick draw honorably and both of them got killed because they were evenly skilled. I feel like that’s a nice end to the debate. But still!! Awesome scene!
Peep Regina reach for her gun before the duel, then relax once Bill cheated.
@@kenla3080 word? missed that
I said the same thing 💯💯
Then remember when he first met him he pointed out he was known for shooting people twice in the back
He’s known for being fast, but he’s also notorious for shooting people in the back and Jim knew it. He asked if he was the guy earlier in the film
Honestly, I’m glad somebody finally made this shootout scene realistic. I’ve always said they waste time counting. Just shoot and be done with it.
I mean it’s “realistic” in the sense hed cheat to Win out of fear lol. A count is rarely used in quick draw stand offs, unless asked for. When asked for its basically a “respect the count”. Bills the one who asked for the count and then manipulated it to win. Jim never asked for a count during their first encounter
@@stanleecarlton2237 Bill said he was going to shoot a man in the mouth who talked too much. That’s exactly what he did. You got to admit, the man told the truth there. 😂😂
It’s the westerns, those counts were stupid. if you want a man dead, just kill’em.
@@Eyesunmoonstars You just ain’t read nothing the dude above typed
@@positivevibes1746 thanks reading comprehension police. 🤓
@@positivevibes1746 lmfao thank you! I was trying to figure out what his response had anything to do with what I just said/explained above 😂😂
My boy Rj( the dude who plays Jim) he’s a really good actor, good to see someone you grew up with make it in these big films, not gonna lie I was rooting for him and when he died I was like oh shiii😭👀
It was good to see him again. But the old man was right about Jim , all that fancy crap will get em killed.
@@Audi2Gunz brah literally everyone was telling him that not just the old man.
That was me, man.. just on the strength of his acting in other movies I was rooting for Jim hard af.. but seeing how much shit he was talking I was like uh oh. I told my wife right away, “It’s classic western shit for cocky gunslingers to bite it, I hope he survives but it ain’t lookin good..”
I actually wish that they had him survive that shot to the cheek or something, anything just to shrug off that cliche. Like can we just get one cocky gunslinger who survives? Was holdin out hope cause it was RJ Cyler but nope.. 😞
@@vesuvianvillain nah, it's good like this, playing around too much gets you in trouble
904 in the building I was hurt to see em go though, but the character will be remembered.
The thing I like about lakeith the most is how he started acting...he took no classes n basically jus walked up to auditioning and look at him now! Every movie he played in is really good!!
Inspiring I swear
They did my boy dirty 😭
Right he was my fav character along with cuff
He did himself dirty. The marshal said he was gonna die 😆😆
@@Eyesunmoonstars You don’t know wytb Jim was faster even cuff said it Cherokee cheated the count
@@Eyesunmoonstars bill cheated Because he was gonna lose hence him asking for a count. Simple. Jim was cocky but he would have won.
I don't see how this was ever a thing... If this is how it really went down in those times, they were more reckless than we are by a long shot lol. ☠ Pun unintended! Boom 💥 b×tch! Nice 😎
Sad as it is, he really brought it on himself, he knew dude was cheat, dude flat out told him he shot people for talking too much, and then...he actually puts himself in a position where he can't just fire his gun. Too much ego, too much pride.
Had he had his gun in his holster at the ready, he could have taken dude's head off the second he flinched with his gun; Cuffie knew Beckworth was faster than her, and she outdrew Bill with ease. You could actually see he wasn't that fast when he went for his gun, never even cleared his holster. He wasn't fast, he was ruthless, and that built his legend
Cuffee might have been faster than Jim though. Her statement only asserts Jim was faster than Bill, not necesarily faster than her. Plus, she already told hin she was faster herself.
How you figure Jim faster than cuffee? She claimed the fastest and kinda proved it . Shiny shit get shot
Man 😂😂I was mad as hell didn’t want neither one to die Great movie 🎥
Right I wanted them all to live. Best movie I seen in a long time
It's dumb seeing people complain about Bill "cheating" in the draw. Not everyone wants to play with their lives. Jim took his eyes off of his opponent as if this were a friendly game with nerf guns. His naivety killed him before Bill did.
Watching people defend cheating is just as funny.
So why agree to the f**king count down? Should've just said nothing and just start shooting but it's cause he knew in a real count down he would've gotten out drawn. It's obvious, which is why it's obvious why he had to cheat.
It what it character does, " I heard you quick....at putting two in peoples backs".
Jim to Cherokee
The kid knew, he just want bragging rights and that got him killed. Simple.
@@Leviathan_Art that boy was taking forever to count, and he was so full of himself, and dumb for taking his eyes off his opponent in a fast draw battle? Wtf lol
@@Leviathan_Art Bill did cheat, but it was partially Jim's fault he got owned there. He should have taken shit more seriously. You have to expect opponents to fight dirty if their lives are on the line, so you have to be alert at all times.
@@Leviathan_Art There is no “cheating” when it comes to life and death.
You ever heard of “history is written by the victors”?
Cherokee Bill is better than Jim in every way. He was alive and Jim was dead.
People who go into dangerous professions with notions of “honor”, die pretty quick.
Hope you grow up one day, little buddy ❤️
Everyone defending Bill in these comments has never heard of the word honor and it shows. You don’t agree to a showdown and then CHEAT the count. He CHEATED. Beckworth may have been arrogant yes but it doesn’t change the fact that he was slightest and unfairly beaten.
Love this scene. Cherokee Bill had a calm demeanor but he was ruthless to the core. And I loved Jim.
That name on his bullet was sick though!! RIP MY BOY JIM
I mean the fact that bill withdrew his holstered gun and shot Jim without him even reacting shows he was pretty fast. Anyway this isn’t a game. Jim was treating this not like life and death.
Exactly, he was probably not faster than Jim, but definitely fast enough to exploit a secobd of distraction to kill him. Jim was too cocky and paid dearly for it.
Honestly the counting itself is already a trap. All he has to do is predict when he’s about to say one and draw his gun just a half second faster. He should have lit a fire cracker or threw a stone into the air.
@@wesleywallace4426 people like you miss the point … He was never going to wait for anything throwing a stone in the air (while you’re waiting for it to land he would have shot) . Fire cracker (whilst you’re waiting for it to crackle he would have shot ).
Bill does what he has to, to stay alive … later on the tales will say he is the fastest because he stayed alive and dead men can’t tell their side of the story … Bill himself didn’t care about who is the fastest , but because he’s killed countless imbeciles who fancied that nonsense (and some were surely faster than him) … it was assumed he was the fastest …
It’s life or death … and during the whole movie Bill didn’t strike anyone as someone who would play games with his own life …
Beckwourth was faster
Jim was faster, he just took his eyes off of Bill in the middle of a showdown… against a cheater.
The baritone of Lakeith's voice, his calm smoldering demeanor, and facial expressions all really made him a perfect nonchalant but deeply focused character💜. He never let on if he felt panicked or worried in any situation. There's always like a slight sadness behind his eyes no matter what character he plays. Maybe it's just me! But I recognize it. He has the look of a wounded boy in an old man's body and soul.
That is a perfect description of his character. He always has this tortured look in his eyes like he’s been through something serious. And it’s like he never really raises his voice for most of his characters
"When you have to shoot, shoot. Don't talk."
-Tuco the Ugly
Two type of people who live in this world ,those who come through the door(fair fight) and those who come through the Windows (guess who always stay alive?)
-Ugly Tuco
Love seeing Lakeith as the baddie for once. Gave me Johnny Ringo/Doc Holliday vibes.
Check em out in uncut gems he wasn't a villain but problematic as hell
You must have not seen him in Judas and the Black Messiah
@@lghrns he was less the villain and more like the conflicted protagonist in judas. In this movie he is clearly a villain and he does fantastic
@@jusa9022 SHIIIII
@@luffylength I think that's his best acting role tbh idk why but I was like "whos that guy " he felt so real, like a dude you know lmao. I think hell do great if he did more movies where they morph hes appearance slightly or was in a superhero/villian movie having some cosmetic or mask on sometimes . I think that way he can get more praise by his acting like how Collin Farrel is getting praised for his penguin character
Lakeith played a villain just 1 time and everybody ready to fight him in real life lmao thats good acting right there
Lakeith got one more role like this before the ppl hate his ass 🤣
🤣😂
He drew so fast that Jim still had a smile on
After reading the comments, I guess he really did set himself up for this. The audience wanted a fair fight but the MOVIE knew that this takes place in its own realistic universe which means that ‘fair square’ shxt ain’t happening. Jim had multiple warnings in this movie to take this more seriously and he didn’t. I was really hoping to see just how fast he was but damnit, the movie had other plans
Yea Jim was dope asf but the movie basically tells you every time he’s on screen that he’s gonna get himself killed. Literally everyone tells him. Plus the fact that there’s not one point in the movie where anyone in Rufus’ crew fights fair. It’s clearly shown that they give no fucks about honor at all. Bill in the train car acted like he was gonna square up with the one random guy and then just slashes both his legs. Rufus acts like he’s gonna box with Willie and then just pistol whips the shit out of him. So if there was any hope left that Jim was gonna live it was gone once you realize he’s taking so much time to count down and expecting Bill to wait.
Nah. The man counted slow on the train trying to get to the soldiers. This tells the audience that no matter how slow or fast the count was, it was irrelevant; Cherokee Bill would've cheated regardless.
Jim - All comes down to who fast and who ain’t, right
Cherokee - No it’s come down to who’s alive and dead
Jim’s death reminds me of how Oberyn martell died against the mountain In GOT ego and pride got in the way
Great movie though
Yes and no. He wanted the mountain to suffer.
He an Jim had different motivations
@@HiHello-wz6bx Correct, but both were welcomed to death, and ironically the mountain made him suffer by blowing his brains out in-front of his sister
@@prettyboijames2522 The mountain made his family suffer, Martell died a quick death.
The reason Oberyn poisoned him was to make the pain last.
@@HiHello-wz6bx Last season made us suffer
@@prettyboijames2522 The last two seasons of Game of Thrones was one of the biggest fumbles in the history of television. Never before have I seen such a popular series implode like that. It's almost like two completely different shows.
To build such a fan base and just let them down like that was just wrong.
It still hurts....
Smh to be fair Cherokee bill tried to warn him.😅 and I quote "I shoot men in the mouth who talk too much"..
That’s exactly what I said. That’s how come I say he didn’t cheat
Bass warned him also.
_Cuffee_ warned him also...and most *PROPHETICALLY* :
Cuffee: *_"I RATHER RIDE INTO A GUN BATTLE ON A DARK HORSE,_* _over a golden stallion."_
Beckwourth: _"Fuck that mean?"_
Cuffee: *_"SHINY SHIT GET SHOT."_*
😳🎯🚷
💯
@@Eyesunmoonstars He cheated as he said a countdown from 5 implying they would draw at 1 but he always knew he was planning to cheat and draw early. He knew from experience that Jim was faster so he used is self preservation to stay alive, still cowardly and cheating, but it was also Jims's own fault, he should have stopped playing around with his gun and not taken his eyes off Bill as he must have known he was capable of such a stunt and not an honourable man
We need that Cherokee Bill spin off movie
Agreed
Yes, a prequel, if played by Lakeith. He played CB so well in this movie, he really just drew you in and you loved him even though he was a snake. Calm, cool, articulate, mild-mannered, smart, attractive - all wrapped up in a seriously dangerous package. Most women will understand 😉. To borrow a comment from another post - “smooth water and a crocodile”
It's coming
@@marcusmoore7600 is this confirmed? Lol don't want to get my hopes up
@@GeorgiaPeachAYEEE no not confirmed but lakeith has said he is down. And the director wants to do it and has said they are working up a script. So fingers 🤞
Dude straight up told him
"It ain't about who's faster.
It's about who's dead and who's alive."
Jim in the afterlife like ".....4........wait who turned off the sun?"
I like Cherokee Bill's approach to reason first before choosing violence lol.
I just realized while watching that Cherokee Bill was a big middle finger to all western death tropes! I guess that makes him the scariest gunman in the film
This scene hurt me but I get the message lol. But imma be sour about this forever Jim was my fav character 😭
I swearrr😭
Right in the beginning of the movie Jim himself said all the Bill stuff was hear say because no one lived to disprove it with “see say”
I swear this part pissed me off so damn much!!!
Was funny as hell
Don’t know why. He had It coming
Damn, I like this movie! They all did their part. Soundtrack slapped too! If I was going to be any one of them, Im Cherokee Bill haha.. Lakeith Stanfield been on jab for a few years now! On point and killing it 😄
I would be bill pickett I like rifle reapters I made one in rdr2 and I made jim beckworths guns
This scene represents young people this days. Being arrogant, careless and not listening to their elders. Also people arguing what Cherokee Bill has done. It just in real life, if you play by the rules and wait in the line, other people will just devour you alive.
Young people ALWAYS
Most of us were like that young
Who tf didnt know Jim was gonna die. Dude was a walking coffin the whole movie.
Brain dead people thats who.
Oscar Awards...All the way around. Best Pix, Best Male and Female, Music, Directing, and ALL of the rest. One of the All-Time BEST.
Honestly... when he removed the first bullet. I thought he was going to remove 5 bullets, spin the chamber and gamble on the gun even shooting 😂
That wouldve been the coolest thing in cinematic history
Me too
😂😂😂me too dawg
Cherokee Bill stole every scene he was in. Best written and performed. A deadly cowboy who was both honorable and a filthy cheat. I loved that he had both sides to him. I was honestly sad to see him die just because I would have watched a whole movie about him.
Lakeith is a sick actor
To each side arguing whether Bill Cheated or not, you both are RIGHT. This was well intended from Jeymes Samuel who in an interview while filming this stated that Nat Love’s Autiobiography was a game changer for him as he only learned from “White Man’s Cinema and their rules” and he had a chance to play around with the Nat’s concepts in a short Western Film (They Die By Dawn) that also included an All Star Cast. By film rules, he cheated. By the actual rules that Nat Love recalled, he didn’t. He wanted to get people talking by incorporating both in this scene to challenge everything we’ve learned by cinematic history in creating an authentic Western film. By all means, he succeeded in a quality film as this.
Bill was so cold with that draw because after Beckworth said 3 he looked at Bill smiling and soon as he took his eye off him he was shot. You know how fast of a movement that has to be to take your gun out, aim and shoot?
He started counting from 5 and I immediately said "Ah shit. Lakeith's gonna win this."
My jaw dropped to the earth crust in this scene, even though deep down I knew he was obviously going to break the rule.
He counted way to slow.
@@thebucketmanj8525 it didn’t matter how slow he counted Cherokee would have cheated the count regardless
No lie. This scene messed me up. All that build up...I was low key upset, until I realized THIS was how he was the fastest gun.
He shoots while you're still counting....
Dang Jim! I was hurt lol
Devastated
I was really impressed by Lakeith Stanfield in this movie.
Yes the train scene was golden! That was his moment
@@GeorgiaPeachAYEEE Very true. What makes it even better is they mention his name and that he's the fastest draw, before you even see his face. So they kind of built up his character prior to actually seeing him. Then you actually see how ruthless he is when he cuts the guys legs on the train.
@@queyoung6597 yes! I definitely think they should make this into a series.. I need to know more about the characters and how they all came together. I think that would be a dope series and something different
LaKeith plays himself all the time lol. He is pretty much the same in Atlanta and other stuff.
@@rodrigoodonsalcedocisneros9266 Very true. Instead of becoming the characters, he makes the character become him.
This scene is the epitome of what life is about.
To be fair, he DID try and give him an out and let him leave. You could see the "sigh, alrighty then, I really didn't want to" look in his eyes and ever so slight nodding when he realized J wasnt going to leave and wanted all the smoke.
Now I got to go throw the movie on in the background and watch it again for the 15th or so time
🔫😁👍
In my humble opinion, this is probably one of the best modern westerns to date. Deconstructs the mythology of the Western genre while at the same time paying homage to it. The cast is great and full of memorable performances.
It made me happy to hear cuffe say Jim was faster than her.
Hands down the best Netflix film ever. I had to watch it twice it's so good.
This was one of the best movies I've seen in my life....and I've seen quite a few
When cuffee said she’s seen faster in the mirror to jim I knew bill would “win” the duel and cuffee would be the one to kill bill. Since the duel had been foreshadowed so heavily already by that point
he told him he didnt listen
Bill was a bad ass , not about to lie. But I did really want to see them go head to head. This was such a good movie , I’ve seen it three times now and I’ll have to watch it again today lol.
1:51 His range of facial expressions in that split second is AMAZING
Focused to Over-confident to recoiled shock, to life-lessness. It really helped to sell the reality of what could have otherwise been a predictable scene
In a game of Life and death, there are no rules or honor.
To me what happened later with Bill and Cuffee made no sense after this scene. The fact that Cherokee Bill sensed that Jim was faster and therefore "cheated" by drawing before count was over and Jim was not even looking, shows that Bill is a seasoned gunfighter who will do anything to survive.
Yet just 15 mins later when he has the drop on Cuffee he doesn't shoot but actually engages in a fair fight. Now that is something Jim would have done but it made so sense for Bill to do this, as we had just scene how calculating he was. It just seemed completely out of character for such a cold blooded killer who does anything to survive.
Saw it coming the whole movie lol he was way too cocky
They should’ve gave him atleast one cool scene lol other than his original character introduction
@@musicbynature2 too many characters...he was obviously the comedic relief and sacrifice. I knew it was him from the jump still loved him though
To quote the good, the bad and the ugly, " if you're going to shoot, shoot don't talk".
Majors does good in a cowboy movie we need more of these
they cheated us out of this match up... and they kept showing him after he died, i thought he was gonna be alive
frrrrrr
I think this is one of the best duel I seen and it is originally great. Cherokee Bill hints Jim already but Jim is so arrogant, careless and stubborn too.
@@sleepingmonster1632 exactly
He was shot his brains out, no way he survived that.
I literally paused it because i was like maybe it just went through his cheek and he'll be ok. Went back and looked, nah, he was dead as hell.
I like how he is a villain and he is willing to cheat to live but he gave him the chance to leave without being killed and told him early on that he didn't care about being quickest just about being alive. Man wasn't in it for the glory, it was just his way of life
"Why do they always have count so slow?" Best quote.
Bill's character spoke so much of the was such a view into the content of the time. Living in a world were nothing was fair,no equality,none between men,men and women, none even between women amongst themselve. Why on earth would he be fair to anyone dumb enough to play with what they had more precious(their lives)
Great stuff.
It was either an Army TAC or Drill Sergeant who once said anyone who is stupid enough to agree to fair fight is fighting a losing battle. Real fights aren't fair. You want a fair fight take up sports.
Bill was the coolest killer of the movie!!!!
The best scenes in the movie involve Lakeith Stanfield
" Countdown from five " was a chess move on Cherokee Bills part
I know people love Jim in this comment section, but I still hate the fact that Bill didn't kill Cuffee while she was reloading the same way he did to Jim here. It's out of character for Bill to wait until she's ready.
Good point, maybe cause she's a lady or maybe he was ready to die
That's what I didn't understand either. I think the writers were trying to make his methods out to be based in cowardness after spending much of the film showing him out to be wise.
Based on the character we got the whole movie it makes 0 sense that he would accept a quickdraw with Cuffe. Easily the dumbest part of the movie for me
To be fair he Bill was very unpredictable and I think it made his character better
Cuffie had already reloaded while he was talking to and killing the other dude
She was literally reloading while she was talking to him and he got shot then turned around and talk to Bill and got shot again. During that whole thing she had already finished reloading she didn’t stand in shock waiting
Fuck man, such a good scene. All the hype around the duel to end it like this huuuurt but made for such a fucking bittersweet moment when cuffie says "beckworth was faster," pure adrenaline
This movie was awesome. The man who created this script was right on point. Picked the right people for the parts. I liked him because he was quick and funny. I hate he had to die. I also hate Cherokee bill had to die because he was mesmerizing.
To be fair cherokee tried to warned him, its not about who faster,its about who lives or dies, cherokee was never a fastest shooter,he's just the one who walk out of the duels alive
The Good, the bad, the Ugly's equivalent of "When you have to shoot, shoot, don't talk!"
Lmfao I knew this would happen as soon as I seen Jim counting down slow as hell.
Loved Cherokee from beginning to end what an awesome character
Damn cherokee was on a kill streak in this movie 😂
His character was wild af ina good way
While I ain't defending what he did, alot of people are saying he agreed to a duel then cheated. But he didn't agree to a dual, he just asked "Countdown from 5?". And while most would assume that's him agreeing, that's him letting them assume. And we all know about assuming. If he really wanted to cheat cheat he would've shot him as soon as he emptied the cylinder.
Both my favourites but I was rooting for lakeith cuz he’s my favourite actor in this movie
I really liked Cherokee bill
“When you have to shoot, shoot! Don’t talk.” -Tuco
Just watched this movie for the 3rd time, and will likely watch it again this weekend. Gotta say this is a classic as those 2 hours and 19 mins went by quick!
I'm reminded of pirates of the carribean "you didn't beat me, you ignores the rules of engagement, in a fair fight I'd kill you "
"Well that's not much incentive for me to fight fair then is it?"
Bill didn't cheat the count. The count was till 5. They never said till who's 5 count. This is why Bill says, "why do they always count so slow."
No when you ask for a count and literally tell the person to count it's to the opposition count. Yes it gives your opponent the advantage but when you feel like your faster thats what you do🤦🏾♂️ he did cheat and he knew he was a dead man walking since he first met jim
Top notch modern day cowboy movie 10/10 fr
I wish Jim would’ve had more scenes, he was a really good character😭
Beckworth ran around all day playing.
i legit wasn’t surprised at all, i wanted jim to win but i knew it was over when he kept staring at that damn gun like pay attention!!!!!!!
The bullet had “Cherokee” on it 🔥🔥🔥🔥
People saying he “cheated” lol in a game of life and death they ain’t no cheaters just winners and losers
Yeah sure. Cowards live longer, braves die younger.
how was it supposed to go down "fairly", clearly the guy counting has the advantage
🤦🏾♀️
That's what you do when you feel like your faster. You let your enemy count and still body them but bill still knew in his gut that jim would win
Jim was obsessed with being the fastest.
Bill was irritated by people wasting his time.
I have never seen this kind of film before, and I just randomly started it on Netflix, I was high as fuck btw. Didn’t know what to expect. But, just 2 minutes into it, I was fully grasped by the movie.
Hands down I think this is one of the best movies I’ve ever seen.
I hate how my boi Jim went out I stuck to that character from the start 😪